The fact that this was probably written shot and edited way before the Habs even lost, I think you're on to something. I've been saying this for years.
I didn't want to believe it, but after the recent Toronto vs Tampa series it solidified in my head: Canada isn't allowed to win, no matter what. Montreal or Toronto. Edmonton or Calgary. It's a lose/lose game. What a joke.
I also think there’s a huge difference in how these clubs were founded. All of the major European clubs were build on working class grass root teams (except like Chelsea, Red Bull Leipzig and Paris Saint Germain), while North American teams are founded for profits and sometimes they even move cities, which is unheard of in Europe. Every German club is at least 50% owned by fans.
I mean, it's all over the show, but you get to choose which type of team you prefer which is what ultimately makes the model better. They have corporate oil oligarch owned garbage teams, but they also on the other end have super legit fan owned working class teams. If I was into soccer I would probably support one of the fan-owned clubs because I'm a bit of an idealistic sort, and I love that the overpriced beer I bought at the game was going towards a better player for my team. Team losing? Why not get more drunk!?
@@PaigeMTL Yeah for sure. But even oil oligarch clubs like Manchester City have a history and a club tradition unlike idk LA Chargers, who cried because San Diego didn’t build them a better stadium, so they moved to LA. Ofc there are exceptions like Green Bay Packers in North America and Red Bull Leipzig in Germany.
Chelsea were founded to be the team for one of the oldest football grounds in sports history. Don’t put them in the same sentence as red bull or psg when it comes to history or tradition.
Ouff.. yeah. Thunder Bay would've had a strong team in that alternate universe.. All four Staal brothers - not to mention that per capita, we've pumped out the most players than anywhere else!
I would absolutely love a tier base system of Hockey. I got to admit, this definitely makes me like the league less. I never really thought about it like this.
From 1976-1990 only one American team won the Cup, NYI 80-83. In the 1980s, Eight Canadian teams went to the final and won Six. With Two All Canadian Cup finals. What this tells us is that Salaries Sky rocketed right after the Gretzky trade. The Canadian dollar was so weak, there was no incentive to play in Canada from a business standpoint.
@@jujuun8992 sure but it’s not compelling to watch. Why would you watch something that has pre determined outcome. Such as, bayern winning the german league every year.
@@trentjackson6837 >Muh Bayern wins every year. So what? Bundesliga is growing. Tickets are absurdly cheap compared to the NHL. Munchen is the biggest city in Germany, so the club does the best, which is fair and expected. People from cities support their hometown teams, and neutrals can support whoever they want. Fair?
@@trentjackson6837 but people actually love watching those dominant teams, either to cheer for them or against them. I can't get excited to watch Columbus Blue Jackets vs Phoenix Coyotes, but if an equivalent of the 70's Bruins or Canadiens, 80's Islanders or Oilers, were in the league, they would be must watch TV. Plus I think with the size of USA + Canada being so much bigger than England, Germany, Spain, Italy, etc, it wouldn't be as lopsided. Especially since the NHL is the single dominant league competing for players. If Toronto was able to buy up all the best players in the NHL, the next players would still be available to be bought up by Montreal, or New York, or whoever. In Europe although there are many more soccer players to choose from, you get some of the best ones going to England, some going to Spain, some going to France, etc. Just look at Major League Baseball. It doesn't have a salary cap (not sure, it might have a luxury tax?). In the last 20 World Series, there have been 13 different winners, and only one by the Yankees which is the biggest team in the league. Because there are so many big markets in USA + Canada.
Canadian teams lose because there is very little opportunity for market growth. The direction within large organizations isn't always explicit. A ref, refs a game wrong, they just don't get games. They know this and hockey is very momentum driven which is easily shaken by often 1 call.
Great video. It’s so frustrating for Canadians, especially after this last playoff run. Bettman didn’t even acknowledge the HABS in his speech, can’t stand him. I heard so many Americans, especially in Florida acting like they’d show Canadians how hockey is played when we know that probably 90% of their fan base never wore a pair of skates ever or wouldn’t recognize their players if they were walking by them on the streets. Tampa had 16 CDN players on their team and more Quebeckers than Mtl Canadiens, same with Vegas. Grrr I wanted the Isles to win so badly because I thought that it would be great to see 2 actual hockey towns compete for once, it’s so great for local kids especially. I don’t know if you knew but we had 2 teams in Quebec before, Mtl Canadiens and the Nordiques. The Nordiques actually moved to Colorado to become the Avalanches because the owner was a terrible person and the rivalry was the most intense one the MTL Canadians ever had, I think the biggest ever in the league, yes yes, bigger than the Bruins/Mtl one. The ratings were off the charts when both team played together.
the ''wouldn't recognize their players if they were walking by them on the street'' might actually be nicer for the players, i remember hearing about a Vegas player enjoying that he could feel like a regualr person rather than a god or something. i also think taxes (or rather the lack of them) help teams alot, players are willing to take what is at face value a lower paying contract but once you factor in taxes its diffrent. for example income tax, neither Florida or Nevada has it and that's 3 of the last 5 cups, Pennsylvania has it but its the lowest of all states with an NHL team (by quite a bit too) so thats 5 of the last 8 cups going to US states with lower taxes
None of this makes sense. The uncapped leagues in europe, have no parody and the team with the most money usually wins the league. In North American sports, good teams can come from any city in any sport
Of course it makes sense. The NHL rewards zero effort by handing the crappiest teams the best players through the draft. There's a reason only two countries use this stupid system.
I always wished Bettman was involved in Football instead of Hockey . He ruined Hockey in Canada general . That’s why I got a nice tshirt that says . Canada Hater since 93
Idc, if another Canadian team makes the finals in the next few years, they won’t be winning only for their city, they will be winning it for Canada (other than the Maple Leafs).
Sounds like Canada needs to either form its own Premier League for hockey (similar to the CPL for soccer) or create a new tier for the CHL where teams get relegated up to a non-junior level of competition (and down) based on performance year to year. The problem, of course, is that the NHL (and AHL) has most of the good arenas in major cities locked up and Canadian governments are famously resistant to funding new arenas and stadiums with taxpayer money. Maybe an outdoor league played in football stadiums a la the Winter/Heritage Classic games would be possible, can't see how using NHL arenas would work unless the government legally forced the management of these arenas to offer dates to the rival league.
I'd hate that shit. It would be a bunch of second rate players because all the money is in the NHL. There's a reason why the CFL is a farm system for the NFL, and why every league that isn't MLB (Japan, Korea, Taiwanese, Mexican, Dominican etc) is a farm system for the MLB. Wherever the most amount of money to be made is will have the best athletes in the world. UFC killed boxing in this way, because any fighter worth anything is drawn to UFC for the money that can be made there. The only exception I can see if if there was a league that players could play in out of season in the same way that a lot of MLB players will play 'Winter ball'.
@@KC-bg1th Okay but let's be honest...aren't Canadian teams basically just minor league teams for the American teams at this point? They're not affiliated in the same way as true minor league teams, but what else would you call a group of teams that have competed for 30 years and haven't had a real chance of winning a cup? It's like the movie WarGames...maybe the only winning move is not to play (in the NHL).
It’s not fixed against Canadian teams. The United States has lower taxes, in some markets great weather and US markets do not face the media scrutiny that players on Canadian teams do. Since free agency started after the first nhl lockout in 1994 their has been unrestricted free agency which has hurt Canadian based teams more than their US counterparts
The closest thing the Vegas knights have to a local player is Bischoff who was born 2700km away in Minnesota (there's 3 BC players who are closer but I consider them less "local")
@@PeterDrake Of course you did, Gary. Your actions speak louder than words. But hey, know what? at least those cheating bastards Montreal Canadiens haven't won the Cup since they cheated to win in 1993. The Cup drought has been their reward.
seeing southern hockey teams being treated so well by bettman (arizona and vegas) and winning so much (tampa) really hurts the traditionalist hockey fan in me. canada deserves a cup and quebec city (and the whole province) deserves the nordiques back.
Bettman isn't anti-Canada. He's anti-moving teams. The only time he's okay with moving a team is when there is no owner willing to own the team in that city. This is why the Atlanta Thrashers moved to Winnipeg. Winnipeg had a willing owner and Atlanta didn't. Bettman was very supportive of the weaker Canadian teams when they were facing severe economic pressure in the late 90's and early 2000's. They brought in revenue adjustments that helped those poorer teams survive. To be clear, I'm not arguing Bettman is great. He sucks on lots of things. CTE's. Marketing. Ownership and management misbehaviour. Growing the game. He's a smarmy lawyer, and it shows. But he isn't anti-Canada. My theory is that Canadian teams don't win because they either rush rebuilds, or avoid them entirely. That might be because of perceived fan pressure, or just heightened negative media attention during the down years. And they tend to have too many people involved who think they know hockey, but aren't great at managing a hockey team. Edmonton actually tried to do a rebuild, and screwed it up at first, but they're a legit contender now. The Leafs rushed theirs. Montreal seems to know what they're doing. Ottawa too, although they might have jumped the gun a bit on exiting the rebuild. They also over-reacted to a good run in 2017. Too many cheerleaders when things seem to be going well, and too many pitchforks and torches when things aren't going well.
@@PeterDrake is that you, Gary? No sane person would take that weasel's side. Since he took over in '93, teams relocated from traditional hockey markets into non traditional...Minnesota to Dallas in '93, Quebec to Denver in 95, Winnipeg to Phoenix in 96, and Hartford to Carolina in '97. Not to mention putting expansion franchises where they don't belong like Nashville and Las Vegas instead of Hamilton and Quebec City. He is the worst thing to happen to the league.
@@sjdrifter72 Do you have a reading comprehension issue? I wrote that Gary Bettman is a smarmy lawyer who is bad at dealing with CTE's, marketing, ownership and management misbehaviour, and growing the game. That makes me a Bettman clone? Sheesh. On the specific team relocations you mentioned, it's definitely a valid criticism. But they all happened during his first 4 years as commissioner. Do you think it might just be possible that he had less power to impose his views back then?
Okay you got me with the title, we went all the way to football in Europe, but still. Maybe I am too lazy to do the research, (which I am) , but do you think that a format like in Europe could work in Canada , knowing we have FAR less population? Great thorough analysis, and you got a subscriber 👍
I’ve thought about that a lot and realistically I don’t think it’ll happen for hockey. The franchise system is more profitable and therefore more competitive in a business sense. That could change if fans were discerning and decided to support a local team outside of the NHL. But I think fans are so attached to these brands that they just can’t do it. It seems like basketball is international enough that it could happen there, which might expose hockey fans to a different way of doing things, but that would be decades away.
I am from austria and basically every country in Europe has many leagues, even the small countries like we have like at least 3 leagues that are somewhat ok, and we have 9 million people, so I definitely think it could work, It eventually splits down to citylevel, for example the 4 league where I live in Vienna is just clubs from Vienna, and there like a few leagues even below that so, I think its more a matter of that it is not super profitable than population
@@tim333y7 how are these leagues successful though? These European leagues are decided before they even begin. The European system only allows for the teams with most money to win, for example bayern and red bull salzburg.
Because of revenue sharing, the NHL salary cap doesn't mean extra revenue that might have been spent above the cap goes to the owners. The dollar numbers in player contracts are in essence shares in the players' portion of the revenue.
I'm a black dude from southern California who's never put on ice skates. I've been a loyal and rabid kings fan since 1990. Hockey is the best sport. Nothing else comes close.
Great video! I agree with your general point (NA sport leagues are essentially cartels that shut down competition in unhealthy ways), but there's a few things you got wrong. First, the draft does not hurt Canadian teams today, much the opposite. Every year, free agency proves it again. Turns out, millionaires athletes in their 20s would rather hang out in New York, California or Miami than Edmonton, no matter how much they liked the Oilers as a kid. Plus they have accountants that tell them how much more take-home money in states with low income taxes (not a big deal for NY vs Edmonton, but a pretty big difference for Montreal vs Tampa/Vegas). If anything, the draft broke up even more anti-competitive systems in the pre-60s NHL, though those did favor Montreal and Toronto (look up the story of how Montreal bought up a semi-pro league to force Jean Béliveau to play for them). As for the cap, it's effects are more complex than you suggest. It doesn't limit expenses as much as you'd think. In the 13 years after the cap but pre-pandemic, player salaries roughly doubled. It's because the cap (well the CBA) guarantee that a fixed percentage of league revenues will go to the players and also forces a salary floor, which combined with the NHL's guaranteed contracts (which not every NA sport league has) provides a lot of security to the players. It probably helps flailing southern markets more than it does small Canadian teams, but I don't think it's that clear-cut. There's no doubt that the NHL has continuously become more US-centric for decades, and that it has hurt the competitive chances of Canadian teams overall. I just don't think those particular policies are good examples of it. Also some problems of Canadian teams are self-inflicted, or depend on other economic factors. I'll also note that while promotion/relegation systems have their charms, they also have their own kinds of problems.
@@softestunicorn-go9614 I wouldn't go so far as to say it was good for the players. But it didn't really hurt them either. It just linked their salary to league revenue, for better or worse. The real battle was over how big a part of the pie they would get, and they got sizeable piece of it (57% of revenue), bigger than their counterparts in the NFL and NBA. The owners were for it because it gave them cost-certainty, and because of the perception that parity would make the league grow more, which would put more money in their pockets.
Good comments guys. When making a 15 minute video I trying to make a good faith "common sense" point. So for example I didn't go into tax rates because in the end the Northern Clubs have enough money in a competitive market to make it all irrelevant. The Leafs don't want to live in a world where the salary cap is applied "post tax" because that all comes out of their profit. No surprise that the Molson family haven't lobbied for a payroll that is twice the size of a club in Texas. In a world with no salary cap, the draft becomes the most important mechanism in levelling. Much like the way these were applied (closed league, draft, then cap) I think you would repeal the cap, then the draft, then open up competition. Anyway, all this stuff is interesting but it doesn't fit in a 15 minute video that's primary message is "We have a problem". I'm working on a Canadian Civil long form episode to get all the extra stuff out so I'd encourage people to follow there if they want to see the more in depth discussion: th-cam.com/channels/ViA8T-lGaUxrmG941xSi-A.html
Good point@@mittens8798. I guess monopoly profits can be good for labour as well. But bad for the consumer. Form of rent seeking from hockey fans really.
Montreal is fucked when it comes to post-tax income for players. A player making $1 million USD in Florida keeps $640k in his pocket. While in Montreal he'd only keep $503,000 USD. The marginal tax rate at that income level is 37% in Florida and 59% in Quebec so the take-home pay numbers would diverge even more dramatically the higher the player's salary gets. So at $10 million he'd keep $6.1 million in Florida and only $4.9 million in Montreal. Over a player's career that annual difference will really add up!
The same thing happens in eSports. Games like Rocket League work like soccer (of course), where any team at all (could literally just be three random dudes) can get all the way to the top if they are really good. Overwatch on the other hand has franchises for cities, which probably suffocates talent.. (and obviously nobody from the city is actually on the team)
So many flaws with this. It would be a 2-4 team league without salary cap. Edmonton had multiple #1 picks and still can’t win. Free agents from Canada avoid Canada and opt for places with no state income tax (why panthers and lightning have been to cup last 5 years). Canada has to start looking at other reasons as to why they can’t do anything to win over last 30+ years. Could be taxes. Could be desirability of cities. Could be fan bases/media. Could be a lot of things. They should be worried that even with leveled playing field and advantages with players from their cities (in history you typically see “home town discounts”), Canada still can’t do anything productive.
32 years, 32 teams, you know what that means. That's right, the oilers are due to win that 1 statistical Cup this year. But I feel the frustration as a habs fan. My hockey fandom also took a massive hit when I finally figured out that pro sports is a replacement for war. I would much rather be able to defend what I believe in than cheer for nitwits on skates, lol.
The NHl can pay referee's extra.. money to call penalties against small market teams. Mostly canadian. And not call penalties against big l market teams
definitely not a fan of Bettman, I love Canadian hockey and agree that the NHL needs to support the people and areas that actually grow up playing hockey, like Canada and maybe Wisconsin before putting more teams down south but how would you do player assignment without a draft? I could potentially get behind no salary cap but the stats tend to show that it adds more parody to the leagues that have them. I've always thought the relegation style would make things interesting.
Abolish the draft. This is the 3rd thread on this I've seen in the last 3 days. Give the Yanks their mercenaries and let's return hockey to the Canadian fans and players. I guarantee that there would be enough Canadians to support a minor league with Territorial Rights. Let's face it, the best players would go to the NHL where the money is. These mercenaries are welcome to their American money. Someone needs to give hockey back to the Canadian people.
Paige, why don’t you tell the whole story of the European system? I am European myself but I prefer the North American system. In france, where I live, much like the other major European leagues the team with the most money wins (psg). Where as in North american sports league winners are way more diverse and money isn’t as much of a factor. Milwaukee bucks (nba), tampa buccaneers (nfl) , tampa bay lightning (nhl) and atlanta braves (mlb) are current champions, these aren’t historical powerful teams or teams with above average finances.
PSG has the most fans, gets the most money, buy the best players, wins the most games. You can pump money in, but eventually you need fans to break even. If you don't care about geography, you can always support a fan owned team like AFC Wimbledon, a different division or different nearby country. We have no other league, we have no other country, it's a continental monopoly controlled to maximize profits for a corporation. We don't even get to pick our favourite billionaire. Imagine if no French team had won anything for 30 years? The only league is the Champions League, and the good players are syphoned off the French team so that (say) Thailand can win. The bosses decided that Thailand would be a profitable market so they put an expansion team there, they get to win for the next decade while the fanbase grows. They also don't have a team in Belgium or Switzerland, those markets are too small and those guys will support teams in neighbouring countries. Nothing matters, we're just a crowd of people around a roulette wheel. If we don't like the team, if they do something terrible, nothing will change, nothing actually can change by design, your actions, a thousand fans walking out of a stadium, nothing has an impact on the spinning wheel. In Soccer, you might like the game, the players, the team. In North America, you have to like the game and players, they've taken the team, it's just a logo and memories of what it used to be.
This is pathetic. I have a question for you.. Since you put some much effort into your investigation and conspiracy theories; how about you also investigate the quality of the Canadian GM’s and the effects of toxicity of Canadian team fanbase and press? As of 2024, the General Managers (GMs) of Canadian NHL teams and their citizenships are as follows: 1. Montreal Canadiens - Kent Hughes, Canadian 2. Toronto Maple Leafs - Brad Treliving, Canadian 3. Ottawa Senators - Pierre Dorion, Canadian 4. Winnipeg Jets - Kevin Cheveldayoff, Canadian 5. Calgary Flames - Craig Conroy, Canadian . 6. Edmonton Oilers - Jeff Jackson, Canadian 7. Vancouver Canucks - Patrik Allvin, Swedish The most toxic NHL fanbases, according to various discussions and surveys, often include the following teams: 1. Edmonton Oilers: Edmonton fans are frequently cited as one of the most toxic, particularly in online forums and discussions. They have a reputation for being highly critical and outspoken, especially regarding their star player, Connor McDavid . 2. Calgary Flames: Fans of the Calgary Flames are noted for using the most profane language on social media, indicating a high level of toxicity in their online interactions . 3. Vancouver Canucks: Canucks fans also rank high in terms of vulgar language use and are often involved in heated online debates and criticisms . 4. Philadelphia Flyers: Flyers fans are known for their intense passion and can be quite harsh, both online and at games . 5. Toronto Maple Leafs: Leafs fans are another group frequently mentioned for their intense and sometimes toxic behavior, particularly on social media. Now go pounder that...
why its due to numbers. You have 7 canadian teams and 25 US teams you tell me why the odds are stacked against us. Come on man. Its obvious. Yes we have a chance but its a slim chance.
@@PaigeMTL you should take that logic to the roulette tables and tell me how well it works out for you. That’s not how probabilities work. Even if that was how they work, the analogy on its own still doesn’t work. All 32 teams do not have the same fixed odds to win the Stanley cup year to year for a endless list of reasons. Stick to politics.
even when a Canadian team gets to the Stanley cup they can't even win it Vancouver has lost twice I think a Canadian team lost 3 years in a row in the 2000s I think it was Edmonton, Calgary and Ottawa and then you had Vancouver's meltdown in 2011 versus Boston. This year you had three really good Canadian teams Edmonton Toronto Calgary and none of them teams was able to get to the Stanley cup.
his point in the video was that with the rules of the NHL, basically it profits all the teams by just trading Canadian players to places that don't have snow, like la and florida, and it's robbing the best players to teams that live in desert's and also bringing in more revenue to the nhl because of the "good players wins to fans to money" thing He kinda sums it up in 12:07 Point being, it's made to help the little dogs to bring in more fans and make more money which ends up messing canada teams up cause of trades
the teams that exist in nevada and such places, they just wouldnt be as good since they never grew up playing the sport, its not as accesible there, so even tho its 25 to 7 teams it would feel more like 10 to 7, but do to this monopoly of help the "little teams get good players to get more wins to get more fans to get more money" these teams thrive more than canadian teams, since we give them canadian players
@@shauncameron8390But cities with no ice or snow as compared to ones with ice or snow. The area surrounding the LA Kings' stadium always doesn't have snow. Neither does the one surrounding the Anaheim Ducks' stadium.
Be POSITIVE! Canada ALWAYS wins the cup. No matter which team gets it... Around 45% of all players are CANADIANS! The USA only has about 21% representation, and the rest is all over the place, from Russia to Sweden. Even Mexico (kinda) if you count Austin. We ARE the NHL...
Three answers. Yes! 100% Without a shadow of a doubt. In the NHL it's more about Gary Bettman & franchises like The Leafs & The Habs not wanting any NHL expansion teams in Canada especially in the provinces of Ontario & Quebec Keeping all that NHL cash to themselves. Go Oilers! ❤🇨🇦🏒
Habs fan tears aren't even dry yet and you've made a mini-doc on why it happened 😂😭
Another monopoly? Get em boys!
Lmao whT tears lmao hahahahaha u sound like a Toronto maple laugh fans
#1 pick tho..😅
@@rhshshshrywusb6126 You seem to be more obsessed with the leafs than actual leafs fans. You okay bud? 🫤
all I know is no Canadian team won since 93' gary bettman started in the nhl in 1993 coincidence?
Eh, Florida teams have made 5 straight NHL finals now.
Nope!❤🇨🇦🏒🏆
@@nicestoriesnottherealstori3006Does that mean Florida is a 'Hockey State' even when NFL & college football still reigns supreme ? 🤔
The chance of that happening is 1/29.9 something so🤷♂️
Wow, I'm starting to realize a lot of the reasons I don't like professional sports has nothing to do with sports.
As the man said "who cares" Hockey is a major American sports league, and that ain't changing.
So the NHL needs expansion teams in Mexico, Europe & Australia ?
It started in canada hockey was invented by Canadians so don't you dare say it started because of Americans
Clearly holding onto this one waiting for the final outcome.
The fact that this was probably written shot and edited way before the Habs even lost, I think you're on to something. I've been saying this for years.
I didn't want to believe it, but after the recent Toronto vs Tampa series it solidified in my head: Canada isn't allowed to win, no matter what. Montreal or Toronto. Edmonton or Calgary. It's a lose/lose game. What a joke.
LMAO what timing
You(tae) got to strike while the iron has a chance of realizing it’s an iron
I also think there’s a huge difference in how these clubs were founded. All of the major European clubs were build on working class grass root teams (except like Chelsea, Red Bull Leipzig and Paris Saint Germain), while North American teams are founded for profits and sometimes they even move cities, which is unheard of in Europe. Every German club is at least 50% owned by fans.
Disagree.
Still cheering for a company, right?
I mean, it's all over the show, but you get to choose which type of team you prefer which is what ultimately makes the model better. They have corporate oil oligarch owned garbage teams, but they also on the other end have super legit fan owned working class teams. If I was into soccer I would probably support one of the fan-owned clubs because I'm a bit of an idealistic sort, and I love that the overpriced beer I bought at the game was going towards a better player for my team. Team losing? Why not get more drunk!?
@@PaigeMTL Yeah for sure. But even oil oligarch clubs like Manchester City have a history and a club tradition unlike idk LA Chargers, who cried because San Diego didn’t build them a better stadium, so they moved to LA. Ofc there are exceptions like Green Bay Packers in North America and Red Bull Leipzig in Germany.
Chelsea were founded to be the team for one of the oldest football grounds in sports history. Don’t put them in the same sentence as red bull or psg when it comes to history or tradition.
The timing jesus man lmaooo
Ouff.. yeah. Thunder Bay would've had a strong team in that alternate universe.. All four Staal brothers - not to mention that per capita, we've pumped out the most players than anywhere else!
more like more players who's left or gets stolen than anywhere else sadly
I would absolutely love a tier base system of Hockey. I got to admit, this definitely makes me like the league less. I never really thought about it like this.
These graphics are amazing
From 1976-1990 only one American team won the Cup, NYI 80-83. In the 1980s, Eight Canadian teams went to the final and won Six. With Two All Canadian Cup finals. What this tells us is that Salaries Sky rocketed right after the Gretzky trade. The Canadian dollar was so weak, there was no incentive to play in Canada from a business standpoint.
Great video Paige! Loved it even if the reality is quite sad
the american private league system is better than just having 2 teams buy all the good players and always winning, like we do in europe
Thank you, he doesn’t explain this at all. In the top European leagues, the team with the most money wins.
@@trentjackson6837 which is fair.
@@jujuun8992 sure but it’s not compelling to watch. Why would you watch something that has pre determined outcome. Such as, bayern winning the german league every year.
@@trentjackson6837 >Muh Bayern wins every year.
So what? Bundesliga is growing. Tickets are absurdly cheap compared to the NHL. Munchen is the biggest city in Germany, so the club does the best, which is fair and expected. People from cities support their hometown teams, and neutrals can support whoever they want. Fair?
@@trentjackson6837 but people actually love watching those dominant teams, either to cheer for them or against them. I can't get excited to watch Columbus Blue Jackets vs Phoenix Coyotes, but if an equivalent of the 70's Bruins or Canadiens, 80's Islanders or Oilers, were in the league, they would be must watch TV.
Plus I think with the size of USA + Canada being so much bigger than England, Germany, Spain, Italy, etc, it wouldn't be as lopsided. Especially since the NHL is the single dominant league competing for players. If Toronto was able to buy up all the best players in the NHL, the next players would still be available to be bought up by Montreal, or New York, or whoever. In Europe although there are many more soccer players to choose from, you get some of the best ones going to England, some going to Spain, some going to France, etc.
Just look at Major League Baseball. It doesn't have a salary cap (not sure, it might have a luxury tax?). In the last 20 World Series, there have been 13 different winners, and only one by the Yankees which is the biggest team in the league. Because there are so many big markets in USA + Canada.
Canadian teams lose because there is very little opportunity for market growth. The direction within large organizations isn't always explicit. A ref, refs a game wrong, they just don't get games. They know this and hockey is very momentum driven which is easily shaken by often 1 call.
Blew it out of the park as they say….great job!
Great video. It’s so frustrating for Canadians, especially after this last playoff run. Bettman didn’t even acknowledge the HABS in his speech, can’t stand him. I heard so many Americans, especially in Florida acting like they’d show Canadians how hockey is played when we know that probably 90% of their fan base never wore a pair of skates ever or wouldn’t recognize their players if they were walking by them on the streets. Tampa had 16 CDN players on their team and more Quebeckers than Mtl Canadiens, same with Vegas. Grrr
I wanted the Isles to win so badly because I thought that it would be great to see 2 actual hockey towns compete for once, it’s so great for local kids especially.
I don’t know if you knew but we had 2 teams in Quebec before, Mtl Canadiens and the Nordiques. The Nordiques actually moved to Colorado to become the Avalanches because the owner was a terrible person and the rivalry was the most intense one the MTL Canadians ever had, I think the biggest ever in the league, yes yes, bigger than the Bruins/Mtl one.
The ratings were off the charts when both team played together.
Majority of most teams are canadian too hahaha
the ''wouldn't recognize their players if they were walking by them on the street'' might actually be nicer for the players, i remember hearing about a Vegas player enjoying that he could feel like a regualr person rather than a god or something. i also think taxes (or rather the lack of them) help teams alot, players are willing to take what is at face value a lower paying contract but once you factor in taxes its diffrent. for example income tax, neither Florida or Nevada has it and that's 3 of the last 5 cups, Pennsylvania has it but its the lowest of all states with an NHL team (by quite a bit too) so thats 5 of the last 8 cups going to US states with lower taxes
None of this makes sense. The uncapped leagues in europe, have no parody and the team with the most money usually wins the league. In North American sports, good teams can come from any city in any sport
But when u add corrupted officiating to boost low or new markets? Im an edm fan and its so disgusting the calls mcdavid hardly gets
You do definitely have a point. After all, Edmonton lost Gretzky, and of course, Winnipeg and Quebec due to an uncapped league
Of course it makes sense. The NHL rewards zero effort by handing the crappiest teams the best players through the draft. There's a reason only two countries use this stupid system.
I always wished Bettman was involved in Football instead of Hockey . He ruined Hockey in Canada general . That’s why I got a nice tshirt that says . Canada Hater since 93
He quite literally doesn’t like our country so sad he ruined the game for us
can you believe he produced this entire video in less than a few hours? crazy Paige.
Doesn't take a genius to realize they'd lose the cup after 3 losses in a row.
Great beard. Mind blown by the green screen and the wig. Also, nice content.
Gary Buttman is why.
Idc, if another Canadian team makes the finals in the next few years, they won’t be winning only for their city, they will be winning it for Canada (other than the Maple Leafs).
Lol especially after seeing the saltiness of Maple Leafs fans this year, my oh my, it sad to see their obsession with the Habs.
@@ellaella5537 coke head Price cheated
@@alexs8846 Yeah, because players are tested while they play. Get help. Salty Leafs
I hate the leafs but if they were finalists u know id be there fuck bettman
This could be the year the leafs finally make a final.
Sounds like Canada needs to either form its own Premier League for hockey (similar to the CPL for soccer) or create a new tier for the CHL where teams get relegated up to a non-junior level of competition (and down) based on performance year to year.
The problem, of course, is that the NHL (and AHL) has most of the good arenas in major cities locked up and Canadian governments are famously resistant to funding new arenas and stadiums with taxpayer money. Maybe an outdoor league played in football stadiums a la the Winter/Heritage Classic games would be possible, can't see how using NHL arenas would work unless the government legally forced the management of these arenas to offer dates to the rival league.
Ryan could by the Sens, maybe the league will be rigged towards the Sens, plus the downtown areana pending.
I'd hate that shit. It would be a bunch of second rate players because all the money is in the NHL. There's a reason why the CFL is a farm system for the NFL, and why every league that isn't MLB (Japan, Korea, Taiwanese, Mexican, Dominican etc) is a farm system for the MLB. Wherever the most amount of money to be made is will have the best athletes in the world. UFC killed boxing in this way, because any fighter worth anything is drawn to UFC for the money that can be made there.
The only exception I can see if if there was a league that players could play in out of season in the same way that a lot of MLB players will play 'Winter ball'.
@@KC-bg1th Okay but let's be honest...aren't Canadian teams basically just minor league teams for the American teams at this point? They're not affiliated in the same way as true minor league teams, but what else would you call a group of teams that have competed for 30 years and haven't had a real chance of winning a cup?
It's like the movie WarGames...maybe the only winning move is not to play (in the NHL).
It’s not fixed against Canadian teams. The United States has lower taxes, in some markets great weather and US markets do not face the media scrutiny that players on Canadian teams do. Since free agency started after the first nhl lockout in 1994 their has been unrestricted free agency which has hurt Canadian based teams more than their US counterparts
Great video
The closest thing the Vegas knights have to a local player is Bischoff who was born 2700km away in Minnesota (there's 3 BC players who are closer but I consider them less "local")
didn't betman say he would be happy if no Canadian ever won again and what Canadian team has won since?
No. He didn't.
@@PeterDrake Of course you did, Gary. Your actions speak louder than words. But hey, know what? at least those cheating bastards Montreal Canadiens haven't won the Cup since they cheated to win in 1993. The Cup drought has been their reward.
Another amazing video!!!
seeing southern hockey teams being treated so well by bettman (arizona and vegas) and winning so much (tampa) really hurts the traditionalist hockey fan in me. canada deserves a cup and quebec city (and the whole province) deserves the nordiques back.
Bettman isn't anti-Canada. He's anti-moving teams. The only time he's okay with moving a team is when there is no owner willing to own the team in that city. This is why the Atlanta Thrashers moved to Winnipeg. Winnipeg had a willing owner and Atlanta didn't. Bettman was very supportive of the weaker Canadian teams when they were facing severe economic pressure in the late 90's and early 2000's. They brought in revenue adjustments that helped those poorer teams survive.
To be clear, I'm not arguing Bettman is great. He sucks on lots of things. CTE's. Marketing. Ownership and management misbehaviour. Growing the game. He's a smarmy lawyer, and it shows. But he isn't anti-Canada.
My theory is that Canadian teams don't win because they either rush rebuilds, or avoid them entirely. That might be because of perceived fan pressure, or just heightened negative media attention during the down years. And they tend to have too many people involved who think they know hockey, but aren't great at managing a hockey team. Edmonton actually tried to do a rebuild, and screwed it up at first, but they're a legit contender now. The Leafs rushed theirs. Montreal seems to know what they're doing. Ottawa too, although they might have jumped the gun a bit on exiting the rebuild. They also over-reacted to a good run in 2017. Too many cheerleaders when things seem to be going well, and too many pitchforks and torches when things aren't going well.
@@PeterDrake is that you, Gary? No sane person would take that weasel's side. Since he took over in '93, teams relocated from traditional hockey markets into non traditional...Minnesota to Dallas in '93, Quebec to Denver in 95, Winnipeg to Phoenix in 96, and Hartford to Carolina in '97. Not to mention putting expansion franchises where they don't belong like Nashville and Las Vegas instead of Hamilton and Quebec City. He is the worst thing to happen to the league.
@@sjdrifter72 Do you have a reading comprehension issue? I wrote that Gary Bettman is a smarmy lawyer who is bad at dealing with CTE's, marketing, ownership and management misbehaviour, and growing the game. That makes me a Bettman clone? Sheesh.
On the specific team relocations you mentioned, it's definitely a valid criticism. But they all happened during his first 4 years as commissioner. Do you think it might just be possible that he had less power to impose his views back then?
Okay you got me with the title, we went all the way to football in Europe, but still.
Maybe I am too lazy to do the research, (which I am) , but do you think that a format like in Europe could work in Canada , knowing we have FAR less population?
Great thorough analysis, and you got a subscriber 👍
I’ve thought about that a lot and realistically I don’t think it’ll happen for hockey. The franchise system is more profitable and therefore more competitive in a business sense. That could change if fans were discerning and decided to support a local team outside of the NHL. But I think fans are so attached to these brands that they just can’t do it. It seems like basketball is international enough that it could happen there, which might expose hockey fans to a different way of doing things, but that would be decades away.
I am from austria and basically every country in Europe has many leagues, even the small countries like we have like at least 3 leagues that are somewhat ok, and we have 9 million people, so I definitely think it could work,
It eventually splits down to citylevel, for example the 4 league where I live in Vienna is just clubs from Vienna, and there like a few leagues even below that so, I think its more a matter of that it is not super profitable than population
@@tim333y7 how are these leagues successful though? These European leagues are decided before they even begin. The European system only allows for the teams with most money to win, for example bayern and red bull salzburg.
Lets pray it never goes full nfl guys
It basically has
It’s because players get a better deal in the US. Same as almost every industry. Canada is and always has been behind economically to the US
So what I'm hearing is... eat Gary Bettman?
Because of revenue sharing, the NHL salary cap doesn't mean extra revenue that might have been spent above the cap goes to the owners. The dollar numbers in player contracts are in essence shares in the players' portion of the revenue.
like the informercial bits haha
NHL is rigged and I can prove it they have no Canadian teams playing tonight and it is pre season 🤔
NHL rules can sometimes be questionable
what rules ?
I am that kid from Vegas, kind of - born and raised in Tampa, I’ve probably put skates on 3 times, and I fucking love the bolts
I'm a black dude from southern California who's never put on ice skates. I've been a loyal and rabid kings fan since 1990. Hockey is the best sport. Nothing else comes close.
31 years of losing just tells me we suck at hockey. Canada sucks at hockey.
Any Trophy is tough to win, you half to be very consistent.
Great video! I agree with your general point (NA sport leagues are essentially cartels that shut down competition in unhealthy ways), but there's a few things you got wrong. First, the draft does not hurt Canadian teams today, much the opposite. Every year, free agency proves it again. Turns out, millionaires athletes in their 20s would rather hang out in New York, California or Miami than Edmonton, no matter how much they liked the Oilers as a kid. Plus they have accountants that tell them how much more take-home money in states with low income taxes (not a big deal for NY vs Edmonton, but a pretty big difference for Montreal vs Tampa/Vegas). If anything, the draft broke up even more anti-competitive systems in the pre-60s NHL, though those did favor Montreal and Toronto (look up the story of how Montreal bought up a semi-pro league to force Jean Béliveau to play for them).
As for the cap, it's effects are more complex than you suggest. It doesn't limit expenses as much as you'd think. In the 13 years after the cap but pre-pandemic, player salaries roughly doubled. It's because the cap (well the CBA) guarantee that a fixed percentage of league revenues will go to the players and also forces a salary floor, which combined with the NHL's guaranteed contracts (which not every NA sport league has) provides a lot of security to the players. It probably helps flailing southern markets more than it does small Canadian teams, but I don't think it's that clear-cut.
There's no doubt that the NHL has continuously become more US-centric for decades, and that it has hurt the competitive chances of Canadian teams overall. I just don't think those particular policies are good examples of it. Also some problems of Canadian teams are self-inflicted, or depend on other economic factors.
I'll also note that while promotion/relegation systems have their charms, they also have their own kinds of problems.
If a salary cap is good for players, why would the league owners be for it and the players union against it?
@@softestunicorn-go9614 I wouldn't go so far as to say it was good for the players. But it didn't really hurt them either. It just linked their salary to league revenue, for better or worse. The real battle was over how big a part of the pie they would get, and they got sizeable piece of it (57% of revenue), bigger than their counterparts in the NFL and NBA.
The owners were for it because it gave them cost-certainty, and because of the perception that parity would make the league grow more, which would put more money in their pockets.
Good comments guys.
When making a 15 minute video I trying to make a good faith "common sense" point. So for example I didn't go into tax rates because in the end the Northern Clubs have enough money in a competitive market to make it all irrelevant. The Leafs don't want to live in a world where the salary cap is applied "post tax" because that all comes out of their profit. No surprise that the Molson family haven't lobbied for a payroll that is twice the size of a club in Texas. In a world with no salary cap, the draft becomes the most important mechanism in levelling. Much like the way these were applied (closed league, draft, then cap) I think you would repeal the cap, then the draft, then open up competition.
Anyway, all this stuff is interesting but it doesn't fit in a 15 minute video that's primary message is "We have a problem". I'm working on a Canadian Civil long form episode to get all the extra stuff out so I'd encourage people to follow there if they want to see the more in depth discussion: th-cam.com/channels/ViA8T-lGaUxrmG941xSi-A.html
Good point@@mittens8798. I guess monopoly profits can be good for labour as well. But bad for the consumer. Form of rent seeking from hockey fans really.
Montreal is fucked when it comes to post-tax income for players.
A player making $1 million USD in Florida keeps $640k in his pocket. While in Montreal he'd only keep $503,000 USD. The marginal tax rate at that income level is 37% in Florida and 59% in Quebec so the take-home pay numbers would diverge even more dramatically the higher the player's salary gets.
So at $10 million he'd keep $6.1 million in Florida and only $4.9 million in Montreal.
Over a player's career that annual difference will really add up!
Thats damn sad for sports fans
Goddamn it you just ruined hockey for me….. 😵💫😂😂
The same thing happens in eSports. Games like Rocket League work like soccer (of course), where any team at all (could literally just be three random dudes) can get all the way to the top if they are really good. Overwatch on the other hand has franchises for cities, which probably suffocates talent.. (and obviously nobody from the city is actually on the team)
Weak
eSport?? Bruh not a real sport but ok.
@@KillaSin515 So you will notice I literally said esport and not sport, but have your temper tantrum anyway…
honestly i blame myself was born in 94 and my dads canadian so one too many canadians born in the usa
sorry yall
So many flaws with this. It would be a 2-4 team league without salary cap. Edmonton had multiple #1 picks and still can’t win. Free agents from Canada avoid Canada and opt for places with no state income tax (why panthers and lightning have been to cup last 5 years). Canada has to start looking at other reasons as to why they can’t do anything to win over last 30+ years. Could be taxes. Could be desirability of cities. Could be fan bases/media. Could be a lot of things. They should be worried that even with leveled playing field and advantages with players from their cities (in history you typically see “home town discounts”), Canada still can’t do anything productive.
32 years, 32 teams, you know what that means. That's right, the oilers are due to win that 1 statistical Cup this year. But I feel the frustration as a habs fan. My hockey fandom also took a massive hit when I finally figured out that pro sports is a replacement for war. I would much rather be able to defend what I believe in than cheer for nitwits on skates, lol.
The NHl can pay referee's extra.. money to call penalties against small market teams. Mostly canadian. And not call penalties against big l market teams
The Stanley Cup was created to award a Canadian champion and we should have kept it that way. It's not our game anymore. We sold it.
Any Canadian teams win in peoples NHL EA games.
definitely not a fan of Bettman, I love Canadian hockey and agree that the NHL needs to support the people and areas that actually grow up playing hockey, like Canada and maybe Wisconsin before putting more teams down south but how would you do player assignment without a draft? I could potentially get behind no salary cap but the stats tend to show that it adds more parody to the leagues that have them. I've always thought the relegation style would make things interesting.
So you really think that players that play for Canadian teams are going to waste their careers with no chance of winning the cup.. I hardly doubt it.
The lottery is rigged also for certain people
Edmonton stealing mcdavid from buffalo was gross and maybe planned maybe not but they got dahlin and eichel?
Tanking might be the term for top talent rolls
It was rigged against Anaheim so that a bigger market like Chicago could draft Connor Bedard.
Gary Bettman mandated in 1994 that no Canadian team will ever win the Stanley Cup.
Until he retires, that will continue. An NHL expansion team in Arizona, now in Utah ? That's insane.😊
@@tudormiller887 Bettman is considering a third try in Atlanta!
@@WW3_Soon The third time is the charm right ? 😊
Sourse (sorry I actually wanna know)?
Abolish the draft. This is the 3rd thread on this I've seen in the last 3 days. Give the Yanks their mercenaries and let's return hockey to the Canadian fans and players. I guarantee that there would be enough Canadians to support a minor league with Territorial Rights. Let's face it, the best players would go to the NHL where the money is. These mercenaries are welcome to their American money. Someone needs to give hockey back to the Canadian people.
So we should work to fix it. We should encourage more places to have hockey teams and make it more like europe
Relating the nhl to fifa or soccer futbol isnt nearly the same as basketball and nfl in terms of northamerican influence/market
I cant watch soccer aside from cardio athletisism vs the shit nflers and nhlers do
Great video but most of all, nice cap! #bignan
Go Laval Legumes!!
Paige, why don’t you tell the whole story of the European system? I am European myself but I prefer the North American system. In france, where I live, much like the other major European leagues the team with the most money wins (psg). Where as in North american sports league winners are way more diverse and money isn’t as much of a factor. Milwaukee bucks (nba), tampa buccaneers (nfl) , tampa bay lightning (nhl) and atlanta braves (mlb) are current champions, these aren’t historical powerful teams or teams with above average finances.
PSG has the most fans, gets the most money, buy the best players, wins the most games. You can pump money in, but eventually you need fans to break even. If you don't care about geography, you can always support a fan owned team like AFC Wimbledon, a different division or different nearby country.
We have no other league, we have no other country, it's a continental monopoly controlled to maximize profits for a corporation. We don't even get to pick our favourite billionaire. Imagine if no French team had won anything for 30 years? The only league is the Champions League, and the good players are syphoned off the French team so that (say) Thailand can win. The bosses decided that Thailand would be a profitable market so they put an expansion team there, they get to win for the next decade while the fanbase grows. They also don't have a team in Belgium or Switzerland, those markets are too small and those guys will support teams in neighbouring countries. Nothing matters, we're just a crowd of people around a roulette wheel. If we don't like the team, if they do something terrible, nothing will change, nothing actually can change by design, your actions, a thousand fans walking out of a stadium, nothing has an impact on the spinning wheel. In Soccer, you might like the game, the players, the team. In North America, you have to like the game and players, they've taken the team, it's just a logo and memories of what it used to be.
No issue - Montreal will win in 25/26.
Montreal v Canucks final would feed families 🔥🔥
Really man?
Pro-Rel does exist in the NHL. It's called the *Stanley Cup Playoffs.*
Vegetarians do eat meat, it’s called tofu.
@@PaigeMTL someone was going to bring up the playoffs argument sooner or later. But I did learn something new from ur vid!
Yeah, but it’s still a bullshit argument
How is the playoffs even close to promotion-relegation?
The leafs lose not because they don’t have good players tho
They make the finals sometimes
Lol rarely . During a pandemic or after a lockout
@@jpwjr1199
Or before a lockout as in the 2004 Flames' case.
This is pathetic. I have a question for you.. Since you put some much effort into your investigation and conspiracy theories; how about you also investigate the quality of the Canadian GM’s and the effects of toxicity of Canadian team fanbase and press?
As of 2024, the General Managers (GMs) of Canadian NHL teams and their citizenships are as follows:
1. Montreal Canadiens - Kent Hughes, Canadian
2. Toronto Maple Leafs - Brad Treliving, Canadian
3. Ottawa Senators - Pierre Dorion, Canadian
4. Winnipeg Jets - Kevin Cheveldayoff, Canadian
5. Calgary Flames - Craig Conroy, Canadian .
6. Edmonton Oilers - Jeff Jackson, Canadian
7. Vancouver Canucks - Patrik Allvin, Swedish
The most toxic NHL fanbases, according to various discussions and surveys, often include the following teams:
1. Edmonton Oilers: Edmonton fans are frequently cited as one of the most toxic, particularly in online forums and discussions. They have a reputation for being highly critical and outspoken, especially regarding their star player, Connor McDavid .
2. Calgary Flames: Fans of the Calgary Flames are noted for using the most profane language on social media, indicating a high level of toxicity in their online interactions .
3. Vancouver Canucks: Canucks fans also rank high in terms of vulgar language use and are often involved in heated online debates and criticisms .
4. Philadelphia Flyers: Flyers fans are known for their intense passion and can be quite harsh, both online and at games .
5. Toronto Maple Leafs: Leafs fans are another group frequently mentioned for their intense and sometimes toxic behavior, particularly on social media.
Now go pounder that...
As far as I could tell, no Canadian teams have won because no Canadian teams beat any American teams. Ok?
Good job watching the actual video...
Soccer is the way...
why its due to numbers. You have 7 canadian teams and 25 US teams you tell me why the odds are stacked against us. Come on man. Its obvious. Yes we have a chance but its a slim chance.
Roll a dice 30 times without getting a 6.
@@PaigeMTL you should take that logic to the roulette tables and tell me how well it works out for you. That’s not how probabilities work. Even if that was how they work, the analogy on its own still doesn’t work. All 32 teams do not have the same fixed odds to win the Stanley cup year to year for a endless list of reasons. Stick to politics.
even when a Canadian team gets to the Stanley cup they can't even win it Vancouver has lost twice I think a Canadian team lost 3 years in a row in the 2000s I think it was Edmonton, Calgary and Ottawa and then you had Vancouver's meltdown in 2011 versus Boston.
This year you had three really good Canadian teams Edmonton Toronto Calgary and none of them teams was able to get to the Stanley cup.
his point in the video was that with the rules of the NHL, basically it profits all the teams by just trading Canadian players to places that don't have snow, like la and florida, and it's robbing the best players to teams that live in desert's and also bringing in more revenue to the nhl because of the "good players wins to fans to money" thing
He kinda sums it up in 12:07
Point being, it's made to help the little dogs to bring in more fans and make more money which ends up messing canada teams up cause of trades
the teams that exist in nevada and such places, they just wouldnt be as good since they never grew up playing the sport, its not as accesible there, so even tho its 25 to 7 teams it would feel more like 10 to 7, but do to this monopoly of help the "little teams get good players to get more wins to get more fans to get more money" these teams thrive more than canadian teams, since we give them canadian players
24
Too many teams in the USA so they have more chance of getting more of their teams in the playoffs compared to canada
Because the US has way more cities a franchise can be viably placed
@@shauncameron8390But cities with no ice or snow as compared to ones with ice or snow. The area surrounding the LA Kings' stadium always doesn't have snow. Neither does the one surrounding the Anaheim Ducks' stadium.
Be POSITIVE!
Canada ALWAYS wins the cup. No matter which team gets it...
Around 45% of all players are CANADIANS!
The USA only has about 21% representation, and the rest is all over the place, from Russia to Sweden. Even Mexico (kinda) if you count Austin.
We ARE the NHL...
Three answers. Yes! 100% Without a shadow of a doubt. In the NHL it's more about Gary Bettman & franchises like The Leafs & The Habs not wanting any NHL expansion teams in Canada especially in the provinces of Ontario & Quebec Keeping all that NHL cash to themselves. Go Oilers! ❤🇨🇦🏒