PGL Major teams ranked w/ moses, cadiaN adresses HUNDEN claims | HLTV Confirmed S5E59
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ก.ค. 2024
- HLTV Confirmed gather up with moses to discuss the pre-Major roster updates (Astralis, fnatic, Complexity, Liquid) and make the team tier list for PGL Major. During the show, the HUNDEN vs. Heroic drama was discussed, and suddenly, cadiaN joined the show to defend his team and present his point of view of what happened.
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0:00 - Podcast intro
Recent news
8:58 - Xyp9X extends with Astralis
19:14 - The future of Astralis roster
24:50 - adreN out, jokasteve to coach Liquid
34:32 - Morale problems in Liquid
44:25 - smooya joins fnatic
46:30 - Complexity drop poizon; team’s problem
52:43 - Where poizon could go?
56:35 - Why nitr0 wasn’t picked up?
59:00 - 00Nation pick up fer
1:01:26 - FPX drop Devilwalk & peca
1:04:30 - EXTREMUM put AU roster on hold
1:07:23 - floppy in talks with Extra Salt
Heroic vs. HUNDEN (feat. cadiaN)
1:11:33 - Recreating the timeline
1:14:40 - “I want to delete HUNDEN from the entirety of CS” - moses
1:18:10 - How were niko, cadiaN, stavn, TeSeS involved?
1:31:23 - cadiaN joins the show!
1:46:58 - Did cadiaN & the team know the bug existed?
1:49:35 - Heroic deciding to speak out
1:52:54 - Why Heroic players didn’t understand what’s going on?
1:59:00 - cadiaN shares timeline of leaked strats scandal
2:09:13 - “It’s become a 'he said she said' ” - SPUNJ
2:13:30 - Was niko’s punishment too light?
2:22:06 - Xizt joins Heroic as Major coach & analyst
2:28:28 - moses: “All Heroic players shouldn’t play this Major”
2:35:23 - Who wants to be a skinionaire? By BitSkins
PGL Major
2:42:30 - Seeding system issues
2:49:09 - What went wrong with the RMRs
2:57:18 - Tiermaker of Major teams
3:37:36 - Parimatch Matchmaker - Major dark horses
3:44:00 - Final words
HLTV Confirmed is a CS:GO (Counter-Strike: Global Offensive) talk show featuring Chad "SPUNJ" Burchill, Zvonimir "Professeur" Burazin, and Milan "Striker" Švejda, with guest appearances from community members such as device, ropz, Twistzz, karrigan, shox, TaZ, GeT_RiGhT, HenryG, JW, smooya, YNk, Maniac, Pimp, seang@res, and more. The show is based around interviews, breakdowns, analysis, and discussions about the esports and casual side of Counter-Strike.
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/ caspercadian
#HLTVConfirmed #podcast #csgo - เกม
![CS:GO - Team Liquid vs. Astralis [Dust2] Map 3 - Group B - ESL Pro League Season 10 Finals](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YiAvwr-IHrg/mqdefault.jpg)
![[ไฮไลต์] แบดมินตันชาย วิว กุลวุฒิ ไทย vs ฟินแลนด์ รอบแบ่งกลุ่ม | โอลิมปิก 2024](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/GIbeFO0tvnQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Honestly suprised we didn't get our own biggest disappointment category, but go off moses
:/
self aware org PogO
Rip les gars
Roasting yourself in the comments huh? 😂
G2 Esports stop posting stuff on TH-cam and go buy zywoo
Less delayed than Heroic's reaction to finding out HUNDEN was in the coach bug
Jesus prof you didn't have to murder them like that
My sister still wants to know when you're gonna set up an Onlyfans page.
stop, they're already dead
3:40:58 g2 are 0-2 in the legends stage and down a map in the b03. Map 2, g2 are down 3-12. During halftime, niko and hunter get out of their chairs, stand on their desks, perform a bosnian family ritual, and kiss passionately on the lips. Second half starts, they both pop off, carrying g2 and don't drop a map for the rest of the tournament. In the playoffs, they 2-0 vitality, 2-0 astralis, and then beat navi in the grand final 32-0.
Lmfao
wtf lmao
Dafuq...lmao🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Just want to say. Gg to Cadian. Much respect for just showing up on the show like this, answering "the call" and sitting in front of te questions, talking this through and showing up. Adult in the room here.. gg and go Heroic !
yeah, right, and he faced no hard questions and was allowed to just freely talk whatever he wanted. g g w p scene is dead
Fair point. No one is fully inocent here. Everyone contributed to this whole mess in their own way. But what's up with casually trowing around "the scene is dead" ? What good saying these things do ? Pathetic thing to say, sorry. Can we just bring some positivity to the scene ?
@@KamKrzem Yeah lmao, cs community gets so easily swayed by these hltv "interviews" of players.
I mean Dark Horse has to be Liquid right? It's literally a dark horse.
im mad that i laughed at this
Just want to say... So good to jave Moses on the show. He always provides a mature and well thought out perspective. He just makes sense. Really really nice to hear his perspective.
Mad respect for striker for crediting liquidpedia as well as himself for informing on the rmr madness
This episode was great guys. You got me so excited for the major now! Can't wait :DD
EG: Stan, Rush, Junior, oBo, Breeze and Extra Salt: AZR, Osee, Floppy, Fang, Liazz
Junior for cerq?? 🤮🤮
Wtf yo junior sucks,cerq aint great eather but atleast he aint that bad.
EG needs to just wipe the slate clean and rebuild around oBo, but we all know they dont have the funds or patience
@@samuelbelko6469 Junior is one the best prospects in NA, he joined furia a team that speaks a different language. The guy is a beast
@@Polyvalent I’m sure they have the funds. They are a T1 org with an LCS slot. The problem with the wiping the slate completely is that there is not many options in NA. If they work with the core Stan, Breze, oBo and fill in with some good pieces they might be able to find consistency
I didnt play CS today for this.. This show is so great at times
By far one of the best episodes even though the topic is mostly revoled around Heroic and the Major. More 4 hour episodes to come?
I don't see Astralis lose if they make it to the final. Just a different beast at that point.
I love the show. I intended to come over to skip through the bookmarks, get updated -but I ended up staying here for 2 hours. How do you do that??
I liked how professor resisted Cadian. You can't teach prof he teaches you. Lol
Just wanted to let you guys know that I love ur Podcast.
Cadian pissed at Hunden because they couldn't win even with him cheating
I know this will be a banger episode
The Matchmaker section was lit af💯🔥🤣
i still don't understand why they re signed hunden after LOL
Same
He had really good game sense
@@Izotopas yeah using HUNDEN cam lmfao
@@Izotopas LOL fax
absolutely loved the classic "my brother did it" excuse for teses boost
This one was a spicy one boys...
Did moses and any of those casters make their pick ems? I want to see it. Can somebody link it if you know?
As a liquid fan, SPUNJ is absolutely correct about the emotion problems of the team
As a liquid fan? Noooo... Really?? Noooo...
I’d agree but I’d also say it’s getting better. Liquid have had some pretty solid come backs recently. Let’s also not forget that liquid had made a great come back vs heroic until that 1v5. I think that’s more than we’d have expected from liquid in the past.
On a side note, if stewie keeps the form he had at the end of the fall showdown, he could solve this problem because he’s hyped and playing well.
Too many fragile egos maybe
Damn you a Liquid fan? Jesus you have some crazy insight must be...
@@c1pher428 I dont think its an Ego problem, I believe is more a mentality and personality problem, but that can be handled in time...
2:33:00 Scenes we might not see again for a long while.
'Xtrfy, I don't spell them anymore...' That's continuity!
chad needs to spell this out, I cant spell extrafi for shit!
I know cadian had a lot to say, but thank you HLTV for being the platform and treating him fairly...... good question and only accepting direct answers
Very suprised by how people are overrating Astralis going into this event. Huge roster moves every other week and an IGL swap out before the major. Glaive hasn't played a pro match in two months and it's not like they're just going to get the high fragging IGL superstar straight back either, his last events for Astralis were awful; 0.84, 0.99, 0.90 ratings for his last three events.
Plus their first major without Mr Consistant.
35:00 onwards. SPUNJ got no filter. I love it.
how does bitskin help with lag?
Moses brings something good to the show
sound is half a sec off.
BIG go for semis ;) Tabsen has a lot of stuff in his Backpack !
Onliners. K1to only can play deagle on FPL. Tizian shaky too. Tabsen and Syrson can't carry the whole team by themselves..
For a sec I thought Moses was drinking a pbr for skinionaire but a la croix is aight too
Gla1ve, Xyp9x, Bubzkji, Lucky, K0nfig. Thinking they will lose Magisk and Dupreeh after the major when their contracts are up. On Heroic's stratbook, that's almost certainly Heroic intellectual property. It's common for any organisation that deals in IP rights in the form of written documents to *protect* these assets legally. Even if it's just there in the contract and hard to legally pursue in a court. If it's not in the contract, it's not in the contract (and the Hunden contract becomes utterly stupid and weak). To assume it isn't, is asinine. Those files were not *his* and for a heap of other reasons this is morally reprehensible
I can understand dupreeh can go to nip for example, or to col to play with es3, but why would magisk leave, he is probably second best player right now in astralis after dupreeh
Magisk stays instead of bubzkji unless he wants to leave(no signs of that)
0 chance hey take bubz over magisk
+1
4 hour episode, I really like those Srof & Ptryker guys!
That's why nitr0 was so important for Team Liquid . For the majority of the time that they were dominating ,nitr0 was like the barrier that keep the mental side of Liquid up .
These 3 people at HLTV confirmed has spent more time than any judges or team to find the bloody guilty person guilty. Keep rocking.
That's really disingenuous to all the work that ESIC have done
Peeps are underestimating NIP massively ... They are playing so good these days.
They had like one good tournament bro.
@@liam3104 I think their main issue was Dev1ce being just okayish. In the last RMR he was firing on all cylinders. But yeah that would still put them in dark horse category.
@@PiyushJena the only team they beat in the irrelevant iem fall was vitality. Its a good win but again the tournament was just a qualifier :D and vitality literally could care less.
two tournaments finals and one trophy, what do you expect more from a new roster
@@liam3104 you are wrong you know? They topped their group at blast, went unbeaten at this rmr. This is more than enough good form considering the recent update and showing how well NIP has adopted to ancient.
Roll the bumper Lucas !!!! 💯🙌👏👏
Liquid repeats the C9 story from Boston major.
Lot of credit to Cadian. Gained lots of respect
How are you not talking about BIG not even in the parimatch?
Big is gonna perform i see them top4 atleast..
3:14:07 how can moses say that when Nip have lost on ancient once in the past 3 months????
probably because he can only dream of knowing even a tenth of what people like Thorin know
Because he's a human and he made a mistake.
@@theairflare Jesus dude chill out,man Can be wrong sometimes.
Nip lost ancient whenever they picked it
So it is a terrible map pick for them.
@@gadjman yes, i am so sorry for pointing out a misstake that he should know, isn't his job to work with csgo?
i fell like hunden embodies the Eddie Guerrero Theme Song.. LOL... Lie, Cheat & Steal
lets not forget the device never turns up in the most important matches at majors. only way astralis won 4 majors was with a lot of people that could turn up and make up for device when it realy mattered. train against vp device wiffed 90precent of the shots he took
two 16-0 in a week Poizon is smart to get out KEKW
Ok Col new brand not Juggernaut but underdog team: jks, liazz, rush, esetag and Nitro as in game leader
Even though I really like how Astralis played in 18 and 19, I doubt they'll make it that far given the fact that they don't have a top-tier Awper on their rooster. The same goes for G2. My top 3 would be Navi, Vitality and Gambit. Because they all have a top-tier Awper and at least 1 superstar-like rifler to support them. Once top awpers catch on fire, they are really hard to stop, even by top riflers. The real dark horses for me would be VP and NIP.
who is vitality’s superstar rifler?
@@renj1935 I think shox but misutaa has been playing damn well too
I just read that VP removes Sanji prior to the commencement of the Major. Now I'd drop VP as heavy contender and put Chokequid or ENCE ahead of them.
How is the #2 ranked team in the world a dark horse lol?
@@CHRIZZ83 hltv are not gods of the universe. nip are not the 2nd best team in the world by a long shot
3:41:46 Best scenario ever
4 h9urs? Damn!
1:55:43 Atta boy Cadian
Liquid needs to talk to no tail and ceb from OG DOTA
SPUNJ would make a phenomenal pasta author
*copy pasta author
@@rivervp8167 anyone with more than two braincells will figure it out what kind of pasta I mean, then again I forgot to include you
Funny how Moses went from talking about how the players should have harsher punishment to having a lot of sympathy for them when they said Cadian was coming on.
I hate Moses
I feel like everyone is overrating astralis way too much. Their best showing this year was like a quarterfinals which was on lan but one good event is being rated higher than gambit who have been either ranked 1 or 2 the whole year. Lan experience is wayyyyy too overblown
The reason why Heroic has been so lenient with Hunden is because they obviously knew. Any other case, he would be out the door in a minute. Now they are just trying to save themselves. And ESIC are cowards. Always have been
I'm a little surprised that Cadian came on to address the situation. I don't think he did himself or his team many favors by commenting on it. ESIC ruled in the teams favor and were super lenient towards them and he could just be giving them more evidence to make a new decision in light of what he said on here. Especially with the whole thing about the team knowing that Hunden cheated but not taking it anywhere. It's a weird angle to say to basically say "Valve won't respond, so why even bother?" You have to say something and show good faith in at least acknowledging what is going on and saying "This isn't right".
Beyond that, the Niko situation is a huge mess. I get that he has some things in play that influence his ability to discern what's happening, but cheating is pretty clear. You knew your coach cheated and didn't do anything. There has to be some kind of a ban for that in light of how everything else was handled. ESIC's punishment system is super weird given how Ian responded to the question. How is there no problem for players knowing about cheating and not reporting it but Furia's coach Guerri had 1 round where the bug happened, he didn't even benefit from it and got slapped with a 3 month ban?
This whole catastrophe gets more weird and messy with every bit of info that comes out.
wait what
no Harry and Hugo as casters for Major ?????
how can this happen
They are one of the best casters along with spunj and machine
This is not done bro
they will probably be at the next one, especially if esl host it
People actually want casters that talk and not just make loud “ahhhh” noises the whole time
@@nickb1848 This is all you get from Harry and Hugo? Come on.
The casters invited to major are at least not worse than h&h. You probably only wached cs for the last few years if you think they are the best
@@MrJeanjean2009 unfortunately that’s all I get from them. I think they’re good guys but I just don’t like their casting b
Wish they figure out some of the details before they do the pod.
Hunden benched himself from mad lions
Regarding the Hunden cheating situatian... There are some important comments here to mention. These players are really young, without the life experience and general mental toughness and well learned ability to judge different situations in life. This is a big general problem here. Internet hatred in this type of situation can be really really draining and though. It fucks up your self confidence. Especially when you do not yet have the life experience that helps you build a strong coping mechanism and good and healthy way of dealing with things and handleing adversity. They are genuinely affected. Apart from Cadian who is a more experienced individual (still put in a really though situation) the other guys are basically young kids who do not yet have built the experience and self confidence for themselves that you guys already have. And we are asking them to be professionals. On the other hand it is only fair to ask this as they are well paid professionals. This does not just mean to play well and grind and collect the paycheck and when shit happens you come out as the victim (which to be fair they actually are victims in a way). It also means that you have to stand up for the reputation, and competitive integrity that you have built trough the years from a really really young age. The players and the org tried to brush this under the rug at their respective time and did not stand up at the time for their own competitive integrity and they did not handle it professionally therefore even when they come out like this, it makes it hard for them to win back their credibility. Make no mistake, I am a fan, I support them, I think they are a good team and good guys, I want them to succeed. But they have to learn from this and understand what it means to really be a professional. You can't just try to not tell anyone. You have to speak up at that exact time and stand up and say that this has been used and that this should be punished accordingly. That is professional. Standing up in time for yourself before you are already presiurized by others. I support them, but they were fucked over and than they handled this really badly. To come back to my earlier point. There is a conflict in understanding what it means to be a professional, asking young kids to be professional before they have the capability to do so. But at the end of the day obviously it is only fair to ask that when they have a good contract with a good payday. WE ALL HAVE TO LEARN FROM THIS !!!
I'm glad someone has a nuanced opinion on this.
I feel bad for them, it really sucks to be put into this situation without having the experience to deal with it.
But at the same time, most people start their careers at the same age (20-25); if they don't act professionally, they bear the consequences.
It sucks, but they have to suck it up. Just the way the world works unfortunately.
man I miss counter points..
2:35:50
Want to phone a friend
Give us mantuu
1:34:22 Danish 🤣
3:36:14 Striker trashing on Copenhagen Flames, and they defeated Astralis and BIG today, he acts like knows everything on cs, can't even respect someone else opinion lol
As much as I want, how much I like cadian as a player or person, to affect my opinion on this situation, I can't deny that regardless of what proof is available, it's very obvious that these players knew what was happening. They deserve some kind of punishment, even if one isn't officially handed.
Can you elaborate on why is it very obvious? (that these players knew what was happening)?
I do not have a dog in a fight, just asking.
@@svirv Hunden released evidence showing cadian setting up the camera before a match and chat logs of niko basically saying everyone on the team knew
@@DuckoftheDraw link?
@@DuckoftheDraw by _setting up the camera_, you mean someone boosted HUNDEN in a position?
[A] It was Teses. His explanation sounds completely plausible: that his focus was on warming up to the match about to start. He didn't question Hunden's request because his focus was away, and no thought of "your credible coach is about to cheat, and you should investigate or deny the boost" entered his mind when HUNDEN asked for a boost.
[B] If no, you mean something else by Cadian, pls explain/link?
About niko's quote, based on the context of the conversation and other evidence, it is very likely niko was manipulated into saying something untrue. Far, far more likely than this quote being truthful, and the context and other evidence being bullshit, and a big conspiracy behind. This is the conclusion of people who digged this case.
@@DuckoftheDraw P.S. The only "ugly" in my opinion: Cadian and stavn were notified post-match that Hunden cheated in Heroic's loss to Astralis.
The fact they didn't disclose it to anyone else and were complicit in their reaction (other than saying "strong words against cheating" between themselves), in my opinion, deserves a form of penalty. Because their inaction allowed this to potentially continue (and continue it did), and allowed Hunden to get away with first solved murder.
Especially for Cadian who's a grown adult and is well versed in the industry (pretty sure 18-y.o. stavn was torn and just went along with Cadian's measures - lack of measures). To leave it completely behind closed doors and to continue like nothing happened? What kind of message this sends to the guilty coach?..
Shady. In my opinion, definitely deserves a penalty for Cadian and stavn, although not as severe as for cheating.
Astralis was sooo overhyped by many experts. And yes, I said it before the major already.
2:28:20 Bald man moses spittin fax
He should have said that to cadian
Why doesn’t CS do a regional league system And everyone plays each other 2/3 times in a “season” using the new short version of the game in a BO3.
Then the top 5/10 players with the most points, from each region, at the end of the season, go through to the bigger tournament, just like they to in “conventional” sports.
And the rest of the teams who didn’t get through, start their player brake early, then once all the tournaments are finished, then everyone has a break.
If we have leagues, this gives traditional tier 2/3 teams the ability to play the top teams, in regions that are a little light in teams, so we could have an EMEA, APAC, LATAM and NA leagues.
100 points for a win
50 for a draw
25 for a loss
And the bottom 3 teams get relegated and gives lower tier teams the ability to move up.
All these leagues can be played online and then Lan for the major tournaments.
NIP vs Astralis grand final and NIP wins.
1:46:57 oh ye from back in tricked you say hmm hmm hmm
Lmao with all the hype going around Navi winning the major, there’s a very good chance they won’t. They barely defeated vitality.
To be fair ,Navi was vouched to win alot of Major but so far they've won none .
It's just so random with Navi .You could either meet a hyper Navi that win every duel and insane 1vs 5 clutches or a very frustrated Navi that need S1mple to carry them .
the 1200 likes is likely russains likes 😉😉😉😉😉😉😉
How come? Astralis no chance team for sure - their time is up,
Gambit probably wins the Major,
VP - disappointment (i hope not),
NaVi - wont make it happen,
NIP - dark horse,
Vitality finalist
Nah, Astralis is favorite just because they are the defending champions.
No way you really said Gamb0t over Nav1. What a joke, NaVi smashed Gambit multiple times in their own online element, imagine on LAN.
@@tyby2076 as long as they've Lucky (unlucky ) it is a dream for em br0 , believe that
@@chewyn6696 how about the last one they played vs one another, NaVi is on top yh but Gamb1t probably only team can whoop NaVi
@@temurergashev they lost to BIG didn't they? Teams update their plays after every tournament.
damn what a clownfiesta those picks
yo please get moses back on
The fact they put up a billboard for the guy when he came back just shows these guys are lying. What a mess.
Wtf guys, this is completely out of reality like what you expect??? Do tou really expect go heroic and gambit that far? Why you completely ignore Cologne results?? That was only LAN event in long time and major is also LAN so results from cologne should be the main criterion if we talk about favourites at this major. What has shown gambit and heroic at cologne???? Absolutely nothing. So why you talking about them like about absolute Gods??😀😀😀 On the other hand Faze is one of the best teams in the world on LAN accoridng to Cologne and you are absolutely ingoring that. Like WTF guys, this is completely out of reality, i felt like you never watched CS:GO before and you are considering teams only by HLTV ranking. Poor episode 😔✌️👌
The NDA's are in and of themselves PROOF that this matter is far from over and lots of heads will roll - beyond that and as a viewer , I won't watch Heroic play, If I wanted to watch cheaters - I would go play MM
I don't understand how Heroic is allowed to stay in pro cs and beyond this how this isn't doing irreparable damage to professional integrity in cs.
Lastly, are Blast and ESL so desperate to break even they don't have the self respect to just bar these guys for at least one tournament? Jesus, have some self-respect.
Cheater or not as long as it bring W to the table it doesn't matter. It matters when one got caught red-handed.
This isn't goody two shoes farce. This is business
, so ofc the org staff and players kept their zipper on covering hunden(deep down, who doesn't wanna use W bringer) and only blabber when it's in the open(for all we know all of em could be in it together).
Them saying they feel guilty and should be banned. Ofc if they say this they'd gather sympathy and can save their rep(who the hell would want a ban on their carreer? They are obviously happy they escaped almost unscatched duh🤣).
It’s funny that Moses says hunden should be gone because Moses could never win a major with a team but hunden could
? Hunden didnt won major in csgo wtf???
IDK I FEEL LIKE LIQUID CAN GET TOP 3 IF U SEEN THEIR LAST VIDEOS THEY HAVE GOOD MORALE RN
Hard to say. LAN helps with morale especially with crowds, but the loss of Adren, what does that mean tactically. Strats is where liquid shine, yeah all of them can frag out, but to me the strats is what made liquid good.
OK
No sympathy for the heroic players. They are cheaters for me.
Moses has a shit take on the Heroic stuff. Otherwise a great episode.
🤣🤣🤣
Navi will win this major for sure
No lol
@@dixonmathew7170 I said it
@@HoPe-jy7yy grats
@@dixonmathew7170 appreciate it bro
@@HoPe-jy7yy i was rooting for faze. :)
Zonic leaves
Gla1ve as coach
Magisk as IGL
Xypex
Dupree
Bub / Konfig
Lucky
ew
I think astralis lost thier dynamic bro . It's a gone team .
@@ashgoku6966 ah man, I hope not.