you just cant understand they didnt have all the plans to make everything for the base game at the same time. the 40 days box.... was made afterwards to help. the more start days, WAS MADE LATER. they saw the issues, made a fix, and your complaining that they let the issue happen
Genuinely appreciate all the time and effort you put into this review, Efka! As always, your videos remain some of the best in the industry. Though we obviously disagree with plenty of things in here - the effort you put in to review the entire breadth of the series was obviously immense. If we may offer a defense for one major point of this review - the amount of content that exists in the TMB line has absolutely nothing to do with the trend of bloat and excess in Kickstarters (and I understand the irony of that statement when our brand is literally "the company that overproduces everything"). We've thought we were done with TMB many a time in the last five years. However, the series has continued to grow leaps and bounds, selling better now than it ever has despite being an "old" game. Fans (if you've run into TMB fans online, you know they're passionate) have genuinely continued to ask for more content, and thus we have continued to make it for them. On this last campaign, however, we made a point to say that this is the end for many of the reasons you brought up in this campaign. There can only be so much content made before it begins to feel rote and predictable. We wanted everything in the line to stand on its own as inspired and worthwhile content. Though we're biased, we feel this Unbreakable campaign puts a lovely bow on things with content that we are immensely proud of and feel is beneficial to the line. Anyway, disagreements aside, keep up the great work - and thanks for taking a look at our very strange games :-)
So, can we get a new pledge tier with the recomended content? Since the original TMB got its own tier, we can show some love for Undertow! The reward could be called No Pun Included or whatever and contain the following: Too Many Bones: Undertow, 40 Waves in Daelore, Ghillie, Nugget and Gasket.
Any chance you guys will take a look at some of the underperforming Gearlocks and revise them a bit before calling everything 'done'? I've reached the point where certain Gearlocks are just never going to be taken out of the box again because of how unsatisfying or underpowered they are. Cheers.
@@styfen Nope! We're comfortable with all of them in their current state. Some are certainly much harder to master or provide a greater challenge, but they were not ever intended to have a flat power level across the board. Ghillie exists to be a very easy to play powerful character for beginners. Tink and Dart exist for experts/veterans. Certain tyrants and baddie types will give certain Gearlocs a lot more headaches. This is part of the design. That's not to say all of their playstyles will be attractive to every player, but we're comfortable with where each of them are at.
This type of complete review of an entire system is soooooo great to see. I'm sure it was an insane amount of work, but it is so worth it and you've done an amazing job!
As someone who went all in on the reprint of Cloudspire, I can completely relate to the “battle station set-up”. 4-6 pamphlets and books open, tutorial on the tv, bgg open on the tablet… I feel like I’m an original IBM computer slowly computing character movements and results. Once I started winning the campaign games it grew on me. But once the game is out. It’s on the table for a week or two.
And what you just described is why I sold it. It's unwieldy and unnecessary. As a long time MOBA player (arguably a very hard genre of video game to understand) I was overwhelmed by the amount of information and how unorganized it all felt. Efka described it perfectly as "scattered". Their games look and feel amazing, but I feel that Chip Theory don't understand how to keep a project within a limited scope.
Thanks for taking the time to dive in, consider it from all sides, and be willing to share negatives and positives. It’s commentary like this that helps the board game community.
I love TMB! The content actually feels as if thought was put into it. Nothing feels throwaway and all of it works great together with the content it’s meant to be compatible with. Truly a wonderful solo game that I consistently enjoy immensely! Definitely a must play for those that haven’t played it yet.
Thank you for the review. I think most of the critique has been well reasoned. However, I strongly disagree with the "impracticality" argument and found actually it to be the opposite. As opposed to other dungeon crawler-type games, I find it great that I don't have to search for room tiles, monster miniatures, monster cards, and whatnot tokens all the time. This is the main reason I never got a lot of expansions for Imperial Assault or Descent. There was just too much stuff to manage. For TMB, I can prepare a game beforehand, getting the monster types, preparing the encounter deck and bring it to game night. I find that super practical and owning more TMB content never felt like a burden but just actually cool stuff that I can shuffle in when I feel like it without making it impossible to manage tons of physical components.
I realize I’m coming at this video years afterwards but wanted to say that I agree with the level of complexity. Having said that, I come from playing shadows of brimstone. Do you want to talk about fiddly with intersecting rules and stat cards and encounter cards and stuff all over the place. Also that game is not designed where all the components are high-quality and there’s some exact form fitting tray or holder to put it in. Your play table better be massive and your ability track stats and rules exceptions and exceptions for those exceptions better be amazing. What I learned was playing SOB completely prepared me for TMB. Everyone kept telling me it’s gonna make you cry before you enjoy it. But honestly I’m not saying this to brag but I grokked 90% of this game right away because I knew what kind of game it was and what it took to wrap my brain around it. I only have the core set and undertow. And I only played undertow so far. So getting the review on the other expansions was super helpful. Thanks for making this incredibly informative video. And I love your style and delivery.
Oh, and I really loved the last images of TMB in water. I play TMB outside a lot - like most summer evenings down in the garden. With a glass of something, a nice little breeze, it is magic. It was the game that got me through the Pandemic as I internalised most of the skills. Nugget often featured on tired days, and Dart on less tired days - often paired up with a less interesting Gearloc from the base.
Awesome review. I'm glad that when randomly picking an extra gearlock for my copy that I went with Ghillie. Fun Chip Theory Games story: when I bought Cloudspire from an eBay seller (under £100 so pretty fair) it was being delivered by Hermes. Someone asked if I was worried about who was shipping it, I said "not really, they could throw it in the nearest lake and it wouldn't harm the components".
Really great video and review, Efka and Elaine! Playing the game and expansions dozens of times, writing the script and filming and editing the video takes numerous hours of dedication and I personally want to thank you for that. An hour long review that I would gladly recommend to anyone interested in the game. Also, seeing your views go from 4,000 (when I started watching it yesterday) to over 17,000 today when I finished made me smile. Keep up the great work!
I don’t feel like I simply got a review I feel like I went on a journey along with you. Also I really enjoyed your end credits as well as the background video. Your cinematography (possibly through skillshare) is really shining through.
Thank you for your video. It let me think about the game one more time and realize I didn't need quite as much content as I had planned on. I've played the game a bit on TTS and enjoyed it and had wanted it. Originally, I was on at >$700 for most of the content plus the trove. Now I'm down to $320 for Unbreakable, Undertow, 4 gearlocks (ghillie,nugget,gasket,polaris), and 40 waves. I believe this should be a ton of content saving $400.
@@18nuccio I understand it's more complex, but I have played the main game on TTS probably four times and won once so I'm coming into it with some knowledge.
Efka, Thank you for your particular brand of board game analysis. I especially like your cultural observations and your metatextual analysis and how these things inform the design of these games. It is nice to have someone from your educational background doing these reviews in such a STEM focused and data driven community.
@@wicaksonoadi1035 I don't remember exactly, but it was English or History or some other Humanities. He mentioned it in one of his videos. (I want to say the Colonialism one)
It seems Chip Theory Games took notice of your (and many other's) opinions on duplicate components such as health chips and attack/defense dice plus a few other redundant things. They announced in the new campaign that they will offer the new expansion both WITH and WITHOUT specific components to help cut down on waste. I think that speaks volumes to the company's willingness to listen to the gaming community and try to come up with creative solutions when they can. Remember NPI said he didn't think it was something that could be addressed now because it was too late but to consider it in the future. Well, they addressed it now. I think they deserve credit for that. Great review and great advice for expectations of publishers in the future !!
Wow, thanks for going there Efka - appreciate all the hard work. As a TMB collector, I couldn't agree more, overall, and I definitely feel the pain of a bunch of "fired/garbage" components and packaging as the expansions come out with replacements.
I think one thing I personally love about TMB is also it’s largest drawback, the asymmetric play. Like Cloudspire and even Root, I feel like each player needs to be as invested as the other to really understand the game and have fun.
Efka, What a fantastic and (mostly) fair review! Too many bones is my favorite game of all time, so much so that my best friend and I created a podcast exclusively to talk about how much we love it and other CTG games (The Spire’s Lookout if you wanna check us out!). I am interested in an update of this review to include everything in the Unbreakable line of content. Rage of Tyranny provides some interesting and difficult boss content that focuses on making the tyrants feel impactful throughout the game. 40 waves is an incredible addition to the already amazing Undertow box, and every gearloc feels impactful. I know you don’t much like tanks in this game, but I’d love to see you give Carcass a whirl! And if you like Ghillie, I think Static may be your new bestie… I do love what you mentioned about environmental impact. That’s always been my personal biggest issue with this game, and hard to grapple with. Still, take comfort that since your review, CTG has streamlined the base box, 40 days, and Age of Tyranny to cut down plastic and even included a “No Redundant Pieces” option on their most recent Kickstarter. I know it’s not the biggest thing in the world, but they are trying. You’re still my most trusted source of board game review content and I hope someday you get to try out the ultimate chapter of TMB! Pick up that unbreakable content when you can or maybe CTG can send you some; if you fell in love with the Bones of this system, I think you’ll like how they close this story! Ps. Did you ever find the riddles…?👀
This is the type of game that I know right away is not for me. It has too much rules, exceptions, vagaries, and stuff. And it costs too much money, space, and environment. Yet I didn't hesitate a moment clicking your 1-hour review. Not for a gloating 'Haha, that's exactly what I thought' experience, but because I knew you'd offer interesting new ways of looking at board games And I was right (haha!). Thanks, Efka and Elaine, you're always amazing.
@@prototypep4 I think the environmental issue is more the amount of massive boxes filled with 90% foam and air. Also stuff like chips put in plastic containers that'll just be thrown out. If I wanted to buy everything for Too Many Bones I'll be dumping a massive amount of cardboard and plastic if I get the trove chest/try to consolidate stuff.
@@hish.b Cardboard is one of the easiest materials to recycle. The plastic well, plastic is a joke to recycle. But, most of those boxes, like many other board game expansion boxes, can just go to recycling.
I have board games that are 35 years old that are still playable and the card stock back then is no where near the quality it is today. Modern gamers need to realise that scuffs on components do not ruin a game. MTG has a lot to answer for.
Love NPI’s stuff. This review has a lot of negative comments I agree with (i.e., the rulebook is bad, the gameplay can be uneven, how content is divided among the various products is problematic, etc.). Where I disagree with the review is where it seems to miss the point of the variety. If learning how to get good with a certain gearloc is a big joy of the game, why slam so many of them so hard? All of the gearlocs present a different sort of puzzle, which combines in puzzly ways with the different tyrants. The only time I’ve strongly disagreed with NPI’s general final take this much was its review of the Arkham LCG, and I don’t think that’s a coincidence. Playing through ALL the content of a huge sprawling content-loaded game in a short amount of time is generally a bad idea for anyone, including reviewers. This game is meant to be explored over time. Play as one gearloc one time and learn how to win with that gearloc. Come back two weeks later and pick a new gearloc. And so on. It’s the rare person who would want to play dozens of games of ANYTHING in a row - and that’s gotta be especially true of a game like TMB that inherently involves a heavy lift of looking up and learning the rules. Learning all of this game in this manner in a constrained period of time couldn’t have been fun, even if it is a board game. In the end, TMB is a zany game and, like all games, it’s not for everyone. In many ways, the quirks of the game are a feature and not a flaw…although the game does indeed have its flaws still. But, if you’re just getting into it, start with the base game. Remember Efka talking about how much he hated relearning the game AFTER he had already played the base game a bunch? Yeah - Undertow is a rough starting point.
Totally agree, a big part of the fun in playing TMB is exploring all the gearlocs and figuring out how each gearloc can solve the ever-changing puzzle presented to you in every game of TMB, not to mention the vast variety of tyrants and combination of baddies, each giving you a different experience everytime you play.. many people have found their joy and eureka moment with each gearloc, and i find NPI’s comment on most of the gearlocs very offputting… But his points on the downsides of the game? Indisputable.. but i must emphasise that TMB is not offering you a hand-holding game with perfect rules and how-to-play, TMB is pretty much an experience that many of us will keep going back to
@@NoPunIncluded You’re not wrong and I appreciate the reply. But, to the extent that’s true (or, better yet, to the extent that this review wasn’t made for someone who was already at that point), then why go through the arduous task of giving thoughts about every gearloc in the way this video does? Plus, I think there’s a lot to be said about how the variety of play experiences is what appeals to the diehard fans of the game. I think it’s helpful to get away from the bloat of packaging and plastic to make my point. Spirit Island is my favorite game and a huge part of that is because of the wildly expansive world Eric Reuss created with 24 wildly asymmetric spirits and 7 different adversaries, each of which requires me to think about the game in a somewhat different way. Some spirits I find annoying at times, some are a bit “on rails” once you know how they work, and some are my personal favorites, but each offers something different. And, while I had a lot of fun making a spirit rankings video, it wouldn’t be helpful for me to do a “review” in which I broke down every spirit with emphatic and highly subjective statements indicating that some are garbage. All 24 spirits are experienced differently by every single person who plays Spirit Island and some spirits take some players a long time to learn how to play well. Granted, to get back to one of the points I really love in this video, each spirit in Spirit Island doesn’t add to a pile of stuff you’re just going to throw out and raise as many questions about packaging and distribution. And I’ll admit that maybe that distinction is enough to warrant your approach here.
@@SoloPlaythroughs You said "But, to the extent that’s true (or, better yet, to the extent that this review wasn’t made for someone who was already at that point), then why go through the arduous task of giving thoughts about every gearloc in the way this video does?" For anyone looking to get into the game, so they'd know the best ones to buy and which ones to skip.
@@argel1200 Sure, but the problem is that Efka seems to assume on the one hand that people who love this game already like the variety while also seeming to assume on the other hand that people new to this game will not. So, while I'm fine with Efka telling me that I don't need a review of Too Many Bones because I am at the point that I like the variety, the way he approached this video betrays an unhelpful assumption that players who are newer to the game might not be interested in that "variety" later. Fans of TMB generally tend to be fans of all of the gearlocs. Gorging yourself on Too Many Bones in a short amount of time and only giving each gearloc 2-4 plays max (Efka said on Twitter that he played around 30 games) is a poor way to form a good assessment of the content. Since each gearloc requires a fair amount of "lift" to learn how to play well, it's not surprising that he didn't find many of them that fun.
Big fan of the game for the past two years and thought this was an extremely helpful and insightful review of one of my favorites. Thank you for the rundown on each expansion/Gearloc in helping me to decide what else to buy.
Such a joyful and insightful video. I've owned TMB and eventually passed it along as it no longer had a place in my collection - for many of the reasons you mentioned. Including the space it took up! (I resisted the Trove Chest, if I had not, it might still be here.) Thank you for the time and effort put into this review. It kind of inspired me to consider getting Undertow again. Kinda....
I love Tink, I wouldn't treat him as a tank, rather as a controller. He has strong and rare skills such as disabling baddies, dealing damage to untargettable enemies and stun, most of which are repeatable.
I've got Tink coming (Tomorrow! With a few others) so it's nice to hear a positive opinion on him after the punishment he got in the video! It did seem odd to me that Efka (IIRC) seemed to both say he can hide in a corner and that the bots are fragile - Is that possible just poor choices in gameplay? (I.e. That Tink should maybe be taking the hits to protect the bots?). I'll look forward to finding out anyway :-)
Neither Tink nor the bots have a lot of damage mitigation and 4-6 health mean the bots sometime go down in a single attack, so they are fragile. If they survive there are plenty of options to heal them and Tink taking the occasional hit can also help. Most people find him underwhelming but there are many who swear by him. Old but nice guide if you want some tips from a TMB expert th-cam.com/video/zTeXKQd3ZjY/w-d-xo.html
@@prototypep4 I also felt that Efka wants to play damage dealers that isn't one is not his jam. Which is fine. But saying the other Gearlocs are bad is a bit weird. Especially Dart with Mono (putting Baddies to sleep) is one of the best skills in the game! And there are lots of other great skills!
Brilliant summary. I have enjoyed playing the core game over zoom during lockdown, an odd way to play that posed challenges that we have overcome. Playing multiple times has made this enjoyable but I haven't found any reviews (until now) which has helped me decide if I want more (and what I want). Thank you for the time you have put into this, great stuff.
Your best work, simply put. I've always wanted these sorts of comprehensive videos for not just a board game, but all the add-ons as well. It's interesting to see how deep the design evolves or manifests over numerous products, and the excessive amount of products has a certain appeal that makes want to watch an hour covering a board game I have no interest in. I can see why people like you and SUSD don't do them often, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I wanted more. Regardless, top notch stuff!
I have bought everything and love and kept all of TMB packaging after getting the treasure trove. I have repurposed the packaging, and the foam core pieces to store my painted miniatures from other games and RPGs. The packaging is heavy-duty, kallax sized and the foam core can be cut to fit miniatures perfectly. I did the same with cloudspire and will do the same when I receive hoplomachus and burncycle. I love what Chip Theory does with packaging, and it doesn't require one to be wasteful with it, even when you combine materials into a single box or a treasure trove, which is about the coolest thing I have ever seen in a boardgame.
I really appreciated this review. As someone who has been enamored of the Hoplomachus line of stuff I eventually got the TMB core and this review helped me to clarify what I like and do not like about TMB (and buying board games in general). It is a truly useful review and buying guide and I think that is the responsible and, unfortunately, rare thing in this genre. My only thought was that I think the core has more merit than you gave it in your conclusion. I'd love to see you review the new Hoplo when it comes out. Your reviews are honest and thought through. That is really refreshing for this hobby.
Wow, what a great and helpful review, thanks Efka and Elaine! I've been curious about TMB since SU&SD covered it awhile back, but have felt both intimidated by the size and uncertain that it would stick to my ribs, so appreciate the thorough and frank coverage and deciphering of it here. And Efka, I have to say that this video stood out for me as your best review video ever. I've been watching pretty much everything you've put out since discovering your channel in 2017 or so, and at times have felt like I've become perhaps too familiar with your tropes and pacing such that-while I've continued to enjoy them-it was a bit like visiting a too-familiar relative ("here comes the pause-joke bit"). Something about your script, pacing, and delivery on this one truly "popped" for me, setting it apart and taking the review to a new level of quality. I hope you feel proud and happy with it too. Congratulations and thanks again. (and also: nice haircut!)
Hey NPI! Thank you for this Too Many Bones review. I am a huge TMB fan and I was seriously considering buying a bunch of stuff for it. But after watching this, it made me realize that I didn't need to do that. That I can just take pleasure in a few more things rather than a huge quantity of new stuff. And that I needed to take a step back instead of being so wrapped up in their new campaign. I also very much appreciate you telling everyone to not hate on CTG in the middle of mind blowingly successful campaign. Your efforts here have had a very healthy impact on my hobby and I really appreciate it.
I think this is the best TMB review ever! The way you explain the challenges and struggles you have to overcome on one hand and the rewards and deep strategies you get on the other hand let me understand the style of game very good 👍🏽 thanks 🤗👍🏽
Efka and Elaine, once again I'm blown away by the effort put in to a review, thank you so much for doing this! TMB is my absolute favourite game, and I just love having the opportunity to hear your thoughts, both good and bad! This is a review I'll undoubtedly be rewatching many times in the future.
The joke with the name Boar'd isn't based on it being a board game component, but being a boar belonging to Dart. Dart-Boar'd. Dartboard. Not brilliant by any means, but better than you gave it credit for. It's the sort of pun you'd easily see in a D&D game.
Yeah see that was where my brain jumped to as soon as he mentioned the character name, but then he went the direction he did and left me sitting there wondering if that was deliberate on his part and he was masking it with his unique brand of dry wit
Also Boar’d is much easier to use and understand than Tink’s Bots, Ghillie’s Pets, and is probably tied with Duster’s Wolf … I’m thinking at some point he probably just got tired of reading reference sheets.
I just love this video! As someone else said, it felt like going on a journey with you, listening to all your important decisions in life and how you feel about them now. It's one of the greatest reviews out there. It's as much about you as it is about the game, it's as much about the hobby and our habbits as it is about the game. As a review, this might be more ambitious than TMB is as a game: what an achievement. And the part about waste. Efka, so well delivered! We have such a strange hobby. I am very conflicted about some of my purchases, so much so, that I changed my habbits some time ago. I am mostly buying second hand. I am not backing KS anymore. Not a single one. I buy far less games than I used to and I am not buying expansions unless I played a game a decent amount of times and everybody involved would like to experience it some more. And guess what? I play just as many games as before, I don't feel bad about my pile of shame (because there is none anymore), I get to enjoy the games more that I actually love. Don't wanna sound preachy, but for me it was the right decision.
I have been going through the process of re-boxing and condensing my games as best I can. I find that even my older games can often fit either the base and 2 or more expansions, or that I could fit two different games in the same box, and I have done so, with my wife helping me make updated labels for the boxes. Some of the worst offenders I've found (by ratio of empty box space to component volume) are small card games. Arboretum, Race for the Galaxy, Boss Monster, Love letter, etc. These kinds of games tend to use only a quarter of the box space, if that! Love letter is barely a double digit number of cards in a box big enough for 100. Dominion, is a big card game with a similar issue, I have thrown out roughly 10 "standard" board game boxes and I'm left with cards that fit in about 1.5 boxes. WHY?! I mean, at least they had the decency to start making a set of "base" cards, but as you mention about having doubles of the generic components, I have a stack of Curses, Copper, Silver, Gold, Estates, Provinces, and (the middle victory point card) that I basically only use to reduce wear and tear on my first set. They are pointless! Gloomhaven (and sequels) are great big boxes, sure, but what I appreciate is that they are *full* boxes, and that they used standees for the enemies. Thank god I don't have to have a whole separate box full of plastic skeletons, demons, etc. that will get 1/5 the playtime of the PC minis (tops). We need more of this in the future. Plus punching out cardboard is WAY better than having miniatures.
You absolutely make some of the best reviews. Your blend of humor and information is top tier. Even when I disagree with your opinion, I still feel as if I can walk away with an informed opinion of my own. Always, always excellent stuff here. My only complaint is a selfish one.. I want more videos!
Thoroughly enjoyable thorough joy of a review. You make a great point about this being a game that only people OK with searching for FAQ/BGG entries is going to enjoy. Recently I considered introducing it to a couple of gamer family members. Then I played a practice game and realized they were going to hate me the first time I had to look up a rules clarification. The twentieth time, they were going to change their last name and drive home in the middle of the night.
@@prototypep4 Thanks! Luckily I have no problem with learning complex games, so that's fine. I am worried with the rulebook being so bad since I like learning from there, but I'll manage somehow
Just backed Unbreakable with 2 added gearlocs. I’m debating adding the base TMB as well but not sure if I need the larger experience since I usually play with 2 total players. Great video! Thank you 🙏🏻
Just one base game is definitely enough to begin with. After you've played it multiple times, you can then decide on whether you think it is worth expanding upon.
Thank you so much for making this. The most comprehensive review and overview of this game. Before I found this video I was trying to piece together bits of information from all over the place to figure out what I wanted to get, much like how you explain the rulebook. Then this gem of a video came along and crystallized everything!
This is the best review that I’ve seen on the series to date! It’s evident that you’ve spent a good deal of time with the game. Fair and balanced! My experience has been very similar. Undertow is great and I expect Unbreakable to be similar in presenting more interesting elements. Thanks for this, well done!
Fantastic work! You and Elaine both have such a deep dedication and commitment to the craft of board games and of being excellent and thorough reviewers. It's awesome stuff! Well done :)
I'm sorry but you said an incorrect thing about Dart, she only exust dice if they are paired with poisons or toxins, never exaust ones used simply to attack!
I only bought the things you recommended and I'm back here after playing the game to thank you for this review. What I got is way enough content that will keep me playing this game for years.
Bravo! And talking about the environmental implications is very much appreciated! I would really like to see this aspect promoted further. I was on the fence between TMB and MageKnight for a while now (I know, two completely different expediences etc....) . So now waiting for your MageKnight Review :)
MKUE comes in a box roughly six times larger than it needs to be for the content it contains and, until recently, the insert didn't even properly hold the components securely, as well as allowing the cards to bend. I bought an insert to deal with the disorganized mess. It came with boxes to hold everything, along with an entire dice tower and card display just to take up the space in the box, and it still rattles around in the cavernous void.
This was an excellent breakdown! Loved it and wish we could pick different items from many of the expansions. The starting cards are soooo needed for the base game! You are so right, you don't need everything for this game. 🙂
I sure do wish most of the content was bundled in more sensible packaging - Considering what anyone with a trove chest will do with it, it would be so, so nice to have a plain box with all the stuff thrown in for at least the main packages (Unbreakable Hero/Bones Basic/Just Enough Bones & the All-In one). But...That would be a pain in terms of splitting SKU's into Gamefound/Retail which I can appreciate is a logistical pain in the butt - Plus trying to ship the trove chest with everything already in it might make for a significant risk of damage, and it would be gutting to receive something so expensive with a massive dent in the corner from shipping. I do hope they can figure out some kind of tidy solution to future projects though :-)
Thanks for the informative, honest review! I'm glad to hear brutal honesty, rather than singing praise just because the company gave you free stuff (not to say that all influencers do this). This game sounds very intriguing, but also very daunting due to the cost and amount of expansions required to make it truly enjoyable over a long period of time.
As others have said, this is one of the most well done reviews I have ever seen. Every aspect of it. I love TMB. Is it perfect? Not at all, and I'd agree with most criticisms to varying degrees, but for us (my son and I) the pro's far outweighs the cons. I'm going to leave it at that. Reviews are subjective, and while we may not agree on every aspect, this was fantastic as always. Now, time to go back and watch your Cloudspire review again! 🙂
Great review! Kinda sums my experience with core. Game tends to snow ball, in a good or bad way. So many games were either too easy or simply lost after failed encounter or two. You lose encounter, because you are maybe not strong enough, what does game do, well, it raises difficulty for next encounter while at the same time not rewarding you anything. Tyrant battles can be very anticlimactic. One shooting tyrant is simply lame after hours it took you to get to him.
During the pandemic lockdown; Too Many Bones saved my sanity. It was a puzzle with a story as a bonus. Mistakes were made that led to frustration. However it was just lather, rinse and repeat. I won a campaign against Barnacle. Upgrading the Gearlocs was the best mechanic for me. I don’t know if I would have had the patience if the situation was different. I did back the latest campaign.
This video is a FANTASTIC guide for new TMB players who want to find their way through the plethora of TMB products. He begins with a little terrific historical background, and then methodically covers everything before Unbreakable. The time you spend with this video will be entertaining, helpful, and useful. -toby
oh no, Dart is by FAR my favorite Gearloc in the game, and she has been since the first time I played the game (my first TMB game ever I played as Dart)
I agree with everything you said. This is one of the most spot on reviews of TMB I've seen. You've even convinced me that Undertow is the best start :)
This game looks really cool and for someone with ocd the sturdiness of its components genuinely makes me very happy it puts my mind at ease but i understand it comes with a cost to the environment but i need peace of mind
Taking on a juggernaut of a series and coming away critical is always a brave stance. Sometimes less is more and sometimes good designs often arrive after the fact, rather than right away. If TMB had the luxury of just releasing its best parts (four of the most fun gearlocks, great encounters, stable tyrants, all in one box) I think it would see more mainstream acceptance rather than a small yet fanatical following. Instead there are a dozen boxes and more than half of the pile is "waste" material that won't see play. However, the parts that DO see play will be memorable and enjoyed for a lifetime. Tough to say if this produces more garbage or more gems, and I think that's the risk of "bloated" Kickstarter style success stories. No one knows if they'll be played in ten years or all entirely obsolete in the face of increasingly VR-plugged in modernity. I like Chip Theory for the risks they have taken, but they don't hold an indefensible position in regards to TMB. It's an ambitious series with the misfortune of remaining tone-deaf on its own colossal misuse of resources (chiefly, time), but a quirky and lovable product at the end of the day. Without the intense, perhaps rabid, love shown via crowdfunding, this is yet another title I don't think an existing publisher would be brave enough to produce. Thanks for the honest and impactful review, NPI!
Thank you for the video! I was NOT going to back the KS campaign (I did not own any TMB). After your review, I ordered some TMB content from the CT website, and backed some items on KS. Thanks again for your honest opinions.
I utterly lost my first games… one after another. I really needed time to dive into the Gearlocks mechanics for hours to grap my first Tyran win. Luckily I started out with Undertow which was a perfect TMB start for me. From the base box Tantrum is most fun for me. Rage is soooo much fun. And I seldom play the other three in any of my games. But over all I see, understand and even agree with your criticisms. But I love that sequence of riddles that TMB offers me.
What an incredibly broad and thorough review. Whether one agrees or disagrees with the findings, the review itself is very well done. Either way, before investing a huge amount of money (and subsequently time) in a game like this, one should always consider as many and as varied reviews as possible. Or as a very wise man once said: Understanding is a three edged sword: your side, their side, and the truth.
Great tell it as it is analysis and for me I'm glad I never went down the TMB Rabbit hole. Maybe Undertow plus Gasket and Ghillie may be an option or even better they build a new game around your critical analysis.
Easy, I’m sure there’s a thousand better ways to send this message but I don’t really engage on YT that often. Big up for being one of the best D.I.Y channels I’ve come across and furthermore big up on being the single best board game channel I’ve stumbled across. Safe x
I have such a love/hate relationship with CT and this game in particular. I do love the game, but it's unreasonably expensive. It would play the same with standees on a cardboard player board, but they have to go so hard. I love the quality of the game and the components but I'm at a point in my life with all the current virus stuff where I can't get this last game. I'd love to just risk it and go for it but it's crazy expensive, like everything they do. And my Trove box was broken when it got to me so I still have to figure out what the hell to do with that
Hey just wanted to thank NPI for introducing me to this game that I never would have otherwise come across. It is 100% my cup of tea. Mostly I play this kind of thing digitally too, which helps mitigates waste.
When you skip to the conclusion cause you're busy, and curious, and you'll come back later dammit! "A Review of Shipping Everything Too Many Bones" It feels almost like that was why you wanted to make the video, but clearly you also enjoy and generally respect the game and the publisher so it was only fair to give it the full treatment. I'll watch the full thing when I have time, but I think I can speak for a large number of us when I say... if you want to get into HBomberguy/Contrapoints length board game video essays... I'd be here for that.
This video is sponsored by Skillshare. The first 1,000 people to use this link will get a 1 month free trial of Skillshare: skl.sh/nopunincluded10211
you just cant understand they didnt have all the plans to make everything for the base game at the same time. the 40 days box.... was made afterwards to help. the more start days, WAS MADE LATER. they saw the issues, made a fix, and your complaining that they let the issue happen
Genuinely appreciate all the time and effort you put into this review, Efka! As always, your videos remain some of the best in the industry. Though we obviously disagree with plenty of things in here - the effort you put in to review the entire breadth of the series was obviously immense. If we may offer a defense for one major point of this review - the amount of content that exists in the TMB line has absolutely nothing to do with the trend of bloat and excess in Kickstarters (and I understand the irony of that statement when our brand is literally "the company that overproduces everything").
We've thought we were done with TMB many a time in the last five years. However, the series has continued to grow leaps and bounds, selling better now than it ever has despite being an "old" game. Fans (if you've run into TMB fans online, you know they're passionate) have genuinely continued to ask for more content, and thus we have continued to make it for them. On this last campaign, however, we made a point to say that this is the end for many of the reasons you brought up in this campaign. There can only be so much content made before it begins to feel rote and predictable. We wanted everything in the line to stand on its own as inspired and worthwhile content. Though we're biased, we feel this Unbreakable campaign puts a lovely bow on things with content that we are immensely proud of and feel is beneficial to the line.
Anyway, disagreements aside, keep up the great work - and thanks for taking a look at our very strange games :-)
So, can we get a new pledge tier with the recomended content? Since the original TMB got its own tier, we can show some love for Undertow!
The reward could be called No Pun Included or whatever and contain the following:
Too Many Bones: Undertow, 40 Waves in Daelore, Ghillie, Nugget and Gasket.
@@javiertoso4354 Seconded.
Any chance you guys will take a look at some of the underperforming Gearlocks and revise them a bit before calling everything 'done'? I've reached the point where certain Gearlocks are just never going to be taken out of the box again because of how unsatisfying or underpowered they are. Cheers.
@@styfen Which gearlocs are those?
@@styfen Nope! We're comfortable with all of them in their current state. Some are certainly much harder to master or provide a greater challenge, but they were not ever intended to have a flat power level across the board. Ghillie exists to be a very easy to play powerful character for beginners. Tink and Dart exist for experts/veterans. Certain tyrants and baddie types will give certain Gearlocs a lot more headaches. This is part of the design. That's not to say all of their playstyles will be attractive to every player, but we're comfortable with where each of them are at.
This type of complete review of an entire system is soooooo great to see. I'm sure it was an insane amount of work, but it is so worth it and you've done an amazing job!
As someone who went all in on the reprint of Cloudspire, I can completely relate to the “battle station set-up”. 4-6 pamphlets and books open, tutorial on the tv, bgg open on the tablet… I feel like I’m an original IBM computer slowly computing character movements and results. Once I started winning the campaign games it grew on me. But once the game is out. It’s on the table for a week or two.
And what you just described is why I sold it. It's unwieldy and unnecessary. As a long time MOBA player (arguably a very hard genre of video game to understand) I was overwhelmed by the amount of information and how unorganized it all felt. Efka described it perfectly as "scattered". Their games look and feel amazing, but I feel that Chip Theory don't understand how to keep a project within a limited scope.
Thanks for taking the time to dive in, consider it from all sides, and be willing to share negatives and positives. It’s commentary like this that helps the board game community.
I love TMB! The content actually feels as if thought was put into it. Nothing feels throwaway and all of it works great together with the content it’s meant to be compatible with. Truly a wonderful solo game that I consistently enjoy immensely! Definitely a must play for those that haven’t played it yet.
100% agree
Thank you for the review. I think most of the critique has been well reasoned. However, I strongly disagree with the "impracticality" argument and found actually it to be the opposite. As opposed to other dungeon crawler-type games, I find it great that I don't have to search for room tiles, monster miniatures, monster cards, and whatnot tokens all the time. This is the main reason I never got a lot of expansions for Imperial Assault or Descent. There was just too much stuff to manage. For TMB, I can prepare a game beforehand, getting the monster types, preparing the encounter deck and bring it to game night. I find that super practical and owning more TMB content never felt like a burden but just actually cool stuff that I can shuffle in when I feel like it without making it impossible to manage tons of physical components.
I realize I’m coming at this video years afterwards but wanted to say that I agree with the level of complexity. Having said that, I come from playing shadows of brimstone. Do you want to talk about fiddly with intersecting rules and stat cards and encounter cards and stuff all over the place. Also that game is not designed where all the components are high-quality and there’s some exact form fitting tray or holder to put it in. Your play table better be massive and your ability track stats and rules exceptions and exceptions for those exceptions better be amazing.
What I learned was playing SOB completely prepared me for TMB. Everyone kept telling me it’s gonna make you cry before you enjoy it. But honestly I’m not saying this to brag but I grokked 90% of this game right away because I knew what kind of game it was and what it took to wrap my brain around it.
I only have the core set and undertow. And I only played undertow so far. So getting the review on the other expansions was super helpful.
Thanks for making this incredibly informative video. And I love your style and delivery.
Oh, and I really loved the last images of TMB in water. I play TMB outside a lot - like most summer evenings down in the garden. With a glass of something, a nice little breeze, it is magic. It was the game that got me through the Pandemic as I internalised most of the skills. Nugget often featured on tired days, and Dart on less tired days - often paired up with a less interesting Gearloc from the base.
Awesome review. I'm glad that when randomly picking an extra gearlock for my copy that I went with Ghillie.
Fun Chip Theory Games story: when I bought Cloudspire from an eBay seller (under £100 so pretty fair) it was being delivered by Hermes. Someone asked if I was worried about who was shipping it, I said "not really, they could throw it in the nearest lake and it wouldn't harm the components".
To be fair, Hermes are dogshit. And my brother works for them.
I'm surprised it even got delivered with Hermes. But seriously, I've got to resist the urge to vent about them anytime they're brought up 😅
Really great video and review, Efka and Elaine! Playing the game and expansions dozens of times, writing the script and filming and editing the video takes numerous hours of dedication and I personally want to thank you for that. An hour long review that I would gladly recommend to anyone interested in the game. Also, seeing your views go from 4,000 (when I started watching it yesterday) to over 17,000 today when I finished made me smile. Keep up the great work!
Your dog barking was awesome. Glad you kept it in! I'm watching it and my dog heard the dog and started barking back.
I don’t feel like I simply got a review I feel like I went on a journey along with you. Also I really enjoyed your end credits as well as the background video. Your cinematography (possibly through skillshare) is really shining through.
Thank you for your video. It let me think about the game one more time and realize I didn't need quite as much content as I had planned on. I've played the game a bit on TTS and enjoyed it and had wanted it. Originally, I was on at >$700 for most of the content plus the trove. Now I'm down to $320 for Unbreakable, Undertow, 4 gearlocks (ghillie,nugget,gasket,polaris), and 40 waves. I believe this should be a ton of content saving $400.
@@18nuccio I understand it's more complex, but I have played the main game on TTS probably four times and won once so I'm coming into it with some knowledge.
Efka, Thank you for your particular brand of board game analysis. I especially like your cultural observations and your metatextual analysis and how these things inform the design of these games. It is nice to have someone from your educational background doing these reviews in such a STEM focused and data driven community.
I hope you don't mind me asking, what is Efka's educational background?
@@wicaksonoadi1035 I don't remember exactly, but it was English or History or some other Humanities. He mentioned it in one of his videos. (I want to say the Colonialism one)
It seems Chip Theory Games took notice of your (and many other's) opinions on duplicate components such as health chips and attack/defense dice plus a few other redundant things. They announced in the new campaign that they will offer the new expansion both WITH and WITHOUT specific components to help cut down on waste. I think that speaks volumes to the company's willingness to listen to the gaming community and try to come up with creative solutions when they can. Remember NPI said he didn't think it was something that could be addressed now because it was too late but to consider it in the future. Well, they addressed it now. I think they deserve credit for that. Great review and great advice for expectations of publishers in the future !!
Wow, thanks for going there Efka - appreciate all the hard work.
As a TMB collector, I couldn't agree more, overall, and I definitely feel the pain of a bunch of "fired/garbage" components and packaging as the expansions come out with replacements.
I think one thing I personally love about TMB is also it’s largest drawback, the asymmetric play. Like Cloudspire and even Root, I feel like each player needs to be as invested as the other to really understand the game and have fun.
I loved the little bit of boardgame history in the beginning. I would love more video's of that type.
Efka,
What a fantastic and (mostly) fair review! Too many bones is my favorite game of all time, so much so that my best friend and I created a podcast exclusively to talk about how much we love it and other CTG games (The Spire’s Lookout if you wanna check us out!).
I am interested in an update of this review to include everything in the Unbreakable line of content. Rage of Tyranny provides some interesting and difficult boss content that focuses on making the tyrants feel impactful throughout the game. 40 waves is an incredible addition to the already amazing Undertow box, and every gearloc feels impactful. I know you don’t much like tanks in this game, but I’d love to see you give Carcass a whirl! And if you like Ghillie, I think Static may be your new bestie…
I do love what you mentioned about environmental impact. That’s always been my personal biggest issue with this game, and hard to grapple with. Still, take comfort that since your review, CTG has streamlined the base box, 40 days, and Age of Tyranny to cut down plastic and even included a “No Redundant Pieces” option on their most recent Kickstarter. I know it’s not the biggest thing in the world, but they are trying.
You’re still my most trusted source of board game review content and I hope someday you get to try out the ultimate chapter of TMB! Pick up that unbreakable content when you can or maybe CTG can send you some; if you fell in love with the Bones of this system, I think you’ll like how they close this story!
Ps. Did you ever find the riddles…?👀
This is the type of game that I know right away is not for me. It has too much rules, exceptions, vagaries, and stuff. And it costs too much money, space, and environment. Yet I didn't hesitate a moment clicking your 1-hour review. Not for a gloating 'Haha, that's exactly what I thought' experience, but because I knew you'd offer interesting new ways of looking at board games And I was right (haha!). Thanks, Efka and Elaine, you're always amazing.
Love the environmental twist, this is a huge issue in this industry and I'm so glad you brought it to front stage! Well played :)
@@prototypep4 I think the environmental issue is more the amount of massive boxes filled with 90% foam and air. Also stuff like chips put in plastic containers that'll just be thrown out. If I wanted to buy everything for Too Many Bones I'll be dumping a massive amount of cardboard and plastic if I get the trove chest/try to consolidate stuff.
@@hish.b Cardboard is one of the easiest materials to recycle. The plastic well, plastic is a joke to recycle. But, most of those boxes, like many other board game expansion boxes, can just go to recycling.
@@prototypep4 smaller boxes, foldable reference sheets, consolidated expansions instead of lots of smaller expansions
I have board games that are 35 years old that are still playable and the card stock back then is no where near the quality it is today. Modern gamers need to realise that scuffs on components do not ruin a game. MTG has a lot to answer for.
@@Stomski right! I love going to the "slightly damaged box" section of my boardgame store to get a nice discount.
Love NPI’s stuff. This review has a lot of negative comments I agree with (i.e., the rulebook is bad, the gameplay can be uneven, how content is divided among the various products is problematic, etc.). Where I disagree with the review is where it seems to miss the point of the variety. If learning how to get good with a certain gearloc is a big joy of the game, why slam so many of them so hard? All of the gearlocs present a different sort of puzzle, which combines in puzzly ways with the different tyrants.
The only time I’ve strongly disagreed with NPI’s general final take this much was its review of the Arkham LCG, and I don’t think that’s a coincidence. Playing through ALL the content of a huge sprawling content-loaded game in a short amount of time is generally a bad idea for anyone, including reviewers. This game is meant to be explored over time. Play as one gearloc one time and learn how to win with that gearloc. Come back two weeks later and pick a new gearloc. And so on. It’s the rare person who would want to play dozens of games of ANYTHING in a row - and that’s gotta be especially true of a game like TMB that inherently involves a heavy lift of looking up and learning the rules. Learning all of this game in this manner in a constrained period of time couldn’t have been fun, even if it is a board game.
In the end, TMB is a zany game and, like all games, it’s not for everyone. In many ways, the quirks of the game are a feature and not a flaw…although the game does indeed have its flaws still. But, if you’re just getting into it, start with the base game. Remember Efka talking about how much he hated relearning the game AFTER he had already played the base game a bunch? Yeah - Undertow is a rough starting point.
Totally agree, a big part of the fun in playing TMB is exploring all the gearlocs and figuring out how each gearloc can solve the ever-changing puzzle presented to you in every game of TMB, not to mention the vast variety of tyrants and combination of baddies, each giving you a different experience everytime you play.. many people have found their joy and eureka moment with each gearloc, and i find NPI’s comment on most of the gearlocs very offputting…
But his points on the downsides of the game? Indisputable.. but i must emphasise that TMB is not offering you a hand-holding game with perfect rules and how-to-play, TMB is pretty much an experience that many of us will keep going back to
Frankly, if you're at a point where you just want variety and 'content' - you don't really need a review.
@@NoPunIncluded You’re not wrong and I appreciate the reply. But, to the extent that’s true (or, better yet, to the extent that this review wasn’t made for someone who was already at that point), then why go through the arduous task of giving thoughts about every gearloc in the way this video does? Plus, I think there’s a lot to be said about how the variety of play experiences is what appeals to the diehard fans of the game.
I think it’s helpful to get away from the bloat of packaging and plastic to make my point. Spirit Island is my favorite game and a huge part of that is because of the wildly expansive world Eric Reuss created with 24 wildly asymmetric spirits and 7 different adversaries, each of which requires me to think about the game in a somewhat different way. Some spirits I find annoying at times, some are a bit “on rails” once you know how they work, and some are my personal favorites, but each offers something different. And, while I had a lot of fun making a spirit rankings video, it wouldn’t be helpful for me to do a “review” in which I broke down every spirit with emphatic and highly subjective statements indicating that some are garbage. All 24 spirits are experienced differently by every single person who plays Spirit Island and some spirits take some players a long time to learn how to play well.
Granted, to get back to one of the points I really love in this video, each spirit in Spirit Island doesn’t add to a pile of stuff you’re just going to throw out and raise as many questions about packaging and distribution. And I’ll admit that maybe that distinction is enough to warrant your approach here.
@@SoloPlaythroughs You said "But, to the extent that’s true (or, better yet, to the extent that this review wasn’t made for someone who was already at that point), then why go through the arduous task of giving thoughts about every gearloc in the way this video does?" For anyone looking to get into the game, so they'd know the best ones to buy and which ones to skip.
@@argel1200 Sure, but the problem is that Efka seems to assume on the one hand that people who love this game already like the variety while also seeming to assume on the other hand that people new to this game will not.
So, while I'm fine with Efka telling me that I don't need a review of Too Many Bones because I am at the point that I like the variety, the way he approached this video betrays an unhelpful assumption that players who are newer to the game might not be interested in that "variety" later.
Fans of TMB generally tend to be fans of all of the gearlocs. Gorging yourself on Too Many Bones in a short amount of time and only giving each gearloc 2-4 plays max (Efka said on Twitter that he played around 30 games) is a poor way to form a good assessment of the content. Since each gearloc requires a fair amount of "lift" to learn how to play well, it's not surprising that he didn't find many of them that fun.
Big fan of the game for the past two years and thought this was an extremely helpful and insightful review of one of my favorites. Thank you for the rundown on each expansion/Gearloc in helping me to decide what else to buy.
Wonderful review. I’ve been curious about this game for years now and what to get and what not to. This was super helpful.
Such a joyful and insightful video. I've owned TMB and eventually passed it along as it no longer had a place in my collection - for many of the reasons you mentioned. Including the space it took up! (I resisted the Trove Chest, if I had not, it might still be here.) Thank you for the time and effort put into this review. It kind of inspired me to consider getting Undertow again. Kinda....
I love Tink, I wouldn't treat him as a tank, rather as a controller. He has strong and rare skills such as disabling baddies, dealing damage to untargettable enemies and stun, most of which are repeatable.
I've got Tink coming (Tomorrow! With a few others) so it's nice to hear a positive opinion on him after the punishment he got in the video!
It did seem odd to me that Efka (IIRC) seemed to both say he can hide in a corner and that the bots are fragile - Is that possible just poor choices in gameplay? (I.e. That Tink should maybe be taking the hits to protect the bots?).
I'll look forward to finding out anyway :-)
Neither Tink nor the bots have a lot of damage mitigation and 4-6 health mean the bots sometime go down in a single attack, so they are fragile. If they survive there are plenty of options to heal them and Tink taking the occasional hit can also help.
Most people find him underwhelming but there are many who swear by him. Old but nice guide if you want some tips from a TMB expert th-cam.com/video/zTeXKQd3ZjY/w-d-xo.html
@@prototypep4 I also felt that Efka wants to play damage dealers that isn't one is not his jam. Which is fine. But saying the other Gearlocs are bad is a bit weird. Especially Dart with Mono (putting Baddies to sleep) is one of the best skills in the game! And there are lots of other great skills!
Yeah. I found Tink super strong when I tried him, too. That the bot can't take Status effects is a big deal, too!
The major takeaway here: it's impossible to hate Ghillie.
Brilliant summary. I have enjoyed playing the core game over zoom during lockdown, an odd way to play that posed challenges that we have overcome. Playing multiple times has made this enjoyable but I haven't found any reviews (until now) which has helped me decide if I want more (and what I want). Thank you for the time you have put into this, great stuff.
Your best work, simply put. I've always wanted these sorts of comprehensive videos for not just a board game, but all the add-ons as well. It's interesting to see how deep the design evolves or manifests over numerous products, and the excessive amount of products has a certain appeal that makes want to watch an hour covering a board game I have no interest in. I can see why people like you and SUSD don't do them often, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I wanted more. Regardless, top notch stuff!
Wow, marvellous review as always. I really enjoyed the slow component drop at the end that was mostly in time with music :D
You are so wrong. Patches is A M A Z I N G!
Don't know about Undertow for beginners. More rules than the already rule-heavy base game and has one of the most complex gearlocs. (Stanza.)
I have bought everything and love and kept all of TMB packaging after getting the treasure trove. I have repurposed the packaging, and the foam core pieces to store my painted miniatures from other games and RPGs. The packaging is heavy-duty, kallax sized and the foam core can be cut to fit miniatures perfectly. I did the same with cloudspire and will do the same when I receive hoplomachus and burncycle. I love what Chip Theory does with packaging, and it doesn't require one to be wasteful with it, even when you combine materials into a single box or a treasure trove, which is about the coolest thing I have ever seen in a boardgame.
I really appreciated this review. As someone who has been enamored of the Hoplomachus line of stuff I eventually got the TMB core and this review helped me to clarify what I like and do not like about TMB (and buying board games in general). It is a truly useful review and buying guide and I think that is the responsible and, unfortunately, rare thing in this genre. My only thought was that I think the core has more merit than you gave it in your conclusion. I'd love to see you review the new Hoplo when it comes out. Your reviews are honest and thought through. That is really refreshing for this hobby.
Wow, what a great and helpful review, thanks Efka and Elaine! I've been curious about TMB since SU&SD covered it awhile back, but have felt both intimidated by the size and uncertain that it would stick to my ribs, so appreciate the thorough and frank coverage and deciphering of it here. And Efka, I have to say that this video stood out for me as your best review video ever. I've been watching pretty much everything you've put out since discovering your channel in 2017 or so, and at times have felt like I've become perhaps too familiar with your tropes and pacing such that-while I've continued to enjoy them-it was a bit like visiting a too-familiar relative ("here comes the pause-joke bit"). Something about your script, pacing, and delivery on this one truly "popped" for me, setting it apart and taking the review to a new level of quality. I hope you feel proud and happy with it too. Congratulations and thanks again. (and also: nice haircut!)
Hey NPI! Thank you for this Too Many Bones review. I am a huge TMB fan and I was seriously considering buying a bunch of stuff for it. But after watching this, it made me realize that I didn't need to do that. That I can just take pleasure in a few more things rather than a huge quantity of new stuff. And that I needed to take a step back instead of being so wrapped up in their new campaign.
I also very much appreciate you telling everyone to not hate on CTG in the middle of mind blowingly successful campaign.
Your efforts here have had a very healthy impact on my hobby and I really appreciate it.
I think this is the best TMB review ever! The way you explain the challenges and struggles you have to overcome on one hand and the rewards and deep strategies you get on the other hand let me understand the style of game very good 👍🏽 thanks 🤗👍🏽
Efka and Elaine, once again I'm blown away by the effort put in to a review, thank you so much for doing this!
TMB is my absolute favourite game, and I just love having the opportunity to hear your thoughts, both good and bad! This is a review I'll undoubtedly be rewatching many times in the future.
The joke with the name Boar'd isn't based on it being a board game component, but being a boar belonging to Dart. Dart-Boar'd. Dartboard. Not brilliant by any means, but better than you gave it credit for. It's the sort of pun you'd easily see in a D&D game.
Pretty funny that Efka said that nobody would ever need the joke explained to them.
I thought its his surf board :p Since he jumps on and off.
Yeah see that was where my brain jumped to as soon as he mentioned the character name, but then he went the direction he did and left me sitting there wondering if that was deliberate on his part and he was masking it with his unique brand of dry wit
Maybe, just MAYBE, the pig is just bored?
Also Boar’d is much easier to use and understand than Tink’s Bots, Ghillie’s Pets, and is probably tied with Duster’s Wolf … I’m thinking at some point he probably just got tired of reading reference sheets.
I just love this video! As someone else said, it felt like going on a journey with you, listening to all your important decisions in life and how you feel about them now. It's one of the greatest reviews out there. It's as much about you as it is about the game, it's as much about the hobby and our habbits as it is about the game. As a review, this might be more ambitious than TMB is as a game: what an achievement.
And the part about waste. Efka, so well delivered! We have such a strange hobby. I am very conflicted about some of my purchases, so much so, that I changed my habbits some time ago. I am mostly buying second hand. I am not backing KS anymore. Not a single one. I buy far less games than I used to and I am not buying expansions unless I played a game a decent amount of times and everybody involved would like to experience it some more. And guess what? I play just as many games as before, I don't feel bad about my pile of shame (because there is none anymore), I get to enjoy the games more that I actually love. Don't wanna sound preachy, but for me it was the right decision.
I have been going through the process of re-boxing and condensing my games as best I can. I find that even my older games can often fit either the base and 2 or more expansions, or that I could fit two different games in the same box, and I have done so, with my wife helping me make updated labels for the boxes.
Some of the worst offenders I've found (by ratio of empty box space to component volume) are small card games. Arboretum, Race for the Galaxy, Boss Monster, Love letter, etc. These kinds of games tend to use only a quarter of the box space, if that! Love letter is barely a double digit number of cards in a box big enough for 100.
Dominion, is a big card game with a similar issue, I have thrown out roughly 10 "standard" board game boxes and I'm left with cards that fit in about 1.5 boxes. WHY?! I mean, at least they had the decency to start making a set of "base" cards, but as you mention about having doubles of the generic components, I have a stack of Curses, Copper, Silver, Gold, Estates, Provinces, and (the middle victory point card) that I basically only use to reduce wear and tear on my first set. They are pointless!
Gloomhaven (and sequels) are great big boxes, sure, but what I appreciate is that they are *full* boxes, and that they used standees for the enemies. Thank god I don't have to have a whole separate box full of plastic skeletons, demons, etc. that will get 1/5 the playtime of the PC minis (tops). We need more of this in the future. Plus punching out cardboard is WAY better than having miniatures.
Excellent and thorough breakdown of the series. Thanks for this!
Phenomenal credit sequence. Subliminally relaxing 😊
The first time playing experience is too many AUUOOUGHs, enjoying this video, especially the early history of excess plastic
You absolutely make some of the best reviews. Your blend of humor and information is top tier. Even when I disagree with your opinion, I still feel as if I can walk away with an informed opinion of my own.
Always, always excellent stuff here. My only complaint is a selfish one.. I want more videos!
An amazing looking game and an amazing review to go along with it. Your efforts are truly appreciated. Thoroughly enjoyable throughout.
Amazing review. No one else puts out content like this
Thoroughly enjoyable thorough joy of a review. You make a great point about this being a game that only people OK with searching for FAQ/BGG entries is going to enjoy. Recently I considered introducing it to a couple of gamer family members. Then I played a practice game and realized they were going to hate me the first time I had to look up a rules clarification. The twentieth time, they were going to change their last name and drive home in the middle of the night.
I love how Efka always goes into board game history, awesome info for those of us late to the party :)
Thanks for this! I would have gone for the base box at once if it weren't for this review, but Undertow with a couple of Gearlocs will be enough ^^
@@prototypep4 Thanks! Luckily I have no problem with learning complex games, so that's fine. I am worried with the rulebook being so bad since I like learning from there, but I'll manage somehow
Just backed Unbreakable with 2 added gearlocs. I’m debating adding the base TMB as well but not sure if I need the larger experience since I usually play with 2 total players.
Great video! Thank you 🙏🏻
Just one base game is definitely enough to begin with. After you've played it multiple times, you can then decide on whether you think it is worth expanding upon.
Thank you so much for making this. The most comprehensive review and overview of this game. Before I found this video I was trying to piece together bits of information from all over the place to figure out what I wanted to get, much like how you explain the rulebook. Then this gem of a video came along and crystallized everything!
Glad it was useful!
Just in time for the next KS! Thanks a bunch!
This is the best review that I’ve seen on the series to date! It’s evident that you’ve spent a good deal of time with the game. Fair and balanced! My experience has been very similar. Undertow is great and I expect Unbreakable to be similar in presenting more interesting elements. Thanks for this, well done!
The colonialism review is also good.
Fantastic work! You and Elaine both have such a deep dedication and commitment to the craft of board games and of being excellent and thorough reviewers. It's awesome stuff! Well done :)
I'm sorry but you said an incorrect thing about Dart, she only exust dice if they are paired with poisons or toxins, never exaust ones used simply to attack!
Thank you, it was bound to be Dart that I made a rules mistake on.
@@NoPunIncluded Does that make Dart better, then?
I tried to watch the last 3 minutes without laughing. I couldn’t do it.
Absolutely worth the hour of my time. Thanks for the great content! Too Many Bones is one of my favorite games, and you covered it beautifully.
Already loving the intro, this will be a nice way to spend an hour ❤️
Great video, sums up exactly why I'm always a little tempted to try too many bones, as well as exactly why I don't.
One hour review! What a treat! Great job!!!
This may the most epic bad ass review I've ever seen.
Wow, this was an amazing and thorough review, thank you so much for it :)
I only bought the things you recommended and I'm back here after playing the game to thank you for this review. What I got is way enough content that will keep me playing this game for years.
That's amazing! Glad you're enjoying it.
Bravo!
And talking about the environmental implications is very much appreciated! I would really like to see this aspect promoted further.
I was on the fence between TMB and MageKnight for a while now (I know, two completely different expediences etc....) . So now waiting for your MageKnight Review :)
MKUE comes in a box roughly six times larger than it needs to be for the content it contains and, until recently, the insert didn't even properly hold the components securely, as well as allowing the cards to bend.
I bought an insert to deal with the disorganized mess. It came with boxes to hold everything, along with an entire dice tower and card display just to take up the space in the box, and it still rattles around in the cavernous void.
🎵 Too Many Bones. Too Many Bones. 🎵 (Sung to the theme of Too Many Cooks)
This was an excellent breakdown! Loved it and wish we could pick different items from many of the expansions. The starting cards are soooo needed for the base game! You are so right, you don't need everything for this game. 🙂
As always great review. Only opinion I truly trust on youtube! Never sugar coats anything and gives it straight.
I sure do wish most of the content was bundled in more sensible packaging - Considering what anyone with a trove chest will do with it, it would be so, so nice to have a plain box with all the stuff thrown in for at least the main packages (Unbreakable Hero/Bones Basic/Just Enough Bones & the All-In one).
But...That would be a pain in terms of splitting SKU's into Gamefound/Retail which I can appreciate is a logistical pain in the butt - Plus trying to ship the trove chest with everything already in it might make for a significant risk of damage, and it would be gutting to receive something so expensive with a massive dent in the corner from shipping.
I do hope they can figure out some kind of tidy solution to future projects though :-)
This was a very ambitious review + I'm impressed by how it turned out!
Thanks for the informative, honest review! I'm glad to hear brutal honesty, rather than singing praise just because the company gave you free stuff (not to say that all influencers do this). This game sounds very intriguing, but also very daunting due to the cost and amount of expansions required to make it truly enjoyable over a long period of time.
As others have said, this is one of the most well done reviews I have ever seen. Every aspect of it.
I love TMB. Is it perfect? Not at all, and I'd agree with most criticisms to varying degrees, but for us (my son and I) the pro's far outweighs the cons.
I'm going to leave it at that. Reviews are subjective, and while we may not agree on every aspect, this was fantastic as always.
Now, time to go back and watch your Cloudspire review again! 🙂
Did you ever end up picking up Cloudspire after watching Efka's review?
Thank you such a deep dive! So helpful when there is THIS MUCH content!
Great review!
Kinda sums my experience with core. Game tends to snow ball, in a good or bad way. So many games were either too easy or simply lost after failed encounter or two. You lose encounter, because you are maybe not strong enough, what does game do, well, it raises difficulty for next encounter while at the same time not rewarding you anything. Tyrant battles can be very anticlimactic. One shooting tyrant is simply lame after hours it took you to get to him.
During the pandemic lockdown; Too Many Bones saved my sanity. It was a puzzle with a story as a bonus. Mistakes were made that led to frustration. However it was just lather, rinse and repeat. I won a campaign against Barnacle. Upgrading the Gearlocs was the best mechanic for me. I don’t know if I would have had the patience if the situation was different.
I did back the latest campaign.
AN HOUR LONG VIDEO?! Did Christmas come early and nobody told meeeee 😭😭😭❤️
This video is a FANTASTIC guide for new TMB players who want to find their way through the plethora of TMB products. He begins with a little terrific historical background, and then methodically covers everything before Unbreakable. The time you spend with this video will be entertaining, helpful, and useful. -toby
Yet another amazing review. Thanks!
oh no, Dart is by FAR my favorite Gearloc in the game, and she has been since the first time I played the game (my first TMB game ever I played as Dart)
What a game, thank you for the comprehensive review!
I agree with everything you said. This is one of the most spot on reviews of TMB I've seen. You've even convinced me that Undertow is the best start :)
Wow, this video is looong, you guys rock!
This game looks really cool and for someone with ocd the sturdiness of its components genuinely makes me very happy it puts my mind at ease but i understand it comes with a cost to the environment but i need peace of mind
"and now im an adult, and I look like a gremlin" Thanks buddy! you made me spit my water all over my keyboard! lol
Taking on a juggernaut of a series and coming away critical is always a brave stance. Sometimes less is more and sometimes good designs often arrive after the fact, rather than right away.
If TMB had the luxury of just releasing its best parts (four of the most fun gearlocks, great encounters, stable tyrants, all in one box) I think it would see more mainstream acceptance rather than a small yet fanatical following.
Instead there are a dozen boxes and more than half of the pile is "waste" material that won't see play. However, the parts that DO see play will be memorable and enjoyed for a lifetime.
Tough to say if this produces more garbage or more gems, and I think that's the risk of "bloated" Kickstarter style success stories. No one knows if they'll be played in ten years or all entirely obsolete in the face of increasingly VR-plugged in modernity.
I like Chip Theory for the risks they have taken, but they don't hold an indefensible position in regards to TMB. It's an ambitious series with the misfortune of remaining tone-deaf on its own colossal misuse of resources (chiefly, time), but a quirky and lovable product at the end of the day. Without the intense, perhaps rabid, love shown via crowdfunding, this is yet another title I don't think an existing publisher would be brave enough to produce.
Thanks for the honest and impactful review, NPI!
Thank you for the video! I was NOT going to back the KS campaign (I did not own any TMB). After your review, I ordered some TMB content from the CT website, and backed some items on KS. Thanks again for your honest opinions.
Amazing. And always beguiling. Thank you
i found this ending surprisingly satisfying lol
Stay Hexy!
I utterly lost my first games… one after another. I really needed time to dive into the Gearlocks mechanics for hours to grap my first Tyran win. Luckily I started out with Undertow which was a perfect TMB start for me.
From the base box Tantrum is most fun for me. Rage is soooo much fun. And I seldom play the other three in any of my games.
But over all I see, understand and even agree with your criticisms. But I love that sequence of riddles that TMB offers me.
Massive review! Much appreciated!
What an incredibly broad and thorough review. Whether one agrees or disagrees with the findings, the review itself is very well done.
Either way, before investing a huge amount of money (and subsequently time) in a game like this, one should always consider as many and as varied reviews as possible. Or as a very wise man once said: Understanding is a three edged sword: your side, their side, and the truth.
Great tell it as it is analysis and for me I'm glad I never went down the TMB Rabbit hole. Maybe Undertow plus Gasket and Ghillie may be an option or even better they build a new game around your critical analysis.
Great work. Watched in full.
Easy, I’m sure there’s a thousand better ways to send this message but I don’t really engage on YT that often. Big up for being one of the best D.I.Y channels I’ve come across and furthermore big up on being the single best board game channel I’ve stumbled across. Safe x
I have such a love/hate relationship with CT and this game in particular. I do love the game, but it's unreasonably expensive. It would play the same with standees on a cardboard player board, but they have to go so hard. I love the quality of the game and the components but I'm at a point in my life with all the current virus stuff where I can't get this last game. I'd love to just risk it and go for it but it's crazy expensive, like everything they do. And my Trove box was broken when it got to me so I still have to figure out what the hell to do with that
Reach out to CT and they will replace your drive chest no questions. They probably have the best customer support of any company out there
Meant TROVE chest! Darn autocorrect!
Hey just wanted to thank NPI for introducing me to this game that I never would have otherwise come across. It is 100% my cup of tea.
Mostly I play this kind of thing digitally too, which helps mitigates waste.
Savage, but in a good way. Efka you raise the bar.
Great and thoughtful conclusion tbh! It is a bit much.....
When you skip to the conclusion cause you're busy, and curious, and you'll come back later dammit!
"A Review of Shipping Everything Too Many Bones"
It feels almost like that was why you wanted to make the video, but clearly you also enjoy and generally respect the game and the publisher so it was only fair to give it the full treatment.
I'll watch the full thing when I have time, but I think I can speak for a large number of us when I say... if you want to get into HBomberguy/Contrapoints length board game video essays... I'd be here for that.