Your videos are helping me immensely. Deep gratitude for your generosity. I'm 70 and still trying to make sense of my childhood and adulthood narcissistic abuse and heal myself, especially from my unconscious contracts to stay unhappy and unsuccessful, or risk my mother's evil eye. She died a year ago but she is alive in my psyche. My father lives on as the enabling narcissist who normalizes her pathology, sets toxic boundaries and censors any conversation about the family dysfunction. Through his lens, I was the problem.
It is a very big task to fill the void and lack of solid foundation by oneself and for oneself. We see each other here doing the work, and I salute every survivor for the bravery it takes to process and show up for themselves.
It was such a struggle to even realize why there was such a huge hole in my heart. I was expecting my husband to bridge that gulf. It was difficult to realize that he never could. I was expecting him to give me all the love I never received in my family of origin. Frankly, if I hadn’t had grandparents that loved me, I probably wouldn’t be here.
I'm certain that part of the "work" a narc parent (or other caregiver we have growing up) does is to lay a foundation, so to speak, of lack so that we don't learn how to fill that basic part of us so that they and any other predator can come by and create that dynamic where we allow them to "fill" that space and we become dependent upon them. It's so bizarre: they are the parasites and yet we are the ones that become addicted to the parasite and despite knowing that we're being sucked of our life and energy, we become tricked into thinking we need their poison.
I had a very unique experience of being extremely highly valued in the external world ie school, university, career, extended family yet tremendously and horrifically devalued by parents and siblings . This was a strange and confusing experience but it enabled me to create distance from my family of origin. But sadly I stayed in their belief patterns for too long, developed chronic illness as a result, but am now totally independent and self sufficient in my life and look after myselfwith priority and care. Long arduous journey of recovery but it can be done. You do lose trust in yourself after adopting ingrained beliefs of a scapegoat but when you get your confidence back and see your narcissistic parents for what they are, you can reclaim your life gradually. But that is the biggest hurdle, seeing the truth as it seems so hard to believe that your own parents who you loved and were devoted to acted like true emotional and verbal abusers
Just realised my parents made me believe my need for them to love me is outrageous and I'm being a terrible spoiled brat if I expect something kind and loving from them. Great video. Thank you
Thank you so much for this. It's taken me decades to realize just how deeply the abuse separated me from "myself'. Learning to love myself-----I'm late doing it but at last, it's being done. This guidance is profoundly helpful. {Oh, Happy Halloween to you too!}
I love everything you said! When I catch myself in self-hatred, I look in the mirror into my eyes and say,"I love you so much." Sometimes when I awaken in the middle of the night I put my hand over my heart or solar plexus and speak soothing words as well. Thank you for this! There is quite a bit of science about self-compassion and it's benefits in recovery.
Just broke down by putting hands on solar plexus and hearing the words, "I have you. I'm with you." The extreme release of fear and feeling alone for so long was immense!! Thank you Jay. I wish all well on their journeys!
I also believe, with all the gaslighting we've lived through generally, that it may take a while for our inner child(ren) to really believe what we are telling them with our words. They will need to be shown we mean what we say. I just felt in in me; saying, " Yeah, sure, you say that, but I'm certainly not ready to believe you." A sad commentary on how alone my little girl has felt and feels abandoned by me. We'll work on it together!
You nailed it. I have always had such a difficult time articulating my ambivalent feelings about doing things that are “good for me.” I was always given praise for sacrificing all of my own needs to take care of the needs of the narcissists in my family. As a result, I fundamentally distrust praise. I was constantly criticized whenever I stood up for my own care or tried to demand that the parental figures in my life show accountability and just basically show up and parent. Hearing you describe the sort of phenomenon that I have always struggled with, the push me pull me, it felt very validating. Thank you
When I realized how much love, affection, attention, 24/7 thinking about them, recalibrating myself to please them, and neglecting my own education, art, career, physical health and bank account, I had given to various BFs and my mother and stepfather, I was 1) Sad that they abused it and rejected it ("If you did it this way, then I'd accept your love, but you keep doing it wrong. Keep trying though! I'm patient." 2) Realized that whoa, if I could give myself a fraction of that focus, love, attention, I might survive or even, dare I dream, thrive!? 3) Sadly, I honestly had a phase where I was unsure whether I could do it. 4) I did it! And that's no easy feat when you have surrounded yourself with abusers your whole life, but it's SO worth it! ---- Love your thoughtful videos, thank you!
@@alwayshoping125 It's a gift to be able to have that love so apply it to yourself. The older I get the more I see how few truly have love and warmth. It'a gift :)
This is what I need to do. I am 68, and have spent most of my life believing I’m here to give up myself for others’ needs, purposes, and narratives. I’m tired, but I have a long way to go, and much to do, before I lie down. It’s come down to my being able to take good enough care of myself to live another 30 years. There are too many people I love, to leave this party early.
It’s good to see another older person here who’s trying to heal the pain from their past. I’m so tired from a long life filled with many narcissistic abusers I wonder if it’s worth the effort. I’ll be 63 in a few days. At least I have learned to take a little bit better care of myself. The abusers are all gone now Thank God. You’re very optimistic about living another 30 years and I wish you well. I know I’ll probably be lucky if I make it to 70. All we can do is our best. Let’s enjoy what’s left and continue with healing.
All the years of being literally dirt poor, and spending every cent on my parents, and other family members, while they all criticised me for being poor. Ugh. I still remember two years ago the feeling I had when buying almost $20 worth of silicone toe spacers as I had a crossed over toe which would be bleeding by the end of the day. As a housekeeper I always habitually kept my toes curled up so as to not hurt. I felt then like it was an enormous amount to spend on myself, and was looking around to see if anyone was watching, and actually flinching. Much like many years ago when shopping my grandmother wanted to buy me this pretty white cardigan- I was in utter terror of what would happen to me if I let her but knew I couldn't tell her why I couldn't have it. I was about 7, and she is dead now and this one thing bothers me so much.
Thank goodness you purchased the toe spacers. Not really sure what that condition is, but it sounds painful and something you absolutely needed to keep going to work and getting through some long tough days of hard labor. Yes, it's hard to invest in ourselves. Meanwhile, I just got evicted in September after losing my business during Covid and here I am seeing Christmas items arrive in the stores and anticipating the sh*tstorm from my 80+ year old parents who WANT CHRISTMAS PRESENTS! And it's all I can do to get set up in my new, much cheaper apartment... Seriously, I came to realize I am the adult and they are the children in this relationship dynamic. That's one way to reframe that may help you through the holidays. Best of luck!
I've never known how to love myself and maybe have never loved anybody else either . My raging covert narc mother always demanded all my attention and expected me to sacrifice everything for her . This was like expecting to get water from a glass that had never had any water put in it . She relished the psychological torture she put me through and would try to shame me into thinking that I was too 'big for your britches' if I thought I was too good for the shit she dumped on me . I'm glad she's GONE . The hand on the solar plexus and speaking to one's self is strangely comforting .
I hate hate hate the use of “love yourself” as victim blame. For children of narcs, “love yourself” looks a lot like survival. You loved yourself enough to get here. I swear that every time I hear it I want to purchase that person a personal massager--NO, YOU go love yourself. That and virtue signaling about “forgiveness”. I know that all these nice people don’t give a fig if I forgive, or don’t. How would they even know? They don’t. It’s just the proper thing to say, in order to appear pious. If they cared, there wouldn’t be nearly as many neglected children.
I’ve often wondered myself why they worked so hard to keep me humbled and humiliated. I had 0 self esteem. What were they seeing? I took off my muddy shoes once to walk through a feed store!!!
I can totally relate to the analytical thing and I still do this. I was always searching for an answer for my low self esteem, anxiety, etc and was patiently waiting for the day when I would feel good enough. Like, if I only I could figure out the secret ingredients that everyone else seems to know and apply it to myself somehow. It never occurred to me to ask myself what I wanted or how I even felt about anything, and it never even occurred to me that anything was wrong with my upbringing until probably my late 20's.
Yes, I've finally figured out that I am always waiting and searching for the moment it can all make sense. My hamster wheel is spinning and spinning until I finally remember to ask myself what I am feeling at that moment, and most of the time it stops the spinning.
I’m glad for you that you learned that so early. I was about 59 when I heard about narcissism and narcissistic families. It’s lifesaving for many of us.
Jay thank you so much again. All your beautiful work makes such a difference to my life. This video came today shortly after I asked God for help to know how I stop shaming myself and to love myself so I know I'm loved by him too, you are an angel to me and I appreciate what you say so much. Thank you and much love to you, best wishes, Harry
I felt warmth in my heart from your message - I also asked God for help today on related subject, because I still have this feeling of God dissatisfied with my aspiration to learn self-love, self-care and self-protection. Sometimes I clearly feel that I'm projecting reaction of narcissistic parent onto God and can dissolve it easily, but other times I feel guilt just for wanting to name it as projection and not wanting it to be the real attitude of God towards me. Especially because a lot of people depict God as altruistic narcissist (i think they even don't realise it) and I still detox not only from lifetime of narcissistic abuse, but spiritual abuse, which is so similar to narcissistic one. The more I dig into narc.abuse the more it helps me to untangle my relationship with God. (I'm not a native speaker, I hope I managed to put my thoughts into words correctly)
@@RK-qs5dy I hope I hear you right RK when you said about how you feel or worry sometimes you project onto God the narcissistic parent, if so I really hear you and I get this too and it sends me into a shame spiral. I think I'm learning that I feel fear and shame about this because at a point in my past, the child me had to see me as the problem and at fault, when it was really my parents. When I begin to believe I'm not responsible for these fears about God being a narcissistic parent, I begin to understand my parents are responsible for these fears. This starts to free me from the shame I carry which is not in fact mine.
@@RK-qs5dy I hope I hear you right RK when you said about how you feel or worry sometimes you are projecting onto God the narcissistic parent. If so I really hear you. I get this too. We're not though. I know that much. The fear I feel that I'm projecting onto God is part of my shame response, which I now see is also not my fault but a survival adaptation to my abusive parents. I wish you every success in recovery from this awful abuse. Its not our fault and God loves us, and is on our side 😊
@@Harry-qw5jv thank you for response! I also wish you healing and living your full life 😊 Yes, it was a battle to imagine God on my side and to trust Him after so much betrayal. I also discovered that shame/guilt/fear/irritation towards myself were not mine - these were instilled by narcissists feelings, which were hindering my real feelings and preventing me from getting in contact with my real feelings: a lot of pain. It was like an almost physical sensation of layer, which I am not allowed to uncover. As if when I try to get in contact with myself I must stumble upon this self-hatred and self-blame and think that they are my own feelings towards myself and there is nothing besides them and that's all I deserve because I'm somehow inherently awful. And I was not allowed to display pain and even feel it, because it will be harmful for the image of ideal parent. When I try to feel my pain there is always interruption from guilting and shaming angry voice. Because of my pain parents look like bad parents and this is worse crime than all that they have done to me. And as if I'm pretending to be in pain just to harm their image.
Self compassion has been my practice since 2023-4. Studies show that self-compassion helps one to be more emotionally resilient and self-sustaining than berating oneself. I love the analogies you use in your videos and cultural references to film, music and stories. The stock market analogy made total sense. One can say it happens in chemical reactions too. When electrons are removed, bonds collapse quickly but adding them requires more energy and is a slower process. You rock, Jay! Thank you! Im looking forward to studying and continuing my healing through your courses.
To hear from someone who makes a sense i havent heard in 30 yrs of searching, to hear that person say that ones most shameful moments deserve most respect...thank you. My degree in psych didnt give me this. Yoy did for free when my perilously won recovery needed it most, was stalled and imperilled for this very question...Namaste and thank you💖
That example you gave of doing a task and feeling like it’s not good enough, then stopping to recognize that it doesn’t matter, I love you (me)! I go through that. I used to get really stuck in a shame spiral when doing a simple task like doing dishes and making a small mistake. I still have moments when the shame comes up over a simple mistake, but I’m able to catch it now and shift my thinking … most times, it takes mindfulness. Happy Halloween!
Me too Beloved Child, in me the shame spiral is worst when the thing involves doing a task that could help or harm someone, for example giving my pet a new prescription pill to try to help him I go into a shame spiral worrying I might have harmed him instead, and I become crippled over the decisions I must make regarding his or my own health. One of my parents would continually harass me over what food could have caused a food intolerance reaction in me or our pet cat who I had the respi si ilty to feed in childhood, blaming me covertly over and over for this, until it became my default to try to find out what I had lovingly or enjoyably fed myself or our cat which caused a food intolerance or reaction. It feels at times like the entire life of myself or my pets lies in my hands alone and one mistake will lead to death of one of us. Trouble is there's no possible way to know how my pet will react to a new food or pill without trying and if he's ill he needs help of course. This makes decisions cripplingly shame and terror inducing. I always knew if I got a major disease she would ask me what I could have done that caused it, and this might actually be worse than the diagnosis itself. It is a terror shame spiral. Just awful to witness in oneself. Thanks for Jay's videos, it is so helpful to begin to be released from this nightmare.
@@Harry-qw5jv I’m so glad you’re coming out of the nightmare. I wonder. Did you always suspect something was wrong or not quite right? I did but I just couldn’t put my finger on it. I’m so glad I’ve awakened. Sounds like you have too. Congratulations. ❤️
@@Harry-qw5jv "I am always one mistake away from complete ruin" is the title of Jay's video here th-cam.com/video/95GnZWLAX7I/w-d-xo.html Definitely worth watching and then try to catch yourself falling into catastrophic thinking. It's tough and relentless but can be stopped. I never have enough money and worry excessively about spending too much on some small item (like 20 euros), or having a difficult conversation where I need to voice some complaints and ensure my needs are being met, etc. and have lately decided to stop torturing myself over EVERY LITTLE THING and to progress more smoothly, rapidly and easily through life. Just get the thing done, then move on to the next... and maybe one day, get back to having FUN and a sense of humor and living fully again!
I so get it! I think growing up and in adulthood, my parents and others around me, used my strong sense of responsibility to manipulate me. When I was actually being responsible enough for my age, they would tell me I was irresponsible because they didn't like the way I was behaving. I think we end up feeling an overwhelming sense of responsibility, more than is normally expected, so we never feel responsible enough or set the bar way to high for ourselves. We weren't taught that it's okay to make mistakes and any mistakes they made were our fault. Our parents should have been helping us navigate through our learning and mistakes. Children should never be made to feel shame for being human and imperfect.
Thank you so much for this. I have practiced the ‘hand on heart saying I love you’ to yourself and if you do it regularly for a few weeks it really starts to grow and resonate. I can’t recommend this practice highly enough. ❤
Hi all, doing Halloween 🎃 sweets here with the kids. European/ GMT. Nice to have you here in the background. And yes the instinct to care goes way beyond “co-dependent”. So for all our inner children, a smile, sweets/ candy and happy scary at my front door for us all.
Thankyou for all of your information. I see that everyone here is in a safe and healing space. I am 50 years old and in recovery like all here. I am learning and healing so much here. Thankyou all for your courage and compassion. It is so rare.
Thank you Jay. I really appreciate everything you have said, it is so important to develop a loving relationship with one’s self. I have noticed how touching my skin while rubbing some oils can feel so calming and soothing and helps to appreciate my body I have been given. It is finding love and meaning in the little things that makes a lot of difference.
Learning to love ourselves the right way, versus the way they showed us love, can be tricky. These videos are helpful in learning the appropriate way to talk to ourselves lovingly. I don't ever remember my parents telling me it's okay to feel a certain way, or that they're sorry I was going through anything. There are also so many other helpful loving phrases that would have helped us navigate life much easier growing up. But, even now, learning self compassion can be a game changer. Thank you 💕
This was a great video. The explanations help us gain perspective on what happened to us. And the advice and techniques at the end were incredibly helpful. I am going to implement them. Thank you for your work helping us.
You often take a broad, "big picture" perspective. I find this is congruent with my own big picture reflections which, in turn, is part of my life path to cope with my background. I need this frame of mind part of the time as I move along through my life. Thank you.
Thanks for exploring this aspect of the abuse we take up upon ourselves that we need to reweave. The stock analogy is helpful since this is also a man made abuse tool. Good to hear my therapist is on point using the family systems strategy. Cheers
Thank you so much. After many years of therapy I now sometimes manage to accept myself. I was in this waiting game and I waited far too long until I might some day "solve the problem that is me" ...
I’ve been working through your class. Some insights are really clicking for me now. The visuals/diagrams and psychology of the scapegoat have helped so much!
To love oneself is to love God,God + self = love ❤️, know that you are loved and have always been loved. It is better to be love then to seek love.no one can love you as much as God loves .just remember you are love,,,,you can not find love through the mind,,,,love is in the heart,,,,
I think so. I feel like there is a natural love and reverence for our highest ideals of God. And rather than lay this at the feet of religion, we celebrate in spite of religion. They used our reverence to slave us. But while they wield our faith like a sword against us, they don’t believe. They never believed. They never had to.
Hi again Jay, I also had a suggestion for a topic I'd love for you to cover. We talk about healing a lot, but to me that implies that we were evrr whole.For example, uf I break my arm and I want it to heal, I want it to be back the way it was before. A person who was raised by narcissists does not have a "before" to go back to. They have to try to become something they have never been, and don't necessarily even know that much about! It is quite a challenge.
There is still an inner child in us. The authentic WE. As we get safer, more attentive to ourselves, more self-loving... we can gradually hear the soft voice of our true self. We build from scratch, you are right. It's a new US. We get to know who we really are. It's an adventure, best experienced when sourounded by new, loving, growing people (like for example in ACA 12step groups or group therapies). 🤗 You don't have to do this alone. We are social beings and best grow/heal through (new, nurturing, mutual) relationships; our wounds need to be seen and excepted by 'enlightened witnes' (aka therapist). 🤗🍀
Animal right was my solution for having a worthwhile life which is neither for the narcissist mother nor myself. I do love and identify with the situation many animals are in. I learn what love and closeness feel like from my own animals. It wasn't until recently I got in contact with my inner parts. Their suffering moved me a great deal. Including them in my love and compassion is actually easy. It feels very healing, like wanting to make up all the lost time.
I love these videos. They are so full of practical tools that work in the here and now to stabilise and ground me in the reality that the worst is over. There is light at the end of the tunnel. Thanks for sharing your light with us Jay.
Incredibly useful, profound and insightful video on the v painful and lifelong journey that is 'recovery from narcissistic abuse' 💔. There is always hope 🙏😊🙏❤️! Many Thanks, Jay
This is such a helpful video. Enjoyed it more and more as it went on....and especially when you discussed the beautiful, loving practices we can do by ourselves. I am looking forward to trying them. Will definitely be watching it again. Thank you!
You are amazing........I was looking for exactly such kind of understanding and the lines you give - oh they are so helpful, I re-read those, write it in for self, and re-watch videos..........Its such great help, enabling, motivating at deeper level............from core of my heart - Thanks a lot, sending you much Love and Light.........may you grow and succeed in a very prosperous way - its a blessing from my heart full of Gratitude......I know this will reach you.......Thank you so much again - this came exactly at the right time.....!!
Hello Jay I had a question on this section: "We're going to think something about ourselves in order to stay away from the worst outcome" 10:27 I was going to kill myself thinking that I was worthless because of the way I was treated, I thought I deserved to kill myself. Isn't it better to have knew that I was lovable and worthy? Instead of the false image my narcissist dad was throwing out on me? Asking seriously, because I am trying to figure it out to want to help others feel better about themselves.
I think it helps to remember the things said to you were projections of how your father felt about himself, or was told about himself. It's hard for our young selves to understand, and I think we get stuck in our younger self where this is concerned (emotional flashbacks, etc.). Integrating the young self with the adult self and ridding false beliefs we were programmed to repeat is perhaps one of the most important goals in my opinion.
Just remember this- if we do commit suicide it just gives them an opening to "tut tut" and it 'proves' that we were defective all along. I made the mistake of saying I was in therapy...well "It's about time..." Little did they know their supply was about to be cut off :)
@@Chahlie I just thought about something, in retrospect I was never defective, but with years of intense abuse I coudn't see life worth living for. This is why I want to help others to not give up. People who committed suicide are not weak, they were strong for so long. Now I love life, since I'm away from my abusers.
I’ve been stuck in the guilt and shame cycle; I’ve lost a lot in my identity from never overcoming emotional neglect or figuring out how to cope instead I went straight to alcohol..I entered a relationship that probably is my most healthiest, but because of my emotional fragility I’ve executed emotional abuse…and got consumed by self hatred that it’s hard to forgive myself for being reactive. For being someone I was scared to become and hurting someone I love deeply that I started hating them because of the things I’ve done. I know how wrong that sounds and it’s not their fault. I feel like I’ve lost myself in the hatred for the things I’ve done, I let alone have trouble expressing how I feel from these places. Can you receive so much damage that it’s too late to come back? I’ve convinced myself I’m a narcissist, after all I’m preoccupied anxious, and have strong people pleasing behaviors. I’m too focused on what I’ve done feeling guilty about things and apologizing but the hatred and self pity is self sabotage. It’s like a wall I can’t climb to show the other person I do care. I feel like I have to constantly prove that. I should have focused merely on the self not how people view me and understood what it means to love and have healthy relationships. I often avoided people because I felt like I was internalizing everything they said, their emotions, and I would only focus on the narratives. The tone of voice, expressions, drop me into hyper vigilance. So much distortion trying to read people and input assumptions, i went crazy just to cram myself to be ready to face social situations, relationships, being cautious. I did so much damage to myself and to other people it feels irreversible.
Hey Jay. Watching 'Monsters and Mysteries in America." There are actual flying monkeys created by a mad scientist in Napa valley. Guess it's full of narcissists too. #toomuchtimeonhands
Hello Jay, I was thinking that the word "entelechy" might be a good way to describe the drive to be all that one can be. Also, I just "butt reported" hateful or abusive content by mistake! I am not sure what I reported . So sorry!
To the person who responded to another commentator and put the link in for Jay’s video. “ I’m only one mistake away from complete ruin” Thank you, it is a very helpful connection and very supportive to help link the right information that is already here. Amazing really…. the jigsaw pieces.
Only good things., owning this, I’m the one who gave thumbs down…. Respectfully I’m saying that I think this comment is not in the spirit of the message and crosses a boundary. All the best.
Having been raised in a cult, I still have almost a gag reflex toward words "self-love" or "self-acceptance" but I'm learning to take the strength away from this hate. Thanks for your work, I find your videos an invaluable resource for healing from years of abuse.
Your videos are helping me immensely. Deep gratitude for your generosity. I'm 70 and still trying to make sense of my childhood and adulthood narcissistic abuse and heal myself, especially from my unconscious contracts to stay unhappy and unsuccessful, or risk my mother's evil eye. She died a year ago but she is alive in my psyche. My father lives on as the enabling narcissist who normalizes her pathology, sets toxic boundaries and censors any conversation about the family dysfunction. Through his lens, I was the problem.
It is a very big task to fill the void and lack of solid foundation by oneself and for oneself. We see each other here doing the work, and I salute every survivor for the bravery it takes to process and show up for themselves.
It was such a struggle to even realize why there was such a huge hole in my heart. I was expecting my husband to bridge that gulf. It was difficult to realize that he never could. I was expecting him to give me all the love I never received in my family of origin.
Frankly, if I hadn’t had grandparents that loved me, I probably wouldn’t be here.
I'm certain that part of the "work" a narc parent (or other caregiver we have growing up) does is to lay a foundation, so to speak, of lack so that we don't learn how to fill that basic part of us so that they and any other predator can come by and create that dynamic where we allow them to "fill" that space and we become dependent upon them. It's so bizarre: they are the parasites and yet we are the ones that become addicted to the parasite and despite knowing that we're being sucked of our life and energy, we become tricked into thinking we need their poison.
Thanks
I had a very unique experience of being extremely highly valued in the external world ie school, university, career, extended family yet tremendously and horrifically devalued by parents and siblings . This was a strange and confusing experience but it enabled me to create distance from my family of origin. But sadly I stayed in their belief patterns for too long, developed chronic illness as a result, but am now totally independent and self sufficient in my life and look after myselfwith priority and care. Long arduous journey of recovery but it can be done. You do lose trust in yourself after adopting ingrained beliefs of a scapegoat but when you get your confidence back and see your narcissistic parents for what they are, you can reclaim your life gradually. But that is the biggest hurdle, seeing the truth as it seems so hard to believe that your own parents who you loved and were devoted to acted like true emotional and verbal abusers
This man will never know the impact of his work.
Just realised my parents made me believe my need for them to love me is outrageous and I'm being a terrible spoiled brat if I expect something kind and loving from them. Great video. Thank you
Thank you so much for this. It's taken me decades to realize just how deeply the abuse separated me from "myself'. Learning to love myself-----I'm late doing it but at last, it's being done. This guidance is profoundly helpful. {Oh, Happy Halloween to you too!}
I love everything you said! When I catch myself in self-hatred, I look in the mirror into my eyes and say,"I love you so much." Sometimes when I awaken in the middle of the night I put my hand over my heart or solar plexus and speak soothing words as well. Thank you for this! There is quite a bit of science about self-compassion and it's benefits in recovery.
Just broke down by putting hands on solar plexus and hearing the words, "I have you. I'm with you." The extreme release of fear and feeling alone for so long was immense!! Thank you Jay. I wish all well on their journeys!
I also believe, with all the gaslighting we've lived through generally, that it may take a while for our inner child(ren) to really believe what we are telling them with our words. They will need to be shown we mean what we say. I just felt in in me; saying, " Yeah, sure, you say that, but I'm certainly not ready to believe you." A sad commentary on how alone my little girl has felt and feels abandoned by me. We'll work on it together!
You nailed it. I have always had such a difficult time articulating my ambivalent feelings about doing things that are “good for me.” I was always given praise for sacrificing all of my own needs to take care of the needs of the narcissists in my family. As a result, I fundamentally distrust praise. I was constantly criticized whenever I stood up for my own care or tried to demand that the parental figures in my life show accountability and just basically show up and parent. Hearing you describe the sort of phenomenon that I have always struggled with, the push me pull me, it felt very validating. Thank you
When I realized how much love, affection, attention, 24/7 thinking about them, recalibrating myself to please them, and neglecting my own education, art, career, physical health and bank account, I had given to various BFs and my mother and stepfather, I was 1) Sad that they abused it and rejected it ("If you did it this way, then I'd accept your love, but you keep doing it wrong. Keep trying though! I'm patient." 2) Realized that whoa, if I could give myself a fraction of that focus, love, attention, I might survive or even, dare I dream, thrive!? 3) Sadly, I honestly had a phase where I was unsure whether I could do it. 4) I did it! And that's no easy feat when you have surrounded yourself with abusers your whole life, but it's SO worth it! ---- Love your thoughtful videos, thank you!
Your number 2 hit me. Just a fraction of the care and focus on others ---- yes I must remember this!!! Thank-you for this gem❤
@@alwayshoping125 It's a gift to be able to have that love so apply it to yourself. The older I get the more I see how few truly have love and warmth. It'a gift :)
Last several months I have been hugging myself and telling myself that "I'm here, I'm with you"
Thank you beautifully said
Yes, it's amazing how much those words, and sell soothing, helps. Thanks for sharing!
This is what I need to do. I am 68, and have spent most of my life believing I’m here to give up myself for others’ needs, purposes, and narratives. I’m tired, but I have a long way to go, and much to do, before I lie down. It’s come down to my being able to take good enough care of myself to live another 30 years. There are too many people I love, to leave this party early.
It’s good to see another older person here who’s trying to heal the pain from their past. I’m so tired from a long life filled with many narcissistic abusers I wonder if it’s worth the effort. I’ll be 63 in a few days. At least I have learned to take a little bit better care of myself. The abusers are all gone now Thank God. You’re very optimistic about living another 30 years and I wish you well. I know I’ll probably be lucky if I make it to 70. All we can do is our best. Let’s enjoy what’s left and continue with healing.
Thank you for sharing your story, an inspiring story to me, I'm 35, thank you.
Beautiful!!
All the years of being literally dirt poor, and spending every cent on my parents, and other family members, while they all criticised me for being poor. Ugh.
I still remember two years ago the feeling I had when buying almost $20 worth of silicone toe spacers as I had a crossed over toe which would be bleeding by the end of the day. As a housekeeper I always habitually kept my toes curled up so as to not hurt. I felt then like it was an enormous amount to spend on myself, and was looking around to see if anyone was watching, and actually flinching. Much like many years ago when shopping my grandmother wanted to buy me this pretty white cardigan- I was in utter terror of what would happen to me if I let her but knew I couldn't tell her why I couldn't have it. I was about 7, and she is dead now and this one thing bothers me so much.
Thank goodness you purchased the toe spacers. Not really sure what that condition is, but it sounds painful and something you absolutely needed to keep going to work and getting through some long tough days of hard labor. Yes, it's hard to invest in ourselves. Meanwhile, I just got evicted in September after losing my business during Covid and here I am seeing Christmas items arrive in the stores and anticipating the sh*tstorm from my 80+ year old parents who WANT CHRISTMAS PRESENTS! And it's all I can do to get set up in my new, much cheaper apartment... Seriously, I came to realize I am the adult and they are the children in this relationship dynamic. That's one way to reframe that may help you through the holidays. Best of luck!
Thank you for sharing. It seems as if we all share many commonalities. The buying gifts with the precious little that we had is part of my story too.
I've never known how to love myself and maybe have never loved anybody else either . My raging covert narc mother always demanded all my attention and expected me to sacrifice everything for her . This was like expecting to get water from a glass that had never had any water put in it . She relished the psychological torture she put me through and would try to shame me into thinking that I was too 'big for your britches' if I thought I was too good for the shit she dumped on me . I'm glad she's GONE . The hand on the solar plexus and speaking to one's self is strangely comforting .
I hate hate hate the use of “love yourself” as victim blame. For children of narcs, “love yourself” looks a lot like survival. You loved yourself enough to get here.
I swear that every time I hear it I want to purchase that person a personal massager--NO, YOU go love yourself. That and virtue signaling about “forgiveness”. I know that all these nice people don’t give a fig if I forgive, or don’t. How would they even know? They don’t. It’s just the proper thing to say, in order to appear pious. If they cared, there wouldn’t be nearly as many neglected children.
I’ve often wondered myself why they worked so hard to keep me humbled and humiliated. I had 0 self esteem. What were they seeing? I took off my muddy shoes once to walk through a feed store!!!
@@user-ey4rc5tu4t I agree.
The incremental upsurge of newly discovered self-love is proportional to the gnawing, chipping treatment of childhood abuse. Thanks
I can totally relate to the analytical thing and I still do this. I was always searching for an answer for my low self esteem, anxiety, etc and was patiently waiting for the day when I would feel good enough. Like, if I only I could figure out the secret ingredients that everyone else seems to know and apply it to myself somehow. It never occurred to me to ask myself what I wanted or how I even felt about anything, and it never even occurred to me that anything was wrong with my upbringing until probably my late 20's.
Yes, I've finally figured out that I am always waiting and searching for the moment it can all make sense. My hamster wheel is spinning and spinning until I finally remember to ask myself what I am feeling at that moment, and most of the time it stops the spinning.
Yup, that feeling that we were transplanted from another planet and don't quite understand the language and customs :)
I’m glad for you that you learned that so early. I was about 59 when I heard about narcissism and narcissistic families. It’s lifesaving for many of us.
@@goldieh7121 I understand.
@@Chahlie yes
Jay thank you so much again. All your beautiful work makes such a difference to my life. This video came today shortly after I asked God for help to know how I stop shaming myself and to love myself so I know I'm loved by him too, you are an angel to me and I appreciate what you say so much. Thank you and much love to you, best wishes, Harry
I felt warmth in my heart from your message - I also asked God for help today on related subject, because I still have this feeling of God dissatisfied with my aspiration to learn self-love, self-care and self-protection. Sometimes I clearly feel that I'm projecting reaction of narcissistic parent onto God and can dissolve it easily, but other times I feel guilt just for wanting to name it as projection and not wanting it to be the real attitude of God towards me. Especially because a lot of people depict God as altruistic narcissist (i think they even don't realise it) and I still detox not only from lifetime of narcissistic abuse, but spiritual abuse, which is so similar to narcissistic one. The more I dig into narc.abuse the more it helps me to untangle my relationship with God.
(I'm not a native speaker, I hope I managed to put my thoughts into words correctly)
@@RK-qs5dy I hope I hear you right RK when you said about how you feel or worry sometimes you project onto God the narcissistic parent, if so I really hear you and I get this too and it sends me into a shame spiral. I think I'm learning that I feel fear and shame about this because at a point in my past, the child me had to see me as the problem and at fault, when it was really my parents. When I begin to believe I'm not responsible for these fears about God being a narcissistic parent, I begin to understand my parents are responsible for these fears. This starts to free me from the shame I carry which is not in fact mine.
@@RK-qs5dy I hope I hear you right RK when you said about how you feel or worry sometimes you are projecting onto God the narcissistic parent. If so I really hear you. I get this too. We're not though. I know that much. The fear I feel that I'm projecting onto God is part of my shame response, which I now see is also not my fault but a survival adaptation to my abusive parents. I wish you every success in recovery from this awful abuse. Its not our fault and God loves us, and is on our side 😊
@@Harry-qw5jv thank you for response! I also wish you healing and living your full life 😊 Yes, it was a battle to imagine God on my side and to trust Him after so much betrayal.
I also discovered that shame/guilt/fear/irritation towards myself were not mine - these were instilled by narcissists feelings, which were hindering my real feelings and preventing me from getting in contact with my real feelings: a lot of pain. It was like an almost physical sensation of layer, which I am not allowed to uncover. As if when I try to get in contact with myself I must stumble upon this self-hatred and self-blame and think that they are my own feelings towards myself and there is nothing besides them and that's all I deserve because I'm somehow inherently awful.
And I was not allowed to display pain and even feel it, because it will be harmful for the image of ideal parent. When I try to feel my pain there is always interruption from guilting and shaming angry voice. Because of my pain parents look like bad parents and this is worse crime than all that they have done to me. And as if I'm pretending to be in pain just to harm their image.
Self compassion has been my practice since 2023-4. Studies show that self-compassion helps one to be more emotionally resilient and self-sustaining than berating oneself. I love the analogies you use in your videos and cultural references to film, music and stories. The stock market analogy made total sense. One can say it happens in chemical reactions too. When electrons are removed, bonds collapse quickly but adding them requires more energy and is a slower process. You rock, Jay! Thank you! Im looking forward to studying and continuing my healing through your courses.
Just realized I'm watch this and commenting a second time!😂
To hear from someone who makes a sense i havent heard in 30 yrs of searching, to hear that person say that ones most shameful moments deserve most respect...thank you. My degree in psych didnt give me this. Yoy did for free when my perilously won recovery needed it most, was stalled and imperilled for this very question...Namaste and thank you💖
That example you gave of doing a task and feeling like it’s not good enough, then stopping to recognize that it doesn’t matter, I love you (me)! I go through that. I used to get really stuck in a shame spiral when doing a simple task like doing dishes and making a small mistake. I still have moments when the shame comes up over a simple mistake, but I’m able to catch it now and shift my thinking … most times, it takes mindfulness. Happy Halloween!
Beloved Child, yes I can connect. It was indoctrination
Me too Beloved Child, in me the shame spiral is worst when the thing involves doing a task that could help or harm someone, for example giving my pet a new prescription pill to try to help him I go into a shame spiral worrying I might have harmed him instead, and I become crippled over the decisions I must make regarding his or my own health. One of my parents would continually harass me over what food could have caused a food intolerance reaction in me or our pet cat who I had the respi si ilty to feed in childhood, blaming me covertly over and over for this, until it became my default to try to find out what I had lovingly or enjoyably fed myself or our cat which caused a food intolerance or reaction. It feels at times like the entire life of myself or my pets lies in my hands alone and one mistake will lead to death of one of us. Trouble is there's no possible way to know how my pet will react to a new food or pill without trying and if he's ill he needs help of course. This makes decisions cripplingly shame and terror inducing. I always knew if I got a major disease she would ask me what I could have done that caused it, and this might actually be worse than the diagnosis itself. It is a terror shame spiral. Just awful to witness in oneself. Thanks for Jay's videos, it is so helpful to begin to be released from this nightmare.
@@Harry-qw5jv I’m so glad you’re coming out of the nightmare. I wonder. Did you always suspect something was wrong or not quite right? I did but I just couldn’t put my finger on it. I’m so glad I’ve awakened. Sounds like you have too. Congratulations. ❤️
@@Harry-qw5jv "I am always one mistake away from complete ruin" is the title of Jay's video here th-cam.com/video/95GnZWLAX7I/w-d-xo.html Definitely worth watching and then try to catch yourself falling into catastrophic thinking. It's tough and relentless but can be stopped. I never have enough money and worry excessively about spending too much on some small item (like 20 euros), or having a difficult conversation where I need to voice some complaints and ensure my needs are being met, etc. and have lately decided to stop torturing myself over EVERY LITTLE THING and to progress more smoothly, rapidly and easily through life. Just get the thing done, then move on to the next... and maybe one day, get back to having FUN and a sense of humor and living fully again!
I so get it! I think growing up and in adulthood, my parents and others around me, used my strong sense of responsibility to manipulate me. When I was actually being responsible enough for my age, they would tell me I was irresponsible because they didn't like the way I was behaving. I think we end up feeling an overwhelming sense of responsibility, more than is normally expected, so we never feel responsible enough or set the bar way to high for ourselves. We weren't taught that it's okay to make mistakes and any mistakes they made were our fault. Our parents should have been helping us navigate through our learning and mistakes. Children should never be made to feel shame for being human and imperfect.
Thank you so much for this. I have practiced the ‘hand on heart saying I love you’ to yourself and if you do it regularly for a few weeks it really starts to grow and resonate. I can’t recommend this practice highly enough. ❤
Hi all, doing Halloween 🎃 sweets here with the kids. European/ GMT.
Nice to have you here in the background. And yes the instinct to care goes way beyond “co-dependent”. So for all our inner children, a smile, sweets/ candy and happy scary at my front door for us all.
Thankyou for all of your information. I see that everyone here is in a safe and healing space. I am 50 years old and in recovery like all here. I am learning and healing so much here. Thankyou all for your courage and compassion. It is so rare.
Thank you Jay. I really appreciate everything you have said, it is so important to develop a loving relationship with one’s self. I have noticed how touching my skin while rubbing some oils can feel so calming and soothing and helps to appreciate my body I have been given. It is finding love and meaning in the little things that makes a lot of difference.
When I put my hands on my solar plexus, I immediately felt comforted and it brought tears to my eyes. What a beautiful, helpful suggestion. Thank you!
Very true! Stand in your truth. Say no. See that you have value. I think inner child work can help you possibly understand your vulnerabilities.
Learning to love ourselves the right way, versus the way they showed us love, can be tricky. These videos are helpful in learning the appropriate way to talk to ourselves lovingly. I don't ever remember my parents telling me it's okay to feel a certain way, or that they're sorry I was going through anything. There are also so many other helpful loving phrases that would have helped us navigate life much easier growing up. But, even now, learning self compassion can be a game changer. Thank you 💕
This was a great video. The explanations help us gain perspective on what happened to us. And the advice and techniques at the end were incredibly helpful. I am going to implement them. Thank you for your work helping us.
You often take a broad, "big picture" perspective. I find this is congruent with my own big picture reflections which, in turn, is part of my life path to cope with my background. I need this frame of mind part of the time as I move along through my life. Thank you.
Thanks for exploring this aspect of the abuse we take up upon ourselves that we need to reweave. The stock analogy is helpful since this is also a man made abuse tool. Good to hear my therapist is on point using the family systems strategy. Cheers
That was a really elegant explanation of fear( which breeds hatred) vs love
Thank you so much. After many years of therapy I now sometimes manage to accept myself. I was in this waiting game and I waited far too long until I might some day "solve the problem that is me" ...
I’ve been working through your class. Some insights are really clicking for me now. The visuals/diagrams and psychology of the scapegoat have helped so much!
I wanna go trick or treating at ur house u seem like you'd have the best candy
To love oneself is to love God,God + self = love ❤️, know that you are loved and have always been loved. It is better to be love then to seek love.no one can love you as much as God loves .just remember you are love,,,,you can not find love through the mind,,,,love is in the heart,,,,
I think so. I feel like there is a natural love and reverence for our highest ideals of God. And rather than lay this at the feet of religion, we celebrate in spite of religion. They used our reverence to slave us. But while they wield our faith like a sword against us, they don’t believe. They never believed. They never had to.
Hi again Jay, I also had a suggestion for a topic I'd love for you to cover. We talk about healing a lot, but to me that implies that we were evrr whole.For example, uf I break my arm and I want it to heal, I want it to be back the way it was before.
A person who was raised by narcissists does not have a "before" to go back to. They have to try to become something they have never been, and don't necessarily even know that much about! It is quite a challenge.
It is very challenging I agree.
There is still an inner child in us. The authentic WE. As we get safer, more attentive to ourselves, more self-loving... we can gradually hear the soft voice of our true self. We build from scratch, you are right. It's a new US. We get to know who we really are. It's an adventure, best experienced when sourounded by new, loving, growing people (like for example in ACA 12step groups or group therapies). 🤗 You don't have to do this alone. We are social beings and best grow/heal through (new, nurturing, mutual) relationships; our wounds need to be seen and excepted by 'enlightened witnes' (aka therapist).
🤗🍀
So right. Never thought about it that way before . Like trying to become something unknown.
Jay Reid is my hero. I feel like he experienced my childhood and ensuing abuse as an adult. 🤗
Would love to take the course, but being disabled and living on $1k a month, it's reasonably priced but still out of reach.
Animal right was my solution for having a worthwhile life which is neither for the narcissist mother nor myself. I do love and identify with the situation many animals are in. I learn what love and closeness feel like from my own animals. It wasn't until recently I got in contact with my inner parts. Their suffering moved me a great deal. Including them in my love and compassion is actually easy. It feels very healing, like wanting to make up all the lost time.
I love these videos. They are so full of practical tools that work in the here and now to stabilise and ground me in the reality that the worst is over. There is light at the end of the tunnel. Thanks for sharing your light with us Jay.
Incredibly useful, profound and insightful video on the v painful and lifelong journey that is 'recovery from narcissistic abuse' 💔. There is always hope 🙏😊🙏❤️! Many Thanks, Jay
It is a lifelong journey isn't it.
Videos like this are so comforting and validating, thank you
This is such a helpful video. Enjoyed it more and more as it went on....and especially when you discussed the beautiful, loving practices we can do by ourselves. I am looking forward to trying them. Will definitely be watching it again. Thank you!
You are amazing........I was looking for exactly such kind of understanding and the lines you give - oh they are so helpful, I re-read those, write it in for self, and re-watch videos..........Its such great help, enabling, motivating at deeper level............from core of my heart - Thanks a lot, sending you much Love and Light.........may you grow and succeed in a very prosperous way - its a blessing from my heart full of Gratitude......I know this will reach you.......Thank you so much again - this came exactly at the right time.....!!
Thank you Jay, so helpful.
Jay, this choked me up. I pray I can practice this more and more every day with the time remaining. Godspeed 🙏✝️🌹
This was beautifuly stated! Thank you for sharing 💖😀
Just found u recently JAY. I love. Ur delivery of knowledge.
@0:45 “It’s the… Eye of the tiger!”
Thankyou so much for your wonderful work🙏🙏🙏🌼
Hello Jay I had a question on this section: "We're going to think something about ourselves in order to stay away from the worst outcome" 10:27 I was going to kill myself thinking that I was worthless because of the way I was treated, I thought I deserved to kill myself. Isn't it better to have knew that I was lovable and worthy? Instead of the false image my narcissist dad was throwing out on me? Asking seriously, because I am trying to figure it out to want to help others feel better about themselves.
I think it helps to remember the things said to you were projections of how your father felt about himself, or was told about himself. It's hard for our young selves to understand, and I think we get stuck in our younger self where this is concerned (emotional flashbacks, etc.). Integrating the young self with the adult self and ridding false beliefs we were programmed to repeat is perhaps one of the most important goals in my opinion.
Just remember this- if we do commit suicide it just gives them an opening to "tut tut" and it 'proves' that we were defective all along. I made the mistake of saying I was in therapy...well "It's about time..." Little did they know their supply was about to be cut off :)
@@pelletier4432 Thank you so much for your answer xo
@@Chahlie Thank you so much Heather, wishing you all the best and more!
@@Chahlie I just thought about something, in retrospect I was never defective, but with years of intense abuse I coudn't see life worth living for. This is why I want to help others to not give up. People who committed suicide are not weak, they were strong for so long. Now I love life, since I'm away from my abusers.
Thank you so much for this
I’ve been stuck in the guilt and shame cycle; I’ve lost a lot in my identity from never overcoming emotional neglect or figuring out how to cope instead I went straight to alcohol..I entered a relationship that probably is my most healthiest, but because of my emotional fragility I’ve executed emotional abuse…and got consumed by self hatred that it’s hard to forgive myself for being reactive. For being someone I was scared to become and hurting someone I love deeply that I started hating them because of the things I’ve done. I know how wrong that sounds and it’s not their fault. I feel like I’ve lost myself in the hatred for the things I’ve done, I let alone have trouble expressing how I feel from these places. Can you receive so much damage that it’s too late to come back? I’ve convinced myself I’m a narcissist, after all I’m preoccupied anxious, and have strong people pleasing behaviors. I’m too focused on what I’ve done feeling guilty about things and apologizing but the hatred and self pity is self sabotage. It’s like a wall I can’t climb to show the other person I do care. I feel like I have to constantly prove that. I should have focused merely on the self not how people view me and understood what it means to love and have healthy relationships. I often avoided people because I felt like I was internalizing everything they said, their emotions, and I would only focus on the narratives. The tone of voice, expressions, drop me into hyper vigilance. So much distortion trying to read people and input assumptions, i went crazy just to cram myself to be ready to face social situations, relationships, being cautious. I did so much damage to myself and to other people it feels irreversible.
Is yoga also a self loving practice similar to Qigong?
Great video!!!
Thank you
wow thank you
I put my hand on my chest and feel judged and i slow down and feel judged, even when i'm alone i hate it.
Hey Jay. Watching 'Monsters and Mysteries in America." There are actual flying monkeys created by a mad scientist in Napa valley. Guess it's full of narcissists too. #toomuchtimeonhands
WOW....
Hey dude, this is a really good video. You should go back and finish editing it!
This video is two years old.
Is that course still available?
Yes! You can find link on the description box.
@@jreid-heal-narcissistic-abuse
👍😀
Hello Jay, I was thinking that the word "entelechy" might be a good way to describe the drive to be all that one can be.
Also, I just "butt reported" hateful or abusive content by mistake! I am not sure what I reported . So sorry!
No idea how to do this. Never have...
Jack Ntulsa. Maybe you can say that was then and this is now and who knows what the future holds? So baby steps maybe, yes it’s a alien concept.
Same
To the person who responded to another commentator and put the link in for Jay’s video. “ I’m only one mistake away from complete ruin”
Thank you, it is a very helpful connection and very supportive to help link the right information that is already here. Amazing really…. the jigsaw pieces.
Also for me, the most poignant video has been. “. There is nothing wrong with how you love”. I’m sure it’s easy enough to find with the posted link.
🙏🏽
Wow 🤩 what a beautiful masculine face structure, I can feel the high levels of testosterone from Paris. 😁😉
Only good things., owning this, I’m the one who gave thumbs down…. Respectfully I’m saying that I think this comment is not in the spirit of the message and crosses a boundary. All the best.
I have thought the same. Very handsome man.
People shouldn't have to pay for recovery from abuse... what a scam this is.
Having been raised in a cult, I still have almost a gag reflex toward words "self-love" or "self-acceptance" but I'm learning to take the strength away from this hate.
Thanks for your work, I find your videos an invaluable resource for healing from years of abuse.