Since some of you might be curious to the DPS Calculations in the build... Mangs vs 0 LR monster: 35,767 Infinity vs 0 LR monster: 28,097 Mangs vs 50 LR monster: 32,906 Infinity vs 50 LR monster: 28,097 Mangs vs 100 LR monster: 12,698 Infinity vs 100 LR monster: 14,892 Mangs vs Diablo Clone: 24,858 Infinity vs Diablo Clone: 24,445 And on top of that, because the Merc in the Mang Sorc Nova build is using Infinity over Insight, your merc is also helping more with CB procs.
@@msan7534 to my knowledge the only monster in the game that is 95% light res is Diablo clone. So those numbers are there. Light immune monsters > 100%, will be knocked down to 95% after sunder. and that is represented but the 100% LR in the above.
@smalps-gaming 3 energy shield , 3 nova base for obsession with coh/forti gives you better dps than Mangs overall to sum it up : any non light broken immune more levels into nova will net better dps any broken immune will net better dps from - to light res
@@user-ei3fw5ct3s yes, you will get more dps for the non immunes that way but less for light immunes that are broken. The point of the mangs build is that its a great blend of both. It falls in the middle of both while still maintaining a high QOL.
200fcr setup with obsession build deals 11k to immunes and 43k to non immunes, where this setup deals 13k and 37k, tit-for-tat damage comparison. With your same setup utilizing a +3 powered amulet instead of maras, you'll be at a more respectable 14k and 39k. -- A +6nova orb without mastery and only 1 facet or +5 2-facet still without mastery using lidless is superior to this build, which are fairly cheap to buy, damage being higher in each category. Cmoon/lidless setup not being far off as well, competing with 15k to immunes and 33k to non-immune. There's really not much of a difference in overall kill speed when comparing any of these builds, this is only another 'slightly modified' setup that gets a pass as usable. -- Not bashing, it's fun to see something different, I dislike the 'new meta' labeling is all when it's still inferior to an easily obtainable +5 orb build with lidless.
That is fair to say. If you label meta as only dmg, there are better options. I like the blend of dmg, survive ability, clear speeds, as well as ease of getting the items. In a lot of cases, there are super GG rare items that are "better" but almost impossible to attain. When comparing this setup to the infinity holding version, which most people use. I consider this 'slightly better.' In D2, slightly better means a lot.
I actually like the fact that in the end all these builds are not that far off from each other. It allows people to work with what they end up finding, and not trashing one equip just cos it's not the best in slot. This combined with the fact that hunt for the perfect item will take forever or may never happen only makes sense for diablo 2 to be healthier / fun game.
@@xlatheblackdragon705 Agreed my man! There are so many cool options and ways to put a build together, and people value different things, and play in their own way. I think its cool that an item like this that is SO hard to find, can have value and a special place in a build in the game.
Also, I think something that's worth mentioning is static field. Nova sorc static field has a larger effect radius than conviction. Thus, the -55% lightning res of infinity will be important even on 0% lightning resist mobs outside of this conviction radius when they get hit with static. The infinity build will generally deal with lower health minions once static field is cast even if the minion originally had 0% lightning resist.
This is true. And mentioned in the video. Static field is going to be more effective with infinity in hand because of the massive -ELR that you have. While it is better, it doesn’t result in faster clear speeds overall. Mangs static still works and has a larger radius although not as effective as infinity, then your gap in dmg finishes the job.
I personally attained one of these staffs through a trade today as soon as I saw your video here. The build surprised me for sure. It’s a bit less damage to broken immunes, but more damage to non immunes like you said. I find it to be a bit faster on players 1-4, but a bit slower on players 8 in certain areas like chaos sanc and Baal. I particular like this build because it allows me to have much more +skills. I have a 32 yard static field radius which is amazing, and I was able to put my last 8 points into warmth so I’m getting about 330% additional regen from the level 25 warmth. It’s certainly much better than the infinity build when it comes to your static distance and mana regen. I would consider it to be very close to the infinity build which surprised the heck out of me. I’m not even so sure it’s any slower on the broken immunes because my damage per nova is so much higher. I’d have to do more play testing to really see. Thanks for the video, you’ve reignited my passion for d2 today, and got me playing again!
There we go my man! You see the light after play testing it. It def does less dmg to broken immunes than infinity, but not by much. And it does a lot more dmg vs regular monsters and all act bosses. In my CS testing it was faster on P8 then infinity. It took me 2:04 to full clear with mangs vs 2:24 with infinity. Also the benefit, if you are not a 99 build, you get to level 40 ES much easier. So for leveling it’s better.
I'm not a fun of the self-infi build myself, but "It’s certainly much better than the infinity build when it comes to your static distance and mana regen" - how is it better in terms of mana regen, when self-infi means insight on merc = ~700% mana regen : >
@@Smakenzi I said infinity build is certainly better for mana regen and static due to holding infinity for -55 ELR and because you have insight on the merc, BUT mang song static is still good and fine. You have more range in Mang song setup for static.
one thing to consider is that with obsession you can go to 200 fcr, which increases clear speed considerably. Wonder if anyone done the math of how close the faster casting nova gets to a self wield inf, also the tele speed added (considering a +3 nova +3 light mastery). Another option that i liked for MF is full FCR gear, 2-20 ammy + magefist + 2 fcr rings along with enigma and self wield inf, which keeps u at 105 BP and u get the mf and DR. lower dmg ofc but the MF is real nice to make a all round farming build
I have a build up for 200 FCR, and I am using it now as I am farming keys for Ubers running, and its considerably slower in kill speed than Mang song. and that's on P1. If you were doing like CS and JUST taking out the unique monsters and trying to seal pop, then it might be faster, but if you are full clearing its slower for sure. like infinity holding. for MF, you could just run MF charms and get close to 200. Or I use tals set when running it for like 250+ MF. But I don't center any builds really for MF. I don't personally care for MF.
Found a mang song 2 weeks ago and am still without an infinity so I’ve been using a mang song over cmoon and have been digging it. Glad I’m actually being semi efficient when I was basically just stoked to rock some rare stuff.
@@smalps-gaming mana 3000, mana regen 40%, mana recovery rate 234% from level 18 warmth. (After CTA) And yes, silkweave. Also I am 3 skiller less because I don’t want to pick up to cube. So extra 3 points to energy shield.
The problem is that the lightning immunes is the big issue the rest of the mobs melts anyway. Cool alternate build tho and the one thing i personaly could use this is if I went an enigma self weild build for mf and life on kill. Then this could actually be good since u get fcr and dont need to get 2/20 amu + 2 rings instead of soj to make it work with an self weild infinity. But overall I prefer having insight on my merc for survivability with an ES sorc and then u need the infinity on urself. Btw all my mercs go with fortidude, they wont die on 8player and to a lot more dmg, just a tip.
When talking clear speeds, the part that usually slow you down are the light immunes, in this case for example, self wielding infinity would be doing like 14k dps, and mangs is doing 13k dps. So its not a huge difference. But then vs all other mobs, you are doing 36k dps vs infinitys 26k. So you make up the time. Also because you do more DPS vs all bosses, you make up time that way. 4100 mana, lots of points into warmth, no issues with survival on P8. Also merc doesn’t die anyway. I know forti is a good setup but, forti and andy is like the old meta. Cure is so helpful and BiS in my opinion.
@@smalps-gaming how can u invest a lot of points into warmth? nova + mastery + stat + telek + es then u wont have any points left to spare? I like it except the fact u need merc to use infinity and u wont have an insight merc. I use cure, the point is cure works with foti. My mercs always got insight/cure/medi and I always use forti with that. The point is they dont need life leach to survive. Mb if ur doing ubers but for any other content they don't no matter player count.
@@smalps-gaming Also this is wrong "When talking clear speeds, the part that usually slow you down are the light immunes, in this case for example, self wielding infinity would be doing like 14k dps, and mangs is doing 13k dps. But then vs all other mobs, you are doing 36k dps vs infinitys 26k. " You need to compare when using the same gear and then mang + ormus vs infinity vs ormus is 13,1k vs 15,3k and 36,4k vs 28,7k.
@@smalps-gaming Idk what happened to my first reply. I use cure build for mercs just going with fortidude. He never dies anyway so he just do tons of more dmg. I like the idea of mangs but a big thing for me is that merc can use insight and u will lose this with mangs build. I also dont get how u can put more points in warmth since nova+mastery+stat+telek+ES consumes them
@@alca7538 I can see that. the +2 skills on the merc armor from COH is more important than the DMG for me. The merc in this build doesn't need to do any dmg anyway. Most end game builds the merc doesn't help much other than their aura's. The +2 skills will boost the Prayer aura for better healing. You don't need to max ES because of Mangs, so there are 8 points left over, and all those can go into Warmth. So you get 300+% Mana regen from the base points plus all the skill points. Insight merc would do less dmg than a merc with infinity doing CB dmg anyway too. The main time the merc actually helps you is with act bosses.
Cure is ladder only and on SP yes. But by this time most people on NL can have it too, because of ladder seasons and through trade. I play NL and have 3 cures. If you don’t have cure, you can use Andy helm. The +2 skills will boost your mercs aura
Crescent is so fun to use. Early on p3 clears are a breeze on an ohm rune worth setup. Most of which you find first or second day. (if you grind like we do lmao) Great video for a different perspective though. I'm gonna tinker with this idea a bit via sp. You ever try IK set on a sorc before? UBER MELTER. I'll leave it up to you to figure out what skills and setup is used :D
Awesome vid! I've thrown away a bunch of Mang Song's, but I don't recall ever getting a +5 before, so I might go hunting for one. Sorry for the dumb question, but how are you playing with 7 other players on console? I don't mean setting things to players8 -- it looks like you're in a full game online.
Mang song is always +5, that doesn’t change. What changes is the roll on the -res. It ranges from -7 to -15. Playing console online PS5, you can have 8 players. Online switch is only limited to P4. Is that what you mean?
7:12 - if i lose my merc, i lose infinity and i deal less damage. Uber Mifiso is unaffected by your conviction aura regardless of if your merc is up or not. Conviction aura is a dominate aura only. Only one entity can hold it, and it's the highest level of it. Your merc conviction aura is level 12, Uber Mifiso is level 20. Meaning Mifiso is not under conviction, regardless of your merc being up or not. your damage is constant - except for the raw jab damage of your merc. Other than that.... valid points whole way through, is it better than a hoto+sprit set up? both +5 skills, but one is 75% fcr, other is 30% fcr and -20 light res +5light damage, hmmmm, im not convinced. but change is hard to accept.
That is correct that conviction does not apply to mephisto because the conviction aura is lower than his, but you lose the 40% CB on Infinity which is big. Also with nova since you are barely doing more DPS than the regen rate, you need the dmg. IMO it’s better than Hoto+Spirit and generally does more DPS. Having played many Nova setups, it feels the best and most consistent. Even swapping to 200 FCR, the clear speeds slow down despite the 200 FCR movement. As stated: the major benefits are more mana, more life, more res, at the expense that the regen is slightly less than with infinity holding setup. I also like that it’s 0% MF, looks cool, and exclusive because of the rarity of Mang’s Song. 👍🏼
the question is what is more valuable for you, -40 enemy resist or 5 all skills with 35fcr... minus resist always beats every other stat imo, so it depends what are you prefer... but still "new meta" for title is a bit strong.
If we are talking all BiS gear, the difference is -30 ELR. Mangs BiS is -50. and infinity holding is -80. When you consider the lower res monsters... you already hit the -100 ELR cap, which is why Mangs does more dmg vs all those non immunes. So your clear speed is faster there. So the only case where infinity "beats" mangs is vs light immunes monsters, which the difference in dmg is about 2k DPS and about .5 seconds. So you make up the time by increasing your clear speed vs all monsters and act bosses. What you gain, is 1000+ mana, more overall res in the build for survivability, and better average DPS. So when you consider "what is important for you" Yes you have to take all these things into consideration.
@@smalps-gaming the bis difference is -35 elr tho, but nvm...sorry man ive talked about my novasorc:D but dont forget about the lvl 17 meditation, it gives you 700% mana regen
CM is a good budget option, Infinity holding is also the other good option. This, IMO is just slightly better than infinity holding. But it takes a super unique to make it happen!
Is Nova a good starter? Trying the new ladder and want to play Nova, just feels like it cost too much mana early on.. Do you perhaps have some suggestion for leveling? Doesn't matter if the DPs is low, as long as I can play Nova :D
You can def play Nova from the start. Its often used in speed running as well. But once you get insight on the merc then you will be fine on mana. Crescent moon or tals set are good budget options for nova.
Start with Large Ax or Broad Ax. Sorc can attack with a two-handed ax at the same speed as a wooden staff. 1 point into Frozen Ammor, 1 point into Frost Nova, 1 point into Warm and don't increase anything with remaining skill points. 6 points into Static Field and then focus on Nova. I can clear every monster camp on P8 with Frost Nova + 3x Static Field + 1-2 Nova. MP won't be a problem. Find an Insign Polearm for the Merc and now you can spam Nova freely until you meet some damn Succubus
One thing to consider is that conviction aura takes around 0.5-1 second to apply. Which often times, you already done dishing out majority of the damage. So I would like to see the calculation WITHOUT conviction aura. Also, can you share the sheet? I would like to double check the numbers, thanks!
The sheet is linked in the reddit post by Pavke. And yes it takes .5 seconds for conviction to apply. Also the difference in Time to kill, infinity vs Mangs against a light immune monster is .5 second difference.
The thing that most people overlook is that when you self wield infinity, with conviction you are hitting the -100 ELR cap for every monster 0-50 Light res. Which is most monsters in the game. So you are actually capped on dmg. Where Mangs is higher dmg by almost 20% for all those monsters. Infinity IS more dmg vs light immunes. So higher average dps for mangs ✅ higher clear speed overall ✅ higher dmg and clear speed vs all act bosses ✅
@@smalps-gaming With some thinking, for non-lightening-immune, that 0.5 second will make the performance difference smaller. Because while conviction is not applied, both setups without -70 from conviction, the -55 from infinity actually stands out. And conviction is usually not applied in first or second nova.
@@chris.w391 I’m assuming at P8 you are doing static first. In this case, infinity still will be more effective than mangs. By the time you are doing novas, conviction is applied. You can test it for yourself, but mangs through the CS is faster than Infinity in my testing. P1 speeds don’t really matter as they are dead in about the same time in either setup.
Good setup. You will do a lot of dmg on the plus side, but not as much vs immunes. Ubers would be fine with that. All but Mephy. You really need to self weild infinity for Uber meph.
Viper is final. I don’t want to lose 35 all res, 1 all skill, 13 MDR just for 2 points in nova. Also going ormus, now you will need 10 FCR from somewhere else. So you lose either mana from the gloves, or a skill point and mana if you go FCR ring. You could go FCR ammy, but then you lose another 30 all res and +2 all skills. So the gain in slight dmg is not worth the QOL losses. 👍🏼
I play single and threw away a few Mang's, only keeping my eth one for the grail showcase (which is -12% lightning res). I wonder how were the ones I ditched now haha
Haha yes!! My first mangs I dropped came from Baal and I ALMOST dropped it because it wasn’t “that” good. Glad I kept it as I realized it was a trophy item in the game. My roll wasn’t good, but got this through trade because no one knows its value. I’m sure there are a lot more folks checking their mangs now!
So cows have 15 light res, so you are saying that infinity -55% light res plus gear and conviction aura is worse than plus skills because we already hit -100 light res that’s it?
7:10 Infinity does nothing in this situation. Mephisto's conviction is level 20 and infinity has lvl 12. Uber Mephisto's conviction will nullify the infinity's conviction entirely.
@@smalps-gaming Sunder charm or not, Higher level conviction only applies, in this case uber mephs convicton. Infinity against uber meph is only good if you are self wielding it because of the flat -% lightning resistance, but the aura itself will be completely nullified and won't do anything at all as long as Uber meph is around
It does. So the most you can get a monster to is -100 ELR. So with infinity in hand, plus all the other gear you are already over -100 ELR. So with that setup you can’t squeeze out anymore dmg. Which is why Mangs does more dmg vs the non immune monsters, because you can get more dmg from the + side of things with the added +5 all skills. The - res from the sunder charm, if that is what you are thinking of, only affects your characters res. Not the res of the monsters.
@@blaiseaka7157 yes because of the -100 Res cap. If a monster has 0 LR, conviction brings that down to -85, Then on gear SW Infinity build will have over -70 ELR, so you are already at -100. With 50 res, conviction brings it down by -85 to -35, then -70 from gear, and you are again over -100. so its the same.
I have a 3 nova obsession. The dmg is higher for 0light immunes, but because you have no added -ELR with it, its not really better. And then vs light immunes, its much weaker/slower than both infinity holding and mangs. And when you push to 200 FCR version, you are sacrificing plus to skills to get the faster breakpoint, and again is falls short vs immunes. But is higher for 0. Mangs is sitting in the middle for both which makes it clear faster overall.
nice vid as per your excel chart, the eschuta+ormus combo does max damage in both sunder and non-sunder setups, is that right? just wanted to ask if i don't sing the mang song , i can maximize my nova sorc build :)
that is correct. Eschutas+ormus will have the highest up side dmg, but your QOL will be low, as well as your dmg vs light immunes is going to be very low. So the overall clear speed will be slowed down.
@@smalps-gaming thanks for reply by QOL you mean mana regen? i can use cure+insight+coh on prayer merc. that should help since you have done lot of research/number crunching on Nova sorc, what would be best gear choices as per you, if cost of gear is not a limiting factor? yes I know finding a perfect obsession base would be next to impossible or its price would be like gazillion HRs, but otherwise humanly gettable gear choices.
@@jaspreetsingh9592 Well yea that is the thing, if you choose Eschutas+ormus, for the highest light dmg vs non immunes, you have to put in 156 str to get spirit, which lowers your mana pool, which means less survive ability. Then you will need to make up the FCR somewhere else, so you likely need a FCR ammy, so then you lose the 30 All res, and life/mana there from no longer having the plus to all skills. Because of Ormus, you lose the 35 All res, and 13 MDR which is probably the most important on this build. Then because of all that, you need Infinity on the merc, so you cannot use insight. So less, life, less mana, less res, less regen, overall less QOL for slightly more dmg vs non immunes. This is why its not recommended. I perfect base obsession, isn't much better. IF you are going obsession, its probably best to shoot for 200 FCR, but in that case, you do have much higher DPS vs non immunes, but again your QOL is much lower because you lose a lot of plus to skills to get to 200 FCR. Best setup for endgame would be this Mangs setup seen here, or Infinity holding. Both have a very high QOL along with clear speeds and survive ability.
@@smalps-gaming Seems like the upside is the best if you put on ormus. Without it it's kind of a wash or a little worse as infinity gets better cure, mana Regen, damage vs immunities, high res monsters(pit lord's 75% res). With Ormus the only thing slightly less is immunities(and actually very comparable) and you generally get say 25% more damage (rough in head math). I think poison resis and magic damage reduction are the only problem points in doing that but I'd say in terms of overall best damage output that's the best version.
@@JustADudeGamer my main focus with this build is fastest overall clear speeds and quality of life. With ormus, you gain slightly more dmg, at the cost of a lot of QOL. There are other options if you want absolute max dmg, but again that’s only on paper. The the QOL would be rough. This was the best of both worlds as it’s got faster overall clear speeds vs SW Infinity in CS and most area’s while maintaining a high QOL with res, and a huge mana pool. Better vs bosses too. And vs light immunes, its almost the same, because at 12k dps vs 14k dps, its like both 2-3 casts of nova. When you are level 99, survival isn’t really much of a problem anymore. So the life regen/mana regen isn’t a problem either. You just level everything in the game without much issue.
Oh they are both VERY useful. 1 point into frozen armor to boost your defense. Get hit less. And for melee hits, the enemy is frozen. So they can’t hurt you. Its one of the best one point wonders in the game. Surprised you don’t know that. And 1 point into thunderstorm is also a very good 1 point wonder. Just random single target dmg that hits for 4-5k lightning dmg. Why not? Like an extra nova for free.
That is a personal choice. Most would say that res isn't that important on an 95% ES build. I like seeing and having a LARGE mana pool. Same with life. People in discord complain about souls... and then when asked how much life and mana they have, it becomes obvious why.
The rarity of the item is what makes it cool. Not everyone running around holding infinity. Someone finds a mangs, one of the rarest items in the game, and previously its worthless. And just a trophy item. Now hopefully finding the item, it has trade value, and has use in a build like this. Makes an Item using 2x Ber runes seem cheap. 😆
@@Squatch_11 😂 0MF is not an issue. Why do you need MF on this build with giffons and a mang song already? Also 0MF is cooler. Better for farming elite bases which yield more rune value in trade than likely any Unique you would find. Sorry man, but MF is for noobs or grail farming and that’s it.
I have an ammy that's way better than maras. Three To lightning skills, damage reduced by 37 with Arcaines armor. I take zero h p damage no matter what. I am using escutas 18 light skill damage, no skillers because i have none. Only one rune word, cta. I can only clear cows but i do pretty fast.
Im on self found, so i found 2 bk's 😂😂. 2 to skills circlet, treks for poison resist. Druid torch and a near perfect anni. I did the run so fast that I activated the anti cheat. No items dropped and I stopped gaining experience.
the damage is calculated in frame casts and what fcr bp you have, it runs at 25 frames per second. so for example you have 200 fcr + 3k nova then you know how many times you can cast that spell per second but the damage is always still variable (200 fcr is 7 frames). you can average the min and max damage and use that but its still not true dps. there is damage in d2 that does use dps and its poison damage or fire damage (standing in a firewall) i like to think about best practice vs better vs worst practice. i have leveled to date around 50 sorcs to 99 and never once used a staff or energy shield. i typically only use es for a sorc for trolling as it can tank a massive amount of damage but is soft in a pvm role when i can have 50% block, max dr, stacked res, hp min @ 3500, I never use nova because it does use a huge amount of mana it does have area of effect pierce and minimum damage for a light skill but the damage is low. thats why the standard is always lightening. i can push the damage into the 50k range but typically stay 32k for pvm. so using dps for damage calculations is extremely deceptive.
The DPS calculations come from Maxroll, and yes there are always ranges, but if you have not tried the Nova sorc with ES and a massive Mana pool. There is no better, easier playstyle feeling. I agree with you that lightning has higher DPS, but its a completely different build, and playstyle. With mana regen and such a large mana pool, there is no issue spamming nova. I did a test and it took over 2 minutes of just spamming nova constantly for the 4100 mana pool to be depleted 100%. So there is no issue. So I guess you would just have to play Nova and experience it to know for sure.
@@smalps-gaming i have played d2 for 23 years now with every setup imaginable. I have put infinity on sorc + nova + es or vita and had insight on merc, switched it, used shields/orb combos ect, staffs ect even put infinity or insight into iron golums its just under powered. i dont use it pvp or pvm i dont know anyone who has used it past testing phases or for past ladder starter builds as end game builds. hybrids just mean the character is under powered. by using es and not the vita light setup the character lacks the punch of a vita light sorc pvm with reduced survivability. i saw screen shots of noob hc players actually using es on hc sorc builds and we all laughed at them when they posted final screen shots of "your deed of valor will be remembered". i think maxroll tried to simplify the d2 damage calculations by lumping elemental damage into "dps" for the gen z players. the issue is not about spamming nova you will have a large mana pool and regen to do that easy but the mana pool is also your hp pool. a well made smiter or ww barb can 2-3 hit an es sorc with 5k mana pool. theres always a trade off in you will have more damage holding infinity vs on merc but lose survivability. my sorc with basic gear has 3500 hp, 50% block, max dr, stacked res and 20k defense with shout from a support barb. a well made character can teleport into a mob and either they will do little damage or live long enough the merc clears all of them out. some guy made a post about this video on jsp and we all agreed it was not impressive. feel free to read the topic yourself.
@@unguidedone ive seen it. I think you need to test it. You agreed the dmg is higher than infinity for 0-50 Light res monsters, and said that “the non immunes are not the issue” well when the majority of monsters are non immunes, and all act bosses, you make up the time because it takes less time to clear those monsters. I don’t care about PVP, so that irrelevant to me. I’m glad you made a great sorc. This build and infinity holding can both tele into a mob and clear it. Up to P8, there’s literally no where it hurts or can’t clear. P8 isn’t even hard. Are there builds that have more dmg? Yes, but they they lack in QOL. The beauty of the build is the balance of both a high quality of life, clear speed and fun. You can keep playing lighting, its a fine build and yes you obviously cannot go ES with lightning because you don’t have enough points. The reason people max es on nova is because you have enough points to max it out along with synergies and TK.
@@smalps-gaming when d2r came out i tested almost all d2 cross over builds in d2r. some had improved damage others were just ok. your literately talking to someone who wrote guides on d2 builds its been done at to ad nauseam especially this build. there is nothing new about this build, you can go back to 2003 to 2009 guides on jsp and find 99% same gear except for the staff no one uses that. i find them all the time(the staff), its the hardest to find unique staff but i just drop them in free games. if you look back i was talking about infinity with the damage higher, i totally ruled out ever using a staff, or es, or nova and the damage using the staff is lower as mentioned in the threads on jsp. the only time i do use a staff is 9 es memory thats about it. you actually can use es with a lightening sorc but requires a memory staff and some prebuff equipment if you want 95% es, the drawback is you lose around 10k light damage. its a extremely common build. the same is true with es blizzard, instead of the vita configuration of max damage of 16-17k you will hit 11-12k. it just requires again extra gear and optional prebuffing scripting with autoit or python so your fingers dont fall off.
200 FCR setup is okay, but it doesn’t do as much DMG because it doesn’t have the -ELR like this setup paired with the +5 skills. You sacrifice a lot of plus to skills to hit 200 FCR. If you check my other videos Ive made that build.
@@smalps-gaming its the same +skills.... staff is +7, arach +1, amy +2, chest +1, helmet +1, CTA +1 = 12. ur setup is wep +5, x2 soj +2, chest +1, amy +2, belt +1, CTA +1 =12. only diff is -20elr vs 200fcr
There’s absolutely no need for infinity on a merc anymore. It’s completely useless. The best in slot merc for a nova sorc is insight, cure and chains of honor. With a sunder charm, infinity on merc is just a waste. You need him to carry an insight to keep your mana steadily going up.
@@cjdig86 🤦🏻♂️ that’s what we will call the old meta. With 4100 mana, and points in warmth, plus mana afterkill, your mana is topped off without needing insight.
Because with sunder it brings the immunes down to 95% light res instantly, then infinity takes effect on that with -17% plus the -43% ELR from the build here. So its like doing -5% more ELR than just having infinity and no sunder
@@smalps-gaming ok i just always just seen when infinity the monsters no read the lightning immunity on em and if just sunder same, but quess more to it, with how much elr done, is 5% much help or can without?, its more so i could maybe do a skiller or something else on that slot or just have more space but if its more effective like this i quess i just do this
With the 30 fcr from mang song's, I'd opt to go for enigma, magefist, and 3/10 amulet instead of vipermagi, frostburn, and maras. With the fcr freedom, i don't see why not choose enigma's quality of life (frw especially) features instead of viper magi.
You could do that. I like having massive mana pool. I also don’t care for MF. But with enigma you would get life after kill. Also a little redundant because of prayer merc. You also lose the very important 13 MDR from viper and the extra facet which boosts your dmg. You can put 2 points in to get blaze which will give you the better FRW
It would be worth a try! Keep those trophies you never know! The interesting part about this setup, is that you can have a Level 40 ES at level 90. where as with infinity holding setup you need to be level 95. So you can get there sooner, which makes you the most tanky. Also with the added Mana from the build, you are already "safer" and even with Maras and having some Res in addition to 95% absorb, and 13 MDR, you are pretty well protected. Im not totally sure though as I don't play HC. I would think most HC players would NOT go with a staff or scythe option and would want a shield for the max block approach.
Number of monster in the game that have that level of resistance to lightning. The bottom there is for light immunes broken by sunder charm, the top is monsters with 0% light res. The reason Infinity doesn’t do as much vs low level res monsters, is because you almost instantly hit the -100 ELR cap. So you can’t increase your dmg anymore. Where as with mang song, the base dmg is higher so the dmg is better vs non immunes.
@@user-dt9cz6lt3w So that chart is using and trying for the highest possible dmg numbers, so its using Ormus robes with +3 to nova. I didn't go that with that option, and went with Viper magi.
self weild sucks bro hoto all day with merc infin anf griffs with sojs and arach and facets i run hell cows p8 no issue and shit on everything. 105 fcr with 5.5k damage
frostburns and marrows or treks/travs 20/20 or 2/10 is fine ammy. ive yet to find a better nova set up then this. merc needs -52 or higher to have nice kkill speed. i shit on p8 everything. telestomping whatever i want. with 4k mana your str8 tank
Minor situational damage increase does not replace infinite mana on an es build. Self wield infinity with prayer med cure merc smokes this wangdong nonsense.
You clearly have not tried this and are just talking. You think I don’t know about “infinite mana” ive played 1000s of hours of infinity holding. With 4100 mana and 300% regen, there is no issue with sustain. And you have more res on top of that. Plus now your merc is doing more dmg. So more res, more mana, high dmg, more dmg from the merc. ✅✅✅✅
You would be missing about -25% ELR there. So you will be slowed down by light immunes. Plus with spirit, your mana pool is going to be much lower. You may get more sheet dmg, but if you check the chart, the overall dmg, and clear speeds will be lower.
I feel like the majority of people will still use crescent moon/spirit or hoto/spirit until some ber's are found and then infinity scythe sorcs will start popping up. Sorry but mang song's is just such an irrelevant item 🤷♂️
Sad you think that. I think you will see infinity sorc still because mangs is hard to get and a perfect 15 roll even harder. Infinity holding feels like the budget option now.
its not the best and its not the new meta! because if it were the best, everyone would use it. And as long as it's not used by the majority of players, using the word meta is just stupid!
😂 ya trade that non upped viper mag for enlightenment at least. And put on caster amulet for the cast rate. If got the runes you need be putting on chains of honor. Lol you couldn't even stay alive for the video even? Lol. Honestly think you be better off holding a socketed eschuta with a 5/5 facet in it, with spirit shield lol 😅
@@smalps-gaming Ya you say that tell you try it. Chains gives you an extra skill point more res and better defense way better then a viper mag slap a plus 2 sorc caster amulet to make up the cast rate and you got a way better build.
@@chadinnocenti4906 Sorry man that is basic advice. you clearly don't know the mechanics of this build. you cannot just "slap on a caster amulet" to make up 30 FCR. and on this build the MDR is more valuable than res.
Since some of you might be curious to the DPS Calculations in the build...
Mangs vs 0 LR monster: 35,767
Infinity vs 0 LR monster: 28,097
Mangs vs 50 LR monster: 32,906
Infinity vs 50 LR monster: 28,097
Mangs vs 100 LR monster: 12,698
Infinity vs 100 LR monster: 14,892
Mangs vs Diablo Clone: 24,858
Infinity vs Diablo Clone: 24,445
And on top of that, because the Merc in the Mang Sorc Nova build is using Infinity over Insight, your merc is also helping more with CB procs.
0 lr monster ;0000000000000
@@NoComment-hh3rn yea I already have socketed the mangs now
@@msan7534 to my knowledge the only monster in the game that is 95% light res is Diablo clone. So those numbers are there. Light immune monsters > 100%, will be knocked down to 95% after sunder. and that is represented but the 100% LR in the above.
@smalps-gaming 3 energy shield , 3 nova base for obsession with coh/forti gives you better dps than Mangs
overall to sum it up :
any non light broken immune more levels into nova will net better dps
any broken immune will net better dps from - to light res
@@user-ei3fw5ct3s yes, you will get more dps for the non immunes that way but less for light immunes that are broken. The point of the mangs build is that its a great blend of both. It falls in the middle of both while still maintaining a high QOL.
It's nice to see the uniques get used as they were intended
YES! that is a nice benefit to this. All Uniques on the Sorc in cool.
200fcr setup with obsession build deals 11k to immunes and 43k to non immunes, where this setup deals 13k and 37k, tit-for-tat damage comparison. With your same setup utilizing a +3 powered amulet instead of maras, you'll be at a more respectable 14k and 39k. -- A +6nova orb without mastery and only 1 facet or +5 2-facet still without mastery using lidless is superior to this build, which are fairly cheap to buy, damage being higher in each category. Cmoon/lidless setup not being far off as well, competing with 15k to immunes and 33k to non-immune. There's really not much of a difference in overall kill speed when comparing any of these builds, this is only another 'slightly modified' setup that gets a pass as usable. -- Not bashing, it's fun to see something different, I dislike the 'new meta' labeling is all when it's still inferior to an easily obtainable +5 orb build with lidless.
That is fair to say. If you label meta as only dmg, there are better options. I like the blend of dmg, survive ability, clear speeds, as well as ease of getting the items. In a lot of cases, there are super GG rare items that are "better" but almost impossible to attain. When comparing this setup to the infinity holding version, which most people use. I consider this 'slightly better.' In D2, slightly better means a lot.
I actually like the fact that in the end all these builds are not that far off from each other. It allows people to work with what they end up finding, and not trashing one equip just cos it's not the best in slot. This combined with the fact that hunt for the perfect item will take forever or may never happen only makes sense for diablo 2 to be healthier / fun game.
@@xlatheblackdragon705 Agreed my man! There are so many cool options and ways to put a build together, and people value different things, and play in their own way. I think its cool that an item like this that is SO hard to find, can have value and a special place in a build in the game.
This answer 😂 dudes a legend
or just crescent moon...
Also, I think something that's worth mentioning is static field. Nova sorc static field has a larger effect radius than conviction. Thus, the -55% lightning res of infinity will be important even on 0% lightning resist mobs outside of this conviction radius when they get hit with static. The infinity build will generally deal with lower health minions once static field is cast even if the minion originally had 0% lightning resist.
This is true. And mentioned in the video. Static field is going to be more effective with infinity in hand because of the massive -ELR that you have. While it is better, it doesn’t result in faster clear speeds overall. Mangs static still works and has a larger radius although not as effective as infinity, then your gap in dmg finishes the job.
I personally attained one of these staffs through a trade today as soon as I saw your video here. The build surprised me for sure. It’s a bit less damage to broken immunes, but more damage to non immunes like you said. I find it to be a bit faster on players 1-4, but a bit slower on players 8 in certain areas like chaos sanc and Baal. I particular like this build because it allows me to have much more +skills. I have a 32 yard static field radius which is amazing, and I was able to put my last 8 points into warmth so I’m getting about 330% additional regen from the level 25 warmth. It’s certainly much better than the infinity build when it comes to your static distance and mana regen. I would consider it to be very close to the infinity build which surprised the heck out of me. I’m not even so sure it’s any slower on the broken immunes because my damage per nova is so much higher. I’d have to do more play testing to really see. Thanks for the video, you’ve reignited my passion for d2 today, and got me playing again!
There we go my man! You see the light after play testing it. It def does less dmg to broken immunes than infinity, but not by much. And it does a lot more dmg vs regular monsters and all act bosses. In my CS testing it was faster on P8 then infinity. It took me 2:04 to full clear with mangs vs 2:24 with infinity. Also the benefit, if you are not a 99 build, you get to level 40 ES much easier. So for leveling it’s better.
How did you trade and changed the player count?
@@Nilso2 Player count is online, so Joined a game that had 8 players in it. Traded through Traderie. and made the trade with someone on Switch.
I'm not a fun of the self-infi build myself, but "It’s certainly much better than the infinity build when it comes to your static distance and mana regen" - how is it better in terms of mana regen, when self-infi means insight on merc = ~700% mana regen : >
@@Smakenzi I said infinity build is certainly better for mana regen and static due to holding infinity for -55 ELR and because you have insight on the merc, BUT mang song static is still good and fine. You have more range in Mang song setup for static.
Damn fine video sir ^^ Fun to see Mang Dongs make an appearance
Yes!! Thank you. Glad there is a good use case for such a fine unique in the game.
Always fun to see mans dong make an appearance
@@cjdig86 yes!
Wow, this is really cool. I actually have a mang songs on single player, so I might try this on my lvl 99 nova sorc. Nice vid man!
Thank you! Appreciate it. Let me know how it goes 👍🏼
I've found two Mang SOng's as part of my online, non-ladder holy grail. This makes me want to use one!
Yes! Go check it out and see what you rolled. Hope it’s a good one. Try it out!
one thing to consider is that with obsession you can go to 200 fcr, which increases clear speed considerably. Wonder if anyone done the math of how close the faster casting nova gets to a self wield inf, also the tele speed added (considering a +3 nova +3 light mastery). Another option that i liked for MF is full FCR gear, 2-20 ammy + magefist + 2 fcr rings along with enigma and self wield inf, which keeps u at 105 BP and u get the mf and DR. lower dmg ofc but the MF is real nice to make a all round farming build
I have a build up for 200 FCR, and I am using it now as I am farming keys for Ubers running, and its considerably slower in kill speed than Mang song. and that's on P1. If you were doing like CS and JUST taking out the unique monsters and trying to seal pop, then it might be faster, but if you are full clearing its slower for sure. like infinity holding. for MF, you could just run MF charms and get close to 200. Or I use tals set when running it for like 250+ MF. But I don't center any builds really for MF. I don't personally care for MF.
Never even seen that weapon thanks for the video gg
It’s a very rare item in the game! One of the most rare.
Found a mang song 2 weeks ago and am still without an infinity so I’ve been using a mang song over cmoon and have been digging it. Glad I’m actually being semi efficient when I was basically just stoked to rock some rare stuff.
Nice man! Putting that thing to use! Still need to get infinity on the merc to make it POP, but still very nice.
Mang Song about such stats is everywhere, and these skilfulness are flying out of every second crate XD
👍🏼
Well said
Smalps won't ask you to hit the like button or sub so consider this post my endoresement for him!
Stellar videos and shorts.💎
Thank you sir! 🙏🏼
I dropped mine over underwhelming stats and am on that my next mang song ill keep
Its hard to find let alone one with nearly perfect stats! good luck
nice vid man. might try this at some point
Thank you! Give it a go 👍🏼
Great video, thanks!
Thank you!
With some testing, I am only level 95, without insight, the mana re-gen will not out gen the mana burn in CS in P1. Had to use potions constantly;(
How much mana do you have? And whats the regen? And are you using silkweaves?
@@smalps-gaming mana 3000, mana regen 40%, mana recovery rate 234% from level 18 warmth. (After CTA) And yes, silkweave.
Also I am 3 skiller less because I don’t want to pick up to cube. So extra 3 points to energy shield.
@@chris.w391 yea so that’s why, mana is kinda low.
@@smalps-gaming I already go the same setup as you.
I'd love if they buffed mang's song (or all "uber uniques") to make them obviously better than their usual counterparts!
Right. They would have to make them clearly better for them to be used over other options
The problem is that the lightning immunes is the big issue the rest of the mobs melts anyway. Cool alternate build tho and the one thing i personaly could use this is if I went an enigma self weild build for mf and life on kill. Then this could actually be good since u get fcr and dont need to get 2/20 amu + 2 rings instead of soj to make it work with an self weild infinity. But overall I prefer having insight on my merc for survivability with an ES sorc and then u need the infinity on urself. Btw all my mercs go with fortidude, they wont die on 8player and to a lot more dmg, just a tip.
When talking clear speeds, the part that usually slow you down are the light immunes, in this case for example, self wielding infinity would be doing like 14k dps, and mangs is doing 13k dps. So its not a huge difference. But then vs all other mobs, you are doing 36k dps vs infinitys 26k. So you make up the time. Also because you do more DPS vs all bosses, you make up time that way. 4100 mana, lots of points into warmth, no issues with survival on P8. Also merc doesn’t die anyway. I know forti is a good setup but, forti and andy is like the old meta. Cure is so helpful and BiS in my opinion.
@@smalps-gaming how can u invest a lot of points into warmth? nova + mastery + stat + telek + es then u wont have any points left to spare? I like it except the fact u need merc to use infinity and u wont have an insight merc.
I use cure, the point is cure works with foti. My mercs always got insight/cure/medi and I always use forti with that. The point is they dont need life leach to survive. Mb if ur doing ubers but for any other content they don't no matter player count.
@@smalps-gaming Also this is wrong "When talking clear speeds, the part that usually slow you down are the light immunes, in this case for example, self wielding infinity would be doing like 14k dps, and mangs is doing 13k dps. But then vs all other mobs, you are doing 36k dps vs infinitys 26k. " You need to compare when using the same gear and then mang + ormus vs infinity vs ormus is 13,1k vs 15,3k and 36,4k vs 28,7k.
@@smalps-gaming Idk what happened to my first reply. I use cure build for mercs just going with fortidude. He never dies anyway so he just do tons of more dmg.
I like the idea of mangs but a big thing for me is that merc can use insight and u will lose this with mangs build. I also dont get how u can put more points in warmth since nova+mastery+stat+telek+ES consumes them
@@alca7538 I can see that. the +2 skills on the merc armor from COH is more important than the DMG for me. The merc in this build doesn't need to do any dmg anyway. Most end game builds the merc doesn't help much other than their aura's. The +2 skills will boost the Prayer aura for better healing.
You don't need to max ES because of Mangs, so there are 8 points left over, and all those can go into Warmth. So you get 300+% Mana regen from the base points plus all the skill points.
Insight merc would do less dmg than a merc with infinity doing CB dmg anyway too. The main time the merc actually helps you is with act bosses.
Interesting setup. I still think self-weild Infinity is better overall.
Thanks. Better overall, just means what people value more. Still subjective, so that is fair to say you like infinity holding better.
NOTE: Cure is LADDER ONLY!... What helm should you use on Non-ladder?...
Cure is ladder only and on SP yes. But by this time most people on NL can have it too, because of ladder seasons and through trade. I play NL and have 3 cures. If you don’t have cure, you can use Andy helm. The +2 skills will boost your mercs aura
Are you still working on 99ing your druid character? I know you mentioned it on your assassin 99 vid so was curious. Really enjoy all of your content!
Thanks! I appreciate that. Yes I am still grinding the Druid. I have 6 Bars left to hit 99!
I love my sorc ctas! Currently using infinty, but I really want to try out mang at some point!😊
Nice! Both great setups
Crescent is so fun to use. Early on p3 clears are a breeze on an ohm rune worth setup. Most of which you find first or second day. (if you grind like we do lmao)
Great video for a different perspective though. I'm gonna tinker with this idea a bit via sp.
You ever try IK set on a sorc before? UBER MELTER. I'll leave it up to you to figure out what skills and setup is used :D
Thanks man! I will
I am intrigued by this IK sorce uber melter. Do tell!
Awesome vid! I've thrown away a bunch of Mang Song's, but I don't recall ever getting a +5 before, so I might go hunting for one. Sorry for the dumb question, but how are you playing with 7 other players on console? I don't mean setting things to players8 -- it looks like you're in a full game online.
Mang song is always +5, that doesn’t change. What changes is the roll on the -res. It ranges from -7 to -15. Playing console online PS5, you can have 8 players. Online switch is only limited to P4. Is that what you mean?
@@smalps-gaming Ah, yup. I play PC and Switch, so thought all consoles were limited to 4 players. Thanks for the clarification!
7:12 - if i lose my merc, i lose infinity and i deal less damage. Uber Mifiso is unaffected by your conviction aura regardless of if your merc is up or not. Conviction aura is a dominate aura only. Only one entity can hold it, and it's the highest level of it. Your merc conviction aura is level 12, Uber Mifiso is level 20. Meaning Mifiso is not under conviction, regardless of your merc being up or not. your damage is constant - except for the raw jab damage of your merc. Other than that.... valid points whole way through, is it better than a hoto+sprit set up? both +5 skills, but one is 75% fcr, other is 30% fcr and -20 light res +5light damage, hmmmm, im not convinced. but change is hard to accept.
That is correct that conviction does not apply to mephisto because the conviction aura is lower than his, but you lose the 40% CB on Infinity which is big. Also with nova since you are barely doing more DPS than the regen rate, you need the dmg.
IMO it’s better than Hoto+Spirit and generally does more DPS. Having played many Nova setups, it feels the best and most consistent. Even swapping to 200 FCR, the clear speeds slow down despite the 200 FCR movement.
As stated: the major benefits are more mana, more life, more res, at the expense that the regen is slightly less than with infinity holding setup.
I also like that it’s 0% MF, looks cool, and exclusive because of the rarity of Mang’s Song.
👍🏼
Good point about the crushing blow in infinity, didn't think of that. Approved of the reasoning behind this
Great build if you’re wanting to hunt for runeword bases
Absolutely and runes, charms, keys
the question is what is more valuable for you, -40 enemy resist or 5 all skills with 35fcr... minus resist always beats every other stat imo, so it depends what are you prefer... but still "new meta" for title is a bit strong.
If we are talking all BiS gear, the difference is -30 ELR. Mangs BiS is -50. and infinity holding is -80. When you consider the lower res monsters... you already hit the -100 ELR cap, which is why Mangs does more dmg vs all those non immunes. So your clear speed is faster there. So the only case where infinity "beats" mangs is vs light immunes monsters, which the difference in dmg is about 2k DPS and about .5 seconds. So you make up the time by increasing your clear speed vs all monsters and act bosses. What you gain, is 1000+ mana, more overall res in the build for survivability, and better average DPS. So when you consider "what is important for you" Yes you have to take all these things into consideration.
@@smalps-gaming the bis difference is -35 elr tho, but nvm...sorry man ive talked about my novasorc:D but dont forget about the lvl 17 meditation, it gives you 700% mana regen
With 4100 mana, and 300% mana regen, its not an issue. And you are right, its -35
You are still hitting the -100 cap for all monsters with 0-50 Light res.
Interesting build. I hope to find a mang song. Not really happy with my crescent moon Nova sorc
CM is a good budget option, Infinity holding is also the other good option. This, IMO is just slightly better than infinity holding. But it takes a super unique to make it happen!
Is Nova a good starter? Trying the new ladder and want to play Nova, just feels like it cost too much mana early on.. Do you perhaps have some suggestion for leveling? Doesn't matter if the DPs is low, as long as I can play Nova :D
You can def play Nova from the start. Its often used in speed running as well. But once you get insight on the merc then you will be fine on mana. Crescent moon or tals set are good budget options for nova.
Start with Large Ax or Broad Ax. Sorc can attack with a two-handed ax at the same speed as a wooden staff. 1 point into Frozen Ammor, 1 point into Frost Nova, 1 point into Warm and don't increase anything with remaining skill points. 6 points into Static Field and then focus on Nova. I can clear every monster camp on P8 with Frost Nova + 3x Static Field + 1-2 Nova. MP won't be a problem. Find an Insign Polearm for the Merc and now you can spam Nova freely until you meet some damn Succubus
One thing to consider is that conviction aura takes around 0.5-1 second to apply. Which often times, you already done dishing out majority of the damage. So I would like to see the calculation WITHOUT conviction aura.
Also, can you share the sheet? I would like to double check the numbers, thanks!
The sheet is linked in the reddit post by Pavke. And yes it takes .5 seconds for conviction to apply. Also the difference in Time to kill, infinity vs Mangs against a light immune monster is .5 second difference.
The thing that most people overlook is that when you self wield infinity, with conviction you are hitting the -100 ELR cap for every monster 0-50 Light res. Which is most monsters in the game. So you are actually capped on dmg. Where Mangs is higher dmg by almost 20% for all those monsters. Infinity IS more dmg vs light immunes. So higher average dps for mangs ✅ higher clear speed overall ✅ higher dmg and clear speed vs all act bosses ✅
@@smalps-gaming agreed, thanks!
@@smalps-gaming With some thinking, for non-lightening-immune, that 0.5 second will make the performance difference smaller.
Because while conviction is not applied, both setups without -70 from conviction, the -55 from infinity actually stands out. And conviction is usually not applied in first or second nova.
@@chris.w391 I’m assuming at P8 you are doing static first. In this case, infinity still will be more effective than mangs. By the time you are doing novas, conviction is applied. You can test it for yourself, but mangs through the CS is faster than Infinity in my testing. P1 speeds don’t really matter as they are dead in about the same time in either setup.
If cost of gear was not a factor, would you still chose Mang Song over Infinity?
Yes, and I do. I have an infinity setup too. I choose Mangs.
I use perf nova ormus +5-5 w/obsession +3 nova rune staff, inf/forty/andy merc, good use of unique though. I still dont use sorc for ubers lol.
Good setup. You will do a lot of dmg on the plus side, but not as much vs immunes. Ubers would be fine with that. All but Mephy. You really need to self weild infinity for Uber meph.
Infinity on sorc paired with insight on merc turns you into a tank. The survive ability alone is far superior over slightly more damage.
Survive ability on this build is high. 4000 mana, 800 life, 34 all res, 13 MDR.
And its actually a lot more dmg
overkill bro unless your doing pvp. Focus on getting higher MF@@smalps-gaming
@@MassMoneyShow I dont play for MF. Literally have found everything I need.
@@MassMoneyShow 100 mf on players 8 is worth more than 400 mf on players 3
Are you going to take ormus eventually? Or viper is the final?
Viper is final. I don’t want to lose 35 all res, 1 all skill, 13 MDR just for 2 points in nova. Also going ormus, now you will need 10 FCR from somewhere else. So you lose either mana from the gloves, or a skill point and mana if you go FCR ring. You could go FCR ammy, but then you lose another 30 all res and +2 all skills. So the gain in slight dmg is not worth the QOL losses. 👍🏼
I play single and threw away a few Mang's, only keeping my eth one for the grail showcase (which is -12% lightning res). I wonder how were the ones I ditched now haha
Haha yes!! My first mangs I dropped came from Baal and I ALMOST dropped it because it wasn’t “that” good. Glad I kept it as I realized it was a trophy item in the game. My roll wasn’t good, but got this through trade because no one knows its value. I’m sure there are a lot more folks checking their mangs now!
So cows have 15 light res, so you are saying that infinity -55% light res plus gear and conviction aura is worse than plus skills because we already hit -100 light res that’s it?
Yes, the added +5 to skills is a huge boost, and Mangs also still has -15 ELR on it, or -20 if you facet it, so it is doing more DPS than infinity.
I found one last season with -14 to light I've messed with it on a fire druid.
Give it a go!
7:10 Infinity does nothing in this situation. Mephisto's conviction is level 20 and infinity has lvl 12. Uber Mephisto's conviction will nullify the infinity's conviction entirely.
Are you not aware that sunder charms exist?
@@smalps-gaming Sunder charm or not, Higher level conviction only applies, in this case uber mephs convicton. Infinity against uber meph is only good if you are self wielding it because of the flat -% lightning resistance, but the aura itself will be completely nullified and won't do anything at all as long as Uber meph is around
@@SaintTyrael correct
Why not use Eschuta's Temper with spirit
Not as good or efficient. You don't get as much - ELR with that setup. and you have to invest too many points to get spirit shield.
So minus res doesn't affect 0LR mobs?
I thought it would be an extra multiplier.
PoE player here.
It does. So the most you can get a monster to is -100 ELR. So with infinity in hand, plus all the other gear you are already over -100 ELR. So with that setup you can’t squeeze out anymore dmg. Which is why Mangs does more dmg vs the non immune monsters, because you can get more dmg from the + side of things with the added +5 all skills.
The - res from the sunder charm, if that is what you are thinking of, only affects your characters res. Not the res of the monsters.
@@smalps-gaming your pinned comment says infinity dps is the same against 50 res and 0 res. I dont understand that part.
@@blaiseaka7157 yes because of the -100 Res cap. If a monster has 0 LR, conviction brings that down to -85, Then on gear SW Infinity build will have over -70 ELR, so you are already at -100. With 50 res, conviction brings it down by -85 to -35, then -70 from gear, and you are again over -100. so its the same.
@@smalps-gaming that makes sense. i forgot about the extra -res line on infinity. Thanks and sorry for wasting your time :)
How does sunder work? Does it take them to 95 and then apply the conviction and other - lightning resistances?
Takes them down to 95% res instantly. There is no delay, then your -ELR gear gets applied. Then conviction works at -17% on top of that.
Ty sir
Wouldn’t 3 nova obsession be bigger than mengs?
I have a 3 nova obsession. The dmg is higher for 0light immunes, but because you have no added -ELR with it, its not really better. And then vs light immunes, its much weaker/slower than both infinity holding and mangs. And when you push to 200 FCR version, you are sacrificing plus to skills to get the faster breakpoint, and again is falls short vs immunes. But is higher for 0. Mangs is sitting in the middle for both which makes it clear faster overall.
nice vid
as per your excel chart, the eschuta+ormus combo does max damage in both sunder and non-sunder setups, is that right?
just wanted to ask if i don't sing the mang song , i can maximize my nova sorc build :)
that is correct. Eschutas+ormus will have the highest up side dmg, but your QOL will be low, as well as your dmg vs light immunes is going to be very low. So the overall clear speed will be slowed down.
@@smalps-gaming thanks for reply
by QOL you mean mana regen?
i can use cure+insight+coh on prayer merc. that should help
since you have done lot of research/number crunching on Nova sorc, what would be best gear choices as per you, if cost of gear is not a limiting factor?
yes I know finding a perfect obsession base would be next to impossible or its price would be like gazillion HRs, but otherwise humanly gettable gear choices.
@@jaspreetsingh9592 Well yea that is the thing, if you choose Eschutas+ormus, for the highest light dmg vs non immunes, you have to put in 156 str to get spirit, which lowers your mana pool, which means less survive ability. Then you will need to make up the FCR somewhere else, so you likely need a FCR ammy, so then you lose the 30 All res, and life/mana there from no longer having the plus to all skills. Because of Ormus, you lose the 35 All res, and 13 MDR which is probably the most important on this build. Then because of all that, you need Infinity on the merc, so you cannot use insight. So less, life, less mana, less res, less regen, overall less QOL for slightly more dmg vs non immunes. This is why its not recommended.
I perfect base obsession, isn't much better. IF you are going obsession, its probably best to shoot for 200 FCR, but in that case, you do have much higher DPS vs non immunes, but again your QOL is much lower because you lose a lot of plus to skills to get to 200 FCR.
Best setup for endgame would be this Mangs setup seen here, or Infinity holding. Both have a very high QOL along with clear speeds and survive ability.
@@smalps-gaming Seems like the upside is the best if you put on ormus. Without it it's kind of a wash or a little worse as infinity gets better cure, mana Regen, damage vs immunities, high res monsters(pit lord's 75% res). With Ormus the only thing slightly less is immunities(and actually very comparable) and you generally get say 25% more damage (rough in head math). I think poison resis and magic damage reduction are the only problem points in doing that but I'd say in terms of overall best damage output that's the best version.
@@JustADudeGamer my main focus with this build is fastest overall clear speeds and quality of life. With ormus, you gain slightly more dmg, at the cost of a lot of QOL. There are other options if you want absolute max dmg, but again that’s only on paper. The the QOL would be rough. This was the best of both worlds as it’s got faster overall clear speeds vs SW Infinity in CS and most area’s while maintaining a high QOL with res, and a huge mana pool. Better vs bosses too. And vs light immunes, its almost the same, because at 12k dps vs 14k dps, its like both 2-3 casts of nova. When you are level 99, survival isn’t really much of a problem anymore. So the life regen/mana regen isn’t a problem either. You just level everything in the game without much issue.
what you do with 1 point in frozen armor? :D and thunderstorm...i mean its not usefull
Oh they are both VERY useful. 1 point into frozen armor to boost your defense. Get hit less. And for melee hits, the enemy is frozen. So they can’t hurt you. Its one of the best one point wonders in the game. Surprised you don’t know that. And 1 point into thunderstorm is also a very good 1 point wonder. Just random single target dmg that hits for 4-5k lightning dmg. Why not? Like an extra nova for free.
Would this work if you have Tal Rahsa's set?
Not really. You would not hit the right breakpoints and the orb is the best part of full tals set.
Better to have mana smalls than resists?
That is a personal choice. Most would say that res isn't that important on an 95% ES build. I like seeing and having a LARGE mana pool. Same with life. People in discord complain about souls... and then when asked how much life and mana they have, it becomes obvious why.
idgaf what others think, at 205fcr (yea, i know 200 is bp), my nova sorc wears fortitude
That’s okay! You do you 👍🏼
GG
Thanks!!
issue with that build is how rare mang song is
The rarity of the item is what makes it cool. Not everyone running around holding infinity. Someone finds a mangs, one of the rarest items in the game, and previously its worthless. And just a trophy item. Now hopefully finding the item, it has trade value, and has use in a build like this. Makes an Item using 2x Ber runes seem cheap. 😆
The issue is that he has zero MF, which is why no one does this build.
@@Squatch_11 😂 0MF is not an issue. Why do you need MF on this build with giffons and a mang song already? Also 0MF is cooler. Better for farming elite bases which yield more rune value in trade than likely any Unique you would find. Sorry man, but MF is for noobs or grail farming and that’s it.
I have an ammy that's way better than maras. Three To lightning skills, damage reduced by 37 with Arcaines armor. I take zero h p damage no matter what.
I am using escutas 18 light skill damage, no skillers because i have none. Only one rune word, cta.
I can only clear cows but i do pretty fast.
Im on self found, so i found 2 bk's 😂😂. 2 to skills circlet, treks for poison resist. Druid torch and a near perfect anni. I did the run so fast that I activated the anti cheat. No items dropped and I stopped gaining experience.
That is a nice ammy for sure! That MDR is so key with an ES sorc
the damage is calculated in frame casts and what fcr bp you have, it runs at 25 frames per second. so for example you have 200 fcr + 3k nova then you know how many times you can cast that spell per second but the damage is always still variable (200 fcr is 7 frames). you can average the min and max damage and use that but its still not true dps. there is damage in d2 that does use dps and its poison damage or fire damage (standing in a firewall)
i like to think about best practice vs better vs worst practice. i have leveled to date around 50 sorcs to 99 and never once used a staff or energy shield. i typically only use es for a sorc for trolling as it can tank a massive amount of damage but is soft in a pvm role when i can have 50% block, max dr, stacked res, hp min @ 3500, I never use nova because it does use a huge amount of mana it does have area of effect pierce and minimum damage for a light skill but the damage is low. thats why the standard is always lightening. i can push the damage into the 50k range but typically stay 32k for pvm. so using dps for damage calculations is extremely deceptive.
The DPS calculations come from Maxroll, and yes there are always ranges, but if you have not tried the Nova sorc with ES and a massive Mana pool. There is no better, easier playstyle feeling. I agree with you that lightning has higher DPS, but its a completely different build, and playstyle. With mana regen and such a large mana pool, there is no issue spamming nova. I did a test and it took over 2 minutes of just spamming nova constantly for the 4100 mana pool to be depleted 100%. So there is no issue. So I guess you would just have to play Nova and experience it to know for sure.
@@smalps-gaming i have played d2 for 23 years now with every setup imaginable. I have put infinity on sorc + nova + es or vita and had insight on merc, switched it, used shields/orb combos ect, staffs ect even put infinity or insight into iron golums its just under powered. i dont use it pvp or pvm i dont know anyone who has used it past testing phases or for past ladder starter builds as end game builds. hybrids just mean the character is under powered. by using es and not the vita light setup the character lacks the punch of a vita light sorc pvm with reduced survivability. i saw screen shots of noob hc players actually using es on hc sorc builds and we all laughed at them when they posted final screen shots of "your deed of valor will be remembered".
i think maxroll tried to simplify the d2 damage calculations by lumping elemental damage into "dps" for the gen z players.
the issue is not about spamming nova you will have a large mana pool and regen to do that easy but the mana pool is also your hp pool. a well made smiter or ww barb can 2-3 hit an es sorc with 5k mana pool. theres always a trade off in you will have more damage holding infinity vs on merc but lose survivability.
my sorc with basic gear has 3500 hp, 50% block, max dr, stacked res and 20k defense with shout from a support barb. a well made character can teleport into a mob and either they will do little damage or live long enough the merc clears all of them out.
some guy made a post about this video on jsp and we all agreed it was not impressive. feel free to read the topic yourself.
@@unguidedone ive seen it. I think you need to test it. You agreed the dmg is higher than infinity for 0-50 Light res monsters, and said that “the non immunes are not the issue” well when the majority of monsters are non immunes, and all act bosses, you make up the time because it takes less time to clear those monsters. I don’t care about PVP, so that irrelevant to me. I’m glad you made a great sorc. This build and infinity holding can both tele into a mob and clear it. Up to P8, there’s literally no where it hurts or can’t clear. P8 isn’t even hard. Are there builds that have more dmg? Yes, but they they lack in QOL. The beauty of the build is the balance of both a high quality of life, clear speed and fun. You can keep playing lighting, its a fine build and yes you obviously cannot go ES with lightning because you don’t have enough points. The reason people max es on nova is because you have enough points to max it out along with synergies and TK.
@@smalps-gaming when d2r came out i tested almost all d2 cross over builds in d2r. some had improved damage others were just ok. your literately talking to someone who wrote guides on d2 builds its been done at to ad nauseam especially this build. there is nothing new about this build, you can go back to 2003 to 2009 guides on jsp and find 99% same gear except for the staff no one uses that. i find them all the time(the staff), its the hardest to find unique staff but i just drop them in free games.
if you look back i was talking about infinity with the damage higher, i totally ruled out ever using a staff, or es, or nova and the damage using the staff is lower as mentioned in the threads on jsp. the only time i do use a staff is 9 es memory thats about it. you actually can use es with a lightening sorc but requires a memory staff and some prebuff equipment if you want 95% es, the drawback is you lose around 10k light damage. its a extremely common build. the same is true with es blizzard, instead of the vita configuration of max damage of 16-17k you will hit 11-12k. it just requires again extra gear and optional prebuffing scripting with autoit or python so your fingers dont fall off.
@@unguidedone good for you man. You are an OG pro. Ive never read one of your guides. And here you are watching and commenting in my video. 👍🏼
At this point wouldnt you just go for 200fcr sorc? If ur merc is using infin i think that would be a superior setup compared to this personally
200 FCR setup is okay, but it doesn’t do as much DMG because it doesn’t have the -ELR like this setup paired with the +5 skills. You sacrifice a lot of plus to skills to hit 200 FCR. If you check my other videos Ive made that build.
@@smalps-gaming its the same +skills.... staff is +7, arach +1, amy +2, chest +1, helmet +1, CTA +1 = 12. ur setup is wep +5, x2 soj +2, chest +1, amy +2, belt +1, CTA +1 =12. only diff is -20elr vs 200fcr
@@OSUGoliath Yes, a whole lot of dmg, and QOL difference for faster teleport speed.
There’s absolutely no need for infinity on a merc anymore. It’s completely useless. The best in slot merc for a nova sorc is insight, cure and chains of honor. With a sunder charm, infinity on merc is just a waste. You need him to carry an insight to keep your mana steadily going up.
@@cjdig86 🤦🏻♂️ that’s what we will call the old meta. With 4100 mana, and points in warmth, plus mana afterkill, your mana is topped off without needing insight.
Is this better then obsession
Yes it is.
why light sunder if already has infinity?
Because with sunder it brings the immunes down to 95% light res instantly, then infinity takes effect on that with -17% plus the -43% ELR from the build here. So its like doing -5% more ELR than just having infinity and no sunder
@@smalps-gaming ok i just always just seen when infinity the monsters no read the lightning immunity on em and if just sunder same, but quess more to it, with how much elr done, is 5% much help or can without?, its more so i could maybe do a skiller or something else on that slot or just have more space but if its more effective like this i quess i just do this
@@denizbircan5894 the -5% and how it breaks the immunity instantly is a big difference in speed. So its kinda needed.
Please tell me, how you get fint item skill
not sure what you are asking.
@@smalps-gaming you have barbarian skill,, find item,, how?
@@antonzlatkov1268 Oh that was from when the 22 Nights of terror happened. It just never went away on my skill board, but it doesn't work.
With the 30 fcr from mang song's, I'd opt to go for enigma, magefist, and 3/10 amulet instead of vipermagi, frostburn, and maras. With the fcr freedom, i don't see why not choose enigma's quality of life (frw especially) features instead of viper magi.
You could do that. I like having massive mana pool. I also don’t care for MF. But with enigma you would get life after kill. Also a little redundant because of prayer merc. You also lose the very important 13 MDR from viper and the extra facet which boosts your dmg. You can put 2 points in to get blaze which will give you the better FRW
You also then need to make up the 65 Poison res lost. You could swap to eth treks, but then lose the mana and mana after kill
did it and it fucking destroys everything, but there is a bit of a problem with fhr
What is the problem? I can hit 20 or 30 FHR pretty easy with charms.
Use a couple of skillers with 12fhr.
Time for it to drop for my grail 😂
Yes! hope it does drop for you, and a good roll!
What about hardcore? I'm only playing hc. :) Damn found Mang in season earlier and dropped back to the ground, silly me. xD
It would be worth a try! Keep those trophies you never know! The interesting part about this setup, is that you can have a Level 40 ES at level 90. where as with infinity holding setup you need to be level 95. So you can get there sooner, which makes you the most tanky. Also with the added Mana from the build, you are already "safer" and even with Maras and having some Res in addition to 95% absorb, and 13 MDR, you are pretty well protected. Im not totally sure though as I don't play HC. I would think most HC players would NOT go with a staff or scythe option and would want a shield for the max block approach.
@@smalps-gaming Ty!!!
We play nova that way in pd2 before 10 years D2R s@cks ty
Good
in the chat , what does the no. of monster means ?
Number of monster in the game that have that level of resistance to lightning. The bottom there is for light immunes broken by sunder charm, the top is monsters with 0% light res. The reason Infinity doesn’t do as much vs low level res monsters, is because you almost instantly hit the -100 ELR cap. So you can’t increase your dmg anymore. Where as with mang song, the base dmg is higher so the dmg is better vs non immunes.
thank you so much 😊
btw, what is the armour used in the chat, for example eschuta+ ormus with 2 x 10fcr ring ?
@@user-dt9cz6lt3w So that chart is using and trying for the highest possible dmg numbers, so its using Ormus robes with +3 to nova. I didn't go that with that option, and went with Viper magi.
I was using this 15 years ago 🤣
new old meta haha
Hi I have base obssesion 3 master light 3 nova 3es 3 static :) the best obssesion :)
That made or found? 😆
I found @@smalps-gaming
I play only found never buy:
@@Sosaii666 that is an insane base to find then! Seems like something offline players would make.
@@smalps-gaming I play online
Idk 🤷
We’ll see if the demand for this item changes. With how rare it is and how they can roll, most people just throw them out.
thats far of the best nova build
ur casual player so just keep it there
dont miss lead ..........
Agreed to disagree on what defines Meta I guess. If people are looking for a pro, ill send them your way. 👍🏼🤡
its not about my or ur way
its about The best nova sorc build :) wich is not ur way for sure
but any casual crap like u can follow ur way ;0
@@adriangenov586 you act like calling someone a casual is some kinda flex for you…
u just made a crap build dont bitch about it hf
called best build ever who care
ur casual @@smalps-gaming
Not good.
The best
self weild sucks bro hoto all day with merc infin anf griffs with sojs and arach and facets i run hell cows p8 no issue and shit on everything. 105 fcr with 5.5k damage
frostburns and marrows or treks/travs 20/20 or 2/10 is fine ammy. ive yet to find a better nova set up then this. merc needs -52 or higher to have nice kkill speed. i shit on p8 everything. telestomping whatever i want. with 4k mana your str8 tank
You know the -res on the infinity doesn’t apply when you use it on the merc? It would only apply to his CL proc.
You know this mangs build is doing 6.4k dmg?
Eshuta ?😂
Not as good
the stupidest build, I made a build in which we have +350mp, 109 speed of using skills, and -60 to monster resistance
What’s MP?
@@smalps-gaming magic find
@@Cinemailk Oh yea, I don't care about MF at all.
Minor situational damage increase does not replace infinite mana on an es build. Self wield infinity with prayer med cure merc smokes this wangdong nonsense.
You clearly have not tried this and are just talking. You think I don’t know about “infinite mana” ive played 1000s of hours of infinity holding. With 4100 mana and 300% regen, there is no issue with sustain. And you have more res on top of that. Plus now your merc is doing more dmg. So more res, more mana, high dmg, more dmg from the merc. ✅✅✅✅
New lul not rly
not to you I guess
Spirit and eld's orb > this staff. You can laso achieve 200 fcr and do more damage and have -25% light res from orb nd -% light re from griff.
You would be missing about -25% ELR there. So you will be slowed down by light immunes. Plus with spirit, your mana pool is going to be much lower. You may get more sheet dmg, but if you check the chart, the overall dmg, and clear speeds will be lower.
What is eld's orb?
@@derfloh8986 Eschutas
They are talking about a rare/magic orb not Eschutas.
@@smalps-gaming I thought that but was not sure. Thanks for clarification 👍
I feel like the majority of people will still use crescent moon/spirit or hoto/spirit until some ber's are found and then infinity scythe sorcs will start popping up. Sorry but mang song's is just such an irrelevant item 🤷♂️
Sad you think that. I think you will see infinity sorc still because mangs is hard to get and a perfect 15 roll even harder. Infinity holding feels like the budget option now.
overkill on mana lol. I rather have more MF for farming.
That is your choice. you can put all MF charms at the bottom if you want. I don't care for MF so we disagree there.
Mf be overrated 💪🏻
I wouldn’t say “meta”. Viable? Yes Meta? No.
How do you define meta?
The top builds that everyone should play if able.
@@spyderman312 So top by what standard? and do you consider popular meta?
its not the best and its not the new meta! because if it were the best, everyone would use it. And as long as it's not used by the majority of players, using the word meta is just stupid!
Try it
😂 ya trade that non upped viper mag for enlightenment at least. And put on caster amulet for the cast rate. If got the runes you need be putting on chains of honor. Lol you couldn't even stay alive for the video even? Lol. Honestly think you be better off holding a socketed eschuta with a 5/5 facet in it, with spirit shield lol 😅
honestly, that is probably the worse advice I've heard. Sorry.
@@smalps-gaming Ya you say that tell you try it. Chains gives you an extra skill point more res and better defense way better then a viper mag slap a plus 2 sorc caster amulet to make up the cast rate and you got a way better build.
@@chadinnocenti4906 Sorry man that is basic advice. you clearly don't know the mechanics of this build. you cannot just "slap on a caster amulet" to make up 30 FCR. and on this build the MDR is more valuable than res.