Prosian: How to make an Indo-European language

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 พ.ค. 2024
  • How do you make an Indo-European language? Well, you have to start with Proto-Indo-European. From there...well, what happens from there? If only someone made a video-oh wait, that's this video! The guy who made this must be so smart. And Handsome! He's also probably unusually good at Soccer (or Football, if you're not American/Canadian). What was I saying?
    I can only imagine you'll want to see it, so here's the spreadsheet:
    docs.google.com/spreadsheets/...
    Sound Changes for English:
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proto-G...
    ...which then bleeds into:
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonolo...
    0:00 Introduction
    0:14 An Indo-European Language
    0:41 An Example: English
    1:01 An Example: Barrow
    7:16 Unpredictability
    8:07 Morphology of Prosian
    9:31 Semantic Shift
    9:58 Six
    10:45 Vexed
    12:58 Boxers
    14:23 Quickly
    15:26 Danced
    16:47 Around
    17:54 the
    18:36 Well

ความคิดเห็น • 222

  • @smergthedargon8974
    @smergthedargon8974 หลายเดือนก่อน +243

    ah yes, my favorite PIE branch: Germano-Tibetan

    • @berndlauert8179
      @berndlauert8179 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

      it's more like a sino-aryan

    • @MRCSANY
      @MRCSANY หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Gotta love it

    • @FlameQwert
      @FlameQwert หลายเดือนก่อน

      Ernst Schafer moment

    • @sasho_metula
      @sasho_metula 28 วันที่ผ่านมา +4

      ​@@berndlauert8179 you mean Sino-Iranian, no?

    • @kimjae-gyu
      @kimjae-gyu 26 วันที่ผ่านมา

      why not dene-caucasian..?

  • @gtc239
    @gtc239 หลายเดือนก่อน +247

    Nooo! Why don't you make /ŋɣ/ > /ŋ/, makes sense considering the Chinese influence and it'd make it very few ancient IE language to have /ŋ/ (other than avestan).

    • @cuitaro
      @cuitaro หลายเดือนก่อน +24

      The Indo-Aryan branch also retained /ŋ/ for some time iirc

  • @claudiomonteverdi7126
    @claudiomonteverdi7126 หลายเดือนก่อน +50

    @5:59 After rule #69, #70 is D - softening. Truly poetic.

  • @spcxplrr
    @spcxplrr หลายเดือนก่อน +73

    15:26 you could also have designed it such that it picks up a loan from some proto-tibetan language or old chinese

  • @Ptaku93
    @Ptaku93 หลายเดือนก่อน +23

    9:07 "psia" isn't the genitive of pies, it's the adjective. The genitive would be "psa", and it would come after the possessee

  • @MishaGold
    @MishaGold หลายเดือนก่อน +78

    I was thinking about a theoretical Indo-European conlang for so long. The only thing i was finding was the "Proto-Carite" thing and now you make this video as long as i subscribed to you recently lol!

  • @SKO_EN
    @SKO_EN หลายเดือนก่อน +43

    Polish also differentiates /w/ and /v/. It's a fairly new innovation, speaking in linguistic timescales at least. The /w/ phoneme is written as (Ł ł) because it used to be pronounced more like a dark L /ɫ/. It started out as an allophone of /l/ and slowly diverged.

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      You know that's not what I meant

    • @SKO_EN
      @SKO_EN หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@zzineohp I don't. Can you clarify?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +10

      @@SKO_EN I mean the w > v pathway occured in every Modern language except English and the Celtic languages-Romanian also differentiates it, but w is from /u/ not /w/

    • @SKO_EN
      @SKO_EN หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@zzineohp Interesting, that makes more sense!

    • @jasminekaram880
      @jasminekaram880 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@zzineohp If I am not mistaken Ossetic still keeps PIE /w/ in certain contexts. :)

  • @falpsdsqglthnsac
    @falpsdsqglthnsac หลายเดือนก่อน +22

    the only use of "barrow" i can think of is "bleak falls barrow," an early game location in the elder scrolls v: skyrim. it's a dungeon that sits on a mountain, so the name fits.

    • @crusatyr1452
      @crusatyr1452 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      I had the same thought!

    • @JonBrase
      @JonBrase 29 วันที่ผ่านมา +7

      Also the "barrow downs" in LotR

    • @hannahstaigvil1098
      @hannahstaigvil1098 26 วันที่ผ่านมา

      I’m glad I’m not the only one

    • @ArkhBaegor
      @ArkhBaegor 20 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      Because "barrow" also means "burial mound"

  • @artemesiagentileschini7348
    @artemesiagentileschini7348 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

    Since it went down to the lowlands of China, you should have considered the Sprachbund nature of languages. That kind of crazy consonant clusters would also have been tonal at this point along with modern Chinese, Mon-khmer, Austroasiatic and Kra-Dai.
    If not tonal at least tone accented. But with the significance of the Chinese trade, the tonality is not hard to see being developed.
    The Tibetan branch is currently undergoing a shift to tonality with some dialects.

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      It has pitch accent

  • @dafyddroff8084
    @dafyddroff8084 หลายเดือนก่อน +27

    I’m working on a Middle Eastern continuation of Gaulish atm

    • @cupidsnow3885
      @cupidsnow3885 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      can u give a sample text and numbers it would surely be interesting

    • @tigergamespl2713
      @tigergamespl2713 15 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      yes, can you show a sample?

    • @Pik180
      @Pik180 14 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      So basically what if Galatian survived?

  • @usuyus
    @usuyus หลายเดือนก่อน +20

    3:50 huh, that's interesting. i've never heard anyone pronouncing the "i" in "istanbul" as /ɯ/. it does go back slightly, but not that much. i wonder from where you got that this pronunciation is "very common" because i wanna make sure that i haven't been living in a bubble for all my life lmao
    edit: well, apparently that way of pronouncing used to be way more common around 40 years ago (my father mentions the speakers on TRT - the national television - when it used to be the only TV channel broadcasting). "diyarbakır" - another turkish city - also used to be pronounced with a back /ɯ/. i guess the younger generations tend to front that "i" more. that is really interesting.

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +14

      That makes sense, linguist tend to be about a generation behind at all times

  • @NewdNewb
    @NewdNewb หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    All this work, and he could've just used Tocharian

  • @sal6695
    @sal6695 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    wonderful video, genuinely!

  • @atomicwoodpecker0123
    @atomicwoodpecker0123 หลายเดือนก่อน +32

    It would be really cool of you added hints of Sinofication, replacing PIE derived words with mandarin chinese loan words.

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +17

      Im definitely gonna try to do that, but in this video I'm mostly focusing on the journey from PIE

    • @atomicwoodpecker0123
      @atomicwoodpecker0123 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      @@zzineohp huzzah, the patrons and merchant-lords, once again, exercise their power effectively

  • @stegotyranno4206
    @stegotyranno4206 หลายเดือนก่อน +29

    Im working on a IE conlang that is heavily influenced by bronze age semitic languages and other stuff, so the grammar is more like a mix od Arabic and Modern persian with unique innovation
    I actually hd one very influenced by chinese phonology as well, it was tonal

    • @slimehound1934
      @slimehound1934 29 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Will you share it somewhere?

    • @stegotyranno4206
      @stegotyranno4206 28 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@slimehound1934 so far its rather rudimentary and I havent too much time recently, but i will post a sample

    • @stegotyranno4206
      @stegotyranno4206 28 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@slimehound1934 ilHašuye ata ilmanduye witsakurye tasjadariš udwaš ata tasjadariš udilday qesahturye, ata tasjadariš atwaš udildHirt
      The horses and the two men with weapons saw up and saw to the sky of stars and saw down to the dirt.

  • @cupidsnow3885
    @cupidsnow3885 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    i loved this video because im doing the exact same thing so this was so helpful, u should make more videos like this or even better turn it into a series!

  • @MrRhombus
    @MrRhombus หลายเดือนก่อน +18

    For almost 2 years, I felt no real will to conlang, but with random inspiration in school and this video. I felt part of me come back to myself, so thank you for this awesome video!
    Edit: What’s sound change 37 called?

  • @imnampun2625
    @imnampun2625 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I really like your video. I am planning for my worldbuilding cultures and languages. Thanks for giving me a tutorial for an Indo-European conlang!

  • @Vininn126
    @Vininn126 หลายเดือนก่อน +11

    Psia is the feminine nominative of psi, which is a possessive adjective, psa would be the genitive singular of pies.

    • @SKO_EN
      @SKO_EN หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      came here to say the same thing, "psia" is an adjective

  • @syro33
    @syro33 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I would love a video covering all the sound changes from PIE to English! sounds very interesting

  • @BohumirZamecnik
    @BohumirZamecnik หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Mind blowing! Btw: The phonetic changes look to me as each generation needs to sound cooler than their parents, they make some sound shift. It's so cool to track them and reapply upon material from thousands of years ago.

  • @Poopick
    @Poopick หลายเดือนก่อน

    Very smart, you earned another subscriber

  • @byrgenwerthh
    @byrgenwerthh หลายเดือนก่อน

    w better call saul reference. btw love the speed you talk at

  • @lettuceandotherveggies715
    @lettuceandotherveggies715 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    But the optative is so cool :(

  • @SisterSunny
    @SisterSunny หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    'oh my god, that was a rush' after having speed-run the forming of 'six' was hilarious, I love your sense of humour LMAO

  • @arminbuch9386
    @arminbuch9386 หลายเดือนก่อน +20

    Well done! However, I'd love to see some grammatical changes. Why's the word order exactly the same as in English? No influences of surrounding Sino-Tibetic languages?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +7

      Well I was going to include an adjective for well but the video was already too long

    • @y11971alex
      @y11971alex หลายเดือนก่อน

      we don't have a very good idea of what common sino-tibetan syntax and grammar actually looked like, no?

  • @Marmuncli
    @Marmuncli หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Loved the video! But I'd argue that the reason why galician and catalan converged to a more spanish-sounding fonetics is not "the desire to be close to one another", but the minorization of catalan and galician and the fact that they were forbidden for like ~40 years during the XXth century and (afaik) for ~250y Catalan since 1714

  • @zzineohp
    @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +206

    12:49 you MORON! Chinese separates between the use of a number as a numeral vs. a noun! You HAVE to include the PARTICLE 个 in between six and the noun! Western liberals these days, they act like they know everything, and yet their ENTIRE body of knowledge COLLAPSES under a single tug. You're not just as bad as Bashar al-Assad, you're worse. Lol!

    • @y11971alex
      @y11971alex หลายเดือนก่อน +20

      If you’re looking for Old Chinese influence then it’s perfectly fine not to have determiners. They were much more limited in distribution in the OC period. 😅

    • @y11971alex
      @y11971alex หลายเดือนก่อน +12

      Moreover Old Chinese had crazy syllable structure much in line with other Sino-Tibetan languages! CCCCCVCC seems perfectly feasible. 😅

    • @aro4cinglife
      @aro4cinglife หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      bruh I'm in a discord server for people doing IE langs and it feels just like that lol

    • @ErenDoppleganer
      @ErenDoppleganer หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Meds? somebody call hospital.

  • @xelldincht4251
    @xelldincht4251 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

    imagine he writes the rules down but deleted the video and a couple hundred later somebody finds the text with the rules and visits those places to find those "Prosian people"

  • @fried___3217
    @fried___3217 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

    As a Mandarin and English speaker, seeing an IE language written in Hanzi is sooooooooooo much fun. It helped me understand the adoption of Hanzi in non-ST languages.

  • @martinkullberg6718
    @martinkullberg6718 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Wow this is some deep conlanging😮, I Also make conlangs, but I keep it simpler, cause I don't get all those complex IPA and sounds and change rules, allthoug I do have change patterns in some of my conlangs.

  • @gabingston3430
    @gabingston3430 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

    Are you going to make a Swadesh List for Prosian?

  • @milobem4458
    @milobem4458 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    That was fun. I didn't catch at what point did your language split from PIE. Did it share much significant history with Germanic or went straight East. If they were walking through Persia to China they would probably accumulate a lot of borrowings from languages along the way (like Romani/Gypsy did), probably some early Indo-Iranian at least, and maybe some Turkic and/or Mongolic.

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      well, that's a later video, in this one i really wanted to focus on PIE

  • @vignotum132
    @vignotum132 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Love it!

  • @twiznii
    @twiznii หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    this video is just what i needed, thanks! i must ask what you site or list you use to see PIE verb and noun declensions because ive been unable to find a reliable one

    • @y11971alex
      @y11971alex หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      in this case I would like to recommend, as an amateur, the one by Fortson and a series of essays called the handbook of comparative and historical indo european linguistics its very broad and gives a good sense of the scholarship as of recently

  • @rustictango6933
    @rustictango6933 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    I like your funny words magic man

  • @kathrynehiersche1817
    @kathrynehiersche1817 25 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I love the ambiguity of the English "we" because when he said 'we' (3:25 referring to linguists), I got to imagine myself in that category 😊

  • @ChrisW101
    @ChrisW101 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    You explained nothing basically...
    Where are the sources to other sound changes? Like how you got the changes in Prosian?

  • @the_doomcliff
    @the_doomcliff 29 วันที่ผ่านมา

    A technical issue - please, balance the volume level of a video next time, + it's very quiet in yhe headphones. Thanks
    Interesting stuff

  • @JakubSkowron
    @JakubSkowron หลายเดือนก่อน

    9:05 Polish example should be "Piłka psa". Psia is an adjective similar to dog in "dog park" (park does not belong to dog, dog just describes what kind of park it is)

  • @netopir3804
    @netopir3804 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    Phonetically Prosian sounds a bit like the eastern Slovenian dialect Prekmurian.

  • @user-dt2uv8ej2i
    @user-dt2uv8ej2i 26 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Please don't yell "stop" so loudly, I was in my headphones, and my ears genuinely hurt...

  • @hedge11
    @hedge11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    2:20 this crazy guy sure did have an interest with a Werner

  • @LinguaPhiliax
    @LinguaPhiliax 19 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Missed opportunity to create unique Hanzi for Prosian words, akin to Chữ Nôm.
    Edit: Just saw the follow-up video, and... I have a couple of notes.

  • @YuutaShinjou113
    @YuutaShinjou113 หลายเดือนก่อน

    already working on my own. it's a direct split from PIE and is heavily influenced by Thai.

  • @harmandon
    @harmandon หลายเดือนก่อน

    i did this but i literally made up random rules and took words off of the wikipedia page for PIE words lol

  • @Bombur888
    @Bombur888 27 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    Ah, yes, alternate timeline Tocharian lol.

  • @jamesyang420
    @jamesyang420 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Really cool conlang! But just wanna point out that the majority of languages heavily influenced by Chinese are phonologically similar in some ways, i.e. monosyllabic, tonal and lack of consonant clusters, sometimes lack of voiced fricatives. Since you also imagined this language using Hanzi as their writing systems, there are some works can be done around this part as well.
    Let's start with your example sentence. Suppose the phonological changes are similar to Beijing Mandarin (other Sinitic languages don't follow the same paths + easier for me to analyze), Šeks becomes shài (-ks from Old Chinese tend to become the 4th tone, also Beijing Mandarin tend to pronounce -ek from Middle Chinese as ai). Mrtsi becomes qí, step 1: mr makes ts a voiced consonant ds, step 2: dsi becomes qí which is the change happened between Middle Chinese and Beijing Mandarin. Peü-teüües can be split into two words: peü and teüües. Peü might first change into püei, then feī (yes there's also a Chinese version of Grimm's Law but it's pu/bu --> f/v --> f). Teüües is a bit hard, but it can change into tües first, then tüè (-s becomes the 4th tone), then tail, tsiò, then qù or jù (q/j is determined by if the ts sound is aspirated or not). So for the first four words we have: shài qí fēi jù (or qù).

    • @jamesyang420
      @jamesyang420 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Another thing I wanna point out: there are many different words between Classical Chinese and modern written Chinese, which are mostly from Mandarin. For example, 了 as a particle did not exist in Early Middle Chinese. Instead, it's a grammaticalized version of verb 了 ("end/to end"), and was not used in formal written language until 20th century (although folk literature like novels/dramas/poems existed already). For a language that was heavily influenced by Chinese, its writing system must be consistent with the formal written language (i.e. Classical Chinese), which is the same reason why English didn't borrow words from Italian but Latin (although Italian words exist but not as formal/academic words). So the choice of semantic parts of these newly invented characters need to be restricted to be within Classical Chinese, while occasional Mandarin words exist but their meaning should be highly colloquial. For example, the Japanese word 俺 (ore) is an informal or even somewhat rude word to refer to "I/me", not used by aristocrats or intellectuals, but lower class workers. The kanji 俺 is borrowed from a Mandarin dialect meaning the same as wo ("I/me"), but since it's from a rural dialect, the word has a colloquial nature itself. Other than this example, the majority of Kanji match their meanings in Classical Chinese. For example, 走る means "to run" in both Japanese and Classical Chinese, but in Mandarin it means "to walk", as "to run" is replaced by another word 跑.

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      well in this video I tried to focus on IE influence, that's the whole point of it anyways

    • @myspleenisbursting4825
      @myspleenisbursting4825 29 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      I can attest to this! Tsat, an Austronesian language spoken is Hainan, has reduced its syllables SIGNIFICANTLY and developed tones from Chinese contact.

    • @myspleenisbursting4825
      @myspleenisbursting4825 29 วันที่ผ่านมา

      By the way, is there a list somewhere compiling the sound changes of Middle Chinese's consonant clusters into Modern Mandarin Chinese? That would be very interesting to look at :)

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  29 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@myspleenisbursting4825 well, historic linguistics for Chinese is a lot more complicated, because A) no language is ever studied as much as English and B) Chinese doesn't write down sounds

  • @or3st
    @or3st หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Good video! But can you link a list of rules you've used (for English)?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      putting it in the description now

  • @pflynx
    @pflynx 26 วันที่ผ่านมา

    You mentioned at around 14:23, that there are some sound shifts, that hit multiple branches of the IE language family. Could you share some references to what these are?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  26 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Well, the sound e makes being changed depending on a laryngeal it's next to (Universal); when the root ends with t/d/dh and the suffix starts with it, the letter s is inserted between the 2 (Universal); Centumization (Italic, Celtic, Germanic, Hellenic) or Satemization (Balto-Slavic, Indo-Aryan, Iranian); Labiovelars become plain labials (Italic, Celtic, Germanic); Syllabic sonorants insert an a before a laryngeal-sonorant cluster (Celtic, Hellenic); Final m > n (Hellenic, Germanic); kw > kʷ (Slavic, Hellenic, Italic); debuccalization of word-initial s (Hellenic, Iranian); fortition of w into v (Iranian, Indo-Aryan, Slavic); Vocalization of word-initial laryngeals (Hellenic, Armenian). That sort of thing.

    • @pflynx
      @pflynx 26 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@zzineohp Thanks a lot! ^-^

  • @TheWizardOfOunce
    @TheWizardOfOunce 20 วันที่ผ่านมา

    😂 “You can’t just Irish Goodbye your way out of PIE.”

  • @TurtleFalcon
    @TurtleFalcon หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    What is the Prosian for “My hovercraft is full of eels”?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      I šeš hyehhöytannaw ičeš oššöms šeš plotrö.
      I - I
      Šeš - genitive particle
      Hyehhöy - Air, loan from middle Chinese kʰiəiH
      Tan - Cushion, loan from Mandarin tián
      Naw - Boat
      (that whole word, hyehhöytannaw is a Calque of the chinese 气垫船, hovercraft)
      Ičeš - has
      Oššöms - Eels, accusative
      Šeš - genitive particle
      Plotö - filling
      (Literally: My air-cushion-boat has a filling of eels)

    • @tiziocaio2631
      @tiziocaio2631 29 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

      This is art.

  • @TheRealVenusian
    @TheRealVenusian หลายเดือนก่อน

    as a historical linguistics enjoyer this is bringing tears to my eyes I love it so much
    interesting how at 18:36 you've gone with 她, Mandarin tā "her", as the word for "the", any reasoning behind that?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Well, Mandarin doesn't have articles, I just picked the word closest to "Female Thing"

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      I could see 个 as an alternative

    • @TheRealVenusian
      @TheRealVenusian หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@zzineohp or maybe you could get close to an article by having a demonstrative, so 这 "this" or 那 "that"?

    • @TheRealVenusian
      @TheRealVenusian หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@zzineohp yeah Mandarin hasn't got articles, hence my confusion haha

    • @chrishealy1679
      @chrishealy1679 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@TheRealVenusian I like that, since a lot of IE articles developed from demonstratives anyway. 彼 or 是 would also be good options for transcription since they're demonstratives in Classical Chinese. I like how fast it becomes apparent why Korean and Japanese eventually had to innovate to represent speech in writing. Would love to see what Prosian does with regard to productive prefixes and suffixes

  • @kadenvanciel9335
    @kadenvanciel9335 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Of all the conlang showcases I’ve seen…

  • @marcellkiss-redey8451
    @marcellkiss-redey8451 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Is your list of rules unique to Prosian, or is it a more general list from which you picked the ones you likes? I couldn't really follow that part...

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      i made em up

  • @onusmusicboers2885
    @onusmusicboers2885 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Do you have any good sources on Proto-IE?

  • @EvenRoyalsNeedToUrinate
    @EvenRoyalsNeedToUrinate หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    Now that you have a stable income through TH-cam it's time to finally upgrade your recording equipment!

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +18

      Good mic options for $0.04?

    • @EvenRoyalsNeedToUrinate
      @EvenRoyalsNeedToUrinate หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      @@zzineohp don't spend it all at once I guess..? but seriously this content looks like a ton of work, I hope you'll be able to generate some kind of revenue from it soon 😅

  • @cupcakkeisaslayqueen
    @cupcakkeisaslayqueen หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I wanted to do it so badly, i just threw japonic out of there (rip japonic, not missing you since i dislike it) and made the japanic branxh but i couldn't get enough info on Proto-Indo-European (probably didnt look hard enough tho), but i still am making some stuff toward it

  • @aro4cinglife
    @aro4cinglife หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    dunno why but this gives mad Jreg vibes, still a good conlang tho

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      Jreggin these

  • @hannahstaigvil1098
    @hannahstaigvil1098 26 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Bleak Falls Barrow?

  • @semsot-the-fake
    @semsot-the-fake 25 วันที่ผ่านมา

    I'm also kinda working on an Indo-European conlang. And since I'm Russian-speaker myself it has pretty complex grammar, like six tenses (three perfect ones and three continious) with the same amount for passive voice therefore four infinitives and seven noun cases with three genders and three declensions (at least the only irregular verb is "to be" and the only weirdly declined nouns are first and second person pronouns: "I-we" and "thou-you"). But since I didn't follow the rules (or rather didn't really care that much how this or that action is actually called) of how the real world languages have evolved from P.I.E. the real Indo-European researchers would either laugh or look askance at me and my creation. Not like I even care though
    Anyway, what's about phonology - consonants at the beginning and the end of the words become voiceless while in the middle they're voiced (I bet no Indo-European language with this weird feature exists, I took it from Korean) and what about grammar - nouns can easily change their gender without the addition of unneccessary suffixes, especially inanimate nouns (which also isn't pretty much of an Indo-European thing), so, for example, a "car" can be masculine, feminine or neuter depending on the context. Since I've come with idea of this language being from a different world where neither Phoenicians nor Romans never existed it would use it's own alphabet consisting of about 80 letters, but it's not because it has that huge phonetic library rather because the diphtongs and consonant clusters are written with a single letter like we write "x" instead of "ks" or "gs" (but since I can't code I'm gonna write the example text with Latin script)
    And yeah, for now I use all this complexity only for one silly objective - singable translations of some songs. If anyone interested I can send here one of my translation
    And finally, the sample text (Schleicher's fable):
    (Ne-Sholli) na-Avfin mida sinfelsa feidifit theirof Eshof: prefos pordambit so-grafja Carra, tevdoros pherrembit so-masna Cravsa en theirdoros fesle pherrembit so-Sema. Sjek Avfin narrafit Esham: "sherjet mva Serda cham feidju che so-Semos podjet Éshosmi". Tham Eshy narrafeit kxn Ja: "slavze Avfi, naszdory Serdy jegsame sherjeit cham Semos, so-Bodis, sxnasdet eiz avfjena Felsa pher Selba ne-sall Fesdjmeit en Avfin manjet sinfelsa". Slavzife se Innarr Avfin pheigefit kxn Asre

  • @cupcakkeisaslayqueen
    @cupcakkeisaslayqueen หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    The polish example "psia piłka" is kinda weird. Its technically correct, but no polidh person ever would say "psia piłka" as the dogs ball. We would say piłka psa, that example you said sounds more like a name of something, i dont really know how ro explain it

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      That makes sense, because psia is apparently not the Genitive

    • @cupcakkeisaslayqueen
      @cupcakkeisaslayqueen หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@zzineohp it would most naturally occur as a proper name, maybe of a dog toy, but I don't really know what case it is being a native speaker. Gotta love not knowing what case is a word in my native Language

    • @LeoNarrator
      @LeoNarrator หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@zzineohp psia is a feminine adjective meaning "canine" or "dog" like in "dog food"

    • @milobem4458
      @milobem4458 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      In my village (in Galicia) we definitely say "psia buda", "psia miska", etc. "Psia piłka" doesn't sound weird to me at all. The only problem is that grammatically it doesn't fit the pattern he was trying to portray in the video, but on it's own it's ok. Actually "piłka psa" sounds stranger to me.

    • @cupcakkeisaslayqueen
      @cupcakkeisaslayqueen หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@milobem4458 well I think it can depend on the person, but also region, I personally live in Częstochowa

  • @Connor-op9gh
    @Connor-op9gh หลายเดือนก่อน

    Is there a source that lists PIE suffixes and shows what grade they put the root into? Like, how do you know that *-os puts the root into e-grade and *-sḱóror puts the root into zero-grade?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Category:Proto-Indo-European_suffixes

  • @user-yh1nm1vy3i
    @user-yh1nm1vy3i หลายเดือนก่อน

    What keyboard settings do you use? I want to be able to type all those cool PIE diacritics and others.

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      US international keyboard, but I need to copy and paste and lot of diacritics to make letters like u-with-breve-and-umlaut

  • @vincentd1120
    @vincentd1120 หลายเดือนก่อน +7

    13:04 fug :DDD

    • @jan_Masewin
      @jan_Masewin หลายเดือนก่อน

      ehehehe

    • @ThorirPP
      @ThorirPP หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      if it had completely went through grims law pug would have become... fuk

  • @Jablicek
    @Jablicek หลายเดือนก่อน

    Jesus wept, this is magic

  • @sadkarret
    @sadkarret หลายเดือนก่อน

    You forgot about Cole's Law!!
    You will need cabbage in order to do it tho

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      unfortunately there is no way to tell if this comment is satire or not

    • @Ramanuj_Sarkar
      @Ramanuj_Sarkar หลายเดือนก่อน

      I think it's a coleslaw joke, unless I'm missing something.

  • @Jon-mh9lk
    @Jon-mh9lk หลายเดือนก่อน

    Why mix simplified and traditional characters? (擊/击 and 圍/围). Are they Communists or are they not?
    Are they maybe using their own set of characters like the Japanese?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      They should all be simplified, probably just a mistake

  • @Kamarovsky_KCM
    @Kamarovsky_KCM หลายเดือนก่อน

    Hi would you please have a list somewhere with all those 101 sound changes listed with explanations or something?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      In the description

    • @Kamarovsky_KCM
      @Kamarovsky_KCM หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@zzineohp Ah, I feared that the wiki pages is all there is. Though that the numbered list of those 101 is some already established and ordered list and not just wiki pages that are hard to understand and get around on. But thanks anyway!

  • @pankobreadcrumbs7090
    @pankobreadcrumbs7090 หลายเดือนก่อน

    are there any good lists of pie roots and suffixes, or did you just use wiktionary?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      ahdictionary.com/word/indoeurop.html is good

    • @killianobrien2007
      @killianobrien2007 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Is wiktionary bad?

    • @pankobreadcrumbs7090
      @pankobreadcrumbs7090 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@zzineohp thank you so much!!

    • @pankobreadcrumbs7090
      @pankobreadcrumbs7090 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@killianobrien2007 wouldnt say bad but for this it doesnt provide enough info a lot of the time

  • @ForceOfUru
    @ForceOfUru หลายเดือนก่อน

    Quite easy actually. First, pick an Indo-European speaking folk. Then divide them into factions by religion, geography or political motives. After that, wait a few centuries. Voalla! You have different nations with different (at least not completely same) languages.

  • @tigergamespl2713
    @tigergamespl2713 15 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    How do I find a reliable PIE dictionary?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  15 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Wikipedias page for Indo-European vocabulary is a good start, I linked an appendix of PIE roots in the original video

  • @LanceAbrams
    @LanceAbrams 9 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Sounds closer to the European branch of IE than the Indo-Iranian branch.

  • @AndrewRusherLDS
    @AndrewRusherLDS หลายเดือนก่อน

    The audio is abit low :(

  • @PlaguevonKarma
    @PlaguevonKarma 25 วันที่ผ่านมา +1

    失业的语言学家?我也是xswl
    我希望你用过文言文的词,文言文非常有趣……

  • @Moses_Caesar_Augustus
    @Moses_Caesar_Augustus 24 วันที่ผ่านมา

    This language sounds like it would be spoken by the gods.

  • @5skdm
    @5skdm 3 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Small nitpick about the thumbnail, the clause “和你也会” might be slightly incorrect, as far as I know “和” is for objects on a list and not a conjunction between clauses, so I think “而” would be better suited to translate "and" . But hey, probably nobody else cares lol

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  3 วันที่ผ่านมา

      Oh no lots of people care. But Prosian only has one word for and, and it uses the same character for both contexts

    • @5skdm
      @5skdm 3 วันที่ผ่านมา

      ​@@zzineohp So Prosian uses 汉字 like how Japanese got a bunch of kanji to package up some roughly similar-meaning words?

  • @randomguy-tg7ok
    @randomguy-tg7ok หลายเดือนก่อน

    Where do you get the list of sound changes for languages from? Do you make them yourself?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      I named most of the myself, but the actual sound changes I poached from 2 Wikipedia articles, Proto-Germanic and the Phonological History of English

    • @EmyFelnen
      @EmyFelnen หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@zzineohp literally used the same articles for the ideas for my other conlang, nice

  • @miguelcanais
    @miguelcanais หลายเดือนก่อน

    How can one start learning all of this?

  • @Zeutomehr
    @Zeutomehr หลายเดือนก่อน

    bʰréh₁wr̥ was a word for well

  • @nevreiha
    @nevreiha หลายเดือนก่อน

    barrow isn't nearly non existent, we still have things named it in england

  • @dyadyaleva3309
    @dyadyaleva3309 หลายเดือนก่อน

    How about consider the Chinese influence on grammar on syntax since the Middle Ages, because educated people of Prosian society should certainly know Middle Chinese language and incorporate its features in their native language?

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      Hey man that's an idea but the video is called "How to make an Indo-European language" not "how to make a Chinese language that's ultimately descended from PIE"

    • @dyadyaleva3309
      @dyadyaleva3309 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@zzineohp yes, I got it. Just a suggestion

  • @gustavoalejandromorletavil426
    @gustavoalejandromorletavil426 หลายเดือนก่อน

    The final translation sounds like an Albanian/Baltic language with East Slavic influence...

  • @manuelmanuel3554
    @manuelmanuel3554 28 วันที่ผ่านมา

    As a Spanish speaker the begging of video was really funny

  • @walktroughman1952
    @walktroughman1952 28 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Now I get why Lithuanian and Latvian are so cursed.

  • @celestialhylos7028
    @celestialhylos7028 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Ahhh.....Why do I end up here?

  • @gustavoalejandromorletavil426
    @gustavoalejandromorletavil426 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Spanish-speaking people reaching proto-Germanic: 🤨

  • @FafnirSiggurdson
    @FafnirSiggurdson หลายเดือนก่อน

    Chinese on the thumbnail is incorrect. 和 cannot connect 2 independent clauses

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      It's not Chinese it's Prosian

  • @phonxil4592
    @phonxil4592 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    和你也会 → also meet with you/with you can also be
    Is that intentional? XD
    Edit: I think it is

  • @robbo415
    @robbo415 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    You can’t say 和你也会 in Chinese. That Chinese in the video panel doesn’t mean “and you can too”, because 和 is a connector for nouns not sentences. The word for “and” that links sentences is 而且, or just a pause. So it should just be 你也会, or 而且你也会, or 你也做得到, etc.

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      It isn't Chinese it's Prosian. Prosian uses the same word for both uses, so it uses the same character to represent the word.

    • @chrishealy1679
      @chrishealy1679 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@zzineohp I came down here looking for this comment lol. I agree it would have made more sense for Prosian to have taken a character that more directly means "and", since the use of 和 to link nouns in Mandarin is derived from a more fundamental meaning having to do with harmony, summing, etc., and is not even a common feature shared with most other Chinese languages. If Prosian were a real language developing near China, it probably would have taken a character like 且 to transcribe "kye", and indeed you can find 且 having this meaning when used in Japanese, Korean, and Vietnamese, at least according to Wiktionary. I could also see 及 or 與 having done this historically.
      But definitely you can make up any justification you want for 和, it's your language and you can do whatever you want with it. Just a little odd for its writing system to have been borrowed from modern Mandarin. Though I suppose if we're really going to get down to historical plausibility, a lot of non-Chinese languages in that region you placed it in use a Brahmic related script anyway. And it's a great language you made, very cool, way beyond my abilities!

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@chrishealy1679 aaaahhh the only Chinese language i know is Mandarin, why does everything have to be so complicaaaaateeeeed

    • @chrishealy1679
      @chrishealy1679 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@zzineohp you should try some classical chinese some time, it's a trip ;)

    • @fried___3217
      @fried___3217 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@chrishealy1679there are also a longggg list of other concerns if you’re going for historical plausibility

  • @LeoNarrator
    @LeoNarrator หลายเดือนก่อน

    Isn't "važmyens" supposed to be spelled with 2 characters? It has 2 morphemes. It's unlikely that the -myens suffix would be present in only one word

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน

      well, yeah, but it's a PIE noun-forming suffix. važmyens is part of a different lexeme then then the descendant of only bhelgh, which would be vyelh, which would be a verb that means "to swell or expand" (although I would semantic shift it to burst). I'm using each hanzi to represent a Lemma or Inflection, not a root that may be present in another word.

  • @y11971alex
    @y11971alex หลายเดือนก่อน

    Come on, PIE had a mediopassive participle in *-mHn-o- 😅

  • @liquidoxygen819
    @liquidoxygen819 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    We demand a Semitic conlang

  • @siyacer
    @siyacer หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    how do you say skibidi toilet in prosian

    • @zzineohp
      @zzineohp  หลายเดือนก่อน +5

      well skibidi is a nonsense word loaned from bulgarian, I imagine it would be nativised as Šibidi, and toilet I reconstruct as Yenlwerurö, ultimately from PIE *h₁en-léw-h₂e-wr̥ (the thing that you make dirty)

    • @siyacer
      @siyacer หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      @@zzineohp only in Ohio

    • @imdayvsketch2299
      @imdayvsketch2299 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      ​@@siyacerhahahqjqjjqjqjw

  • @hinatwinz917
    @hinatwinz917 8 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Reupload this video, but use Portuguese as the indo-European language example instead of English and use a different Indo-European root.

  • @lit2021
    @lit2021 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    važmyens sounds very Baltic to me :D can anyone of you Lithuanians and Latvians understand any of this?

    • @cupidsnow3885
      @cupidsnow3885 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      lol it does like lithuanian

  • @wezzuh2482
    @wezzuh2482 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Damn i learned a bit from watching this silly buffoonery

  • @AlexLococo
    @AlexLococo 28 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Bale bérgaz la bida...

  • @gonzalojulianconde4605
    @gonzalojulianconde4605 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Jaja dijo verga

  • @Tyler-bp4md
    @Tyler-bp4md หลายเดือนก่อน

    I speak an Indo-European language