@@michaelalando Very philosophical of you but alas dear philosopher, this is not a philosophy thread, it is very specifically about a boxer, who participated in the professional sport of boxing, hence me specifically referring to boxing. *Ahem !*
One thing Big John you were And you will always be Heavyweight Champion and nobody can take that from you..R.I.P millions of fighters can’t be Champion But you were.
I think of these fighters that fall apart..It’s very possible Big John might have had CTE..He had a long amateur career on top of Professional career There no set number of blows or knockouts or Concussions.. they say just little sub-concussion punches have a effect and He had a lot years Boxing sparring and he’s been knocked out a few times I think if you look at his symptoms he had it fits CTE .And they need to start evaluating fighters and those who unravel in these contact sports.
I was at ringside when Tate was kayoed by Weaver, I think there were 3 people in the arena pulling for Mike, myself, my brother & some guy on the other side of the ring facing us we were very vocal, after the ko Weaver came to our side of the ring & shook his glove at us. The tide started to turn in in the12th round as Weaver hit Tate with a 3 punch combination that was the beginning of the end for Tate. Mike Weaver was an unappreciated & laconic heavyweight. I gave Weaver a very good chance of beating Tate as I saw him fight in 1977 against unbeaten Bill Sharkey. Sharkey battered Weaver from pillar to post first 3 rounds, Weaver rode the storm out and won on points, years later Weaver said that was one of his toughest fights ever, Sharkey just kept coming at me and wouldn't let up. The whole problem with Tate was his handlers, they were lightweights & that is being kind. Who in the world would let their fighter go up against a clone of Mike Weaver in Trever Berbick in less than 90 days after such a bad ko.
@@johnoliver189 I had a chance to meet Mike Weaver in 1986, he was fighting Razor Ruddock on the undercard of the Bonecrusher Smith--David Bey fight in Fayetteville,N.C. All the fighters were staying at big motel in town & training was done in one of the convention rooms. I was with my brother & 2 other guys. We went right to the training room, 1 of us went somewhere else. We were talking to Emil Griffin who was training Bonecrusher, when other guy showed up & said " I just talked to Mike Weaver " we took off, but Weaver was nowhere to be found. We missed him by no more than 3 minutes.
That's a very sad ending for Big Jonh Tate, I was an amateur boxer when Mike Weaver knocked him out in the 15th round. You remain our World Heavyweight Champion and will always be! (R.I.P)
A nice decent man who's personality was changed completely through drugs and beatings to the head .People who said he he didn't have a chin have never been hit by a 200lb+ man.
Yup, after each sparring session my head would feel like it was filed with cotton. Btw, one of my trainers was Leroy Caldwell he fought Tate in this video.
He took some solid shots from legitimate punchers coming up. in the pros, and he was a very decent man. Tennessee loved him. He drew a big crowd in Knoxville for the Weaver bout. I remember people handing out "Free" fight tickets, but on the back in fine print it said "The fight starts when you try to get in with this" .I sure wish his life hadn't turned out the way it did.
@@eldragon4076 Same situation with me. I too trained under a high level trainer in a gym with mostly pros and some champions. Sparring was always vs more experienced boxers and always hardcore. It was almost accepted and expected to eventually get "a little punch drunk" for us. I think I had concussions after every sessions (approx 3 days a week). To this day I think it's effected me these last 20 years. Do you feel effects anymore? Searching for words, forgetting things, get upset with things that most brush off etc?
I was a fan of John Tate's from watching the 1976 Olympics. My father, older brother, and I watched the Tate vs. Weaver fight together. We were heartbroken by Tate being KOed in the 15th round. Ace Miller even told Tate to run during the round, but he stated that he wanted to go for the KO. That ill-advised decision sadly derailed the rest of his career.
Wow....John Tate wanted to go for a ko ? He definitely wasn't trying. Looked exhausted and in survival mode. Weaver hit Tate with a body shot near the end of the 14th round. At that moment Tate looked like his will to win was gone. Crappy amateurish management. The new champion has a time frame to defend. They should have made the first defense later in the year.
I watched the Weaver fight live when I was a kid.I really liked him as a fighter, and felt so sad when he lost along with the events that led to his death. He was on the fasttrack to big money fights against Ali and Holmes. Those 45 seconds that changed everything....
I was so proud that a heavyweight Champion came from Tennessee. The way he handled Coatzee proved he was the real deal. I hate so many of these brave warriors suffer so much when it ends.
@@johnlaws9853 No doubt. So many of the great fighters do. They come from poverty and go back into it. There are a few exceptions but for the most part, this is what they do.
@@everettwhite9874 Very noble of you but let's be realistic. You will have a harder time in life if you can't read or write. This world we live in is not friendly.
I started following Big John's career when we were guests at the same wedding and was delighted at his steady rise to the championship. Of course I attended the Weaver fight (the second Tate fight I attended), which was going very well, until the 12th round when I had a big scare. Big John seemed on his way to victory - then, shockingly, almost at the end, he was knocked out. What a bummer! The crowd kept chanting "Big John Tate!" for several minutes. One amusing memory is with chatting with the custodians in my building, two very nice black ladies, about how I heard his manager Ace Miller was teaching Big John to read and write, and they told me they didn't think Ace had it down all that well himself.
Damn-that was an amazing documentary, very painful. I also watched the ‘76 team and followed them all from then on- Always really liked Big John, too bad how it worked out. This channel is amazing, keep up the great work!
That was a fantastic mini doc. I've been binging out on your content and this is my favorite one thus far. Big John was such a good guy , especially before his downfall due to drugs, and his trainer Miller was seemed to have a high degree of integrity, which is rare for handlers in this sport. Did you do all of the editing and soundtrack? Soundtrack was top notch with the cinematic feel.
I was at the Tate-Weaver fight. I was in high school, and, being from a town near Knoxville, I was a big fan of Tate's ever since the 76 Olympics......I used to go to Ace Miller's gym, watch the Knoxville Golden Gloves, and talk to him and Big John often. I remember him bringing his championship belt to the gym on night, and I got to see it and take pictures with him and the belt. He was a good, kind, man before that Weaver bout. It was a shame how his life turned for the worse afterward.
Think this is the saddest and the best video I have seen in this channel the segments of interviews of Tate, his coach, etc were a very good detail; Tate had a very cool voice too so it was extra sad to hear it talking mostly about regrets.
Excellent documentary. Big John had his moment in the sun, and it's too bad that became more of an albatross than a source of comfort to him. Drug addiction is a terrible disease where even those with a lot of family/friends support have a tough time making it. I also agree with other posters who criticize the decision to put John in the ring with Berbick so soon after his KO loss to weaver. He needed two or three easier fights to get his confidence back. RIP
As a Montreal native it was cool to see him win the medal in 76 . Listening to Claude Mouton the ex- Mtl. Canadien's announcer at the Berbick fight was a nice flashback. That fight was the undercard of the 1st Leonard Duran. It was also the same night that Cleveland Denny lost his life at the Hards of Gaetan Hart .All said, very sad night .
John Tate, with a sort of movie-star looks, has always been a little enigmatic. He seemed to fade as quickly as he came. I would love to see a very extended documentary about him!
When "Big" John Tate fought my countryman Gerrie Coetzee at Loftus Versfeld all of Black South Africa was rooting for him. I remember this fight as a little boy as we sat glued to the television set. A win for a Black man was seen as a blow against the oppressive apartheid regime of South Africa. This was pretty much the sentiment for any White boxer who fought for a world championship.
I spent lot of time in South Africa back in the early 1980's, got to meet lot of top boxing people in South Africa. I would never go back to SA now, place is falling apart, you traded the Boer Party for something much worse.
@@strangerintown3676 Life is relative. If you insinuating the oppression of Black people should have persisted under a racist and unethical system, then you part of the problem.
@@strangerintown3676 No doubt there is much that has gone wrong under the ANC-led government and I am in no way a supporter of theirs, but the manner in which you inflect upon the Boer Party, as you call it, surmises that was a better option. I don't know which country you come from and what demographic you part of, but that notion is absolutely horrendous.
I remember watching Tate vs Weaver live and , not really knowing either fighter, I was rooting for Weaver as he was getting a hiding. I was stoked when Weaver landed that left hand. I had no idea it would precipitate such a monumental fall from grace for Tate. What a tragic story. I didn’t even know he’d died. 😔
This channel really is great. I've been binge-watching your video's since I stumbled across it the other day. So yeah, thanks for putting these videos together Man. I can see the time, hard work and effort you put into making them, and I appreciate that.
Trump got knocked out after one term two impeachments. Then attacked our Capitol January 6. Begs for 11,780 nonexistent votes in Georgia like a whining coward loser!! Haha trump lost.
I remember watching this with my dad. I was 10 years old. It was on ABC when regular TV was free and actually showed championship boxing. Only the absolute biggest fights were on "Closed circuit" TV.
That old thing called greed and more for the wealthy corporate parasites. I remember listening to, Sonny Liston vs. Cassuis Clay , Heavyweight championship bout on a old stand up floor model RCA radio and then the Lewiston Maine rematch when Ali put down Liston with the , so called, phantom punch. Soon after ABC started their televised friday night and weekend boxings matches. Throughout the rest of the 1960's and 1970's television provided all the great, various weight ,championship bouts. I became a diehard boxing fan . Never missed a televised boxing match. The rise of Marvelous Marvin Hagler was something special and I became a instant loyal fan. Even prior to Haglers last fight I was never interested in that flashy, ego freak sugar ray loser. I was always under the impression the challenge needs to soundly beat the champion to take his belt . The flashy little pitter pat pops that do nothing , that couldn't hurt a fly doesn't impress me and shouldn't impress the judges scoring either. Anyway, radio then television brought boxing to my era and generation. The advent of close circuit tv then pay per view was the beginning of the end . It's not only sports and boxing in particular, but every aspect of our society has been corrupted and rigged for enormous profits for a few already weathy parasites. You also have the real parasitic scumbags like that poor excuse of a human being called , Don King....one of the grossest, sociopaths of all time. Hopefully that individual scumbag has a horrible and painful death..no one deserves it more.
@@willyD200 Oh yeah, boxing was great back in the 70s to mid 90s. Tommy Hearns, Larry Holmes,Marvin Hagler, Marlon Starling, Michael Carbajal,Simon Brown,Julian Jackson,and of course Mike Tyson were some of my favorite fighters back when.
I have long suspected that Buster Douglas and Riddick Bowe, who also ate their way out of contention, would find a similar unpleasant fate. Glad to be wrong.
An immense and rare talent. Heart breaks to hear this. How many HW fighters today would fight Gerrie Coetzee, Mike Weaver and Trevor Berbick over an 8 month period ? He was badly mismanaged and should never have been put through that. Big John Tate at his very best would destroy every HW boxer of 2021, bar none. We love you Big John !
This happens often in boxing, Tommy Morrison was scheduled for a 11 million dollar title fight against Lennox Lewis all he had to do was get through Ray Mercer...the rest is history 🙄
That was a overly cocky move, since Mercer had already beaten him in the Olympic trials. One of those things where you look back, & its like, "wtf were they thinking?"
@@irishlamb4018 The ironic thing about Tommy Morrison and John Tate is that they both look like guys who would have strong chins. They both had thick necks and broad jawlines.
Rest in paradise to both. I had the privilege to be trained by Ace Miller. I never took boxing seriously however the training and knowledge I recieved definitely was.
I remember the Tate and Weaver fight like it was yesterday. It was me, my dad, and my uncle watching the fight together. We were all siding with John Tate. For, we were a fan of him from his the Olympic days. When the fight was over with him and Mike Weaver, we just couldn’t believe that John Tate lost.
John was a great fighter he beat my good friend Greg Page ...i thought John would beaten Holmes back in the day ....Weaver was lucky...I remember watching the fight i was along many others shock ..
I followed his career when I was young. In his prime he was an elite boxer for sure. He had a way of shifting during a fight that reminded me of Ali and Holmes. Losing to Mike Weaver in any round was nothing to hang his head about. Both of these fighters were very underrated.
I remeber watching the fight thinking why doesn't Tate just dance around the ring and avoid Weaver? Then suddenly boom! He went down like a tree! I yelled out Oh no!; WTH?
Love the video. The writing, narration, editing. Great storytelling. A story in this case with a very sad ending. But definitely glad to know of this one time champion.
@@juniorjohnson5961 he also sent time in and out of prison. Mostly for raping his daughters babysitter. Not a good person, really. He also never should have agreed to fight Ali. Tyson really went after him for that. Or, as Larry Holmes said about Berbick’s unceremonious end, “God doesn’t like ugly.”
I trained and lived at same gym as Big John we were good friends this is NOT that great of biopics several statements were not true. I was lucky to be training and knowing Big John I even sparred with him although Ace wouldn’t let him go full power on me because I was alway about 70lbs lighter. He was a great man with a giant heart who fell victim to drugs it NEVER CHANGED BIG JOHN’S HEART 🧡 R.I.P. Champion Big John Tate 🙏🏽❤️
Nowadays Tate's next fight after Weaver would have been a rematch. For the past five years the titles have been pretty much frozen by the same group of fighters going after each other.
As a life long Knoxville Tennessee resident boxing who grew up loving boxing,....my dad use to say to me when I'd get in fights in school,.."Nolia!! we just need to take him over to Chilhowee Park and let Big John straighten him out." Nolia was my mother's name and Chilhowee Park was where the Golden Gloves hum was in Knoxville. I grew up knowing about and respecting John. He was a household name for most of my childhood. It did however break my fathers heart during John's many appearances in TV he local newspapers and news. My dad was proud to boast a Heavyweight champion from our own state and city. Such a sad ending. Anyway,.....another masterpiece. Well done sir. Well done.👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
Tate v Coetzee was not the first integrated boxing match in South Africa. The first such fight was Bob Foster v Pierre Fourie for the WBA light heavyweight championship in 1973
His Knoxville home is right across from a food city I went to growing up, he’s kinda like a legend in Knoxville that you’ll hear the older people talking about every once in a while.
What is often overlooked is that in terms of 1 punch knockout power in BOTH hands, Mike Weaver may have no equal in heavyweight history. Prior to his title fight against Larry Holmes, Weaver knocked out Bernardo Mercado with a left hook that left Mercado unconscious for 3 minutes. Weaver then hurt Holmes badly in the 4th round with a left hook and in the 10th round with a right hand of their war at Madison Square Garden. After knocking out Tate to win the WBA Title, he knocked out Gerrie Coetzee in the 13th round with a huge right hand. Weaver's problem was that he was a lazy fighter and lacked the consistent aggressiveness needed to maximize his punching power.
Back here in Botswana there was a game kids played in the 80s called Big John Tate. It especially alludes to him being beaten to the deck. Didnt know Tate then but this video sort of put that into perspective. There were also paper bags with a pic of Tate on them from South Africa
Talented fighter. Had boxing skills and power, but with an Achilles heel- his chin. In his Olympic loss to Stevenson, and his losses to Weaver and Berbick, when he got tagged, he went out. His body's reaction to getting hit with a big shot was extreme and scary. That problem guaranteed that his reign as champion, and his status as a serious contender, was going to be brief no matter what. It's a shame his life spiraled out of control the way it did.
Tate's chin and lack of endurance was going to catch up to him sooner or later. Fame can raise you, and bury you. I would like to know if anyone seriously tried to help Tate.
His Heavyweight Champion Chin they don’t give the titles away to Glass Jaw Joes he climbed up the latter to the title you only saw the Big fights he lost...He won more and it’s all he knew and made it there and back from where he started...from nothing.
Tragically there is a long history of poor young men who become famous sports figures and amass great sums of money only to die destitute. The list of these people is long and heartbreaking. Dishonest handlers, drugs, and alcohol any of which can take a man like Tate and turn him into a substance-addicted beggar. RIP Big John, you deserved better.
Adversity comes to all, not just champions. The real heroes are the people who never give up and keep going no matter what the troubles. Cancer - old age - heart attacks. Trouble will come, but we have to keep going doing the best we can for as long as possible. It's not that you got knocked down by life, it's that you got back up. The man working in the coal mine, the factory, the fields of farms, you never know who will be the next champion, even if no one else knows it.
The names: Mike Weaver,Gerrie Coetzee,Trevor Berbick and John Tate,good fighters I saw growing,the heavyweight division was stacked in the 70s,80s,tragic story,John Tate!!
I watched this fight on ABC until the 12th round. I went to bed. I picked weaver to win and there was no way he would get the decision since he had bAsically lost every round. I got to school the next day and when I heard Weaver won, I thought they were joking w me.
He never really caught a big break. Even though Sonny Liston achieved far more, their lives as young kids were similar. Maybe Tate didn't steal as much as Liston, but they both were illiterate and as poor as poor gets. I remember someone once told Liston that he got some sort of present from his father. "Liston replied "The only thing my father ever gave me was a beating".....
I lived and trained with Big John at our Boxing gyms. Great man with a heart of gold! R.i.P. Champion Big John! Not a very good account on some cases in this document, a lot of bullshit. I was there the whole time even at the fight he lost to Weaver.
Big John was my kind of guy, heart-breaking that he had low self esteem and then became a victim of the booming 80's drug epidemic. So what, you lose with 45 seconds remaining, big f%&king deal, everybody loses, some ironically, some poetically, some tragically and some fatally. If only he could have squared it with himself: that losing don't make the loser...the drugs did that to him. RIP Big John. Awesome job as always Rich.
A classic example of why you should never take drugs, life is hard enough to navigate with all your faculties intact, if you impair your judgement then your ability to control fame, fortune and then the eventual loss of success is going to be zero. A sad story, I feel so sorry for Tate, when you see what his life might have been, but I hope others can learn a lesson from this tragedy.
Very sad. He was working in pup wood, I usted to do the same work, he worked the ground, having to carrying the logs, same way I had to do. They would say it will either kill you or make you a man. It will do both if you are not careful. Big John turned to drugs, I was an alcoholic at the time, and I stayed one for years. If we could only see our future, so much we would change....a body can only take so much...
Big John tate was a good boxer and a good friend he should have won that fight by mike weaver he had the chance to win the fight in the 15 round but he lost it at the very end I remember that fight on ABC wild world of sports
Good question. At the very least he should have had points taken away, and the fight stopped because of the foul. Then, if Tate couldn’t continue, go to the judges scorecards. I believe that’s what the rules were then.
As a referee myself if an opponent turns his head which causes the back to be hit unless the ref feels the fighter throwing did it intentionally he is ok to let it go. Meaning you are throwing a legal shot and your opponent turns his head and gets hit, that’s the fighter turning his heads fault; it a;so looked like one or more blows came from the side From behind once again caused by Tate b3ing out of proper position
@@RichtheFightHistorian, I agree this was very well done. However I would point out that the truck he died in was not his truck. It belonged to a guy that grew up in Oak Ridge and he and his girlfriend were riding in the passenger seat while Tate was driving. When the local news came on the TV and showed the truck I knew instantly who's truck it was and by the way not the truck in this video. I always felt bad for Mr. Tate after he died and wished he had never meet the guy who owned the truck as he was IMO a long time POS who from my understanding later died over drugs.
It's crazy when I was a young adult I use to sell Big John Crack in the hood. Not proud of it but it's true. He was a really good guy and we had a lot of good conversations.
One correction needs to be made, John Tate started boxing when he lived in West Memphis before he moved to Knoxville. Our coach in West Memphis, Mr House picked him up from working at the West Memphis lumber mill to go to practice in Memphis and he took up half of the back seat of the car. I saw him knockout an opponent. He made great improvements after he moved to Knoxville.
@@samuraihardware7435 The Creator of the Heavens and Earth created everything, every thought, every emotion 🏝 Splitting an atom can be a force for good, or the most devistating force. Our desires can be good and they can be used in a bad way. Do we appreciate what we've been given and try to look after it, or complain and put ourselves in a state where drugs are needed.🤷🏽♂️ But I know for sure The Creator of the Heavens and Earth created this plague and your humble request could lift it👍🏾 #WeAskTheCreatorOfTheHeavensAnd EarthToLiftThisPlagueGlobally We ask The Creator of the Heavens and Earth to lift this plague globally 🌏😎 👍🏾🇦🇺
So I'll throw it out there- Weaver doesn't land that punch and Tate goes on to win a wide decision, and Ali signs to fight him instead of Holmes. How does that go?
Not much different. Tate fell to the wayside because of his decisions and choices in life and not because he lost to Weaver and Berbick. Plenty of fighters lost to Weaver and Berbick and they didn’t all end up lost in life like John Tate did.
Man.Boxing is filled to the brim with such tragic stories. RIP John.
ya, it is, his is one of the sadder ones.
Rest in peace God bless you John
Actually all life is.
@@michaelalando
Very philosophical of you but alas dear philosopher, this is not a philosophy thread, it is very specifically about a boxer, who participated in the professional sport of boxing, hence me specifically referring to boxing.
*Ahem !*
@@SPIDERM0OSE Sorry, i didn't mean to offend you.
One thing Big John you were And you will always be Heavyweight Champion and nobody can take that from you..R.I.P millions of fighters can’t be Champion But you were.
amen!
Exactly
@@studjo19 Yes obvious, but not obvious to him John Tate. That is the point.
yep
I think of these fighters that fall apart..It’s very possible Big John might have had CTE..He had a long amateur career on top of Professional career There no set number of blows or knockouts or Concussions.. they say just little sub-concussion punches have a effect and He had a lot years Boxing sparring and he’s been knocked out a few times I think if you look at his symptoms he had it fits CTE .And they need to start evaluating fighters and those who unravel in these contact sports.
I was at ringside when Tate was kayoed by Weaver, I think there were 3 people in the arena pulling for Mike, myself, my brother & some guy on the other side of the ring facing us we were very vocal, after the ko Weaver came to our side of the ring & shook his glove at us. The tide started to turn in in the12th round as Weaver hit Tate with a 3 punch combination that was the beginning of the end for Tate. Mike Weaver was an unappreciated & laconic heavyweight. I gave Weaver a very good chance of beating Tate as I saw him fight in 1977 against unbeaten Bill Sharkey. Sharkey battered Weaver from pillar to post first 3 rounds, Weaver rode the storm out and won on points, years later Weaver said that was one of his toughest fights ever, Sharkey just kept coming at me and wouldn't let up. The whole problem with Tate was his handlers, they were lightweights & that is being kind. Who in the world would let their fighter go up against a clone of Mike Weaver in Trever Berbick in less than 90 days after such a bad ko.
Great story! This U.S. Olympic boxing team is what got me into boxing!
It wasn’t a shock to me that Tate was ko’d. As you pointed out, weaver was landing some heavy shots in those later rounds and Tate was tiring badly.
Great point, totally mismanaged. Tate faced Coetzee, Weaver and Berbick all inside of 8 months. That is managerial malpractice.
@@johnoliver189 I had a chance to meet Mike Weaver in 1986, he was fighting Razor Ruddock on the undercard of the Bonecrusher Smith--David Bey fight in Fayetteville,N.C. All the fighters were staying at big motel in town & training was done in one of the convention rooms. I was with my brother & 2 other guys. We went right to the training room, 1 of us went somewhere else. We were talking to Emil Griffin who was training Bonecrusher, when other guy showed up & said " I just talked to Mike Weaver " we took off, but Weaver was nowhere to be found. We missed him by no more than 3 minutes.
@@paulg444 I would go as far to say his management bordered on being criminal.
That's a very sad ending for Big Jonh Tate, I was an amateur boxer when Mike Weaver knocked him out in the 15th round. You remain our World Heavyweight Champion and will always be! (R.I.P)
Who was Mike Weavers trainer, anyone know? I heard it was Archie Grant. Is that true?
This is a fantastic production! Many thanks to everyone who put it together: Great Job!
A nice decent man who's personality was changed completely through drugs and beatings to the head .People who said he he didn't have a chin have never been hit by a 200lb+ man.
Yup, after each sparring session my head would feel like it was filed with cotton. Btw, one of my trainers was Leroy Caldwell he fought Tate in this video.
He took some solid shots from legitimate punchers coming up. in the pros, and he was a very decent man. Tennessee loved him. He drew a big crowd in Knoxville for the Weaver bout. I remember people handing out "Free" fight tickets, but on the back in fine print it said "The fight starts when you try to get in with this" .I sure wish his life hadn't turned out the way it did.
@@whitehurstcomic that's what I always here about the man.
@@eldragon4076
Same situation with me. I too trained under a high level trainer in a gym with mostly pros and some champions. Sparring was always vs more experienced boxers and always hardcore. It was almost accepted and expected to eventually get "a little punch drunk" for us.
I think I had concussions after every sessions (approx 3 days a week). To this day I think it's effected me these last 20 years.
Do you feel effects anymore? Searching for words, forgetting things, get upset with things that most brush off etc?
I was a fan of John Tate's from watching the 1976 Olympics. My father, older brother, and I watched the Tate vs. Weaver fight together. We were heartbroken by Tate being KOed in the 15th round. Ace Miller even told Tate to run during the round, but he stated that he wanted to go for the KO. That ill-advised decision sadly derailed the rest of his career.
Wow....John Tate wanted to go for a ko ? He definitely wasn't trying. Looked exhausted and in survival mode. Weaver hit Tate with a body shot near the end of the 14th round. At that moment Tate looked like his will to win was gone. Crappy amateurish management. The new champion has a time frame to defend. They should have made the first defense later in the year.
I watched the Weaver fight live when I was a kid.I really liked him as a fighter, and felt so sad when he lost along with the events that led to his death. He was on the fasttrack to big money fights against Ali and Holmes. Those 45 seconds that changed everything....
Same as the last few seconds for Taylor vs Chavez. It always makes you wonder, "What if".
Tate shoulda took the prize fight with Holmes.
@@brocklanders3616 Even if Taylor hadn't gotten knocked out by Chavez his career wouldn't have gone much further. He was basically shot by then.
I was so proud that a heavyweight Champion came from Tennessee. The way he handled Coatzee proved he was the real deal. I hate so many of these brave warriors suffer so much when it ends.
He had enough money to live comfortably, but he himself chose to piss his money and life away.
@@johnlaws9853 No doubt. So many of the great fighters do. They come from poverty and go back into it. There are a few exceptions but for the most part, this is what they do.
@@johnlaws9853 He definitely got taken advantage of also. He couldn't read or write.
@@lonniejackson5733 Fortunately, the ability to read and write isn’t the full measure of any man.
@@everettwhite9874 Very noble of you but let's be realistic. You will have a harder time in life if you can't read or write. This world we live in is not friendly.
This channel was needed. Remembering less popular boxers that could have become legendary if only... nicely done 👏
I started following Big John's career when we were guests at the same wedding and was delighted at his steady rise to the championship. Of course I attended the Weaver fight (the second Tate fight I attended), which was going very well, until the 12th round when I had a big scare. Big John seemed on his way to victory - then, shockingly, almost at the end, he was knocked out. What a bummer! The crowd kept chanting "Big John Tate!" for several minutes. One amusing memory is with chatting with the custodians in my building, two very nice black ladies, about how I heard his manager Ace Miller was teaching Big John to read and write, and they told me they didn't think Ace had it down all that well himself.
Big John Tate and Mike Weaver .... I will always remember that fight. God's speed Mr Tate .... God's speed.
Damn-that was an amazing documentary, very painful. I also watched the ‘76 team and followed them all from then on-
Always really liked Big John, too bad how it worked out.
This channel is amazing, keep up the great work!
Thanks so much, Bob.
That was a fantastic mini doc. I've been binging out on your content and this is my favorite one thus far.
Big John was such a good guy , especially before his downfall due to drugs, and his trainer Miller was seemed to have a high degree of integrity, which is rare for handlers in this sport.
Did you do all of the editing and soundtrack? Soundtrack was top notch with the cinematic feel.
Thanks, Ousama. I do the editing. The music I get from the artlist website.
I was at the Tate-Weaver fight. I was in high school, and, being from a town near Knoxville, I was a big fan of Tate's ever since the 76 Olympics......I used to go to Ace Miller's gym, watch the Knoxville Golden Gloves, and talk to him and Big John often. I remember him bringing his championship belt to the gym on night, and I got to see it and take pictures with him and the belt. He was a good, kind, man before that Weaver bout. It was a shame how his life turned for the worse afterward.
Thanks for sharing. I saw him a few times at Pittman's Gym in Oakland in the late 80s.
@@RichtheFightHistorian
Good production Rich. Good.
Think this is the saddest and the best video I have seen in this channel the segments of interviews of Tate, his coach, etc were a very good detail; Tate had a very cool voice too so it was extra sad to hear it talking mostly about regrets.
That wasn't Tate's voice. It was Rich's voice.
First of all I sub'd... Very well put together and as sad as it was... Great story!
Excellent documentary. Big John had his moment in the sun, and it's too bad that became more of an albatross than a source of comfort to him. Drug addiction is a terrible disease where even those with a lot of family/friends support have a tough time making it. I also agree with other posters who criticize the decision to put John in the ring with Berbick so soon after his KO loss to weaver. He needed two or three easier fights to get his confidence back. RIP
As a kid I remember watching that fight. ABC was airing 4 championship fights in 1 (one) night. What a vicious KO. Tragic life.
@Marco Antonio Yes 4 title fights from 3 locations.
Those were the days!
Big John Tate was an American Man a Damn Good American and a Damn Good Man !!
He would've hated trump
As a Montreal native it was cool to see him win the medal in 76 . Listening to Claude Mouton the ex- Mtl. Canadien's announcer at the Berbick fight was a nice flashback. That fight was the undercard of the 1st Leonard Duran. It was also the same night that Cleveland Denny lost his life at the Hards of Gaetan Hart .All said, very sad night .
John Tate, with a sort of movie-star looks, has always been a little enigmatic. He seemed to fade as quickly as he came. I would love to see a very extended documentary about him!
LOL .
When "Big" John Tate fought my countryman Gerrie Coetzee at Loftus Versfeld all of Black South Africa was rooting for him. I remember this fight as a little boy as we sat glued to the television set. A win for a Black man was seen as a blow against the oppressive apartheid regime of South Africa. This was pretty much the sentiment for any White boxer who fought for a world championship.
I spent lot of time in South Africa back in the early 1980's, got to meet lot of top boxing people in South Africa. I would never go back to SA now, place is falling apart, you traded the Boer Party for something much worse.
@@strangerintown3676 Life is relative. If you insinuating the oppression of Black people should have persisted under a racist and unethical system, then you part of the problem.
@@strangerintown3676 No doubt there is much that has gone wrong under the ANC-led government and I am in no way a supporter of theirs, but the manner in which you inflect upon the Boer Party, as you call it, surmises that was a better option. I don't know which country you come from and what demographic you part of, but that notion is absolutely horrendous.
@@bh1422 National Party correct name, I was using slang when I called it Boer Party. P.W. Botha was Prime Minster when I was in SA.
Tate has NOTHING to be ashamed of regarding the Weaver fight...fought his heart out.
I remember watching Tate vs Weaver live and , not really knowing either fighter, I was rooting for Weaver as he was getting a hiding. I was stoked when Weaver landed that left hand. I had no idea it would precipitate such a monumental fall from grace for Tate. What a tragic story. I didn’t even know he’d died. 😔
I always liked him and had empathy for him..... Nice job on the doc Rich.... RIP Big John...
This channel really is great. I've been binge-watching your video's since I stumbled across it the other day. So yeah, thanks for putting these videos together Man. I can see the time, hard work and effort you put into making them, and I appreciate that.
Thanks for the support, I appreciate it.
First video I’ve seen of yours yo, good work
That's so sad. Drugs are tough to beat and when everyone and everything is seemingly against him it made it even rougher. RIP Big John Tate!
People fall in to escape intense pain.
Trump got knocked out after one term two impeachments.
Then attacked our Capitol January 6. Begs for 11,780 nonexistent votes in Georgia like a whining coward loser!!
Haha trump lost.
I remember watching this with my dad. I was 10 years old. It was on ABC when regular TV was free and actually showed championship boxing. Only the absolute biggest fights were on "Closed circuit" TV.
That's how I became a boxing fan and that's why kids don't care about boxing now
@@samfranks9468 they do now thanks to Jake Paul
@@357-swagnumultramagax9 MMA ruined boxing I can't stand it
That old thing called greed and more for the wealthy corporate parasites. I remember listening to, Sonny Liston vs. Cassuis Clay , Heavyweight championship bout on a old stand up floor model RCA radio and then the Lewiston Maine rematch when Ali put down Liston with the , so called, phantom punch. Soon after ABC started their televised friday night and weekend boxings matches. Throughout the rest of the 1960's and 1970's television provided all the great, various weight ,championship bouts.
I became a diehard boxing fan . Never missed a televised boxing match. The rise of Marvelous Marvin Hagler was something special and I became a instant loyal fan. Even prior to Haglers last fight I was never interested in that flashy, ego freak sugar ray loser. I was always under the impression the challenge needs to soundly beat the champion to take his belt . The flashy little pitter pat pops that do nothing , that couldn't hurt a fly doesn't impress me and shouldn't impress the judges scoring either.
Anyway, radio then television brought boxing to my era and generation. The advent of close circuit tv then pay per view was the beginning of the end . It's not only sports and boxing in particular, but every aspect of our society has been corrupted and rigged for enormous profits for a few already weathy parasites. You also have the real parasitic scumbags like that poor excuse of a human being called , Don King....one of the grossest, sociopaths of all time. Hopefully that individual scumbag has a horrible and painful death..no one deserves it more.
@@willyD200 Oh yeah, boxing was great back in the 70s to mid 90s. Tommy Hearns, Larry Holmes,Marvin Hagler, Marlon Starling, Michael Carbajal,Simon Brown,Julian Jackson,and of course Mike Tyson were some of my favorite fighters back when.
I have long suspected that Buster Douglas and Riddick Bowe, who also ate their way out of contention, would find a similar unpleasant fate. Glad to be wrong.
Thanks for the video, RICH THE FIGHT HISTORIAN
An immense and rare talent. Heart breaks to hear this. How many HW fighters today would fight Gerrie Coetzee, Mike Weaver and Trevor Berbick over an 8 month period ? He was badly mismanaged and should never have been put through that. Big John Tate at his very best would destroy every HW boxer of 2021, bar none. We love you Big John !
Yes his management was crap. He should have waited longer before making his first defense.
This happens often in boxing, Tommy Morrison was scheduled for a 11 million dollar title fight against Lennox Lewis all he had to do was get through Ray Mercer...the rest is history 🙄
Actually it was Michael Bentt he had to get past IIRC.
@@milagrossantiago9942 Indeed, it was bentt that did a number on him
@willl 77 plus weak chin
That was a overly cocky move, since Mercer had already beaten him in the Olympic trials. One of those things where you look back, & its like, "wtf were they thinking?"
@@irishlamb4018 The ironic thing about Tommy Morrison and John Tate is that they both look like guys who would have strong chins. They both had thick necks and broad jawlines.
You got to feel sorry for those late 70s early 80s Heavyweight contenders coming up under the shadow of Ali.
True
Rest in paradise to both. I had the privilege to be trained by Ace Miller. I never took boxing seriously however the training and knowledge I recieved definitely was.
Ace Miller seemed like a great guy
I saw this fight as a kid on ABC wild world sports! Unforgettable! My favorite U.S. Olympic boxing team! 1976.
Tragic.....very well put together mini documentary well done
Hey thanks, MadDog.
I remember the Tate and Weaver fight like it was yesterday. It was me, my dad, and my uncle watching the fight together. We were all siding with John Tate. For, we were a fan of him from his the Olympic days. When the fight was over with him and Mike Weaver, we just couldn’t believe that John Tate lost.
I was a toddler when that fight between coetze and Tate occured. I remember my late father celebrating with friends at our home
Great video, subscribed.
This was super fascinating to watch! John Tate was my uncle :D
I still love Big John. I use to see him running and he would always wave as I passed by, he also was wearing that big grin that he always shared.
John was a great fighter he beat my good friend Greg Page ...i thought John would beaten Holmes back in the day ....Weaver was lucky...I remember watching the fight i was along many others shock ..
Was he fuck
@@michaeljohnson-fx9ri Beaten Larry Holmes? keep dreaming! But RIP to John
I miss john he was my first cousin
He Seemed Happy when Living the Small Town Quiet Life, Some of us Just Struggle in any other Environment R.i.p Big John
Excellent Work, loved that.
I followed his career when I was young. In his prime he was an elite boxer for sure. He had a way of shifting during a fight that reminded me of Ali and Holmes. Losing to Mike Weaver in any round was nothing to hang his head about. Both of these fighters were very underrated.
The life of a boxer..tragedy....but John Tate did become heavyweight champion! That cannot be taken away! RIP Champ!
I remeber watching the fight thinking why doesn't Tate just dance around the ring and avoid Weaver? Then suddenly boom! He went down like a tree! I yelled out Oh no!; WTH?
Great videos. Just subbed. Thanks for sharing!
Love the video. The writing, narration, editing. Great storytelling. A story in this case with a very sad ending. But definitely glad to know of this one time champion.
Thanks so much!
Thanks for the upload.
Excellent documentary.
Very professional.
Thoroughly enjoyed it
Thank you!
0:50 Tate vs James Emory Chapman 1975 Golden Gloves
3:12 Tate vs Jerry Thompkins
Unsettling that both fighters that night, Tate and Berbick, came to tragic ends within 2-3 decades.
Cleveland Denny was killed in the ring on another card that June fight.
What happened to Berbick ?
@@juniorjohnson5961 I believe he was killed by his nephew in Jamaica over a financial dispute.
@@juniorjohnson5961 he also sent time in and out of prison. Mostly for raping his daughters babysitter. Not a good person, really. He also never should have agreed to fight Ali. Tyson really went after him for that. Or, as Larry Holmes said about Berbick’s unceremonious end, “God doesn’t like ugly.”
@@PhilAndersonOutside lol
Well done video. Tragic story for sure.
Olympic Bronze Medalist and The Heavyweight Champion of the world! Nothing but respect for Mr Big John Tate.
Rest in peacefully in heavenly home you are still Champ 🙏😇🙏 God bless your souls 😭🇦🇨🇧🇪🇸🇧♥️🖤💛😭😭😭😭
That was one of the best biopics in a long time. I always wonder how the boxer that throws the career or life ending punch must feel.
I trained and lived at same gym as Big John we were good friends this is NOT that great of biopics several statements were not true. I was lucky to be training and knowing Big John I even sparred with him although Ace wouldn’t let him go full power on me because I was alway about 70lbs lighter. He was a great man with a giant heart who fell victim to drugs it NEVER CHANGED BIG JOHN’S HEART 🧡 R.I.P. Champion Big John Tate 🙏🏽❤️
@@carloscrawford2454 Hi Carlos, always happy to be corrected, by someone with greater knowledge. Thank you.
Absolutely fantastic documentary, Ive never heard of him yet your story of him will remain in my memory . Thank you.
Thank you.
Nowadays Tate's next fight after Weaver would have been a rematch. For the past five years the titles have been pretty much frozen by the same group of fighters going after each other.
every boxer has a fascinating story, great job with your videos. .
Thanks, Johnny.
As a life long Knoxville Tennessee resident boxing who grew up loving boxing,....my dad use to say to me when I'd get in fights in school,.."Nolia!!
we just need to take him over to Chilhowee Park and let Big John straighten him out."
Nolia was my mother's name and Chilhowee Park was where the Golden Gloves hum was in Knoxville. I grew up knowing about and respecting John. He was a household name for most of my childhood. It did however break my fathers heart during John's many appearances in TV he local newspapers and news.
My dad was proud to boast a Heavyweight champion from our own state and city. Such a sad ending. Anyway,.....another masterpiece. Well done sir. Well done.👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
That's a cool story, I didn't know about Chilhowee Park. Thanks for sharing.
Tate v Coetzee was not the first integrated boxing match in South Africa. The first such fight was Bob Foster v Pierre Fourie for the WBA light heavyweight championship in 1973
His Knoxville home is right across from a food city I went to growing up, he’s kinda like a legend in Knoxville that you’ll hear the older people talking about every once in a while.
What is often overlooked is that in terms of 1 punch knockout power in BOTH hands, Mike Weaver may have no equal in heavyweight history. Prior to his title fight against Larry Holmes, Weaver knocked out Bernardo Mercado with a left hook that left Mercado unconscious for 3 minutes. Weaver then hurt Holmes badly in the 4th round with a left hook and in the 10th round with a right hand of their war at Madison Square Garden. After knocking out Tate to win the WBA Title, he knocked out Gerrie Coetzee in the 13th round with a huge right hand. Weaver's problem was that he was a lazy fighter and lacked the consistent aggressiveness needed to maximize his punching power.
Shame about what happened to John Tate. Nice man.
@@blokin5039 ?
Poor Big John..this video made me sad..he was right about one thing..god never left him..I'm sure he was accepted at the gates of heaven.
Back here in Botswana there was a game kids played in the 80s called Big John Tate. It especially alludes to him being beaten to the deck. Didnt know Tate then but this video sort of put that into perspective. There were also paper bags with a pic of Tate on them from South Africa
It’s a shame Big John is mostly remembered only for getting knocked out by Mike Weaver
Talented fighter. Had boxing skills and power, but with an Achilles heel- his chin. In his Olympic loss to Stevenson, and his losses to Weaver and Berbick, when he got tagged, he went out. His body's reaction to getting hit with a big shot was extreme and scary. That problem guaranteed that his reign as champion, and his status as a serious contender, was going to be brief no matter what. It's a shame his life spiraled out of control the way it did.
Tate's chin and lack of endurance was going to catch up to him sooner or later. Fame can raise you, and bury you. I would like to know if anyone seriously tried to help Tate.
If he can go 15 with weaver hes got a chin
@@deadarmd Tate had the chin, but none of the stamina.
His Heavyweight Champion Chin they don’t give the titles away to Glass Jaw Joes he climbed up the latter to the title you only saw the Big fights he lost...He won more and it’s all he knew and made it there and back from where he started...from nothing.
I was at that fight when Weaver knocked him out. Tate seemed to be comfortably ahead before that nasty left hook caught him with under a minute left.
Tragically there is a long history of poor young men who become famous sports figures and amass great sums of money only to die destitute. The list of these people is long and heartbreaking. Dishonest handlers, drugs, and alcohol any of which can take a man like Tate and turn him into a substance-addicted beggar.
RIP Big John, you deserved better.
Adversity comes to all, not just champions. The real heroes are the people who never give up and keep going no matter what the troubles. Cancer - old age - heart attacks. Trouble will come, but we have to keep going doing the best we can for as long as possible. It's not that you got knocked down by life, it's that you got back up. The man working in the coal mine, the factory, the fields of farms, you never know who will be the next champion, even if no one else knows it.
I remember this fight. I watched it on tv that night. I was a weaver fan.
The names: Mike Weaver,Gerrie Coetzee,Trevor Berbick and John Tate,good fighters I saw growing,the heavyweight division was stacked in the 70s,80s,tragic story,John Tate!!
A sad tale, but unfortunately an all too common one. Good fighter in his prime but many fighters are mentally destroyed by a bad defeat.
I watched this fight on ABC until the 12th round. I went to bed. I picked weaver to win and there was no way he would get the decision since he had bAsically lost every round. I got to school the next day and when I heard Weaver won, I thought they were joking w me.
He never really caught a big break. Even though Sonny Liston achieved far more, their lives as young kids were similar. Maybe Tate didn't steal as much as Liston, but they both were illiterate and as poor as poor gets. I remember someone once told Liston that he got some sort of present from his father. "Liston replied "The only thing my father ever gave me was a beating".....
I lived and trained with Big John at our Boxing gyms. Great man with a heart of gold! R.i.P. Champion Big John! Not a very good account on some cases in this document, a lot of bullshit. I was there the whole time even at the fight he lost to Weaver.
There was really no disgrace in losing to Mike Weaver late in the 15th round/ Weaver was capable of knocking out anyone at anytime !!!###
Big John was my kind of guy, heart-breaking that he had low self esteem and then became a victim of the booming 80's drug epidemic. So what, you lose with 45 seconds remaining, big f%&king deal, everybody loses, some ironically, some poetically, some tragically and some fatally. If only he could have squared it with himself: that losing don't make the loser...the drugs did that to him. RIP Big John.
Awesome job as always Rich.
Well said big bro
A classic example of why you should never take drugs, life is hard enough to navigate with all your faculties intact, if you impair your judgement then your ability to control fame, fortune and then the eventual loss of success is going to be zero. A sad story, I feel so sorry for Tate, when you see what his life might have been, but I hope others can learn a lesson from this tragedy.
👏👏👏👏👏👏good job Rich!!
Very sad. He was working in pup wood, I usted to do the same work, he worked the ground, having to carrying the logs, same way I had to do. They would say it will either kill you or make you a man. It will do both if you are not careful. Big John turned to drugs, I was an alcoholic at the time, and I stayed one for years. If we could only see our future, so much we would change....a body can only take so much...
I'm fighting alcohol as we speak so far so good none 4 the new year
Some of the stories of young up and comers in boxing....what they went through as kids and made their own way....amazing will for life.
RIP John Tate!
Big John tate was a good boxer and a good friend he should have won that fight by mike weaver he had the chance to win the fight in the 15 round but he lost it at the very end I remember that fight on ABC wild world of sports
How was Berbick not disqualified for hitting him back in the head?
He should have been.
EXACTLY what i was thinking 🤔!!!!
Good question. At the very least he should have had points taken away, and the fight stopped because of the foul. Then, if Tate couldn’t continue, go to the judges scorecards. I believe that’s what the rules were then.
As a referee myself if an opponent turns his head which causes the back to be hit unless the ref feels the fighter throwing did it intentionally he is ok to let it go. Meaning you are throwing a legal shot and your opponent turns his head and gets hit, that’s the fighter turning his heads fault; it a;so looked like one or more blows came from the side From behind once again caused by Tate b3ing out of proper position
@@matthewfitzgerald95 Thanks for your input. Did you box before becoming a referee?
Great fighter ...RIP
Great documentary. Really well done.
Thanks, Phil.
@@RichtheFightHistorian, I agree this was very well done. However I would point out that the truck he died in was not his truck. It belonged to a guy that grew up in Oak Ridge and he and his girlfriend were riding in the passenger seat while Tate was driving. When the local news came on the TV and showed the truck I knew instantly who's truck it was and by the way not the truck in this video. I always felt bad for Mr. Tate after he died and wished he had never meet the guy who owned the truck as he was IMO a long time POS who from my understanding later died over drugs.
It's crazy when I was a young adult I use to sell Big John Crack in the hood. Not proud of it but it's true. He was a really good guy and we had a lot of good conversations.
Say my man at least your not gloating about some body's else's misery
He seemed like a good guy.. Did you ever meet Ace Miller?
@@ousamaabdu794 I did not no
Poor Duane Bobick . He always got his ass kicked after being hyped
Another stellar documentary!=)
Thanks, Jason.
One correction needs to be made, John Tate started boxing when he lived in West Memphis before he moved to Knoxville. Our coach in West Memphis, Mr House picked him up from working at the West Memphis lumber mill to go to practice in Memphis and he took up half of the back seat of the car. I saw him knockout an opponent. He made great improvements after he moved to Knoxville.
Yeah great improvement
Rest In Peace Champ!!!
A well put together piece on the big man 👌
We ask The Creator of the Heavens and Earth to lift this plague globally 🌏😎 👍🏾🇦🇺
God created drugs if he's responsible for creating everything.
@@samuraihardware7435 The Creator of the Heavens and Earth created everything, every thought, every emotion 🏝
Splitting an atom can be a force for good, or the most devistating force.
Our desires can be good and they can be used in a bad way.
Do we appreciate what we've been given and try to look after it, or complain and put ourselves in a state where drugs are needed.🤷🏽♂️
But I know for sure The Creator of the Heavens and Earth created this plague and your humble request could lift it👍🏾
#WeAskTheCreatorOfTheHeavensAnd EarthToLiftThisPlagueGlobally
We ask The Creator of the Heavens and Earth to lift this plague globally 🌏😎 👍🏾🇦🇺
RIP NO 1 CAN TAKE HIM AWAY FROM U.
I remember watching the Weaver - Tate fight, greatest heavyweight fight I've ever seen!
Great documentary, thanks for posting.
My pleasure, thanks for watching.
So I'll throw it out there- Weaver doesn't land that punch and Tate goes on to win a wide decision, and Ali signs to fight him instead of Holmes. How does that go?
Not much different. Tate fell to the wayside because of his decisions and choices in life and not because he lost to Weaver and Berbick. Plenty of fighters lost to Weaver and Berbick and they didn’t all end up lost in life like John Tate did.
Nice work.