A long riders take on the “Charlotte Dujardin” controversy.
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ย. 2024
- Typical Pete rant about abuse in the horse industry.
#CharlotteDujardin #Paris2024 #TeamGB #Equestrian #dressage #horsebackriding #saddleup #longriding #equestrian #horse #horsebackadventures #saddle #saddlery #adventure #traveling
Don't leave out the judges! They reward popularity, extreme movement over sound correct training and bad judging actually encourages the rest of riders to copy what wins!
@@kimwilliamson3615 100% agree. FEI has a LOT TO ANSWER FOR! Imagine if they actually awarded points for ethical conduct!
this is the big problem
U are so correct!!👍
The FEI has turned a blind eye to the abuses for many years , they full know about it but refuse to punish or gives consequences to those abusers! Whistleblowers are subject to extreme abuse and definitely will loose their jobs in the horse world!
I started riding at 5. My instructor was a retired colonel from the British Cavalry. He was strict BUT he never allowed us to blame the horse for ANY mistake. The mistake lies with the rider: either he/she didn't give the right commands or he/she was demanding things the horse cannot physically do. I have NEVER whipped any of my ponies or horses. When I started working and had to put my horses in livery I moved them frequently because EVERYWHERE I saw blatant cruelty and couldn't take it. I was considered an enemy by the other riders/owners. That is when I stopped competing. I would like to see a one year ban of ALL equestrian sports (including endurance) to give us time to make new rules that put the horses' welfare First. I started competing in small local shows and even there I saw parents telling their children to "show him who's boss". If we did to dogs what we do to horses we'd all be in jail. And rightly so. Thanks Pete for your video. I hope a huge, nationwide investigation into horse cruelty, with cc cameras on all the time, comes out of this with NO ONE being above the law. I just hope that this one thing can come out of the horror that has just been exposed.
@@shermoore1693 I agree with you here. A one year ban or hold would be “in theory” great. But in practice… it would kill so many horses. Why? Because the second they loose their “value” to these people, then they loose everything. Sadly I’m a bit of a pessimistic realist here and have come to accept most people will NOT change and it’s a big part due to the money the sport generates. No one cares about the grunts dying in Ukraine… it’s all about money. People are the same when it comes to horses too. The people with the $$ have the influence over those that make the rules that govern them. :(
@@BeprofessionalLookcool Gosh, your comments make me think you are right. I hope not, but you probably are. Surely I'm not the only one wanting radical change in the horse world? Can't we unite and fight the money-hungry people that use horses to inflate their egos? Thanks for your comment, but I do hope you're wrong, though I fear you're right.
@@shermoore1693 yeah it’s like any animal. If it has value, we breed them. If not… then it’s gone. Just look at hunting in Africa. Where people want to protect the animals they go extinct through habitat loss to farming and poaching. But charge to shoot them and the farmers make more off HAVING wild areas and game animals. Sadly, it’s all about the $$ and always will be. Same as oil, we are dependent on it because the second we aren’t every economy collapses overnight.
You have never whipped your horse because you have never competed to any significant level.
@@ln5747 I have never competed at any significant level because I refused to whip my horse.
00:32 "overweight riders on ill fitting saddles on fat horses with bad hooves" I COULD NOT AGREE MORE!!! There are people out there who are trying to do the right thing by their horses but they seem to be in the minority. Let's hope you can get your message across.
I read an article saying that the calculation should be: 15% of weight of horse should be the maximum for weight of saddle plus rider. So a 500kg horse should never be ridden for anyone over 70 kg IF the saddle weighs 5 kg. I personally would add: this is fine for a normal hack, but for horses doing any form of competition (and therefore more physically challenging) that should be reduced to 10%. Just my opinion. the second part.
@@shermoore1693 Thank you! it's always good to have more information and helpful guidelines
And people who are large on small horses!!
You mean the message that exposing the abuse of professional horses is ok and to report on it is hypocrisy. Yeah, this guy has a wonderful message, what an appalling disgrace he is. And anyone with his line of thinking shouldn't be allowed to work with horses. As I said in my longer comment above, watch Steve Young Horsemanship's channel to see what's achievable with zero cruelty in sight. He could work any of the olympic horses to same results without terrorising them.
Hi @@katealison6087 no, of course abusing horses is not ok, under any circumstances. But there are many forms of abuse, which is what the message is from this channel. So just because someone is not "whipping" a horse, doesn't mean that there is no abuse. An ill fitting saddle causes pain to the horse with every stride, in the same way that ill fitting shoes would cause you or me pain. This is his message and he also does not condone the training methods under discussion.
Abusing horses is so terribly normalized that folk will fight for the right to abuse their horses instead of taking a step back and looking at what's better for the horse and not the human.
Define abuse. Is using leg abuse? It will be at some point if people like you get their way, which is a large majority in the weak, woke West.
It was a non event. Your a midwit applying human emotion and characteristics to a horse. You think the horse went to it's stable after with mental health issues, crying itself to sleep and thinking about killing itself. In reality, it would have felt like a minor sting which the horse naturally reacted to and had forgotten about as soon as the lesson had finished.
Regardless of what other perks do, what Charlotte Charlotte Dujardin did was totally unacceptable.
@@india1422 100% agree. She just got caught and like her, all of us should try and do better.
@@BeprofessionalLookcoolsorry but it’s too late for CD now, she should have all titles taken away for what she’s done, it worked with Lars Armstrong, there’s so much wrong with this sport from many people from judging to riders, sorry but it’s my opinion
@@expatmoose *LANCE* Armstrong, you mean?
@@lynnegee6814 yup sorry my bad
@@BeprofessionalLookcool how annoying that she got caught. And let's not forget the hypocrisy of that, right? Because that's the important part. No, the message that it is never ok to terrify these sensitive cautious creatures into doing anything for human gain is the message. I keep mentioning Steve Young Horsemanship because he's the gold standard. The moment when a horse clicks - and that's visible in its body language - that he's a kind and absolute leader is when he gets 100 compliance. The horse feels safe and he accepts the leadership - and the results are nothing short of beautiful. Whips aren't needed, constricting bits aren't needed, spurs aren't needed. Nothing other than good leadership, directed through the understandings of horse psychology is ever needed. To see that woman whip that horse round the school - I physically couldn't watch all the way through.
She needs therapy like all abusers
I don't disagree with the points you make regarding welfare issues - but I wonder if you've even seen the video or did you just hear that she 'whipped' him? - it wasn't a moment of frustration or anger, she was calmly, deliberately whipping the horse to get it to lift his feet for over a minute and even commented that the whip was *hit for hitting hard but you could see the sting of it on the horse - it also begs the question that if this is what she thought was acceptable in front of people being videod what does she do in private?
@@jillrhodry1139 seen the video and i can’t stand it. It is pretty standard though, and some really big names are going to fall really soon I’d say. First Mark Todd, now her. But so long as there’s money to be made, this will continue.
Sick sick sick god help us
@@BeprofessionalLookcoolThis should not be the norm. No excuses.
It was disgusting but honestly very very far from the worse that happens in dressage or any competitive discipline. And in my opinion big lick is pure torture and way way worse than what is shown in this video.
Completely agree!
Very well said. Thank you for so clearly communicating about this.
Totally with you with regards to fat people. No fat person should even consider riding a horse !!
Bit rough . Some larger breeds of horses can carry a 5th of their weight ???
I do agree, but there is one thing I'd like to point out: you said that you KNOW you have made mistakes and that you're trying to better yourself. And that's the point. You didn't know better then, but you learned, you grew and you're continuously trying to improve. But many riders are either unwilling to better themselves, to grow and learn, or they know that what they're doing is abusive, but they just don't give a s***, because they don't care about their horses. They just see their horses as a machine, a means to make money. And THAT is the big issue for me with many "professionals".
I don’t ride anymore. It’s been years since I have. But when I used to ride, I couldn’t stand to see the way many trainers treated horses. I saw way too much abuse of these beautiful majestic animals which is one of the reasons I quit riding. You are absolutely right about over-weight people- Anyone over 200 pounds should not be on a horse’s back.
some folks shouldn't even own pet rocks just because you own a horse doesn't make you a horse person anymore than standing in a garage makes you an automobile
I live in south Texas. I have a real problem with the rodeos. Need i say more? I realize its a culture thing but the cutting horses, the broncs, and barrel racers break my heart. Maybe I'm a soft touch but earning an animal's trust is key to any training or simply owning. Breeding for profit is another abuse. Hopefully this latest hot topic will kindle some changes all around. I have never owned a horse. Always dreamed of it but it wasn't in the cards. I ride but not often any longer. Cruelty is cruelty. We all know what it looks like and how we feel about it.
Any where ppl make $$$ off of horses is where you can for sure find abuse. I would love a world where horses are more regarded, no racing, no rodeo, no competitions where the jumps are not overly high, wide, no double bits, etc.
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REFORM the judging! I want to see bitless and bridle-less. There is nothing more beautiful than watching a horse move with pride in their body. Watching the mustang trainers - I want to see that gentle approach rewarded by judges with the olympic bred horses!
There’s nothing wrong with the more gentle bits , it’s the HANDS that holds the reins that’s the issue.
@@jule3480 more gentle bits are as you say, fine, and it is the hands. We ride I. French egg butt snaffles and are loose rein 99% of the time. But my fire breathing nut job of a horse really loves to lean into the bit after his first 6 years being spent in turkey. But… I have a brow band and that’s it. He can slip the bridle of hinshelf. A lot of the crap the use in dressage is pretty brutal mate.
@@devilspassmeby I could not agree more! The horses are bullied to perform movements the judges want to see. If soft, willing movements without a bit were rewarded, then over night we could change the game. But… bit less isn’t even allowed I believe?
She was angry with the horse.
This video makes more sense than any I have watched on this subject.
It's funny that Charlotte is being cancelled due to this and there's even talk about dressage being banned from the Olympics, when absolutely no one is highlighting the horrific abuse in sports like horse racing or polo. Horse racing is Especially cruel, yet celebrated and supported by pretty much everyone. No one talks about the horses legs that are broken, shot/euthanized during races, drugged and beaten. They only see riches, glitz and glamor. Same with polo, no one is talking about Price Harry of all people, with blood on his horses side from spur marks during a polo match. Also, it's well-known how the Amish push their horses to work far beyond their capacity, incredibly abused animals end up at auctions with serious injuries. Also, as you mentioned, fat people, uneducated people, ill-fitting saddles, starvation, no medical treatment... there is SO much abuse in the horse world, its disgusting. Horses deserve better! Having said that, I hope that this incident with Charlotte serves to highlight ALL the abuse, in ALL disciplines, not just pin the blame on her. I'm not saying what she did was okay, it's not. But this is only the tip of the iceberg - shes not the only one to blame. I just hope people arent blind to that.
@@heather5936 I haven’t even started on the topic yet. It’s utter BULLSHIT how much abuse is just… ignored because $$$$$$$$$
@@BeprofessionalLookcool yes. It just grinds my gears that likely the very same "uneducated person" giving Charlotte sh*t, won't bat an eye at buying tickets to sit in the stands at the Grand National becausethey get to "dress up" and "network". Hypocrites.
Over 65 horses have died since 2000. (Grand National) But the highlight is now on Dressage being pure evil... ha.
I've had my say, thank you for coming to my Ted talk.
I’m not sure where you’ve been but there’s literally HUNDREDS if not thousands of people who HAVE called out the cruelty in those horse industries. There’s organizations that are devoted to trying to stop cruelty in those industries and spend millions of dollars and every spare minute on it. Yes there’s too much cruelty in the horse world. However that doesn’t excuse the cruelty and blatant abuse of this world class competitor. The claim that its hypocritical to call out this woman because others abuse horses is ABSURD! It’s basically saying- it’s all over the industry, there’s people who do worse so…we need to give her a break because “ horses kick each other “ . The fact is, everyone who’s had horses has seen cruelty in some form. And you call it ALL out, I’m more d
Plus this woman has a history of abusive practices..
I wasnt expecting the fat people rant, it cracked me up! Certainly lightened this sad sad incident.
Maybe its a good driver for change in the weird prancy horsey world, the dog world has had to change, and even the Kennel club realised its a bad thing to breed mutant dogs ( german shepherd slopy backs and pug breathing problems to name a couple) but it always takes a big outcry like this to change things.
The quick response was good , now for the long term change
I quit horses because they made me feel like a jailer, slave owner and slave all at the same time. I did not want to continue keeping such an intelligent animal and not be able to meet its needs. The horse community was constantly telling me ‘she sees you as a friend but you need to be her boss’. I don’t enjoy being a ‘boss’. People should only have horses if they are wealthy enough to give them herd mates, a track system, a ton of time and have the temperament, willingness and intelligence to use new-age training techniques like Emma Massingale or Jesse Drent. My horse was the most intelligent animal I have ever had the privilege to own but with that comes a tremendous amount of responsibility if you want to do right by them. I now follow wild horses instead. Seeing them live authentically like they are meant to is how I enjoy them most.
Ethical barns exist. They're rare - it took me 13 years without riding to find one- but they exist. Horses in the fields for at least half the day WITH OTHER HORSES, no yanking on the reins, no spanking, no screaming coaches, coaches making sure uou don't bounce in the saddle when begore telling you to do more difficult exercizes... that exists. If you want to go back on saddle, I hope you'll find such a barn. 😊
Agree, but explain to me how Jesse Drent can be the great horseman he is, but look away when his mate Matt clearly abuses his dressage horses🤬🤬
@liselottenormannsrensen7867 Matt is the complete opposite, I don't see this relationship lasting, too much of a difference in philosophy. Jesse can do a lot better.
@@CreekValleyCritters Hope you are right. The way you treat animals says a lot about your character as a human. And Jesse is just the sweetest, humble and loving person❤️ And Matt is .....more like selfabsorbed🤨Jesse deserves better
A balanced, intelligent and empathetic video, thank you 🤘👍
Horse racing is just brutal.I do not believe they have any morals.
It's waaay worse.
I agree with a lot of what you said, I don’t use bits or shoe my horses, I don’t stable my horses, I also don’t whip my horse over 2 dozen times in a span of a couple of minutes. She IS NOT a good horsewoman. She may be a good rider, she is definitely not a good horsewoman. But, I look at it this way: what goes around comes around.
@@laurenjames515You tell us, Sherlock.
Stabling horses full time is horse prison.
Basically you're saying nobody should be allowed to compete. And if they do they are a bad horse person. Obviously absurd. They are 100x the horse person you are but you're a midwit and everyday horse owner (not a world class one) who is applying your emotions and parameters to a situation and other people and thinking your answers are what should be universal. Height of arrogance and stupidity.
I agree! Also, same: My Icelandic was only once in a box, and that was because he had a broken bone in his leg due to getting kicked. He's unshoed, doesn't have a bit, we mostly do groundwork rather than riding, and yes, I do have a whip, but that's for giving him directions, that's my long arm - he's never been hit with it.
@@GraupeLie and you also can't compete to any decent level.
I've had horses for 20 years. I just have one rescue pony left now. I don't ride any more, I feel no desire to control them or make them do things they don't want to do. I just love their company because they're so beautiful inside and out. I don't have anything to do with anyone in the horsey world because frankly, it's full of utter bar stewards who get a kick out of controlling a big animal. It's all about ego for the vast majority of them. And yes, fat riders are selfish as hell.
@@skeovkp48598 I think I’m headed this way personally. My boy is 9, and I can’t imagine another horse after him or ever parting with him. He’s carried me through 13 countries now and he’s my best mate. The horse world is toxic, but more and more I am finding good folks by being as harsh as I am.
@@BeprofessionalLookcool No, i could never part with a horse. Once they're with me, I feel I have a duty to care for them for the rest of their lives - I just don't trust anyone else to care for them as I would, or not to sell them on, and once they're out there in the horse market, who knows what might happen to them. They're so vulnerable. I know my beliefs are unusual, and likely to be mocked, and in the past, I've been influenced by the cultural norms of the horsey world. But I'm old enough, and have seen enough not to care what others think now. Great video, and if it helps shift the way these beautiful creatures are perceived even a tiny bit, it's a job well done.
The problem is four-fold; 1. CJD is a highly decorated ambassador/idol in the discipline. 2. This abuse incident was not knee-jerk, or CJD losing her temper. It was gratuitous and sadistic; the horse in question wasn’t doing anything that could remotely be perceived as ‘wrong’, and 3. While we’re all aware that abuse is widespread throughout the equine industry, it’s Dressage that’s currently under scrutiny, and not just because of CJD. That gives the public a chance to be heard when it advocates for change, and could actually achieve change.
And four; while I agree with you on almost every point, I don’t believe it’s helpful, in terms of advocating for change, to detract from a high profile case by raising every area where welfare needs attention. It runs the risk of normalising it, when dressage itself already has a MAJOR problem with normalised malpractice.
Outrage, attention, action are appropriate reactions to this. Of course, that doesn’t justify hate towards CJD but she also must face the consequences. She may even have unwittingly done horses a favour-perhaps it will open her eyes and contribute towards trying to get the FEI to understand the public will not support this. Because God knows, Dressage sorely needs a MAJOR overhaul!
I started riding at 6 yo and I'm 48 now, whipping a horse was standard as horrible as it sounds. I always hated it but thought I had to. Stopped as soon as I had my own horse but I still did what I was told for a decade.
We were also not taught a single thing about saddle fitting, we thought any saddle would fit any horse and I hurt many of my horse with ill fitted saddles.
I know better and do better now but the horse world as bad as it is has come a long way this last decade or so. There is hope, 20/30 years ago or so nobody would have seen anything wrong with that video.
@@JezaGaia you are 100% correct here. And I read this stupid book by the so called “long riders guild” in which the self proclaimed oracle of long riding dispenses his wisdom. I’ve now learned he’s a liar and a fake, has actually never done a long ride and the whole book was made up of 2hand info from the 80s. No mention of saddle fit or anything relevant to an ACTUAL long ride hence why we have a whole chapter just on it in our book. We are desperately trying to change the industry.
I am a Canadian and compete up to the 4* level in Eventing and am an Equine Canada Level IV Coach.
I attend Badminton and Burghley every year.
I witnessed Oliver Townend spurring and whipping two horses cross country in the 80's and reported him to the Technical Delegate, wherein he was unable to compete in show jumping.
Sadly, I believe abuse is rampant in all equestrian disciplines, particularly at the elite levels.
@@ReginaldTateishi-nr1jw 100% agree. That’s why we long ride. If you push your horse… you fail. You whip it. You fail. If you loose trust… you fail. We all need a good hard look at ourselves and hopefully some good will come of this.
I trail ride bitless, and my mare and I are best friends. She literally talks to me and tells me how she feels. I pray any mistakes I have made are minor and that Lena understands there was no malice and that she forgives me.
Oliver didn’t learn anything apparently. He’s horrid!
Thank you for what you did re OT, I remember that episode well and wondered who had been strong enough to do what the stewards didn't/ don't, and report abuse by OT. I've had horses over 50 years, am a qualified Veterinary Equine Behaviourist, and cannot abide what is happening to horses in elite horse sports. There is SO much abuse, exploitation, and also acceptable use of horrendous pressure and force in basic horse keeping and training. There is only one ethical, scientifically evidenced, enriching for horses, approach with horses, yet Positive Reinforcement is completely lacking from the vast majority of horse people, and traditional, hand me down, scientifically horrendous,old fashioned ways are still rampant at all levels.
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Preach! Loved this rant because it's just so true. Abuse is far too normalised in the horse world but people will be overly critical when it comes to blatant abuse (whipping hard) but don't look at the more "unnoticeable" issues like stalling horses, overfeeding, overweight riders, how some riders bit up and use harsh bits because they can't train properly, spurs, shoes, and over-jumping horses... Horses are not here to fuel our egos, they are animals who have their own feelings...
I do admit I have not been the best horse person but I am learning every day, I train my horse with positive reinforcement, bitless or bridleless, and I always allow him to have a choice (which actually makes him want to participate).
Thank you for addressing overweight riders. There’s absolutely NO excuse for it.
How dare they!!!
@@alexharrel they are selfish and want the world to suit them. They are no worse in their view of the world than many, but sadly their size alone causes physical abuse :(
It isn't either/or. Everyone has the obligation to take an animal abuser to task. There are many forms of horse abuse... mostly through ignorance, often with good intentions. Your lady with the ill fitting saddle is an example. What she isn't doing is WILLFULLY causing PAIN and Stress to a horse who is doing its best to guess what the hell she wants, or what it has done wrong. Meanwhile this woman is teaching her STUDENTS that this is the correct way to train a horse! Horse shows at every level are only about the riders ego, and the community is rife with abuse.
My grandkids had to volunteer at a 4H horse show and there was so much abuse such as yanking the reins repeatedly after not winning in a class that they refused to go to another show. My ponies live in a herd with 24/7 turnout. Yes everyone who has had horses has committed abuse at some time or another, but hopefully we learned it was not effective or appropriate and found a better way to communicate.
It's about growth and understanding - calling out what is being brought to light as completely WRONG and yet using this to further our knowledge and animal husbandry that is for the horses, not the people "caring" for them. Love this perspective you've outlined here in this video. We are all certainly guilty of something that could have been done better with our animals. Thank you for the perspective!
Thank you for making this video. I don’t know a single person worthy of casting a stone at Charlotte ESPECIALLY while rodeos, horse racing, or anything related to Tennessee walking horses still exists in its current form. I agree and constantly complain about the same abuses you’ve mentioned in this video and so many more and far worse than what she demonstrated. I’m certainly not excusing it but it is very clear that she is trying to get the horse to just move forward and the horse is not at all scared or bothered to respond which in my opinion is indicative of very poor previous training and much worse “abuse” which is common in just about every barn I’ve ever encountered.
Anyway, thank you for speaking up and having a refreshingly reasonable response to Charlotte’s crucifixion.
Well put. So-called normal care of horses being abusive is never discussed.
@@margaretburckard6684 and why would it be? No one wants to hear it when it is something that hits them and means they need to have a good look at themselves.
We've completely lost our way in this world. Humans are the most dangerous thing a horse can ever encounter. It's time to figure out how we can do better in our everyday care of horses.
@@GloryDaze73 agreed 100%
Finaly someone talking with sens, really knowing what's in the matter. Not like vice majority of those hypocritics...
like your thoughts regarding horses and the way we should be going forward thank you
I removed my son and I from the equestrian world 5 years ago because we got tired of what it has become. We didn't fit in because 1) we treated horses like horses not snowflakes, diamonds 2) diamontes and matching gear wasnt important to us nor were results and postibg every single thing on social media. We wore cheap clothes and rode for fun and because my sons ride or horse wasnt perfect he was looked down upon. It all became about competition instead of enjoyment and love for the horse. 3) The cruelty of stabling horses day after day on a yard that shut its field at the first sign of rain was heartbreaking. Horses would be left all day in small dirty stables with zero attention or stimulation except for a hamdful of hay thrown over in the morning 4) The privileged, if you have money it basically entitles you and that applies to everything, dirty stables, hores left for hours, use of whip or encouragement of use of whip and the hardest thing was seeing a foal and its mother in a small stable left to its own devices day after day. Oh and horses shot when no longer any use. Is it any surprise i removed us from this horrible world? No its no just CD, its everywhere im sad to say!
@@aprilshowerscleaningcare yep, and it’s why all call these bastards out on their bullshit. Your story is so common. :(
So sad isn't it 😢
Horses are abused in every sport. That doesn’t make it right.
I bought a young thoroughbred (OTTB) and took him out of a dressage barn.
He loved to work cattle and trail ride, so he lived his best life doing what made HIM happy and he was also in an 1100 acre pasture with other horses.
A horse that is trained with love and respect but also firmness and guidance will give you a partner.
@@Cwgrlup we need more people like you ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
I am so glad to see/listen to your video today. I have made so many mistakes with horse keeping and horse training in the many years (over 46) that I have spent with them.
I worked to do better as I figured out when and how I was abusive.
I wonder if all these self-righteous, judgmental critics that are leaving horrible comments about Charlotte believe they have never made mistakes and are just perfect.
If that is the case, then possibly a bit of self reflection for a closer look might be in order.
Thank you for your very real, thoughtful and level-headed video today.
I am new to your channel and admire your blatant honesty.
Thanks for that!
I hope Charlotte D does see this!
Greetings from Kentucky.
@@maggy1338 thank you! I am a different breed. I am a drunk with PTSD and a hatred of people. We lie, cheat, steal and screw each other over. Horses… they are so simple. They just move like water and how you choose to move that water says a lot about you. CD put rocks in a stream to move it… I dig shorter straight channels to the sea. Everything I did wrong was from listening to people, everything I did right was from listening to the horses.
You’ve raised very good points.Thank you
Thanks for posting this video. It’s incredibly accurate and I wholly agree. About a year ago I put on substantial weight and immediately stopped riding my horse to prevent discomfort to my horse. I employed a rider to keep him in work and to keep his brain active. It’s all very well everyone jumping on the bandwagon now to criticise Charlotte Dujardin but most of these critics are no better for the reasons you have correctly outlined.
There are so many ways to abuse a horse and I agree that all of us have done things we are not proud of. But while I am not a fan of the "cancel" culture and would promote empathy towards all living things, people tend to think that physical harm is the only form of abuse. This is most certainly not the case. We are a horse rescue who takes in horses that have terribly emotional issues brought on by people who perhaps thought they were doing the right thing but we're not thinking of the horse at all. Even in so so
called natural horsemanship the abuse is terrible. Let's hope that this incident creates awareness for all forms of abuse and not just physical pain.
@@canhamfarmhorserescue the emotional abuse I’ve seen in horses is heartbreaking. Thank you for pointing this out and it’s something many people don’t get about my horse. Most people are terrified to ride him because he is so expressive and good luck holding him back. He’s not “broken”, he’s in partnership. But poor old reeking horses can be just dead inside and OTTBs just make me want to cry. We are just awful to our horses aren’t we “as a race that is”. Thank you for trying to save a few.
@@BeprofessionalLookcool thank you for caring.
We who care salute you, Sir....!!! How many generations does it take to learn how to help and not hurt these majestic animals. ♥
THANK YOU! The ignorance and hypocrisy in the Equestrian Community is insane!! I'd say that in at least 90% cases, horse welfare goes out the door as soon as money and popularity is involved. People need to stop treating living, breathing animals like stepping stones to bring themselves to success. I also agree that there is worse than whipping a horse, although obviously I would never condone it. Some criticising Dressage riders for hyperflexing / riding in Rollkur when they're a Jumper who makes their horse go over high obstacles again and again, ruining their tendons and ligaments is something I see way too often.
We also need to take a step back and evaluate whether or not our own individual horse wants / needs to be ridden. I am not one of the crowd who argues that horse riding is automatically abusive, I think many horses need to be ridden in order to get the amount of exercise required to keep them healthy, but the amount of hollow-backed horses I see that are still being ridden (especially in western riding communities) is repulsive.
I don't think we should completely ban horse competitions because I fear that then people would do it illegally behind closed doors and that would allow for even more abuse to take place. The FEI as well as other big brand Equestrian organisations need to be brought to justice or at least held accountable for willfully ignoring Pro Riders breaking their rules and there needs to be a new, better and thorough regulation of Professional Horse Sport Events.
One time is bad judgement and stopping is growth and doing in front of the rider and the person watching and filming tells me she thinks it’s ok. Anyone who’s had a horse fails but you don’t do it like you’re a hero, you apologise and change. But you make a lot of good points and you recognise the wrong and changed.
The best take on this!! I cannot agree with you more. Each time I am with my horse all I can do is try to be better than yesterday. I try to educate myself every day to communicate better to provide the best life I can.
Thank you for sharing Sir
I've only really been in the horse world for I think 4 maybe 5 years now, and its very very frustrating! I've learned so much more on how to treat horses right, feed them and care for them online than any trainer... Its very easy to call out abuse when its blatantly smacking a horse 25 times oh yeah that's abusive.. to anything...but It is so hard to talk about other things like horses being deprived of social interactions this is super common and people don't think its that big of an issue :/ I honestly don't understand why so many people are surprised Charlotte Dujardin did this I guess its cus she had a "golden girl" reputation but like just in the past year she had either blood or blue tongue on a horse, and her horses have always looked over bent to me, and when she rides in a nose band its always to damn tight! I do not see people complain about the nosebands enough! Its nose bands and martingales I HATE THEM.
Show jumping I see that combination all the time and its just....if your in the Olympics why do you need that? Like your the best of the best at that point why do you need it?! Even in western I see so many people claim to rope anything you need a tie down so the horse wont keep his head so high. "you'll hit him if his head is to high" I personally don't know what there talking about, but I think its cus lots of ropers they don't realize just how hard there yanking the rein around a horse is gonna put his head up high if you squeeze the rein to hard cus it hurts and it startles him. I find it odd I have to explain this to experienced ranchers in my area and they tend to not listen they just say that I get lucky and always get put on the nice horse and the easy horse, this is not true I just try really hard to not put the horse in pain and I don't make riding a fight Lots of people make horse riding a fight and they don't realize it.
You've been in the horse world 4 or 5 years and you think you know what's what 😂
@@ln5747 I didn’t say that! But I’ve encountered people who have been in here for 30 years and they are not able to tell if a horse is lame unless it’s limping…
30 years in you should know more than that? And these people also don’t know that horses make facial expressions of pain. Equine pain face is pretty common knowledge So there have been times I’ve known more than them.
@@azureequus8045 you said you know more about caring for them than any trainer in 4 or 5 years, what a foolish, arrogant and absurd statement 🤣. Someone working seriously with horses for 30 years knows a lame horse. Any decent trainer knows way more than you. Dujardin absolutely knows WAY more than you.
I completely agree with you about people being hypocritical, theres a quote from black beauty which says:
"Only ignorance! how can you talk about only ignorance? Don't you know that it is the worst thing in the world, next to wickedness? -and which does the most mischief heaven only knows".
Charlotte was being wicked, and deliberately abusing a horse. But so many people who would criticise her, are also harming their horses, out of ignorance. The horse doesn't care which one it is, wickedness or ignorance, it only knows the suffering it endures.
The equastrian world needs a revolution. But to be honest, I've lost hope. It's body-shaming to say someone is too big for their horse.
Questioning harsh tack, shoes and bit's, makes you a "snowflake". What a toxic community. Horses deserve better.
@@boopplop-nl4bj yep. Absolutely.
I hate dressage too.
I have never seen anything from this guy before and it is so nice to hear someone else say what I've been saying for years. Thank you.
@@user-pb3fv8on1e it took us years of failure to get where we are but we have a reasonable grasp on things now… I hope 🤣😂
This is a really important perspective. Thank you for sharing your thoughts
A very well balanced point of view!
I just found you on TH-cam. Such a balanced view and one held by many true horse people who reflect everyday how we can do better for our beloved horses. We are devastated for what we have done without malice to our horses over the years. When one bit, one saddle went on every horse we rode. Science has helped in so many ways. Bits for every mouth and tongue type, saddle fitting done regularity as horses shape change, X-rays and gait analysis to make sure our horses are not in pain, body work and massage sessions, feed analysis and grazing and hay 24/7. This is just the tip of the iceberg. Those so called experts who sit back from their great height and judge all those beneath them (us) as they flop and jerk all over their horse with their ill fitting saddles and harsh ripping hands. .Let’s look inwards and keep to our own lane and give our horses the very best we can and apologise to those that have gone that we should have done better with them.
Hard to understand the comments here, or tell between actual riders and the agenda folk on a high horse (see what I did there). But between Helgestrand, polo ponies, western saddle, and above all horse racing, for this to be what gets so much vitriol is beyond me. Many trainers can do better, but to release a single four-year old video days before the Olympics isn’t a horse-first approach; this was targeted. We need to see the full, unaltered video.
Our off-the-track thoroughbred is turning 22; that’s three times older than a wild horse ever gets, and she still shows the boys how to go for a breeze. And if she could talk, she’d thank us for the carrots, and tell us all to calm down and get a grip and brush her some more. Stop with the generalization that all horses are abused. They’re not. And stop with the virtue signaling. Because if people really cared about horses, they would rescue one from a kill pen. But this discussion will only lead to more horses being put down…
@@imabeapirate interesting you say virtue signaling. I’d say it’s quite the opposite and you need to listen again if you think I said ALL horses are abused. I said horses are the most abused domestic animals. Big difference. Horse ARE the most commonly abused domestic animals on earth, that doesn’t mean you aren’t a superb and caring owner.
All excellent points. 100% agree that not allowing horses to live as naturally as possible is one of the cruelest things we do to horses. Just look at all the cases of cribbing and weaving by horses trapped in small boxes 22-23 hours day. And you're right too, that poor food, poor farrier care and poor saddle fit are also abuses. I still think it's worth using Ms Dejardin's abuse not at her directly, but what big money equine sport is getting away with, including many of the other forms of abuse you've listed. And your right, it is all very complex regarding racing, etc. But if we don't find ways to prioritize horse welfare in horse sport there will eventually be no horse sports. Surely we can find ways to improve welfare of horses and other domestic animals after all we're the animals with the big brains?
I respect your personal honesty and believe it's the only way for these systemic issues to be fixed is by doing something to improve ourselves and life/care for our horses. Will say though that this "modern dressage" isn't true Dressage it's equivalent of circus training, Classical Dressage is long, slow, patient training starting from ground fitness up taking literally years/decades and not on young horses and a double bit is ONLY used for refinement when a horse and rider have reached their pinnacle preferably with no noseband either. Look up Nuno Oliveira among other of the greats
Circus training is the correct description. Horrifying.
There is NO EXCUSE for any animal abuse. There is something wrong with people who abuse animals. I have zero sympathy for the perpetrators.
Thanks for a bit of sanity.
Totally agree with you.
So well said!! If you have been following the comments on the disgraced games regarding Charlotte, my comments will come up all over. I'm sick and tired of all the hypocrites crying for blood. They are at the least guilty of riding a horse and probably overweight! I totally agree with you on the fact that fat people should not do endurance. Arabs are not tall and stocky. Mostly around 14.2 hh. And Carl has proven himself to be no man worth his salt at all! I can't believe he didn't stick up for Charlotte. He knew her better than anyone of those 10!
Olympics 2024-
-abuse of Christians
-abuse of horses
Very wise thoughts. Thank you. Also to mention that CD is obviously an excellent rider, but not the best skilled trainer. 😢
I do not kick, hit, or scream at my horse.
@@silky2204 I’ve screamed at mine a few times 😂🤣 but he’s nuts. He’s fond of spooking at his own farts on cliffs etc.
You make great points. I feel guilty about even putting a lightweight snaffle bit in my horses mouth. I agree heavy people and heavy handed people get off horses. I never used spurs and never want to. Horses give us the privilege to be on their back so I use light hands love patience and kindness. I do give my horses loads of healthy treats, trainers and riders do not agree with that. I want my horses on grass and grow my own hay for them. I love being patient with them when I’m teaching them. I’m sorry but never ever could I whip or torture a horse the way she did. So sorry-great channel but no free passes for her on this hot mess. Ty for this video.
I do agree with you in many aspects, especially that we need to have a partnership with our horses. I was a dressage rider for many years, started when I had my first pony, 9 years old, 50 years ago. I was brought up to believe, that the way I was taught was the right or only way. When my daughter was introduced to horses, I could not do it any longer. She was given one opportunity: The Icelandic horse. These tough little horses can live out all year, they are fun to ride and as far away from dressage as possible. But we do need to call out the "stars", the ones our young girls look up to and want to be like. The FEI need to act, not just talk about, how horses should look and behave. And expect the judges to work by the rules. The equestrian world needs to change, but it is a loooong journey. I want to be an optimist and believe we will get there🤞But in my lifetime? Probably not😢
People rarely have any insight into their own condition, but that doesn’t detract from the fact what she did was wrong, it wasn’t accidental it wasn’t done because she thought it was right she knew it was wrong. What did you go when you saw the abuse?
@@lizroberts1569 when I see ANY abuse I call it out and it’s made me very unpopular in the horse world.
Thank you, sir, for your perspective.
Lovely work - perfect - said all the same things this morning xxx
Interesting that you didn’t mention bits which operate entirely on the level of pain they inflict on a very sensitive part of the horse’s mouth. It’s 100% cruel to ride with a bit in a horse’s mouth.
@@TriciaBridgesKoontz it’s not 100% cruel with a bit. The hands make the bit harsh just as they can make a hakamore harsh. HOWEVER, dressage bits are totally faaarkked! I hate them! I hate nose bands and all the crap the English ride in. We do ride with bits. We ride with egg but French snaffles and soft hands. I can ride bitless or with just a lead rope. But for us, with soft hands, it’s the most comfortable for our boys.
It's the humans who insist on dominance . animals are companions and need fair and sympathetic treatment.
You speak lots of home truths
Next ...what can be done about american show horses and the barbaric methods there
@@pixie706 I think it starts with setting good examples and calling others on their bullshit.
Thank You, for making this video, I think Charlotte was thrown under the bus, why who knows. You can’t tell me only Charlotte does this, I’m talking Grand Prix not the everyday trainer with the everyday horse. But it probably happens in all stables, with trainers in all the levels that might use unkind methods to get quicker results. Why has everyone just complaining on one. It’s like saying that this is the only person who has done anything like this.
How about complaining about almost every person who has ridden thus far in this Olympics, we’ve got blood, blue tongue, hyperflexion (behind the vertical), bad fitting tack, to name a few These are the best of the best and they can’t be bothered to correctly saddle these horses, I guess they have people to saddle these horses, even still, you’d think they’d see that something wasn’t correct.
People say that Charlotte should be banned from owning and being around horses because of the whip, racehorses are whipped, naming just one sport.
People say that Dressage should be banned sport because horses in the wild don’t do that. Horses in the wild, don’t have humans telling them what to do, or wear leather contraptions, they don’t jump brightly coloured objects, or race each other until exhaustion, or cut cattle out of a herd.
I have seen posts that the owner was the one recording, I don’t know if this true, if it is, and they also were laughing, because people have stated that the one with the camera was laughing. If I didn’t like the training methods, I wouldn’t be just standing there, laughing.
I’d be telling them to stop, and if they didn’t, telling the rider to get off and take my horse home or to another stable, hoping that they might be not abusive, then doing something about it. But the one with the recording did nothing for 2 to 4 years, depending upon person. Why did it take all this time, some say, it’s because it would have been ignored, haven’t they heard of PETA?
Abuse happens in all sports, with animals and without. No animal or person should be abused but not just one person should be held accountable for all abuse, if you see a crime you should report immediately, not hold this information for years, because then you also are as guilty for covering it up.
Totally agree with you in what you say about how horses are one of the most abused animals. Striving to do better and learn is ❤.
What a wise and balanced way to express how you feel! Is the trip i saw announced in one of the shorts, starting in scandinavia, this year august? Or is this announcement from a previous year?
@@josinevandongen357 we were planning to do the Low Countries this year but we have switched to heading east to explore Poland and the Carpathian’s
BAN ALL COMPETING AND STOP THESE SHITSHOW
@@mariaviir3289 as much as I agree… the second we do countless people loose their jobs, an industry dies and when it does people can no longer afford the horses and they end up worthless and even more neglected than they are now.
Sane and wise words. Thankyou.
Spot on.
Well said....Thank you
Most horse ppl i know and see, dont even consider ground work and something as simple as not holding a lead rope up at the chin......thank goodness for ppl on the internet bringing light to alternative ....i should say best practices....such as Steve Young and Free Spirit Equestrian......
Regardless of someone's skill, performing abusive techniques does not give them a pass.
Suffice to say, wherever humans and money are involved there will be problems....
Great well done for you glad to hear honesty. But why four years old video comes to light jellousey?
@@janiceellis5461 aparantly they make money off every view? 🤷♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️
Yupp. This guy.
Still, I'm a dog person, and I am sure dogs are the worst abused pets we have. But, eff that, let's do better!
@@ulalaFrugilega I fell for my wife based entirely off the way she had put her dog first in every decision she made over five years. She cares for her horse and dog in ways that make me at times question my place in her life… and that’s why I love her.
I used to work in the show and horse racing industries and I am also remorseful about things I participated in. I now think all industries that use animals is abuse. I am a good rider, not overweight but I won't ride anymore because that is using a horse for my pleasure and I used to come up with all of the arguments horse people come up with but we should not be sitting on their backs. It's 2024, we need to evolve. I don't eat animals or their products anymore because I refuse to pay for animal abuse.
@@j.cassavoy4661 hey GOOD FOR YOU! I absolutely respect anyone with your convictions. My wife and I do eat meat… however… we raise it ourselves and are disgusted by the animal abuse that occurs in many places where meat is produced. We have chickens, turkey, sheep, rabbits and trout as well as a huge vegetable garden and today is blueberry picking day in the forest. We are evolving… but backwards. And our horses, I don’t feel one tiny bit bad saddling up a horse that excitedly runs to me when called and sleeps like a pet dog beside me on the road. I don’t hit or whip him, I hug him and scratch his belly feeding him carrots. We absolutely love each other and he is my PARTNER. He gets a farm to roam, and 24hour a day hay in winter while outside ALL year doing horse stuff. I truely believe he benefits from our “deal” so it doesn’t have me questioning is it ethical often. He gets thousands spent on his wellbeing every year and is so grateful he lets me ride him. Which… he loves! He absolutely LOVES to ride!
The judges reward extravagant movements trained by abusive methods and classical principles. Whistle blowers are ignored and will also not be able to work in the industry ever again!!
Thank you for this. We are all human and all we can ask of each other is to try and better ourselves. I am 60 years old and if I had to tell you the things I have done which were accepted at that time I would be too ashamed. They say over 200 000 horses were taken to WW2 from Australia. Only one returned and that was because it was a general's horse. However what I have learnt the last 2 week is that there are many children out there who have most likely never been near a horse who have a lot to say. Seems like these children were born perfect..and here I thought only God was perfect.
❤ TERRIFIC Well said. 👏 🙏
The best way to learn is to make a mistake, I teach people everyday how to ask their horse to do something not demand that their horse do something. Not everybody is cut out to be a trainer. Some of us are better at riding. Where knowledge ends frustration begins.
Thanks for you input.
YES YES YES. THANK YOU!!
Real horse lovers cannot be faked by fake Programms. The eternal flame is in the heart. The gold medal goes to people who stand up for the horses. 2024 cross sum 8. ♾️ . Time for change, reflection and judgement ❤
I recently left a barn after witnessing the owner beating a horse who was spooked and unseated a beginner rider. It was appalling.
All animal racing is abuse.
@@Godless_Doc so common it’s not funny. I’m just looking at photos of a guide… and his clients celebrating a ride over a 3000m high pass. Not ONE fukn saddle fits!!!!!! Every dam day mate. :( it makes me sick.
@@BeprofessionalLookcool mercifully I found a laid back, humane barn where none of us are interested in competition.
Very well said!
What Dujardin did is being ripped to shreds as horrific physical abuse, yet those same people can watch feral stallions fight over mares and not notice the numerous bite scars all over their necks and bodies left from battling other stallions. Double standard, as I'm sure that that dressage whip used by Dujardin didn't leave a mark on the horse in question and inflicted little more than a sting.
Ignorance is no defence. People are not properly taught and trained. A horse is a willing, noble animal. The fault always lies with the handler not the horse. Education is key. Abuse is not/never ever a training technique. Nothing wrong with metal shoes on horses .... owned horses for over 50 years and my parents before me, never had an issue... !
The real issue being if that Olympian got to where she is, who taught her such abusive tactics??? That is the point, abuse is not necessary to excell in horse disciplines. Most certainly she is deserving of criticism! Deliberate animal cruelty belongs nowhere in a civilised society.
What would happen to race horses if we ban racing? The same thing what is happening to them now. The racing carrier is short and majority is not even suitable for adoption. They are started at barely 2 years old and the turnover is quick. Only a handful continues after the first season. If the racing industry stops breeding, there are no disposals and those who are already born would find other homes if they have not been damaged yet. Thoroughbred adoption facilities are full of those suitable as pasture ornaments or for very light riding only. Too damaged for anything else.
@@ezire what happens is people loose millions of dollars… and industry dies “good” but the horses become worthless and end up in dog food cans.
Thank you !
Watch for Charlotte Dujardin to claim "she's the victim" for being exposed as abuser of horses. Watch for her to attack the whistle blower & claim the whistle blower is worse abuser. Charlotte Dujardin should be permanently banned from horse sports.
How do you GPS track your horses?
I love your opinion ❤ i have seen and compare a lot of equistrian talks about Charlotte and the most are so hypocrit, the problem is much bigger, cancelling one rider is not the awnser, we need to start talking how horses lives can be improved al together, every discipline uses abuse every day. On my riding school i see things dayly that make me mad. And talking about it like you do now IS the awnser!
@@Wendy-bd9zu thank you, and I’m happy to chat in person anytime if I can help support anyone in positive change.
I am onboard with you.
I definitely agree and the Arabian show world is the worst