Recently did a Xc lap with some friends who were on their XC bikes, I was using my 170mm enduro. As was said in the video, you lose time on the straights and climbs but gain time when braking and cornering. It is a fun trade
You can tell Anna has an XC background, her flow was so natural. Well done! And commiserations Isaac, having to withdraw hurt sucks. You should both definitely return with retro bikes!
I ran a Ripmo last year for a few XC races an it was fun with XC tires. Turn up the PSI in the shocks to have 15% sag and go run. The issue vs a XC bike is all covered in the video. The biggest part was the amount of work you have to do to move that 34lb bike around for 90 mins. Still lots of fun and shows that you can still have fun.
Similar experience to Anna's with fast rolling XC tires vs trail/enduro knobies. I tried them ONCE on my trail bike. I thought they were great after my first climb, but when I hit the brakes going down I panicked while sliding down the hill!
Watching this video I see the difference in cornering techniques between XC and DH. Can you make video or discuss these differing techniques and answer why they are different?
A close friend of mine just did a XC marathon with 86km and 2.500m of elevation in 6,50 hrs on a heavy trail almost Enduro bike 😱🤪 and he enjoyed it even he was done and dusted afterwards. The only thing he changed were the tyres from magic marry / big Betty to rocket Ron / racing Ralph
You're all more fit than I am, that's for sure. If I were to do an event like this, probably on a hardtail with suitable tires. I'm thinking Maxxis with some aggressive tread, but with soft compound and minimal sidwall features due to lack of impact and tech on the trail. Less rolling resistance but bite into the sod and soft soil really well. Hard tail I think would provide better rear tire traction feedback to judge grip limits coming into corners. Of course I might be all washed up. Kudos to Isaac for dropping out after a lowside injury. Adrenalin can mask the severity of an injury and then we set off making it worse without knowing.
I did XC races and Jamboree rides on my Polygon T7 29er. I just changed both set of tires to the Vittoria Syerra and completely lowered down my Handlebars. It’s pretty much adequate.
I race a weekly series and some weekend races. I'm no elite, not even expert, but I have fun in the sport category. Running a Downcountry bike (Norco Revolver FS 120) that has been converted to be more XC focused.. lacks lockouts though which make it a bit slow off the line.
Funnily enough I did exactly what you did in an XC Race at the weekend. The tracks were pretty claggy and muddy and I had so much friction from the tyres it was crazy. Super grippy but such a hard slog! My legs were cooked after lap one. I did three laps but only two were counted as the last one was outside the time limit. Definitely dusting off my hardtail for the next one with some faster rolling xc tyres. I think the tyres made a massive difference. I certainly didn't do as well as you 😂 it was great fun though. Quite a change from my normal style of riding.
@@povadventure5305, depends whether you're after something new or from years gone by. If I was on the look for a 120mm full sus all rounder I'd look no further than a 2009 Marin Mount Vision 5.8. I'm slightly biased due to owning one for the past 12.5 years, but it is more than able to hold its own against more up to date bikes... It was voted Mtb of the year in 2009 & 2010 for good reason. If you had a decent budget to spend, you could upgrade the drive train and groupset, maybe the rear shock, service the forks, some good tyres and you're good to go... Awesome all round bike.
@@MrLg55555 sounds pretty sweet, my dad has an 27.5 rift zone and its heavy and sucks on the smoother stuff. I raced XC on it before but I dont recomend it. I am looking at the trek top fuel now
@@povadventure5305, I'd feel the same pain on a Rift Zone! I've also got a 2015 Mount Vision C XM8 27.5 Enduro rig and although it's half decent on the level, I wouldn't want to be using it for XC stuff all the time... To heavy for starters. Around 14.5 kg even though it's carbon... On the descents altogether different story...
@@povadventure5305 I'm on a 2020 Polygon D7, but upgraded. Only thing stock is the crankset and saddle. Sid Select+ fork, Rockshox Deluxe shock, Hunt Trailwide rims, etc.
When I was a young buck and racing competitively, I preferred a hardtail with an adjustable travel fork. I was using a Norco Fireball with a Rockshox 85mm-135mm fork
Interesting - I think my old 2002 Klein Palomino would have been a better choice for this race than the modern trail bikes you guys were using. Enjoyed this video!
The Canton Spectral is not the typical trail MTB. It's an all-mountain, (light) Enduro bike. So much that Jesse Melamed is using it at the EWS this season.
Even though it was a very flat xc race, in a technical race it's different, I ran a polygon siskyu n9 an xcm and the result was what I expected 13 out of 100, it's not the arrow, it's the warrior
I've got a KTM FS Macina Lycan 271 E-MTB.... 130mm front (68 degrees) Pikes and 125mm rear Monarch....Do everything on it from trail centres(occasionally) to wilderness Torridon....
That course should have been raced on a cross bike. Instead of a race, find a loop with a 6% grade 3+ minute climb, some punchy, grunt climbs, rock gardens, steep descent, with 180° switchbacks. Put the same tires on an XC, Trail, and Enduro. Get 3 good riders that are about the same size and have them do 30 minutes on each bike using Favero mtb pedals and HR monitors. Then, put on the Fox Neo Live system on the trail bike and compare. We already know the Enduro bike will slower on the uphill portion, but the power output and HR data will be interesting to see the difference. And we will also find out if the shock controls make a difference.
Having the grippy trail tires and went down which is very unexpected . I use my minions in xc races that are 2.3 with exo casing . I race in desert conditions so for me grip has a priority and a bit tougher casing for flat prevention
My first XC race I did was on my first full suspension bike that had 140mm travel. I raced for 6hrs and covered 36miles of track 😅 Not bad I would say.
I’m literally in the middle of trying to decide on getting a spectral 125. I live and work in south Florida most the year but spend time in New England.
My guess prior to watching says a trail bike lags a little on the climbs but absolutely murders XC on the descents. My x-duro build kind of fits with trail and on the climbs it lags behind XC bikes but on the downhills it keeps the pace like an enduro. To clarify, X-duro because it has Enduro geometry with 150mm in the nose but a very short rear with 120mm travel out back. Enduro tyre (Conti Der Kaiser 61mm) on the nose and an XC tyre (Conti Vapour 54mm) on the back. It's more XC meets enduro than a balance like a trail bike.
@@BIIIKES The nose can get a bit excited but you very quickly learn to keep it down. It's a compromise I'm happy to make though and after the last bout of upgrades the rear travel is up to 130mm, the Chainstays are 8mm longer and the nose is a little better at staying down. It's also a good bit more capable downhill which is where I want the control and performance.
lol so true every time i see xc on youtube it looks so easy but then the xc race where i live are insane last week we raced xc on an enduro track so much fun
Modern trail bike geo definitely makes sacrifices for that high speed descending stability. No steering precision, steep and committed seating positions, longer, heavier.... They've become slower in a lot of ways.
Yep, all things being equal a slacker head angle makes the steering slower, and takes more weight off the front, making it easier for the front to washout in corners, probably why james crashed.
@@Dreggz1312 Its always operator error, the question is would he of crashed if he took the same corner at the same speed on a cross country bike? there's a reason why sports motorcycles have steep steering angles, because it turns better and gives more front end grip.
Honestly trail bikes are no comparison to an xc bike. I own both and my average speed is down by a good 2mph with the same heart rate on the trail bike.
It doesn’t matter whether it’s a hardtail or a full sus. Whether it’s running an 80 mm or 190 mm fork or 150 mm rear shock. No matter what the geometry get out there and just ride.
A lot of comments on here from people doing 'very well' in XC races on their trail/enduro bikes. I call 100% BS. Take the shuttle up and coast down your gravity fed trail, and quit pretending you're an athlete.
If you can ride both sizes or go somewhere to ride the different sizes then that's the best way to figure it out. If you can't do that then the best option is to go for the smaller size. It's easier to conform to a smaller frame.
@@Pompelaify no prob. Glad I could help. If you end up getting a smaller frame and it doesn't fit well the best and least expensive thing to do is adjust the seatpost hight and the saddle position. Then the stem if that doesn't work. Hopefully you get the best bike that fits you well. Also some frame geometry from on brand may be different than the one your looking for. For example on a specialized I fit a large but on a canyon I fit a medium. Always check out the bike websites and compare your body measurements with the ones they have for the frame sizes .
I don’t understand why they’re riding full suspension on this. Looks like a cx race, might have been faster on a hardtail or cx bike. Especially when they said no technical. Also that guy was like it’s not competitive so it’s not a race?
Gaining time braking on grass with chunkier tyres? I find that hard to believe, if the ground is hard then the big knobs can't dig in, I've run big tyres before, vigilante, magic mary, now I run barzo front and rear and I can't tell a difference, I can still keep up with my friends on their enduro tyres.
If terrain would have at least few technical bits downhill or even uphill the results would be different. Exactly what they mentioned in the beginning of the video, that current XC races are not what is in this video.
Have you tried racing before? Do you have any races you're hoping to attend this summer? Let us know below!
I was there!!!!
Yes, twice, last time (end of october, on my heavily modded UMF DirtKick). And yes, 2 XC in spring, and 1 enduro in summer. :)
I race xc on a trail bike and I can attest to it being miserable at times.
Recently did a Xc lap with some friends who were on their XC bikes, I was using my 170mm enduro. As was said in the video, you lose time on the straights and climbs but gain time when braking and cornering. It is a fun trade
Anna, you are absolutely fabulous and a true asset to GMBN. I truly hope that they understand and appreciate what they have with you.
You can tell Anna has an XC background, her flow was so natural. Well done! And commiserations Isaac, having to withdraw hurt sucks. You should both definitely return with retro bikes!
I ran a Ripmo last year for a few XC races an it was fun with XC tires. Turn up the PSI in the shocks to have 15% sag and go run. The issue vs a XC bike is all covered in the video. The biggest part was the amount of work you have to do to move that 34lb bike around for 90 mins. Still lots of fun and shows that you can still have fun.
Anna is so awesome!!!
Similar experience to Anna's with fast rolling XC tires vs trail/enduro knobies. I tried them ONCE on my trail bike. I thought they were great after my first climb, but when I hit the brakes going down I panicked while sliding down the hill!
Looks like more of a CX race
…without the mud, off camber bits, bunnyhop bars and deep sand.
Brits seem to Do gravel rides tougher than their XC rides 😆
Watching this video I see the difference in cornering techniques between XC and DH. Can you make video or discuss these differing techniques and answer why they are different?
A close friend of mine just did a XC marathon with 86km and 2.500m of elevation in 6,50 hrs on a heavy trail almost Enduro bike 😱🤪 and he enjoyed it even he was done and dusted afterwards. The only thing he changed were the tyres from magic marry / big Betty to rocket Ron / racing Ralph
You're all more fit than I am, that's for sure.
If I were to do an event like this, probably on a hardtail with suitable tires. I'm thinking Maxxis with some aggressive tread, but with soft compound and minimal sidwall features due to lack of impact and tech on the trail. Less rolling resistance but bite into the sod and soft soil really well. Hard tail I think would provide better rear tire traction feedback to judge grip limits coming into corners. Of course I might be all washed up.
Kudos to Isaac for dropping out after a lowside injury. Adrenalin can mask the severity of an injury and then we set off making it worse without knowing.
I did XC races and Jamboree rides on my Polygon T7 29er. I just changed both set of tires to the Vittoria Syerra and completely lowered down my Handlebars. It’s pretty much adequate.
Podium tak?😆
Pain is temporary, quitting lasts forever.
Anna is tough and a good sport.
Anna is a real trooper
I remember Ben Moore turning up to an Xc race once on a 160mm giant Trance with flats and won it
I race a weekly series and some weekend races. I'm no elite, not even expert, but I have fun in the sport category. Running a Downcountry bike (Norco Revolver FS 120) that has been converted to be more XC focused.. lacks lockouts though which make it a bit slow off the line.
Funnily enough I did exactly what you did in an XC Race at the weekend. The tracks were pretty claggy and muddy and I had so much friction from the tyres it was crazy. Super grippy but such a hard slog! My legs were cooked after lap one. I did three laps but only two were counted as the last one was outside the time limit. Definitely dusting off my hardtail for the next one with some faster rolling xc tyres. I think the tyres made a massive difference. I certainly didn't do as well as you 😂 it was great fun though. Quite a change from my normal style of riding.
Great job Anna!
Great job to you both, definitely like to see you try the same race on the cross or gravel bike!
I race XC and Enduro on my 120mm full sus bike! I even podium sometimes.
What bike? Im looking at a 120mm bike that could race XC but still be fun on the rough stuff
@@povadventure5305, depends whether you're after something new or from years gone by.
If I was on the look for a 120mm full sus all rounder I'd look no further than a 2009 Marin Mount Vision 5.8.
I'm slightly biased due to owning one for the past 12.5 years, but it is more than able to hold its own against more up to date bikes... It was voted Mtb of the year in 2009 & 2010 for good reason.
If you had a decent budget to spend, you could upgrade the drive train and groupset, maybe the rear shock, service the forks, some good tyres and you're good to go...
Awesome all round bike.
@@MrLg55555 sounds pretty sweet, my dad has an 27.5 rift zone and its heavy and sucks on the smoother stuff. I raced XC on it before but I dont recomend it. I am looking at the trek top fuel now
@@povadventure5305, I'd feel the same pain on a Rift Zone!
I've also got a 2015 Mount Vision C XM8 27.5 Enduro rig and although it's half decent on the level, I wouldn't want to be using it for XC stuff all the time... To heavy for starters. Around 14.5 kg even though it's carbon...
On the descents altogether different story...
@@povadventure5305 I'm on a 2020 Polygon D7, but upgraded. Only thing stock is the crankset and saddle. Sid Select+ fork, Rockshox Deluxe shock, Hunt Trailwide rims, etc.
When I was a young buck and racing competitively, I preferred a hardtail with an adjustable travel fork. I was using a Norco Fireball with a Rockshox 85mm-135mm fork
Very cool video! Enjoyed it!
Way to go Anna!!
When can you guys move to filming in 4k?, we need to see Anna to higher pixel density 😆
Interesting - I think my old 2002 Klein Palomino would have been a better choice for this race than the modern trail bikes you guys were using. Enjoyed this video!
Would be nice to see the Neuron in this test. I think it would be a better trail bike for these type of races.
Feels like a Cyclocross bike would to well there.
Yeah. It doesn't look like mountain biking.
The Canton Spectral is not the typical trail MTB. It's an all-mountain, (light) Enduro bike. So much that Jesse Melamed is using it at the EWS this season.
Yeah 160mm is Enduro
I’ve done a few xc runs on my trail bike it’s alright but would def use an xc bike for xc it’s more comfy
I have raced xc on a super heavy marin rift 27.5 with dh tires and on a 27.5 trail hardtail with xc tires which is not that bad
I use a perfect mix between XC and Enduro: the Rocky Mountain Element - the ideal Down Country Bike. 😊
Well done,Anna! Sorry to hear about the issues,Isaac!
This was great , more of these vids
This was really cool! Great job.
Oh me oh my the adventures of Ol' One Lap Isaac! Can't wait so see what silly antics he gets into next week!
Great job Anna and Isaac! I am spent just watching you guys race. Well Good as always. Cheers - M
Great video. For next time, if they won't let you use a CX bike how about a flat bar gravel bike.
I did a XC race on my canyon Spectral. I threw on some XC tires and then over pumped my suspension so the bike wouldn’t sag too much
@gmbn yes Anna, come back wednesday on a gravel bike, did it last week; i was the only one 😢
Even though it was a very flat xc race, in a technical race it's different, I ran a polygon siskyu n9 an xcm and the result was what I expected 13 out of 100, it's not the arrow, it's the warrior
I've got a KTM FS Macina Lycan 271 E-MTB.... 130mm front (68 degrees) Pikes and 125mm rear Monarch....Do everything on it from trail centres(occasionally) to wilderness Torridon....
That course should have been raced on a cross bike. Instead of a race, find a loop with a 6% grade 3+ minute climb, some punchy, grunt climbs, rock gardens, steep descent, with 180° switchbacks.
Put the same tires on an XC, Trail, and Enduro. Get 3 good riders that are about the same size and have them do 30 minutes on each bike using Favero mtb pedals and HR monitors.
Then, put on the Fox Neo Live system on the trail bike and compare.
We already know the Enduro bike will slower on the uphill portion, but the power output and HR data will be interesting to see the difference. And we will also find out if the shock controls make a difference.
I think I just witnessed a cyclocross race on mountain bikes. I mean, seriously this isn't a true test of the bikes on a real XC race course.
1:05 I genuely tought they brought a Sintesi Bazooka. It would have been awesome
That green spectral is such a beautiful colour!
I´d love to see a gmbn presenter race with a short xc race and then a dh race. That would be really cool
Good thinking! We'll pass that on to the team 👍
Having the grippy trail tires and went down which is very unexpected . I use my minions in xc races that are 2.3 with exo casing . I race in desert conditions so for me grip has a priority and a bit tougher casing for flat prevention
My first XC race I did was on my first full suspension bike that had 140mm travel. I raced for 6hrs and covered 36miles of track 😅 Not bad I would say.
🎶 I'm too xc for my bike... 🎵😁
Stiff frame to track the ground?? 🤔
Just go for it, the bike just needs to survive to be suitable IMHO
I’m literally in the middle of trying to decide on getting a spectral 125. I live and work in south Florida most the year but spend time in New England.
Sounds like a good option, for both. Hardtail may be more fun in Florida.
Would be interesting to see how down country bikes like the Yeti SB115 would do, with some fast tyres in a XC race 😅
I still want to see the retro bike tried here in another video.
Do it on a gravel/CX bike.
Great job, Anna!
good effort anna, again you stuck it out
when i did my first race i did it on my trail vitus escarpe proper nailed me used a hardtail the next time and got better time
My guess prior to watching says a trail bike lags a little on the climbs but absolutely murders XC on the descents. My x-duro build kind of fits with trail and on the climbs it lags behind XC bikes but on the downhills it keeps the pace like an enduro.
To clarify, X-duro because it has Enduro geometry with 150mm in the nose but a very short rear with 120mm travel out back. Enduro tyre (Conti Der Kaiser 61mm) on the nose and an XC tyre (Conti Vapour 54mm) on the back. It's more XC meets enduro than a balance like a trail bike.
Your front end doesn't lift off the ground on steeper climbs?
@@BIIIKES The nose can get a bit excited but you very quickly learn to keep it down. It's a compromise I'm happy to make though and after the last bout of upgrades the rear travel is up to 130mm, the Chainstays are 8mm longer and the nose is a little better at staying down. It's also a good bit more capable downhill which is where I want the control and performance.
Looks way smoother than most courses I’ve raced
lol so true every time i see xc on youtube it looks so easy but then the xc race where i live are insane last week we raced xc on an enduro track so much fun
it was all grass?
I only race XC on a trail bike. I only have a trail bike lol. Do swap tires though it doesn't seem to help 😂
At 1:38. Did I see Anna cutting zip ties with a Park Tool cable cutter?
Modern trail bike geo definitely makes sacrifices for that high speed descending stability. No steering precision, steep and committed seating positions, longer, heavier.... They've become slower in a lot of ways.
"no steering precision"
Yep, all things being equal a slacker head angle makes the steering slower, and takes more weight off the front, making it easier for the front to washout in corners, probably why james crashed.
@@benjy288 operator error
@@Dreggz1312 Its always operator error, the question is would he of crashed if he took the same corner at the same speed on a cross country bike? there's a reason why sports motorcycles have steep steering angles, because it turns better and gives more front end grip.
Would he have crashed if he rode it like a trail bike instead an xc bike, and put more weight on the front when a particular corner calls for that?
He's canyon spectral with 160mm is Enduro not trial. Surely.
Honestly trail bikes are no comparison to an xc bike. I own both and my average speed is down by a good 2mph with the same heart rate on the trail bike.
This was great.
This seems like a prime race for a Gravel Bike
What happened to Issac? I don't see him on the channel
You did good with that bicycle😮.
Good stuff. Short answer: absolutely
I thought Canyon Spectral was an enduro bike.
The strive is the enduro bike
Spectral is somewhere in between. The category is called all-mountain
I totally would race XC on my Enduro hardtail! Perhaps i would change the rear tire? hmm
Enjoyed seeing all those Scott bikes on course with you guys ;) 😉
It doesn’t matter whether it’s a hardtail or a full sus. Whether it’s running an 80 mm or 190 mm fork or 150 mm rear shock. No matter what the geometry get out there and just ride.
Boom.
"Can you go racing a (butchered) cyclo-cross track against XC bikes, ON TRAIL BIKES?"
Would be a better fitting titlte
Love them bikes❤
A lot of comments on here from people doing 'very well' in XC races on their trail/enduro bikes.
I call 100% BS.
Take the shuttle up and coast down your gravity fed trail, and quit pretending you're an athlete.
Hi guys. If my size is on the border between small and medium, is it better to choose a larger or smaller mountain bike?
If you can ride both sizes or go somewhere to ride the different sizes then that's the best way to figure it out. If you can't do that then the best option is to go for the smaller size. It's easier to conform to a smaller frame.
@@Speedy.V Thank you .
@@Pompelaify no prob. Glad I could help. If you end up getting a smaller frame and it doesn't fit well the best and least expensive thing to do is adjust the seatpost hight and the saddle position. Then the stem if that doesn't work. Hopefully you get the best bike that fits you well. Also some frame geometry from on brand may be different than the one your looking for. For example on a specialized I fit a large but on a canyon I fit a medium. Always check out the bike websites and compare your body measurements with the ones they have for the frame sizes .
Where has Isaac gone? We need him back on the team!
Seems like a rigid mtb or gravel bike(Cutthroat or the like) with 29x2.2 xc would have been the right choice here.
I don’t understand why they’re riding full suspension on this. Looks like a cx race, might have been faster on a hardtail or cx bike. Especially when they said no technical. Also that guy was like it’s not competitive so it’s not a race?
I would’ve just used a gravel bike on this course.
XC is awesome...so is CX
Gaining time braking on grass with chunkier tyres? I find that hard to believe, if the ground is hard then the big knobs can't dig in, I've run big tyres before, vigilante, magic mary, now I run barzo front and rear and I can't tell a difference, I can still keep up with my friends on their enduro tyres.
As the steering angle is very slack, do you think that, for example, the Canyon Spectral K.I.S. could give any benefit from it?
If terrain would have at least few technical bits downhill or even uphill the results would be different. Exactly what they mentioned in the beginning of the video, that current XC races are not what is in this video.
fun vid....
You can race on whatever you want. Just level your expectations about winning😂
You need to drop this seat 😉, you learn that in the enduro race
Next week borrow Blake & his fatbike
160mm front and 150mm rear is definitely not a trail bike.
Welp I'm doing a XC race in a couple of months in my santacruz chameleon with 140mm up front and i35mm rims with 2.6 tires... Yeah... 😅😅😅
Totally silly course to be doing a trail bike as xc test.
the mistake was the tire choice. but ive only watched a short bit of video. im just guessing lol
Enduro bike is thé best
It annoys me so much how there is a need to create a bike category for every 10mm of travel.
That's xc?
XC?
It's a golfcourse .
Not much of a xc-course