Order The BEST Gaming Table Ever? (Scott is back) S15E13
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ม.ค. 2024
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In S15E13, Scott visits and talks to us about his table quest!
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The RAT tower is honestly the coolest dice tower we've ever seen!!
Scott’s table is too excessive for me personally, but it’s beautiful and I love his passion. I want to see him succeed so much and I hope he can appear on more episodes to see his progress.
So cool the little voice over
Looking forward to more!
All hail CEO-to-be Matt
Please give this to Ed to play with! I believe he could modularize this in 2 days!
The Paladin table seems to be for the extreme 1% of gamers, and doesn't really work for anything but RPG gamers.
The great thing about the MGT/Prophecy is that it works for lots of tabletop gaming, from RPG to war gaming to board gaming.
Might just be a better idea to make and sell the plans, and those who want it could buy the plans and get a local woodworking or do it themselves if they know woodworking.
More specifically his darn D&D LoTR themes. Too niche for me. I prefer agnostic items that can be used/played for any game, not just the (now) lamest RPG in the world: Dummkopfs and Dragheads.
Love the cut narration by Matt
Time to buy/start another company that can do this. Ed can be the lead craftsman
Fuck yes! I need to see that!
Hey Scott, Little unsolicitied advice. Your demand is going to determine the pricepoint here because it is a niche luxury product. It doesn't follow the same rules that WW is currently under. Your best bet is to make a mailing list where people can sign up to get info and then have an ability for folks to put a deposit down on it to hold a place in line. That deposit number will give you the most accurate way to gauge demand. If someone is willing to put $1000-5000 down for something they have no idea what it is going to look like it means they have very high risk tolerance with the funds to buy without second guessing. THAT is your market for something like this. If you only get 10 people that put deposits down then you now have an idea of what your total number of tables you have to build for is gonna be and what you're willing to put in regarding effort/time to get the price down. 25k x 10 means $250k for YOU, materials and labor. If however you get 50 now you can play with price a bit more and spend more time getting that price down to maximize features for price. But again your take will dictate how much effort you put into that. You might consider having two tiers for deposits. One low say $500 that guarantees the table won't cost more than $10k and another high say $5000 where it is just building the best table that is closest to what you have. That will also help determine demand on what kind of build. Make the deposit refundable and make it clear that if there's no deposit there's no guarantee someone else can buy it.
I loved the high-variance dice, i've given away some to other dm's, they love it too. But it's more of a rule-of-cool dm prerogative, not something a player would buy i guess
I like how Wyrmwood is like the big brother mentoring baby Paladin along and helping it follow their path.
Yes, love the exposition 4th wall break at the beginning!
More Scott episodes please!
Prophecy has been around a while and an expansion of the the low volume high-margin brand seems to me a way to assist on the balance sheet. A high-end hex table could fit into this branding and give the prophecy orders a bit of an uplift. Finding the right balance between your internal brand development is a worthwhile challenge to help balance the books and give consumers choice without SKU creep.
I do agree with you as I was thinking a Prophecy tier Hex table would be amazing. The problem with integrating this, is something that happened with player trackers back a few Kickstarters ago, it will need a LOT of refinement as Prophecy line has a certain design guidelines which absolutely clash on with Paladin's design. But I certainly would love to see a more Wyrmwoodesq collaboration, I think that would elevate the hex table even more!
A hex Prophecy would be a beautiful addition. But I think right now it would lead to more cannibalization of the current Propechy sales occurring from MGT.
@@deathsavingbros It depends on how you view cannabalisation. The choice the consumers currently have between brands is critical, also taking into account Market share and consumer trends. You want to build a portfolio that fills the market 'white spaces' that also build right company Profitability. So building brands rather than individual items that fit certain consumer sectors.
I love Paladin Sidequests! Jason as the voice of reason and reality to temper the rest of the childlike wonder in the room, I hope more episodes like this keep cominng!
Matt Mercer came up with a type of roll that creates the high variance effect with regular dice. It's called the *Emphasis Roll.* You roll two D20's, just like Advantage or Disadvantage, and whichever number is farthest from 10 is your roll. Boom, bigger wins, bigger failures, no special dice. It's suggested for whenever a player is doing something really risky. Like "I want to jump off the roof and try to land on my horse and ride away.". Well, that could either go really well or really badly. So, emphasis roll!
It is a great system, but it was Brennan Lee Mulligan that published the rules for it.
@@AJisbackgroundpony Noted! I've just seen the clip of Brennan talking about it and he credited Matt Mercer.
@@VagabondTEthose two chaps are too humble, they will probably credit each other for time eternal
I love high variance dice. I appreciate your genius Doug.
Wasn't wyrmwood just complaining that the prophecy isn't different/special enough compared to the MGT? This is the answer! You are looking for high end and unique I would say this makes the mark and is a prophecy hexy table. Wyrmwood/Paladin high end wood working!
I kind of agree?
Yes this
We need more "Story time with uncle Matt."
On next week’s episode… Crazy Ed what do you have for us? Well I built that crazy hexagon table and I have some ideas how we can do it better and cheaper.
Bring Paladin into Wyrmwood help him with logistics and Kickstarter!!!
Issue is there is no money in it for Wyrmwood and they dont mind helping out Scott, but doesnt mesh with their business.
@@Mutation666
The money is there. If they can get it, license it. He gets a flat rate per table.
It could also be an issue of Scott too. Giving up control of your baby might not be what he wants. He may be trying to hire Wyrmwood like a contractor and they are kinda too big for that now especially since this table might take customers away from Prophecy
Scott doesn’t need the money. He has a successful career that he loves making way more than what he could make with Wyrmwood and Paladin. It wouldn’t make sense to do that. This is just Scott’s side gig passion project and will likely stay that way
@@higgy82 they kind of explained this but not really. they aren't built to make that table. They are built for the MGT, everything is getting cannibalized to meet that demand. Prophecy sales are down because they are probably pushing it less anymore. They can't tear down setups in their machines that have MGT stuff that needs to run and they don't have space/capital to purchase more machines to run something that isn't MGT. He should follow what they told him, find a small custom shop, get a quote on 10 tables, shop that number around, take some deposits, order up the tables and hope it works out lol
Wyrmwood Shark Tank when? Let your woodworking fans pitch ideas!
Another idea for y'all @wyrmwoodgaming, maybe you guys find a way for Scott to take a Hex table and make the decorative elements modular. Like is there some way to "upgrade" the hex table to something similar to this where you can have removable parts (laser cut designs?) where you can trick your table out? Pimp your MGT!
Full-Time, Crazy Ed got this solved in 1 to 2 month max for joinery added to the plans. Add 1 month of testing/assembly + hardware testing, and then you kickstart a smaller batch with a aggressive price to test it without losing money. 350 billable hours at 100$/h is 35,000$, not 70k$. Wyrmwood have their hands full with lead times on MGT. You can't sell a meal to someone's who's full! :P
Scott's table is basically a TARDIS console and I want it soooooo bad.
BRING BACK HIGH VARIANCE DICE! Specifically later this year. Scott’s table is beautiful, it would compete with a Prophecy, with less “dual purpose.” But to be fair, my own game table was build after seeing Scott’s table.
Surely WW is really good at simplifying designs. I feel like this could be done decently well with far fewer parts. Can be changed into a Prophecy hex table if simplified a bit. Integrate it into WW designs and accessories by putting a magnetic rail facing all the players instead of purely magnet-based accessories. Then you could even have Scott find a shop or group of wood-workers willing to do extra custom parts for it. You replace a panel with a fancier one at much higher cost and you have something closer to the original.
I'd love to see Scott, Jason, Bennett, and Crazy Ed collaborate on a project.
It's not a bad idea to make a sect of wrymwood in its own smaller space dedicated to custom furniture, aka prophecy. Heck the whole branch can be called wyrmwood prophecy and it's the chairs and the tables and whatever else you guys design as ultra premium truly handmade furniture.
think that was the point they were making, high cost low volume, not very profitable for wyrmwood
No, I understand that. But between keystone legacy and wyrmwood wanting to elevate prophecy line I think becoming it's own thing and optimizing a space for bespoke furniture would help both.
Scott’s from my town. Big fan!
HIGH VARIANCE DICE!!! I have ordered these every time you have offered them. Brennan Lee Mulligan does a similar thing with 2 D20s and people love it. Every time my folks have a high stakes roll I bust out the tower of doom and they roll one of my HIGH VARIANCE DICE!! from Wyrmwood and they love it when they spectacularly succeed or fail. They all asked me where I got them and if they could order some and then I have to sadly smile and say that they are not available anywhere.
I love when you guys do the "math" meme that a everyday thing for me....."I hear ya" but "I don't hear ya"
For whatever reason I really liked this episode.
This is tough, because I love the Paladin table, but I have no need for another table after my Wyrmwood one. Best of luck Scott!
just a thought but could this be a "prophecy" offer by wyrmwood? that's the only way i could see it working for wyrmwood to do this.
Morning Wyrmlings!
Best show on TH-cam
I bought TWO R.A.T Towers and can't wait for them to arrive later this year as I would need them for a nine-player D&D group.
Oh man I loved the high variance dice. My Players and I love using them in intense situations
My partner and I have talked about getting an MGT, but we currently have a table and do not yet own a home. But the lead time wouldn't necessarily be make or break. If we decide to get one, we will order it and wait.
However, I'm willing to wait for a table because the price is decent. If the price were to go up significantly, I likely would not buy one, even if I could get it the next week.
I use my high variant dice all the time in RP situations. It’s a great tool to have as both a player and DM.
Seeing Season 4 Bobby again was wild.
I could see this being a passion project that gains some grounds and Wyrmwood partnering when the ramp up gets bigger. Because it is a fantastic table. But this would go in a prophecy style line up of expenses even at that point.
The potential of having the Revelation, get it, reveal, cause of the bit in the middle, plus it is a synonym for Prophecy... From Wyrmwood is a good one. Make it double elite, cream of the crop, have it rise to the top. Offer it as a more expensive Prophecy 2.0, and engage the modular bits into the desk's design as well.
Doug! I love my high variance d20. But I don’t use it often because it gets pulled out for the scenarios in which it should either critically succeed or critically fail. For the crazy things! So it doesn’t get used as much as the others, but i love it and it does its job well. I just don’t need lots of them because it doesn’t get used as often…
I loved the high variance dice. I built a whole D&D character off of those. I wish I had gotten more than one set.
I just wanna add I loved the High Variance Dice!
I would buy the plans for the paladin table. Making something like that myself in my shop would be awesome!
I was having a similar thought. Sadly you just can’t justify really high prices on plans alone and the sales would be really small because there just isn’t enough people out there who have the resources/time to build a project like this themselves who would also want the table.
But that said there are so many great designs out there that I would love to see sold as plans so that people could go make their own tables at prices and materials they want/have more control over.
I would 100% get Scott's table for one reason: It's all of the wow-factor of a Prophecy in a much more compact shape.
I have space for a hexagonal gaming table. I don't have space for a big-ass Prophecy.
All of which is moot because 1) Scott hasn't set a price yet, much less opened the order book and 2) Something like this will likely not ship to the UK.
To answer the end cap question: I would be interested if the lead time were lower at the current prices (materials costs notwithstanding). I understand Jason's point about raising the price to reduce demand, but part of the appeal of the MGT is the price.
I would buy an MGT if they were available in Europe. And the lead time was acceptable
European workshop or partner is the next step to conquering the world! If the MGT was available from Europe, not had a huge shipping cost and additional 20-25% of VAT, I would buy it with a lead time of over a year. But not two years, a mans got to have standards.
Love my high varience d20!
Im glad the variant dice didn’t hit. It would be like the roll20 “random” dice roller. Parties get tpk’ed because the dm will get several nat20s and players get way more nat 1s. There’s a reason we usually want to roll real dice when we have used algorithms that favor more highs and lows.
Here's the thing, I liked the RAT. I wanted to get one. I just spent too much money on you guys the last year and ran out of my budget. Please keep offering it.
I loved the high variance dice! still have my glass D20
If I could do this, I would totally buy one of these.
This paladin table is easy. All you need to do. Is break the base down into panel parts (faces); that bolt to one another. The same can be applied to the top part. The inner panel on top screws in; then the entire top assembly sits down on top of the base. And those pillar supports they mentioned earlier are the fastener joints between the top and bottom with face plates. Put in a felt hex fabric on top of the panel, then add a topper panel. Done. I would do this in oak ($12,000); red cedar with black resin ($20,000); and black walnut with black resin ($30,000). Limit your stock to each as 8 | 6 | 3 per every two years and you have a steady source of income every two years. Thats $306,000 every two years 🤷🏼♂️. If that’s not enough for you. Drop it down to every year then
I loved the idea of the RAT, but I had too many outstanding questions about it with my order to risk buying and not being happy with it. I do hope to get one in the future because the idea is excellent.
Man I've been randomly posting crokinole requests for so long, my body is ready.
My players love high variance dice. Some of the funniest moment in my campaign exist because pf those dice
I think at the price being asked, people would want custom elements to their own table. Woods, colours, lighting, motifs and weapons from their own games. He's very much in prophecy territory, but its not a plain table, would need trim options, size options, height option and more.. chairs that match etc Seems like quite a quest, good luck to him.
You could offer to tables, one with the mechanism and another with out it. Also one with carvings to sell apart the details or logos, just like the DM screen
Name: it's a Prophesy SHIELD table. Prophesy-tier quality, but as a hex it's a shield
Broman looks like he’s regretting his life choices at the end there 😂
I own a a set of high variance die and i truly love it. my players on the other hand don't enjoy it nearly as much as i do and my DM won't let me use it for every roll.
I would love one of these tables -- thought it was incredible when I first saw it -- but I highly doubt I could afford it. If it was MGT pricing levels, I'd buy one without even hesitating ofc. I don't even have space for it, but I'd stick it in the basement until we move. In reality though, zero chance it's in my price range.
The problem with high variance dice is that you could just count a regular dice the same way, so it's just a less useful die.
I would have loved a black walnut wargaming table, but it was just too expensive. Price is always going to be a factor, but turn around time is also important. The thing that made caused the most problems on the initial MGT was covid. Now that the time to get a table has dropped from 2+ years to 6-8 months, the challenge is to get those times down even further.
Bromann be like, ok that's 20 more employees... And it's gone... And it's back... And it's gone... Welp back to work.
seems like a cool table to put in the prophesy category. dont see how itd work at the mgt table level. hope he finds a crafter
I love my high variance D20 and my players love it to
I wonder if this could be a "Prophecy" hex table
Sorcery casue of the lift function
High variance dice were/are a bad idea because it reduces the weight of player choice.
Consider taking it to the extreme (ten 1s and ten 20s). You've now created a coin flip with extra steps. Similarly, you could simply use another size dice for your roll. A d12 or a d10 will give you higher variance just the same as a HVd20. We don't use d10s to attack in a d20 system because... the rest of the system isn't designed for it. There are d10 systems for you to use if you like them, and they deal with stats very differently (eg Cyberpunk, where a 5 is a pretty good stat).
Changing a d20 system, even temporarily, into a d10 (or similar) system changes the relative value of your player choices at character creation. A HVd20 benefits characters that are weak in a skill more than those who are strong in it. If you normally have below a 50% probability of success, the HVd20 will always be a benefit. Which, it's fine to give a character a circumstance bonus and if you want to do that with a dice then whatever. But the way TTRPGs work is that characters always have tradeoffs. They're weak in some skills so that they can be strong in others. You have the rogue try to pick the lock, but you want the bard to be your negotiator (as an example, I know you can build either class however you like). If you're frequently pushing the probability distribution of success closer to that coin flip, it makes the characters at the table more similar to each other, thus reducing the impact of player choice.
AND, D&D 5e specifically already has a mechanic to grant a circumstance bonus to probability distribution which still respects the weight of player choices - it's called advantage/disadvantage.
That table would cost 20k for me to make it! That is a lot of work for that design.
This is exactly what Jason was talking about, high price but small and manageable yield.
I think Wrymwood just found the Hexagonal Prophecy design.
While it's fantastic that he added in all his details, if it's going to be a product then it needs to be redesigned to be simpler. Like what about an MGT version that's functionally just an add-on for the hex table? The top is exactly the same and the add-on is a deep base with the elevator unit and a stronger bottom so the table is supported. Heck maybe the "deep base" unit could be adapted to other MGT sizes.
I'll buy 1 or 2 crokinole boards right now. There are like one manufacturer of good boards and you guys should become the 2nd
You know what, hearing Doug talk about how him and Ian started in their wood shop. How did they meet Jason? I've been with this channel since season 1, I don't remember.
We need an MGT pop-up show room road show. Live demos for convincing the spouse. Limited stock to allow some people to leave with tables - sell the floor models and have no teardown.
As a woodworker myself, I would bid that build at about $8K. However, I would sell that table for probably $12-$15K.
"High variance dice" made a D20 more like a coin flip...
My table got pushed back a month. Should be delivered this month. Hopefully it doesn’t get pushed back again
I got the high variance stretch goal metal d20s, and really wish I had full sets.
Have crazy Ed make 2 of these tables with the intent of doing one to spec and the second as a streamlined version.
Thinking back on high variance, I now want a high variance Baldur's Gate 3 game mode.
Honestly, I did not see enough of a push on the random attack tower. It's dope and I would buy one, but I'm not the biggest fan of the wood/style. Any other versions, wood choices on that? Did I miss a video on this product?
Scott does great work!! id say 10k for that if i have to assemble it is fair. if someone assembles it for you id say 15 to 20K is fair
Hopefully I can get the desk in Germany in the future
I wanted a RAT tower, but it not being available to add to cart at launch made it difficult to nail down.
Bit under the weather Doug? take care ❤
I have 5 HVD20s they’re so much fun in my games
How about selling the prints? I get my cnc delivered soon and I would love to try to make one of these tables.... eventually.
I really want a high variance die for our table (despite that we play online but one can dream), but I was never able to remember what they were called or find them anywhere.
This should be sent to a custom designer first. Have someone draw it up in Cabinet Vision and generate a cutlist with drawings. Most of us who are competent on that software have a background in woodworking and would have good sense of what would and would not work designwise and woodwise. Then take it to a mid-size custom shop and get a quote for the labor/machining/finishing/assembly stuff.
I had NO idea the RAT was in that campaign 😢
This sounds like a case of taking custom orders and charging through the nose for it. I would figure out the material cost, including scrap/cut offs. I would then budget generously for time, probably at least $60 per hour and assume an intermediate level woodworker. The time it took him to make his own table would probably work for that. Then add a 25-50% markup. I'd figure up the material cost for a range of woods, and I'd break down the time projections based on different features, to include things like the inlays. The objective should be to make them highly customizable, rather than producing them and trying to find a buyer.
You know I don't even remember seeing anything about the random attack tower....
MEGADESK!
Scott would probably need something akin to WW's infrastructure in order to ship out this type of table at any reasonable scale, AND be able to do all the business shenanigans involved with any sort of product like this... but it's not like WW's to do list isn't already full to bursting, so they've got no bandwidth to spare.
Perfect world, WW would do this as a one-off venture to just test the waters and see how long it'd take to sell 10-20 of them, but realistically the next year or two of WW bandwidth is going to be eaten up with their outstanding obligations, so they'd have complaints out the wazoo if they were to use up bandwidth in making this product feasible and producible.
How can I get that book to build my own Scott's table
I miss the high variance dice