I'm afraid drop bars on any mtb will always be wrong. Plus let's be honest drops have no real advantage anyway because aero is a myth. So.... just ride a retro mtb! Hugely prefer my '93 Cannondale to my modern Gravel bike.
@@willgell9022 I prefer flat bars. Actually, I prefer moto inspired bars like soma dream or the persuader bar I have on my ogre. But, while aero bars are largely mythical, aero person on bike is not. I live in North American steppe land with winds not infrequently hitting 30mph sustained with gusts as much as 60-70mph. I've had gusts nearly take the wheels out from under me. My commute home yesterday was into a 28mph headwind. Aero very much is a thing here.
Good video! For my first bikepacking trip I put a rack on the back of my Gary Fisher Tasajarra and strapped a sleep pad to the handlebars and the tent poles to the top tube. Still needed a small backpack. 50 miles up out of NYC to a state park, camped overnight, and rode back the next day. Replacing bike, will bag accordingly.
That sounds like a LOT of fun! It's all about going out and building on what you've learned. Thanks for watching! We hope to do more bikepacking and gravel riding this year - Felix
It is a misconception that double chainrings are heavier. In fact, the overall system of a 2x di2 GRX is 20-odd grams LIGHTER than the 1x version of the same drivetrain. The reason is that 1 added chainring + the front derailleur and screws are lighter than the bigger cassette and longer rear derailleur arm of a 1x (notwithstanding chain stopper or whatnot). Mind you, 2x is only lighter for di2 versions.
I put a 11-40 t cassette at the back with a 2 times GRC chainring to be able to climb everything. It works as long as I don't do 40t at the back and /large chainring up front.
What I’m loving gravel riding: Slightly more MTB geometry (I’ve got last years Whyte Gisburn v2): it descents better than my 11yo hard tail MTB due to its geometry (except no suspension). I was worried I might be going "too MTB" when I got it, but it’s great. Far more upside than downside. Well, I haven’t notice any downside tbh. Dropper: came with the bike and I thought might be a bit novelty for a gravel bike (I’m a MTBer too). But it means I can have the seat at optimum road height, but just a quick bit of drop, and it makes it much better riding tech, slides and rooty without being "trapped" a little higher than you’d like at top saddle height. GRX groupset: I’ve got 1x so the left hand lever is the dropper lever. Nice. More nice: the in-line hydraulic cross levers GRX has available I got fitted. Long days adventures it’s lovely being able to ride in 3 positions with brakes in all. GRX has the only in-line sub-brake levers for a hydraulic system on the market AFAIK. But, they didn’t get GRX exactly right ‘cuz: I love 1x on my MTBs. I love 1x on my gravel. But when it comes to ratios, the standard GRX 1x is 11-42 on the rear (I guess cuz it’s a standard shimano freehub). SRAM has 10-42 with theirs. My bike came with a 38t 1x. Don’t want any bigger cuz I’m climbing steep stuff, sometimes with a load of luggage. That’s not a standard GRX front ring size, it’s a the one whyte fitted and I agree it’s a good size in the bottom end. But with the shimano 11t it’s just a little easily to sit in the top gear just a shade too easy. So I fitted a SRAM freehub and SRAM 10-42t cassette and now have GRX 1x with a 38t chainring and 10-42t cassette. I find that the spot-on gear ratio for 1x for all the riding I do. Why didn’t shimano ship 1x GRX with their microspline and a 10t option? Chainring: And since I have one on my MTB I got an absolute black oval 38t chainring and keeping the original as a spare. I find that oval shape just evens out the the power and stops you stalling those times you’ve been out adventuring most of the day and makes that slight bonus help to just get you to the top of the ridge when considering you have too much beer in your panniers. Tyres: 700c quite wide rims with some 42mm WTB resolutes. Seem good and fast on tarmac, but still grippy as I could reasonably hope for off road given road performance. That bike happily zips to work pretty much as fast as my vintage road bike, but can adventure all sorts of places that would surprise you. The sheer range of what it does makes it hard to not be ideal for everything except when I need my full-sus MTB or if I wanted to seriously go as fast as possible to the exclusion of everything else on tarmac and no fun cross country short-cut ideas. Superb bike. Lots of comfortable positions. Ideal gear range. Dropper. Pannier rack. As at home commuting on the A27, as getting lost in the beautiful (and sometimes very muddy, steep or rough) countryside. GFTW! 🙂
P.S. cuz they were riser bars I got new straight ones for the in-line brake levers, and flipped the step upside down to account for the loss of rise. Got flared ones cuz I liked the original 500mm bars but they seemed a little wide sometimes. Now they’re a little narrower at the top, but still got the full width of the originals where my hands sit for more control in the the drops. I doubt I’d have changed the originals though if I hadn’t needed flat-top drop ones. But I like them now I have them!
on the point of 1x and 2x drivetrains - There is also the option of "subcompact" 2x chainsets - the so-called "adventure" or gravel 2x - - 48/32 or 46/30 you will get a lot of climb AND sprint with a huge range on what most gravel bikes have for a cassette - i.e. an 11-34t or even up to an 11-36. with Shimano's GRX rear derailleur. A 1x usually goes up to a 38 to 42t front ring - and would only give you a 1 to 1 ratio with not much in the way of sprint. Road doubles have plenty of sprint but not much climb. Subcompact doubles are the way to go - the best of all worlds.
Great video, but let me add two words: Dropper Post. They’re great for off-road riding, and not just the super-technical stuff. When I go off road, I like my center of gravity just a bit lower, and a bit more room for my legs to absorb shocks. Heck, they’re even fun when you pull to a red light and can put both feet flat on the ground while remaining on the saddle.
Different types of terrain. MTBs have to descend steeper stuff so slacker is necessary even if gives up on responde. In road response is considered more important.
i think that refer to riding style in mtb as slacker mean more confident going aggresive down hills, and it's more about steering feel in roadbike as steeper HA mean more fast(aggressive) handling
It's indeed a not so handy word choice. For both mtb and gravel, a slacker head angle means you can tackle more aggressive terrain because the bike becomes more stable and your front wheel sticks out more to the front (less likely to go OTB). In this case - instead of the word "aggressive" - they should have used the word more "nervous" or "agile".
More aggressive road bikes have you leaning farther forward for aerodynamics. Road bikes are ridden fast enough that aerodynamics are more important than handling. On a mountain bike, you need the bikes handling to be completely optimal to handle more aggressive terrain. Wind resistance is not as big an issue on a mountain bike. Handling priorities are also different when terrain is consistent and smooth as under the road bike, versus constantly changing terrain under a mountain bike.
Bikepacking: maybe you should differentiate between handlebar rolls and handlebar bags. Rolls sometimes have to be taken off the handlebar to store the items back into it. I find a frame bag much easier to access than a roll. Some handlebar bags have their opening facing towards the rider, so it's easier to access while riding as opposed to leaning over the lid.
Honest question from an MTB dude: Why would you buy a gravel bike over a hardtail XC MTB? Are you guys using your everyday road bike to also do gravel? < If that's the case I understand it, but I just don't get why you would choose a gravel bike over an XC MTB.... Not hating, I simply don't know.
It's definitely faster on hardpack, and I also prefer a wider range of positions offered by drop bars too. I'm not at all feeling myself stricted in handling compared to flat bars. The only thing that XC MTB will be superior to my current gravel bike is the tire width and therefore grip, especially on loose sand and similar.
I go on long trips with my specialized diverge gravel bike. Sometimes it’s mostly pavement, sometimes just gravel. It’s just easier to adapt. Just switch tires from narrow (25mm) to wide (44mm) but also in between such as 30mm, 38mm; it only depends on the terrain I’m about to ride. Things you can’t do on your mtb... over 100 km in one day and your hands can get fatigued, you re not as aero and light as a bike with dropped handlebars, and whenever you just want to go for a fast ride, you just pump 120 PSI in your tires and can fly. I call it: VERSATILITY
@@4tressed It means "without waiting any longer, right away" So he say: we are going to show these things RIGHT AWAY and then he go's on about subscribing and stuff.
No brainers for gravel riding are......the widest tyres you can fit in the dropouts, tubeless, flared bars (I'm loving the Salsa Cowchippers @ 460mm wide) and a 1x..... I'm an MTB rider some of the time (from 1992) and rapid gear changes are the norm off-road when on drop bar bikes and MTB's when the terrain changes.....I have minced the odd chain here and there over the years on a 2x, so have converted two 2x and one 3x MTB to 1x.....It's personal preference though as 2x is great in a lot of situations...... WTB Resolutes were mentioned early in the video....I've got them in a 42c on my gravel bike and they're good in most circumstances.....I have had problems, of late, on the sticky UK bridleways we get in eastern England as they spin out occasionally when on the really messy stuff....Good tyres though, even with the softish rubber used......I've had countless thorn punctures on these but the tubeless setup I've got copes very well.... Good vid as always
I run 700x38c carbon wheels for speedier rides and 650bx2.1 for multi-day road/off-road adventures with pannier rack/bags. I run a super compact 30/46 up front. 11-42t on the rear for 650b and 11-36t for my carbon wheels.
Flared bars suck - I realized this after about hour 7 of the Belgian Waffle Ride in Cedar City (125 miles) when my arms and upper body were dead. For short rides they're ok, but I am going back to traditional bars with my new gravel build, as they are far more comfortable/give better support and are faster.
Did you try to adjust your body position first? I've switched to flared bars on my road bike after trying it on gravel and still find it the most comfortable option. Conversion required shorter stem for road bike. And I definitely prefer longer rides, 100+ km a day.
@@4tressed My reach is already short on my gravel bike (hence the new frame)....it's impossible to get comfortable on long rides. I'd never use them again.
@@drouleau go for the best for you, of course :) Everybody is unique, so there is no rule that fits all. Just tried to share some personal experience with you.
I really think your body position is not good then, which is not surprising because every single drop bar has a different geometry (flared bars even more different). You might need a different stem or experiment with the angles of your handlebars and/or levers. Fact is that flared handlebars will give you a more neutral body position, so if set up correctly, they should definitely be more comfortable. Another thing I'm thinking of, is the fact that with flared bars you have your hands and arms in a different position, meaning you use different muscles. If your muscles are trained for years on road bars, it's not strange that it takes a while to build up the muscles you were not using in the old position, which you are using now. Imagine training for push ups with your hands close to eachother and your elbows out, when you train like that for years and suddenly you switch to trying push ups with your elbows next to your body or with your hands wide apart, you wont come close to the amount of push ups you were able to do in your old stance. That doesn't mean one is better than the other, just that you trigger some muscles that you didn't train before in your old position. Long story short: don't give up on your flared bars already. Experiment a bit with the angles and give yourself some time to build up the muscles you didnt use in your old position. Flared bars offer a more neutral body position, so when used correctly they will really make (especially longer) rides more comfortable for your body.
@@mrtnknrr It's fine, I'm already going back to normal bars on my new build. There's basically no reason to use flared bars, especially for events where you're trying to go reasonably fast. I also don't really find them to handle any better than normal bars, unless you're bikepacking with a wide handlebar bag and need the clearance....that's about the only reason I can see for using one.
I've been getting into more pff-roading and decided to try a flat bar set-up on my gravel bike. I feel like it's a natural fit. Do you have an opinion on that?
I use different brand, material, width saddles on my different bikes. Tiny stiff saddle for my slammed road bike to a 145mm saddle on my very upright bikepacking bike. For me at least, the more aggressive position the more soft tissue pressure I feel from wider saddles. But wider is better for my seated pressure on more upright geometries
Also not a dumb question. People debate over it. Some people keep same saddle on all bikes. Ultimately, only you can decide what's good for you after a lot of trial
Yes, not a dumb question! Saddles are a difficult one since people's opinions vary so much. We always recommend trying as many as possible on each of your bikes. For gravel riding, I like to use a slightly longer saddle to help me move my weight around the bike better and for me weight is less of an issue. Thanks for watching! - Felix
Does anyone know what the exacrt handlebar model is on the bike @ the 7:00 minute timestamp? Looks like they have 5cm rise on each side from the stem. Thanks!
Depends where you ride. On flat you won't, I ride 38T in the front and my smallest cog is 11T. Until around 45km/h I can keep pace normally, and I can easily spin even a bit above 55km/h. If you want to bomb down steep mountains with 80km/h, you won't have enough gears to keep pedaling. But if you ride non-steep terrain it's more than enough. To be honest, when I ride above 60km/h I dont even want to be pedaling, I just want to keep myself in a stable (and aero) position. The only thing you sacrifice is having small gaps between your gears. So I'd say if you live in high mountains where you sometimes climb for an hour or more, go for 2x (for smaller gaps in the gears when climbing, making it easier to find the be in the perfect gear all the time). But if you ride smaller hills (for example me who rides in 400m high hills) where one moment you're climbing, the next moment you're descending and the next moment you're climbing again, go for 1x (the bigger gaps in the gears means you can shift more quickly, which is nice with fast changing terrain where you never climb for more than 20 minutes).
So MTB riders buy gravel bikes because their MTBs are slow on pavement and flat, unpaved roads. But now gravel tyres are getting wider and wider, basically turning gravel bikes back into mountain bikes just without suspension (for now ...).
Different gear for different terrain. I use a mtb for riding technical terrain and a gravel bike for (off road) touring. A mtb is overkill - slow and boring - on dirt roads, let alone on paved concrete, which - when touring - you will spend at least 30% of the time on when connecting your dirt roads on your tour. Basically a gravel bike is faster on dirt roads and paved roads, making it more fun for touring as well as enables you to cover bigger distances in the same time. Where as the mtb is great for more technical terrain, which is usually rather a relatively short lap (maybe 20km, instead of 100+km) in a small part of the forest. Yes you can use a mtb for gravel, but it's not the ideal machine, the same way a downhill bike with 200mm suspension is not the ideal bike for your XC mtb trail.
Good question! Those are the aptly named Redshift Kitchen Sink handlebars. You can read more about them in Jack's article on BikeRadar.com: www.bikeradar.com/news/redshift-kitchen-sink-handlebar/
#1 tip for dirt/gravel riding: Get some proper MTB/BMX pedals and some proper shoes. Clipped in road bike shoes are idiotic, they give you no advantage, they're useless to walk in and you can't move your feet around. Read the comments above about drop bars giving you several ergonomic positions depending on the situation; the same goes for pedals.
I’m enjoying the bike so far th-cam.com/users/postUgkxMesz3KOGEmwmvyKQfLfrRSUXLFzfVHZA My only real complaints are the brakes and the pedals. I feel like a bike designed for bigger people should have much larger pedals and more heavy duty brakes. I’ve only gotten two really good rides out of it, minimal downhill action, and the brakes feel like they’re already going out. A larger person has more momentum, so I think this wasn’t thought through very well. Also, I wear size 13-14 wide shoes. My feet cramp up on these pedals that are clearly made for smaller feet. Since I’m not a pro rider (and I don’t think many are who purchase this bike) I don’t think that the straps on the pedal are necessary at all. None of this takes away from the enjoyment I get from riding, however. I’ll just head to a bike shop to improve on a few things.
@@thecappy yup! With 500%+ mark ups! Got to pay those marketing teams salaries that try and convince you their frame is better then a no name frame from the same manufacturing plant! With possibly less QC.
@@thecappy Ditto - in the process of getting a custom Merlin Ti Sandstone (although my current Niner RLT9 steel doesn't suck - just too small for me). I refer to carbon gravel bikes as "disposable bikes".
@laplaysu91: I've seen some bike magazines test no name Chinese frames and take X-rays, and the difference was shocking (frames where falling apart from the inside and the thickness was extremely inconsistent). Buying no name Chinese carbon parts is like playing Russian roulette. 5 times there will be no bullet in the gun and you have a safe (just a bit heavier than usual) carbon frame, but 1 out of the 6 will be the bullet and the frame will snap in half on the worst possible moment, creating life treatning situations. I know big bike brands often produce in China as well, but theh have their own factories and their European / American level quality control, where they destroy everything that fails the test. Buying from places like Alibaba, these products do not need to meet American/European quality standards and there is no quality control, so you will be the guinea pig who find out if you got lucky or destroyed your face or even die if it snaps on the wrong moment. I really recommend that if you dont have money for carbon, just buy aluminium from a trusted brand. Risking your health is not worth the cheap carbon parts when you can have proper alu parts for the same price. And I'm not even talking about why we should not buy anything from China, because they are actually currently having a holocaust where they built 100s of camps for Uighurs, of which millions have already disappeared. How they absorb Hong Kong into their dictatorship by sentencing everyone to prison for life who will go on the streets to protest. How their treat their people with their Big Brother system. How they were informed that corona was a virus that would spread all over the world but they just made the scientist who warned the government disappear and acted like nothing was going on. Long story short: Just don't do it.
I don't really understand why someone would want to stuff up a good road bike. Just buy a good dual suspension Mtb for gravel grinds. Speed is irrelevant if you are riding for pleasure but if you have a reasonable ego looking for a trip give a current Emtb a proper long hard and fast ride on proper Mtb tracks and you might even find out why you were born. They are not the work of the Devil but allow us to explore terrain multiplying the benefits of One of mans greatest gravity cheating inventions the bicycle.
Yep, do the trail fast and then die on your way home on tarmack) Either from tiredness or boredom. Yes, MAYBE trails will be slower on a gravel bike, but they still be a lot of fun, as will be the tarmack.
I think what never gets talked about is where you live. I live in Ireland and, by and large, we have roads and trails. But if you live somewhere with actual gravel or unsealed roads I totally get that
Gravel bike for high speed long 100km+ touring / exploring rides through new terrains on mixed surface (from paved roads to single trail), where your goal is to explore the nature you're in, climb many different hills and see many parts of the forest. XC for shorter laps on technical terrain with a slower average speed. Here you don't ride to explore the forest because on technical terrain you cant have a high average speed, meaning the length if the lap is a lot short. Here you ride for the trails and its technical aspects. Yes you can ride gravel / adventure on an XC bike, but the paved parts will be boring as hell, even the dirt roads will be quite boring. Plus your bike is heavier and has a lot more drag, so it's less fun on that terrain and it will limit the distance you can cover during a day, making it less efficient for rides where you aim to explore.
Worth adding, I have both bikes, but when my gravel bike needed to be repaired and I grabbed my 29er hardtail XC bike for a gravel ride, it was really sucking the pleasure out of my gravel ride (too slow and overkill for the terrain).
What do you think of our choices? Let us know what juicy gravel setup tips you have in the comments! 🏞 🚲
At 5:06 in this video..
What are those handlebars?
Best setup: $200 mid/late 90s mtb converted to drops. Shock optional. Use the $2000 you save for beer and plane tickets
That's what I'm currently doing 🤙🏾
I'm afraid drop bars on any mtb will always be wrong. Plus let's be honest drops have no real advantage anyway because aero is a myth. So.... just ride a retro mtb! Hugely prefer my '93 Cannondale to my modern Gravel bike.
@@willgell9022 I prefer flat bars. Actually, I prefer moto inspired bars like soma dream or the persuader bar I have on my ogre. But, while aero bars are largely mythical, aero person on bike is not. I live in North American steppe land with winds not infrequently hitting 30mph sustained with gusts as much as 60-70mph. I've had gusts nearly take the wheels out from under me. My commute home yesterday was into a 28mph headwind. Aero very much is a thing here.
I just purchased GT grade elite 1st thing 1st swapping out handle bars spank vibrocore 30mm uprise with redshift suspension stem
@@lakishaweaks9784 that's the one with those flexible seat stay pseudosuspension yeah? How does it feel?
Good video! For my first bikepacking trip I put a rack on the back of my Gary Fisher Tasajarra and strapped a sleep pad to the handlebars and the tent poles to the top tube. Still needed a small backpack. 50 miles up out of NYC to a state park, camped overnight, and rode back the next day. Replacing bike, will bag accordingly.
That sounds like a LOT of fun! It's all about going out and building on what you've learned. Thanks for watching! We hope to do more bikepacking and gravel riding this year - Felix
It is a misconception that double chainrings are heavier.
In fact, the overall system of a 2x di2 GRX is 20-odd grams LIGHTER than the 1x version of the same drivetrain. The reason is that 1 added chainring + the front derailleur and screws are lighter than the bigger cassette and longer rear derailleur arm of a 1x (notwithstanding chain stopper or whatnot). Mind you, 2x is only lighter for di2 versions.
I put a 11-40 t cassette at the back with a 2 times GRC chainring to be able to climb everything. It works as long as I don't do 40t at the back and /large chainring up front.
What I’m loving gravel riding:
Slightly more MTB geometry (I’ve got last years Whyte Gisburn v2): it descents better than my 11yo hard tail MTB due to its geometry (except no suspension). I was worried I might be going "too MTB" when I got it, but it’s great. Far more upside than downside. Well, I haven’t notice any downside tbh.
Dropper: came with the bike and I thought might be a bit novelty for a gravel bike (I’m a MTBer too). But it means I can have the seat at optimum road height, but just a quick bit of drop, and it makes it much better riding tech, slides and rooty without being "trapped" a little higher than you’d like at top saddle height.
GRX groupset: I’ve got 1x so the left hand lever is the dropper lever. Nice. More nice: the in-line hydraulic cross levers GRX has available I got fitted. Long days adventures it’s lovely being able to ride in 3 positions with brakes in all. GRX has the only in-line sub-brake levers for a hydraulic system on the market AFAIK.
But, they didn’t get GRX exactly right ‘cuz: I love 1x on my MTBs. I love 1x on my gravel. But when it comes to ratios, the standard GRX 1x is 11-42 on the rear (I guess cuz it’s a standard shimano freehub). SRAM has 10-42 with theirs. My bike came with a 38t 1x. Don’t want any bigger cuz I’m climbing steep stuff, sometimes with a load of luggage. That’s not a standard GRX front ring size, it’s a the one whyte fitted and I agree it’s a good size in the bottom end. But with the shimano 11t it’s just a little easily to sit in the top gear just a shade too easy. So I fitted a SRAM freehub and SRAM 10-42t cassette and now have GRX 1x with a 38t chainring and 10-42t cassette. I find that the spot-on gear ratio for 1x for all the riding I do. Why didn’t shimano ship 1x GRX with their microspline and a 10t option?
Chainring: And since I have one on my MTB I got an absolute black oval 38t chainring and keeping the original as a spare. I find that oval shape just evens out the the power and stops you stalling those times you’ve been out adventuring most of the day and makes that slight bonus help to just get you to the top of the ridge when considering you have too much beer in your panniers.
Tyres: 700c quite wide rims with some 42mm WTB resolutes. Seem good and fast on tarmac, but still grippy as I could reasonably hope for off road given road performance.
That bike happily zips to work pretty much as fast as my vintage road bike, but can adventure all sorts of places that would surprise you. The sheer range of what it does makes it hard to not be ideal for everything except when I need my full-sus MTB or if I wanted to seriously go as fast as possible to the exclusion of everything else on tarmac and no fun cross country short-cut ideas. Superb bike. Lots of comfortable positions. Ideal gear range. Dropper. Pannier rack. As at home commuting on the A27, as getting lost in the beautiful (and sometimes very muddy, steep or rough) countryside. GFTW! 🙂
P.S. cuz they were riser bars I got new straight ones for the in-line brake levers, and flipped the step upside down to account for the loss of rise. Got flared ones cuz I liked the original 500mm bars but they seemed a little wide sometimes. Now they’re a little narrower at the top, but still got the full width of the originals where my hands sit for more control in the the drops. I doubt I’d have changed the originals though if I hadn’t needed flat-top drop ones. But I like them now I have them!
I've long, long legs so I put an old dropper on mine today, superb. really drops the CoG, on or off-road.
on the point of 1x and 2x drivetrains -
There is also the option of "subcompact" 2x chainsets - the so-called "adventure" or
gravel 2x - - 48/32 or 46/30 you will get a lot of climb AND sprint with a huge range on what most gravel bikes have for a cassette - i.e. an 11-34t or even up to an 11-36.
with Shimano's GRX rear derailleur.
A 1x usually goes up to a 38 to 42t front ring - and would only give you a 1 to 1 ratio
with not much in the way of sprint. Road doubles have plenty of sprint but not much climb.
Subcompact doubles are the way to go - the best of all worlds.
Great video, but let me add two words: Dropper Post. They’re great for off-road riding, and not just the super-technical stuff. When I go off road, I like my center of gravity just a bit lower, and a bit more room for my legs to absorb shocks.
Heck, they’re even fun when you pull to a red light and can put both feet flat on the ground while remaining on the saddle.
Hi Abe, thanks for your suggestion! That is a very worthy upgrade especially for the more aggressive gravel rider!
Yes waiting on pnw black Friday sale
Pnw components black Friday sale
Funny how we're saying that slacker is more aggresive in mtb yet steeper is more aggresive in drop bar cycling.
Different types of terrain. MTBs have to descend steeper stuff so slacker is necessary even if gives up on responde. In road response is considered more important.
marketing companies trying to relate to Lycra idiots!?
i think that refer to riding style in mtb as slacker mean more confident going aggresive down hills, and it's more about steering feel in roadbike as steeper HA mean more fast(aggressive) handling
It's indeed a not so handy word choice. For both mtb and gravel, a slacker head angle means you can tackle more aggressive terrain because the bike becomes more stable and your front wheel sticks out more to the front (less likely to go OTB). In this case - instead of the word "aggressive" - they should have used the word more "nervous" or "agile".
More aggressive road bikes have you leaning farther forward for aerodynamics. Road bikes are ridden fast enough that aerodynamics are more important than handling. On a mountain bike, you need the bikes handling to be completely optimal to handle more aggressive terrain. Wind resistance is not as big an issue on a mountain bike.
Handling priorities are also different when terrain is consistent and smooth as under the road bike, versus constantly changing terrain under a mountain bike.
The only tip in here about bike setup was #4.
The rest are all parts selection and buying stuff.
That was my thought too. I was expecting to see advice on saddle height, reach, stack bar rotation, cleat position etc
Bikepacking: maybe you should differentiate between handlebar rolls and handlebar bags. Rolls sometimes have to be taken off the handlebar to store the items back into it. I find a frame bag much easier to access than a roll. Some handlebar bags have their opening facing towards the rider, so it's easier to access while riding as opposed to leaning over the lid.
I run a single ring in front and back saving even more weight!
Honest question from an MTB dude: Why would you buy a gravel bike over a hardtail XC MTB? Are you guys using your everyday road bike to also do gravel? < If that's the case I understand it, but I just don't get why you would choose a gravel bike over an XC MTB.... Not hating, I simply don't know.
Basically, they’re much faster on roads and hard packed gravel than mountain bikes.
It's definitely faster on hardpack, and I also prefer a wider range of positions offered by drop bars too.
I'm not at all feeling myself stricted in handling compared to flat bars.
The only thing that XC MTB will be superior to my current gravel bike is the tire width and therefore grip, especially on loose sand and similar.
Good answers and they make sense.
I go on long trips with my specialized diverge gravel bike. Sometimes it’s mostly pavement, sometimes just gravel. It’s just easier to adapt. Just switch tires from narrow (25mm) to wide (44mm) but also in between such as 30mm, 38mm; it only depends on the terrain I’m about to ride. Things you can’t do on your mtb... over 100 km in one day and your hands can get fatigued, you re not as aero and light as a bike with dropped handlebars, and whenever you just want to go for a fast ride, you just pump 120 PSI in your tires and can fly. I call it: VERSATILITY
@@teddybobu98 Thanks for the reply!
Great video
So many TH-camrs don’t know what “without further ado” means.
Can you explain a little bit? I'm not a native speaker, and indeed there are lots of videos I've watched that had this phrase used in them.
@@4tressed It means "without waiting any longer, right away" So he say: we are going to show these things RIGHT AWAY and then he go's on about subscribing and stuff.
@@SenorGonzo thank you! So I got the meaning correct, that's only the exact use case that was "wrong")
@@SenorGonzo ... he goes* on (third person, no apostrophe!) ...
So much ado about nothing 🤗
Great videos
Some very good tips thanks!
No brainers for gravel riding are......the widest tyres you can fit in the dropouts, tubeless, flared bars (I'm loving the Salsa Cowchippers @ 460mm wide) and a 1x.....
I'm an MTB rider some of the time (from 1992) and rapid gear changes are the norm off-road when on drop bar bikes and MTB's when the terrain changes.....I have minced the odd chain here and there over the years on a 2x, so have converted two 2x and one 3x MTB to 1x.....It's personal preference though as 2x is great in a lot of situations......
WTB Resolutes were mentioned early in the video....I've got them in a 42c on my gravel bike and they're good in most circumstances.....I have had problems, of late, on the sticky UK bridleways we get in eastern England as they spin out occasionally when on the really messy stuff....Good tyres though, even with the softish rubber used......I've had countless thorn punctures on these but the tubeless setup I've got copes very well....
Good vid as always
I run 700x38c carbon wheels for speedier rides and 650bx2.1 for multi-day road/off-road adventures with pannier rack/bags. I run a super compact 30/46 up front. 11-42t on the rear for 650b and 11-36t for my carbon wheels.
Just make sure you buy one with a threaded bottom bracket versus pressed fit …
So, they’re making gravel bikes more like road bikes? Or mountain bikes?
What's the handlebars shown in the video at 5:06? Anybody? Anybody? Come on BikeRadar, it's your video. Somebody there knows.
For real what was that ?
Still waiting for an answer!
@BikeRadar Would still like an answer.
Redshift sport kitchen sink bar
Flared bars suck - I realized this after about hour 7 of the Belgian Waffle Ride in Cedar City (125 miles) when my arms and upper body were dead. For short rides they're ok, but I am going back to traditional bars with my new gravel build, as they are far more comfortable/give better support and are faster.
Did you try to adjust your body position first?
I've switched to flared bars on my road bike after trying it on gravel and still find it the most comfortable option. Conversion required shorter stem for road bike.
And I definitely prefer longer rides, 100+ km a day.
@@4tressed My reach is already short on my gravel bike (hence the new frame)....it's impossible to get comfortable on long rides. I'd never use them again.
@@drouleau go for the best for you, of course :) Everybody is unique, so there is no rule that fits all. Just tried to share some personal experience with you.
I really think your body position is not good then, which is not surprising because every single drop bar has a different geometry (flared bars even more different). You might need a different stem or experiment with the angles of your handlebars and/or levers. Fact is that flared handlebars will give you a more neutral body position, so if set up correctly, they should definitely be more comfortable.
Another thing I'm thinking of, is the fact that with flared bars you have your hands and arms in a different position, meaning you use different muscles. If your muscles are trained for years on road bars, it's not strange that it takes a while to build up the muscles you were not using in the old position, which you are using now. Imagine training for push ups with your hands close to eachother and your elbows out, when you train like that for years and suddenly you switch to trying push ups with your elbows next to your body or with your hands wide apart, you wont come close to the amount of push ups you were able to do in your old stance. That doesn't mean one is better than the other, just that you trigger some muscles that you didn't train before in your old position.
Long story short: don't give up on your flared bars already. Experiment a bit with the angles and give yourself some time to build up the muscles you didnt use in your old position. Flared bars offer a more neutral body position, so when used correctly they will really make (especially longer) rides more comfortable for your body.
@@mrtnknrr It's fine, I'm already going back to normal bars on my new build. There's basically no reason to use flared bars, especially for events where you're trying to go reasonably fast. I also don't really find them to handle any better than normal bars, unless you're bikepacking with a wide handlebar bag and need the clearance....that's about the only reason I can see for using one.
I've been getting into more pff-roading and decided to try a flat bar set-up on my gravel bike. I feel like it's a natural fit. Do you have an opinion on that?
Perhaps a dumb q, but do people just use their favoured road saddle for gravel bikes?
I use different brand, material, width saddles on my different bikes. Tiny stiff saddle for my slammed road bike to a 145mm saddle on my very upright bikepacking bike. For me at least, the more aggressive position the more soft tissue pressure I feel from wider saddles. But wider is better for my seated pressure on more upright geometries
Also not a dumb question. People debate over it. Some people keep same saddle on all bikes. Ultimately, only you can decide what's good for you after a lot of trial
@@cjohnson3836 thanks.
Yes, not a dumb question! Saddles are a difficult one since people's opinions vary so much. We always recommend trying as many as possible on each of your bikes. For gravel riding, I like to use a slightly longer saddle to help me move my weight around the bike better and for me weight is less of an issue. Thanks for watching! - Felix
Does anyone know what the exacrt handlebar model is on the bike @ the 7:00 minute timestamp? Looks like they have 5cm rise on each side from the stem. Thanks!
So disappointed in the lack of an exuberant “GOOD-BYEEEE” 🤪
We're sure it'll make a come back! Thanks for watching, from all at BikeRadar!
Do you think a gravel bike like Trek domane is a good bike for 30 to 40 min daily commuting?
I would like to know this too. From my initial research they look like very good value with some versatility too. I'm just beginning this journey
Which bike is on the thumbnail?
When you go to a one by in the front do you sacrifice top speed on the road or is it not to bad
Depends where you ride. On flat you won't, I ride 38T in the front and my smallest cog is 11T. Until around 45km/h I can keep pace normally, and I can easily spin even a bit above 55km/h. If you want to bomb down steep mountains with 80km/h, you won't have enough gears to keep pedaling. But if you ride non-steep terrain it's more than enough. To be honest, when I ride above 60km/h I dont even want to be pedaling, I just want to keep myself in a stable (and aero) position.
The only thing you sacrifice is having small gaps between your gears. So I'd say if you live in high mountains where you sometimes climb for an hour or more, go for 2x (for smaller gaps in the gears when climbing, making it easier to find the be in the perfect gear all the time). But if you ride smaller hills (for example me who rides in 400m high hills) where one moment you're climbing, the next moment you're descending and the next moment you're climbing again, go for 1x (the bigger gaps in the gears means you can shift more quickly, which is nice with fast changing terrain where you never climb for more than 20 minutes).
Guessing based on your name, you're probably also Dutch or Belgian, in which case I would recommend 1x :)
@@mrtnknrr Thanks a lot man!
And I’m from Belgium indeed.
1x have no advantage on gravel bikes, just marketing bullshit
Like the video says, it depends what terrain and topography you're riding. Makes a lot of sense if you don't have the gradients to deal with
Mit Rennrad im Gelände? Wo ist der Spass?
Why all gravel bikes don't have front fork suspension?
Cost, weight, tubeless fat tires... I have a Redshift suspension stem on mine.
I have redshift 2
Have 3 bikes. A hardtail mtb, full suspension mtb and a gravel bike. Why anyone would ride a gravel bike off road is crazy to me
Let the pain hits you until it jits no more
Double ring, always.
So MTB riders buy gravel bikes because their MTBs are slow on pavement and flat, unpaved roads. But now gravel tyres are getting wider and wider, basically turning gravel bikes back into mountain bikes just without suspension (for now ...).
Fewer flats
How about just buy a Mt Bike and be done with it?
just like the pic you guys used of him going downhill with a bike packing set up!
Different gear for different terrain. I use a mtb for riding technical terrain and a gravel bike for (off road) touring. A mtb is overkill - slow and boring - on dirt roads, let alone on paved concrete, which - when touring - you will spend at least 30% of the time on when connecting your dirt roads on your tour. Basically a gravel bike is faster on dirt roads and paved roads, making it more fun for touring as well as enables you to cover bigger distances in the same time.
Where as the mtb is great for more technical terrain, which is usually rather a relatively short lap (maybe 20km, instead of 100+km) in a small part of the forest.
Yes you can use a mtb for gravel, but it's not the ideal machine, the same way a downhill bike with 200mm suspension is not the ideal bike for your XC mtb trail.
What brand are the bars shown at 5:06?
Good question! Those are the aptly named Redshift Kitchen Sink handlebars. You can read more about them in Jack's article on BikeRadar.com:
www.bikeradar.com/news/redshift-kitchen-sink-handlebar/
There is also a set made by Ride Farr.
#1 tip for dirt/gravel riding: Get some proper MTB/BMX pedals and some proper shoes. Clipped in road bike shoes are idiotic, they give you no advantage, they're useless to walk in and you can't move your feet around. Read the comments above about drop bars giving you several ergonomic positions depending on the situation; the same goes for pedals.
I’m enjoying the bike so far th-cam.com/users/postUgkxMesz3KOGEmwmvyKQfLfrRSUXLFzfVHZA My only real complaints are the brakes and the pedals. I feel like a bike designed for bigger people should have much larger pedals and more heavy duty brakes. I’ve only gotten two really good rides out of it, minimal downhill action, and the brakes feel like they’re already going out. A larger person has more momentum, so I think this wasn’t thought through very well. Also, I wear size 13-14 wide shoes. My feet cramp up on these pedals that are clearly made for smaller feet. Since I’m not a pro rider (and I don’t think many are who purchase this bike) I don’t think that the straps on the pedal are necessary at all. None of this takes away from the enjoyment I get from riding, however. I’ll just head to a bike shop to improve on a few things.
Tip 1: Chinese carbon frame
Tip 2: Chinese carbon wheel set
Tip 3: save thousands by doing Tip 1 and 2
Aren't most if not all carbon products coming from China, even from major manufacturers?
@@thecappy yup! With 500%+ mark ups! Got to pay those marketing teams salaries that try and convince you their frame is better then a no name frame from the same manufacturing plant! With possibly less QC.
@@laxplaysu91 absolutely! I learned my lesson on the plastic bikes about a decade ago. I'm going titanium for my next and probably final bike.
@@thecappy Ditto - in the process of getting a custom Merlin Ti Sandstone (although my current Niner RLT9 steel doesn't suck - just too small for me). I refer to carbon gravel bikes as "disposable bikes".
@laplaysu91: I've seen some bike magazines test no name Chinese frames and take X-rays, and the difference was shocking (frames where falling apart from the inside and the thickness was extremely inconsistent). Buying no name Chinese carbon parts is like playing Russian roulette. 5 times there will be no bullet in the gun and you have a safe (just a bit heavier than usual) carbon frame, but 1 out of the 6 will be the bullet and the frame will snap in half on the worst possible moment, creating life treatning situations.
I know big bike brands often produce in China as well, but theh have their own factories and their European / American level quality control, where they destroy everything that fails the test. Buying from places like Alibaba, these products do not need to meet American/European quality standards and there is no quality control, so you will be the guinea pig who find out if you got lucky or destroyed your face or even die if it snaps on the wrong moment.
I really recommend that if you dont have money for carbon, just buy aluminium from a trusted brand. Risking your health is not worth the cheap carbon parts when you can have proper alu parts for the same price.
And I'm not even talking about why we should not buy anything from China, because they are actually currently having a holocaust where they built 100s of camps for Uighurs, of which millions have already disappeared. How they absorb Hong Kong into their dictatorship by sentencing everyone to prison for life who will go on the streets to protest. How their treat their people with their Big Brother system. How they were informed that corona was a virus that would spread all over the world but they just made the scientist who warned the government disappear and acted like nothing was going on.
Long story short: Just don't do it.
First
Congratulations! You've won 1,000,000 genuine BikeRadar gold stars! Thanks for watching, from all at BikeRadar ⭐️
@@bikeradar what would i do to the 1 million geuine bikeradar gold star
@@redimergatus3354 Well that one is totally up to you!
Drop your saddles 20mm everyone. Seriously.
And run your knees ;)
I don't really understand why someone would want to stuff up a good road bike. Just buy a good dual suspension Mtb for gravel grinds. Speed is irrelevant if you are riding for pleasure but if you have a reasonable ego looking for a trip give a current Emtb a proper long hard and fast ride on proper Mtb tracks and you might even find out why you were born. They are not the work of the Devil but allow us to explore terrain multiplying the benefits of One of mans greatest gravity cheating inventions the bicycle.
If you need 2 or more of these changes, just get an mtb
With a road bike and a MTB bike you are perfect!! Gravel bike are stupid.....useless.
I don’t understand why there’s gravel bike😁 An mtb xc bike can better do these trails than a gravel bike 😁
Because a gravel bike works well on roads too.
Yep, do the trail fast and then die on your way home on tarmack) Either from tiredness or boredom.
Yes, MAYBE trails will be slower on a gravel bike, but they still be a lot of fun, as will be the tarmack.
I think what never gets talked about is where you live. I live in Ireland and, by and large, we have roads and trails. But if you live somewhere with actual gravel or unsealed roads I totally get that
Gravel bike for high speed long 100km+ touring / exploring rides through new terrains on mixed surface (from paved roads to single trail), where your goal is to explore the nature you're in, climb many different hills and see many parts of the forest.
XC for shorter laps on technical terrain with a slower average speed. Here you don't ride to explore the forest because on technical terrain you cant have a high average speed, meaning the length if the lap is a lot short. Here you ride for the trails and its technical aspects.
Yes you can ride gravel / adventure on an XC bike, but the paved parts will be boring as hell, even the dirt roads will be quite boring. Plus your bike is heavier and has a lot more drag, so it's less fun on that terrain and it will limit the distance you can cover during a day, making it less efficient for rides where you aim to explore.
Worth adding, I have both bikes, but when my gravel bike needed to be repaired and I grabbed my 29er hardtail XC bike for a gravel ride, it was really sucking the pleasure out of my gravel ride (too slow and overkill for the terrain).