Origin Feats/Backgrounds (D&D Beyond Article) | Nerd Immersion
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ต.ค. 2024
- D&D Beyond article: www.dndbeyond....
As we get ever closer to the 2024 PHB release, I wanted to cover the latest @DnDBeyond article about Origin Feats and Backgrounds!
Thanks for watching!
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On Magic Initiate - they've said in a previous video why it's just Cleric, Druid, and Wizard spells lists. It's a callback to how they were going to have the main 3 spell lists for Arcane, Divine and Primal spells. So now it's Cleric (Divine), Druid (Primal) and Wizard (Arcane).
The main reason is that the other casters have "unique" spells that are thematic to those classes, and allowing you to grab those spells with a Magic Initiate Feat would greatly reduce the desire to play those classes.
Magic Initiate (Paladin) would give any class Smite.
Magic Initiate (Warlock) would give any class Eldritch Blast.
Magic Initiate (Ranger) would give any class that ability to be a better Ranger than the Ranger.
What's neat about the new magic initiate is that, according to the wording in this article anyway, you can choose what attribute is the spellcasting modifier separately from what class the spell came from. This means you can take cure wounds or guiding bolt with intelligence casters or take chromatic orb or grease with wisdom casters
Very nice quality of life change. My group has always house ruled that it works that way.
or shield with a paladin/ranger/clr .....
@@shoganmajere7913 yes but you could do that before since shield doesn't depend on any specific attributes. This new version let's you use your own stat for attack/dc/healing where the old version you had to use the stat of the class you got the spell from which often meant you were using suboptimal modifiers
I preferred the build-your-own version in the Unearthed Arcana, and will be using (and indeed encouraging) custom backgrounds even before the DMG officially introduces it. I just hope D&D Beyond allows for custom backgrounds when the PHB releases.
If a DM ever allowed custom backgrounds before they should allow custom origins, if they didn’t theres really no difference for their players.
@@brilobox2 I allowed custom backgrounds in base 5e, but not custom origins (at least without a good reason). My reasoning was that your background should be purely roleplay, and few characters fit neatly in one of the given backgrounds. So long as you can make sense as to why you have those 2 skills in your background, you can have them. You can even pick 2 skills that seemingly aren't related. Maybe you were a diplomat for a while and got Persuasion, then got chased out of town for a political mistake and had to learn how to live off the land, so you got Survival too.
As for disallowing custom origins, I have only ever seen it used to minmax, and usually to the detriment of the lore of the world that my players are collectively playing in.
If you want to play something that exists in my world but doesn't exist as a playable race, then we can work together to make something that is thematic and balanced. If you just want to play a character with two +2s in both of your main attributes to get double 17s at level 1, then go find a different table. I'm not going to sacrifice the lore of my world for you to play special snowflake Mary Sue.
As it stands, IF my group switches to the 2024 PHB, I am going to implement level 1 stat maximums based on what species they pick. There will be no 17 STR halfling Barbarians at level 1 at my table, for example. In fact, you're going to have to play something like a Goliath or an Orc if you want a 17 STR at level 1.
@@brilobox2except the feat. I'll probably allow my players to change out the feat since some of the options just aren't good.
Don't forget, Warlocks can pick Origin feats with one of their repeatable Invocations. Now, I know you probably won't want to use many of them this way, but picking up Tough and/or Alert (if you hadn't already) sound like a pretty good use of an Invocation to me.
Human warlock can have 3 origin feats. Probably not worth it though.
Use you invocation for something different.
@@Eddy_Grimm I could see Tough, Alert, and either Lucky or Magic Initiate.
@@clarkside4493 Over a pact invocation?
@Eddy_Grimm It's worth it. Some of these are really good. In fact musician would be pretty cool if it didn't seemingly conflict with human.
I'd be happy for them all besides healer (even on a character casting a bunch of heals it doesnt seem good), tavern brawler (seems not good maybe im just not understanding it) and maybe crafter (depends on what you can craft)
Magic intitiate for example let's you grab 2 cantrips and a level 1 spell from Bard, Cleric, Druid or Wizard.
I mean are you going to turn down
I get why you cant pick from Sorcerer, Warlock, Bard. Seems lorewise that Sorcerers are born/ gifted with magic, Warlocks have a personal patron giving them, Bards magic comes from music. You just can rip spells thatceasly from them. But from Druids nature magic, sacred magic Cleric texts and read through a Wizards book. Also Paladins Oath and its magical benefit is personal
* gasp * no Folk Hero??? Yehyeh😂 As a Beast Master or Drake Warden its great!. Other ol favs are Acolyte, Soldier, Outlander and a few others
Frustrating to text on my , smol letterboard phone. I meant " You just cant rip music that easly from them "
And meant Folk Hero is great for say Drake Warden, Beast Master due to the Animal Handling F.H gives
9:02 Alert is so good for an Assassin Rogue
Alert is for anyone trying to go early in initiative especially because it says ally and not party member meaning if a summon or something else gets a good roll you can swap with it as well.
Thanks for going over this one as well as the species. I felt like the official overview was a bit rushed. I'm curious, when DnD started the video series on the PHB, they said it is best to start with the class and then do the species and background. I am of the thought of the opposite where you would need to know your species first and then move to background and then class. I'm betting there isn't really an exact order for character creation even if you created the same character three times doing the order differently each time.
I often try to create a character from the ground up, as if chronologically from their own life.
I was surprised to see the the Urchin is no more. But the Wayfarer is pretty much the same thing so I don’t mind. It’s just funny because I recently made an Urchin Druid with the Playtest.
Technically it says you can pick an old background and I would do it purposefully because it lets me choose the ability scores and feat.
Some of the feats i want on very specific classes. For example being a tough Dwarf gives you +3 hp per level.
@@barcster2003a custom background called Street Rat would do, just reuse Urchin.
@@barcster2003 To be honest, I suspect most DM's will be allowing that Long as you justify. Farmer with alert could simply be a shepherd, alert for attacks on his flock.
@unciuncia420 I still think its a problem. It's mother may I for a feat and stats.
Sure the DM could be awesome but it should just allow options in the players handbook.
@@barcster2003 Yes but anything custom should be discussed with the DM. That’s why the rules for custom Backgrounds are in the DMG
I have an issue with the way backgrounds are handled. It's hard to explain, so I'm going to just give an example.
DM - "Tell me about your character."
Player - "So my parents died when I was young and I had to survive on my own in Waterdeep."
DM - "Oh, so you're a Wayfarer?"
Player - "Um....I guess....?"
DM - "Oh, so that means your good at stealing stuff!"
Player - "Wait. What!? I'm a Paladin! I'm an honorable, knightly-type! Why would you think I would be a thief?"
DM - "Well, you see, all Wayfarers know how to use Thieves Tools, so that means you at LEAST were a criminal of some type."
Do you see the problem?
Yeah they shouldn't have backgrounds
Thanks for saving it's all of them, it did break my heart
thanks for this I have been waiting on information on origin feats
I'm looking forward to make my own with this framework.
Depending on the amount of gold the classes start with and the gold from your background while picking the crafter feat, if crafting materials are purchasable then you could technically start with a pistol for only 100 gold.
Someone already mentioned thematically but there are iconic class spells that really should belong to that class. Viscous Mockery, Sorcerous Burst (If it made it through), Eldritch Blast, Hunter's Mark, and Divine Smite.
I think there is alot of spells they are trying to protect, Hunter's mark is one of them ( wondering if fey touched was changed to prevent players from getting it and hex.) But hex, hellish rebuke, sorcerer burst, vicious mockery, hail of throns, ensarling strike, smite (normal, searing, thunderous and warthful) and more.
Is Sorcerous Burst confirmed to be in the book? I can't find proof that it was made official.. I really want confirmation because it instantly became my favorite damaging cantrip.
Heck yea Ted! I’ll be watching your reviews!
The only background that I will select will be the Folk Hero to be able to choose my ability scores and origin feats 🙏🙏🙏
I'm glad the magic initiate change made it through. Wisdom based true strike is going to be amazing on my melee clerics
Party's fighter need healing? No worries, just trade the assassin initiative with the 8 dex cleric.
Ready action so the wizard can blast the mob with a fireball before I wade in melee? Get that weaksauce outta my face. I can take a whole turn by switching initiative with them.
Bard couldn't shake the effects of mindblast, and the Mind Flayer is about to eat her brain? Nah, son. Not while the low dex Pally who did make the save can swap spots and smite octopus boy to bits.
The new alert doesn't need buffing. That initiative house rule is insane.
Im not really sure if I like it because of the flavor and builds it opens up or what, but the Magic Initiate feat is one of the first things I got excited about the 2024 update. The old one felt a bit clunky, I hope the new Truestrike made it onto the book, I like it more than booming blade honestly.
I'm definitely interested in the Crafter feat and the fast crafting table.
Great video! Please zoom in on the page though
Great video, thanks!
I really mourn the loss of the nifty Background Features and Personality Traits, Ideals, Bonds, and Flaws. It would be nice if the book explained, or at least had a sidebar for, how the DM and the mechanics might make allowances for elements in the Social and Exploration features based on Backgrounds.
And I had hoped that WotC would make the effort to better hard-code the Personality Features like Bonds and Flaws in mechanics, like Heroic Inspiration, instead of as a forgettable suggestion for DMs. For newer players, and those who have a low investment in actual roleplaying, having those mechanics could help incentivize and guide the actual roleplaying elements of the game instead of just leaning into a generic fantasy combat pillar.
Heroic Inspiration is literally just Inspiration. Almost nobody payed attention to the Flaws/Bonds/whatever sections, they were there to remind you how your character behaved, little more. Just because its on the sheet doesn’t mean it has to have mechanical implications.
@brilobox2 I am aware that Heroic Inspiration is the new name for 2014's Inspiration -- my entire comment is predicated on the existing 2014 mechanic that exists in both the PHB and DMG regarding how Inspiration was supposed to be used as a mechanical incentive to reinforce Roleplay and optionally things like Genre or Theme.
I am lamenting that the playtest, and now the 2024 rules, have abandoned an often forgotten feature. We're in an age where contemporary opinion wants to abandon roleplaying tools like Alignment, with its detractors often citing games that utilize other factors to encourage character behavior (loyalties, goals, ethics, etc.). Meanwhile those exact features are represented in the game presently as Ideals, Bonds, and Flaws. I wish that instead of tossing these out, or leaving them toothless, WotC had instead decided to embrace them as levers to enhance the anemic Social and Exploration pillars of the game.
Thinking about Magic Initiate (Druid) with Shillelagh, I wonder what the weapon mastery is for the club?
Tbh the only real thing that disappoints me is that there aren’t any feats with a single ASI included that are available at level one solely because that kinda ruins all of the build ideas I had planned when it came to converting characters I have in 5e that rolled all even ability scores
It's to preserve the fundamental math of the game when using point buy. If you roll even ability scores, you can pick up a nice +1 feat at 4th level (and 8th).
@@SortKaffe I prefer having all my ability scores as even as possible across all levels
Pat says roll high and that he's doing well
As somebody that is always picking their race for the feat that will build defining for my character, having the short list of available feast just kills half the builds I would be going for.
I really like the orgin feat mechanic. I just wish there were more. I really hoped they were going to have higher level feats when they introduced them similar to Pathfinder but nah.. It's just level 1 & level 4+ feats. 🫤
Nah, no thanks. At least for me. Feature creep is exactly the reason I bailed out from PF.
In paper it sounds cool to have that many options, in practice you end up using a fraction of them and the rest go to waste.
Heck, that happens even in 5e but in PF and PF2 it's ridiculous.
weirdly, nobody has addressed yet = can you customise your background, other than the 16 pre-made options? of course most DMs would allow whatever will work, but ideally we can point to a formal Rule as Written to justify
It appears as though, instead of picking a background, you can grab any 2 skills, any +2/+1 or +1/+1/+1 stat bumps, any origin Feat, and any tool proficiency, etc. and just make your own.
Honestly, it's kinda a waste of space in the book, since I feel like everyone is just going to do that.
Do instruments have any mechanical benefit like tools are now gaining? Because the tools having specific items you can craft give a reason to acquire multiple tool proficiencies. But what does the musician feat do for you, other than the flavor of using a different instrument? Unless there's something more to them, there's really no need to have proficiency in multiple instruments, since any one will give you the same benefits that any other would. And since Bards already get some, they have even less incentive to use up an origin feat on it, unless the flavor of swapping instruments is really important to them.
If you ever use the instruments as part of a check you can add your proficiency bonus if you aren’t already adding it from Preformance.
@@brilobox2 But that is any instrument. My point was that there's no need for multiple proficiencies, since a single instrument gives you any instrument-based benefit. Compared to tools that have unique lists of crafting items, depending on the tool. So that's a good reason to get alternative tool proficiencies. But if you can play a lute, you gain nothing by also knowing the recorder.
Looks like a tiefling valor bard with searing smite and booming blade or a human with magic initiate is a superior paladin than the base palading. At 20th level with a longsword it can searing smite for 10d6 fire+4d8 thunder damage, 1d8+5 x2...and if it has spirit guardians up it another 8d8.
Total of 14d8 + 10d6 +10 ability modifier damage in the first attack. And with plate and a shield their ac can be in the high twenties..
These origin feats are crazy
You can't grab Paladin spells with Magic Initiate. I believe the same is true for Bard's Magical Secrets. If you want to Smite, you have to grab a level in Paladin.
In Sage Advice, there's a couple of questions about Magic Initiate and part of one of the answers implies that if you're a wizard and pick the wizard magic initiative feat, you can add the spell to your spellbook.
If this implied feature remains in the new version, then that means that you can the spell to your spellbook, level up, pick a new spell, add that spell to your spellbook, rinse and repeat and fill your spellbook with a bunch of first level spells.
That seems cheesy and any sensible DM would ban that if you were abusing it. Theres no reason for it to be added to your spellbook because its always prepared.
I'd allow it if they pay the cost to add it to their spellbook. The cost of learning a new spell isn't doing to research, it's literally copying it into their magic book with their magic ink.
Sure, they basically skip over a bunch or roleplay stuff to get access to all of the 1st level Wizard spells (eventually) at the cost of their 1st level feat and a bunch of gold.
So playing an older variant human just gets strictly upgraded? Variant feat, origin feat, 3 ability score points rather than 2? Also if it is properly backwards compatible with the new Alert feat it says add proficiency but not you gain proficiency, so a Harengon could get proficiency, get expertise in it, and add Alert on top of it.
Did booming blade and green flame blade make it not the PHB? And if so,did they fix them?
Just a random question but what is your thoughts on why wizards dont have access to spells like hex or hunters mark. Wizards are the only class able to Create spells so it is very feasible that a wizard creates a spell that mimics hunters mark or hex. Just wanted your thoughts on this.
Are you at gen con Ted? If you are will you be covering what is reveled at the panel mixing of the third party d and d beyond partnership stuff? I forget its name but what I think a lot of people want is some kinda road map for what is coming next it’s no longer a fun surprise it’s a annoying reveal with the content we get when it’s not the stuff we really wanna get from those partnerships know what I mean?
Question: Are you restricted on exactly what, or how much, you can reveal from the new PHB? Can you literally just show us the whole book if you want to come the 1st?
I still don't understand why they removed ASI from species just to re-add it on backgrounds. You're just moving the creative bottleneck instead of removing it, which I thought was their intention
I agree it would be better to just have it as part of generating ability scores instead, just streamline an easy "you get a +2 +1 or three +1s." Which is basicslly ehat i let my players do. Though their rationale for this choice was essentially that your background defines your skills rather than what you were born as
@@Chocogrimm yeah I understand in-universe what the logic is, just feels antithetical to previous game design goals. I like your idea of just having it right at the start when generating scores.
I also agree it should be +2/+1 or 3 +1s to any stat you want. Separating it from races was a good choice now just make it it's own thing not forced to be tied to specific stats.
I think is about telling a story, but custom background is pretty much here since you can use any that wasn't revised.
Me personal ill be looking in the scag for good skill combination. Except for my first 2024 build gnome barbarian farmer. Farmer matches everything I need or want on the build.
@@adamg0013 sure but limiting choices like that places a limit on storytelling. Like if Acolyte only offers ASI in Wis, Int or Cha (not sure it does or not, just an example) then it would be inefficient to have an Acolyte Fighter, or Acolyte Barbarian. Just my opinion
D&D 5e = woke
D&D 2024 = super woke
Play the best masculine one: D&D Rules Cyclopedia.
I'm actually glad the background features are gone. Most of them did very little and some were just awkward. Like you always know someone in town... Go to a place you have never been to on another plane and player goes I know someone here and I just wanna be like you didn't even know this place existed until five minutes ago.
I like a number of them but they really should let you choose the feat you want instead of tying it or at least say you can choose ___________ background which lets you choose your ability scores and origin feat. I would purposefully choose a background not in the book simply to pick my stats and my feat.
Im also pretty disappointed in healer that origin feat needs a bit more to it.
Use non-redone backgrounds and you're sound.
There’s already the option for custom backgrounds.
@@FBI_Metal_Slime At the DM's discretions. It's going to be in the DMG not the PHB from what I can work out.
@@FBI_Metal_Slime as a standard rule accessible to players?
@Eddy_Grimm yeah I'd purposefully pick a background not in the book because of it.
@@Eddy_Grimm if a DM ever allowed custom backgrounds they will allow custom origins, and if they didn’t theres no difference for their players.
Sad theirs no background that grants you an origin feat that gives you weapons and armor (cries in Dwarve and Hobgoblin)
Species weapon proficiencies were redundant 90% of the time, but it should be an option in the origin feats.
@@brilobox2 I played one campaign that it became a huge deal once. We all had to start out as commoners with no class features at all. We only had a short list of simple weapons we could use, but race features giving proficiency was a huge deal in the early game.
I dont really like any of the origin feats except for tavern brawler. building a sorcerer but none of them really excite me, probably just going to take magic initiate to pick up spells from another list.
Sorcerer is the only class where I I can't find an obvious contender, but that just means that you're free to pick up Alert, Lucky, or Tough, which are all good on anyone.
I hoped Metamagic Adept would be added as an origin feat and I would probably ask my DM if I could pick that instead? RAW, it's not available until 4th level, but it doesn't have an ability score improvement and isn't super powerful (2 sorcery points can be converted to a 1st level spell slot, which is on par with Magic Initiate).
Really?! Ever since they updated the Magic Initiate feat in the playtest Ive been having lots of fun with it on casters, specially on Cleric, Sorcerer and Warlock. I really like the change, tho I get why others prefer Alert and Lucky.
Really? Seems like a lame take to me. I’m already thinking of a ton of builds that I wanted to do in the past but all required variant human that I can now do with any species.
@@brilobox2 in my opinion most of them are decent feats but don't help create a build that I am going for. When I think about available feats in the game that I want to take, none of them are on the origin list.
Hopefully this video will be watchable without all the intrusive Ads...
UBlock.
Is there specific 8th and 12th levels feats
The more I hear about the new character creation the less it makes sense narratively.
Why? Does how you spent your early life matter less than what you were born as? Don’t answer, its rhetorical. A custom origin solves every problem, and if a DM allowed custom backgrounds (any good one would) in the past they will allow custom origins.
@@brilobox2 If you're talking about the how attribute modifiers were tied to race instead of background, then how you spend your attribute points is literally your background, and your +2/+1 was your race.
Seriously, if you use the standard array, 72 of your points are your background and 3 are your race (usually), that's 96% of your attributes being linked to your background and 4% linked to your species. At worst, 92% of your stats are background and 8% are your species (assuming a 15, 15, 15, 8, 8, 8, point buy and a vanilla human with a +1 in all attributes).
"My race is halfling, but my background was a blacksmith, so I should be strong!" GREAT! Put a 15 in STR. You're now a strong halfling! What? You don't like that the Orc has a 17? Well guess what? He's an Orc. Orcs are STRONGER than Halflings on average! The strongest Orc is going to be stronger than the strongest Halfling, barring magic.
Some of me asked!
So it seems to me that in order to avoid bioessentialism and the appearance of being racist, all they have done with these reworked backgrounds is made them a stereotype of another color and classist. Backgrounds as a distinct named entity with different names and different qualities are completely useless. Just pick your ability score increases, pick a feat, pick two proficiencies and a toolset and be done with it. If you want to give it a cutesy nickname, good for you. In order to fix one perceived problem, all they've done is create another one, and as awkwardly as they could.
Hhhmmm…
~_~
I have found that 5e and now 5.5e is more video game more than dnd. Not a fan of feats.
I have decided to hunted my 5e with the simplicity of shadow dark and writing my own that still keeps some resource management