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I can't believe people would do such dangerous actions when cutting wood. I'm new to woodworking, but it's called common sense. If it isn't safe, then don't cut it. It's not worth a hospital visit or, worse, losing your fingers, hand, or possibly your life. Ty for bringing this to everyone attention in a respectful matter. Great video
Most tablesaws in Europe have a sliding table, where you stand offset to the side of the blade. I would ask why i almost never see these kinds of saws in the Us
Long pieces that aren't supported by an outfeed table and the technique does make sense, I do it all the time with working with 8-10' boards because i work a lot with rough milled lumber, but reaching over the saw as demonstrated was obviously dumb.
@@BeakerbiteEspecially useful on 10' or longer cuts even with an extended outfeed. We had an unwritten rule to always grab a helper for extra long cuts.
@@TheJohn8765That’s not paranoia. That’s good sense, I am the exactly same, there has to absolutely no chance of any machine starting when I’m not completely ready for it to do so.
I winced every time he showed how his whole hand would be pulled down on top of the blade. But even worse was the way his body had to hunch over the blade for reaching over, where it put his guts directly over the blade.
I was cutting a long (6+ foot) board on a jobsite tableswaw once without proper guards or an outfeed table (big brain move...I know). To keep the board from tipping, I went around to the other side to support it and pull it through. Next thing I knew, the board was gone and I had my hand wrapped in my shirt, too afraid to look at it. That one stupid decision cost me my index finger between the first and 2nd knuckle, and permanently disfigured my ring and index fingers beyond repair to where they're now almost useless for anything more than holding an icy beverage. Fortunately for me, it was my left hand, and I am right handed, but that one split second cost me a 4 day hospital stay, MULTIPLE surgeries, and 2 years of physical therapy to regain the little bit of use I have in my left hand...Fortunatley, I had really good insurance, otherwise my medical bills would've totaled over 700K across those 2 years. Table saws are meant to be used a certain way. Please don't think you're smarter than the engineers that design them! It took me YEARS to gain the courage to use one again!
Them you SO much for sharing. You’re probably saving multiple others from a similar accident. Not hyperbole to call you a hero. So sorry that happened to you.
I'm sorry to hear about your accident. I encourage you to share it often so that others may learn about the dangers of using a table saw improperly. You said it well: table saws are meant to be used in a certain way. Hopefully beginners will learn the proper techniques and avoid anything else. Otherwise table saws, generally the most useful power tool in a wood shop, are just too dangerous to use. Thanks for sharing.
thank you for sharing your painful experience. I'm a beginner woodworker and this type of knowledge of what not to do is golden. Will definitely make sure to never even consider doing something like that.
There is actually a third force involved when cutting on the table saw. The two shown (forward through the blade and laterally against the fence) and you push down toward the table to keep the work from riding up the blade. That awful method shown of pulling the work from the back side of the table would not allow you to keep force down on the table.
20+ years as a carpenter and never had I heard of this...absoloutly bonkers. I have done some sketchy maneuvers on my tablesaw in the past, but nothing this crazy. Im also an artist and guitar player and I like having all my fingers...lol
I was confused by the thumbnail because people do use tools to push the work piece through in order to keep their fingers away from the blade. Then, I started the video and was like, what the actual hell. It never even occurred to me to consider doing that.
@@SmallSpoonBrigade That same confusion is what lead me to click the thumbnail in the collection of recommended videos. I'm not a woodworker, though I do know how to safely use a table saw thanks to my father, but TH-cam sometimes recommends woodworking videos because I follow one guy who is (John Malecki) but I don't follow him for his woodworking videos, just his random ones and some of his live-edge tables (And because he's local to me and it's cool to watch local TH-camrs)
I learned my table saw cutting skills back in shop class in the early 1970s and they have served me well. Your information is as solid now as my shop teachers was 50 years ago. Terrific video.
Me, too. Strangely enough, I think my shop teacher from then probably gave me the best learning experience I had in school. He was only the second person that tried to teach me how to 'think' about what I was doing before doing it. My Dad was the first, but if he were still here, he might say he still can't tell if it worked.
This is the first video of yours that I’ve seen and I feel compelled to comment on how beautiful your frikkin table saw is. The ground finish and the way the fence effortlessly and precisely slides out of the way when you unlock it just… it just really hit the spot for me. 😂 -Career machinist that has negligible experience with woodworking
I think you’re spot on in your assessment that those comments must come from people who have never used a table saw. I will admit that I have finished long rips by pulling from the opposite side before, but I was fully aware that it was an increased risk even though I was further than arms reach from the blade. The idea of reaching over the blade to pull the work through gives me the willies.
Completely agree with everything you said here. One thing I also do is I try to avoid having my face in the plane of the blade. I'll take a kick back to the arm or the gut, but I don't want one in the face. I consider it while grinding as well whether it's hand held or bench mounted. Great video.
If you’re making cuts that you think could possibly result in kickback, rather than repositioning your face, i would suggest a blade guard with anti-kickback pawls, some kind of featherboards or rollers that keep downward pressure on your piece, and also maybe a face shield that covers your entire face. I think that with any cut that’s reasonable to make on a table saw, blade guards with riving knives and something like jessem rollers or a downward featherboard would make it almost impossible for a piece to get kicked back into your face. If you’re cutting some huge workpiece that cannot be supported on your table, you should probably just use a track saw or circular saw instead for the cut. If you’re cutting vertical small pieces that you think could get kicked back, I think wearing a face shield would be pretty smart. I don’t recall ever wearing my face shield at the table saw, but I would consider it for maybe thin dados in a thin strip where I could not use my blade guard and maybe there might not be enough material for a featherboard or rollers to hold the piece down reliably. It’s never stupid to wear extra protection and take more thought-out precautions. I do sometimes wear a thick leather jacket when cutting some pieces that I think could possibly get kicked back to my body. I almost never do it, but I have done it a few times on cuts where I could not use my full blade guard.
Thank you for this. I cringe at videos I watch with so many unsafe practices being used. I just watched one where they have loose router bits laying on the fence. I don't even want to think of a sharp router bit falling hitting spinning blade and becoming airborne. Also knowing right blade for the wood your cutting, cleaning your surface before using, and doing dry cut runs before cutting. NEVER GET CONPLACENT!!!!!! Thanks again James for all the great knowledge you share with the community.
Good advice Nubs. People should be aware that all power tools can cause serious injury even by experienced users and using proper technique. Stay alert and focused at all times. Do not use any equipment when under the influence or impaired in any way.
Yep, those were my comments in the video. Yep, I am that big of an ideo. James was spot on. I have very little experience with table saws and I learned a lot from this video. James does a great job demonstrating some of the horrific ways pulling the wood through the saw can be and the impracticality of doing so. Could tools and methods be developed for pulling safely through the saw be developed? Maybe but I am not the one to do it. I don't have the expertise or experience to attempt to do so. I think this was a great video. If I had the idea of pulling instead of pushing others I am sure have had it too and now they know just how bad things can go if they try it. I still think a redesign of how table saws cut would be a good idea to eliminate kickback and make them safer without increasing the cost. The new regulations of mandating all table saws have the emergency blade stop mechanism might give rise to the redesign. Perhaps a pair of oscillating blades that when one blade is moving up the other is moving down. The R&D to develop such a system is beyond my budget or skill set. If you do and make a million you're welcome. If you do and lose a finger or hand attempting it I am sorry but you knew I didn't know what I was talking about.
I am still glad to this day that my school taught woodworking the way they did. What they did was, they had the woodworking and metal working class computers have safe search for accidents disabled, so that the teachers could tell us “look up metal and wood working mistakes. Now that we’ve seen what level of danger you WILL be in if you mistreat, disrespect, or think you’re better than the tool, I will begin teaching safety on (insert tool)” the images of seeing a mangled hand, or the one real serious one I saw, where a guy was impaled by a piece of wood into his stomach, always stick in my mind whenever I even mildly begin to think I’m better than the tool
discussion of the body mechanics of woodwork remains my favorite thing on this channel. I think the main thing people making these suggestions miss is the importance of being squared to the work for security. sure, it can seem counterintuitive to put your body directly in line with the cut, but that's exactly the position where you have the most control. if you stand off to the side, you have to angle your stance. you're off balance, and that's going to lead to more of the problems you think you're avoiding.
Your analysis is right on. In 30 years of making sawdust, I've had two minor kickbacks. Both on jobsite saws and totally my fault by not checking the square of the fence after transport. You can't "assume" the fence is still square.
My cheap table saw is slowly bending the whole mechanical section with each start up. I need to find a solution to this, its now dangerously out of alignment with the fence.
@@sparkyenergia Depending on the table saw you have, you may be able to attach a metal bracket to help support the part that's flexing. (If I'm understanding you correctly). It's difficult to know exactly unless we knew precisely what your issue is. Just make sure that you're not modifying something in a way that compromises the proper movements of the machine. Additionally, almost every table saw (even the cheap jobsite saws) allow you to adjust both the alignment of the blade (through adjusting the motor mountings) and the assignment is the fence to keep everything true and square. Your owner's manual should have a step by step guide to do this, or you can easily find one through a search online. (Actually, I believe that Stumpy has a couple videos on here describing the process, if memory serves me right.) It's pretty easy to do, and a required maintenance for any table saw
I think some people are more concerned about kickback than they are about blade contact. Kickback injuries can be serious, but they're usually not life-changing. Blade contact injuries are a different story.
"some people are more concerned about kickback than they are about blade contact" pulling the stock increases the chances for getting a lesson one won't forget the entire life. As short as that life may come to be.
@@StumpyNubs I knew a kid growing up that had to have 4 fingers reattached because he had tried to bring a piece back that was already engaged with the blade. They were able to reattach all the digits, but they never did fully straighten afterwards. He very nearly got the nickname stumpy nubs as a non-ironic nickname.
Had a coworker take a plywood kickback to the upper thigh severing an artery. It was an ugly scene to say the least. Another coworker that knew something of first aid tied a tourniquet to his thigh stop the bleeding and rushed him to the hospital. Could have been really bad if that tourniquet hadn't been tied.
i very much appreciate your focus on safety because i see so many woodwork channels not taking it seriously. but anyone suggesting to pull on a table saw has probably never used one
James, I do not have time to read comments from nice but misguided people who own dangerous power equipment. You are doing your best to teach the safest ways to use said equipment and I admire your concern and your level of patience.
I've used a table saw professionally for 20 years, and I was held to passing a safety test in design school, before being allowed to use the saw freely in the shop. I went on to teach and administer the test as a shop supervisor at several other institutions. I teach staying behind the plane of the fence whenever possible. When you can stand to the right of the fence to perform a cut safely, you should absolutely do so. People are different sizes, so this is different for everyone, but it greatly reduces the opportunity to be struck by a kickback. When the work is large enough that it's no longer comfortable, then operators should move to a comfortable position behind the work, or consider a different tool to complete the cut. Nowadays, a cordless track saw is a much better option than muscling more than half a sheet of plywood through the table saw if you're not very comfortable doing so. The education one receives from their first kickback is invaluable, and much better to go whizzing by than to be struck by it.
You can always learn to be safer around shop tools but your fingers won't regrow. Its good information even if you know the correct actions. Thank you for the refresher.
After years of watching woodworking vid's on the internet, I have only one piece of safety advice to share. "Listen to James and treat all other new safety ideas with scepticism." Thanks Stumpy, for your continued common sense.
Absolutely correct ! I would just like to add that the simple push sticks that are often supplied with table saws are dangerous, too ! While it is correct that they push the workpiece from the correct side, they do not hold the wood down at a second position. the yellow push-and-press instrument used in the video is a MUCH better choice.
Once again, James, you are ABSOLUTELY correct. There is a reason why we do things a certain way in a shop environment. It's because they work. With ANY machine there is always a chance for a mishap. But these tried and true methods have significantly reduced that possibility across the board. They have been peer reviewed for decades adding to their efficacy . You ARE safer following the established best practices of your machines. If you listen to the advice of the old farts you just may just become one someday. And that , my brother, is a beautiful thing. I'm 71 now. Started when I was 16.
Well done as usual. It's great that the attention paid to safety is (at least generally) improving. In my woodshop class, anno 1966, I made a Soma puzzle, which required 2" cubes. I sawed stock to 2" square and then sawed off the cubes from the square stock on the table saw, the push stick being my thumb rather close to the (of course) unguarded blade. One piece kicked back. Very luckily, it just caused some momentary distress to my thumb. The shop teacher sidn't interfere or say anything. I should have paid attention to how many fingers he was missing. Cheers from still with all my fingers Vienna, Scott
The motor on a table saw is typically able to produce 2000 watts. For perspective, a professional athlete can produce 400 watts for a sustained period of time. I'm glad you pointed out workpiece size. When I do dados for the portable closets I make, I use a side-to-side technique to manage the workpiece and keep it snug for a consistent depth of cut. At no time are my hands over the blade. If it feels awkward, it's a bad idea.
I’m a better and safer woodworker because of your amazing videos. I truly appreciate you spending your valuable time to share your wisdom and keeping us safe.
Thanks for sharing with us James, you're right 100% but you'll never convince those others until they loose something. Stay safe and listen to James!!! Fred.
Again, I thank you for your educational content - you explain the WHY and the HOW that so many other channels don't address as often. It comes only from experience and your ability to convey important items clearly is as impressive.
You promote not only safety but professionalism as well thanks from Australia. I might add I’m 74 and still use lots of power tools, but also very concerned with safety as I’ve been in construction most of my working life. I was well taught re safety by my father and have not shed much blood but the thing is sometimes, just sometimes you have a time component that obscures safe practice! Take care from Australia
Everytime I watch one of your table saw safety videos, I get the chills how easy it is to get seriously injured. I am a hobbyist level woodworker and the fact that proffesionals can get it wrong scares me no end. Thanks. I think....?
We always say "ask for help with larger pieces, and safety safety safety, love the videos & the side rocker chair probably feels like fishing on a small boat would put me to sleep
As I've said since the early days of the web: the internet is a suppository of misinformation. I've never heard of pulling a piece through--the closest I've seen is having someone support the material on the outfeed side. Great video.
I learned the hard way what a kickback was. I was ripping luan and had never really used a table saw. Ran it through and then pulled it back towards myself, then the blade caught the Luan and flung it right back at me and hit me in the groin. I’ll never forget the sound made when it kicked that piece of material back at me. I was lucky no one saw what happened or I would’ve been fired right then in there. Not long after, I watched a guy do the same thing I did, but I caught him in time and taught him the right way to do it. I never will forget that.
Another excellent safety video! I can't imagine how many people you assisted with this, but thank you for sharing what experienced woodworkers know. Keep up the great work!
This needed to be said. I learned how to use a cabinet saw with expert supervision in my university workshop, but I’m sure there are plenty of people who just buy a table saw and go to town, not realizing this is one of the most dangerous tools in the workshop.
I find your videos very informative. Thank you for the time, and effort you put into there production. As a DIY woodworker, and home owner. I am always trying to improve my skills. Your introduction to the Clean Armour UV cure top coat gave me and idea. I also do 3D printing with both filament and SLA (resin) printers. I am now curious how the finish would look using colored resin as my top coat.
My woodshop teacher taught us the "stay on the other side of the fence" to keep us safe. I felt so uncomfortable doing that I chose not to get certified to run it solo in the class. This is how so many of these bad ways of using equipment get spread - one person with the wrong knowledge in a place to spread this to others. It's such ideas that make me cringe whenever I hear "Those who can't do teach". Teachers have to pull double duty, know their subject AND be able to effectively teach it. James, I salute you in your constant effort to put education in your videos along with excellent woodworking techniques.
Push the piece toward the blade with your elbow while standing perpendicular to the entire tablesaw, and use your chin to press it towards the fence. It's the safest way, trust me I'm a internet expert.
I didn’t even know this was a thing, but I’m glad you took the time to nip it in the bud! I think the number of injuries from table saws are akin to most car accidents happening 5 miles or less from home. It’s a saw that is used so much more that of course it’s going to increase the stats on injuries. I still feel like it’s one of the safest saws as long as attention is paid to the forces at play and keeping the parts you want to keep out of the plane of the blade. The blade is always in the same place and doesn’t move around, unlike a circular saw, reciprocating saw, jig saw etc.
I worked at a shop that had a power feed. That was so cool. I cannot afford a power feed for my hobby, but it would be cool to have, and I felt very safe using it.
I remember my dad using his table saw in the garage to cut various pieces of wood. I don't think I remember him having any kind of fancy guard. I remember hearing him talking about basically this kickback, but I didn't understand it as a teenager or younger. I just know that I always tried to stand far away and not in front or in back of the saw. Recently I've started using a circular saw to cut 1x4s to build a model railroad, but I'm getting to the point where I might want to use a table saw instead of circular saw. I've had decent luck cutting longer pieces of plywood (not full 4x8) by clamping a straight board and running right up against the side of the board. I'm glad I came across this video in my suggested videos after a couple searches on how to use certain table saws.
With over 55 years of experience working with wood, I still have all my fingers. With that being said, I only had one incident where, while cutting a 45° angle where the cut-off caught the blade and came back hitting my right thumb, leaving with a slight cut and bruise. The reason why I stayed injury free? SAFTEY FIRST! The use of guards, whenever possible, comes first. All my tools and equipment have operable guards. Saftey glasses! Ear protection! Dust collection. Air filtration is always in working order before starting any project. If not, I order a replacement or find one that's in working condition. We are not like some of the amphibians that grow back missing parts..
Leaning from the back over a rotating saw blade. What a wonderful way to get disemboweled. We had an idiot at work always giving advice on things he had no clue about. This was the guy who tried to weld his broken glasses frames with plastic lenses left in. Also the guy who dropped a match into a closed steel barrel to burn off the excess fumes. Almost blew his head off when the lid went flying into the air.
Had you not said it, I would not have believed anyone could do such a thing. Well, what do I know. I'm still freaking out about the closed barrel. That's right out of a sit-com - with real world consequences.
Every time I saw him leaning down over the blade or demonstrating his hand being pulled through it the hair went up on the back of my neck. Huge yikes. I haven't seen anything so dangerous since Year 10 shop and young idiots misusing a bandsaw recklessly.
@valvenator I had to laugh at the glasses frames welding story. I've never welded anything in my life and almost certainly I'll never start, but I did manage to learn, decades ago, about just how little heat it takes to melt plastics. Ye Gods.
@@agcons I did welding in my younger days. I decided that my lungs were more important that this skill. Welding is dirty work. Rewarding but really, really dirty.
Honestly, I am gobsmacked. I’ve been working in woodshops for 52 years, and no one has ever suggested pulling stock through from the backside of a saw. Catching outfeed from someone feeding the saw, yes. But that’s pretty passive.
I have had helpers I told to support a piece try it even after being told not to and also the occasional passerby that thinks they'll be helping when they weren't asked to
@@williamsmith9026 So the helper is supposed to just support the piece vertically to prevent it from drooping rather than grabbing on to it to try and pull it?
Good point, which I thought about watching this. How do you go with feeding large stock as he showed, do you have to do it cack-handed? I'm not left-handed but I imagine it would be easier for you to run your saw the other way (if possible) to be able to handle it properly for you on the left rather than the right.
I’m recovering from a moment of inattentiveness that almost cost me my thumb. The blade had nearly stopped and I just lightly brushed the blade as I withdrew my hand from the cut and was distracted. I was shocked by how easily it went through nail and flesh. If it was still under power it would take the digit off in a heartbeat. I didn’t use a guard because it was “just one cut”. A&E doctors said I’m not the first or last, so whilst it’s up to you please take care when making every single cut however you do it! These videos are invaluable underlining this without being condescending. Keep up the good work!!
When I was in college, I worked in a furniture mill. For safety instruction, we would watch safety films that had been by the US government in the 1940s and '50s instructing how to use woodworking equipment safely. The techniques our handsome host teaches are entirely consistent with those films. Table saws have been in common use for more than 100 years. If pulling the wood through the saw was better than pushing it through, it would have been discovered decades ago. We all would have been taught that was the best way to do it. There's a reason why no shop teacher would ever teach students to use the saw this way, and for the same reason, no tables saw owner's manual illustrates this method as appropriate. The reason is that its unsafe. Take it from someone who's run thousands of board feet through a table saw and has been responsible for teaching his crew members how to use the tool safely: If I had seen one of my crew use the saw this way, I would have severely repremanded him. Had I seen him do it a second time, I would have fired him immediately. My primary goal when I came to work each morning was to NOT take someone to the hospital getting their blood all over my car. Fortunately, no one was ever severely injured on my watch.
I remember those safety films. The guy demonstrating was always wearing a sport coat and tie. And the shop was virginal. I don't think he'd ever seen a raw board in his life.
An excellent explanation, James, thank you. Hopefully this will give some viewers a lightbulb moment where they say "Ah, I get it now"...great. But of course there'll still be those who don't listen or don't have enough brain cells to understand rational thinking. But good on you, James, you've done your bit and made the point clear. Beyond that, if people don't want to listen, well let's hope they don't do too much damage to themselves or someone else.
WOW, VERY good info. I agree with you and I cannot believe some people actually suggested those ideas. BTW, I bought 2 of those feather boards. Awesome extra hands. Basic table saw safety rules still apply for Wood shop. I need to look into the finishing stuff, clean armor? I'll check it out. Thanks man.
As a shop teacher of 20 years who has taught countless high school students how to safely use a table saw, I CANNOT believe you even have to make this video! People actually believe those are the correct methods? Have they ever read or even understand the manufacturer's' instructions? No manufacturer in their right minds would ever recommend those methods for fear of being sued into oblivion! Thank you for calling this malarkey out! In all my time teaching young people to use a tablesaw, I can count on one hand how many times I've seen kick back in my shop, because there is only one way to do it safely.
I have been lucky. I have had two kickbacks. Once being dumb, and once not realizing the poplar i was cutting had so much internal stress that it separated causing a pinch between the blade and fence. The dumb kickback was a small board and barely bruised me thru the leather apron i was wearing, and the poplar kickback passed to my right side (i try to never stand in the line of fire) and imbedded the board into the wall. After seeing your older video with the outside kickback i have been even more careful. (your video was the first time i ever even knew an outside kickback was possible!!!)
Wow as a new woodworker but an older man I’ve never heard anything so dumb . Thanks for always sharing such truly great advice and videos as always James. Keep up the great work.
Different techniques for different sizes of workpieces makes good sense. I never reach over the fence, and keep my body out of the way of kickbacks (which I rarely have). I did put the skiver back on, but not the guard.
The positioning you have out of the path of the blade makes the most sense to me, especially with larger pieces. The biggest thing anyone using a table saw needs to do is be aware of what they're doing, and be aware of what happens to their position if something unexpected happens (a slip, a kickback, etc). That said, I will honestly admit that as a random DIY guy with a small table saw and often no outfeed table, I definitely have pulled large sheets through to finish a cut. Never to start, but to finish once well over half through. It can be done safely, especially if you aren't concerned about any accuracy flubs (but then to the fair point, why are you using a table saw?). Not that it's the point of the video, but I can't overstate the importance of outfeed support for large pieces, and for the DIYer with limited space and budget, adjustable/collapsible portable roller stands are an absolute must have to avoid awkward cutting.
A rocking char that rocks sideways reminds me of the time I rode a carrousel that was running backwards. They did it for two days at Halloween. I can say I rode it but I won't ever do it again. Bill
An excellent safety video! I'm a woodworker that has been doing it since I was 12 years old. Back then when I started, it was in woodshop class. Safety was always the first lessons we were taught in all of the classes I took. I value my hands and fingers as much as I do my own life, and can say because of my safety first practices, I still have all of my fingers and thumbs, in good working order. One safety rule I think should be rule number one in any shop that operates heavy and dangerous equipment is for visitors to the shop, as well as workers in the shop: Never do anything that can distract a heavy equipment operator from his or her work. It is dangerous to the worker operating the equipment, as well as the person that distracts that worker. In one company I worked for, both I and my father were working in the company cabinet shop. Dad was the main saw man at that time. He was making a cut on the tablesaw, when a visitor walked over and asked him a question, while he was in the middle of the cut! It was enough of a distraction to cause him to lose a finger; his right forefinger to be exact. I saw it happen, and it was horrifying. Other members of our cabinet shop crew saw it happen also. Blood was everywhere on Dad of course but also on the man that had caused his accident, me as I was close by when it happened, and all over the tablesaw, wood and surrounding area. We who witnessed the incident told the plant manager the reason it happened, and that guy lost his job. A few months later I was offered the supervisors position in the cabinet shop. I didn't really want it, so I asked if someone else could do it. They told me I was the best man for the job. I told them I really would rather keep doing the work of cabinet designing and building! They knew I was their best cabinet builder, so they made me Lead Man instead, and someone I trusted became my supervisor. The first thing I did as Lead Man was write safety rules for every station in the cabinet shop. Each station had many different rules that related to what was done at those stations, but certain rules were the same across the whole shop. Number one was my anti-distraction rule. No visitor was allowed to enter the cabinet shop without first reading that rule, and that included the company owner, the plant manager, all supervisors, all visiting customers touring the plant, and all employees, as well as myself! I was not going to exempt myself from following my own rules. The effect of having those rules posted was a much safer shop. The plant manager brought the company owner to the shop to read those rules. He authorized having similar rules posted throughout the plant. Please do a video on the importance of an anti-distraction rule. It is my goal to help reduce injuries and possible deaths due to distractions! Your help in this would be most welcome! Subscribing!
All correct. As you point out, you must have firm control of the board with your hands, with a push stick on small cuts. Holding the board lightly because you are afraid of of the blade is problematic. Another thing, you must be able to see the blade, the fence, and the board clearly, pushing from the wrong side of the fence is asking for trouble.
Interesting - I really had /never/ heard of the INSANE idea of hooking the board from the other side! Thanks for this, for those folks who clearly need to think things through a bit more thoroughly. The [few] times I have had a kick back have been typically when I was a bit too hurried to thoroughly think through the cut BEFORE doing it - e.g. looking closely at a board to see that the way is was milled, and the grain indicate it's likely to pinch when cut, and simply cut from the other side, or end to make it work better - even with a splitter. Or being aware that small pieces of a rabbet being cut loose are likely to slide [quickly] back at me, and position myself appropriately.
I really like this video. Just pinching the bridge of your nose for second and then sitting your audience down like a disappointed father, "ok... let's walk through what that looks like" Keep up the great work, and that nickel plated Harvey table saw -- 🔥🔥🔥
Because I live in a flood zone I equipped my ground level garage shop with tools I can roll into our elevator and take to the second floor if necessary. My table saw is a 8-1/4” Skill job site which I’ve equipped with the 48” Bow fence extension with vertical feather guides you reviewed which greatly improved ease of use and safety. For cutting sheet goods I purchased a Kreg ACS track saw / table system with the folding wheeled stand. A very simple alternative to having kicked-back boards punching holes through the wall behind is to make a ‘kick back catcher’; a frame suspending a piece of canvas or even lighter muslin coated with some latex paint between saw and wall to stop it. I got that idea because I’ve made my own painted muslin background for photography.
The only "pull" I have ever done is with large boards, but before you hate me, I do this with another person on the "pull" side, mostly to help me guide the board. Part of this is due to the fact that I, as many other DYIs, have a "portable" table saw that doesn't have the weight and stability of the large table saw you and other professionals typically have. I wish I did though...otherwise, I agree with your take 100%.
Hi James I’m not a carpenter but I enjoy your videos I have the following idea if the fence was made of tapered material would it spread the cut on the outgoing side thereby taking away any pressure on the blade sent from Chris in the uk
Thanks James. Good video. Because of my experience, I will continue to alert folks about Clean Armor's "satin" finish. YES, it's amazing how it cures in a couple or minutes (I'm currently doing an entire hardwood floor with it. But I had a very frustrating experience in applying their "satin" finish. To me, and everyone I've shown it to, it looks like gloss. Unless you want a pretty darned shiny finish, don't order the "satin" finish! In 50 years of woodworking, I've never seen a "satin" as shiny as theirs. The solution might run you an extra $133.00, (plus shipping and tax) but you order their matte finish and mix it with the satin. I liked the ratio of 60% matte and 40% satin. THAT looks like satin to me. But ABSOLUTELY do your own testing FIRST! Great product, but very expensive to screw up with.
I once had a guy "catching" the wood on the other side of the table until he thought he should pull to "help me" guide through the cut - I thanked him for his thoughtfulness and chastised him for his actions - I had been explicit in what I wanted him to do but his good naturedness just couldn't stop. I don't have room for a drop off table so I went back to just dropping the wood onto a soft landing. Good guy tho.
There is no way the pulling the work toward you is a serious suggestion! Now I've seen it all. Stupid has no bounds. Keep spreading good sound and safe techniques. Love your channel
A good rule of thumb is: if you feel awkward using a power tool then stop immediately, re-evaluate the situation, and look for advice from experienced woodworkers (not from internet rando). Operating a tool should never be awkward. If it does then there's a safer way to do it that you don't know about.
1:38 made me feel pretty uncomfortable, even when the saw wasn't on... immediately gave me the "nope" feeling 😅 People need to watch this video if they're going to use table saw. Unless they want other bits than just wood flying around the workplace 😬
Best move I made was learning to align my saw table to the blade. This allows me to measure from one of the table guides to the fence at both ends of the table. Previously I had just been measuring from the front of the blade to the fence, and from the back of the blade to the fence hoping this would have the fence parallel to the blade. That always seemed to be pinching the board I was cutting or seeing the far side of the blade having slop even though I was holding the board tight to the fence. When I aligned my table to the blade running the piece through the saw was much smoother and I never feel i’m risking kickback.
As always an informative video. Very curious about how you got the outstanding finish on the table saw. I seem to have missed the video of that process and it doesn't show up on your channel listings. Any info would be greatly appreciated.
The saw is nickel plated. It's an option Harvey offers on some of their new machines. It prevents corrosion. The internal cast components are plated too.
Not to mention, the stop button is usually a big, paddle shaped button that is easily pressed by your knee, and happens to typically reside where you would be expected to stand when using the saw in the safest manner.
As an added bonus - beyond removing the pinch factor - a riving knife keeps the back of the cut from twisting away from the fence and hitting the back of the spinning blade. I've seen people flip small pieces up and hit themselves in the face this way. No, I don't use a guard but I ALWAYS use a riving knife.
Everything you said is true an not unknown to me as someone who has been woodworking since I could hold a hammer in my hands. Your advice should serve the newbies who have yet to had a kickback. Hopefully unlike a child who is told the stove is hot and proceeds to touch it, they take your advice wisely and don't "test the waters"
I will say (and please correct me if I’m wrong) I will sometimes stand sideways to the saw (with my right side facing the saw) as I make the cut. I’ve seen larger pieces kick back and go airborne at head height, and they also go up, and to the left side of the blade. Which would be where you’re standing
I know you use the table saw a lot in your vids, but there's a good case to be made for home wood workers using a track/plunge saw for most cuts. And only using the table saw
One method is to be cautious and aware. I work with metal since 1990 and had only minor injuries. Also i have both eyes, ten fingers and my hearing isn’t damaged. You can do it too, folks!
Every time you put your hand on that blade my stomach would give a little heave lol great video, thank you! As someone who is eager to keep all my fingers and limbs intact, I'm always looking for safety tips with the table saw 😅
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I can't believe people would do such dangerous actions when cutting wood. I'm new to woodworking, but it's called common sense. If it isn't safe, then don't cut it. It's not worth a hospital visit or, worse, losing your fingers, hand, or possibly your life. Ty for bringing this to everyone attention in a respectful matter. Great video
Most tablesaws in Europe have a sliding table, where you stand offset to the side of the blade. I would ask why i almost never see these kinds of saws in the Us
Holy cow. I've never once thought about pulling cuts through a table saw. That's insane!
I saw that and almost freaked out. I mean, I've used a Tablesaw since I was 16. That's just - be sure to put 'be stupid' on your todo list.
Long pieces that aren't supported by an outfeed table and the technique does make sense, I do it all the time with working with 8-10' boards because i work a lot with rough milled lumber, but reaching over the saw as demonstrated was obviously dumb.
I've pulled cuts but with the help of a partner. One feeding, one catching. Eventually the catcher has the better position and finishes the cut.
@@BeakerbiteEspecially useful on 10' or longer cuts even with an extended outfeed. We had an unwritten rule to always grab a helper for extra long cuts.
@@JoshR-k9qor 16’😅
I knew the saw wasn't turned on, but my heart still dropped when you simulated a kickback and having your hands go over the blade.
They don’t call this channel “intact fingers”
I'm paranoid enough I wouldn't even have the damn thing plugged in...
@@TheJohn8765That’s not paranoia. That’s good sense, I am the exactly same, there has to absolutely no chance of any machine starting when I’m not completely ready for it to do so.
Same!
I winced every time he showed how his whole hand would be pulled down on top of the blade. But even worse was the way his body had to hunch over the blade for reaching over, where it put his guts directly over the blade.
I was cutting a long (6+ foot) board on a jobsite tableswaw once without proper guards or an outfeed table (big brain move...I know). To keep the board from tipping, I went around to the other side to support it and pull it through. Next thing I knew, the board was gone and I had my hand wrapped in my shirt, too afraid to look at it. That one stupid decision cost me my index finger between the first and 2nd knuckle, and permanently disfigured my ring and index fingers beyond repair to where they're now almost useless for anything more than holding an icy beverage. Fortunately for me, it was my left hand, and I am right handed, but that one split second cost me a 4 day hospital stay, MULTIPLE surgeries, and 2 years of physical therapy to regain the little bit of use I have in my left hand...Fortunatley, I had really good insurance, otherwise my medical bills would've totaled over 700K across those 2 years. Table saws are meant to be used a certain way. Please don't think you're smarter than the engineers that design them! It took me YEARS to gain the courage to use one again!
Them you SO much for sharing. You’re probably saving multiple others from a similar accident. Not hyperbole to call you a hero. So sorry that happened to you.
Ouch, that hurt only by reading it. Thanks for sharing.
Please pin this comment
I'm sorry to hear about your accident. I encourage you to share it often so that others may learn about the dangers of using a table saw improperly. You said it well: table saws are meant to be used in a certain way. Hopefully beginners will learn the proper techniques and avoid anything else. Otherwise table saws, generally the most useful power tool in a wood shop, are just too dangerous to use. Thanks for sharing.
thanks for sharing! may it prevent another similar accident
thank you for sharing your painful experience. I'm a beginner woodworker and this type of knowledge of what not to do is golden. Will definitely make sure to never even consider doing something like that.
There is actually a third force involved when cutting on the table saw. The two shown (forward through the blade and laterally against the fence) and you push down toward the table to keep the work from riding up the blade. That awful method shown of pulling the work from the back side of the table would not allow you to keep force down on the table.
Worse yet, by pulling the piece with a hook, you risk lifting the piece up as your hook is reaching from above and over.
Yeah, if you not push down hard enough on the work piece it might lift up and lift off...
There are a lot of woodworking TH-camrs I enjoy watching... But I learn the most from YOU. Seriously, thank you so much! Go Wings!
Double down on this statement! Thank you
I learn a lot from this channel, too. Go Lions!
20+ years as a carpenter and never had I heard of this...absoloutly bonkers. I have done some sketchy maneuvers on my tablesaw in the past, but nothing this crazy. Im also an artist and guitar player and I like having all my fingers...lol
I was confused by the thumbnail because people do use tools to push the work piece through in order to keep their fingers away from the blade. Then, I started the video and was like, what the actual hell. It never even occurred to me to consider doing that.
@@SmallSpoonBrigade me either...and I would never do it
@@SmallSpoonBrigade I can only hope that it was kids trolling on mom's computer...
@@SmallSpoonBrigade That same confusion is what lead me to click the thumbnail in the collection of recommended videos.
I'm not a woodworker, though I do know how to safely use a table saw thanks to my father, but TH-cam sometimes recommends woodworking videos because I follow one guy who is (John Malecki) but I don't follow him for his woodworking videos, just his random ones and some of his live-edge tables (And because he's local to me and it's cool to watch local TH-camrs)
I think about how much I love playing the bass every time I turn the machine on
If this video was done by anyone I did not watch I would think it was a joke. This is why your advice is critical to the naive out there
I learned my table saw cutting skills back in shop class in the early 1970s and they have served me well. Your information is as solid now as my shop teachers was 50 years ago. Terrific video.
Me, too. Strangely enough, I think my shop teacher from then probably gave me the best learning experience I had in school. He was only the second person that tried to teach me how to 'think' about what I was doing before doing it. My Dad was the first, but if he were still here, he might say he still can't tell if it worked.
This is the first video of yours that I’ve seen and I feel compelled to comment on how beautiful your frikkin table saw is. The ground finish and the way the fence effortlessly and precisely slides out of the way when you unlock it just… it just really hit the spot for me. 😂
-Career machinist that has negligible experience with woodworking
I think you’re spot on in your assessment that those comments must come from people who have never used a table saw. I will admit that I have finished long rips by pulling from the opposite side before, but I was fully aware that it was an increased risk even though I was further than arms reach from the blade. The idea of reaching over the blade to pull the work through gives me the willies.
You have to pull from the other side to finish long rips. It's not any more dangerous than pushing unless you're leaning over the saw.
Completely agree with everything you said here. One thing I also do is I try to avoid having my face in the plane of the blade. I'll take a kick back to the arm or the gut, but I don't want one in the face. I consider it while grinding as well whether it's hand held or bench mounted.
Great video.
If you’re making cuts that you think could possibly result in kickback, rather than repositioning your face, i would suggest a blade guard with anti-kickback pawls, some kind of featherboards or rollers that keep downward pressure on your piece, and also maybe a face shield that covers your entire face.
I think that with any cut that’s reasonable to make on a table saw, blade guards with riving knives and something like jessem rollers or a downward featherboard would make it almost impossible for a piece to get kicked back into your face. If you’re cutting some huge workpiece that cannot be supported on your table, you should probably just use a track saw or circular saw instead for the cut.
If you’re cutting vertical small pieces that you think could get kicked back, I think wearing a face shield would be pretty smart.
I don’t recall ever wearing my face shield at the table saw, but I would consider it for maybe thin dados in a thin strip where I could not use my blade guard and maybe there might not be enough material for a featherboard or rollers to hold the piece down reliably. It’s never stupid to wear extra protection and take more thought-out precautions.
I do sometimes wear a thick leather jacket when cutting some pieces that I think could possibly get kicked back to my body. I almost never do it, but I have done it a few times on cuts where I could not use my full blade guard.
Thank you for this. I cringe at videos I watch with so many unsafe practices being used. I just watched one where they have loose router bits laying on the fence. I don't even want to think of a sharp router bit falling hitting spinning blade and becoming airborne. Also knowing right blade for the wood your cutting, cleaning your surface before using, and doing dry cut runs before cutting. NEVER GET CONPLACENT!!!!!! Thanks again James for all the great knowledge you share with the community.
I don’t watch such videos anymore, typical are far eastern videos or Russian, crazy what some do,as a beginner I frown on such people
Good advice Nubs. People should be aware that all power tools can cause serious injury even by experienced users and using proper technique. Stay alert and focused at all times. Do not use any equipment when under the influence or impaired in any way.
Yep, those were my comments in the video. Yep, I am that big of an ideo. James was spot on. I have very little experience with table saws and I learned a lot from this video. James does a great job demonstrating some of the horrific ways pulling the wood through the saw can be and the impracticality of doing so. Could tools and methods be developed for pulling safely through the saw be developed? Maybe but I am not the one to do it. I don't have the expertise or experience to attempt to do so. I think this was a great video. If I had the idea of pulling instead of pushing others I am sure have had it too and now they know just how bad things can go if they try it.
I still think a redesign of how table saws cut would be a good idea to eliminate kickback and make them safer without increasing the cost. The new regulations of mandating all table saws have the emergency blade stop mechanism might give rise to the redesign. Perhaps a pair of oscillating blades that when one blade is moving up the other is moving down. The R&D to develop such a system is beyond my budget or skill set. If you do and make a million you're welcome. If you do and lose a finger or hand attempting it I am sorry but you knew I didn't know what I was talking about.
Thanks for being a good sport about it :)
Love the footage of you trying to pull it from the back of the saw. Very funny and illustrative. Prime content!
I am still glad to this day that my school taught woodworking the way they did. What they did was, they had the woodworking and metal working class computers have safe search for accidents disabled, so that the teachers could tell us “look up metal and wood working mistakes. Now that we’ve seen what level of danger you WILL be in if you mistreat, disrespect, or think you’re better than the tool, I will begin teaching safety on (insert tool)” the images of seeing a mangled hand, or the one real serious one I saw, where a guy was impaled by a piece of wood into his stomach, always stick in my mind whenever I even mildly begin to think I’m better than the tool
discussion of the body mechanics of woodwork remains my favorite thing on this channel. I think the main thing people making these suggestions miss is the importance of being squared to the work for security. sure, it can seem counterintuitive to put your body directly in line with the cut, but that's exactly the position where you have the most control. if you stand off to the side, you have to angle your stance. you're off balance, and that's going to lead to more of the problems you think you're avoiding.
Your analysis is right on. In 30 years of making sawdust, I've had two minor kickbacks. Both on jobsite saws and totally my fault by not checking the square of the fence after transport. You can't "assume" the fence is still square.
My cheap table saw is slowly bending the whole mechanical section with each start up. I need to find a solution to this, its now dangerously out of alignment with the fence.
Unless you have a Dewalt table saw with that insane fence. DWE7491RS is what I am talking about.
@@sparkyenergia Depending on the table saw you have, you may be able to attach a metal bracket to help support the part that's flexing. (If I'm understanding you correctly). It's difficult to know exactly unless we knew precisely what your issue is. Just make sure that you're not modifying something in a way that compromises the proper movements of the machine.
Additionally, almost every table saw (even the cheap jobsite saws) allow you to adjust both the alignment of the blade (through adjusting the motor mountings) and the assignment is the fence to keep everything true and square.
Your owner's manual should have a step by step guide to do this, or you can easily find one through a search online. (Actually, I believe that Stumpy has a couple videos on here describing the process, if memory serves me right.) It's pretty easy to do, and a required maintenance for any table saw
Yep. Never assume with dangerous power tools. Either know or find out. Otherwise don't use until you do.
I think some people are more concerned about kickback than they are about blade contact. Kickback injuries can be serious, but they're usually not life-changing. Blade contact injuries are a different story.
"some people are more concerned about kickback than they are about blade contact" pulling the stock increases the chances for getting a lesson one won't forget the entire life. As short as that life may come to be.
Kickback can pull your hand into the blade.
@@StumpyNubs true. This being said, the necessary distinctions in the meaning of the possibility/probability/impact words comes into play.
@@StumpyNubs I knew a kid growing up that had to have 4 fingers reattached because he had tried to bring a piece back that was already engaged with the blade. They were able to reattach all the digits, but they never did fully straighten afterwards.
He very nearly got the nickname stumpy nubs as a non-ironic nickname.
Had a coworker take a plywood kickback to the upper thigh severing an artery. It was an ugly scene to say the least. Another coworker that knew something of first aid tied a tourniquet to his thigh stop the bleeding and rushed him to the hospital. Could have been really bad if that tourniquet hadn't been tied.
i very much appreciate your focus on safety because i see so many woodwork channels not taking it seriously. but anyone suggesting to pull on a table saw has probably never used one
James, I do not have time to read comments from nice but misguided people who own dangerous power equipment. You are doing your best to teach the safest ways to use said equipment and I admire your concern and your level of patience.
I've used a table saw professionally for 20 years, and I was held to passing a safety test in design school, before being allowed to use the saw freely in the shop. I went on to teach and administer the test as a shop supervisor at several other institutions. I teach staying behind the plane of the fence whenever possible. When you can stand to the right of the fence to perform a cut safely, you should absolutely do so. People are different sizes, so this is different for everyone, but it greatly reduces the opportunity to be struck by a kickback. When the work is large enough that it's no longer comfortable, then operators should move to a comfortable position behind the work, or consider a different tool to complete the cut. Nowadays, a cordless track saw is a much better option than muscling more than half a sheet of plywood through the table saw if you're not very comfortable doing so. The education one receives from their first kickback is invaluable, and much better to go whizzing by than to be struck by it.
You can always learn to be safer around shop tools but your fingers won't regrow. Its good information even if you know the correct actions. Thank you for the refresher.
After years of watching woodworking vid's on the internet, I have only one piece of safety advice to share.
"Listen to James and treat all other new safety ideas with scepticism."
Thanks Stumpy, for your continued common sense.
Absolutely correct ! I would just like to add that the simple push sticks that are often supplied with table saws are dangerous, too ! While it is correct that they push the workpiece from the correct side, they do not hold the wood down at a second position. the yellow push-and-press instrument used in the video is a MUCH better choice.
Once again, James, you are ABSOLUTELY correct. There is a reason why we do things a certain way in a shop environment. It's because they work. With ANY machine there is always a chance for a mishap. But these tried and true methods have significantly reduced that possibility across the board. They have been peer reviewed for decades adding to their efficacy . You ARE safer following the established best practices of your machines. If you listen to the advice of the old farts you just may just become one someday. And that , my brother, is a beautiful thing. I'm 71 now. Started when I was 16.
Well done as usual. It's great that the attention paid to safety is (at least generally) improving. In my woodshop class, anno 1966, I made a Soma puzzle, which required 2" cubes. I sawed stock to 2" square and then sawed off the cubes from the square stock on the table saw, the push stick being my thumb rather close to the (of course) unguarded blade. One piece kicked back. Very luckily, it just caused some momentary distress to my thumb.
The shop teacher sidn't interfere or say anything. I should have paid attention to how many fingers he was missing.
Cheers from still with all my fingers Vienna, Scott
The motor on a table saw is typically able to produce 2000 watts. For perspective, a professional athlete can produce 400 watts for a sustained period of time. I'm glad you pointed out workpiece size. When I do dados for the portable closets I make, I use a side-to-side technique to manage the workpiece and keep it snug for a consistent depth of cut. At no time are my hands over the blade. If it feels awkward, it's a bad idea.
I’m a better and safer woodworker because of your amazing videos. I truly appreciate you spending your valuable time to share your wisdom and keeping us safe.
Thanks for sharing with us James, you're right 100% but you'll never convince those others until they loose something. Stay safe and listen to James!!! Fred.
Again, I thank you for your educational content - you explain the WHY and the HOW that so many other channels don't address as often. It comes only from experience and your ability to convey important items clearly is as impressive.
Superb video. I’m in my sixties and relatively new to table saws. These videos are just brilliant thank you. George U.K.
You promote not only safety but professionalism as well thanks from Australia. I might add I’m 74 and still use lots of power tools, but also very concerned with safety as I’ve been in construction most of my working life. I was well taught re safety by my father and have not shed much blood but the thing is sometimes, just sometimes you have a time component that obscures safe practice! Take care from Australia
Thanks for all the tips, James! 😊
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Thanks, James. It's amazing the things some people think up. And thank you for debunking some myths. Have a great weekend! 😃😃😃❤❤❤
Everytime I watch one of your table saw safety videos, I get the chills how easy it is to get seriously injured. I am a hobbyist level woodworker and the fact that proffesionals can get it wrong scares me no end. Thanks. I think....?
We always say "ask for help with larger pieces, and safety safety safety, love the videos & the side rocker chair probably feels like fishing on a small boat would put me to sleep
As I've said since the early days of the web: the internet is a suppository of misinformation. I've never heard of pulling a piece through--the closest I've seen is having someone support the material on the outfeed side. Great video.
I think it would be accurate enough just to call it a suppository of information 🤣
3:48 Go-go gadget arms!
It is amazing how so many bad ideas can sound so reasonable in your head. And not just in woodworking.
I learned the hard way what a kickback was. I was ripping luan and had never really used a table saw. Ran it through and then pulled it back towards myself, then the blade caught the Luan and flung it right back at me and hit me in the groin. I’ll never forget the sound made when it kicked that piece of material back at me. I was lucky no one saw what happened or I would’ve been fired right then in there. Not long after, I watched a guy do the same thing I did, but I caught him in time and taught him the right way to do it. I never will forget that.
Another excellent safety video! I can't imagine how many people you assisted with this, but thank you for sharing what experienced woodworkers know. Keep up the great work!
This needed to be said. I learned how to use a cabinet saw with expert supervision in my university workshop, but I’m sure there are plenty of people who just buy a table saw and go to town, not realizing this is one of the most dangerous tools in the workshop.
I know people that have lost fingers because they thought they knew better than their instructors... Welp.
In the university I work at they removed and hid the blade and nut retaining it because some students stood on the table saw while operating it...
@@pettere8429 what the... just. what
I find your videos very informative. Thank you for the time, and effort you put into there production. As a DIY woodworker, and home owner. I am always trying to improve my skills. Your introduction to the Clean Armour UV cure top coat gave me and idea. I also do 3D printing with both filament and SLA (resin) printers. I am now curious how the finish would look using colored resin as my top coat.
My woodshop teacher taught us the "stay on the other side of the fence" to keep us safe. I felt so uncomfortable doing that I chose not to get certified to run it solo in the class. This is how so many of these bad ways of using equipment get spread - one person with the wrong knowledge in a place to spread this to others.
It's such ideas that make me cringe whenever I hear "Those who can't do teach". Teachers have to pull double duty, know their subject AND be able to effectively teach it. James, I salute you in your constant effort to put education in your videos along with excellent woodworking techniques.
Push the piece toward the blade with your elbow while standing perpendicular to the entire tablesaw, and use your chin to press it towards the fence. It's the safest way, trust me I'm a internet expert.
LOL
You keep your chin back with a featherbeard.
Thank you once again for a well thought out video. I am new to wood working and you have saved my digits countless times. LOVE your channel
Good video. I am amazed that anyone thought these were an option.
Even though the saw as off, I winced and slammed my eyes shut each time you demonstrated this technique.
I didn’t even know this was a thing, but I’m glad you took the time to nip it in the bud! I think the number of injuries from table saws are akin to most car accidents happening 5 miles or less from home. It’s a saw that is used so much more that of course it’s going to increase the stats on injuries. I still feel like it’s one of the safest saws as long as attention is paid to the forces at play and keeping the parts you want to keep out of the plane of the blade. The blade is always in the same place and doesn’t move around, unlike a circular saw, reciprocating saw, jig saw etc.
Thank you for constantly showing us these, and other dumb mistakes *before* we make them. That timing is the most important part.
I worked at a shop that had a power feed. That was so cool. I cannot afford a power feed for my hobby, but it would be cool to have, and I felt very safe using it.
I remember my dad using his table saw in the garage to cut various pieces of wood. I don't think I remember him having any kind of fancy guard. I remember hearing him talking about basically this kickback, but I didn't understand it as a teenager or younger. I just know that I always tried to stand far away and not in front or in back of the saw.
Recently I've started using a circular saw to cut 1x4s to build a model railroad, but I'm getting to the point where I might want to use a table saw instead of circular saw. I've had decent luck cutting longer pieces of plywood (not full 4x8) by clamping a straight board and running right up against the side of the board.
I'm glad I came across this video in my suggested videos after a couple searches on how to use certain table saws.
With over 55 years of experience working with wood, I still have all my fingers. With that being said, I only had one incident where, while cutting a 45° angle where the cut-off caught the blade and came back hitting my right thumb, leaving with a slight cut and bruise. The reason why I stayed injury free? SAFTEY FIRST! The use of guards, whenever possible, comes first. All my tools and equipment have operable guards. Saftey glasses! Ear protection! Dust collection. Air filtration is always in working order before starting any project. If not, I order a replacement or find one that's in working condition. We are not like some of the amphibians that grow back missing parts..
Leaning from the back over a rotating saw blade. What a wonderful way to get disemboweled. We had an idiot at work always giving advice on things he had no clue about. This was the guy who tried to weld his broken glasses frames with plastic lenses left in. Also the guy who dropped a match into a closed steel barrel to burn off the excess fumes. Almost blew his head off when the lid went flying into the air.
Had you not said it, I would not have believed anyone could do such a thing. Well, what do I know. I'm still freaking out about the closed barrel. That's right out of a sit-com - with real world consequences.
Every time I saw him leaning down over the blade or demonstrating his hand being pulled through it the hair went up on the back of my neck. Huge yikes. I haven't seen anything so dangerous since Year 10 shop and young idiots misusing a bandsaw recklessly.
If you've got a blade guard, that won't happen, but it's still a tremendously stupid idea.
@valvenator
I had to laugh at the glasses frames welding story. I've never welded anything in my life and almost certainly I'll never start, but I did manage to learn, decades ago, about just how little heat it takes to melt plastics. Ye Gods.
@@agcons I did welding in my younger days. I decided that my lungs were more important that this skill. Welding is dirty work. Rewarding but really, really dirty.
Honestly, I am gobsmacked. I’ve been working in woodshops for 52 years, and no one has ever suggested pulling stock through from the backside of a saw. Catching outfeed from someone feeding the saw, yes. But that’s pretty passive.
I have had helpers I told to support a piece try it even after being told not to and also the occasional passerby that thinks they'll be helping when they weren't asked to
@@williamsmith9026 So the helper is supposed to just support the piece vertically to prevent it from drooping rather than grabbing on to it to try and pull it?
@DKNguyen3.1415 yes
English your second language?
@@williamsmith9026 no. Just unfamiliar with table saws and what someone might try and do around them.
Benefit of being a lefty. Im on other side of the fence on small items as that is the most comfortable to be lined up correctly
Good point, which I thought about watching this. How do you go with feeding large stock as he showed, do you have to do it cack-handed? I'm not left-handed but I imagine it would be easier for you to run your saw the other way (if possible) to be able to handle it properly for you on the left rather than the right.
I've been pushing left handed through table saws for over 65 years. It's worked safely and well for me.
@@BTimmer Same with this lefty; 45 years with two kickbacks that missed me and I still have all my finger
As a lefty, with large sheet stock I stand behind the piece that passes between the blade and the fence.
I’m recovering from a moment of inattentiveness that almost cost me my thumb. The blade had nearly stopped and I just lightly brushed the blade as I withdrew my hand from the cut and was distracted. I was shocked by how easily it went through nail and flesh. If it was still under power it would take the digit off in a heartbeat.
I didn’t use a guard because it was “just one cut”. A&E doctors said I’m not the first or last, so whilst it’s up to you please take care when making every single cut however you do it! These videos are invaluable underlining this without being condescending. Keep up the good work!!
It is always the outlier "simple" cut that's a life changer cuz it makes one complacent..
When I was in college, I worked in a furniture mill. For safety instruction, we would watch safety films that had been by the US government in the 1940s and '50s instructing how to use woodworking equipment safely. The techniques our handsome host teaches are entirely consistent with those films. Table saws have been in common use for more than 100 years. If pulling the wood through the saw was better than pushing it through, it would have been discovered decades ago. We all would have been taught that was the best way to do it. There's a reason why no shop teacher would ever teach students to use the saw this way, and for the same reason, no tables saw owner's manual illustrates this method as appropriate. The reason is that its unsafe.
Take it from someone who's run thousands of board feet through a table saw and has been responsible for teaching his crew members how to use the tool safely: If I had seen one of my crew use the saw this way, I would have severely repremanded him. Had I seen him do it a second time, I would have fired him immediately. My primary goal when I came to work each morning was to NOT take someone to the hospital getting their blood all over my car. Fortunately, no one was ever severely injured on my watch.
@@DKWalser any clue of the name of safety films?
@@zlocksca Not a clue. It was more than 40 years ago.
Ok
I remember those safety films. The guy demonstrating was always wearing a sport coat and tie. And the shop was virginal. I don't think he'd ever seen a raw board in his life.
@@mrcryptozoic817 Power tools and a tie... nice.
An excellent explanation, James, thank you. Hopefully this will give some viewers a lightbulb moment where they say "Ah, I get it now"...great.
But of course there'll still be those who don't listen or don't have enough brain cells to understand rational thinking.
But good on you, James, you've done your bit and made the point clear. Beyond that, if people don't want to listen, well let's hope they don't do too much damage to themselves or someone else.
WOW, VERY good info. I agree with you and I cannot believe some people actually suggested those ideas.
BTW, I bought 2 of those feather boards. Awesome extra hands. Basic table saw safety rules still apply for Wood shop.
I need to look into the finishing stuff, clean armor? I'll check it out. Thanks man.
As a shop teacher of 20 years who has taught countless high school students how to safely use a table saw, I CANNOT believe you even have to make this video! People actually believe those are the correct methods? Have they ever read or even understand the manufacturer's' instructions? No manufacturer in their right minds would ever recommend those methods for fear of being sued into oblivion! Thank you for calling this malarkey out! In all my time teaching young people to use a tablesaw, I can count on one hand how many times I've seen kick back in my shop, because there is only one way to do it safely.
Good video, James. Hard to believe some people criticize you for NOT promoting such poor practices. Thanks for sharing.
I have been lucky. I have had two kickbacks. Once being dumb, and once not realizing the poplar i was cutting had so much internal stress that it separated causing a pinch between the blade and fence.
The dumb kickback was a small board and barely bruised me thru the leather apron i was wearing, and the poplar kickback passed to my right side (i try to never stand in the line of fire) and imbedded the board into the wall.
After seeing your older video with the outside kickback i have been even more careful. (your video was the first time i ever even knew an outside kickback was possible!!!)
Wow as a new woodworker but an older man I’ve never heard anything so dumb . Thanks for always sharing such truly great advice and videos as always James. Keep up the great work.
Different techniques for different sizes of workpieces makes good sense. I never reach over the fence, and keep my body out of the way of kickbacks (which I rarely have). I did put the skiver back on, but not the guard.
The positioning you have out of the path of the blade makes the most sense to me, especially with larger pieces. The biggest thing anyone using a table saw needs to do is be aware of what they're doing, and be aware of what happens to their position if something unexpected happens (a slip, a kickback, etc).
That said, I will honestly admit that as a random DIY guy with a small table saw and often no outfeed table, I definitely have pulled large sheets through to finish a cut. Never to start, but to finish once well over half through. It can be done safely, especially if you aren't concerned about any accuracy flubs (but then to the fair point, why are you using a table saw?). Not that it's the point of the video, but I can't overstate the importance of outfeed support for large pieces, and for the DIYer with limited space and budget, adjustable/collapsible portable roller stands are an absolute must have to avoid awkward cutting.
I keep thinking “People can’t really be this dumb” but here we are… 🙄 Thanks for yet again preaching the (safe) truth, James! 👍🏼
True that. I can't believe a video such as this even needs to be made.
A rocking char that rocks sideways reminds me of the time I rode a carrousel that was running backwards. They did it for two days at Halloween. I can say I rode it but I won't ever do it again.
Bill
An excellent safety video! I'm a woodworker that has been doing it since I was 12 years old. Back then when I started, it was in woodshop class. Safety was always the first lessons we were taught in all of the classes I took. I value my hands and fingers as much as I do my own life, and can say because of my safety first practices, I still have all of my fingers and thumbs, in good working order. One safety rule I think should be rule number one in any shop that operates heavy and dangerous equipment is for visitors to the shop, as well as workers in the shop: Never do anything that can distract a heavy equipment operator from his or her work. It is dangerous to the worker operating the equipment, as well as the person that distracts that worker.
In one company I worked for, both I and my father were working in the company cabinet shop. Dad was the main saw man at that time. He was making a cut on the tablesaw, when a visitor walked over and asked him a question, while he was in the middle of the cut! It was enough of a distraction to cause him to lose a finger; his right forefinger to be exact. I saw it happen, and it was horrifying. Other members of our cabinet shop crew saw it happen also. Blood was everywhere on Dad of course but also on the man that had caused his accident, me as I was close by when it happened, and all over the tablesaw, wood and surrounding area. We who witnessed the incident told the plant manager the reason it happened, and that guy lost his job.
A few months later I was offered the supervisors position in the cabinet shop. I didn't really want it, so I asked if someone else could do it. They told me I was the best man for the job. I told them I really would rather keep doing the work of cabinet designing and building! They knew I was their best cabinet builder, so they made me Lead Man instead, and someone I trusted became my supervisor. The first thing I did as Lead Man was write safety rules for every station in the cabinet shop. Each station had many different rules that related to what was done at those stations, but certain rules were the same across the whole shop. Number one was my anti-distraction rule. No visitor was allowed to enter the cabinet shop without first reading that rule, and that included the company owner, the plant manager, all supervisors, all visiting customers touring the plant, and all employees, as well as myself! I was not going to exempt myself from following my own rules. The effect of having those rules posted was a much safer shop. The plant manager brought the company owner to the shop to read those rules. He authorized having similar rules posted throughout the plant.
Please do a video on the importance of an anti-distraction rule. It is my goal to help reduce injuries and possible deaths due to distractions! Your help in this would be most welcome!
Subscribing!
All correct. As you point out, you must have firm control of the board with your hands, with a push stick on small cuts. Holding the board lightly because you are afraid of of the blade is problematic. Another thing, you must be able to see the blade, the fence, and the board clearly, pushing from the wrong side of the fence is asking for trouble.
Interesting - I really had /never/ heard of the INSANE idea of hooking the board from the other side! Thanks for this, for those folks who clearly need to think things through a bit more thoroughly. The [few] times I have had a kick back have been typically when I was a bit too hurried to thoroughly think through the cut BEFORE doing it - e.g. looking closely at a board to see that the way is was milled, and the grain indicate it's likely to pinch when cut, and simply cut from the other side, or end to make it work better - even with a splitter. Or being aware that small pieces of a rabbet being cut loose are likely to slide [quickly] back at me, and position myself appropriately.
I really like this video. Just pinching the bridge of your nose for second and then sitting your audience down like a disappointed father, "ok... let's walk through what that looks like"
Keep up the great work, and that nickel plated Harvey table saw -- 🔥🔥🔥
Because I live in a flood zone I equipped my ground level garage shop with tools I can roll into our elevator and take to the second floor if necessary. My table saw is a 8-1/4” Skill job site which I’ve equipped with the 48” Bow fence extension with vertical feather guides you reviewed which greatly improved ease of use and safety. For cutting sheet goods I purchased a Kreg ACS track saw / table system with the folding wheeled stand.
A very simple alternative to having kicked-back boards punching holes through the wall behind is to make a ‘kick back catcher’; a frame suspending a piece of canvas or even lighter muslin coated with some latex paint between saw and wall to stop it. I got that idea because I’ve made my own painted muslin background for photography.
The only "pull" I have ever done is with large boards, but before you hate me, I do this with another person on the "pull" side, mostly to help me guide the board. Part of this is due to the fact that I, as many other DYIs, have a "portable" table saw that doesn't have the weight and stability of the large table saw you and other professionals typically have. I wish I did though...otherwise, I agree with your take 100%.
Hi James I’m not a carpenter but I enjoy your videos I have the following idea if the fence was made of tapered material would it spread the cut on the outgoing side thereby taking away any pressure on the blade sent from Chris in the uk
Thanks James. Good video. Because of my experience, I will continue to alert folks about Clean Armor's "satin" finish. YES, it's amazing how it cures in a couple or minutes (I'm currently doing an entire hardwood floor with it. But I had a very frustrating experience in applying their "satin" finish. To me, and everyone I've shown it to, it looks like gloss. Unless you want a pretty darned shiny finish, don't order the "satin" finish!
In 50 years of woodworking, I've never seen a "satin" as shiny as theirs. The solution might run you an extra $133.00, (plus shipping and tax) but you order their matte finish and mix it with the satin. I liked the ratio of 60% matte and 40% satin. THAT looks like satin to me. But ABSOLUTELY do your own testing FIRST! Great product, but very expensive to screw up with.
I once had a guy "catching" the wood on the other side of the table until he thought he should pull to "help me" guide through the cut - I thanked him for his thoughtfulness and chastised him for his actions - I had been explicit in what I wanted him to do but his good naturedness just couldn't stop. I don't have room for a drop off table so I went back to just dropping the wood onto a soft landing. Good guy tho.
I do use outfeed rollers for larger pieces and I can fashion a stable outfeed for plywood.
Thank you for another great safety lesson. Keep’ em coming!
There is no way the pulling the work toward you is a serious suggestion! Now I've seen it all. Stupid has no bounds. Keep spreading good sound and safe techniques. Love your channel
I have never seen or thought to try the two different ways you showed. And yes the best is kick back gaurd.
You are a genius if a wonky rocking chair is yer worst. Somebody get this man a sash and some medals… woods? Medals.
Great explanation on not using these bad ideas!
A good rule of thumb is: if you feel awkward using a power tool then stop immediately, re-evaluate the situation, and look for advice from experienced woodworkers (not from internet rando). Operating a tool should never be awkward. If it does then there's a safer way to do it that you don't know about.
1:38 made me feel pretty uncomfortable, even when the saw wasn't on... immediately gave me the "nope" feeling 😅 People need to watch this video if they're going to use table saw. Unless they want other bits than just wood flying around the workplace 😬
Thanks for the video James. Level headed as always. I will take all the safety videos I can get on this hobby/occupation of ours!
ALWAYS the voice of common sense and reason.
Watching you demonstrate these examples looks as hilarious as it is dangerous. 🇬🇧
Best move I made was learning to align my saw table to the blade. This allows me to measure from one of the table guides to the fence at both ends of the table. Previously I had just been measuring from the front of the blade to the fence, and from the back of the blade to the fence hoping this would have the fence parallel to the blade. That always seemed to be pinching the board I was cutting or seeing the far side of the blade having slop even though I was holding the board tight to the fence. When I aligned my table to the blade running the piece through the saw was much smoother and I never feel i’m risking kickback.
As always an informative video. Very curious about how you got the outstanding finish on the table saw. I seem to have missed the video of that process and it doesn't show up on your channel listings. Any info would be greatly appreciated.
The saw is nickel plated. It's an option Harvey offers on some of their new machines. It prevents corrosion. The internal cast components are plated too.
Not to mention, the stop button is usually a big, paddle shaped button that is easily pressed by your knee, and happens to typically reside where you would be expected to stand when using the saw in the safest manner.
As an added bonus - beyond removing the pinch factor - a riving knife keeps the back of the cut from twisting away from the fence and hitting the back of the spinning blade. I've seen people flip small pieces up and hit themselves in the face this way. No, I don't use a guard but I ALWAYS use a riving knife.
I used to teach table saw safety and approve this message.
Everything you said is true an not unknown to me as someone who has been woodworking since I could hold a hammer in my hands. Your advice should serve the newbies who have yet to had a kickback. Hopefully unlike a child who is told the stove is hot and proceeds to touch it, they take your advice wisely and don't "test the waters"
Yikes! Bad ideas are everywhere! Thanks for your info.
I will say (and please correct me if I’m wrong) I will sometimes stand sideways to the saw (with my right side facing the saw) as I make the cut. I’ve seen larger pieces kick back and go airborne at head height, and they also go up, and to the left side of the blade. Which would be where you’re standing
I know you use the table saw a lot in your vids, but there's a good case to be made for home wood workers using a track/plunge saw for most cuts. And only using the table saw
One method is to be cautious and aware. I work with metal since 1990 and had only minor injuries. Also i have both eyes, ten fingers and my hearing isn’t damaged. You can do it too, folks!
Every time you put your hand on that blade my stomach would give a little heave lol great video, thank you! As someone who is eager to keep all my fingers and limbs intact, I'm always looking for safety tips with the table saw 😅
55 years of table saw use. I you've done well here. I still can't believe the St-p-d things people come up with (some comments that TH-cams receive)