🥳🫂👍🏿 After too many “that’s what my character would do” derailments, we arrive at “OK, your character goes and does that. Now I need you to make a character that wants to go on this adventure”
Yup. I just do a party split. Some DM's are afraid to do this but it can be really great for the narrative. It can be a lesson for problem players as well without seeming like targeted punishment. You just play the greater parties adventure and they just find themselves with nothing to do.
My Analysis Paralysis usually occurs in combat when I expect to know the right combination of skills, spells, and moves to hold up my end. If I make a mistake I feel like I'm letting everyone down.
Asking the group "I'm thinking of doing this. Can you help me make this work?" goes a long way, and everyone will likely be happy to help. The more you do stuff, the better you'll get and soon you'll be helping other players. Also, you can show gratitude to helpful players by backing what they are trying to do in the game as well.
Best thing you can do is 3 things: #1 Learn your abilities. Go read or watch videos on your class and character build. You will get a lot of helpful tips on how to optimize your combat experience. There's literally a video for every class or build or strategy out there. #2 Plan your moves ahead of time. There are no, "My turns". We should be paying attention to what our companions/monsters are doing because it will affect your turn. It matters if the Cleric is getting smacked around by flanking enemies....someone go grapple him and drag him out or heal him or kill the enemies on him. #3 It doesn't matter if you don't make the perfect move. Just do something useful. Hitting an enemy with a basic attack is never the wrong choice. And if you are planning ahead, it will make your decision even easier. You are allowed to make mistakes. And by doing that you learn why you shouldn't do what you just did. It will be intuitive and reflexive at that point. Good luck!
I hear that. It's a common feeling. There are some great pieces of advice for you in the comments. I hope you've taken them to heart! :) Ultimately, there are few "mistakes" that will last in D&D.
Great video. I cover all of these points you made in my session 0 (except passivity). Fun is subjective! Paying attention is not hard. If you don't want to put any effort into playing the game, you shouldn't be there. Don't intentionally dodge the material the DM prepared for you and force the DM to improv on a frequent basis. Don't split the party! This splits the game time. Adversarial players are frequently against the DM as well, treating them like they are ruining their game. I know it's a list of 5, but I have to add players that argue the rules to the list, as well as cheaters.
I got analysis paralysis during the LARP event last weekend. I intended to take a certain path that I knew would end up badly but I though was possible to take in the first place. Turned out that it wasn't really possible due to the rules of the event and I would just get stuck. I decided to talk to the archimage (one of the moderators) and figure out if he would narratively help my PC with her goal. Which I did, but by the time I finished, I was behind everyone else and couldn't really move forward with the plot. Kudos to moderators for offering me to become an NPC smuggler so I could do something till the end of the day. If I play another game in similar format, I'll probably do whichever quest will be physically closer to me and sort out the narrative consequences later
PVP in an RPG is an early warning system. Some folks act like unrelenting bastards whenever RPGs are played, and this may prove consistent with their behaviour in their lives. Remember that it is okay to get choosy with who is in your game group No one is perfect, but be immediately clear when PVP is not fun. You aren't a wuss, you are a team player in a social game. Thanks Tim! You are spot on, yet again!
I for one sat with my phone the entire session last night because it was a 5hr combat that was the continuation of a 3.5hr combat from last session. and every turn took around 40-45 minutes And next session it might be the end of the fight.. or end of the party.. one or the other
Meanwhile, my Monday party is full of DnD veterans who zip through 4 big battle encounters in a single 3 hour session... 😂😂😂 I love DnD. Some people don't love it as much as I or you do. And thats why they don't learn their abilities, or think about what they are going to do before their turn comes up. I have a 2nd Monday session and Friday session where we have a few players that just take so much time to do their damn turns and it breaks my brain. 😂 Those players: "ummm...aaaahhh, what can I do with my Bonus Action....and my Action.....let's me check my spellbook...." Me: "My gods, just hit something with your sword or cast a cantrip, you can't go wrong! Arrrrgh" Luckily, my Wednesday Character is so OP that I end a lot of the fluff of battle with Fireballs so the "fighter" doesn't take a million years deciding who to attack. 😮
Brutal!! Slogging player turns happened to my groups far more in D&D 3e (usually when summoners that had a lot of minions weren't paying attention). It was boring & painful. I have DM'd huge combats that took a few sessions, but these were the result of player actions calling out everything in the dungeon/battlefield all at once.
One bad quality that I have is that whenever my character is KOed or has died, I get upset. I do my best to keep upset feelings down and quiet but the negative feelings linger for a while.
It's understandable to get upset over, frankly. It's like getting put in time-out in a sports game. No one ever LIKES that. Just gotta keep telling yourself that it's not anyone out to get you, or doing it on purpose, except the monsters... Take it out on the monsters. :)
How I avoid Analysis Paralysis at my table is by having the players determine their Standard Operations and Close Quarters Combat actions for the first three rounds at CHARACTER CREATION. This way they know what they are going to do for the first two rounds at least before they need to change their tactics. This is how special operations teams work in the real world. They have developed tactics for various situations, practice those tactics until it's a perfect ballet of death. I don't demand that they do it, but having made the suggestion gets them thinking about it ahead of time. Great analogy about team sports. Only problem is that though I graduated high school in 1985, I don't recall the football, basketball or wrestling team having lots of gamers involved (my high school was an exception, there were a dozen of us gamers and most of us participated in scholastic sports), perhaps that's changed in the intervening decades. I'm a huge proponent of organized sports for children. It used to teach things like sportsmanship, teamwork, and persistence. There were actual winners and losers and what I quickly learned was that in the big picture POV, none of it really mattered. What mattered were the lessons learned and connections made. I still have regular contact with that original gaming group, now dubbed The May Weekenders, and my graduating class is planning it's 40th reunion next summer where I'm going to plan a LARP for entertainment and as a reconnect exercise. A brief comment on 'spotlight hogs' and what may be going on there. As someone with ASD and ADHD when the game starts to go nowhere, no one is stepping up to make decisions or role play, I can't help myself but interject to get the action moving. Most recently I was invited to play a one shot with pregen characters. I didn't know the other players and they had mostly selected their characters before I got to the game (online). Once I looked at the remaining characters I just went with my go to class, the Rogue. Though all the PCs had a reason for the adventure, my character had the most pressing and deeply personal reason, so I took the lead. As a new player I waited and prompted the other players to step up and take the lead, but in the end it was my PC that became "party leader" and was perhaps seen as hogging the spot light. Our 'tables' in the Dugan's basement were for spending time with each other. We all agreed that was the focus, not the particular game we played. And we played dozens and dozens of games/systems. There were no edition wars Good Fun/Bad Fun dichotomies. It's also possible to play an UNDERLING if you're a passive player. Lots of fun being the sidekick sometimes. I tried being an adversarial character once. It was a disaster. The game dissolved in three sessions.
@@edwardkopp1116 Some good ideas here. I also tell the players that I look at the characters and assume competency. They are the ones in the situation, and have more perfect knowledge of it - and the characters usually aren't stupid. Facilitate actions, plans, & ideas (without being overbearing).
The ones that don't read their abilities or think about what they are going to do before their turns...because they are on their phones...or jerking it....who knows.
You're far from egregious in these departments, Wes. We all dip into bad behavior at times. If you feel called out on a specific action, then address it, but this was definitely not created with you in mind. :)
It seems to be a sporadic problem among a handful of viewers. We've been troubleshooting, but it's a struggle. What are you listening on? (system type and speaker?)
@@DM-Timothy Be it headphones or portable speakers on my HP Laptop, it's always noticeably lower in volume than anything else on TH-cam I listen to (and it's mostly podcasts).
The biggest player problem to me is that most players are either boring and predictable, or the “wow look at me I’m so wacky and zany!”. Players that do stuff that furthers the narrative and adds to the story are few and far between. Most players either want to ruin it on purpose cause they think it’s soooo funny to tell a fart joke during a climactic scene, or they just want to killl stuff and get loot
It can be tough. I've been fortunate enough to find some pretty amazing players, but even then, their tolerance for gas jokes is significantly higher than my own. Sometimes I have to realize that just because they're making silly comments doesn't mean that they aren't taking the game seriously in their own way. Their way is just not always my way. Reminding myself of that usually helps me chill out about it and laugh along.
I play a Battle Sorcerer 🎩 🪄 (2Warlock 10 Divine Sorcerer) that is the "tank" of our group. It's one of the most complicated characters to run with with 8 attacks currently, 6 from Quicken Eldtrict Blast and 2 from my Erinyes flavored Summoned Celestial. Guess how long it takes me to finish my turn and add cool descriptions of my actions? Like 1 minute. Maybe 2 if Im popping off a Quickened upcasted Fireball at a group of 8 cultists, turning 7 of them into ash - i mean that is a lot of dex saves. 😅😂 I pay attention all the time to the battle map and study/plan out my moves so I do not CLOG up the turn order which isnt fun for anyone. Im considerate of my time and know that I will get more turns if we all learn our abilites, plan, pay attention, and be interested in the game you're playing. No one cares if you dont take the best action, thats what OP characters like mine are for - to pick up the slack. Just do something, have fun, and just try different stuff. Research your class/builds on TH-cam for free. Be considerate and dont be that guy/gal always saying, "ummmm.....aaaaah.....". 😊
🥳🫂👍🏿
After too many “that’s what my character would do” derailments, we arrive at “OK, your character goes and does that. Now I need you to make a character that wants to go on this adventure”
Yup. I just do a party split. Some DM's are afraid to do this but it can be really great for the narrative. It can be a lesson for problem players as well without seeming like targeted punishment. You just play the greater parties adventure and they just find themselves with nothing to do.
Solid answer. Eventually, the foot has to get put down, or you don't go anywhere.
My Analysis Paralysis usually occurs in combat when I expect to know the right combination of skills, spells, and moves to hold up my end. If I make a mistake I feel like I'm letting everyone down.
Everybody makes mistakes, nobody cares.
Asking the group "I'm thinking of doing this. Can you help me make this work?" goes a long way, and everyone will likely be happy to help. The more you do stuff, the better you'll get and soon you'll be helping other players. Also, you can show gratitude to helpful players by backing what they are trying to do in the game as well.
Best thing you can do is 3 things:
#1 Learn your abilities. Go read or watch videos on your class and character build. You will get a lot of helpful tips on how to optimize your combat experience. There's literally a video for every class or build or strategy out there.
#2 Plan your moves ahead of time. There are no, "My turns". We should be paying attention to what our companions/monsters are doing because it will affect your turn. It matters if the Cleric is getting smacked around by flanking enemies....someone go grapple him and drag him out or heal him or kill the enemies on him.
#3 It doesn't matter if you don't make the perfect move. Just do something useful. Hitting an enemy with a basic attack is never the wrong choice. And if you are planning ahead, it will make your decision even easier. You are allowed to make mistakes. And by doing that you learn why you shouldn't do what you just did. It will be intuitive and reflexive at that point.
Good luck!
I hear that. It's a common feeling. There are some great pieces of advice for you in the comments. I hope you've taken them to heart! :) Ultimately, there are few "mistakes" that will last in D&D.
Great video. I cover all of these points you made in my session 0 (except passivity).
Fun is subjective!
Paying attention is not hard. If you don't want to put any effort into playing the game, you shouldn't be there.
Don't intentionally dodge the material the DM prepared for you and force the DM to improv on a frequent basis.
Don't split the party! This splits the game time.
Adversarial players are frequently against the DM as well, treating them like they are ruining their game.
I know it's a list of 5, but I have to add players that argue the rules to the list, as well as cheaters.
Still solid points. I'll admit, I actually LIKE it when the group splits the party, but otherwise we're in agreement. :D
Great to watch again. I definitely needed reminders on things like providing context around the prompt "What do you do?"
I got analysis paralysis during the LARP event last weekend. I intended to take a certain path that I knew would end up badly but I though was possible to take in the first place. Turned out that it wasn't really possible due to the rules of the event and I would just get stuck. I decided to talk to the archimage (one of the moderators) and figure out if he would narratively help my PC with her goal. Which I did, but by the time I finished, I was behind everyone else and couldn't really move forward with the plot. Kudos to moderators for offering me to become an NPC smuggler so I could do something till the end of the day. If I play another game in similar format, I'll probably do whichever quest will be physically closer to me and sort out the narrative consequences later
Kudos to the moderators indeed! thanks for sharing your experience.
PVP in an RPG is an early warning system. Some folks act like unrelenting bastards whenever RPGs are played, and this may prove consistent with their behaviour in their lives. Remember that it is okay to get choosy with who is in your game group No one is perfect, but be immediately clear when PVP is not fun. You aren't a wuss, you are a team player in a social game. Thanks Tim! You are spot on, yet again!
Yep... Player agency be damned, as a GM there will be no PVP at my table.
Thanks so much. And an amen on your comments!
I for one sat with my phone the entire session last night because it was a 5hr combat that was the continuation of a 3.5hr combat from last session. and every turn took around 40-45 minutes And next session it might be the end of the fight.. or end of the party.. one or the other
Meanwhile, my Monday party is full of DnD veterans who zip through 4 big battle encounters in a single 3 hour session... 😂😂😂
I love DnD. Some people don't love it as much as I or you do. And thats why they don't learn their abilities, or think about what they are going to do before their turn comes up.
I have a 2nd Monday session and Friday session where we have a few players that just take so much time to do their damn turns and it breaks my brain. 😂
Those players: "ummm...aaaahhh, what can I do with my Bonus Action....and my Action.....let's me check my spellbook...."
Me: "My gods, just hit something with your sword or cast a cantrip, you can't go wrong! Arrrrgh"
Luckily, my Wednesday Character is so OP that I end a lot of the fluff of battle with Fireballs so the "fighter" doesn't take a million years deciding who to attack. 😮
Brutal!! Slogging player turns happened to my groups far more in D&D 3e (usually when summoners that had a lot of minions weren't paying attention). It was boring & painful. I have DM'd huge combats that took a few sessions, but these were the result of player actions calling out everything in the dungeon/battlefield all at once.
@@007ohboy now imagine if its the DM who is Um and Aaah-ing for each enemy :P
Sounds rough, I'm sorry. Getting players (and DMs) to take their turns faster is a super common challenge.
One bad quality that I have is that whenever my character is KOed or has died, I get upset. I do my best to keep upset feelings down and quiet but the negative feelings linger for a while.
It's understandable to get upset over, frankly. It's like getting put in time-out in a sports game. No one ever LIKES that. Just gotta keep telling yourself that it's not anyone out to get you, or doing it on purpose, except the monsters... Take it out on the monsters. :)
Good morning! Welcome back.
How I avoid Analysis Paralysis at my table is by having the players determine their Standard Operations and Close Quarters Combat actions for the first three rounds at CHARACTER CREATION. This way they know what they are going to do for the first two rounds at least before they need to change their tactics. This is how special operations teams work in the real world. They have developed tactics for various situations, practice those tactics until it's a perfect ballet of death. I don't demand that they do it, but having made the suggestion gets them thinking about it ahead of time.
Great analogy about team sports. Only problem is that though I graduated high school in 1985, I don't recall the football, basketball or wrestling team having lots of gamers involved (my high school was an exception, there were a dozen of us gamers and most of us participated in scholastic sports), perhaps that's changed in the intervening decades. I'm a huge proponent of organized sports for children. It used to teach things like sportsmanship, teamwork, and persistence. There were actual winners and losers and what I quickly learned was that in the big picture POV, none of it really mattered. What mattered were the lessons learned and connections made. I still have regular contact with that original gaming group, now dubbed The May Weekenders, and my graduating class is planning it's 40th reunion next summer where I'm going to plan a LARP for entertainment and as a reconnect exercise.
A brief comment on 'spotlight hogs' and what may be going on there. As someone with ASD and ADHD when the game starts to go nowhere, no one is stepping up to make decisions or role play, I can't help myself but interject to get the action moving. Most recently I was invited to play a one shot with pregen characters. I didn't know the other players and they had mostly selected their characters before I got to the game (online). Once I looked at the remaining characters I just went with my go to class, the Rogue. Though all the PCs had a reason for the adventure, my character had the most pressing and deeply personal reason, so I took the lead. As a new player I waited and prompted the other players to step up and take the lead, but in the end it was my PC that became "party leader" and was perhaps seen as hogging the spot light.
Our 'tables' in the Dugan's basement were for spending time with each other. We all agreed that was the focus, not the particular game we played. And we played dozens and dozens of games/systems. There were no edition wars Good Fun/Bad Fun dichotomies.
It's also possible to play an UNDERLING if you're a passive player. Lots of fun being the sidekick sometimes.
I tried being an adversarial character once. It was a disaster. The game dissolved in three sessions.
@@edwardkopp1116 Some good ideas here. I also tell the players that I look at the characters and assume competency. They are the ones in the situation, and have more perfect knowledge of it - and the characters usually aren't stupid. Facilitate actions, plans, & ideas (without being overbearing).
Good morning to you too! :) Catching back up has been a thing... lol. Not a successful thing, either.
I recognise all of these player types.
The ones that don't read their abilities or think about what they are going to do before their turns...because they are on their phones...or jerking it....who knows.
Yeah, they're out there. Honestly, a lot of it is a matter of degrees. A little isn't a big deal, but a lot can be tough.
4:50 right here. Best advice.
Thanks. D&D works out, almost no matter how crazy our choices. But it's easy to get caught in that worry of doing the wrong thing.
Thank you Timothy. As always poignant insight.
Thank you so much, you're too kind. :)
Great video!
Thanks so much! I'm glad you liked it. I kinda had something you said about the lack of this kind of advice in my brain when I put it together. :)
Oof. Called out on #1 big time!
EDIT: wait a minute. I feel targeted! These are ALL (but 4) directed at me. 😢
You're far from egregious in these departments, Wes. We all dip into bad behavior at times. If you feel called out on a specific action, then address it, but this was definitely not created with you in mind. :)
Could you up your gain, please? Your voice is very quiet in your videos.
Not a problem on this end. Perfectly clear and natural.
It seems to be a sporadic problem among a handful of viewers. We've been troubleshooting, but it's a struggle. What are you listening on? (system type and speaker?)
@@DM-Timothy Be it headphones or portable speakers on my HP Laptop, it's always noticeably lower in volume than anything else on TH-cam I listen to (and it's mostly podcasts).
@@r.downgrade5836 Thanks for replying and letting me know what you're using. We'll keep working on it. In the mean time, my apologies!
I think adding compression can help level the volume across disparate listening environments
Obvious tips
Good you name them
Thank you!
No worries, thanks for your response!
The biggest player problem to me is that most players are either boring and predictable, or the “wow look at me I’m so wacky and zany!”. Players that do stuff that furthers the narrative and adds to the story are few and far between. Most players either want to ruin it on purpose cause they think it’s soooo funny to tell a fart joke during a climactic scene, or they just want to killl stuff and get loot
It can be tough. I've been fortunate enough to find some pretty amazing players, but even then, their tolerance for gas jokes is significantly higher than my own. Sometimes I have to realize that just because they're making silly comments doesn't mean that they aren't taking the game seriously in their own way. Their way is just not always my way. Reminding myself of that usually helps me chill out about it and laugh along.
I play a Battle Sorcerer 🎩 🪄 (2Warlock 10 Divine Sorcerer) that is the "tank" of our group. It's one of the most complicated characters to run with with 8 attacks currently, 6 from Quicken Eldtrict Blast and 2 from my Erinyes flavored Summoned Celestial.
Guess how long it takes me to finish my turn and add cool descriptions of my actions? Like 1 minute. Maybe 2 if Im popping off a Quickened upcasted Fireball at a group of 8 cultists, turning 7 of them into ash - i mean that is a lot of dex saves. 😅😂
I pay attention all the time to the battle map and study/plan out my moves so I do not CLOG up the turn order which isnt fun for anyone. Im considerate of my time and know that I will get more turns if we all learn our abilites, plan, pay attention, and be interested in the game you're playing.
No one cares if you dont take the best action, thats what OP characters like mine are for - to pick up the slack. Just do something, have fun, and just try different stuff. Research your class/builds on TH-cam for free.
Be considerate and dont be that guy/gal always saying, "ummmm.....aaaaah.....". 😊