Ready for more Soulslike world design content? Check out my new video on the design of The Lands Between, from Elden Ring - th-cam.com/video/LvnlvB9n6ic/w-d-xo.html
I like the outro " It's a one off thing, not sure I'll revisit souls game again. Never say never but right now I don't want to" And then... E L D E N R I N G :D
@@BF1_enthusiast That's telling the player where they should not go, it's very different. 2 people started their own characters after I did and I had to guide them to the Burg, and even then I only knew about it because of Dunkey's videos.
@@Fishballs697 Yes, but's there's three paths and the correct one is opposite of where your camera points where you arrive and is often blocked by the walls of the Shrine.
You mention the feeling of being "homesick" in DS1 when you venture far from Firelink Shrine... Honestly I couldn't think of a better way to describe it. My first time playing the game I felt so much dread being so far away without having opened any shortcuts back to familiar territory. I don't think I've ever felt anything like that while playing a game before, and haven't since. What an amazing game.
STALKER makes you feel that way big time, and moreso than Dark Souls. Returning at last to a fire with fellow stalkers is a tremendous relief every time.
I think Miyazaki mentioned in an interview that that is what he was going for-he broke the world up into sections because of the limited hardware, that way loading screens were only when the player died/teleported
one of my favorite sections of dark souls 3 is the cathedral of the deep, the whole place has just one bonfire, but it has so many shortcuts and connected paths that really one bonfire is all you need, and that really reminded me of dark souls 1.
@@markdewinter1962 i knew about the rosaria bonfire even a year ago, but the path to rosaria is so convoluted and out of the way, that i didn't counted it, specially because there is no easy amd fast way down from it
One thing that makes the world of Dark Souls so believable is that so much is hidden, that you won't find everything. The sense that you haven't done everything there is to do. Because at that moment you reach the boundaries of a game and realize it's just a game.
This is something I used to love growing up on brick-hard 8-bit games. It was exceedingly rare to ever finish or see a whole game, so as a child your imagination just extends the world to infinity, and countless imaginings and urban legends grew to fill those fields.
So true. I always trie to "break" games, to exepose their linearity as a game. but in ds1 it took me about 40hours. This 40h were the best time i had in gaming ever.
Game design isn't art in the traditional sense, it's much more akin to architecture. You get great world design when you approach your levels like an architect, not an artist.
SuperButterBuns I’m mostly a sucker for the fact that you could fight The Taurus Demon, Gargoyles, Pinwheel, Sif, Moonlight Butterfly, Gap Dragon, or Quelaag after fighting the Asylum demon.
You should do a crossover with Mark brown sometime. I don't know what it would be about, but it would be hilarious. Maybe you could do a game design analysis of the procedurally generated terrain of Terra? (Edit: fixed grammar)
That elevator back to Firelink Shrine is one of my more memorable gaming moments. I remember being completely blown away when I realised how small and intricately designed the game world actually was. But more than that, Firelink in DS1 really does feel like home.
Fantastic video. The map of DS1 has always been the thing that stuck with me the most. It’s the reason I never completely finished DS2 or 3. I just never felt as invested or inspired.
pity. considering 3 is by far the better souls game. it does everything better other than level design and npcs. too many ppl seem to forget that ds1s second half also had the worst level design in souls history. nothing can compare to the shithole that is izalith and tomb.
AH silver are you high or something? Dark souls 1 is better then 3 in every way. 3 doesn't even have it's own lore it's just taking so much from 1 and giving more info on something that's it
Admyr 6 not in every way, but indeed it's better in execution, impact, and especially the world design. DS3 objectively have better combat and polish through out the game (compared to the obviously rushed DS1). Although my personal favorite is still Dark Souls 1 and Bloodborne (especially Bloodborne), DS3 is pretty underwhelming to be honest even with the improved combat, etc.
One of my favorite things about Dark Souls is that it teaches you to belong in its world. It starts off "hard" because you don't yet know the rules. And when Lordran kills you, it's saying "You're not one of mine. Not *yet*. Let me teach you." And through repeated efforts, it teaches you to understand itself. I'd argue that most of the things that feel challenging on a first playthrough are a cakewalk in successive runs. Lordran isn't trying to mess with you... it's trying to show you the environment you're looking to blend into, similarly to the clown fish/anemone interaction. Once it's taught you how to be a part of it, Lordran is a very welcoming world, and the magic of the first half makes it an absolute joy to explore.
I think a huge reason why so many people think dark souls is so difficult (it’s really not) is their mindset. You can either treat the game as everything trying to screw you over, being overly challenging and impossible to overcome and it’ll be the hardest game of all time. You wont learn anything and you wont improve. But if you accept death and learning from your failures, it’s a cakewalk
I just finished my first playthrough of dark souls remastered, and this is exactly how it was for me. I took a break for a few months very early only at undead parish, but by the time I got through blighttown something clicked and the world just started making sense. Can’t wait to get back to it for new game plus after a short break!
Seems a really long way around just saying 'trial and error', which is all it is. Great level design, stunning game overall, but it isn't the first, nor the last, game that relies on trial and error style learning.
I strongly disagree with your criticism of the Lordvessel adding late-game warping (while still believing that the lack of fast travel is essential to this game's design). When you get the Lordvessel, you are the furthest you have ever been from home, and you just faced the hardest challenge of the game yet. You're weary, weak and beaten dreading the long journey home after this gruelling challenge. At your lowest point, Gywenevere speaks to you like an angel from the heavens blessing you with the power to warp! It's one of the most sublime and cathartic moments in any game.
The only thing I could think when it happened was "damn, fast travel, well it was nice while it lasted". I wasn't happy or relieved, and even if I had been, that single moment isn't worth the loss of the greatest strength of the game for half of it to me. Still I overall love the level design. I'm sad it never got replicated in any subsequent From game. I would have been fine with the ability to teleport between Gweynevere and Firelink Shrine and leave it at that.
@@Arkayjiya I think I would have kept warping, I just would have limited it to: Anor Lando, Firelink, maybe the blacksmith's tower, the boss rooms for each of four lords (since they're mostly distant endpoints), the stone dragon (same reason, also, seriously secret, and it gives you an alternate to Queelag's Sister that's probably better than going through hell or Blighttown), the beginning and end points in Oolaciel, probably the painted world, and the Lordvessel itself for theme even though it's kinda pointless ^^.
I think you don't have it for the part where not having it is most important. All those places where you "loop back" to the Firelink shrine in the beginning. All of the places after that really are dead-ends, particularly because the way you enter the boss fights makes it almost impossible to backtrack (except Seath). But when I did my New Game+ I grabbed that Master Key and had an insane amount of fun being able to go *everywhere* else in whatever order I wanted. I can understand why backtracking is a bit of a loss but when you consider how often I had to visit the divine blacksmith (and farming titanite shards/chunks) ... it would be prohibitively painful to disallow it at that point and also kinda pointless without more interconnectedness of areas that lore wise really should feel as physically isolated as they do. Nito and the Bed of Chaos and the Four Kings and Seath should all feel like they haven't "seen" each other in thousands of years and that it's not trivial at all to get between their realms.
Funny story, when I played the game, I decided sometime after the Gargoyles (not sure when, whenever my Drake Sword stopped being effective at one-hitting enemies) that my "quest" would be to forge the greatest divine sword ever. A max-leveled divine Balder side sword (and later the same for the Claymore and Zweihander). That required getting the Greater Divine ember, which is, of course, half-way into the Tomb of the Giants. This was LONG before I had the Lord Vessel so I underwent the necessary trials of descending through the Catacombs, into the Tomb of Giants, suiciding to get the ember (after resting at the nearby bondfire) and then farming white titanite chunks down there until I had enough to max out my sword. Then I had to climb ALL THE WAY back up from the Tomb on foot. No warping. It left me with an incredible sense of accomplishment. But it was because I chose to "role-play" my character in that way and I was glad to do it. Would not have felt so good about doing that most other times. In fact, in most other cases, where I'm not farming, everyone on the way back would be dead anyway anyway so it would just be walking without a challenge. I think I *did* climb out of Ash Lake though, or at least tried.
I spent about 90% of my time playing the game without fast travel, and it felt just fine to finally get it, so I guess it's a matter of interpretation. I feel that, had I spent far less time wandering around and exploring before finally tackling the remainder of Anor Londo, it would still feel like just the right time to be granted fast travel. I do not agree with having it from the start, which is one of the reasons why I'm a little frustrated with playing Dark Souls 3 now, despite the fact that it's still a good game. I do feel that, based on what I've played and what I know about the rest of the Soulsborne series, that Dark Souls 1 still has the absolute best design, fast travel during the latter parts or not.
What I loved about dark souls was when me and my brother would play. Whenever we watched each other and saw something happen (like being thrown into the painting) to the other, we would always ask "How did you do that?" and the answer would always be "I don't know"
I didn't connect the doll with the painting on my first playthrough, and got so confused when I was dissed by the painting on my second. Felt a bit dumb when I later had the doll and it's description says, "drawn into a cold and lonely painted world".
some of my fondest memories are playing DS with my then boyfriend (now husband) and 2 roommates. One roommate introduced us to DS and we all got hooked. We'd all come home from work, sit down on the couch and watch each other play... we'd rotate who played each day. The amazing thing was that it was almost as much fun backseat gaming as it was to play yourself. Also I think less frustrating to have 4 heads rather than one in terms of getting lost
This has always been MY standout feature in Dark Souls. Not the difficulty, the skill you gain, the accomplishment, the great background story that can easily pass you by or the personal stories. This, the level design. It's the reason why if I could ever experience a game for the first time again, it would be Dark Souls. It's what inspired me to take the stray ways when walking through forests. Finding out where this path goes just to see that I know the place is an amazing feeling. One I first felt in Dark Souls and one I now seek over and over again in real life.
SimplyMav yep this was my favorite thing about dark souls too. I remember the feeling when I kicked that first ladder under the bridge and went down to the bonfire only to realize I was where I just was for the last hour and a half. It was so cool. And then the elevator mentioned in the video at the church, whoa that blew my mind
Definitely agree. It's a shame because in my opinion it's one of the only things missing from DS3, with a more interconnected world I'd easily say it's the best Dark Souls game. I forgive Bloodborne however as it's got so much depth to its themes, lores and semiology that I can forgive it's less interconnected world. It's also got some of the best local level design in the series.
Omg I forgot about the return to the asylum. I remember rolling off the elevator and just trying to jump off of every surface to get on the roof nearby. When I landed on that pillar I totally thought I had found something I wasn't supposed to, until I found items and the nest up top. I curled into a ball and nothing was happening, so I pulled out my phone and started to look it up when suddenly the crow came and picked me up. One of my absolute favorite moments in the game happened here, and I haven't ever heard anyone say they had this same moment: when you beat the asylum demon in the beginning, a dev note outside the door says "Good Job! Walk straight ahead". Okay so I forgot that this note was there and now I'm all fucking proud of myself for finding this secret, I kill the hollows, read the note, "Good job! Walk straight ahead". Oh man am I so proud of myself in this moment, even the devs are telling me good job, I walk straight ahead and fall through the floor and instantly get smashed by the secret boss. Oh man I laughed so hard, the devs fucking got me!
I like the shout out to The Great Hollow and Ash Lake near the end. These missable areas were my favourite places in the game. I couldn't believe that the game developers would hide the most beautiful part of their game.
My favorite memory in this game is due to the lack of fast travel. I went into the catacombs early and inadvertently got lost in the Tomb of Giants. That suffocating feeling of being stuck and afraid I might have to start the game over was the definition of immersion. It didn’t feel like my character was lost down there, it felt like I was lost down there. Had I been able to warp out I would have never had the chance to feel that same connection to the game.
Man, kicking down that ladder leading from the bridge back down to the bonfire in Undead Burg was one of my favourite gaming moments. The elevator back to Firelink Shrine then completely sold me on the world design of Dark Souls. Every new discovered connecting pathway was a thrill to find and as you said, thinking and executing optimal routes was a game in itself.
Same. Before I ever played the game I had read comments calling Dark Souls a metroidvania and thought "what? Isn't it an action RPG?" Then when I opened those shortcuts back to areas I had already explored, it all made sense. I think that was what sold me on the game and made the dozens of deaths I already had by that point worth it.
After dying a million times and having to run through all of those paths, you will remember it. You will remember it so hard you start to suspect maybe you child is gonna inherit that memmory thorugh your DNA.
I took a screenshot in my DS1 playthrough and someone asked me where in the game it was. I was able to tell them exactly where, exactly which enemies are nearby without having to look at my file because i died so many times getting to it the first time. That shit sticks with you, man
you mean he completely butchered it to the point where the word is misses parts as the letters frantically try to pull itself back together failing spitting itself out in a jumbled mess....ooo NASTY
I've just finished the game for the first time, agree with so much of this. Found the lack of fast travel irritating at first, but it made me learn to love the world and it's connections. It just feels so real. However I like that you get it after O&S - by that point you've made those journeys 1000 times, to the convienence of warping to some bonfires doesn't detract, for me at least. That said, I've played Bloodborne and Sekiro too, and I think those games do it well too, but in their own way. Sekiro is boss focused, so many easily warpable checkpoints is really nice. Bloodborne also has a lot of connections, and using the Hunter's Dream to warp emphasizes the importance of that otherworldly home world, which I love.
I did go to to catacombs on my first playthrough, realised im doing shit damage and i can't kill anything 😂 decided just to run past enemies activating the switchs and i died, back to firelink decided to go downstairs to new londo, couldn't hit the ghosts accidentally jumped into water😂, back again in firelink finally saw the path to the bridge and undead burge and i continued on.
One of the most memorable thing about Dark Souls for me is the hidden area, the first time I play it blind there is just sooooo much thing I missed But unlike most AAA game these days, the thing I missed isn't just small item or weapon or collectable stuff or side quest but a whole area that is just so big filled with stuff to do and interesting things to see, so my second playthrough when I look up all the stuff I missed my mind is fucking blown away XD I love it
I played the games offline for my first playthrough on each, and I had the extreme strange luck to discover the Great Hollow and Ash Lake on my own. It blew my mind.
I remember bragging to my best friend about how the entirety of the DLC "Artorias of the Abyss" can just... be missed. You could just never go there. Or worse, you could make decisions which block you from it (I think). I expected it would be like most expansion packs with a giant "Expansion Content HERE
4:15 "If you help out Solaire, you can skip the Demon Fire Sage and Centipede Demon." I think you mean, if you help out the Fair Lady/ Quelaags sister. Helping Solaire is another of the easter eggs you get after helping the Fair Lady
You can also kind of cheat the system by using the poison cloud spell and use it at the shortcut locked door. The poison will kill the sunlight maggot and Solaire will survive without you ever opening that door.
7:51 EXACTLY!, and that's why I'm very excited for Elden Ring, apparently that game is going to be an Open World Souls Game, imagine that feeling but amplified 100 times more. I can't wait to see what kind of open world Miyazaki and his team come up with. A harsh world where exploration becomes a conscious decision, a journey you have to prepare for. Imagine being deep into the mountains or a forest totally fucked up, begging for a bonfire or whatever it's going to be with you HP bar almost empty, regretting your decisions up top that point, thinking; "oh shit, should have took the other path, what the hell am I doing here anyway?, I'm not supposed to be here".
Based on DS3 I'm only expecting a game that's hard for the sake of being hard. I feel like Dark Souls 1 was lightning in a bottle they haven't managed to replicate. Dark Souls 2 threw off the beautiful world design and the series never looked back because people only really took notice of how hard the game is so that's what they capitalized on. Dark Souls 3 has just been a slog to get through and I didn't get very far into Bloodborne before I gave up on it. It's made me not want to try Sekiro and I'm extremely hesitant to try Elden Ring.
I think you missed a pretty big aspect of the world design. The creator mentioned several times, that he intended Dark Souls to be kind of like a children's adventure, that has to be completed together. That's why such a large amount of content is hidden behind so many layers, it's not meant to be played alone. The point is that gamers would converse and socialize regarding their experience, and find secrets together. It's sort of like a social adventure.
This was something I actually felt a lot playing Breath of the Wild. Because the game is so open ended, every friend I've talked with who's also played the game has had their own stories and tips about what they learned while playing. While walkthroughs and guides are wonderfully convenient, I've always found enjoyment in discovering a game alongside others. And when a game's design can encourage that it earns major points in my books. Of course there are ways to take this too far, but I'm sure you get the gist of it.
Except BOTW has nothing to talk about past the locations themselves and the fact that the world itself is so big doesn't make it feel like those are hidden places you missed but more like you just went in an other direction. BOTW is a good game with amazing exploration mechanics, but the world itself is shallow and I got bored of it after 10h :/ There's just nothing here to reward your exploration, I don't feel rewarded for going on my own path, hell ! If anything I felt punished because I just steamrolled every major boss in the game leaving a "that's it ?" taste in my mouth. I don't feel Dark Souls at all in BOTW, I don't even feel Zelda in BOTW ^^' For me this game is just a proof of concept, a statement about how games can handle exploration without handholding the players at every turn but instead giving them tools for them to plan their own trips. As a game it failed in my opinion, too many shallow mechanics that are either too easily broken or just terrible and the entire game is plagued with that durability system that sucks the joy out of any loot you could get out of your exploration.
" Except BOTW has nothing to talk about past the locations themselves and the fact that the world itself is so big doesn't make it feel like those are hidden places you missed but more like you just went in an other direction." You sound like someone that quit dark souls after the first area, never found anything secret, and then declares the game is super linear, has no secret areas, and is boring because there's only easy enemies. BOTW is probably the most Zelda Zelda has been for years, too.
Most BotW secrets are... what exactly? Locations referencing other Zelda games? Items that you can get from numerous other places? Afaik there's only 1 proper secret in the game and it hides the Hylian Shield.
Dark Souls has always felt like a Mix of Zelda and Castlevania to me. I know people will understand the Zelda, so let me explain Castlevania. I'm talking about the old school games. The combat of Dark Souls is far more complex then Castlevania of course, but I'm talking about how it makes me feel. Your attacks are very methodical in both games. You can't just go spamming attacks like you can most games, or you'll be severely punished.
Classicvania also has that perfectly placed enemy design that will destroy you if you just try to rush through the most obvious path. Add to that the slight delay and long wind up time on your whip, the slow and limited movement and the huge knockback you'd get from being hit by enemies and each level becomes a very precise and tactical gauntlet. Dark Souls (and also Dark Souls 3 and Bloodborne to some extent) is great because it managed to nail that same feeling but in 3D, with vastly more varied and complex combat and in a non-linear world.
That elevator from the Parish down to Fireink Shrine is such an impactful moment. I'm glad you called attention to it, I had almost forgotten how strongly it affected me the first time.
It’s interesting to note that the individual areas are somewhat linear in order to avoid confusing the player, but when you put them all together they turn into this sprawling metroidvania.
It's amazing how after just the first sentence you know what moment he is about to describe, just because almost anyone playing this game felt this sense of awe when finding the firelink shortcut for the first time
There is a game that took this inspiration. Ghost of a Tale is this fable like game where you play a mouse in a fortress and you are jailed. Truought the game, you will be finding and activating more and more and more shortcuts that you literally will feel like a mouse scampering around through every little tunnel that directly goes to the place you want. It blew my mind just like dark souls did with its shortcuts.
Ghost of a Tale is an incredible achievement considering the minuscule dev team. After having the chance of playing it, I wondered about how many similar great-though-underrated games were out there.
Love how after all you said, you ended the video with the elevator from undead parish back to firelink shrine, just like it begun, mirroring the way dark souls 1 connects the world. Genius writing.
4:23 You don't need the Master Key to skip Taurus Demon. You can go through New Londo Ruins, kill Ingward for the Key to the Seal, open the door to the Valley of the Drakes and continue from there as if you had the Master Key. Obviously not something a new player would do and it's definitely out of the way, but the game does let you avoid the Taurus Demon even with other starting gifts.
I genuinly think taurus demon is one of the hardest bosses in the game, his bridge is weird, you are weak, if your on first playthrough your about to be shot by archers. And to this day 5 playthroughs in i actually just have no idea how he works.
If you keep taurus alive for the first 20 or 30 levels of your playthrough, you can also reap the soft humanity that drops from killing specific numbers of undead enemies, something that only happens while the boss still lives.
I've never played Dark Souls. No idea why this showed up in my recommendations, but I love this video. You see I'm a D&D DM interested in making my campaigns more and more deadly and complex without sacrificing entertainment value so finding out new info on how to design an open world that is as deadly and complex as Dark Souls was a really good watch. Thank you.
I am a game design student. I'm looking for my first actual game to be an indie Metroidvania, and I am so very grateful for the information that you've provided with your bosskey videos on DarkSouls, Hollow Knight, Metroid, and Castlevania. Genuinely it helps so very much and I've been watching most of your playlist as research.
“In this point in the game you’ll have unlocked something very special!” Yeah! Feast your eyes on the big ol round bo-bowl… you get a big round bowl for bonfire warping… yeah. That’s what I was going to say too! That’s exactly what popped into my head when you showed Gwynevere. Her cool and useful crusty old bowl or whatever… On an unrelated note, the song Giant Woman from Steven Universe is stuck in my head… lol
15:50 keep in mind that Dark Soul is actually a unfinished game, lost izalith was rushed and that why the temple part before the bed of chaos only have those statue enemies. If I'm not mistaken, if you look down the bridge that leads to the fog of wall of the bed of chaos you can actually see a missing floor there.
As someone who played Souls series for thousands of hours THANK GOD for fast traveling, you might find it not appealing if you play it once and leave it but it would become a horrible chore if you need to travel by foot everywhere especially late game when the world becomes much bigger it would have killed replayability and pvp for a lot of people.
Yeah, as someone who has replayed the game many times I'm very glad it's not in from the start, but if you had to walk your ass from Nito's boss room all the way to the Duke's Archives I would have thrown my controller through a wall.
I totally agree with you, but I think Mark was suggesting to give players other paths to connect more areas. Unfortunately, as we all know, the last bit of DkS was finished in a hurry and released without the content that eventually found place in Artorias of the Abyss, so I think that is why "part 4", as Mark named it, may give mixed feelings.
I think an easy solution would simply be to only allow it in New game+, preserving both world immersion for your first 50-60 hour playthrough and ease of replayability.
I never realized the invisible wall, I thought I had explored the whole game, years later here I am watching dark hollow and ash lake, what a troll game I love it
The real troll move is putting the Great Hollow behind *two* illusory walls. My first playthrough I got through the first wall, and assumed that was it. It wasn't until my 2nd run that I discovered the wall behind the first wall.
Bruh literally the first second of the video, when I hear the music I felt I was thrown back into the firelink shrine and I can almost see the depressed dude sitting next to me
About the difficulty in the four lords act. I agree that the difficulty of the regular enemies is roughly the same for all of those areas, but I also think that most, if not all of them have some unique mechanic or obstacle, where your level doesn't matter much, that you have to deal with by figuring it out. If you don't do that, the areas will be significantly harder. Like knowing to use divine weapons to keep the skeletons from respawning. If you tackle this area as one of the last ones you will probably one-shot lots of stuff, but it is still going to be annoying if the enemies constantly respawn. Other examples would be: Finding/using the skull lantern, Bed of chaos being more of a puzzle(/luck) fight, ghosts in new londo ruins where you also need specific weapons or have to use an item with a time limit (albeit very forgiving), humanity draining attacks, Buffed enemies in the duke's archives that will hit hard regardless, and lots of other things like weird platforming that can influence an area. Just something I was thinking about around 14:45.
I would argue that the four lords difficulty will depend on build since each lord is kinda a build seath-magic nito-str four king- dex bed of chaos-luck
@@littlemoth4956 Seath & I killed each other simultaneously, which lead to the nightmarish task of navigating through the crystal caves to get the 70K souls and the bonfire. It was certainly one of the most intense moments of the game for me, though I'm not sure I'd recommend it.
@@littlemoth4956 really? I find seath the most difficult lord and the four kings the easiest. I didn't even know that more than one can spawn at a time until my fourth playthrough. I will say though seaths the first one i kill, and kings are the last so like arguably it could be how much stronger i am. But i kill the big dogs owner "the dlc knight guy" (the blades set you get by killing his follower is my favourite fashion souls set so i i like to get it asap) But yeh i think his probably the hardest boss in the game, save maybe manus but idk i beat manus 1st try but i also only have thought him once and it was in my big bulky plate armour and dragon kings axe (i think thats the item you get from gaping dragons tail) build. Aka easy mode.
17:53 *WRONG!* You can also roll to discover illusionary walls which doesn't degrade any durability whatsoever - which is what I am doing with any suspicious looking wall
Xrenyn the MusicMage Plus it's super cheap to fix your weapon. Very damage weapons only take about 200 souls to fix, while most of the time it will only cost around ten to maintain. With the repair kit, you can do it anywhere.
Wow Mark, I didn't know you were a giant crow (1:20). The way the world fits together like this has always been one of my favorite parts of Dark Souls, it's great to see such a well-done video on it!
When I was playing Dark Souls, I refused to fast travel, I always felt like I might miss something new in an area I've already been in, even if nothing new appeared, I still like to gather what I would considered extra souls while traveling to a new location, Sometimes I would farm the creatures in any new area I would find and learn the best tactics for me for clearing everything out, eventually using the many looped paths to farm souls until I ended up back to where I started, I'd rest up, and do it all over again, I really enjoyed Dark Souls, So much that I now get excited for and also look forward to any new game Fromsoftware puts out,
Just wanted to say that THIS is the video that finally made me give Dark Souls a shot a little over two years ago. Ever since, I've played 2, 3, BB, Sekiro, Demon's, and finally Elden Ring these past few months--all multiple times. What a phenomenal series
That rampaging feeling you felt towards the end of the game does make sense narratively. You are practically overcoming gods here and taking their power, after all.
A Link to the Past isn't the only Zelda game that uses that 5 act structure, though it is the only Zelda game that alternates between linear and nonlinear acts. Most other main Zelda titles (Ocarina of Time, Wind Waker, Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword specifically) follow an adapted 5 act structure that allows them to keep the gameplay consistently linear: Act 1: Frequent story developments at the start of the game. Act 2: Link is told to collect x number of maguffins to progress. Very little story development. Act 3: Frequent story development. Link encounters the main villain (usually ganondorf), and probably gets his butt kicked. Act 4: Link is told to collect x number of maguffins to progress. This is usually the longest act. Act 5: Frequent story development as Link re-encounters the villain and wins this time.
I absolutely love the world design. Getting through hell and back to find a gate, lever etc that takes to a part of the map that you didn't know was linked to. Fucking love it
@@africanspiritual101coner7 fr crazy thing is i have been near that area alot of times farming for shards i just never thought that there is a hidden wall with a whole entire area behind it. I accidentally discovered it when i was going to pee and put down my controller and i hit the wall.
Dude, I’ve played the game like 30 times over. It’s absurd. I always pay ash lake a visit for the Dragon Torso Stone, though (after I found the fucking place 600ish ours in).
This video is the single reason why i bought a ps4 a couple of years ago. Playing Dark Souls is one of the best experiences I had in video gaming, and I sincerly want to thank you for it.
For the 4 nonlinear bosses part, wouldn't it make sense to just scale them based on how many have been defeated? Like each boss has 4 potential difficulty levels, and whichever one you fight first gets level 1, the second gets level 2, and so on. Scaling to the player's level feels cheap because it devalues the experience and equipment you worked so hard for, but scaling based on how many bosses you've defeated doesn't have that problem because you can still be under or over prepared just like you would be with a linear progression. I've been wishing for a nonlinear Pokemon game to do this sort of thing or ages. There could even be a in-game explanation or it based on your badges.
But at the same time, if you encounter a boss that you can’t beat and leave it for later, coming back to discover it’s stronger even after leveling up from the others could be pretty discouraging. Having played through the game countless times, the four kings are my kryponite. Having them be tougher would suck.
That's actually in the lore, one of the manga's explained that gym leaders raise lots of pokemon so that they have some at the right strength to test any given trainer, and as even the early anime demonstrated, gym leaders can use any criteria they want to award badges. Not that that has come through in the games though.
The solution is simple but brilliant. Unfortunately it wouldn't really work in Dark Souls because I contest that the difficulty of the four Lord Soul bearers is flat- Nito's difficulty is dependent on whether or not you have a blessed weapon and his AI roulette, the 4 Kings are a literal DPS check, Seath is frankly too easy unless you go for the tail cut, and the Bed of Chaos is not only a puzzle boss for whom your level is almost completely irrelevant (apart from how much stamina you have to sprint with and how much HP you have to survive its attacks), it's a _terrible_ puzzle boss and the single worst boss in the entire franchise. Scaling the bosses based on how many you've beaten would only work in a game where they're perfectly balanced to all be exactly as hard as each other. Dark Souls is brilliant, but it's a rough diamond of a game (and it's common knowledge that the second half of the game was completely rushed to completion, hence the reason Lost Izalith is so utterly goddamn awful).
No, that would be terrible, "scaling up" area enemies and bosses as long you progress in story is the worst decision a developer can make to a game, because it take away all the feeling that you're really progressing and getting stronger at the game, because make you feel the game is stagnant, like if every area and boss had the same level
I love how you pointed out that “the depths” aren’t even that deep. Places like Lost Izalith, Ash Lake, and the Abyss are literally several times deeper.
I always thought the depths referred to the entrance to the deepest parts of the game since it lead into blight town kinda like youre standing at the top and this *gestures to big deep hole* is the depths -referencing the area all the way down to the bed of chaos.
Mr. Brown, I have watched this video just about once every month or two since I started DS1 last year. I slowly got into the game more and more and was officially hooked by the time I reached Sens. I beat the game for the first time today, and am feeling pretty accomplished, and also very excited for the other FromSoftware games I have yet to play. Thanks for such an amazing video.
First initial intro couldn’t be more true. Exact same experience for me. As soon as I took that elevator back down to firelink, I knew I was going to love that game. 10/10
Long Post Warning: Great game overall, thoroughly enjoyed myself and am glad I played it. Absolutely love the level design except for Lost Izalith lol. I thought the illusory walls were a major bummer, it's good that they are optional but in many cases they are extremely helpful. Hiding bonfires behind them should have been a no-no imo. Something I really struggled with in Dark Souls is not knowing where to go. I don't need a world map or a quest log but idk how I was going to find Blighttown, the Catacombs, or the Abyss without looking it up. The linear structure of Dark Souls 2 makes it much harder to get lost. While spelling everything out would ruin the experience the game is trying to deliver, I think this formation of the design is not very resilient to forgetting. Suppose at any point in the story, you put the game down for a year and by the time you come back you have completely forgotten what you were supposed to be doing. It would have been very helpful if Frampt or someone would have been available to tell you your high-level objectives and even possibly a hint on how to accomplish them. Something like "Gravelord Nito is buried beneath Firelink Shrine, guarded by his army of Undead Skeletons" or "One Lord Soul is sealed deep beneath the ruins of New Londo, in another world. To traverse from our world to the Abyss, seek the grave of Artorias hidden in the Darkroot.". My other issue with my experience was that for multiple bosses I found myself doing an extremely uninteresting and long walk over and over. I question the point of making the player do this. I'd rather have a boss fight that takes longer with almost immediate re-trying than to have to run past a bunch of enemies for 2 minutes (I found this particularly annoying for Nito, Gwyn, and Bed of Chaos). Most other bosses have some amount of walking but compare the distance to Gwyn and the distance to Quelaag or the Ceaseless Discharge from their closest respective bonfires).
It might just be the cost and time of designing such an interconnected world. Its really quite difficult to do a good job, and a large proportion of your consumer base won't care about it.
i think it's a mix, there are issues with the warp in ds1, the warp for a player are super convenient, which is why they are a staple after 1, but it sacrifices the interconected level design of the first, dark souls 2 doesn't have the interconection on the fist half of ds1 but people seem to forget that the hunt for the 4 lord souls are basically just how dungeons are designed from 2 to 3 since they are areas that are not connected to one another and enclosed on their own realms for the most part (considering New Londo a mix since there is no bonfire but there is access from 2 points once gates are opened), it's a pay off between being more player friendly, stream lined and basically better designed, since the biggest problem in dark souls 1 is the road towards the Lord Vessel and back tracking for points of interest (blacksmith, merchants, etc) at which point the warp transforms it and the rest of the levels into dark souls 2 and 3 broadly speaking.
Great video! I have to disagree with your assessment that it's a problem that the difficulty is "Flat" in the latter half of the game though. I'll agree that difficulty scaling is something that could be taken into consideration, but I don't think that doing it the Dark Souls way is an "inferior" approach. I'd call latter half of Dark Souls "The Mega Man Effect". When I first played Demon's Souls 9 years ago, it's actually a parallel I immediately made with this bold little PS3 game. I called it "The RPG Mega Man." After you complete the Intro stage (the first Boletaria Archstone), you're given 5 Demon Masters to choose from. Defeating a Demon Master gives you his soul, which you can then convert into a useful Spell or Demon Master weapon. You can then use this Demon Master Weapon against one of the other 5 Demon Masters (Including the one you unlocked in the level you were just in.) Obviously it's more complex than Mega Man, but I think there's a lot that can be learned from the parallel since Mega Man is a great example of the most basic form of this concept. In Mega Man, being faced with 8 robot masters to choose from in a blind run is daunting, and depending on where you go first it almost seems insurmountable. But finding that one level that clicks for you makes you just a little stronger with your newly obtained Robot Master weapon. After you breach that difficulty wall just a little, the game starts to unfold for you gradually until you've conquered the whole thing. Dark Souls (and Demons Souls) is the same way. If you ever find yourself in a situation where you're frustrated by the current challenge, you can choose to try going somewhere else and come back once you've obtained a new power, or maybe enough experience from the other areas. And, just like in Mega Man, on subsequent playthroughs you can challenge yourself by doing things in a different order - maybe even in the order that originally made you uncomfortable. This kind of design helps a lot with replay value, and even if you feel like the challenge is too small, you can choose to restrict how much you level up, or use builds that might not be completely optimal for the situation - again this is just like Mega Man and choosing not to use E-Tanks or running the game without using Robot Master Weapons. I think you're right that there is a risk that the game becomes boring as a result of the flat difficulty and reduced challenge with power scaling, but that certainly didn't happen with me when I played DkS the first time. If anything I felt relieved and powerful that I made it that far, contributing to the feeling that I overcame that "Prepare to Die" reputation of the game. A lot of great Metroidvania games have a similar approach too, and I think it's great. Hollow Knight is probably the best example I can think of off the top of my head. There's nothing wrong with the opposite approach like Axiom Verge's critical path forcing you to do all the bosses in a specific order, but I wouldn't write off "The Mega Man Effect" as an inferior design approach - just a way to invoke a different feeling or rational thinking process.
I still remember the time when I got cursed by a basilisk in ash lake and I had to walk all the way back to the undead merchant in order buy purging stones. That is one of the best memories I have of dark Souls.
I really hope Elden RIng continues to be able to provide the sense of mystery and achievement of Dark Souls 1. I love entirety of the soulsborne games, but just like you said, it has never been the same since Dark Souls 1. To me Dark Souls 1 is a masterpiece that i will always cherish. Since Miyazaki is spearheading Elden RIng, im really looking forward to its release.
There isn't really a lot to be spoiled. Even if you know the keypoints of the game, the big part is exploring the world, and there's all the hidden story through item descriptions.
I came across your Boss Keys series shortly before running my first D&D campaign. At the time, I wasn't sure how I was going to do any dungeon design, then I started watching through all of these videos...and your analysis of each one really helped me out. The first dungeon was simple, but started off with three possible paths, all of which were open from the start. The players could go any way they want. The catch with it was, the less you explored before find the heavy, locked door to the boss's room, the more henchmen he'd be able to call when you fought him. I used your discussions on branching paths and memorable things (in this case a much more menacing door) and made a fairly simple, yet successful dungeon. I also made a secret room behind a bookshelf (cliché but effective), the idea being that upon defeating the boss, the players would find a key to a lock from somewhere. If they did not discover the secret room, then a sense of wonder what it does would be instilled; if they did find the room, they'd come across two locked chests with no way of opening them. Finding the key would be the "Aha!" moment. And on a more video-related note, I'm so happy that you did a video on Dark Souls 1. I've drawn lot of inspiration for my writing and map designing from this game and love the feeling of being in such a large and connected world, the likes of which you don't see enough of. This feeling was lost in Dark Souls 2 with the multi-branch system that it did with the easy teleports to any bonfire.
I would argue that the vagueness surrounding the way to blighttown and the four lords was intentional, to make the community around the game more active, and they succeeded.
Ready for more Soulslike world design content? Check out my new video on the design of The Lands Between, from Elden Ring - th-cam.com/video/LvnlvB9n6ic/w-d-xo.html
I like the outro " It's a one off thing, not sure I'll revisit souls game again. Never say never but right now I don't want to"
And then... E L D E N R I N G :D
Ariamis? After all these years have i missed a section of the game? There is a painted world of Ariandel, laugh laugh laugh see what i did there.
"Dark Souls forgoes traditional map systems in favor of a different system, where, if you go the wrong way, you get murdered by 100 skeletons."
That's the game telling you where you should go next
@@BF1_enthusiast That's telling the player where they should not go, it's very different. 2 people started their own characters after I did and I had to guide them to the Burg, and even then I only knew about it because of Dunkey's videos.
I spent the first two hours of the game battling skeletons. Lol
@@Fishballs697 Yes, but's there's three paths and the correct one is opposite of where your camera points where you arrive and is often blocked by the walls of the Shrine.
The map of Dark Souls is just a Metrovania map
You mention the feeling of being "homesick" in DS1 when you venture far from Firelink Shrine... Honestly I couldn't think of a better way to describe it. My first time playing the game I felt so much dread being so far away without having opened any shortcuts back to familiar territory. I don't think I've ever felt anything like that while playing a game before, and haven't since. What an amazing game.
This is truly one of the most unique feelings of dark souls, which makes it one of the best game I have ever played in my life
It feels amazing to go back to a safe place, after all that suffering stronger, more experienced and with new cool stuff.
The first journey to the Depths is a true horror game
STALKER makes you feel that way big time, and moreso than Dark Souls. Returning at last to a fire with fellow stalkers is a tremendous relief every time.
you explained perfectly one of my least favorite things in Dark Souls 1. thanks, it'll help me vocalize it better.
"Amazing chest ahead. Try using two hands."
Ah yes, the thing everybody says before reaching Gwynevere
“Try tongue but hole”
"Try thrusting"
Try this. AVADA KEDAVRA!
‘Fatty’.
Its amazing that a game of this scale has no loading screens, impressive for a game from 2011.
(Except on death, but for there to be no other loading screens is incredible)
Well, long elevators like the ones in the undead parish and darkroot basin are actually loading screens in disguise
eh not that impressive gothic 3 a game from 2006 did it and has 0 screen loading
I think Miyazaki mentioned in an interview that that is what he was going for-he broke the world up into sections because of the limited hardware, that way loading screens were only when the player died/teleported
@@aligmal5031 thanks ali
one of my favorite sections of dark souls 3 is the cathedral of the deep, the whole place has just one bonfire, but it has so many shortcuts and connected paths that really one bonfire is all you need, and that really reminded me of dark souls 1.
Bro, it actually has two. Try finding Rosaria of the Deep!
@@markdewinter1962 i knew about the rosaria bonfire even a year ago, but the path to rosaria is so convoluted and out of the way, that i didn't counted it, specially because there is no easy amd fast way down from it
@@joster09 It takes like 1 1/2 minutes lmao.
Mark de Winter yh but in a first playthrough without a guide no one is finding her, well at least I didn’t
OXY I found the roof but didn’t know u could drop down onto pillar then drop onto random ledge that would then get you to the bonfire
One thing that makes the world of Dark Souls so believable is that so much is hidden, that you won't find everything. The sense that you haven't done everything there is to do. Because at that moment you reach the boundaries of a game and realize it's just a game.
This is something I used to love growing up on brick-hard 8-bit games. It was exceedingly rare to ever finish or see a whole game, so as a child your imagination just extends the world to infinity, and countless imaginings and urban legends grew to fill those fields.
Crowbar I got this exact same feeling when playing Breath of the wild. The world just seems endless and engaging at the same time
So true. I always trie to "break" games, to exepose their linearity as a game. but in ds1 it took me about 40hours. This 40h were the best time i had in gaming ever.
Verflixte Klixx you're right!
Game design isn't art in the traditional sense, it's much more akin to architecture. You get great world design when you approach your levels like an architect, not an artist.
I am a sucker for DS1 talks 10/10 good stuff Mark!
Good to see you here buns!
Hello lubricated bread
SuperButterBuns Fancy seeing u here I’m a bit late tho... 😔
SuperButterBuns I’m mostly a sucker for the fact that you could fight The Taurus Demon, Gargoyles, Pinwheel, Sif, Moonlight Butterfly, Gap Dragon, or Quelaag after fighting the Asylum demon.
Same here
been waiting for this one!
TierZoo, holy shit if it isn't my favorite runescape biologist! Love your vids btw
Love your vids man!
You should do a crossover with Mark brown sometime. I don't know what it would be about, but it would be hilarious. Maybe you could do a game design analysis of the procedurally generated terrain of Terra?
(Edit: fixed grammar)
TierZoo of all dark souls creatures?
my god this is the best cross over idea i've ever heard
That elevator back to Firelink Shrine is one of my more memorable gaming moments. I remember being completely blown away when I realised how small and intricately designed the game world actually was. But more than that, Firelink in DS1 really does feel like home.
God what I would give to be able to forget everything I know and just play this game blind again. No playthrough will ever be as fun as the first.
Trueee
Not sure if you already did, but play Demon Souls. It's incredible.
Yup. I wish this always. A sad reality. The first time can never happen again. Better than first time sex. True story.
I thought on my first playthrough that Sif was a required boss fight, long before I rang either bells. I... had a hard life.
If you have ds on PC, play the daughters of ash mod
Fantastic video. The map of DS1 has always been the thing that stuck with me the most. It’s the reason I never completely finished DS2 or 3. I just never felt as invested or inspired.
pity. considering 3 is by far the better souls game. it does everything better other than level design and npcs. too many ppl seem to forget that ds1s second half also had the worst level design in souls history. nothing can compare to the shithole that is izalith and tomb.
Hey hotboi
I know you
AH silver are you high or something? Dark souls 1 is better then 3 in every way. 3 doesn't even have it's own lore it's just taking so much from 1 and giving more info on something that's it
Admyr 6 not in every way, but indeed it's better in execution, impact, and especially the world design.
DS3 objectively have better combat and polish through out the game (compared to the obviously rushed DS1).
Although my personal favorite is still Dark Souls 1 and Bloodborne (especially Bloodborne), DS3 is pretty underwhelming to be honest even with the improved combat, etc.
"At this point of the game you unlocked something very special"
*Proceeds to show Gwynevere's amazing chest ahead*
I thought that’s what he meant 😂😂 then the text came up. Oh yeah forgot about that. 😂😂
Try tongue but hole
Try two handing
One of my favorite things about Dark Souls is that it teaches you to belong in its world. It starts off "hard" because you don't yet know the rules. And when Lordran kills you, it's saying "You're not one of mine. Not *yet*. Let me teach you." And through repeated efforts, it teaches you to understand itself. I'd argue that most of the things that feel challenging on a first playthrough are a cakewalk in successive runs. Lordran isn't trying to mess with you... it's trying to show you the environment you're looking to blend into, similarly to the clown fish/anemone interaction.
Once it's taught you how to be a part of it, Lordran is a very welcoming world, and the magic of the first half makes it an absolute joy to explore.
Lordran is trying to mess with you *a little* though haha
It starts hard and ends hard. Which is very different.
I think a huge reason why so many people think dark souls is so difficult (it’s really not) is their mindset. You can either treat the game as everything trying to screw you over, being overly challenging and impossible to overcome and it’ll be the hardest game of all time. You wont learn anything and you wont improve. But if you accept death and learning from your failures, it’s a cakewalk
I just finished my first playthrough of dark souls remastered, and this is exactly how it was for me. I took a break for a few months very early only at undead parish, but by the time I got through blighttown something clicked and the world just started making sense. Can’t wait to get back to it for new game plus after a short break!
Seems a really long way around just saying 'trial and error', which is all it is.
Great level design, stunning game overall, but it isn't the first, nor the last, game that relies on trial and error style learning.
I strongly disagree with your criticism of the Lordvessel adding late-game warping (while still believing that the lack of fast travel is essential to this game's design).
When you get the Lordvessel, you are the furthest you have ever been from home, and you just faced the hardest challenge of the game yet. You're weary, weak and beaten dreading the long journey home after this gruelling challenge. At your lowest point, Gywenevere speaks to you like an angel from the heavens blessing you with the power to warp! It's one of the most sublime and cathartic moments in any game.
The only thing I could think when it happened was "damn, fast travel, well it was nice while it lasted". I wasn't happy or relieved, and even if I had been, that single moment isn't worth the loss of the greatest strength of the game for half of it to me. Still I overall love the level design. I'm sad it never got replicated in any subsequent From game. I would have been fine with the ability to teleport between Gweynevere and Firelink Shrine and leave it at that.
@@Arkayjiya I think I would have kept warping, I just would have limited it to: Anor Lando, Firelink, maybe the blacksmith's tower, the boss rooms for each of four lords (since they're mostly distant endpoints), the stone dragon (same reason, also, seriously secret, and it gives you an alternate to Queelag's Sister that's probably better than going through hell or Blighttown), the beginning and end points in Oolaciel, probably the painted world, and the Lordvessel itself for theme even though it's kinda pointless ^^.
I think you don't have it for the part where not having it is most important. All those places where you "loop back" to the Firelink shrine in the beginning. All of the places after that really are dead-ends, particularly because the way you enter the boss fights makes it almost impossible to backtrack (except Seath). But when I did my New Game+ I grabbed that Master Key and had an insane amount of fun being able to go *everywhere* else in whatever order I wanted. I can understand why backtracking is a bit of a loss but when you consider how often I had to visit the divine blacksmith (and farming titanite shards/chunks) ... it would be prohibitively painful to disallow it at that point and also kinda pointless without more interconnectedness of areas that lore wise really should feel as physically isolated as they do. Nito and the Bed of Chaos and the Four Kings and Seath should all feel like they haven't "seen" each other in thousands of years and that it's not trivial at all to get between their realms.
Funny story, when I played the game, I decided sometime after the Gargoyles (not sure when, whenever my Drake Sword stopped being effective at one-hitting enemies) that my "quest" would be to forge the greatest divine sword ever. A max-leveled divine Balder side sword (and later the same for the Claymore and Zweihander). That required getting the Greater Divine ember, which is, of course, half-way into the Tomb of the Giants. This was LONG before I had the Lord Vessel so I underwent the necessary trials of descending through the Catacombs, into the Tomb of Giants, suiciding to get the ember (after resting at the nearby bondfire) and then farming white titanite chunks down there until I had enough to max out my sword. Then I had to climb ALL THE WAY back up from the Tomb on foot. No warping. It left me with an incredible sense of accomplishment. But it was because I chose to "role-play" my character in that way and I was glad to do it. Would not have felt so good about doing that most other times. In fact, in most other cases, where I'm not farming, everyone on the way back would be dead anyway anyway so it would just be walking without a challenge. I think I *did* climb out of Ash Lake though, or at least tried.
I spent about 90% of my time playing the game without fast travel, and it felt just fine to finally get it, so I guess it's a matter of interpretation. I feel that, had I spent far less time wandering around and exploring before finally tackling the remainder of Anor Londo, it would still feel like just the right time to be granted fast travel.
I do not agree with having it from the start, which is one of the reasons why I'm a little frustrated with playing Dark Souls 3 now, despite the fact that it's still a good game.
I do feel that, based on what I've played and what I know about the rest of the Soulsborne series, that Dark Souls 1 still has the absolute best design, fast travel during the latter parts or not.
What I loved about dark souls was when me and my brother would play. Whenever we watched each other and saw something happen (like being thrown into the painting) to the other, we would always ask "How did you do that?" and the answer would always be "I don't know"
I didn't connect the doll with the painting on my first playthrough, and got so confused when I was dissed by the painting on my second. Felt a bit dumb when I later had the doll and it's description says, "drawn into a cold and lonely painted world".
i live in north korea
@@OliverOcelot29 k.
some of my fondest memories are playing DS with my then boyfriend (now husband) and 2 roommates. One roommate introduced us to DS and we all got hooked. We'd all come home from work, sit down on the couch and watch each other play... we'd rotate who played each day. The amazing thing was that it was almost as much fun backseat gaming as it was to play yourself. Also I think less frustrating to have 4 heads rather than one in terms of getting lost
This has always been MY standout feature in Dark Souls. Not the difficulty, the skill you gain, the accomplishment, the great background story that can easily pass you by or the personal stories.
This, the level design. It's the reason why if I could ever experience a game for the first time again, it would be Dark Souls.
It's what inspired me to take the stray ways when walking through forests. Finding out where this path goes just to see that I know the place is an amazing feeling. One I first felt in Dark Souls and one I now seek over and over again in real life.
SimplyMav yep this was my favorite thing about dark souls too. I remember the feeling when I kicked that first ladder under the bridge and went down to the bonfire only to realize I was where I just was for the last hour and a half. It was so cool. And then the elevator mentioned in the video at the church, whoa that blew my mind
Wanna know why I'm a parkourer? There you have it!
skill, sense of accomplishment, background story and personal stories are all built into that solid foundation of great world desiign tho
Definitely agree. It's a shame because in my opinion it's one of the only things missing from DS3, with a more interconnected world I'd easily say it's the best Dark Souls game.
I forgive Bloodborne however as it's got so much depth to its themes, lores and semiology that I can forgive it's less interconnected world. It's also got some of the best local level design in the series.
In DS3 I tried to explore absolutely everything. I guess when I play DS1 I'll be at it for quite some time
"At this point in the game, you'll have unlocked something very special."
Me: Boobs
Video: Fast travel
Me: OH.
Amazing chest ahead
Yup. Same here.
Try thrusting but whole
Omg I forgot about the return to the asylum. I remember rolling off the elevator and just trying to jump off of every surface to get on the roof nearby. When I landed on that pillar I totally thought I had found something I wasn't supposed to, until I found items and the nest up top. I curled into a ball and nothing was happening, so I pulled out my phone and started to look it up when suddenly the crow came and picked me up. One of my absolute favorite moments in the game happened here, and I haven't ever heard anyone say they had this same moment: when you beat the asylum demon in the beginning, a dev note outside the door says "Good Job! Walk straight ahead". Okay so I forgot that this note was there and now I'm all fucking proud of myself for finding this secret, I kill the hollows, read the note, "Good job! Walk straight ahead". Oh man am I so proud of myself in this moment, even the devs are telling me good job, I walk straight ahead and fall through the floor and instantly get smashed by the secret boss. Oh man I laughed so hard, the devs fucking got me!
Er, no? There's a message on the ground for the exact same hole that says "WATCH OUT!"
@@protonjones54 that one is to warn you of asylum demon in the tutorial.... well, it depends on when you read it xD
I like the shout out to The Great Hollow and Ash Lake near the end. These missable areas were my favourite places in the game. I couldn't believe that the game developers would hide the most beautiful part of their game.
My favorite memory in this game is due to the lack of fast travel. I went into the catacombs early and inadvertently got lost in the Tomb of Giants. That suffocating feeling of being stuck and afraid I might have to start the game over was the definition of immersion. It didn’t feel like my character was lost down there, it felt like I was lost down there. Had I been able to warp out I would have never had the chance to feel that same connection to the game.
"Amazing video ahead..."
"Try watching..."
That's Nito
"Tongue like button"
Man, kicking down that ladder leading from the bridge back down to the bonfire in Undead Burg was one of my favourite gaming moments. The elevator back to Firelink Shrine then completely sold me on the world design of Dark Souls. Every new discovered connecting pathway was a thrill to find and as you said, thinking and executing optimal routes was a game in itself.
Same. Before I ever played the game I had read comments calling Dark Souls a metroidvania and thought "what? Isn't it an action RPG?" Then when I opened those shortcuts back to areas I had already explored, it all made sense. I think that was what sold me on the game and made the dozens of deaths I already had by that point worth it.
agreed. I was blown away when I saw that connection back to firelink while playing
After dying a million times and having to run through all of those paths, you will remember it. You will remember it so hard you start to suspect maybe you child is gonna inherit that memmory thorugh your DNA.
I took a screenshot in my DS1 playthrough and someone asked me where in the game it was. I was able to tell them exactly where, exactly which enemies are nearby without having to look at my file because i died so many times getting to it the first time. That shit sticks with you, man
That's kewl
That was a generous pronunciation of “Ariamis”
you mean he completely butchered it to the point where the word is misses parts as the letters frantically try to pull itself back together failing spitting itself out in a jumbled mess....ooo NASTY
@@jaygopinath1694 no? he just put the emphasis on the first i
I've just finished the game for the first time, agree with so much of this. Found the lack of fast travel irritating at first, but it made me learn to love the world and it's connections. It just feels so real. However I like that you get it after O&S - by that point you've made those journeys 1000 times, to the convienence of warping to some bonfires doesn't detract, for me at least.
That said, I've played Bloodborne and Sekiro too, and I think those games do it well too, but in their own way. Sekiro is boss focused, so many easily warpable checkpoints is really nice. Bloodborne also has a lot of connections, and using the Hunter's Dream to warp emphasizes the importance of that otherworldly home world, which I love.
Or you go to the catacombs as your first stop not realizing there are other paths, and spend an hour smaking your head against the skeletons outside.
Then people pick up the sweihander, turn themselves around, and easy mode their ass through the game
Struggling through the "wrong" ways was the best part of it all for me. Unforgettable.
I did go to to catacombs on my first playthrough, realised im doing shit damage and i can't kill anything 😂 decided just to run past enemies activating the switchs and i died, back to firelink decided to go downstairs to new londo, couldn't hit the ghosts accidentally jumped into water😂, back again in firelink finally saw the path to the bridge and undead burge and i continued on.
@@Rugg-qk4pl I mean, if you are willing to slog through the skeleton mosh pit so early on, you fucking deserved the zweihander.
"narrowly avoid getting roasted by a dragon" yeah right, like you didnt get immolated the first time through like all of us.
Liars love to say they don't died there
@@Raylightsen *Liars love to say that they didn't die there.
Fixed that for you
i hated that dumb bridge
Actually, I didn't die there, because I'm smart and I went another way.
Anindita Paul without the master key, there’s not another way
One of the most memorable thing about Dark Souls for me is the hidden area, the first time I play it blind there is just sooooo much thing I missed
But unlike most AAA game these days, the thing I missed isn't just small item or weapon or collectable stuff or side quest but a whole area that is just so big filled with stuff to do and interesting things to see, so my second playthrough when I look up all the stuff I missed my mind is fucking blown away XD I love it
I played the games offline for my first playthrough on each, and I had the extreme strange luck to discover the Great Hollow and Ash Lake on my own. It blew my mind.
Ragnar Skarpsvärd Excuse me but wtf?
@Australiantatious huh? Come again? Both bosses are non-optional
I remember bragging to my best friend about how the entirety of the DLC "Artorias of the Abyss" can just... be missed. You could just never go there. Or worse, you could make decisions which block you from it (I think). I expected it would be like most expansion packs with a giant "Expansion Content HERE
4:15 "If you help out Solaire, you can skip the Demon Fire Sage and Centipede Demon."
I think you mean, if you help out the Fair Lady/ Quelaags sister. Helping Solaire is another of the easter eggs you get after helping the Fair Lady
You can also kind of cheat the system by using the poison cloud spell and use it at the shortcut locked door. The poison will kill the sunlight maggot and Solaire will survive without you ever opening that door.
Also, even if you do help the Fair Lady, you do still have to fight the demon firesage.
7:51 EXACTLY!, and that's why I'm very excited for Elden Ring, apparently that game is going to be an Open World Souls Game, imagine that feeling but amplified 100 times more. I can't wait to see what kind of open world Miyazaki and his team come up with. A harsh world where exploration becomes a conscious decision, a journey you have to prepare for. Imagine being deep into the mountains or a forest totally fucked up, begging for a bonfire or whatever it's going to be with you HP bar almost empty, regretting your decisions up top that point, thinking; "oh shit, should have took the other path, what the hell am I doing here anyway?, I'm not supposed to be here".
Hope it's gonna release soon
So long as they dont rush it like Cyberpunk.... Id be glad...
Based on DS3 I'm only expecting a game that's hard for the sake of being hard. I feel like Dark Souls 1 was lightning in a bottle they haven't managed to replicate. Dark Souls 2 threw off the beautiful world design and the series never looked back because people only really took notice of how hard the game is so that's what they capitalized on. Dark Souls 3 has just been a slog to get through and I didn't get very far into Bloodborne before I gave up on it. It's made me not want to try Sekiro and I'm extremely hesitant to try Elden Ring.
its released now,did you try it ?
@@shaikmansoorahamed2293 it sucks
"Boss Keys" is an amazing series, "Dark Souls" an amazing game and Mark Brown an amazing YT channel
I think you missed a pretty big aspect of the world design. The creator mentioned several times, that he intended Dark Souls to be kind of like a children's adventure, that has to be completed together. That's why such a large amount of content is hidden behind so many layers, it's not meant to be played alone. The point is that gamers would converse and socialize regarding their experience, and find secrets together. It's sort of like a social adventure.
This was something I actually felt a lot playing Breath of the Wild. Because the game is so open ended, every friend I've talked with who's also played the game has had their own stories and tips about what they learned while playing.
While walkthroughs and guides are wonderfully convenient, I've always found enjoyment in discovering a game alongside others. And when a game's design can encourage that it earns major points in my books.
Of course there are ways to take this too far, but I'm sure you get the gist of it.
Except BOTW has nothing to talk about past the locations themselves and the fact that the world itself is so big doesn't make it feel like those are hidden places you missed but more like you just went in an other direction.
BOTW is a good game with amazing exploration mechanics, but the world itself is shallow and I got bored of it after 10h :/
There's just nothing here to reward your exploration, I don't feel rewarded for going on my own path, hell ! If anything I felt punished because I just steamrolled every major boss in the game leaving a "that's it ?" taste in my mouth.
I don't feel Dark Souls at all in BOTW, I don't even feel Zelda in BOTW ^^'
For me this game is just a proof of concept, a statement about how games can handle exploration without handholding the players at every turn but instead giving them tools for them to plan their own trips.
As a game it failed in my opinion, too many shallow mechanics that are either too easily broken or just terrible and the entire game is plagued with that durability system that sucks the joy out of any loot you could get out of your exploration.
" Except BOTW has nothing to talk about past the locations themselves and the fact that the world itself is so big doesn't make it feel like those are hidden places you missed but more like you just went in an other direction."
You sound like someone that quit dark souls after the first area, never found anything secret, and then declares the game is super linear, has no secret areas, and is boring because there's only easy enemies.
BOTW is probably the most Zelda Zelda has been for years, too.
Most BotW secrets are... what exactly? Locations referencing other Zelda games? Items that you can get from numerous other places? Afaik there's only 1 proper secret in the game and it hides the Hylian Shield.
@@fy8798 wait, how does him talking down on zelda make it sound like he quit dark souls? Im lost
Dark Souls has always felt like a Mix of Zelda and Castlevania to me.
I know people will understand the Zelda, so let me explain Castlevania. I'm talking about the old school games. The combat of Dark Souls is far more complex then Castlevania of course, but I'm talking about how it makes me feel. Your attacks are very methodical in both games. You can't just go spamming attacks like you can most games, or you'll be severely punished.
check out Super Ghouls n Ghosts too
Xearrik Gaming Dark Souls basically feels like a modern version of retro video games like those.
and Diablo
Dark Souls is also some kind of Metroidvania. :-)
Classicvania also has that perfectly placed enemy design that will destroy you if you just try to rush through the most obvious path. Add to that the slight delay and long wind up time on your whip, the slow and limited movement and the huge knockback you'd get from being hit by enemies and each level becomes a very precise and tactical gauntlet. Dark Souls (and also Dark Souls 3 and Bloodborne to some extent) is great because it managed to nail that same feeling but in 3D, with vastly more varied and complex combat and in a non-linear world.
That elevator from the Parish down to Fireink Shrine is such an impactful moment. I'm glad you called attention to it, I had almost forgotten how strongly it affected me the first time.
game looks cool
Fancy meeting you here.
Are you remastering your dark souls top 10 stones videos or top 10 dark souls remastered stones?
*Insert top 10 *insert concept* list*
gee i wonder why indeimaus of all people would say that
Are you gonna make videos about it?
You my sir, are in a lot of really good videos. Im just passing by to let you know that you seem to have really good taste ;)
Your videos are so in depth, it's rare to find someone that disects a game the way you do. Keep it up
UnicornForce check out Matthewmatosis' channel, he did a 6 hour review of this game
It’s interesting to note that the individual areas are somewhat linear in order to avoid confusing the player, but when you put them all together they turn into this sprawling metroidvania.
I remember watching this video and having to stop watching so I could play this game, beat it, and then come back to watcg
It's amazing how after just the first sentence you know what moment he is about to describe, just because almost anyone playing this game felt this sense of awe when finding the firelink shortcut for the first time
"Gravelord Nito in the Valley of the Giants"
Literally unwatchable.
lolllll
It's such a traumatic zone to explore, obviously his memory is a bit hazy. No big deal.
Lmaoooo
Not to mention "Deeproot Basin"
I'm Imagining the eagle just dropping off Nito instead of The Pursuer.
There is a game that took this inspiration. Ghost of a Tale is this fable like game where you play a mouse in a fortress and you are jailed. Truought the game, you will be finding and activating more and more and more shortcuts that you literally will feel like a mouse scampering around through every little tunnel that directly goes to the place you want. It blew my mind just like dark souls did with its shortcuts.
Ghost of a Tale is an incredible achievement considering the minuscule dev team.
After having the chance of playing it, I wondered about how many similar great-though-underrated games were out there.
Is this the Dark Souls of Boss Keys videos?
It's the Boss Key of Dark Souls videos
Queque technically correct
I think that Dark Souls is the Dark Souls of the SoulsBorne games.
AdalRoderick
I think SoulsBorne is Zelda 2 of Zelda clones.
I’ll see myself out. 😁🔫
DaedricSheep Verily
Love how after all you said, you ended the video with the elevator from undead parish back to firelink shrine, just like it begun, mirroring the way dark souls 1 connects the world. Genius writing.
4:23 You don't need the Master Key to skip Taurus Demon. You can go through New Londo Ruins, kill Ingward for the Key to the Seal, open the door to the Valley of the Drakes and continue from there as if you had the Master Key. Obviously not something a new player would do and it's definitely out of the way, but the game does let you avoid the Taurus Demon even with other starting gifts.
Damn imagine hating Taurus demon so much you do all this shit :DD
@@jakubsvoboda7644 I think is usually to leave the area as a Pvp place, since the enemies can be easily killed and can fight uninterrupted
I genuinly think taurus demon is one of the hardest bosses in the game, his bridge is weird, you are weak, if your on first playthrough your about to be shot by archers. And to this day 5 playthroughs in i actually just have no idea how he works.
If you keep taurus alive for the first 20 or 30 levels of your playthrough, you can also reap the soft humanity that drops from killing specific numbers of undead enemies, something that only happens while the boss still lives.
@@MetalSolidCrisis meh, i have never had a issue with humanity, i usually end up just selling them to frampt.
I've never played Dark Souls. No idea why this showed up in my recommendations, but I love this video. You see I'm a D&D DM interested in making my campaigns more and more deadly and complex without sacrificing entertainment value so finding out new info on how to design an open world that is as deadly and complex as Dark Souls was a really good watch.
Thank you.
I am a game design student. I'm looking for my first actual game to be an indie Metroidvania, and I am so very grateful for the information that you've provided with your bosskey videos on DarkSouls, Hollow Knight, Metroid, and Castlevania. Genuinely it helps so very much and I've been watching most of your playlist as research.
BOSS KEYS VOL 2 BABYYY
the dark souls of comebacks
gay
“In this point in the game you’ll have unlocked something very special!”
Yeah! Feast your eyes on the big ol round bo-bowl… you get a big round bowl for bonfire warping… yeah. That’s what I was going to say too! That’s exactly what popped into my head when you showed Gwynevere. Her cool and useful crusty old bowl or whatever…
On an unrelated note, the song Giant Woman from Steven Universe is stuck in my head… lol
15:50 keep in mind that Dark Soul is actually a unfinished game, lost izalith was rushed and that why the temple part before the bed of chaos only have those statue enemies.
If I'm not mistaken, if you look down the bridge that leads to the fog of wall of the bed of chaos you can actually see a missing floor there.
Thank you! This part of DS1 is so often overlooked, yet adds so much to the game feel.
As someone who played Souls series for thousands of hours THANK GOD for fast traveling, you might find it not appealing if you play it once and leave it but it would become a horrible chore if you need to travel by foot everywhere especially late game when the world becomes much bigger it would have killed replayability and pvp for a lot of people.
Yeah, as someone who has replayed the game many times I'm very glad it's not in from the start, but if you had to walk your ass from Nito's boss room all the way to the Duke's Archives I would have thrown my controller through a wall.
Finally someone said it
I totally agree with you, but I think Mark was suggesting to give players other paths to connect more areas. Unfortunately, as we all know, the last bit of DkS was finished in a hurry and released without the content that eventually found place in Artorias of the Abyss, so I think that is why "part 4", as Mark named it, may give mixed feelings.
I think an easy solution would simply be to only allow it in New game+, preserving both world immersion for your first 50-60 hour playthrough and ease of replayability.
Yeah, I personally think that the game gives you fast travel almost at the perfect moment. It's a bit annoying prior to it, but only just.
I'm not even going to lie I sub to your channel months ago waiting for the day that you would upload this video
I never realized the invisible wall, I thought I had explored the whole game, years later here I am watching dark hollow and ash lake, what a troll game I love it
The real troll move is putting the Great Hollow behind *two* illusory walls. My first playthrough I got through the first wall, and assumed that was it. It wasn't until my 2nd run that I discovered the wall behind the first wall.
Bruh literally the first second of the video, when I hear the music I felt I was thrown back into the firelink shrine and I can almost see the depressed dude sitting next to me
About the difficulty in the four lords act. I agree that the difficulty of the regular enemies is roughly the same for all of those areas, but I also think that most, if not all of them have some unique mechanic or obstacle, where your level doesn't matter much, that you have to deal with by figuring it out. If you don't do that, the areas will be significantly harder. Like knowing to use divine weapons to keep the skeletons from respawning. If you tackle this area as one of the last ones you will probably one-shot lots of stuff, but it is still going to be annoying if the enemies constantly respawn. Other examples would be: Finding/using the skull lantern, Bed of chaos being more of a puzzle(/luck) fight, ghosts in new londo ruins where you also need specific weapons or have to use an item with a time limit (albeit very forgiving), humanity draining attacks, Buffed enemies in the duke's archives that will hit hard regardless, and lots of other things like weird platforming that can influence an area.
Just something I was thinking about around 14:45.
I would argue that the four lords difficulty will depend on build since each lord is kinda a build seath-magic nito-str four king- dex bed of chaos-luck
2:25... Valley of the Giants... VALLEY OF THE GIANTS!!! An impostor, get him!
oh gawd he did said that
He also said "Moonlit Butterfly"
Nagini, dinner.
@@lordvoldemort8742 Abraca Dabra. There, I used the killing curse.
@@aninditapaul9291 Avada kedavra
"all of the lords are equal in difficulty" *Laughs in 4 kings
Without poise they are harder than Seath.
4 kings were super easy, and seath was aswell, that skeleton dude was the hardest one for me, I dropped the game before I could beat him
@@theblancmange1265 With/without poise they are difficult as shit. Almost everyone killed Seath on their first try.
@@littlemoth4956 Seath & I killed each other simultaneously, which lead to the nightmarish task of navigating through the crystal caves to get the 70K souls and the bonfire. It was certainly one of the most intense moments of the game for me, though I'm not sure I'd recommend it.
@@littlemoth4956 really? I find seath the most difficult lord and the four kings the easiest.
I didn't even know that more than one can spawn at a time until my fourth playthrough.
I will say though seaths the first one i kill, and kings are the last so like arguably it could be how much stronger i am. But i kill the big dogs owner "the dlc knight guy" (the blades set you get by killing his follower is my favourite fashion souls set so i i like to get it asap)
But yeh i think his probably the hardest boss in the game, save maybe manus but idk i beat manus 1st try but i also only have thought him once and it was in my big bulky plate armour and dragon kings axe (i think thats the item you get from gaping dragons tail) build. Aka easy mode.
The Dark Souls theme which played right at the start threw me back countless years of blood, sweat and dedication to what is my favourite series.
The feeling of returning back to firelink shrine really amazes me how I always come back to firelink shrine when looping around the world
Valley of the Giants
ok you have 53% of my attention just because its dark souls
Boss Keys for Dark Souls?
A surprise to be sure, but a welcome one.
Don Billbo Hello there!
oaa2288 General Kenobi
Don Billbo you are a bold one.
17:53 *WRONG!* You can also roll to discover illusionary walls which doesn't degrade any durability whatsoever - which is what I am doing with any suspicious looking wall
Xrenyn the MusicMage
Plus it's super cheap to fix your weapon. Very damage weapons only take about 200 souls to fix, while most of the time it will only cost around ten to maintain. With the repair kit, you can do it anywhere.
Except for one in Sen's Fortress that can't be discovered by rolling. I only found out that rolls don't work on it yesterday.
There's one in Sen's Fortress? Maybe that's why I didn't find it XD
Weapon durability is a complete non issue in dark souls tbh.
... unless you are using crystal weapons :/
Also the crystalline armour gets a few thousand souls expensive if you get hit by an acid attack, so...
World design is what kept me coming back in From Software's games! ✨ thanks for this amazing upload! 😊❤️
Wow Mark, I didn't know you were a giant crow (1:20). The way the world fits together like this has always been one of my favorite parts of Dark Souls, it's great to see such a well-done video on it!
When I was playing Dark Souls, I refused to fast travel, I always felt like I might miss something new in an area I've already been in, even if nothing new appeared, I still like to gather what I would considered extra souls while traveling to a new location, Sometimes I would farm the creatures in any new area I would find and learn the best tactics for me for clearing everything out, eventually using the many looped paths to farm souls until I ended up back to where I started, I'd rest up, and do it all over again, I really enjoyed Dark Souls, So much that I now get excited for and also look forward to any new game Fromsoftware puts out,
18:00 You can actually dodge roll through illusory walls.
Some of them, others, like the one in Sen’s fortress, that has to be attacked.
DARK SOULS BOSS KEYS?! MY LIFE IS COMPLETE
Just wanted to say that THIS is the video that finally made me give Dark Souls a shot a little over two years ago. Ever since, I've played 2, 3, BB, Sekiro, Demon's, and finally Elden Ring these past few months--all multiple times. What a phenomenal series
That rampaging feeling you felt towards the end of the game does make sense narratively. You are practically overcoming gods here and taking their power, after all.
A Link to the Past isn't the only Zelda game that uses that 5 act structure, though it is the only Zelda game that alternates between linear and nonlinear acts. Most other main Zelda titles (Ocarina of Time, Wind Waker, Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword specifically) follow an adapted 5 act structure that allows them to keep the gameplay consistently linear:
Act 1: Frequent story developments at the start of the game.
Act 2: Link is told to collect x number of maguffins to progress. Very little story development.
Act 3: Frequent story development. Link encounters the main villain (usually ganondorf), and probably gets his butt kicked.
Act 4: Link is told to collect x number of maguffins to progress. This is usually the longest act.
Act 5: Frequent story development as Link re-encounters the villain and wins this time.
That joke at 4:24 is sooo under appreciated lol
This is the first time I've ever heard someone critique DS for the bosses not being hard enough
Pinwheel
Tbh
After you get used to the game
The bosses are a joke except the dlc
So now I got to a point when I tell people your channel is the best on TH-cam but deep down I know it's actually the best thing on the internet.
I absolutely love the world design. Getting through hell and back to find a gate, lever etc that takes to a part of the map that you didn't know was linked to. Fucking love it
*how Dark Souls has even more in common with Zelda than you might think*
Me: Other than a silent MC that smashes pots???
Crazy how im at my 9th playthrough when i discovered the "Great hollow" and "Ash lake'
No way bruh 😧😧
@@africanspiritual101coner7 fr crazy thing is i have been near that area alot of times farming for shards i just never thought that there is a hidden wall with a whole entire area behind it. I accidentally discovered it when i was going to pee and put down my controller and i hit the wall.
@@ergicgaming1618 yeah Blighttown is already a dangerous area nobody wants to visit more than twice, so it's easy to miss the great hollow.
Dude, I’ve played the game like 30 times over. It’s absurd. I always pay ash lake a visit for the Dragon Torso Stone, though (after I found the fucking place 600ish ours in).
RIP Kentaro Miura
i'm happy that i watched tutorials on the internet and not torchered myself with these imposdible to find out secrets
This video is the single reason why i bought a ps4 a couple of years ago. Playing Dark Souls is one of the best experiences I had in video gaming, and I sincerly want to thank you for it.
If you kill Priscilla, you have no soul.
Wait why (X I also do for the XP
@@NRGsensation Congratulations you have a killed an innocent child.
@@cj1535 🤣 also the lifehunt Scythe 😁(if you trade her soul)
For the 4 nonlinear bosses part, wouldn't it make sense to just scale them based on how many have been defeated? Like each boss has 4 potential difficulty levels, and whichever one you fight first gets level 1, the second gets level 2, and so on. Scaling to the player's level feels cheap because it devalues the experience and equipment you worked so hard for, but scaling based on how many bosses you've defeated doesn't have that problem because you can still be under or over prepared just like you would be with a linear progression.
I've been wishing for a nonlinear Pokemon game to do this sort of thing or ages. There could even be a in-game explanation or it based on your badges.
But at the same time, if you encounter a boss that you can’t beat and leave it for later, coming back to discover it’s stronger even after leveling up from the others could be pretty discouraging. Having played through the game countless times, the four kings are my kryponite. Having them be tougher would suck.
That's actually in the lore, one of the manga's explained that gym leaders raise lots of pokemon so that they have some at the right strength to test any given trainer, and as even the early anime demonstrated, gym leaders can use any criteria they want to award badges. Not that that has come through in the games though.
The solution is simple but brilliant. Unfortunately it wouldn't really work in Dark Souls because I contest that the difficulty of the four Lord Soul bearers is flat- Nito's difficulty is dependent on whether or not you have a blessed weapon and his AI roulette, the 4 Kings are a literal DPS check, Seath is frankly too easy unless you go for the tail cut, and the Bed of Chaos is not only a puzzle boss for whom your level is almost completely irrelevant (apart from how much stamina you have to sprint with and how much HP you have to survive its attacks), it's a _terrible_ puzzle boss and the single worst boss in the entire franchise. Scaling the bosses based on how many you've beaten would only work in a game where they're perfectly balanced to all be exactly as hard as each other. Dark Souls is brilliant, but it's a rough diamond of a game (and it's common knowledge that the second half of the game was completely rushed to completion, hence the reason Lost Izalith is so utterly goddamn awful).
No, that would be terrible, "scaling up" area enemies and bosses as long you progress in story is the worst decision a developer can make to a game, because it take away all the feeling that you're really progressing and getting stronger at the game, because make you feel the game is stagnant, like if every area and boss had the same level
I know that I'm late for the party, but the pokémon crystal clear rom hack does exactly what you are talking about, if you still are into it.
I love how you pointed out that “the depths” aren’t even that deep. Places like Lost Izalith, Ash Lake, and the Abyss are literally several times deeper.
Randall Clark yeah I’m pretty sure that’s correct.
I always thought the depths referred to the entrance to the deepest parts of the game since it lead into blight town kinda like youre standing at the top and this *gestures to big deep hole* is the depths -referencing the area all the way down to the bed of chaos.
Mogreturns possibly, but you don’t even necessarily need to step foot in the depths to access blight town and below.
Mr. Brown, I have watched this video just about once every month or two since I started DS1 last year. I slowly got into the game more and more and was officially hooked by the time I reached Sens. I beat the game for the first time today, and am feeling pretty accomplished, and also very excited for the other FromSoftware games I have yet to play. Thanks for such an amazing video.
First initial intro couldn’t be more true. Exact same experience for me. As soon as I took that elevator back down to firelink, I knew I was going to love that game. 10/10
I love your uploads so muchhhhh
12:34 "Amazing chest ahead"
Long Post Warning: Great game overall, thoroughly enjoyed myself and am glad I played it. Absolutely love the level design except for Lost Izalith lol.
I thought the illusory walls were a major bummer, it's good that they are optional but in many cases they are extremely helpful. Hiding bonfires behind them should have been a no-no imo.
Something I really struggled with in Dark Souls is not knowing where to go. I don't need a world map or a quest log but idk how I was going to find Blighttown, the Catacombs, or the Abyss without looking it up. The linear structure of Dark Souls 2 makes it much harder to get lost.
While spelling everything out would ruin the experience the game is trying to deliver, I think this formation of the design is not very resilient to forgetting. Suppose at any point in the story, you put the game down for a year and by the time you come back you have completely forgotten what you were supposed to be doing. It would have been very helpful if Frampt or someone would have been available to tell you your high-level objectives and even possibly a hint on how to accomplish them. Something like "Gravelord Nito is buried beneath Firelink Shrine, guarded by his army of Undead Skeletons" or "One Lord Soul is sealed deep beneath the ruins of New Londo, in another world. To traverse from our world to the Abyss, seek the grave of Artorias hidden in the Darkroot.".
My other issue with my experience was that for multiple bosses I found myself doing an extremely uninteresting and long walk over and over. I question the point of making the player do this. I'd rather have a boss fight that takes longer with almost immediate re-trying than to have to run past a bunch of enemies for 2 minutes (I found this particularly annoying for Nito, Gwyn, and Bed of Chaos). Most other bosses have some amount of walking but compare the distance to Gwyn and the distance to Quelaag or the Ceaseless Discharge from their closest respective bonfires).
And this is why soulsborn is my favourite game series
12:19 They actually did that in Elden ring!!!! Very appreciated.
I know you probably won't read this, but thank you for you videos.
MrMlindsay you’re welcome!
I love how DS1 does this, it's a shame no other game in the series even tries to replicate it
Doom2Guy yeah. It's kinda like they sacrificed an amazing design choice for a more westernised, less epic, run-of-the-mill RPG
IMHO I think DS2 sotfs actually has better level design
I like it too but shushhh unless you want to get downvoted
It might just be the cost and time of designing such an interconnected world. Its really quite difficult to do a good job, and a large proportion of your consumer base won't care about it.
i think it's a mix, there are issues with the warp in ds1, the warp for a player are super convenient, which is why they are a staple after 1, but it sacrifices the interconected level design of the first, dark souls 2 doesn't have the interconection on the fist half of ds1 but people seem to forget that the hunt for the 4 lord souls are basically just how dungeons are designed from 2 to 3 since they are areas that are not connected to one another and enclosed on their own realms for the most part (considering New Londo a mix since there is no bonfire but there is access from 2 points once gates are opened), it's a pay off between being more player friendly, stream lined and basically better designed, since the biggest problem in dark souls 1 is the road towards the Lord Vessel and back tracking for points of interest (blacksmith, merchants, etc) at which point the warp transforms it and the rest of the levels into dark souls 2 and 3 broadly speaking.
Great video! I have to disagree with your assessment that it's a problem that the difficulty is "Flat" in the latter half of the game though. I'll agree that difficulty scaling is something that could be taken into consideration, but I don't think that doing it the Dark Souls way is an "inferior" approach.
I'd call latter half of Dark Souls "The Mega Man Effect".
When I first played Demon's Souls 9 years ago, it's actually a parallel I immediately made with this bold little PS3 game. I called it "The RPG Mega Man." After you complete the Intro stage (the first Boletaria Archstone), you're given 5 Demon Masters to choose from. Defeating a Demon Master gives you his soul, which you can then convert into a useful Spell or Demon Master weapon. You can then use this Demon Master Weapon against one of the other 5 Demon Masters (Including the one you unlocked in the level you were just in.) Obviously it's more complex than Mega Man, but I think there's a lot that can be learned from the parallel since Mega Man is a great example of the most basic form of this concept.
In Mega Man, being faced with 8 robot masters to choose from in a blind run is daunting, and depending on where you go first it almost seems insurmountable. But finding that one level that clicks for you makes you just a little stronger with your newly obtained Robot Master weapon. After you breach that difficulty wall just a little, the game starts to unfold for you gradually until you've conquered the whole thing.
Dark Souls (and Demons Souls) is the same way. If you ever find yourself in a situation where you're frustrated by the current challenge, you can choose to try going somewhere else and come back once you've obtained a new power, or maybe enough experience from the other areas. And, just like in Mega Man, on subsequent playthroughs you can challenge yourself by doing things in a different order - maybe even in the order that originally made you uncomfortable.
This kind of design helps a lot with replay value, and even if you feel like the challenge is too small, you can choose to restrict how much you level up, or use builds that might not be completely optimal for the situation - again this is just like Mega Man and choosing not to use E-Tanks or running the game without using Robot Master Weapons.
I think you're right that there is a risk that the game becomes boring as a result of the flat difficulty and reduced challenge with power scaling, but that certainly didn't happen with me when I played DkS the first time. If anything I felt relieved and powerful that I made it that far, contributing to the feeling that I overcame that "Prepare to Die" reputation of the game.
A lot of great Metroidvania games have a similar approach too, and I think it's great. Hollow Knight is probably the best example I can think of off the top of my head. There's nothing wrong with the opposite approach like Axiom Verge's critical path forcing you to do all the bosses in a specific order, but I wouldn't write off "The Mega Man Effect" as an inferior design approach - just a way to invoke a different feeling or rational thinking process.
I still remember the time when I got cursed by a basilisk in ash lake and I had to walk all the way back to the undead merchant in order buy purging stones. That is one of the best memories I have of dark Souls.
18:49
This made me feel incredibly smart because the MOMENT I saw that huge painting I knew I had to use the doll because of its description
I really hope Elden RIng continues to be able to provide the sense of mystery and achievement of Dark Souls 1. I love entirety of the soulsborne games, but just like you said, it has never been the same since Dark Souls 1. To me Dark Souls 1 is a masterpiece that i will always cherish. Since Miyazaki is spearheading Elden RIng, im really looking forward to its release.
Ahhh, a Dark Souls Boss Keys. Just in time for Dark Souls to get delayed on Switch... Spoilers, here I come :)
how u can get spoiled if the game is available in other consoles and pc
The wife and I had to agree on one console, and the decision was unanimous. What can I say?
Because maybe he doesn't have other consoles?
Honestly, most of the game was spoiled for me (of my own volition) and it was still one of my favorite gaming experiences ever.
There isn't really a lot to be spoiled. Even if you know the keypoints of the game, the big part is exploring the world, and there's all the hidden story through item descriptions.
I'd love to see you cover more games in Boss Keys.
I came across your Boss Keys series shortly before running my first D&D campaign. At the time, I wasn't sure how I was going to do any dungeon design, then I started watching through all of these videos...and your analysis of each one really helped me out.
The first dungeon was simple, but started off with three possible paths, all of which were open from the start. The players could go any way they want. The catch with it was, the less you explored before find the heavy, locked door to the boss's room, the more henchmen he'd be able to call when you fought him. I used your discussions on branching paths and memorable things (in this case a much more menacing door) and made a fairly simple, yet successful dungeon.
I also made a secret room behind a bookshelf (cliché but effective), the idea being that upon defeating the boss, the players would find a key to a lock from somewhere. If they did not discover the secret room, then a sense of wonder what it does would be instilled; if they did find the room, they'd come across two locked chests with no way of opening them. Finding the key would be the "Aha!" moment.
And on a more video-related note, I'm so happy that you did a video on Dark Souls 1. I've drawn lot of inspiration for my writing and map designing from this game and love the feeling of being in such a large and connected world, the likes of which you don't see enough of. This feeling was lost in Dark Souls 2 with the multi-branch system that it did with the easy teleports to any bonfire.
I would argue that the vagueness surrounding the way to blighttown and the four lords was intentional, to make the community around the game more active, and they succeeded.