At this moment, for the first time since horse carts and wood stoves, we can power our own homes, businesses and vehicles from solar, batteries and EVs. Good to finally see Duracel in the game.
Just in case this helps you, Duracell is a company, which is a thing, and therefore it would be correct to say "Duracell hasn't...", rather than "Duracell haven't..." When I was learning English, I used to make the same mistake because I thought, well, a company is a group of people, which is a "they", so " haven't" would be the right word. But it turned out that was wrong.
So question how long to charge an EV from your battery storage, how much battery storage ? And can you run your house at the same time. Say there is a power cut, planned or not, in December, like during the recent storms where some houses have had no power for 4 days. The ironic part is that you still pay a standing charge for a supply that isn’t there
Robert made the point that as more people charge off peak the off peak rates are going to be higher. Does this suggest that investment in a battery isn’t going to offer much of an advantage at that point?
It's more the EV charging that would eventually affect off peak rates as more and more people make the switch. It'll more likely move towards charging batteries when there's plenty of renewable power so it doesn't go to waste. So house batteries will continue to be a sound investment for shifting cheap power to cover peak demand periods. They're also very useful in storing solar energy if you have your own array for use over night.
No I don't think so because most people will have solar. Using that power yourself is better for you than sending it to the grid. But the power can be exported across Europe so there'll always be somewhere for it to go. Some economists believe power will become free per unit, and you'll just be paying for the grid connection because like Unlimited Texts and Calls it'll just become too cheap to be worth charging for. Not any time all that soon though. They also have other benefits such as coping with power cuts - both local and national and the software is going to balance everything out for you.
@@leegoodman297 thank you! I’m considering installing a heat pump and a storage battery. I’d pretty much narrowed it down to GivEnergy so this confuses matters slightly. I don’t envisage getting solar as my house is in the shadow of an avenue of huge trees restricting sunlight.
I would expect that the standard off peak setup of 6 hours overnight will change. But there will still be times of lower demand - it just may be at 10:00-16:00 in the future, or a proliferation of smart tariffs like Octopus agile :) Being able to load shift with a battery may vary over time in terms of return, but it should always prove a useful tool.
I have just ordered solar panels and a battery for my own house, when you look at the projected savings it’s a no brainier and puts you the consumer in control. It begs the question though as to why the government is not really backing this approach with grants and loans to the degree that it should if it they want to see consumers ( including businesses ) bills go down and lift people out of fuel poverty. Reducing demand on the grid should be the first priority rather than building ever more pylons, solar “farms” and battery storage sites on farmland. Their approach to use big business to invest in and build this infrastructure in my opinion will result in consumers paying a high price for electricity into the future. Perhaps this is something you could look into for a future show?
Dear Bobby, Please would you do a "walk-around" of your home and an explanation of how all of your systems work together. I would love to see a "worked example". Thanks
Have you seen this video they filmed about Robert's house? A Tour Of Robert Llewellyn’s Ultra-Efficient Eco Home: th-cam.com/video/XZZisnQi7Ww/w-d-xo.html It's a couple of years old now, but discusses many of the aspects you asked about.
With export rates being more than overnight rates it is a better strategy to charge up batteries every night even in the summer and export excess power in the day as it generates more money than the overnight charging cost. I'd love to see a product that didn't require an electrician to install, i.e. a battery with a 13A plug and a connection to monitor the grid flow.
Are variable tariffs going to be around long enough for a home storage battery to pay back without having your own solar panels to store from? Or should I try using a car instead?
I've just installed a battery to go with my solar and I am mostly running my house and cars at 7p/kw. There is a bit of a learning curve but I certainly think it will pay for itself.
I hope people realise that we can't all individually do this. It'd be an extremely wasteful way to design an energy system. Eventually the plebs will rise to and be able to spot those PV panels and allotments, to the point were Elon might question the loyalties of his body guards. We're in the together no matter what.
Why not encourage/subsidize installation on urban roof space (residential and commercial). Would reduce need for grid upgrade and delays in in connections.
I also wondered this and decided / been informed it's due to leases on buildings, landlords, grid connections in that area may need upgrading also. Also quality of the roofs of these buildings being able to support the extra weight. So basically it's waaaay more paperwork therefore more money compared to just slapping the panels on open land. But the gov just announced they are going to push more into this area so that's a result make the energy where it's used makes more sense right? 👍
@@Burtis89 if the local cables need upgrading then that’s what should be the focus not National infrastructure. If there is the will I’m sure we could get a solution to leases and landlords.
Council estates / flat blocks could utlise this sort of system with great rewards to make bills cheaper for them using huge battery storage systems. Vertical solar arrays on the walls or even maybe turbines/communal heat pumps on the roofs being high up. All being beneficial to grid balancing as they can soak up a lot, charge and discharge a lot. Community batteries make more sense to me than personal ones as a starting point to bring the costs down 🤔
The only issue here is people would then download from the flat battery stores to their own personal batteries stores and resell it to others within the flats. Power Gangs etc. This was already identified by fraud prevention companies
Interesting if you have a 90 amp fuse on a consumer unit how many amps can you draw per hour? Using a single ring main of a flat you can draw? Therefore if someone draws via 3 pin plug to batteries on mass they will empty the larger batteries, it is already an issue with flats on mains power, not a scare tactic, this is one reason smart energy meters are being installed, to watch & prevent, however batteries have not caught up yet.
The EV battery install quotes have only gone up due to marketing, no-one thought it was an option before recent new technologies. So 20-80% increase is an expected & a given, however everyone is quoting only 2 brands of battery at those prices, so good luck trying to sell something that is more expensive. Also the two way inverters might be an issue currently as well.
I would suggest that battery storage offers a short term return , however as the market moves to more electric usage IE EV this will change, use your EV to run your house etc
If battery storage works on small scale for home owners why dont the energy suppliers install mega battery packs themselves as normally with increased scaling up in size more savings can be made.
I also do not agree with the presentation / wording from the presenter (not host) he is using his words very carefully, do you research peeps, wholesale pricing does not reflect what we pay directly, there are too many middlemen who want their money before we get the price, it is how business works.
Our current electric tariff is a variable peak, day ahead pricing. While the retail rate is obviously not the wholesale rate, it is directly tied to that cost and tracks accordingly. From an automation standpoint, I can easily see where using one regional variable for calculations is way easier (for now) than trying to obtain and calculate based on hundreds of thousands of individual location costs. The difference between wholesale and retail is not just "too many middlemen", its where the costs for transmission, substations, distribution, service trucks, service personnel, customer service, ect are funded from. I work with a very large industrial complex. We get electricity at a very discounted rate. The flip side is that we take power in at 138k volts directly from the transmission network. We had to build and maintain out own substation and inter-plant 13K volt distribution system. There is no free lunch.
Duracell isn't that the company that sells mountains of very expensive disposable batteries that often end up in landfills. Profit driven Johnny come lateleys IMHO.
yes and no - the company behind this battery is a UK one known as Puredrive, they have a name/branding licencing agreement with the Duracell company, which you're referring to.
High quality products? Duracell batteries have gone down in quality. The batteries I have leaking most are Duracell. If they can no longer get the once mastered AA battery right, how can we trust them with a home battery?
Different company (for now) - the company behind this battery is a UK one known as Puredrive, they have a name/branding licencing agreement with the Duracell company. Whether Berkshire Hathaway, who own the Duracell brand are involved in funding or have an intent to purchase Puredrive is anyones guess.
I am a fan of Fully Charged and all. But batteries without solar are not economical! Even with solar they barely are. At the current price, break even is around ten years if you're really lucky. Which is usually the warranty time.
The payback period on my installation ( solar and battery ) is 7 years, remember that every time the price of electricity goes up the payback period reduces.
Any interview with a CEO can be accused of that. Think of it more as an opportunity for those who are interested to learn about the history and ethos of one of the players in the renewable energy market. There's no pressure to buy here.
At this moment, for the first time since horse carts and wood stoves, we can power our own homes, businesses and vehicles from solar, batteries and EVs. Good to finally see Duracel in the game.
And folks, most homes are going to need 50 kWh to b feee fem the predatory, unreliable and rapacious electric utility cartels.
Batteries that allow you to run on night storage rates can be very worthwhile! Battery prices yet to drop further!
Excellent analogy of the advantages of battery & solar!
I'm Im off grid its excellent eve more independant
About time...Duracell haven't been at the forefront and lagged behind but glad they're finally joining the transition
Just in case this helps you, Duracell is a company, which is a thing, and therefore it would be correct to say "Duracell hasn't...", rather than "Duracell haven't..."
When I was learning English, I used to make the same mistake because I thought, well, a company is a group of people, which is a "they", so " haven't" would be the right word. But it turned out that was wrong.
So question how long to charge an EV from your battery storage, how much battery storage ? And can you run your house at the same time. Say there is a power cut, planned or not, in December, like during the recent storms where some houses have had no power for 4 days. The ironic part is that you still pay a standing charge for a supply that isn’t there
This government (2024) wants energy suppliers to offer tariffs with and without separate standing charges.
Robert made the point that as more people charge off peak the off peak rates are going to be higher. Does this suggest that investment in a battery isn’t going to offer much of an advantage at that point?
It's more the EV charging that would eventually affect off peak rates as more and more people make the switch. It'll more likely move towards charging batteries when there's plenty of renewable power so it doesn't go to waste. So house batteries will continue to be a sound investment for shifting cheap power to cover peak demand periods. They're also very useful in storing solar energy if you have your own array for use over night.
I do think the price advantage may shrink, but not disappear
No I don't think so because most people will have solar. Using that power yourself is better for you than sending it to the grid. But the power can be exported across Europe so there'll always be somewhere for it to go. Some economists believe power will become free per unit, and you'll just be paying for the grid connection because like Unlimited Texts and Calls it'll just become too cheap to be worth charging for. Not any time all that soon though.
They also have other benefits such as coping with power cuts - both local and national and the software is going to balance everything out for you.
@@leegoodman297 thank you! I’m considering installing a heat pump and a storage battery. I’d pretty much narrowed it down to GivEnergy so this confuses matters slightly.
I don’t envisage getting solar as my house is in the shadow of an avenue of huge trees restricting sunlight.
I would expect that the standard off peak setup of 6 hours overnight will change. But there will still be times of lower demand - it just may be at 10:00-16:00 in the future, or a proliferation of smart tariffs like Octopus agile :) Being able to load shift with a battery may vary over time in terms of return, but it should always prove a useful tool.
I have just ordered solar panels and a battery for my own house, when you look at the projected savings it’s a no brainier and puts you the consumer in control. It begs the question though as to why the government is not really backing this approach with grants and loans to the degree that it should if it they want to see consumers ( including businesses ) bills go down and lift people out of fuel poverty. Reducing demand on the grid should be the first priority rather than building ever more pylons, solar “farms” and battery storage sites on farmland. Their approach to use big business to invest in and build this infrastructure in my opinion will result in consumers paying a high price for electricity into the future.
Perhaps this is something you could look into for a future show?
Dear Bobby, Please would you do a "walk-around" of your home and an explanation of how all of your systems work together. I would love to see a "worked example". Thanks
Have you seen this video they filmed about Robert's house?
A Tour Of Robert Llewellyn’s Ultra-Efficient Eco Home:
th-cam.com/video/XZZisnQi7Ww/w-d-xo.html
It's a couple of years old now, but discusses many of the aspects you asked about.
19:30 TLAs!
With export rates being more than overnight rates it is a better strategy to charge up batteries every night even in the summer and export excess power in the day as it generates more money than the overnight charging cost. I'd love to see a product that didn't require an electrician to install, i.e. a battery with a 13A plug and a connection to monitor the grid flow.
Are variable tariffs going to be around long enough for a home storage battery to pay back without having your own solar panels to store from? Or should I try using a car instead?
Where are the 13A plug and play storage batteries?
We need a Kryten voice option for Alexa, or at least for a few Everything Electric related skills.
I've just installed a battery to go with my solar and I am mostly running my house and cars at 7p/kw. There is a bit of a learning curve but I certainly think it will pay for itself.
What’s the payback period for all this kit ???
With Durecell this would be a lifetime commitment.
Presumably, on numerous occasions, when the sun isn’t shining, it’s er windy. So, there’s that! Wind turbines and solar panels aren’t the same.
I hope people realise that we can't all individually do this. It'd be an extremely wasteful way to design an energy system. Eventually the plebs will rise to and be able to spot those PV panels and allotments, to the point were Elon might question the loyalties of his body guards.
We're in the together no matter what.
Why not encourage/subsidize installation on urban roof space (residential and commercial). Would reduce need for grid upgrade and delays in in connections.
I also wondered this and decided / been informed it's due to leases on buildings, landlords, grid connections in that area may need upgrading also.
Also quality of the roofs of these buildings being able to support the extra weight.
So basically it's waaaay more paperwork therefore more money compared to just slapping the panels on open land.
But the gov just announced they are going to push more into this area so that's a result make the energy where it's used makes more sense right? 👍
@@Burtis89 if the local cables need upgrading then that’s what should be the focus not National infrastructure. If there is the will I’m sure we could get a solution to leases and landlords.
Council estates / flat blocks could utlise this sort of system with great rewards to make bills cheaper for them using huge battery storage systems.
Vertical solar arrays on the walls or even maybe turbines/communal heat pumps on the roofs being high up.
All being beneficial to grid balancing as they can soak up a lot, charge and discharge a lot.
Community batteries make more sense to me than personal ones as a starting point to bring the costs down 🤔
The only issue here is people would then download from the flat battery stores to their own personal batteries stores and resell it to others within the flats. Power Gangs etc. This was already identified by fraud prevention companies
@kophotography895 easily solved with fitting non export meters.
I think that situation you mention is just a scare tactic
Interesting if you have a 90 amp fuse on a consumer unit how many amps can you draw per hour? Using a single ring main of a flat you can draw? Therefore if someone draws via 3 pin plug to batteries on mass they will empty the larger batteries, it is already an issue with flats on mains power, not a scare tactic, this is one reason smart energy meters are being installed, to watch & prevent, however batteries have not caught up yet.
The EV battery install quotes have only gone up due to marketing, no-one thought it was an option before recent new technologies. So 20-80% increase is an expected & a given, however everyone is quoting only 2 brands of battery at those prices, so good luck trying to sell something that is more expensive. Also the two way inverters might be an issue currently as well.
@bobbyllew will obviously have to be the voice of the battery AI 😂
I would suggest that battery storage offers a short term return , however as the market moves to more electric usage IE EV this will change, use your EV to run your house etc
Brokering pricing is different to wholesale pricing
Until consumers install a heat pump... then a 30 to 50 kWh home battery will become the norm. 😮
If battery storage works on small scale for home owners why dont the energy suppliers install mega battery packs themselves as normally with increased scaling up in size more savings can be made.
How does this differ from project mercury from Octopus?
The question is, when will you start selling in 🇧🇷?
The problem is the cost of maintaining the grid is going to be borne by fewer homeowners driving up their costs.
Who lives in a house at -10 degrees I will stick to LFP
I also do not agree with the presentation / wording from the presenter (not host) he is using his words very carefully, do you research peeps, wholesale pricing does not reflect what we pay directly, there are too many middlemen who want their money before we get the price, it is how business works.
Quite so.
Far, far too many snouts in the trough.
Our current electric tariff is a variable peak, day ahead pricing. While the retail rate is obviously not the wholesale rate, it is directly tied to that cost and tracks accordingly. From an automation standpoint, I can easily see where using one regional variable for calculations is way easier (for now) than trying to obtain and calculate based on hundreds of thousands of individual location costs. The difference between wholesale and retail is not just "too many middlemen", its where the costs for transmission, substations, distribution, service trucks, service personnel, customer service, ect are funded from. I work with a very large industrial complex. We get electricity at a very discounted rate. The flip side is that we take power in at 138k volts directly from the transmission network. We had to build and maintain out own substation and inter-plant 13K volt distribution system. There is no free lunch.
Duracell isn't that the company that sells mountains of very expensive disposable batteries that often end up in landfills. Profit driven Johnny come lateleys IMHO.
yes and no - the company behind this battery is a UK one known as Puredrive, they have a name/branding licencing agreement with the Duracell company, which you're referring to.
High quality products? Duracell batteries have gone down in quality. The batteries I have leaking most are Duracell.
If they can no longer get the once mastered AA battery right, how can we trust them with a home battery?
Different company (for now) - the company behind this battery is a UK one known as Puredrive, they have a name/branding licencing agreement with the Duracell company. Whether Berkshire Hathaway, who own the Duracell brand are involved in funding or have an intent to purchase Puredrive is anyones guess.
Good point.
We'll soon know.
I am a fan of Fully Charged and all. But batteries without solar are not economical! Even with solar they barely are. At the current price, break even is around ten years if you're really lucky. Which is usually the warranty time.
The payback period on my installation ( solar and battery ) is 7 years, remember that every time the price of electricity goes up the payback period reduces.
@@DavidRains-j4u Yes. But if you calculate the battery separately, it is losing money. A cycle usually costs between 20 and 30 eurocents per kWh.
This is just a commercial, disgusting
Any interview with a CEO can be accused of that. Think of it more as an opportunity for those who are interested to learn about the history and ethos of one of the players in the renewable energy market. There's no pressure to buy here.
@
That’s ridiculous. You apparently didn’t watch the first part of the video.
@@Shelmerdine745 Well. There's the OVO sponsorship message at the beginning of course. But there's more to the video than that.
One correction- France is not on
3 phase for home power.
Don't agree. I have a house in France and it is on 3 phase
Is C Rating equals Cycles Rating
1C means you discharge the entire battery in one hour, 0.5C means you discharge the entire battery in 2 hours. Same logic can apply to recharging.