I’ve met Jake at a handful of shows and he’s a super legit dude. August Burns Red is one of the most consistent bands over the last 20 years and they just keep getting better.
@@SuperHighCarlos not me bro. I went and took a listen based on your comment and it feels too forced. Messengers carried me along, this one feels like I am waiting for something that aint coming. Still got MAD respect, but I am playing Redemption again to cleanse my soul. The tempo changes and crescendos, thats what does it for me. Stay HIGH Carlos
This was so good. As a Christian, it's definitely offered a lot of self- reflection when I nerd out on theology and apologetics, and neglect good relationship with God and others. I just went through a divorce myself, and my ex sounds a lot like how Jake described his ex wife (not to mention, I wasn't a very good Christian husband, if I'm being honest). But I've been wrestling with that same notion that "maybe she's mean because she's been through so much pain, and I'm not helping her as much as I think I am just cuz I'm so damn 'knowledgeable' 😢". Thanks for this interview, Finn. I appreciate you to quite an astonishing degree.
As someone who spent many years in the church and studied a lot of theology, I never thought I'd see the day I'd hear about Calvinism, let alone the book "Debating Calvinism," in a Finn McKenty video, but here we are! Great interview! Jake is a solid dude.
Calvinism is one of those prederminist things, right? Like God knows everything you're going to do before you do it? I never understood that. If God is omniscient, then whether I end up in heaven or hell is already determined, so why would I bother trying? If my destiny is set in stone regardless of what I choose to do, then either I do whatever I want knowing I'm going to hell, or I do whatever I want and somehow I'm going to redeem myself later and get into heaven, I just don't know how that happens yet.
@@PalmelaHanderson It’s one of the characteristics of Calvinism, yes. Essentially, Calvinism teaches that God is sovereign over all things, including one’s salvation. You can look up the acronym TULIP to learn more about the specific doctrines that undergird Calvinism. The questions you raise are what Jake is alluding to when talking about the Calvinism vs. Arminianism debate. Does god predestine some to heaven and some to hell (Calvinism) or does he give libertarian free will to everybody so they can either choose or reject him (Arminianism)? A sensible Calvinist would probably answer your questions by saying the Bible teaches both but in a more nuanced way (this view is also known as Compatibilism): God predestines an “elect” people, but he also calls all people everywhere to repent and believe in Christ. These are not mutually exclusive or irreconcilable truths. It’s a mystery that the finite mind can’t fully comprehend, which makes us post-Enlightenment Westerners very uncomfortable. Side note: Apologies for the nerdy theology lesson. 😆
@@PalmelaHanderson yeah, it's kinda weird and difficult to wrap your head around. I was raised Calvinist. No sure if I still believe it or not. It does feel like some people just have a connection with God and some other people just don't no matter how hard they try. Calvinism would explain that, I guess. A little fatalistic, ngl.
@ed shanks there’s a lot of early church writings condemning predeterminism/fatalism, might be worth checking out. Helped me realize Calvinism is not really what the Bible teaches
@Ed Shanks If you're a struggling Christian, battling what you know to be true with the authority of your church, let me shed some light that I believe is pretty honest as a Christian myself. All denominations are corrupt in varying degrees. Calvanism, Baptists, Catholic, Mormon, Judaism it makes no difference, they all add things to their religion that are not in the Bible. To varying degrees these "rules" are meant to control congregations. My advice, read your Bible and have your own relationship with God, and if you can find a non denominational church that follows the Bible in the way your spirit tells you is correct, then great! Go there! But please don't let a corrupt denomination tear you away from your personal relationship with God.
Also bravo to you Finn, you were extremely polite and respectful to this man and his faith. I like how we can have these kind of conversations without it becoming a debate regardless what you believe
The bit about “men without direction” resonates with me. I spent much of my 20’s a raging nihilistic alcoholic with a tendency to isolate and I’d punch people instead of crying. A lot of “why do anything” and “why live at all” infected my mindset. I still don’t really know what I’d like out of life but I lament the time I spent waiting around to die.
Hey man, I felt compelled to answer your comment bc I felt what I have to say might benefit you in some way, shape or form. Besides it being a worldview that I would like to promote anyway. My post got a bit long, though 😅 Imo there is no real purpose to life, but weirdly enough that gives me a generally positive outlook on life. Like, if there's no purpose here anyway and I will just be gone when I am dead, the best thing I can do is A) enjoy my time here and marvel at the general beauty of creation and nature and so forth, and B) create meaning by being as good and constructive as I can be to the people (and other living beings) around me as I can. Life will eventually bring pain through old age and loss of loved ones for all of us, along with constant other worries, so trying to bring positive things to ourselves and others is all we can really do anyway. For example, my grandma is 95, and I try to spend as much time with her as my life allows me to and be good to her, entertain her, do some trips with her. Because in my belief her whole world, the world that gets created in her consciousness, will be erased the moment she dies, and the only thing I can really do is help l her have as good a time as possible as long as it lasts, right? Imo we create meaning among one another, if that makes sense. It probably helps that I developed a deep sense of wonder and humility before the world and existence as a whole. As an atheist, that heartfelt positive humility towards god/creation that some religious people have really touched me and struck a chord within me when I experienced it the first time around 14-15 years old. I hope you can find some meaning or at least joy in life! Besides all the shit out there there's also so much beauty and just general awesomeness around. I hope you can enjoy as much of it as possible! Have a good one :)
@@muenchhausenmusicawesome comment. I like to to say I am a Christian philosophically and in practice to the best of my ability. Yet as somehow always fascinated with science, reason, sociology, psychology and history I am well aware that the Christian dogma has been crafted in hundreds of different bigoted and politicized forms. For instance the Roman Empire basically cosplaying Christianity so they could absorb more people and create a larger more stable empire. While much of those leaders in practice had no such reciprocal humanistic interests and were ancient times version of the “narcissist materialist basic ignorant bro”. What you are describing to me is a the most natural blueprint within a unbiased non brain washed human being. Some have called it Humanism. Have had a friend say he is a humanist and found he was more “Christian” than some those claiming the title. I really enjoyed the Christian side of the Punk/Indie/Rock/Altwrnative Indie Diy Music scene Because this was during the toxic side of the new hip hop era, the banality of pop country mainstream, and the directionless nihilism of either regular folks in the west or significant portions of the punk metal and hip hop cultures. Nowdays philosophically and practically would still tell many folks in brief interactions or inquiries that “l am a Christian”. However I am congnizant that this is my geographic inheritance of the most humanist Taoist or Reasonable philosophy available to me in the developed western society. Truly though as someone recovering from disability still I do believe in certain aspects of modern medicine, so I have availed myself of this therapy. Plus psychology and mental health care is important. We live a largely unnatural world mixed with a beautiful natural earth. So nowdays in my view it is justified even if one was straightedge or Christian to for example take a particular medication for a particular time period. Also counterculturist dogmas of the hippies, or the more nihilist atheistic perspectives of todays various versions of this philosophies will often leave a human directionless. So the most sensible thing to do is do your best, know yourself and all your unique needs and propensities, and design your life, routine and life compass based on your quiet calm intuition. Today one may require a more ketogenic diet, paleo is a good example and choosing organic foods not covered in pesticides. Also I respect halal and kosher practices of food preparation. Lastly we now things like Functional medicine and Allopathic medicine and regenerative medicine with the best docs today will synthesize and synchronize/combine protocols of solutions. Jeet Kun Do by Bruce Lee has been a huge inspiration. He was of course not a perfect man yet he said “Use what works, discard what doesn’t” I really like that and how it will look different for each person. “Live and let live”, “To each his/her/their own”. I am not by any means some master of knowledge even though all my life I have explored these questions deeply all my life. Yet it would be kind of cool if we perhaps had a church or a religion called “The Church Of Common Sense”. With “Sense” being both a noun, a verb and an adjective. So while I now respect a lot of atheists I will never endorse nihilism nor say it’s inherent to all people. I believe we are evolving and animals have wonderful innocence about them despite their animal nature. Yet we as human kind have evolved a frontal lobe & the capacity for compassion, innovation, & creativity are our saving grace
I had a experience with Jake after a concert. I let him know how his music encouraged me and helped me. I asked if I could pray for him and then he prayed for me. I was that young kid looking for a leader. Thanks Jake!
I met with Jake at a Sydney show when they were supporting Northlane, and I remember telling him "Your music saved my life" in reference to the album 'Rescue & Restore'. I actually remember him being a little taken aback by my statement, but then saying something to the notion of "I'm glad our music helped you find your way through that time." Listening to this interview has me recontextualing how 'Rescue & Restore' actually got me through those difficult times, and what Jake really meant. At the end of the day, that album (specifically songs like 'Spirit Breaker' and 'Echoes') showed me how people can open up and tell a story of a time they were vulnerable and hurt, which then armed me with the tools to do the same with my own peers and eventually go to therapy. Yes, the album was the catalyst for change in my life, but it is the way I used the lessons from that album to live a more positive life that saved me. ABR are the freaking best
Jake signed by guitar backstage, I only got to meet Matt but I was supposed to go meet and greet them but I missed it because I never been to one before and messed up. I got to meet Matt at least and he brought my guitar to be signed by the entire band! They are the best people and I have been a fan since 2008!!!! I remember being a emo kid going through a lot back then and this band met me in the middle and their individual faith is what made me Christ Curious, and years later I became a believer in Yeshua.
I wouldn’t be the man by I am today without abr. I thank god for them all of the time. They’re so talented and I love how they keep growing for the better always 🙏
Jake is the best frontman in metalcore. His vocals, energy and crowd control (for lack of a better word) are unmatched in the scene. He also seems to be a great person outside of the music.
Thanks guys for this great video. When I was going through my divorce, "breaking promises" really articulated some of the millions of things I felt during that time. However after listening to Jake talking about it I could not help but realize how similarly I felt about it. You can hold on to that resentment, make it grow into hatred and destroy not only yourself, but your relationship with God and others without achieving anything except utter loneliness. I had to realize that not only could I not blame God for something my ex-wife and I broke, but that not all the blame can be put on either her or myself. So to let go, keep loving both yourself, them and in the end wishing them all God’s love and happiness was the best decision I could have made. Doesn’t mean it is easy (been almost 5 years since for me and I still need to remind myself of the fact some times), but at least I know that I did the best with what I had without destroying the fond memories I still have. @Finn, Thank you for being so open minded about Christianity. Tbh we aren’t always the most likeable, open minded people ourselves and (to me at the very least) I really admire your willingness to understand our stance. I really hope that I can be as open minded and thoughtful as you towards other people. @Jake, One of the most memorable moments I had at a show was the day that you shook my hand after your Cape Town show in South Africa. Here was the frontman of a well known international band shaking my hand at one of their shows. Just know that even though we didn’t speak, that kind gesture meant a lot to me as a fan. God bless you guys!
This was a fantastic interview and a very respectful conversation, Finn. I was curious if/when ABR would make an appearance for this video format; glad to see it happened!
Coming to God saved my life. I was going to end it. I was done. I was moments from unaliving myself and decided instead to give it up to Jesus. Best decision i ever made. Im glad i came from a spot that i did, because i refuse to shove my faith in people's face, love all humans regardless of their belief system, and honestly rarely even talk about my faith with people. I've written songs that touch on it, but otherwise it's a pretty private thing. Anyway, great interview. God is good, punk rock is awesome, life rules, rock on.
Been listening to ABR for 20 years and hearing Jake’s story makes me love them even more. What a sincere, humble guy. We need a lot less judgment in the world and a lot more love and humility, and of all people who should be leading that charge and setting that example it’s Christians, and yet we are seeing rampancy of the opposite behavior, of the highest order. What the hell happened?
This interview was great! Loved the uplifting conversation from both of you, it’s refreshing to see two people with differing ideologies who both want uplifting results out of the conversation.
I grew up in a very Christian household, and used to be quite religious myself. I’ve since pretty much turned away, but I do think if I knew more Christians like Jake, maybe things would be different. The world and religion need more like him.
Same here. Grew up in a super controlling religious family, which obviously helped turn me away from religion. Getting an advanced degree in the sciences also helped. Organized religions are pretty evil overall, I like Jake's more personal take on it.
Same here and i honestly feel like i would've benefitted more if i grew up around someone like Jake. I love my grandfather (god rest his soul) and my family, but I feel extremely relatable with him than and others like him.
@@Cyanoblades that’s the same way I feel. He actually wrote a devotional that I picked up back when I was still working through things after my dad passed away during college and had a shit load of anxiety. Even though I was straying away from religion, it actually helped me a lot with the self-worth and understanding how to accept people. I’m much more sympathetic to the more spiritual types like him that have their own faith but don’t let the dogmas interfere with how they treat others.
@@Alexandria87 agreed. And I’ve always respected that Jake/ABR aren’t afraid to call out hypocritical religious people or ask themselves what if their beliefs are wrong, like in their songs Blackwood and Twenty-One Grams. Overall a group of guys you can’t help but consider good role models, no matter your beliefs
Something that strikes me is how Jake isn't what I always pictured as a typical front man with the life of the party over the top personality. He has his own way of being charismatic and I can tell he is truly genuine. His power is in his actions and he doesn't need to have a huge personality to communicate his truth. On top of that when we are in a time where it's more discouraged to be anything but nihilistic he remains honest about who his is instead of disrespecting all belief systems because it's cool. He wants to break down barriers and help people heal. I always looked up to this man for assisting me in becoming a better man myself since about 2010. Very happy to hear you guys talk about how being a man is under attack. We need this more than ever! So thank you!
So good to hear you all talk about the importance of men needing strong, loving men in their lives as fathers and father figures. Men have an important role and should be held to the utmost responsibility for leading the next generation of men to be an asset to society and not a liability.
I really appreciated this conversation. I have grown up in the church and have been taken advantage of in and out of the church. Manipulation, jealousy, lies and more was my experience. I still have faith but I truly feel damaged from “the church” and all the division that’s found there most of the time. This conversation shows what it’s all about - no arguing was done here- this conversation was all about love. Not forcing ideology on someone, or telling you you’re wrong. Life is your own journey and no one should tell you how it’s supposed to go or how to think. Growth is an individual journey and sharing our stories without putting up a wall of pre conceived beliefs can sometime restrict the opportunity of love. You guys said it best though! Thanks for putting this episode on!!
Great interview. I appreciated his very candid discussions of being moved and spoken to by the Holy Spirit and not being a tight ass. Praying for more Christians in the public eye like Jake.
Thank you so so so much for this! I honestly got tears in my eyes watching this interview. I have two metalcore bands that I can say are my favourite and August Burns Red is one of those two. And Jake has been such an inspiration to me for years I always wanted for him to be on your show. The way you conducted this interview, how honest and important it was, I'm just really thankful, Finn. And thanks to Jake for being there!
What a pleasant surprise. I was one of those kids that felt like i was "saved" by this band (not literally but I always considered ABRs music as the main thing that got me through rough times in my teenage years). I used to watch all the interviews with Jake back in the day but this is the first i've heard from him in probably almost a decade! Super dope
Jake is my hero. I'm not a Christian, but from what I can discern, our foundational beliefs are dead on. You are making the world a better place! Thanks for doing this interview Finn. It was excellent, and your questions are always great.
aside from really enjoying that you engaged so graciously about his faith, I think you really nailed the BIG problem in society/politics today... we don't ever communicate in GOOD FAITH anymore...especially in social media, of course!
Jake is a great guy, relatable I'm how he admits mistakes and just wants to be a little better every time, his respect for people and things is inspiring. Finn it's so refreshing to see an interview that's not asking asinine questions. Thanks for a dose of real.
What an insightful and incredible interview. I've loved ABR since I was in my late teens. Composure was the 1st song where I felt like I wasn't the only person in the world who was going through what I was going through at the time when I 1st heard the song.
Such a great dude and a great interview. Keep these interviews coming man, I absolutely love these deep dives into everyone’s backgrounds and stories. Excellent content!
I'm a Christian and i talk to God all day long. Now, i'm one of those Christians that says "fuck" and "shit" way too much because it is a habit of mine. I had a heroin problem for a decade until 2013 and i'm a little rough around the edges as a result of that life experience, among others. Thanks for giving another Christian a platform to speak on, Finn. It seems you are either Agnostic or Atheist to me just from listening to you talk on past videos but i really appreciate the fact that you don't just call anyone religious a clown or a naïve person. love your channel, homie! didn't expect this interview to ever pop up on here but i LOVE it. 😎
Lol, I'm the same way. I've been gaming with a group of fellow Christians for about two years now, and its hard for me to watch my mouth around them 😂😂😂 I don't really think there is anything wrong with swearing, but I do think being respectful of others who don't want to hear it is important.
@@edshanks2189 dude right there with you! I've always kinda pictured swearing as bad when you are intentionally using it to be mean to someone else...and that is even subjective. for example "Nazi punks fuck off!" isn't bad. 😂 What do y'all play?
@@ghost_to_a_ghost yeah, context is super important. A word is just a word. Society and culture determine what is/isn't "bad". I think as Christians we're supposed to conduct ourselves in a certain way, and it has more to do with our general attitude than what words we use. I used to argue with other Christians about this, but at this point I've realized its much easier to just be polite when your around certain people. Not worth the argument. 🤣 I play Overwatch (technically OW 2 now) with them. Matches can get intense, and I used to be kinda toxic. Playing with them has helped me watch what I say and not be so quick to trash talk my teammates who aren't in the group. The guys I play with are better people than I am 🤣🤣
@@edshanks2189 dude I agree 1000% with everything you said 👍 I have not played much Overwatch but I do have it! you on PC? if you are, add me as a friend on Steam. same username as here on TH-cam. if you are on XBox, let me know and I'll give you my Microsoft account username. I play a lot of different games from PUBG to Minecraft and everything in-between, honestly. I'm a Stardew Valley fanatic as well lol. I gotta open at work tomorrow morning but good talking to ya homie! Lemme know if you wanna play some games sometime! If we ever log on with your Christian friends, I am good at holding my tongue. I cut hair for a living at a barber shop that mostly old men go to and I have gotten pretty good at censoring myself around them. 😜 you have a good nite either way, dude! 😎👍
I remember back when ABR was first a rising band. Definitely successful now, yet somehow still feels like they’re downplayed and under appreciated. We’ve heard you earn up to making bad calls and trying to champion positivity in the world. It was really cool to hear a Christian who went to seminary say he had his god-complex moments and that he had to apologize to his family and even churches. It seems like you were both on almost completely the same page coming from similar yet very different backgrounds. Pretty neat conversation both leaning into being your own force for positivity, including your ask at the end about how to handle negativity from his stance. I really appreciated this episode.
Met Jake in the early days of ABR on tour Destroy the Runner. Great guy, very humble a nice guy throughout the early days and even now. Great conversation and insights.
I think what's really needed are loving households ultimately. Non-traditional households, although always a minority, can still provide the loving structure needed to keep someone from destroying their life. What's most important is simply love from parental figures.
Met Jake when they played in Austin back in 2010ish. Cool ass dude he was just chillin in the lobby area of the venue and talked to me and my band mate for about 10 mins.
As a reformed Baptist, I appreciate hearing Jake Luhr's perspective on religion as a whole. I suspect I wouldn't agree with him on some major issues, but his perspective is still refreshing in other ways.
Thank you guys for saying it: men needing to be men and to be shown the way to be men is not political, it's an absolute fact of life. I get so tired of social issues being politicized because they're just simply too subjective for laws to be created around them. Let's let people be who they want to be on a social level but let's not degrade our society to near collapse in the process.
I Crowd Surfed like 6 times at their show at the Rave the last time they were there. Jb acknowledged me like the 5th time. Def worth it.... it was tits lol.
I saw these guys on there messengers tour in Florida at the mojo room. Jake met me after and then took me to dinner at Wendy’s with a few of the other guys from august burns red. The guys legit
Normally i find the church to be a waste of my personal time because i believe in myself, and not in god. However, I could listen to Jake talk all day because his philosophy, faith is so open minded and interesting. Throughout this interview Jake has gained my respect because he seems transparent, genuine and authentic, which is not too normal to come across in my opinion. A very respectful guy, who has matured and grown with his experiences through years. I'm not even a fan of ABR, haha
I have hearing issues, I have been rocking out to Redemption(ALL of Messengers) for years - i just read the lyrics and saw that the entire song is a prayer, and it is EPIC. If they played the shlt in church i might attend, but I dont need a church or a rappy preest to talk to God. I would never say ABR is preachy, the preachy people are the hypocrites and blass femurs. I am good with God and FU if your not. Our Father Who art in Heaven is an alien by this definition and the US gov told us last year aliens are real. As I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, F(orget) fear, I can't wait to watch the shlt show folks. To the good ones, see ya at the next show - for the rest you reap what you sow
A lot of empty words falling apart Jake. A real Christian loves and share with others about his Savior and Lord. “How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?” Romans 10:14
There are few truly Christian metal bands left out there in my opinion. And imo two of the best examples of living out Christianity’s mission and values is Mattie Montgomery from For Today and Jake from ABR. With the right people, think there’s huge potential for a resurgence of Christian bands in the metal scene because so many people need that message so bad. And conversations like this are exactly how we get there Thanks for the interview, much love and respect to both of you!
I have always respected Jake. He's not the best screamer in comparison to current vocalist like will, and CJ but he's very carasmatic and overcame addiction to join ABR
Men a need a father… not a controversial opinion, but in the world of counter culture is. Truly, it is wisdom. Men need fathers, men are 97% of people in jail, men are 98% of job related deaths, men are 99.8% of war related casualties. Can two women raise a good male? Sure but men need dads. Legit
I grew up with a great dad so I'm not speaking from experience, but I think saying men need a father is a bit reductionist. I get the sense that it's mainly about a healthy surrounding in general - even just in a material/financial sense. So I don't see why, for instance, two women shouldn't be able to raise a boy just as well. I don't think there's like an inherent nature to all men that determines us to be a certain way. Just my two cents.
![[#2024MAMA] G-DRAGON - 무제(Untitled, 2014)+POWER+HOME SWEET HOME+뱅뱅뱅+FANTASTIC BABY | Mnet 241123 방송](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ox29z5Nf1Uk/mqdefault.jpg)
Glad you got to meet August Burns Red. August Burns Red seems like such a nice guy.
Yes 😂😂😂😂😂
Wouldn't he be just August? 🤔
Maybe August Burns? Mr. Burns? 😂
August Burns Red shirt guy
I’ve met Jake at a handful of shows and he’s a super legit dude. August Burns Red is one of the most consistent bands over the last 20 years and they just keep getting better.
U still feel that way after listening to their newest album?
@@SuperHighCarlos Wasn’t my favorite, but still a pretty solid album.
@@SuperHighCarlos yep
@@SuperHighCarlos not me bro. I went and took a listen based on your comment and it feels too forced. Messengers carried me along, this one feels like I am waiting for something that aint coming. Still got MAD respect, but I am playing Redemption again to cleanse my soul. The tempo changes and crescendos, thats what does it for me. Stay HIGH Carlos
This was so good. As a Christian, it's definitely offered a lot of self- reflection when I nerd out on theology and apologetics, and neglect good relationship with God and others.
I just went through a divorce myself, and my ex sounds a lot like how Jake described his ex wife (not to mention, I wasn't a very good Christian husband, if I'm being honest). But I've been wrestling with that same notion that "maybe she's mean because she's been through so much pain, and I'm not helping her as much as I think I am just cuz I'm so damn 'knowledgeable' 😢".
Thanks for this interview, Finn. I appreciate you to quite an astonishing degree.
As someone who spent many years in the church and studied a lot of theology, I never thought I'd see the day I'd hear about Calvinism, let alone the book "Debating Calvinism," in a Finn McKenty video, but here we are! Great interview! Jake is a solid dude.
Calvinism is one of those prederminist things, right? Like God knows everything you're going to do before you do it? I never understood that. If God is omniscient, then whether I end up in heaven or hell is already determined, so why would I bother trying? If my destiny is set in stone regardless of what I choose to do, then either I do whatever I want knowing I'm going to hell, or I do whatever I want and somehow I'm going to redeem myself later and get into heaven, I just don't know how that happens yet.
@@PalmelaHanderson It’s one of the characteristics of Calvinism, yes. Essentially, Calvinism teaches that God is sovereign over all things, including one’s salvation. You can look up the acronym TULIP to learn more about the specific doctrines that undergird Calvinism.
The questions you raise are what Jake is alluding to when talking about the Calvinism vs. Arminianism debate. Does god predestine some to heaven and some to hell (Calvinism) or does he give libertarian free will to everybody so they can either choose or reject him (Arminianism)?
A sensible Calvinist would probably answer your questions by saying the Bible teaches both but in a more nuanced way (this view is also known as Compatibilism): God predestines an “elect” people, but he also calls all people everywhere to repent and believe in Christ. These are not mutually exclusive or irreconcilable truths. It’s a mystery that the finite mind can’t fully comprehend, which makes us post-Enlightenment Westerners very uncomfortable.
Side note: Apologies for the nerdy theology lesson. 😆
@@PalmelaHanderson yeah, it's kinda weird and difficult to wrap your head around. I was raised Calvinist. No sure if I still believe it or not. It does feel like some people just have a connection with God and some other people just don't no matter how hard they try. Calvinism would explain that, I guess. A little fatalistic, ngl.
@ed shanks there’s a lot of early church writings condemning predeterminism/fatalism, might be worth checking out. Helped me realize Calvinism is not really what the Bible teaches
@Ed Shanks If you're a struggling Christian, battling what you know to be true with the authority of your church, let me shed some light that I believe is pretty honest as a Christian myself. All denominations are corrupt in varying degrees. Calvanism, Baptists, Catholic, Mormon, Judaism it makes no difference, they all add things to their religion that are not in the Bible. To varying degrees these "rules" are meant to control congregations. My advice, read your Bible and have your own relationship with God, and if you can find a non denominational church that follows the Bible in the way your spirit tells you is correct, then great! Go there! But please don't let a corrupt denomination tear you away from your personal relationship with God.
Also bravo to you Finn, you were extremely polite and respectful to this man and his faith. I like how we can have these kind of conversations without it becoming a debate regardless what you believe
The bit about “men without direction” resonates with me. I spent much of my 20’s a raging nihilistic alcoholic with a tendency to isolate and I’d punch people instead of crying. A lot of “why do anything” and “why live at all” infected my mindset. I still don’t really know what I’d like out of life but I lament the time I spent waiting around to die.
Hey man, I felt compelled to answer your comment bc I felt what I have to say might benefit you in some way, shape or form. Besides it being a worldview that I would like to promote anyway. My post got a bit long, though 😅
Imo there is no real purpose to life, but weirdly enough that gives me a generally positive outlook on life. Like, if there's no purpose here anyway and I will just be gone when I am dead, the best thing I can do is
A) enjoy my time here and marvel at the general beauty of creation and nature and so forth, and
B) create meaning by being as good and constructive as I can be to the people (and other living beings) around me as I can. Life will eventually bring pain through old age and loss of loved ones for all of us, along with constant other worries, so trying to bring positive things to ourselves and others is all we can really do anyway.
For example, my grandma is 95, and I try to spend as much time with her as my life allows me to and be good to her, entertain her, do some trips with her. Because in my belief her whole world, the world that gets created in her consciousness, will be erased the moment she dies, and the only thing I can really do is help l her have as good a time as possible as long as it lasts, right? Imo we create meaning among one another, if that makes sense.
It probably helps that I developed a deep sense of wonder and humility before the world and existence as a whole. As an atheist, that heartfelt positive humility towards god/creation that some religious people have really touched me and struck a chord within me when I experienced it the first time around 14-15 years old.
I hope you can find some meaning or at least joy in life! Besides all the shit out there there's also so much beauty and just general awesomeness around. I hope you can enjoy as much of it as possible! Have a good one :)
@@muenchhausenmusic Couldn't have said it better. Godspeed.
@@muenchhausenmusicawesome comment. I like to to say I am a Christian philosophically and in practice to the best of my ability. Yet as somehow always fascinated with science, reason, sociology, psychology and history I am well aware that the Christian dogma has been crafted in hundreds of different bigoted and politicized forms. For instance the Roman Empire basically cosplaying Christianity so they could absorb more people and create a larger more stable empire. While much of those leaders in practice had no such reciprocal humanistic interests and were ancient times version of the “narcissist materialist basic ignorant bro”.
What you are describing to me is a the most natural blueprint within a unbiased non brain washed human being. Some have called it Humanism.
Have had a friend say he is a humanist and found he was more “Christian” than some those claiming the title. I really enjoyed the Christian side of the Punk/Indie/Rock/Altwrnative Indie Diy Music scene
Because this was during the toxic side of the new hip hop era, the banality of pop country mainstream, and the directionless nihilism of either regular folks in the west or significant portions of the punk metal and hip hop cultures.
Nowdays philosophically and practically would still tell many folks in brief interactions or inquiries that “l am a Christian”. However I am congnizant that this is my geographic inheritance of the most humanist Taoist or Reasonable philosophy available to me in the developed western society.
Truly though as someone recovering from disability still I do believe in certain aspects of modern medicine, so I have availed myself of this therapy.
Plus psychology and mental health care is important.
We live a largely unnatural world mixed with a beautiful natural earth. So nowdays in my view it is justified even if one was straightedge or Christian to for example take a particular medication for a particular time period.
Also counterculturist dogmas of the hippies, or the more nihilist atheistic perspectives of todays various versions of this philosophies will often leave a human directionless.
So the most sensible thing to do is do your best, know yourself and all your unique needs and propensities, and design your life, routine and life compass based on your quiet calm intuition. Today one may require a more ketogenic diet, paleo is a good example and choosing organic foods not covered in pesticides. Also I respect halal and kosher practices of food preparation.
Lastly we now things like Functional medicine and Allopathic medicine and regenerative medicine with the best docs today will synthesize and synchronize/combine protocols of solutions.
Jeet Kun Do by Bruce Lee has been a huge inspiration. He was of course not a perfect man yet he said “Use what works, discard what doesn’t” I really like that and how it will look different for each person. “Live and let live”, “To each his/her/their own”. I am not by any means some master of knowledge even though all my life I have explored these questions deeply all my life.
Yet it would be kind of cool if we perhaps had a church or a religion called “The Church Of Common Sense”. With “Sense” being both a noun, a verb and an adjective. So while I now respect a lot of atheists I will never endorse nihilism nor say it’s inherent to all people. I believe we are evolving and animals have wonderful innocence about them despite their animal nature. Yet we as human kind have evolved a frontal lobe & the capacity for compassion, innovation, & creativity are our saving grace
I had a experience with Jake after a concert. I let him know how his music encouraged me and helped me. I asked if I could pray for him and then he prayed for me. I was that young kid looking for a leader. Thanks Jake!
I met with Jake at a Sydney show when they were supporting Northlane, and I remember telling him "Your music saved my life" in reference to the album 'Rescue & Restore'.
I actually remember him being a little taken aback by my statement, but then saying something to the notion of "I'm glad our music helped you find your way through that time."
Listening to this interview has me recontextualing how 'Rescue & Restore' actually got me through those difficult times, and what Jake really meant.
At the end of the day, that album (specifically songs like 'Spirit Breaker' and 'Echoes') showed me how people can open up and tell a story of a time they were vulnerable and hurt, which then armed me with the tools to do the same with my own peers and eventually go to therapy. Yes, the album was the catalyst for change in my life, but it is the way I used the lessons from that album to live a more positive life that saved me.
ABR are the freaking best
I like that sandcastle metaphor. People often fail to realise how small their world is.
Jake signed by guitar backstage, I only got to meet Matt but I was supposed to go meet and greet them but I missed it because I never been to one before and messed up. I got to meet Matt at least and he brought my guitar to be signed by the entire band! They are the best people and I have been a fan since 2008!!!! I remember being a emo kid going through a lot back then and this band met me in the middle and their individual faith is what made me Christ Curious, and years later I became a believer in Yeshua.
I wouldn’t be the man by I am today without abr. I thank god for them all of the time. They’re so talented and I love how they keep growing for the better always 🙏
I really admire Jake and I’m so thankful to hear Finn talk positively about Christianity. Just saw ABR last month and it was incredible.
Jake is the best frontman in metalcore. His vocals, energy and crowd control (for lack of a better word) are unmatched in the scene. He also seems to be a great person outside of the music.
Watching this 2 days after seeing them in Charlotte front row. Neck still broke.
Saw them there too!🤘🏾🤘🏾
I was there too!!
I was there too!!!
Thanks guys for this great video.
When I was going through my divorce, "breaking promises" really articulated some of the millions of things I felt during that time. However after listening to Jake talking about it I could not help but realize how similarly I felt about it. You can hold on to that resentment, make it grow into hatred and destroy not only yourself, but your relationship with God and others without achieving anything except utter loneliness. I had to realize that not only could I not blame God for something my ex-wife and I broke, but that not all the blame can be put on either her or myself. So to let go, keep loving both yourself, them and in the end wishing them all God’s love and happiness was the best decision I could have made. Doesn’t mean it is easy (been almost 5 years since for me and I still need to remind myself of the fact some times), but at least I know that I did the best with what I had without destroying the fond memories I still have.
@Finn,
Thank you for being so open minded about Christianity. Tbh we aren’t always the most likeable, open minded people ourselves and (to me at the very least) I really admire your willingness to understand our stance. I really hope that I can be as open minded and thoughtful as you towards other people.
@Jake,
One of the most memorable moments I had at a show was the day that you shook my hand after your Cape Town show in South Africa. Here was the frontman of a well known international band shaking my hand at one of their shows. Just know that even though we didn’t speak, that kind gesture meant a lot to me as a fan. God bless you guys!
This was a fantastic interview and a very respectful conversation, Finn. I was curious if/when ABR would make an appearance for this video format; glad to see it happened!
Coming to God saved my life. I was going to end it. I was done. I was moments from unaliving myself and decided instead to give it up to Jesus. Best decision i ever made. Im glad i came from a spot that i did, because i refuse to shove my faith in people's face, love all humans regardless of their belief system, and honestly rarely even talk about my faith with people. I've written songs that touch on it, but otherwise it's a pretty private thing. Anyway, great interview. God is good, punk rock is awesome, life rules, rock on.
Been listening to ABR for 20 years and hearing Jake’s story makes me love them even more. What a sincere, humble guy. We need a lot less judgment in the world and a lot more love and humility, and of all people who should be leading that charge and setting that example it’s Christians, and yet we are seeing rampancy of the opposite behavior, of the highest order. What the hell happened?
This interview was great! Loved the uplifting conversation from both of you, it’s refreshing to see two people with differing ideologies who both want uplifting results out of the conversation.
I grew up in a very Christian household, and used to be quite religious myself. I’ve since pretty much turned away, but I do think if I knew more Christians like Jake, maybe things would be different. The world and religion need more like him.
Same here. Grew up in a super controlling religious family, which obviously helped turn me away from religion. Getting an advanced degree in the sciences also helped. Organized religions are pretty evil overall, I like Jake's more personal take on it.
Same here and i honestly feel like i would've benefitted more if i grew up around someone like Jake. I love my grandfather (god rest his soul) and my family, but I feel extremely relatable with him than and others like him.
@@Cyanoblades that’s the same way I feel. He actually wrote a devotional that I picked up back when I was still working through things after my dad passed away during college and had a shit load of anxiety. Even though I was straying away from religion, it actually helped me a lot with the self-worth and understanding how to accept people. I’m much more sympathetic to the more spiritual types like him that have their own faith but don’t let the dogmas interfere with how they treat others.
@@Alexandria87 agreed. And I’ve always respected that Jake/ABR aren’t afraid to call out hypocritical religious people or ask themselves what if their beliefs are wrong, like in their songs Blackwood and Twenty-One Grams. Overall a group of guys you can’t help but consider good role models, no matter your beliefs
Something that strikes me is how Jake isn't what I always pictured as a typical front man with the life of the party over the top personality. He has his own way of being charismatic and I can tell he is truly genuine. His power is in his actions and he doesn't need to have a huge personality to communicate his truth. On top of that when we are in a time where it's more discouraged to be anything but nihilistic he remains honest about who his is instead of disrespecting all belief systems because it's cool. He wants to break down barriers and help people heal. I always looked up to this man for assisting me in becoming a better man myself since about 2010. Very happy to hear you guys talk about how being a man is under attack. We need this more than ever! So thank you!
Love love love this. Finn, you're so smart and respectful. I love these healthy conversations between Christians and non-Christians.
I’m so excited to give this a listen. My favorite band.
So good to hear you all talk about the importance of men needing strong, loving men in their lives as fathers and father figures. Men have an important role and should be held to the utmost responsibility for leading the next generation of men to be an asset to society and not a liability.
I really appreciated this conversation. I have grown up in the church and have been taken advantage of in and out of the church. Manipulation, jealousy, lies and more was my experience. I still have faith but I truly feel damaged from “the church” and all the division that’s found there most of the time. This conversation shows what it’s all about - no arguing was done here- this conversation was all about love. Not forcing ideology on someone, or telling you you’re wrong. Life is your own journey and no one should tell you how it’s supposed to go or how to think. Growth is an individual journey and sharing our stories without putting up a wall of pre conceived beliefs can sometime restrict the opportunity of love.
You guys said it best though! Thanks for putting this episode on!!
Just a couple of days ago, I thought, it would be so cool to have ABR here. So thanks for having Jake.
Great interview. I appreciated his very candid discussions of being moved and spoken to by the Holy Spirit and not being a tight ass. Praying for more Christians in the public eye like Jake.
Thank you so so so much for this! I honestly got tears in my eyes watching this interview. I have two metalcore bands that I can say are my favourite and August Burns Red is one of those two. And Jake has been such an inspiration to me for years I always wanted for him to be on your show. The way you conducted this interview, how honest and important it was, I'm just really thankful, Finn. And thanks to Jake for being there!
What a pleasant surprise. I was one of those kids that felt like i was "saved" by this band (not literally but I always considered ABRs music as the main thing that got me through rough times in my teenage years). I used to watch all the interviews with Jake back in the day but this is the first i've heard from him in probably almost a decade! Super dope
ABR is my favorite metalcore band. Great to see this. Great interviewing skills there, FinnMck! I respect you and Jake so much more after this.
I appreciate such a respectful conversation!
Yay Jake!!!!! ❤. Can’t wait for the new album
Jake is my hero. I'm not a Christian, but from what I can discern, our foundational beliefs are dead on. You are making the world a better place! Thanks for doing this interview Finn. It was excellent, and your questions are always great.
Awesome conversation. Definitely good advice here. Got me thinking for sure. Much Love to ABR. Thank you and God bless.
you're a really kind soul, Finn!
aside from really enjoying that you engaged so graciously about his faith, I think you really nailed the BIG problem in society/politics today... we don't ever communicate in GOOD FAITH anymore...especially in social media, of course!
Jake is a blessing. Everyone needs to read his book ❤️. Never thought someone I didn't know could have such an impact on my life. Thank you.
His book is very good 💯
Jake is a great guy, relatable I'm how he admits mistakes and just wants to be a little better every time, his respect for people and things is inspiring. Finn it's so refreshing to see an interview that's not asking asinine questions. Thanks for a dose of real.
What an insightful and incredible interview. I've loved ABR since I was in my late teens. Composure was the 1st song where I felt like I wasn't the only person in the world who was going through what I was going through at the time when I 1st heard the song.
That was absolutely beautiful. Thank you both, I really needed that.
This was a great interview thank you Finn and thank you jake 🙏 🤘🔥
Ahh yes Adventure time with Finn & Jake from ABR! Lolz
Such a great dude and a great interview. Keep these interviews coming man, I absolutely love these deep dives into everyone’s backgrounds and stories. Excellent content!
More of these conversations! Solid work Finn
I LOVED THIS WHOLE INTERVIEW!!!
Thanks Finn and Jake, awesome to see a conversation between two humans who have different view points done so well. Great example for the rest of us!🤙
Such a great person. Love Jake!
I'm a Christian and i talk to God all day long. Now, i'm one of those Christians that says "fuck" and "shit" way too much because it is a habit of mine. I had a heroin problem for a decade until 2013 and i'm a little rough around the edges as a result of that life experience, among others. Thanks for giving another Christian a platform to speak on, Finn. It seems you are either Agnostic or Atheist to me just from listening to you talk on past videos but i really appreciate the fact that you don't just call anyone religious a clown or a naïve person. love your channel, homie! didn't expect this interview to ever pop up on here but i LOVE it. 😎
Lol, I'm the same way. I've been gaming with a group of fellow Christians for about two years now, and its hard for me to watch my mouth around them 😂😂😂
I don't really think there is anything wrong with swearing, but I do think being respectful of others who don't want to hear it is important.
@@edshanks2189 dude right there with you! I've always kinda pictured swearing as bad when you are intentionally using it to be mean to someone else...and that is even subjective. for example "Nazi punks fuck off!" isn't bad. 😂 What do y'all play?
@@ghost_to_a_ghost yeah, context is super important. A word is just a word. Society and culture determine what is/isn't "bad". I think as Christians we're supposed to conduct ourselves in a certain way, and it has more to do with our general attitude than what words we use. I used to argue with other Christians about this, but at this point I've realized its much easier to just be polite when your around certain people. Not worth the argument. 🤣
I play Overwatch (technically OW 2 now) with them. Matches can get intense, and I used to be kinda toxic. Playing with them has helped me watch what I say and not be so quick to trash talk my teammates who aren't in the group. The guys I play with are better people than I am 🤣🤣
@@edshanks2189 dude I agree 1000% with everything you said 👍 I have not played much Overwatch but I do have it! you on PC? if you are, add me as a friend on Steam. same username as here on TH-cam. if you are on XBox, let me know and I'll give you my Microsoft account username. I play a lot of different games from PUBG to Minecraft and everything in-between, honestly. I'm a Stardew Valley fanatic as well lol. I gotta open at work tomorrow morning but good talking to ya homie! Lemme know if you wanna play some games sometime! If we ever log on with your Christian friends, I am good at holding my tongue. I cut hair for a living at a barber shop that mostly old men go to and I have gotten pretty good at censoring myself around them. 😜 you have a good nite either way, dude! 😎👍
We need more of this in the world. People that don’t necessarily agree chatting with one another.
I think Finn agrees with 95% of what Jake said. He just doesn’t believe in God. but Finn is a godless christian hahahaha
Great job gentleman!!!! So living and true.
I remember back when ABR was first a rising band. Definitely successful now, yet somehow still feels like they’re downplayed and under appreciated.
We’ve heard you earn up to making bad calls and trying to champion positivity in the world. It was really cool to hear a Christian who went to seminary say he had his god-complex moments and that he had to apologize to his family and even churches.
It seems like you were both on almost completely the same page coming from similar yet very different backgrounds. Pretty neat conversation both leaning into being your own force for positivity, including your ask at the end about how to handle negativity from his stance. I really appreciated this episode.
This is SO good, Jake seems so solid... This has gotta be my favorite one you've done yet Finn 💜
Aaaah man, I need to listen to those guys now! 😂 Great discussion!
Excellent interview! Professional and respectful of both individuals and their viewpoints.
Jake did a great job explaining Faith vs Religion!
As an ex-Christian, I’m pretty quickly turned off by anything religious - but I love people like Jake. One of the good ones. Great interview!
Broooooo!!!!!!! 💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼 awesome work Finn! Love Jake ❤️
Great interview. Well done finn. Good point about the attack on family.
Saw them lalive a few days ago and his mom was there and came on stage it was really cute. They had an amazing set as well.
Was this the Charlotte, NC show? I was at that one too ..thought his mom coming up at the end was pretty great
@@rpgsforever123 yeah it was. That whole encore was great.
I was at the Charlotte show as well.
It was amazing!
Respect to both of you guys
I’m not religious, but I love this band so much and respect what they do in every way
Great live. Thanks for this.
I love this conversation
Met Jake in the early days of ABR on tour Destroy the Runner. Great guy, very humble a nice guy throughout the early days and even now. Great conversation and insights.
Yeasss same here!! I remember that tour and besides humble jakes always been genuine as well
Destroy the runner! What a call back! Forgot all about that band until now. Good tunes
What a great interview.. just what I needed.. thank you
I think what's really needed are loving households ultimately. Non-traditional households, although always a minority, can still provide the loving structure needed to keep someone from destroying their life. What's most important is simply love from parental figures.
August Burns Red is the best
This got so deep and philosophical so quickly
Met Jake when they played in Austin back in 2010ish. Cool ass dude he was just chillin in the lobby area of the venue and talked to me and my band mate for about 10 mins.
Finn, would enjoy a video from you on "The Other F Word".
So many good things in this interview. Thanks Finn. ❤️
Not a fan of ABR, but I got respect for them after seeing them live. Wholesome interview, there is is some depth in this conversation. Good one.
Just seems like a genuinely good dude.
As a reformed Baptist, I appreciate hearing Jake Luhr's perspective on religion as a whole. I suspect I wouldn't agree with him on some major issues, but his perspective is still refreshing in other ways.
Always liked ABR and your shows, Finn. Great ep!
Thank you!
Jake is an idol for me, absolutely love this guy
Lets go! Been looking forward to this
Love Jake and ABR. One of the first metalcore bands I got into
Thank you guys for saying it: men needing to be men and to be shown the way to be men is not political, it's an absolute fact of life. I get so tired of social issues being politicized because they're just simply too subjective for laws to be created around them. Let's let people be who they want to be on a social level but let's not degrade our society to near collapse in the process.
Such a great convo.
Finn is a really thoughtful guy as is Jake.
great interview!
I Crowd Surfed like 6 times at their show at the Rave the last time they were there. Jb acknowledged me like the 5th time. Def worth it.... it was tits lol.
I saw these guys on there messengers tour in Florida at the mojo room. Jake met me after and then took me to dinner at Wendy’s with a few of the other guys from august burns red. The guys legit
Adding to the chorus of people who met Jake at a show. Standup dude.
Cool I got to see them in Club 101 El Paso Texas 2007!!!!!!!
❤ABR
Great interview. This is my second time watching it 😂
Awesome interview!
Love both you lads! Finn can you try to interview Brian Fair from Shadows Fall now that they are back together? Keep up the good work sir!
Normally i find the church to be a waste of my personal time because i believe in myself, and not in god.
However, I could listen to Jake talk all day because his philosophy, faith is so open minded and interesting.
Throughout this interview Jake has gained my respect because he seems transparent, genuine and authentic, which is not too normal to come across in my opinion.
A very respectful guy, who has matured and grown with his experiences through years.
I'm not even a fan of ABR, haha
Great job, Finn.
Great interview, you should interview fit for a king! They’re extremely underrated but sellout shows and merch
Yep I did!
@@FinnMckentyPRMBA shiiiiit I need to look it up, i recently just got into their music and think it’s badass
I have hearing issues, I have been rocking out to Redemption(ALL of Messengers) for years - i just read the lyrics and saw that the entire song is a prayer, and it is EPIC. If they played the shlt in church i might attend, but I dont need a church or a rappy preest to talk to God. I would never say ABR is preachy, the preachy people are the hypocrites and blass femurs. I am good with God and FU if your not. Our Father Who art in Heaven is an alien by this definition and the US gov told us last year aliens are real. As I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, F(orget) fear, I can't wait to watch the shlt show folks. To the good ones, see ya at the next show - for the rest you reap what you sow
A lot of empty words falling apart Jake. A real Christian loves and share with others about his Savior and Lord. “How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?”
Romans 10:14
There are few truly Christian metal bands left out there in my opinion. And imo two of the best examples of living out Christianity’s mission and values is Mattie Montgomery from For Today and Jake from ABR. With the right people, think there’s huge potential for a resurgence of Christian bands in the metal scene because so many people need that message so bad. And conversations like this are exactly how we get there
Thanks for the interview, much love and respect to both of you!
King of metal video? Where did it go?
It felt too mean spirited
I was so hyped to watch that bro, hopefully you will reupload it 🙌
@@FinnMckentyPRMBA based Finn
@@FinnMckentyPRMBA I was in the middle of watching it before it went away!
The hoes were too scared.
Orlando!
Love your shit fin ❤️
Awesome
I have always respected Jake. He's not the best screamer in comparison to current vocalist like will, and CJ but he's very carasmatic and overcame addiction to join ABR
Men a need a father… not a controversial opinion, but in the world of counter culture is. Truly, it is wisdom. Men need fathers, men are 97% of people in jail, men are 98% of job related deaths, men are 99.8% of war related casualties. Can two women raise a good male? Sure but men need dads. Legit
I grew up with a great dad so I'm not speaking from experience, but I think saying men need a father is a bit reductionist. I get the sense that it's mainly about a healthy surrounding in general - even just in a material/financial sense. So I don't see why, for instance, two women shouldn't be able to raise a boy just as well. I don't think there's like an inherent nature to all men that determines us to be a certain way. Just my two cents.