Thank you, Irvin, for caring so much about preserving character, instead of satisfying expectations of those who don't get the universe. You serviced us amazingly with this movie.
+carmikaze - joinsquad. com He wanted a well-told love story; one that wouldn't look cheesy or forced and that's what we got. So, just because the movie had a love story in it, you think Kershner isn't a champion? It was George's idea to have the love story in the first place.
Well, Han was the one who kissed Leia in a pretty rapey scene. I dunno why he had a similar scene in Bladerunner where he kinda forced himself towards Rachael. I can't blame the actor of course.
This right here...THIS is filmmaking. Subtlety, character, drama. Themes. Everything missing from the you-know-what trilogy. These minute details, decisions, and sensibilities make all the difference in the world of great storytelling, and unforgettable cinema. Case in Point: 0:12 (ahem...Binks.) 0:19 (cough....Anakin/Padme.) 0:29 (uh...all three prequels). In 16 seconds, Kershner describes directorial sensibilities that make (or break) great stories.
Yeah, I think the attention to detail in this is obvious. Re shooting love scenes, retooling the dialogue to sound more natural... It seems like this was all necessary, but never done. Perhaps they were too busy with building, shooting, and making soooooo many special effects and shooting locations that they sort of rushed over the actual dialogue scenes.
Despite what’s said here, Solo’s original scripted response was supposed to be “You remember that because I’ll be back.” So, yes, Harrison Ford almost took Arnold Schwarzenegger’s famous catchphrase.
I'm surprised Lucas didn't put the 'I love you. I love you too' version back into the ESB special edition! That way he could have ruined a perfect scene in all 3 movies.
Tycho Meertens in the third one he inserted a cartoon frog doing an upbeat song and dance number immediately before Jabba the Hutt feeds a slave to a giant monster for his own entertainment and in the first one he saw fit to jarringly move Harrison Ford's head with a computer to make Han Solo's cold blooded act of self defence into an immediate and fully justified act of self defence.
Kids, these men are why the original Star Wars movies were so great. Gary Kurtz, an amazing producer, Irvin Kershner and even Richard Marquand, great directors and of course Kasdan for the script writing. These are the men that made sure the petulant little Georgie boy wasn't let out of his room for too long and insisted on integrity, above all else. Thank you, gentlemen, for your part in making the originals so well-loved and realistic.
Right on, man. Glad you included George in there. People are acting like Disney is the only problem now and think George knows what he's doing (and he doesn't).
the whole prequels were suposed to be darker.. i renember Lucas back from 1994 to 1999 saying time and time again that the new movies were going to be much darker than the original trilogy because they would tell the fall of Anakin Skywalker , the Jedi and the Republic.. a full tragedy.. and then from 1999 to 2005 i was "yeah right"
***** Source? any interview with Lucas from 1990 to 1998.. For example in: www.thestarwarstrilogy.com/starwars/post/2013/05/27/Re-live-The-Release-of-the-Star-Wars-Special-Editions-part-1
***** "Im Anakin ..im a Jedi (2 seconds later) now im 100% Sith lol" "you look beautifull , thats because im love.. no thats because im in love with ya" "she is dying because she just lost the will to live" "its over Anakin my higher ground gives me +5 in attack!" "why we cant put stardestroyers and TIEs George? -because the empire will have 20 years to build them .. -ok ..then why are we putting the DeathStar 20 years before in the same scene?" "Yoda: im going to kill the emperor! .. (Yoda accidentally falls a few meters) .. "oh noes im defeated forever , lol im leaving forever and let all the republic just fall without barelly trying" yes it was darker and certainly the best of the prequels... but still the bullshit metter was too high for me
Anakin did not turn 'dark' in a matter of 2 seconds. Did you completely ignore all the scenes of his amounting frustration with the Jedi Council for not trusting him? How about in Attack of the Clones when he tearfully tells Padme how he slaughtered a village of Tuskan Raiders - not just the men, but women and children too? You also hear a glimpse of the Imperial March theme at the end of that scene. How about all the conversations with Palpatine, who became almost a father-figure, giving nothing but praise to Anakin, when the Jedi Council would let him down? Beheading Count Dooku against Obi-Wan's command but Palpatine's? All the hints about him only being able to spare his loved one & child from the same fate his mother suffered if he had better power given by the darkside? That's just the tip of the iceberg. There's so many implied instances that Anakin was going to turn. - Mocking the prequels with dialogue as if the Original Trilogy didn't have crap lines? This video even shows how Han's original line was, _"I love you too."_ What about, _"I knew. Somehow,, I always knew."_ When Leia and Luke reveal their sibling kinship... Then why did they kiss... twice? There's plenty of crap dialogue in the originals. - Padme dying. Did you forget the, _"She was alive. I felt it!"_ scene? Subtly hinting the Emporer drained the life out of her. - Having the higher ground does give the user an advantage. When did Obi-Wan defeat Anakin? Precisely at that moment. He's had experience in the technique cause he did it against Darth Maul. - Yoda was depleted from his lightsabre (3:30) and was knocked far further than a 'few meters". He left because he felt he couldn't defeat Sidious. The bullshit meter is only there because you're viewing the film with your bullshit glasses on.
George is like the emperor of Star Wars. He's responsible for everything, but it takes a Darth Vader like Irvin Kirshner or Lawrence Kasdan to actually enact his master plan. The prequels were too much for one man to handle on his own, even George.
Lucas is a great idea man (well he borrows those ideas from old movie serials, comic books, Samurai films, Westerns, and fantasy novels, but he borrows from good sources and combines them in fun ways to make them his own). He's great at building universes, and concepts, and the broad strokes of the story. But, when it comes to characters, emotions, and the intricate details of the story he needs collaborators (not "yes men" but real collaborators) to flesh them out, and filter out what doesn't work.
It's true I like the prequels but come on dude. Imagine having a legendary director like Spielberg or even James Cameron on his side writing dialogue, having great cinematography and Lucas doing the outline,story and effects etc
The interviews of the main three characters of the original trilogy complained about his style of dialogues. Harrison Ford said something like "You can type it but you can't read it."
1:23 to 1:28, legit great advice for life when faced with indecision, the way he says it makes it laugh and its always stuck with since I saw it nearly 20 years ago.
+Chas Gregg Yep, althought Hayden Christensen wanted to portray Anakin differently, but Lucas wouldn't let him. As a result, we had a bunch of good actors who had nothing to work with and seemingly little to no control over their characters.
+Ked Viper I don't recall where he said it but Hayden wanted to portray Anakin as a much darker character from the get-go. It would have made more sense that way, given his ultimate decision to join the dark side, but also I don't think it would have given the character a satisfying narrative arc either. So I can agree with Lucas on that end. Anakin needed to come across as a good-hearted guy initially and be seduced to the dark side, not be a dark, somber character throughout that becomes Darth Vader. The problem is Hayden's idea didn't work, and Lucas didn't have any idea how to execute his own ideas well.
switchbuckle5th Oh okay, I didn't remember (know?) how Hayden wanted to portray Anakin, just that it was different from what George wanted. In any event, I agree with you that Anakin needed to be good to start with so that his character arc would be satisfying. Unfortunately, the prequels portrayed him as a whiny bad apple from the start, making it seem totally unbelievable that Obi Wan would later describe him as "a good friend". The Clone Wars show does a much better job developing Anakin. He's portrayed as a strong, confident, good guy who occasionally steps over the line and violates Jedi Code when he deems it necessary, largely due to wartime situations. That makes much more sense to me and falls in line with what Yoda said in TESB, about the Dark Side being quicker, easier, and more seductive. His reasons for getting pissed at the Jedi Counsel make sense too, and make it understandable why that temptation would be there for him.
You wanna see something amazing, watch the behind the scenes of Revenge of the Sith. Lucas is going over a scene with Hayden Christensen and mentions "I've been thinking a lot about this scene. I even re-wrote it last night." And Christensen does the best double take ever, because clearly this is the first time HE'S heard about it. Dude's in full costume, make-up, talking just before shooting, and just NOW he's being told the scene was rewritten.
Incompetence on Lucas' part, yet again. He treats the actors like walking lumps of meat who he can just program to know and say their lines on the spot without any preparation.
Irvin Kirschner was George's college film teacher so I think out of respect George didn't challenge him, thank God. Kirschner Kurtz and kasden made a terrific film empire is genius .
@@Willpowerbomb I mean I give it 50/50 credit. I think Star Wars is at it's best when George is collaborating with someone. Just look at the Originals and the Clone Wars TV show. It's at it's worse when he is working solo AKA the prequels. George isn't perfect but he did change cinema forever.
What a great film maker. Thank you Irvin for the best chapter in the entire Star Wars saga. So sad he went out on a whimper with Robocop 2...but then again it's not his fault as the movie had a very troubled production to being with. Still, I would have loved to see his TRUE vision/version of that film.
I feel that Robocop 2 is worth a re-assessment. Yes, he came on at the 11th hour; I think he gave it some structure, some foundation. Frank Miller's over-the-top ideas are there but Kershner kept it grounded. The early scenes of Murphy being berated and then seeing his wife are unforgettable. He brought a stylistic classiness (clear geography; little of the boring shot-reverse shot that plagues Hollywood) to Miller's trashy ideas. IMO of course.
The same can be said for "Never Say Never Again". Kershner did the best he could with a chaotic production and limited source material, and at the very least managed to wrangle good performances out of Sean Connery and Barbara Carrera.
"You look beautiful. You should wear girls' clothes all the time." Please tell me that was Lucas. PLEASE TELL ME THAT WAS LUCAS BECAUSE I WILL LAUGH SO HARD. That would have been that generation's "I don't like sand" line.
That was Lucas, or at least that was what was in the script. That was them trying to play it out as written by Lucas, but it wasn't working. So, they improvised and that's what we got on screen. It was the same with the freezing chamber scene. They had to improvise there and not go by Lucas' script. Ironically, Lucas' present Mrs fell for Lucas when she heard the "I know" line in ESB. If she only knew that she wasn't falling for nerdy little Lucas, but rather Harrison Ford! lol
@@VinVonVoom Lucas shot 0% of the scenes in ESB. It was all shot in either England or Norway, whilst Lucas spent most of the time in California, with just an odd visit to the set. Kershner himself said that the script as written wasn't working, so they had to improvise a lot. I mean, I can't believe some of you people, thinking that Lucas made everything that we see on screen, even when he was thousands of miles away at the time!
@@white-dragon4424 You should probably read some JW Rinzler before making such bold assessments, after the disastrous Irven Kerschner cut, Lucas had to fly all the way to England and reshoot most of the love scenes and re-edit most everything else.
People keep blaming George Lucas for doing a poor job directing the prequels HOWEVER it is a FACT that Lucas initially wanted STEVEN SPIELBERG to direct Phantom Menace. Spielberg claimed he was busy working on A.I. so turned it down. It later came out that after Spielberg turned him down Lucas then approached directors ROBERT ZEMECKIS and then RON HOWARD. All three directing icons are George's close FRIENDS and none had the BALLS to take on the project. George was left to do them on his own and now he is forever criticized. The true commentary on these events is that George's buddies essentially hung him out to dry when he NEEDED THEM most.
Steve Hewitt They've come out in recent interviews and admitted that they didn't want to get involved in such a huge undertaking. They knew if fans weren't happy they would be taking a lot of the blame, so they stayed away. Taking on the biggest film franchise in history can be intimidating.
At that point it would probably had been a good decision to look for promising young directors like they do now for the new films (Gareth Edwards, Rian Johnson). C'mon, you can't tell me there wasn't a single young director around in the late 90s who would have killed to get the chance to direct a new Star Wars-Movie?
+David Duarte George could've found someone, I don't think him and Kershner were buddies when he chose Kershner to direct the film. It's not like only his closest pals had the right to direct a Star Wars film.
@@TechnologicallyTechnical Kershner was Lucas' tutor. You can say Lucas didn't need to hire anyone close to him to direct Star Wars movies, but frankly the Disney Star Wars movies have been shoddy, to say the least.
Isaiah Tufor to be fair, the reason why he didn’t direct the last two original trilogy movies was because he had to oversee ILM and production. He was also on the Set overseeing kershner and Marquand.
@@sixshot4 He actually took a hands-off approach on Irvin Kershner because he himself as a director didn't like interference with the director from the studio. Supposedly he worked with Marquand a little bit closer but that's only because Marquand wasn't comfortable with the visual effects. Though information on Marquand's directing seems to have gotten lost in history somewhat since he died in the late 80s before he could have any real involvement in a lot of BHS featurettes etc.
@Gilch30 If you know the background, he was as much involved in Empire as he was in Star Wars or Jedi. As I stated in my first post, Lucas was still the main creative force behind the Empire (as he was behind the SW and Jedi). Btw, films are art. There is no such thing as "the best" film. It is entirely up to ones opinion/taste.
All hail Kersh! We are fortunate that he fought Lucas on how the final cut should be, as Lucas didn't know that what he had was the best film his name would ever be associated with. I've heard that Lucas actually apologized for the existence of this film when it was released... Sigh.
So I'm looking at Star Wats stuff in anticipation of seeing the new one tomorrow. Lo and behold, here's something uploaded by Thorium Gordon! Official #1 TH-camr of all time.
+Dylan Roberts It was included on the 6-movie DVD set containing the Special Editions. I have not purchased TESB on iTunes so no idea if this doc is available there today or not. Those 6 DVDs certainly shipping with some great doc material, and I was surprised how good TESB doc was. No, I don't remember the actual title of it, sorry.
It's pretty evident that Kershner did not agree with the darker direction episode 5 took compared to the first Star Wars. But I still admire him for sticking it out in the end. Hell, the guy made a 007 film where James Bond dumps a jar of pee on someone in a fight scene.
So Irvin Kershner changes one line and this proves he was against Lucas? The fact that Kershner once came up with a better version of a line Lucas wrote means absolutely, guess what... NOTHING! Please don't fool yourselves into thinking otherwise and come up with a legitimate gripe.
Reading some of the comments below you'd think Kershner was the creator of Star Wars. He was a director for HIRE chosen by Lucas because Lucas recognized Kershner had strengths with actors and character that Lucas lacked. I don't for one second want to denigrate Kershner's spectacular contribution to ESB. But the preposterous notion that he was it's savior is typical internet fanboy DRIVEL. Lucas supported Kershner as director even he went TEN MILLION dollars over budget. Kershner did not invent the force, lightsabers, create the characters or dream up a galaxy far, far away. Lucas did and he was smart enough to recognize that for Star Wars to grow he needed someone else at the helm of the second movie. I think Lucas chose the perfect person. But Kershner had NEVER made a successful film before the Empire Strikes Back. But they were a great team on ESB and that's the way I choose to think of it. Because I don't hate Lucas and take a shot at him every chance I get. I believe in being fair to people.
I hope you realize most of the thinks you listed were also not invented by Lucas, rather than by Ralph McQuarrie. Lucas is an exceptional expert in taking credits for other peoples work.
"I needed humour in the picture, and yet I couldn't have gags." Return of the Jedi was very guilty of this! They really should have got Irvin to do the whole lot.
Rest in Peace, Irvin Kershner. He made one of the best movies of all time and proved, that he's a 1000 times better director , than Lucas. George now just a completely selfish businessman. Shame.
+Dániel Soós 1000 times better? Irvin Kershner, who directed the inferior remake of Thunderball, the inferior sequel Robocop2, and the forgotten Eyes of Laura Mars. Keep trotting out Kershner like everything he did was made of gold.
Well, correct what you said. Maybe I'm a little inconsiderate. And yes, without Lucas, we never get Star Wars. Speaking about selfishness ,I didn't not talking about charity. I talking about the treat towards the movie fans, those who love the real Star Wars feeling. Lucas put his soul an heart into the classic triogy, but he lost it in the prequels. And those stupid restoration of the old movies....
Well, that's the idea. I think he should teamed up with Lawrence Kasdan. I don't know what others think,but I've would chosed River Phoenix for the role of Anakin, if he didn't die so young.
thegooseman90 doesn't everyone? Who are these magical directors and producers that do it all themselves? Kubrick had Alcott and a lot of adapted stories. Hitchcock had Robert Burks and a lot of adapted stories. No one creates masterpiece film after masterpiece film all by themselves. If those two directors had experience massive financial success to the point where they no longer needed studio dollars to finance their visions who's telling what kind of yes men they may have surrounded themselves with.
The difference is that Kubrick and Hitchcock were masters in what they did already and with the help of other talented people around them, it sharpened the film even more. George Lucas cannot direct or write a script in the first place, it's somewhat of a miracle that A New Hope turned out to be as good as it was.
That's exactly what happened, you're right on the ball. The problem is that no one at Fox really examined HOW the original trilogy was pulled off, they simply treated Lucas as this auteur genius who created everything. It rarely works that way. Most of the great core ideas and staples in Star Trek, for example, were contributed by various writers in the first season, not Gene Roddenberry. When they gave him full control over The Motion Picture, it was a disaster and they quickly regretted it.
@Gilch30 It seems you don't know the background. After Brackett died, Lucas wrote two screenplay drafts from scratch before he hired Kasdan to improve the dialogue. The screenplay credit as it is in film is merely a gesture. Kasdan stated that he had more work and liberty with Jedi script than Empire one since Empire script was pretty much defined when he received it. "Lucas had nearly entire control on that script and filmmaking." - as he had on Empire.
I love how all these Lucan haters praise to no end everyone else involved in the originals but give Lucas no credit. It's treated like George was just the money man and these guys did all the work. They were George's projects and he had a great team around him, but it doesn't take away from him. You guys talk about Kirshner like he's Hitchcock. He's not. I'll take Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones over Robocop 2 any day.
People praise the other creative folks involved in the original trilogy, because the prequel trilogy, and the special editions prove what happens when Lucas has complete control. It seems to clear to me that the other folks working on the movie took Lucas' vision and turned it into some great films.
Lavon Media really? Tell me about it. I've seen it a few times and I can't remember a damn thing. It came and went. You may not like the prequels but every film Lucas every directed is more relevant to film and society than any film Kershner directed, except one, the one he made with Lucas.
Επανεινωνδας Κοσμας Well... The first two episodes of Star Wars was nothing but boring political space crap, annoying jar jar, An akward love interest and Ankian acting like a total bitch. It wasn't until episode 3 that it got improved and we see young Darth turn to the dark side and also being a total badass.
Επανεινωνδας Κοσμας As for Robocop 2.... It wasn't as good as the first Robocop but still.... It was a fun action flick in my personal opinion. That is all I can say.
A lot of the best scenes in cinema history come from actors improvising dialogue. A good director would know if those improvised bits would be worth keeping.
Probably from Ewan McGregor. He's the one that I would call the most likely because I do think he's a wonderful actor that was given shitty lines for those films. Christensen is in no league to complain because he made the prequels funny.
Good thing about Lucas, he was surrounded by creative talent, this helped him craft. Disney doesn't have any creative talent, they are tricksters. They use hooks and bait to get your money,. Lucas only used a good story. No tricks, no hooks, just talent.
MelancoliaI the prequels furthered the lessons you were being taught, that the pen is mightier than the sword, that the empire beat the Jedi using the Jedi weakness of diplomacy and advanced technology, ultimately reducing the Jedi population which is a fundamental weakness, the Jedi strength, is strength in number because they are weaker than the Sith but stronger together, disciplined not to use the force to its full potential because it's not the Jedi way.
MelancoliaI only you can explain why you find them awful, universally, they are not awful, in your mind, they are. Like many fans, you see the scrawl, hear the opening theme, shut your eyes and imagine what the movie is like. You haven't actually seen Star Wars, you've seen what you think Star Wars should be. There lies the flaw, the fundamental difference between Lucas vision and yours, Disneys and every other director, producer, writer, fan and actor that will come after. Lucas drew a picture of a triangle and you think he drew a square because in your mind, the triangle should be a square.
No....I actually kept my eyes open. What did I see? Fake looking overwrought CGI, where the actors were painfully obviously not interacting with the world around them. Muddled storytelling, awful dialogue and acting, and nothing particularly iconic or memorable being introduced. I for one, wasn't against the idea of Lucas introducing new things in the prequels. It's just that he did it so very...badly. You prequel apologists are funny though, with your whole "LUCAS IS THE CREATOR THEREFORE HE IS INFALLIBLE" line. Doesn't work that way.
Kershner was a brilliant man. I don't know why he didn't come back for Return of the Jedi. He really contributed a lot to Star Wars. I feel like areas that George Lucas was weak in Kershner was strength. It was a good collaboration.
Half Eaten Media There was a lot of tension between Irvin and Lucas during ESB's production, mostly because Irvin actually understood proper filmmaking/storytelling, so Lucas got more of a yes-man for ROTJ
It's a tricky issue. I'd prefer to acknowledge (as many have here) that the collection of talents combined (ultimately) extremely well. Don't forget Kasden & Bracket as screen-writers and John Williams powering the film along, or the great cinematography, nor Kurtz. The film going over schedule/budget was ultimately a benefit, but it put Lucas under incredible financial strain.
People always ask, "What happened to George Lucas between the Original Trilogy and the prequels?" Nothing! He was always a terrible screenwriter and a terrible director. But with the original trilogy he was a young filmmaker who was highly collaborative. Even on A New Hope (which is credited as "Written & Directed by George Lucas"), he worked with other screenwriters and a strong producer who pushed him in the right direction. Then with Empire, of course, we get the brilliant Larry Kasdan and Irvin Kershner who, together with producer Gary Kurtz, produced the greatest Star Wars film ever. And the same on Jedi: Kasdan screenwriting and Marquand directing, though you can see Lucas' inane influence in the Ewoks and the cheesy ending. Fast forward to the prequels, and Lucas is the only creative vision on the film. He is surrounded by "yes men," including producer Rick McCallum, none of whom have the guts to tell him it all sucks or, at the very least, push him in a better direction. Lucas is great at developing stories and characters,but there is a HELLUVA lot more to great filmmaking than that, most importantly screenwriting and directing. And he SUCKS HARD at both. He always has. So, nothing happened to him between the OT and the PT. What happened is that he became the Lord of Lucasfilm, didn't collaborate, and was surrounded by sycophants and dolts, and as a result he absolutely destroyed the story of Anakin Skywalker.
+Steven Hunter The prequels were very successful financially.. Research it. If they were so bad, how come bad word of mouth didn't kill them at the box office? Lucas is no Tarantino concerning dialogue but he gets the job done. Should Anakin have been recast? Sure. The prequels had an audience and they were trying to push CGI technology further. At the end of the day, George Lucas gave us Star Wars and Indiana Jones- which I like even more.
+Mike Rychlik Anakin being recast? Christensen is a great actor, it was really shitty dialogue that killed the film. He was amazing in Shattered Glass and he played what the Anakin character was supposed to be, but he was actually reading good lines.
+Steven Hunter Well, although I agree that George's screenwriting has always needed outside assistance, I think he's fine "workman" director. STAR WARS: A NEW HOPE and AMERICAN GRAFFITI are well-directed films. But, I do agree that Lucas needs both boundaries and strong creatives around him (collaborating).
Quite fascinating. That really helps to explain at least partly why he didn't direct a single film between A New Hope and The Phantom Menace, along with the fact that he dealt with some personal life things and he was certainly wealthy enough to not have to depend on directing at that point. I am still a fan of the prequels, however, not because they are particularly well shot or written but because I think the ideas within them are brilliant and wreak of an insightful imagination. He may not have had quite the confidence to take on the directing job all on his own, but all in all he seems to me like a sort of "timid genius" type, who has brilliant ideas but is maybe just an introverted, Type B personality type who is not good with people and therefore gets caught in his own head when left to himself, rather than the collaborative process that the Originals ended up as. Regardless of what you think of the prequels, you could say that Lucas's experience with them were probably a big factor in him handing the franchise over to Disney, so that it could survive in the hands of people who would bring in tons of diverse filmmakers and voices for years to come. Even if he himself might not care for the new films, at least he had the foresight to give away his creation, for better or worse, for the open possibility that that entails.
I consider Lucas to be more of a World Builder than a director. There is no doubt that the guy has a lot of imagination and great ideas and the sheer sense of scale and size in the prequels (Ep.III in particular) is mind-boggling. But as a director, I think he would be better off making smaller, more experimental stuff (I consider his very first movie, "THX1138" to be a hidden gem)
+Movies For Newbies I find your recount a bit dubious solely for the reason that you claim Lucas offered the job of directing to Roland Emmerich. I don't believe for a second that Emmerich would not have jumped at the chance of directing a Star Wars movie. Independence Day was pretty much Emmerich saying "I'm the new Lucas/Spielberg".
Movies For Newbies What's your source for all this? It seems incredibly unlikely he offered anything to Kurtz as he basically fired Kurtz when Empire went over schedule and budget and replaced him with Howard Kazanjian who would also go onto produce Raiders and Jedi.
Hey I love THX-1138 and American Graffiti too, but Ep1-3 reek of no one challenging Lucas. Particularly Ep1. Did you watch the doc that came with the DVD? After they screened it at Lucas Ranch, you could tell no one was impressed. And the Anakin skywalker actor kid was only liked by Lucas (for his spontaneity), everyone else was thinking one of the other candidates had better acting skills. I can't imagine any better explanation for Ep1-3 sucking except the-talented-Lucas surrounded by yes men.
Be fascinating to think what Kersh would have done with Phantom Menace bad he been offered that gig. Lucas was always going to direct Episode III and I understand completely. That was the part of his story he really was most interested in 'completing' and 'making'. But the first two prequels needed directors who could actually get actors to shine and Kersh seems the guy to me. The SFX were all good and the story was good but Lucas half blew it with the directing of his actors. As it is I enjoy the prequels bug recognise their significant weaknesses as films.
r.i.p irvin kirshner, and thank you for directing empire strikes back
God bless that man.
Every once in a while, people with talent are allowed to make a film.
This is why Empire is the best Star Wars movie.
Caravan of Courage. :P
Thank you, Irvin, for caring so much about preserving character, instead of satisfying expectations of those who don't get the universe. You serviced us amazingly with this movie.
when Irvin says "something powerful going on inside luke's soul" i immediately think of the line "Ben, why didn't you tell me?"
Irvin Kershner....CHAMPION.
+Uniform Tango 74 He wanted a love story, so no.
+carmikaze - joinsquad. com He wanted a well-told love story; one that wouldn't look cheesy or forced and that's what we got. So, just because the movie had a love story in it, you think Kershner isn't a champion? It was George's idea to have the love story in the first place.
@@slicex3408 really
Even he made the greatest plot twist
rumor has it, that Han should've said " I am haunted by the kiss, that you should never have given me"...
I wish I could just, wish away the carbonate.
RF-D2 and then Padme said, "Please stop looking at me like that. It makes me feel uncomfortable." XD
*Leia
Meteorite Entertainment Han: Sorry, your worship. * creepy smile *
Well, Han was the one who kissed Leia in a pretty rapey scene. I dunno why he had a similar scene in Bladerunner where he kinda forced himself towards Rachael. I can't blame the actor of course.
Empire Strikes Back is the best....RIP Kershner.
This right here...THIS is filmmaking. Subtlety, character, drama. Themes. Everything missing from the you-know-what trilogy. These minute details, decisions, and sensibilities make all the difference in the world of great storytelling, and unforgettable cinema. Case in Point:
0:12 (ahem...Binks.)
0:19 (cough....Anakin/Padme.)
0:29 (uh...all three prequels).
In 16 seconds, Kershner describes directorial sensibilities that make (or break) great stories.
Kershner was great.
Yeah, I think the attention to detail in this is obvious. Re shooting love scenes, retooling the dialogue to sound more natural... It seems like this was all necessary, but never done. Perhaps they were too busy with building, shooting, and making soooooo many special effects and shooting locations that they sort of rushed over the actual dialogue scenes.
The sequel trilogy?
Luke P both the sequels and prequels tbh
The only one that kind of makes sense is the Jar Jar one. You're just trying to spin everything in the video to hate on the prequels
-I love you...
-I know.
Fucking SAVAGE
Rumor has it, the original script had Leia say; I love you. And Han replies with; "I'm gay."
tigermunky I thoght he was with Chewie lol
Nah that was Kathleen's original idea.
@@swishfish8858 im sure George would’ve made him say “I’m sand”
Ahh you’re thinking of the JK Rowling cut
People like Gary and Kersh is what has been missing from Star Wars since 1983. They just got it.
Irvin did more than an amazing job on Empire Strike Back. It is one of the most iconic movies of today.
Despite what’s said here, Solo’s original scripted response was supposed to be “You remember that because I’ll be back.” So, yes, Harrison Ford almost took Arnold Schwarzenegger’s famous catchphrase.
An actual director doing directing in a star wars film. Who da thunk?
+GooseHinson If only we could've had that for more of these......They could've been the biggest grossing movie of all.....wait a minute....?
tell that to JJ Abrams, Gareth Edwards, Rian Johnson or any of the directors of the mandalorian
From what I hear, George Lucas thought the line "I know" was a bad idea and would spring out bad laughs. The audiences proved him wrong.
Not really, tons of people laugh at that part.
alexreleases who are these tons of people you speak of?
But they are usually good laughs not bad laughs. They laugh because it's a Han thing to say.
I laugh at that part, because it's so unexpected and cool. Gets me every time.
George Lucas doesnt understand people.
I'm surprised Lucas didn't put the 'I love you. I love you too' version back into the ESB special edition! That way he could have ruined a perfect scene in all 3 movies.
He probably fought hard to get it in there.
Lucas: "The 'I love you too' is like poetry, it rhymes with 'I love you.'"
What did he ruin in the other movies?
Kirshner approved of all of the changes to Empire Strikes Back.
Tycho Meertens in the third one he inserted a cartoon frog doing an upbeat song and dance number immediately before Jabba the Hutt feeds a slave to a giant monster for his own entertainment and in the first one he saw fit to jarringly move Harrison Ford's head with a computer to make Han Solo's cold blooded act of self defence into an immediate and fully justified act of self defence.
@@Kitties_are_pretty lmfaooooooooooooo
Kids, these men are why the original Star Wars movies were so great. Gary Kurtz, an amazing producer, Irvin Kershner and even Richard Marquand, great directors and of course Kasdan for the script writing. These are the men that made sure the petulant little Georgie boy wasn't let out of his room for too long and insisted on integrity, above all else. Thank you, gentlemen, for your part in making the originals so well-loved and realistic.
I'm sorry, did you say something?
+Ira ProV lol no
+Ira ProV ca.ign.com/articles/2002/11/11/an-interview-with-gary-kurtz read it you fraud
+RZIBARA that was an intense 5 pages! I enjoyed reading it all though, Gary Kurtz is a great mind...
***** again, did you say something of note? I must have missed it.
This guy understood Star Wars and elaborated on it without making it worse. Looking at you K.K. and J.J. and R.J. and G.L.!!!!
Right on, man. Glad you included George in there. People are acting like Disney is the only problem now and think George knows what he's doing (and he doesn't).
RIP Irvin Kershner. You changed the world of movies forever
Irvin Kershner deserved an Oscar nomination for directing this movie. If not the greatest sequels of all time then one of the top few.
Thanks to Empire Strikes Back every movie franchise now wants to do a "darker" second movie.
the whole prequels were suposed to be darker.. i renember Lucas back from 1994 to 1999 saying time and time again that the new movies were going to be much darker than the original trilogy because they would tell the fall of Anakin Skywalker , the Jedi and the Republic.. a full tragedy..
and then from 1999 to 2005 i was "yeah right"
*****
Source? any interview with Lucas from 1990 to 1998..
For example in:
www.thestarwarstrilogy.com/starwars/post/2013/05/27/Re-live-The-Release-of-the-Star-Wars-Special-Editions-part-1
*****
"Im Anakin ..im a Jedi (2 seconds later) now im 100% Sith lol"
"you look beautifull , thats because im love.. no thats because im in love with ya"
"she is dying because she just lost the will to live"
"its over Anakin my higher ground gives me +5 in attack!"
"why we cant put stardestroyers and TIEs George? -because the empire will have 20 years to build them .. -ok ..then why are we putting the DeathStar 20 years before in the same scene?"
"Yoda: im going to kill the emperor! .. (Yoda accidentally falls a few meters) .. "oh noes im defeated forever , lol im leaving forever and let all the republic just fall without barelly trying"
yes it was darker and certainly the best of the prequels... but still the bullshit metter was too high for me
Anakin did not turn 'dark' in a matter of 2 seconds. Did you completely ignore all the scenes of his amounting frustration with the Jedi Council for not trusting him? How about in Attack of the Clones when he tearfully tells Padme how he slaughtered a village of Tuskan Raiders - not just the men, but women and children too? You also hear a glimpse of the Imperial March theme at the end of that scene. How about all the conversations with Palpatine, who became almost a father-figure, giving nothing but praise to Anakin, when the Jedi Council would let him down? Beheading Count Dooku against Obi-Wan's command but Palpatine's? All the hints about him only being able to spare his loved one & child from the same fate his mother suffered if he had better power given by the darkside? That's just the tip of the iceberg. There's so many implied instances that Anakin was going to turn.
- Mocking the prequels with dialogue as if the Original Trilogy didn't have crap lines? This video even shows how Han's original line was, _"I love you too."_
What about, _"I knew. Somehow,, I always knew."_ When Leia and Luke reveal their sibling kinship... Then why did they kiss... twice? There's plenty of crap dialogue in the originals.
- Padme dying. Did you forget the, _"She was alive. I felt it!"_ scene? Subtly hinting the Emporer drained the life out of her.
- Having the higher ground does give the user an advantage. When did Obi-Wan defeat Anakin? Precisely at that moment. He's had experience in the technique cause he did it against Darth Maul.
- Yoda was depleted from his lightsabre (3:30) and was knocked far further than a 'few meters". He left because he felt he couldn't defeat Sidious.
The bullshit meter is only there because you're viewing the film with your bullshit glasses on.
Kieran Emery well yoda could beat sidious..they are pretty much equals but anyway..
George is like the emperor of Star Wars. He's responsible for everything, but it takes a Darth Vader like Irvin Kirshner or Lawrence Kasdan to actually enact his master plan. The prequels were too much for one man to handle on his own, even George.
Yeh, someone gets it, George is important, but has one role.
This is beautiful :O I so much agree
Lucas is a great idea man (well he borrows those ideas from old movie serials, comic books, Samurai films, Westerns, and fantasy novels, but he borrows from good sources and combines them in fun ways to make them his own). He's great at building universes, and concepts, and the broad strokes of the story.
But, when it comes to characters, emotions, and the intricate details of the story he needs collaborators (not "yes men" but real collaborators) to flesh them out, and filter out what doesn't work.
It's true I like the prequels but come on dude. Imagine having a legendary director like Spielberg or even James Cameron on his side writing dialogue, having great cinematography and Lucas doing the outline,story and effects etc
@@TetsuDeinonychus his Yes Men were so bad. They would say anything after he left and I'm just like wtf what's the point of you saying yes
The interviews of the main three characters of the original trilogy complained about his style of dialogues. Harrison Ford said something like "You can type it but you can't read it."
1:23 to 1:28, legit great advice for life when faced with indecision, the way he says it makes it laugh and its always stuck with since I saw it nearly 20 years ago.
"George, you can type this shit, but you sure as hell can't say it." - Harrison Ford
This guy created the heart of the Star Wars series. Everything significant happens in Empire.
There's the problem with the prequels. We didn't have another director or an actor like Harrison Ford to change hum drum lines.
+Chas Gregg Yep, althought Hayden Christensen wanted to portray Anakin differently, but Lucas wouldn't let him. As a result, we had a bunch of good actors who had nothing to work with and seemingly little to no control over their characters.
Ked Viper
Sorry, I don't remember the video that referenced that. :(
I've watched too many Star Wars videos in the last couple months to remember.
+Ked Viper I don't recall where he said it but Hayden wanted to portray Anakin as a much darker character from the get-go. It would have made more sense that way, given his ultimate decision to join the dark side, but also I don't think it would have given the character a satisfying narrative arc either. So I can agree with Lucas on that end. Anakin needed to come across as a good-hearted guy initially and be seduced to the dark side, not be a dark, somber character throughout that becomes Darth Vader. The problem is Hayden's idea didn't work, and Lucas didn't have any idea how to execute his own ideas well.
switchbuckle5th
Oh okay, I didn't remember (know?) how Hayden wanted to portray Anakin, just that it was different from what George wanted. In any event, I agree with you that Anakin needed to be good to start with so that his character arc would be satisfying. Unfortunately, the prequels portrayed him as a whiny bad apple from the start, making it seem totally unbelievable that Obi Wan would later describe him as "a good friend".
The Clone Wars show does a much better job developing Anakin. He's portrayed as a strong, confident, good guy who occasionally steps over the line and violates Jedi Code when he deems it necessary, largely due to wartime situations. That makes much more sense to me and falls in line with what Yoda said in TESB, about the Dark Side being quicker, easier, and more seductive. His reasons for getting pissed at the Jedi Counsel make sense too, and make it understandable why that temptation would be there for him.
No Youmaynot Yup. Your thoughts and mine on the subject are completely aligned. *nods*
Irvin Kershner was the true director of Star Wars.
And you and all the 56 people that upvoted you are morons for thinking that.
Yes your Right He is the Director of Star Wars the Empire strikes back he Belongs to him in our Childhood memories.
He directed it - George’s story - whim approves everything. Nothing was done without George’s approval.
"It didn't FEEL right". And that's where it all went right.
You wanna see something amazing, watch the behind the scenes of Revenge of the Sith. Lucas is going over a scene with Hayden Christensen and mentions "I've been thinking a lot about this scene. I even re-wrote it last night." And Christensen does the best double take ever, because clearly this is the first time HE'S heard about it. Dude's in full costume, make-up, talking just before shooting, and just NOW he's being told the scene was rewritten.
Incompetence on Lucas' part, yet again. He treats the actors like walking lumps of meat who he can just program to know and say their lines on the spot without any preparation.
Irvin Kirschner was George's college film teacher so I think out of respect George didn't challenge him, thank God. Kirschner Kurtz and kasden made a terrific film empire is genius .
Natalie Panaro Stack There was actually some tension between George and Irvin during the production of the film
So George doesn’t get ANY credit for Empire? That’s taking it a little too far, don’t you think?
@@Willpowerbomb I mean I give it 50/50 credit. I think Star Wars is at it's best when George is collaborating with someone. Just look at the Originals and the Clone Wars TV show. It's at it's worse when he is working solo AKA the prequels. George isn't perfect but he did change cinema forever.
@@CometStar100 🙄
@@Dektoonics_inc. What?
"This scene isn't working, let's make it more subtle." - Irvin vs Lucas
What a great film maker. Thank you Irvin for the best chapter in the entire Star Wars saga. So sad he went out on a whimper with Robocop 2...but then again it's not his fault as the movie had a very troubled production to being with. Still, I would have loved to see his TRUE vision/version of that film.
I feel that Robocop 2 is worth a re-assessment. Yes, he came on at the 11th hour; I think he gave it some structure, some foundation. Frank Miller's over-the-top ideas are there but Kershner kept it grounded. The early scenes of Murphy being berated and then seeing his wife are unforgettable. He brought a stylistic classiness (clear geography; little of the boring shot-reverse shot that plagues Hollywood) to Miller's trashy ideas. IMO of course.
The same can be said for "Never Say Never Again". Kershner did the best he could with a chaotic production and limited source material, and at the very least managed to wrangle good performances out of Sean Connery and Barbara Carrera.
"You look beautiful. You should wear girls' clothes all the time."
Please tell me that was Lucas. PLEASE TELL ME THAT WAS LUCAS BECAUSE I WILL LAUGH SO HARD. That would have been that generation's "I don't like sand" line.
I thought it was kinda funny tbh
That was Lucas, or at least that was what was in the script. That was them trying to play it out as written by Lucas, but it wasn't working. So, they improvised and that's what we got on screen. It was the same with the freezing chamber scene. They had to improvise there and not go by Lucas' script. Ironically, Lucas' present Mrs fell for Lucas when she heard the "I know" line in ESB. If she only knew that she wasn't falling for nerdy little Lucas, but rather Harrison Ford! lol
@@white-dragon4424 No it's an Irven Kerschner line. George is the one who rewrote and reshot all of the love scenes.
@@VinVonVoom Lucas shot 0% of the scenes in ESB. It was all shot in either England or Norway, whilst Lucas spent most of the time in California, with just an odd visit to the set. Kershner himself said that the script as written wasn't working, so they had to improvise a lot. I mean, I can't believe some of you people, thinking that Lucas made everything that we see on screen, even when he was thousands of miles away at the time!
@@white-dragon4424 You should probably read some JW Rinzler before making such bold assessments, after the disastrous Irven Kerschner cut, Lucas had to fly all the way to England and reshoot most of the love scenes and re-edit most everything else.
People keep blaming George Lucas for doing a poor job directing the prequels HOWEVER it is a FACT that Lucas initially wanted STEVEN SPIELBERG to direct Phantom Menace. Spielberg claimed he was busy working on A.I. so turned it down. It later came out that after Spielberg turned him down Lucas then approached directors ROBERT ZEMECKIS and then RON HOWARD. All three directing icons are George's close FRIENDS and none had the BALLS to take on the project. George was left to do them on his own and now he is forever criticized. The true commentary on these events is that George's buddies essentially hung him out to dry when he NEEDED THEM most.
+David Duarte
maybe they read the script..
Steve Hewitt They've come out in recent interviews and admitted that they didn't want to get involved in such a huge undertaking. They knew if fans weren't happy they would be taking a lot of the blame, so they stayed away. Taking on the biggest film franchise in history can be intimidating.
At that point it would probably had been a good decision to look for promising young directors like they do now for the new films (Gareth Edwards, Rian Johnson). C'mon, you can't tell me there wasn't a single young director around in the late 90s who would have killed to get the chance to direct a new Star Wars-Movie?
+David Duarte George could've found someone, I don't think him and Kershner were buddies when he chose Kershner to direct the film. It's not like only his closest pals had the right to direct a Star Wars film.
@@TechnologicallyTechnical
Kershner was Lucas' tutor.
You can say Lucas didn't need to hire anyone close to him to direct Star Wars movies, but frankly the Disney Star Wars movies have been shoddy, to say the least.
This is what happens when Lucas focuses on special effects, and leaves the substance of the film to people more talented than him.
Boy do i hate people like you.
@Isaiah Tufor Learn how to make sense and how to write properly. This is unwatchable.
@Isaiah Tufor Tarantino actually had someone else direct a few of his early movies lol.
Isaiah Tufor to be fair, the reason why he didn’t direct the last two original trilogy movies was because he had to oversee ILM and production. He was also on the Set overseeing kershner and Marquand.
@@sixshot4 He actually took a hands-off approach on Irvin Kershner because he himself as a director didn't like interference with the director from the studio. Supposedly he worked with Marquand a little bit closer but that's only because Marquand wasn't comfortable with the visual effects. Though information on Marquand's directing seems to have gotten lost in history somewhat since he died in the late 80s before he could have any real involvement in a lot of BHS featurettes etc.
@Gilch30 If you know the background, he was as much involved in Empire as he was in Star Wars or Jedi. As I stated in my first post, Lucas was still the main creative force behind the Empire (as he was behind the SW and Jedi).
Btw, films are art. There is no such thing as "the best" film. It is entirely up to ones opinion/taste.
If only Kirshner had directed the prequels.
he was too old
@@wwb16 Of course.
He follow up works Never say never again and RoboCop 2 basically showed that he was lucky to get good material Once
@@adamcade604 I'd agree to an extent, I haven't seen all of his older films and I think Eyes Of Laura Mars was solidly directed.
All hail Kersh! We are fortunate that he fought Lucas on how the final cut should be, as Lucas didn't know that what he had was the best film his name would ever be associated with. I've heard that Lucas actually apologized for the existence of this film when it was released... Sigh.
The movie wasn't well received by the critics at the time need i remind ypu
Empire isnt just the best star wars. It IS star wars.
Empire of dreams documentary - Epic
I could imagine if Irvin Kershner directed an MCU film.
So I'm looking at Star Wats stuff in anticipation of seeing the new one tomorrow. Lo and behold, here's something uploaded by Thorium Gordon! Official #1 TH-camr of all time.
Who the hell was in charge of the subtitling? Jack Daniels?
+Daily Mouth Hahhahahahahahahahahaahhahahahaahhahaaha smoke, gagging :-D
Dude, I laughed so freakin' hard at this video and it's drunk-azz subtitles. HAHAHA!
First 35 seconds of the video and I'm already liking what I'm listening.
what documentary is this?
+Dylan Roberts It was included on the 6-movie DVD set containing the Special Editions. I have not purchased TESB on iTunes so no idea if this doc is available there today or not. Those 6 DVDs certainly shipping with some great doc material, and I was surprised how good TESB doc was. No, I don't remember the actual title of it, sorry.
+gordonmcdowell Thanks!
+Dylan Roberts search "star wars empire of dreams" on TH-cam, and you will take a step to a larger world...
Empire of Dreams.
+Genetic Heresy its like poetry...it rhymes!
what is this "behind the scenes" video from??
+Apple Lucas the 2004 documentary, "Empire of Dreams"
It's pretty evident that Kershner did not agree with the darker direction episode 5 took compared to the first Star Wars. But I still admire him for sticking it out in the end.
Hell, the guy made a 007 film where James Bond dumps a jar of pee on someone in a fight scene.
The empire strikes back is the best star wars period!!!!
Caravan of Courage. :P
I saw Episode II again and I noticed that Natalie Portman has 10 costume changes in the movie! Guess they have to sell the toys.
That was Larry Kasdan's writing and he was the one upset when it wasn't done as written. Just like with Solo.
The best Star Wars Director, shame he never made anything very special afterwards.
They should have got him to do Return of the Jedi. Maybe it would be less cheesy and more coherent of a film from start to finish.
He seemed to have a lot of trouble in production, and Lucas had to bail him out near the end
So Irvin Kershner changes one line and this proves he was against Lucas? The fact that Kershner once came up with a better version of a line Lucas wrote means absolutely, guess what... NOTHING! Please don't fool yourselves into thinking otherwise and come up with a legitimate gripe.
Reading some of the comments below you'd think Kershner was the creator of Star Wars. He was a director for HIRE chosen by Lucas because Lucas recognized Kershner had strengths with actors and character that Lucas lacked. I don't for one second want to denigrate Kershner's spectacular contribution to ESB. But the preposterous notion that he was it's savior is typical internet fanboy DRIVEL. Lucas supported Kershner as director even he went TEN MILLION dollars over budget. Kershner did not invent the force, lightsabers, create the characters or dream up a galaxy far, far away. Lucas did and he was smart enough to recognize that for Star Wars to grow he needed someone else at the helm of the second movie. I think Lucas chose the perfect person. But Kershner had NEVER made a successful film before the Empire Strikes Back. But they were a great team on ESB and that's the way I choose to think of it. Because I don't hate Lucas and take a shot at him every chance I get. I believe in being fair to people.
+JohnWesley Downey Yeah and have of these people wouldn't even be able to mention another film Kershner did without the help of google.
Robocop 2 is pretty fucking awesome.
Spot on!
I hope you realize most of the thinks you listed were also not invented by Lucas, rather than by Ralph McQuarrie. Lucas is an exceptional expert in taking credits for other peoples work.
Beautiful, really beautiful !! You 150% right !
What is this a clip from? Where can I find the rest of this?
Empire of Dreams is the full doc.
@@CarlMarxPunk Thanks!
Great director, and a great mentor.
Carrie Fisher is looking so beautiful in those clips.
RIP Mr. Kershner. You directed one of my favorite films and my favorite _Star Wars_ film.
"I needed humour in the picture, and yet I couldn't have gags." Return of the Jedi was very guilty of this! They really should have got Irvin to do the whole lot.
We won't Forget Irvin Kershiner Directed this Movie it belongs to Him Amen.
Can you imagine Episode 1 written by Lawrence Kasdan and directed by Irvin Kershner? How AWESOME it would be?
Rest in Peace, Irvin Kershner. He made one of the best movies of all time and proved, that he's a 1000 times better director , than Lucas. George now just a completely selfish businessman. Shame.
+Dániel Soós
1000 times better? Irvin Kershner, who directed the inferior remake of Thunderball, the inferior sequel Robocop2, and the forgotten Eyes of Laura Mars. Keep trotting out Kershner like everything he did was made of gold.
Well, correct what you said. Maybe I'm a little inconsiderate. And yes, without Lucas, we never get Star Wars. Speaking about selfishness ,I didn't not talking about charity. I talking about the treat towards the movie fans, those who love the real Star Wars feeling. Lucas put his soul an heart into the classic triogy, but he lost it in the prequels. And those stupid restoration of the old movies....
Well, that's the idea. I think he should teamed up with Lawrence Kasdan. I don't know what others think,but I've would chosed River Phoenix for the role of Anakin, if he didn't die so young.
Hayden did a good job in Life as a House and Shattered Glass
Just like Disney
Solo says "I know " , in Rise of the Skywalker too.
I respect George Lucas but he needed the creative filters of Gary Kurtz and others for the prequels.
thegooseman90 doesn't everyone? Who are these magical directors and producers that do it all themselves? Kubrick had Alcott and a lot of adapted stories. Hitchcock had Robert Burks and a lot of adapted stories. No one creates masterpiece film after masterpiece film all by themselves. If those two directors had experience massive financial success to the point where they no longer needed studio dollars to finance their visions who's telling what kind of yes men they may have surrounded themselves with.
The difference is that Kubrick and Hitchcock were masters in what they did already and with the help of other talented people around them, it sharpened the film even more. George Lucas cannot direct or write a script in the first place, it's somewhat of a miracle that A New Hope turned out to be as good as it was.
Daniel Nicklas and yet American Grafitti is still a better piece of art than anything Star Wars related.
Wasn't ANH saved in editing by his wife?
_"And he most definitely did not surround himself with yes men when he made the prequels"_
What's your next comment? *Islam is a religion of peace?*
This is one of the best documentaries every made
You know what these scenes need?
Exposition on Sand
That's exactly what happened, you're right on the ball. The problem is that no one at Fox really examined HOW the original trilogy was pulled off, they simply treated Lucas as this auteur genius who created everything. It rarely works that way. Most of the great core ideas and staples in Star Trek, for example, were contributed by various writers in the first season, not Gene Roddenberry. When they gave him full control over The Motion Picture, it was a disaster and they quickly regretted it.
George always had full control
Exactly, pin this comment
I would LOVE to see the alternate takes of the carbon freezing scene!
Everything that Irvin says at first there is the exact opposite that happened in The Last Jedi.
i really like last jedi but its no empire strikes back
@Gilch30 It seems you don't know the background. After Brackett died, Lucas wrote two screenplay drafts from scratch before he hired Kasdan to improve the dialogue. The screenplay credit as it is in film is merely a gesture. Kasdan stated that he had more work and liberty with Jedi script than Empire one since Empire script was pretty much defined when he received it.
"Lucas had nearly entire control on that script and filmmaking." - as he had on Empire.
RIP Carrie!
I'm gonna keep it tight and short:
Empire Strikes back > The New Hope
And of the OT Return of the Jedi is at the bottom. 2/3 of the film is boring and makes use of gags over humour as Kershner talks about in the video.
Nope. Youre reffering to the special edition. The original unaltered 1977 star wars is leaps ahead of empire in every way.😊
Irvin kershner........to rian johnson
You both are the best.
I can only imagine what Irvin Kerschner would have done with he script of the Attack of the Clones.
Gustavo Medeiros , possibly thrown it out.
I still ESB was the best one followed by ANH.
From what I can tell, yes he was. He's more influtential and powerful now then he was back then, so ppl are afraid to speak against his bad ideas.
I love how all these Lucan haters praise to no end everyone else involved in the originals but give Lucas no credit. It's treated like George was just the money man and these guys did all the work. They were George's projects and he had a great team around him, but it doesn't take away from him. You guys talk about Kirshner like he's Hitchcock. He's not.
I'll take Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones over Robocop 2 any day.
Επανεινωνδας Κοσμας Except Robocop 2 was a better movie than episode 1 and 2 of Star Wars!
People praise the other creative folks involved in the original trilogy, because the prequel trilogy, and the special editions prove what happens when Lucas has complete control. It seems to clear to me that the other folks working on the movie took Lucas' vision and turned it into some great films.
Lavon Media really? Tell me about it. I've seen it a few times and I can't remember a damn thing. It came and went. You may not like the prequels but every film Lucas every directed is more relevant to film and society than any film Kershner directed, except one, the one he made with Lucas.
Επανεινωνδας Κοσμας Well... The first two episodes of Star Wars was nothing but boring political space crap, annoying jar jar, An akward love interest and Ankian acting like a total bitch. It wasn't until episode 3 that it got improved and we see young Darth turn to the dark side and also being a total badass.
Επανεινωνδας Κοσμας As for Robocop 2.... It wasn't as good as the first Robocop but still.... It was a fun action flick in my personal opinion. That is all I can say.
A lot of the best scenes in cinema history come from actors improvising dialogue. A good director would know if those improvised bits would be worth keeping.
Probably from Ewan McGregor. He's the one that I would call the most likely because I do think he's a wonderful actor that was given shitty lines for those films. Christensen is in no league to complain because he made the prequels funny.
Good thing about Lucas, he was surrounded by creative talent, this helped him craft. Disney doesn't have any creative talent, they are tricksters. They use hooks and bait to get your money,. Lucas only used a good story. No tricks, no hooks, just talent.
Then please kindly, if you well tell me what happened with the prequels.
MelancoliaI the prequels furthered the lessons you were being taught, that the pen is mightier than the sword, that the empire beat the Jedi using the Jedi weakness of diplomacy and advanced technology, ultimately reducing the Jedi population which is a fundamental weakness, the Jedi strength, is strength in number because they are weaker than the Sith but stronger together, disciplined not to use the force to its full potential because it's not the Jedi way.
I mean in the sense of why they were so awful.
MelancoliaI only you can explain why you find them awful, universally, they are not awful, in your mind, they are. Like many fans, you see the scrawl, hear the opening theme, shut your eyes and imagine what the movie is like. You haven't actually seen Star Wars, you've seen what you think Star Wars should be. There lies the flaw, the fundamental difference between Lucas vision and yours, Disneys and every other director, producer, writer, fan and actor that will come after. Lucas drew a picture of a triangle and you think he drew a square because in your mind, the triangle should be a square.
No....I actually kept my eyes open. What did I see?
Fake looking overwrought CGI, where the actors were painfully obviously not interacting with the world around them. Muddled storytelling, awful dialogue and acting, and nothing particularly iconic or memorable being introduced.
I for one, wasn't against the idea of Lucas introducing new things in the prequels. It's just that he did it so very...badly. You prequel apologists are funny though, with your whole "LUCAS IS THE CREATOR THEREFORE HE IS INFALLIBLE" line. Doesn't work that way.
Kershner was a brilliant man. I don't know why he didn't come back for Return of the Jedi. He really contributed a lot to Star Wars. I feel like areas that George Lucas was weak in Kershner was strength. It was a good collaboration.
Half Eaten Media There was a lot of tension between Irvin and Lucas during ESB's production, mostly because Irvin actually understood proper filmmaking/storytelling, so Lucas got more of a yes-man for ROTJ
Lucas = Worldbuilding
🤝
Kershner = Story and characters
@@TechnologicallyTechnical So you say Lucas doesn't understand proper filmmaking? Come on
@@TechnologicallyTechnicalthat is a lie. Lucas wanted Kershner to direct Return of The Jedi Kershner didn't want to return.
@@officialmonarchmusic I'd say he's not a gifted writer or director, and he'd agree, because he's said so himself.
I love this movie!!
Director of one of the best films in history. LEGEND!
"Humor, not gags" EXACTLY what's wrong with TLJ
patrick soler what gags.
Humor and gags are same thing.
Steamboat Willie. Nope.
why is this titled vs Lucas? Lucas isn't even in the video lol, was expecting some opposite views or something
+Dizzy Blu Trying to get views?
Don't worry Kersh, you nailed it.
Han saying he doesn't trust Lando is honestly much more in character too.
It's a tricky issue. I'd prefer to acknowledge (as many have here) that the collection of talents combined (ultimately) extremely well. Don't forget Kasden & Bracket as screen-writers and John Williams powering the film along, or the great cinematography, nor Kurtz. The film going over schedule/budget was ultimately a benefit, but it put Lucas under incredible financial strain.
People always ask, "What happened to George Lucas between the Original Trilogy and the prequels?" Nothing! He was always a terrible screenwriter and a terrible director. But with the original trilogy he was a young filmmaker who was highly collaborative. Even on A New Hope (which is credited as "Written & Directed by George Lucas"), he worked with other screenwriters and a strong producer who pushed him in the right direction. Then with Empire, of course, we get the brilliant Larry Kasdan and Irvin Kershner who, together with producer Gary Kurtz, produced the greatest Star Wars film ever. And the same on Jedi: Kasdan screenwriting and Marquand directing, though you can see Lucas' inane influence in the Ewoks and the cheesy ending.
Fast forward to the prequels, and Lucas is the only creative vision on the film. He is surrounded by "yes men," including producer Rick McCallum, none of whom have the guts to tell him it all sucks or, at the very least, push him in a better direction. Lucas is great at developing stories and characters,but there is a HELLUVA lot more to great filmmaking than that, most importantly screenwriting and directing. And he SUCKS HARD at both. He always has. So, nothing happened to him between the OT and the PT. What happened is that he became the Lord of Lucasfilm, didn't collaborate, and was surrounded by sycophants and dolts, and as a result he absolutely destroyed the story of Anakin Skywalker.
+Steven Hunter Yes.
I feel this is very true.
+Steven Hunter The prequels were very successful financially.. Research it. If they were so bad, how come bad word of mouth didn't kill them at the box office? Lucas is no Tarantino concerning dialogue but he gets the job done. Should Anakin have been recast? Sure. The prequels had an audience and they were trying to push CGI technology further. At the end of the day, George Lucas gave us Star Wars and Indiana Jones- which I like even more.
+Mike Rychlik Anakin being recast? Christensen is a great actor, it was really shitty dialogue that killed the film. He was amazing in Shattered Glass and he played what the Anakin character was supposed to be, but he was actually reading good lines.
+Steven Hunter Well, although I agree that George's screenwriting has always needed outside assistance, I think he's fine "workman" director. STAR WARS: A NEW HOPE and AMERICAN GRAFFITI are well-directed films. But, I do agree that Lucas needs both boundaries and strong creatives around him (collaborating).
Why didn't Lucas try to get this guy to direct the prequels? Lucas tried to find a director for the prequels but they all encouraged him to direct.
Quite fascinating. That really helps to explain at least partly why he didn't direct a single film between A New Hope and The Phantom Menace, along with the fact that he dealt with some personal life things and he was certainly wealthy enough to not have to depend on directing at that point.
I am still a fan of the prequels, however, not because they are particularly well shot or written but because I think the ideas within them are brilliant and wreak of an insightful imagination. He may not have had quite the confidence to take on the directing job all on his own, but all in all he seems to me like a sort of "timid genius" type, who has brilliant ideas but is maybe just an introverted, Type B personality type who is not good with people and therefore gets caught in his own head when left to himself, rather than the collaborative process that the Originals ended up as.
Regardless of what you think of the prequels, you could say that Lucas's experience with them were probably a big factor in him handing the franchise over to Disney, so that it could survive in the hands of people who would bring in tons of diverse filmmakers and voices for years to come. Even if he himself might not care for the new films, at least he had the foresight to give away his creation, for better or worse, for the open possibility that that entails.
I consider Lucas to be more of a World Builder than a director. There is no doubt that the guy has a lot of imagination and great ideas and the sheer sense of scale and size in the prequels (Ep.III in particular) is mind-boggling. But as a director, I think he would be better off making smaller, more experimental stuff (I consider his very first movie, "THX1138" to be a hidden gem)
+Movies For Newbies I find your recount a bit dubious solely for the reason that you claim Lucas offered the job of directing to Roland Emmerich. I don't believe for a second that Emmerich would not have jumped at the chance of directing a Star Wars movie. Independence Day was pretty much Emmerich saying "I'm the new Lucas/Spielberg".
Movies For Newbies What's your source for all this? It seems incredibly unlikely he offered anything to Kurtz as he basically fired Kurtz when Empire went over schedule and budget and replaced him with Howard Kazanjian who would also go onto produce Raiders and Jedi.
the most hilarious subtitles ever
Congratulations mr.Kershner for made One Of The Best 2 movies in the World!
Second is Godzilla 1984
Rumor has it originally Leia said "I love you" and Han said "That's a spicy meatball!"
Rian should take some notes...
This one movie held the franchise together.
I always thought he said I know because he had done so many takes.
Hey I love THX-1138 and American Graffiti too, but Ep1-3 reek of no one challenging Lucas. Particularly Ep1. Did you watch the doc that came with the DVD? After they screened it at Lucas Ranch, you could tell no one was impressed. And the Anakin skywalker actor kid was only liked by Lucas (for his spontaneity), everyone else was thinking one of the other candidates had better acting skills. I can't imagine any better explanation for Ep1-3 sucking except the-talented-Lucas surrounded by yes men.
It’s certainly no accident Empire is the best of all the Star Wars films by a lot.
Be fascinating to think what Kersh would have done with Phantom Menace bad he been offered that gig.
Lucas was always going to direct Episode III and I understand completely. That was the part of his story he really was most interested in 'completing' and 'making'. But the first two prequels needed directors who could actually get actors to shine and Kersh seems the guy to me. The SFX were all good and the story was good but Lucas half blew it with the directing of his actors. As it is I enjoy the prequels bug recognise their significant weaknesses as films.
Is this Mike from breaking bad? :P