I'm one of the menuetOS dev guys. Ville is still developing the 64 bit version. It was great fun working with him and the other volunteers in the early days.
Have you given Oberon a try? It was one of Niklaus Wirth’s projects over at the ETH in Zurich in the late 80’s. They managed to cram an entire OS and IDE onto a single floppy.
Wirth achieved so much more, one of his dozen language projects was the Lola a language for describing chip design, and I recall his team also built an engineering desktop and CAD tools for Lola. It was actually used by a chip design shop in Utah. If only all his students of Pascal/Modula/Oberon could have also seen Lola.
All that on one floppy? Kinda reminds me of Amiga Workbench, a substantial OS on a low density floppy. There were extra disks but they were not necessary for most users.
All of that indeed! I actually couldn't find a difference between the floppy and cd images (not that I have investigated any deeper than you can see in this video). That's a big difference with KolibriOS, that offers more on the CD image and simply doesn't offer a separate media CD.
I don't have an issue with IDE at all, but it's been superseded by SATA over two decades ago. Both machines I tried it on were old, but don't have any IDE peripherals. I would expect a modern OS to be able to read from a SATA drive haha Happy new year to you too!
@@ex-itguy This is your problem. For one, this OS is a project to learn concepts, not a competitor to commercial or wider audiences already out there. Second, this OS isn't "modern" anymore. When it was programmed, ATA was still the main storage bus (or SATA in ATA mode). And looks like it already has outpassed its utility to its creator/creator team .
@hyoenmadan it's still under active development, with 5 releases in 2024 (one of which in December), so that makes it a modern OS in my opinion. By the way I tried a system with an IDE drive (the P4 from my ReactOS video) and that one didn't read the cd either (while the disc reads fine in another OS on the same machines. I didn't include it in the video because I felt it wouldn't really add anything. But you're probably right that it's a me problem.
Some Linux distros I find don't play well with Ventoy or other multi-boot software. I have plenty of USB drives so I just flash my distro of choice direct to a USB key using Balena Etcher.
Dank je wel! Jij ook alvast het beste voor 2025! Ik heb verschillende sticks en poorten geprobeerd en zoals je in de video kunt zien worden de sticks wel "gezien" door het OS maar domweg niet gekoppeld. Wellicht een kennis probleem, maar van een modern OS verwacht ik eigenlijk dat dat automatisch gebeurd haha
No linux, no X on it at all. This has its own graphical architecture, completely programmed in assembly. That's what makes the code so compact it can fit in a floppy disk. Ofc no one stops anyone to do the same with C.. After all QNX is C which also can fit in a floppy... But for it you need hard tuning in the compiler, or build your own which can generate compact executable code. Let alone LLVM/Clang, Vanilla GCC will not cut it.
@@hyoenmadan ohh wow that explains it. i didn't immediately notice and thought it was a linux distro 😅 really shows how bloated linux and many others are
Especially since it's 64-bit and floppy drives were more or less phased out when 64-bit cpu's became available. I would expect a modern OS to be able to boot without using an extra layer like Ventoy.
That's because you have NEVER EVER programmed an USB device, let alone an OS driver stack. For you is just plugging a thumbdrive and magically get it working in your commercial backed OS, but the whole USB sh*t as architected is a mess. Sometimes even Linux these days fails to get some USB devices and drives to work properly with it. Seeing the goal of this project was to learn system programming, not USB programming, isn't a surprise the USB stack was the least of their priorities. Is already good the basic stuff works in older P3 and P4 machines (using OHCI and EHCI). But for most purposes this project already passed out its utility to its creators. Now, the OS is opensource. No one forbids you to take on the sources and port it to UEFI, or complete the USB2 stack and program an XHCI USB3 stack for it.
Be prepared for those BLLISTERINGLY fast read/write speeds of nowhere near 250kbps ( UNLESS YOUR VERY LUCKY ), and when you get bored waiting 20 minutes for a 1mb file to transfer, you too can enjoy the other stuff that doesnt work in this stupid idea for an OS....why do people waste everyone's time making these pointless things? This rubbish has been around for years now and NEVER gets any better. An OS on a floppy has to be the STUPIEST idea ever, and that says a lot in world where Donald Trump is allowed to keep breathing.
Nah... You just have a short sighted mind, thinking stuff is done for free to cater your own needs. Many of the stuff done for free out there was mostly to learn knowledge. As the only way to properly learn system programming stuff in a fast track is building small projects like this one. ReactOS is in the same track. Many of the programmer working in them already have now system programming works in places like Apple, Microsoft, IBM or are working under Military contract. For them this sort of projects only exist as a learning tool for a bigger purpose which will not be given for free. They don't care if it doesn't cater the needs of the general public, that's a tertiary goal for them.
Geos for C64 is my favorite OS on a floppy, slower than menuet by far but still fun. there is a vid on YT of a guy who got win 10 running with less than 200mb of ram, not fully functional, really slow, but still impressive. deleted all my trash to keep it civil. i hope everyone has an awesome day.
I'm one of the menuetOS dev guys. Ville is still developing the 64 bit version. It was great fun working with him and the other volunteers in the early days.
Great hearing from you! Do you feel this video provides an accurate impression or have I missed anything obvious?
Complete being a relative term
Indeed it is 😅
I ran that years ago on an ancient Pentium 200MHz with 16MB of RAM
I believe you still can run KolibriOS on that 😄
Have you given Oberon a try? It was one of Niklaus Wirth’s projects over at the ETH in Zurich in the late 80’s. They managed to cram an entire OS and IDE onto a single floppy.
Wirth achieved so much more, one of his dozen language projects was the Lola a language for describing chip design, and I recall his team also built an engineering desktop and CAD tools for Lola. It was actually used by a chip design shop in Utah. If only all his students of Pascal/Modula/Oberon could have also seen Lola.
Sounds interesting! Could be fun to check out. Is it still in active development though?
@@ex-itguy it’s not that active these days, but you can find all that you need to get it up and running at oberon.org/en.
@@stevetodd7383 Thanks! I'l look into it!
@@stevetodd7383 Thanks! I'll put it on my list. 🙂
Perhaps the file system on the USB drive is not compatible.
Could be, but the different sticks have different filesystems. Not sure _what_ it supports then.
Menuet as far as I remember, only supports FAT and FAT32 filesystems, and ISOFS for CDs. Nothing more and nothing less.
All that on one floppy? Kinda reminds me of Amiga Workbench, a substantial OS on a low density floppy. There were extra disks but they were not necessary for most users.
All of that indeed! I actually couldn't find a difference between the floppy and cd images (not that I have investigated any deeper than you can see in this video).
That's a big difference with KolibriOS, that offers more on the CD image and simply doesn't offer a separate media CD.
awesome, ima give it a try.
And have a happy one Dude, thanks for a year of Great Videos
Thanks! Best wishes for the rest of the week! 😄
More like a Stiffy than a Floppy …
Hahaha, I was kinda waiting for a comment like that! 😄
6:53 personally.. i love IDE standard (Intergrated Drive Electronics)... and by the way... happy new year
I don't have an issue with IDE at all, but it's been superseded by SATA over two decades ago. Both machines I tried it on were old, but don't have any IDE peripherals. I would expect a modern OS to be able to read from a SATA drive haha
Happy new year to you too!
@@ex-itguy This is your problem. For one, this OS is a project to learn concepts, not a competitor to commercial or wider audiences already out there. Second, this OS isn't "modern" anymore. When it was programmed, ATA was still the main storage bus (or SATA in ATA mode). And looks like it already has outpassed its utility to its creator/creator team .
@hyoenmadan it's still under active development, with 5 releases in 2024 (one of which in December), so that makes it a modern OS in my opinion.
By the way I tried a system with an IDE drive (the P4 from my ReactOS video) and that one didn't read the cd either (while the disc reads fine in another OS on the same machines. I didn't include it in the video because I felt it wouldn't really add anything.
But you're probably right that it's a me problem.
@hyoenmadan its about the challenges and other fun things. And or to be lightweight... its not ment for everyone or everything
cya next year dude :P
A whole year! What a wait! 😄
Some Linux distros I find don't play well with Ventoy or other multi-boot software. I have plenty of USB drives so I just flash my distro of choice direct to a USB key using Balena Etcher.
This isn't Linux though, it has its own kernel. Direct to USB didn't work, that's why I used Ventoy. :)
@@ex-itguy Ah okay. Interesting. It's crazy that they can fit a desktop OS onto a floppy! Not even Windows 3.1 fit onto one floppy.
Leuke video! Gelukkig Nieuwjaar alvast! Heb je de usb in zowel een usb 2.0 als een usb 3.0 poort getest?
Dank je wel! Jij ook alvast het beste voor 2025!
Ik heb verschillende sticks en poorten geprobeerd en zoals je in de video kunt zien worden de sticks wel "gezien" door het OS maar domweg niet gekoppeld. Wellicht een kennis probleem, maar van een modern OS verwacht ik eigenlijk dat dat automatisch gebeurd haha
I did this on my phone 😅 thanks
You ran MenuetOS on your phone? That's next level! 😄
@ex-itguy yes I use Limbo x86 I also have Windows XP
@@davidengle6065 I never thought of that! Awesome!
I treid to use menuet, but it was missing just about anything but the desktop.
Haha, yeah it doesn't seem like a very functional OS. But maybe you and I are both wrong. ;)
It can Doom .
@@Mikewee777 apparently, if it reads that damn cd! 😄
What’s the point in something so non functional
Not sure, to be honest I think it's mostly a programmer's playground. ;)
is there some kind of alien tech compression here? xorg would never fit on a floppy😸
Yes, it came from the Vorticons 😄
I don't think it's using x , the kernel isn't based on Linux either.
No linux, no X on it at all.
This has its own graphical architecture, completely programmed in assembly. That's what makes the code so compact it can fit in a floppy disk. Ofc no one stops anyone to do the same with C.. After all QNX is C which also can fit in a floppy... But for it you need hard tuning in the compiler, or build your own which can generate compact executable code. Let alone LLVM/Clang, Vanilla GCC will not cut it.
@@hyoenmadan ohh wow that explains it. i didn't immediately notice and thought it was a linux distro 😅 really shows how bloated linux and many others are
System has no floppy anymore. NO value to put OS in floppy. Thumb drive easily has 4GB and put OS inside thumb drive make more sense.
Especially since it's 64-bit and floppy drives were more or less phased out when 64-bit cpu's became available. I would expect a modern OS to be able to boot without using an extra layer like Ventoy.
That's because you have NEVER EVER programmed an USB device, let alone an OS driver stack. For you is just plugging a thumbdrive and magically get it working in your commercial backed OS, but the whole USB sh*t as architected is a mess.
Sometimes even Linux these days fails to get some USB devices and drives to work properly with it. Seeing the goal of this project was to learn system programming, not USB programming, isn't a surprise the USB stack was the least of their priorities. Is already good the basic stuff works in older P3 and P4 machines (using OHCI and EHCI). But for most purposes this project already passed out its utility to its creators.
Now, the OS is opensource. No one forbids you to take on the sources and port it to UEFI, or complete the USB2 stack and program an XHCI USB3 stack for it.
Be prepared for those BLLISTERINGLY fast read/write speeds of nowhere near 250kbps ( UNLESS YOUR VERY LUCKY ), and when you get bored waiting 20 minutes for a 1mb file to transfer, you too can enjoy the other stuff that doesnt work in this stupid idea for an OS....why do people waste everyone's time making these pointless things? This rubbish has been around for years now and NEVER gets any better. An OS on a floppy has to be the STUPIEST idea ever, and that says a lot in world where Donald Trump is allowed to keep breathing.
Hahaha well that's a bit harsh. You don't _have_ to check it out or even use it. ;)
@@ex-itguy The truth often is.
Nah... You just have a short sighted mind, thinking stuff is done for free to cater your own needs.
Many of the stuff done for free out there was mostly to learn knowledge. As the only way to properly learn system programming stuff in a fast track is building small projects like this one.
ReactOS is in the same track. Many of the programmer working in them already have now system programming works in places like Apple, Microsoft, IBM or are working under Military contract. For them this sort of projects only exist as a learning tool for a bigger purpose which will not be given for free. They don't care if it doesn't cater the needs of the general public, that's a tertiary goal for them.
Geos for C64 is my favorite OS on a floppy, slower than menuet by far but still fun.
there is a vid on YT of a guy who got win 10 running with less than 200mb of ram, not fully functional, really slow, but still impressive.
deleted all my trash to keep it civil.
i hope everyone has an awesome day.
😆