The magic X half twist addition solves most of the concerns with the girth hitch; the possibility of one strand being cut is not entirely far-fetched, in a rockfall, etc. The specific extra remote chance of it cutting precisely adjacent to the girth hitch itself is outside the realm of bother, really. Its adjustability, compactness, and use with two to several loops going to unevenly spaced pieces, while simply evening out the distributing tensions, makes it far superior to any BFK clump of sling, which still weakens static sling more and is non-adjustable once tied. Equalizing, sliding concepts have been largely debunked as to actual effectiveness, usually presenting greater risk of adding slack and thus shock loading, if a side fails. Just don't get tempted to knot any of the loops to adjust or shorten, as they weaken the static sling far more than the girth itself.
I tend to use the girth hitch master a lot due to the ability to maximize material on - say - a two screw ice anchor when you want some vertical distance between the two screws (water ice tends to sheer horizontally), and I agree that the work being done to try to normalize putting the x into the girth hitch is a good direction. Yeah, I think the only way you are likely to cut at the knot without some completely random chance is if you misplace your knot across some rock feature - big no no. But I am also a firm believer that there are trade offs in just about all gear and systems, and I thought it worth pointing out that the amount of "tail" in a knot matters if material gets cut. That being said, the amount of tail in a knot also is related to the size of the knot and therefore the weakening of the sling in the first place (as you point out). So, like everything in climbing, it comes down to risk assessment and then choosing the right system for the risks we are facing. Thanks for chiming in with some very good points!
We are talking belaying a second at a top rope situation here so the forces on the masterpoint will rarely exceed 2 kN. If one is concerned whether the sling will break at the knot at 11 kN or so, one is way out of his element.
I agree. It really comes down to doing that one loop before making the girth hitch. Then you won't see that slip at 1 to 2kN (if you have a smooth stock carabiner.) I just feel that if you are going to put a video out there, you have to show the risks for completeness. You could get a cut just above the knot if you misplace your masterpoint or could make the mistake of point-belaying off of it with an older sling and exceed 6kN. So, as you point out, don't use it if you don't know not to do those things 😉
I'm not being sarcastic. My only point is that the amount of tail in a knot that is made from dyneema matters (or may not) depending upon your level of risk tolerance. If you cut a larksfoot just above the master point, there is not enough tail (for slippery dyneema) to catch. Something like a figure 8 would have a lot more tail that would have to unwind. Now, to your point, the only way a knot will cut (rather than get pulled to failure) is if you misplace your knot by putting it in some badly positioned point with a cut hazard. And getting pulled to failure is pretty close to impossible with new material holding some ridiculous amount of Kn.
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Have you used this master point? What do you find are the pos and cons?
The magic X half twist addition solves most of the concerns with the girth hitch; the possibility of one strand being cut is not entirely far-fetched, in a rockfall, etc. The specific extra remote chance of it cutting precisely adjacent to the girth hitch itself is outside the realm of bother, really. Its adjustability, compactness, and use with two to several loops going to unevenly spaced pieces, while simply evening out the distributing tensions, makes it far superior to any BFK clump of sling, which still weakens static sling more and is non-adjustable once tied. Equalizing, sliding concepts have been largely debunked as to actual effectiveness, usually presenting greater risk of adding slack and thus shock loading, if a side fails. Just don't get tempted to knot any of the loops to adjust or shorten, as they weaken the static sling far more than the girth itself.
I tend to use the girth hitch master a lot due to the ability to maximize material on - say - a two screw ice anchor when you want some vertical distance between the two screws (water ice tends to sheer horizontally), and I agree that the work being done to try to normalize putting the x into the girth hitch is a good direction. Yeah, I think the only way you are likely to cut at the knot without some completely random chance is if you misplace your knot across some rock feature - big no no. But I am also a firm believer that there are trade offs in just about all gear and systems, and I thought it worth pointing out that the amount of "tail" in a knot matters if material gets cut. That being said, the amount of tail in a knot also is related to the size of the knot and therefore the weakening of the sling in the first place (as you point out). So, like everything in climbing, it comes down to risk assessment and then choosing the right system for the risks we are facing. Thanks for chiming in with some very good points!
We are talking belaying a second at a top rope situation here so the forces on the masterpoint will rarely exceed 2 kN. If one is concerned whether the sling will break at the knot at 11 kN or so, one is way out of his element.
I agree. It really comes down to doing that one loop before making the girth hitch. Then you won't see that slip at 1 to 2kN (if you have a smooth stock carabiner.) I just feel that if you are going to put a video out there, you have to show the risks for completeness. You could get a cut just above the knot if you misplace your masterpoint or could make the mistake of point-belaying off of it with an older sling and exceed 6kN. So, as you point out, don't use it if you don't know not to do those things 😉
Can you recommend a knot that would hold up to having it cut at the masterpoint?
I'm not being sarcastic. My only point is that the amount of tail in a knot that is made from dyneema matters (or may not) depending upon your level of risk tolerance. If you cut a larksfoot just above the master point, there is not enough tail (for slippery dyneema) to catch. Something like a figure 8 would have a lot more tail that would have to unwind. Now, to your point, the only way a knot will cut (rather than get pulled to failure) is if you misplace your knot by putting it in some badly positioned point with a cut hazard. And getting pulled to failure is pretty close to impossible with new material holding some ridiculous amount of Kn.