Hey Dan, I’m a part time luthier and an engineer. I really like the proof concept here! Plywood is not a deal breaker, Yamaha, Ibanez, and many other companies have made some fairly respectable guitars out of plywood over the years. Luan is essentially a variety of of mahogany, it has been used as a “tonewood “ for decades. The bracing is what’s killing your tone. The top should probably be thinner, but if you had carved or even sanded down the bracing a bit, it can really open up the sound. I’d like to see you do the top half and back half like you did, but screw them together so you can open it back up and shave down the top bracing a bit at a time
I wouldn't call myself a professional luthier, but I've made enough guitars and agree. As you said, I think the tone could be radically improved with a proper vertical bracing. Additionally, the top could be something like cedar - not too expensive and tonally good. I would note that the sound you're hearing is mostly coloured pickup noise. That is, the sound of the string. In that regard, it isn't much different from an electric. For a good natural sound the ribs could afford to be significantly thinner too. At some point, I wonder if it isn't cheaper to get some quarter sawn tin bits of wood and just build it that way. That thing must weight a tonne, and with laser cut ribs, back, front and bracing this thing would sound (and look) magnificent.
Dude this is crazy dan. I remember when you were reviewing chunti chinese pedals. Now youre freaking building your own guitars out of cnc machines!!! Your dedication to continual learning is really inspiring.
I think that main problem is over bracing. It would be interesting to see this all plywood version lightly braced. The sides don’t matter as much because they acoustically inert. If the plywood back has a radius it would do the job reflecting the sound. It would fun to see just those changes to give the plywood version a chance.
Hi Dan, you were talking about putting a Strat pickup near the bridge, however, seeing as how the acoustic sound is not that good and the 3-disc-piezos sound is carrying a higher frequency, why not go for a humbucker across the sound hole for some warmth to add to the piezo ensemble. Might even end up getting a 335ish sound out of it with greater access to the higher notes on the fretboard. I would totally use this live where the acoustic sound was not so important but the acoustic vibe was (and it's probably a super strong body for life on the road). Thanks for your creativity as ever!! Can't wait to see how this goes forward.
Man! This is awesome. Booth as a proof of concept and as a viable hybrid guitar. The fact that you could build this in a couple of days, with accessible materials, and with minimal power tools is impressive! Now I want a laser machine haha
ปีที่แล้ว +1
the layers make the cutaway amazing. Looking forward to the e.g. spruce top version
Its a neat proof of concept if anything else. I LOVE the look and the shape of it. I prefer small acoustics. They never sound as good as a full on dreadnaught or etc. but a small bodied acoustic is WAY more ergonomic and much more fun to sit on the couch with and strum some song ideas. I have an old 60s Kent acoustic thats only slightly bigger than a parlor sized guitar and its my favorite acoustic I own because of how comfortable it is. My dream acoustic would be one in the shape of an SG. Maybe someday someone will deliver
I love the sleek design and overall look of the guitar, especially the cutaway. I've made two solid wood acoustic guitars and the hardest part is bending the wood (especially the cutaway) but this gives me an idea.
Great! Videos explaining all the learning process of composing a hole guitar with god and bad done things through the way, are very very helpful for all level of viewers! Congrats and thank you very much dude!👍
This concept is very cool, Dan. I'm looking forward to watching the prototyping process play out over time and seeing where things land in the end. I've been building electrics for around a decade now, and have done some semi-hollow builds, but never a full on hollow body or acoustic. I've been toying around with building something kind of along the lines of the Fender Acoustasonic series guitars. Anyway, seeing this was good motivation to get on it already!
Great job Dan, I love how you've tried, and Alpha tested it, and you now know what you want for the Beta test. Through my Desk set up, which is 5.1, and very neutrally balanced, the Saddle and the discs together sounded awesome, Perhaps a parallel stack/DI with their own unique chain would work great for stage use.
I actually find this is a VERY useful guitar. The Piezo takes care of the brightness,- for the first time ever without sounding harsh and piercing. The transducers gives you all the low mids and body the sound needs. Blend them to taste with a little eq and a dash of comp. and you´ve got a fullbodied perfectly balanced acoustic guitar sound. Especially for recording in your home studio. The acoustic sound of the guitar is perfectly just right for a lo-fi Depression Era style low down dusty railroad tracks trash can fire blues band ala Skip James´s Hard Times Killing Floor Blues. Nothing wrong about it,- just find it´s perfect use.
I really like how honest you are about what was learnt, actually in every video you don't present yourself as a know-it-all expert. I tell you the sides made the way you did them is very very nice. Yes I agree you will get a better sounding one just making the top and bottom with wood and same thickness as a traditional acoustic, plus bracing also traditional way. Let us see that Prototype #2!!!
I do love the design, but another factor to improve its acoustic sound is to make it bigger overall. Thicker body and a more sizeable design will get a bigger and louder acoustic sound. Go for it!!
ปีที่แล้ว
Many lessons to learn and that's the beauty of it. You could try the concept with less reinforcements all around and see how well plywood (and the design) can resonate before you commit to better woods.
Garrison Guitars were crafted using innovations including the Griffiths Active Bracing System, a revolutionary method of guitar construction that took over six years to perfect. The single unit brace combined all the acoustic guitar's top braces into a single unit to allow for resonance to have an uninterrupted path of travel throughout the instrument and provided enhanced structural stability. From Wikipedia
I'm really hoping you do make another one. This is a supper cool looking guitar and if you could get it to sound decent it would be an awesome little guitar to tote around.
About the sides, I believe your line of though is wrong... I've seen some whitepaper in the past that shows that mass is the more important thing on the side for sustain and sound projection... So the fact that your sides are thicker than expected is working for a better sound than anything in the other direction.
Definitely a good starting point. With some tweets you will have something interesting. With a thinner top and back and better shaped bracing to allow for vibration you can probably get something good sounding as well as looking.
I really enjoyed the proof of concept, I've been wanting to try some kits, and guitar tools that you've made over the years. Just difficult with a military schedule haha. But awesome stuff!
I think the look of this acoustic guitar is killer. I like your idea of using a an electric guitar neck and agree that the bracing is too thick and is deadening the vibration. Drop humbucker in there and have fun with it. 👍👍👍
Good first try and important learning experience. As far as I know, there are two basic approaches regarding the back and sides. One is to design them to contribute to the sound production, and the other is to isolate the from sound production and use them to "reflect" the sound of the top. I had the opportunity to play a Fleta Classical Guitar which was very rigid/stiff and heavy for that type of guitar. It was the loudest and best sounding Classical guitar I ever played. These guitars, if you can find one, sell for about $50,000, and I worked in a guitar store that specialized in selling top of the line Classical, Flamenco, and Acoustic Guitars from all around the World. I don't think you need any tonewoods for the back and sides, and are better off making them stiff and reflective. For the top, a good tonewood is a necessity. Avoid the excessive arm carve, as a .5 - 1 inch radius should be comfortable. Looking forward to your next Acoustic CNC build. Moo
I’m glad you have the perspicacity to recognize that it doesn’t actually sound good. If you are interested in making a guitar that sounds good, I recommend to you the books ‘Contemporary Guitar Design and Build’ by Trevor Gore and Gerard Gilet.
Great concept Dan. The top needs to be thinner probably around 3mm or even 2.5 mm. The sound bars could have been shaped into a more triangular style, carved and sanded down. That would take more material away so less material for the strings to vibrate. Also the triangle shape keeps your sound bars strong. Also use solid woods so you're not wasting material. Unless you're using the cutouts for cnc projects down the road. If you choose to use plywood for the sides, you might want to look into a side bender. Either using the Foil heated blanket method with mold and clamps or you could make your own very cheap and hand bend the sides yourself. Cool project overall !
I'd like to throw in my 2 cents on this build. First of all, I agree with your comments on the bracing. Its a little too much. I think the bracing is preventing the wood from vibrating and killing the sound. Also the sides are definitely too thick. Things to consider changing are the width of the sides and size of the body. I think increasing both of these, along with the other changes, will thicken up the sound and make it sound better. Anyway, nice concept and looking forward to the next version and videos.
Thanks for the input, I was limited on size with the laser I was using, but I have a larger laser now and I agree, I’m going to make the next one a little bigger
I must say it is a nice looking acoustic. I also agree with your opinion of its sound. Trying is the on,y was in succeeding. Eventually you’ll figure it out. Again it looks cool. 👍🤘
I really like how it sounds acounstically and with the 3 transducer piezo, but I am a cigar box guitar guy as well. I bet it would sound glorious into a Pignose 7-100 with a slide at max volume. Gimme that crusty swamp sound.
The side thickness isn't really a problem. In fact, the more stable it is, the better the top and back resonance will be. Think of the top and back like a drum head. If the sides of a drum are too thin and unstable, you'll never get a good tight drum head. But yeah, you're spot on about the rest, top and back thickness, the bracing is way overkill, especially the back. Also, I would laser cut the bridge plate from a separate piece of rosewood and glue that to the top instead of integrating that into the braced piece you cut. that's definitely killing the sound. Interesting project though and cool to see the end result, even if it doesn't sound very good, lol.
Good concept and learning project. There's a reason the old masters worked for decades learning instrument design. Yes - plywood sides, thinner with glue and alignment points. Yes, reduce bracing, use different mounting, and tune. Yes, thinner top and bottom. Yes, electric guitar neck. No, disc piezo. Yes, bridge piezo. Maybe, electric guitar pickups. Or whatever you think is right. I'm just spit-balling.
My thoughts. No, it does not sound good but that is where the negative stops. The design is great. The cuts ways are unique to me and I really like the variance of the headstock and the tuner placement. If you don't plan to keep it I would suggest giving it to someone looking to learn guitar. The look and playability could inspire a new player that doesn't understand tone yet to keep playing with the joy of having a cool looking guitar. Good job. Keep on building, bro!
I think it sounds rustic. Sides should be thin too if you do it again. Also for the placement of the piezos, near the neck for treble and near the bridge for bassier.
It’s very light (lighter than an electric guitar, but a little heavier than most acoustics). It’s very balanced in my opinion, more balanced than a normal acoustic
I wonder if installing different pickup types onto wooden discs that would slot into the sound hole would make this a really versatile chambered(?) electric. Feel like it'd suit jazz. Plus swapping pickups would take a few minutes
I think it sounds fun I hear of the benefits of each technique for reproducing the sound my question is how are you mixing the 3 together or all the signals in phase or are you playing with the phase inversion have you tried electrically too Shift the Phase by 45ﾟ.
@@GunsandGuitars Well I didn't have my headphones on it just when you incurred the under the saddle and the piezo you know actually physically in the guitar , It sounded like you were getting some mid range suck out of that. I actually thought it sounded quite nice especially in the bridge pick up. It would not be very hard to add back some mid range with a small coil Acting as a Choke. I have a plug in frequency analyzer when I say plug in I mean it's actually a one design for cars but it was designed to equalize out the car so you could determine which frequency to reward so it actually has a microphone input as well as an audio input. I utilize it all the time because it's very nice as a standalone piece of equipment to give me a frequency response That I can see. I also created a simple streaming device that will stream the same way and the same hardness every time. It's nothing fancy it's just a pendulum with a rubber band and a stop for either side. Anyway my point is I think you have a very viable instrument right there in a course there's room for improvement like anything but you are a wonderful builder and I would love to have something like that personal. But if you're interested in finding out exactly more on how to makee that instrument sound better or closer to what you were looking for. Why not take some samples of acoustic guitars that you like and the same type of sample with that guitar and then you were able to manipulate the frequencies artificially. I did this with my electric guitar years ago it had a piezo saddle and a mahogany body, I never used the 2 pickups together so I used the acoustic side for Is my middle pick up combination. No preamp just straight to the output. We took my classic guitar and my seduct I played the same things on my electric and my acoustic. We used the graph function in my friend's computer printed everything off and digital copy as well I was able to take and make a transfer overlay for overhead projector and see exactly where the frequencies crossed more they didn't and then I used gyraters to create the appropriate notches and Boost. It was a little bit work and of course it wasn't perfect As I was effectively trying to get a solid guitar to sound more like an acoustic a classical. In the end it worked out quite well and made a very flexible preamp. If you ever have any ideas I would like to chat I extend myself to you. I buildt 2 but I'm more of an electronics and pick up Guy.
Oh myyyyy. That is uh. So do people still camp at Woods Canyon Lake or Christopher Creek? Used to love camping there as a kid and up in the white mountains. Yeah that was way too much bracing. Just glue some tone bars in parallel or in an x brace. An interesting POC would be hollowing out a block of wood to make the back and sides and then carving a spruce top on a CNC to fit that and build an arch top acoustic or hybrid. A laser cutter would probably start a fire doing that though.
Excellent build. Question.... would finding a way to measure the amount of adhesives used also make for a more predictable sound? Maybe make a glue station with gauge blocks to get a consistent glue pattern. Man great job going outside the box!!
Awesome guitar but some thoughts on the tone. Perhaps the body should be scaled up in size. The soundhole seems very close to the edges at the waist area. The soundboard would be too stiff when it is too close.
There are many factors that play apart to the "dead" sound of the acoustic. The thick walls like you mentioned is a big one. Material for acoustics is planed to between 2.5mm - 4.5 depending on the maker. Your bracing wasn't necessarily overkill. There just wasn't any shaping done to it. Braces a lot of times are carved like arches. And the shaping can shape(pun intended 😅) the sound in the end. And plywood is definitely not a tone wood. The layers and adhesive they use makes it's much denser than an average wood, in theory to make it would less material or thickness would be ideal and would help it sound better
WOW Dan, the more I see you developing your methods and inventiveness, I'm starting to think you might be the re-incarnation of Leo Fender. Keep up the great work bro. OH and BTW, did you try Phosphor Bronze strings? They can really bring out the low end in an acoustic. Maybe even making the body thicker for next time too. I love the 24 frets!!!
With either of the transducers it sounds pretty good on my computer. Just have a set of 2 pretty good computer speakers for my system. Played acoustically it is bit like a banjo sound not fully but more like the Banjo than just a guitar. I think one thing that made a difference is the bracing inside. Most acoustic guitars I have seen the bracing is tapered at the ends where it connects to the sides as well the are shaved from fat closest to the op and back and toward the inside of the guitar they narrow down and in some cases the have a kind of scalloped shape. With the braces being left the full width and height top to bottom and sided to side it muted a little too much of the sound. At least that's what I'm thinking.
Hi Dan I found this very interesting acoustic guitar tops need to be able to move freely-ish some builders lock the bracing into the top others wouldn't dream of it also the bridge plate has a significant affect as well as preventing damage from the strings it supports the top and helps the vibration so as you said your guitar is over built and too stiff but if you recorded a track with it panned to one side and a *good" acoustic on the other it would blend beautifully you guitar has many of the higher frequencies of a twelve sting I've done this in the past with my old Gibson one side and a cheap ply guitar ( my first guitar in Nashville tuning actually!) On the other it actually sounds really good . Be watching development from London England.👍😃👌
Great work Dan. I was considering a very similar design. As you may be aware the depth of the guitar adds to bass and yes wood/thickness. I did not see a eq-preamp which may be needed for bridge pickup. Not sure I would bother with 3 peizo. But an excellent start. Personally I would shoot for thin no hole acoustic guitar that is more electric feel with amplified acoustic sound. very hard to make both. just ask Ovation.
I am 100% not an acoustic type of player, like, at all. I'd play that though. The scalloped lower horn give me ESP Eclipse vibes. I dig it mate, good luck with the improvements!! :)
From a laser enthusiast with more than a decade of cnc programming/operating allow me to make a suggestion if you want to try this again with possibly better results. First and foremost let me save you a LOT of wood and suggest you make the sides out of a single piece of wood stood on its side with living hinge cuts instead of a lot of layers layer flat. You would want to start and stop at the top edge where that sharp corner is because it won't wrap around that sharply but should handle all of the other bends just fine. This would leave a lot of small slits in the side of the guitar but you can remedy this with a layer of thin wood vener on the inside and outside blocking the holes up.
😎 wow Dan looks great the bridge sounds good.. Im sure you guys will suss out the little gremlins to make it a great guitar... Glad I got to watch ,been a bit rough down here in New Zealand with the Cyclone damage.. ✌😎👍
@@GunsandGuitars thank you Brother, things are happening slowly for Families and Friends . A lot of work to do ,some people are still without power and housing ,but all the locals gather up and picth in.. Any how much Love n Respect to all watching, Loving your Journey with all you do on TH-cam. ✌😎👍..
I actually like the acoustic sound the most. Followed by the saddle pickup, the 3 discs are naff though. Great idea though, be interesting g to see vesion 2 in the future
Overall, I admire your concept for buiding it and the design choice. But you are spot on for the sound. it sounds like a cheap Rogue acoustic, which are not made from tone woods. But on the upside, it could be used in a small group at a campfire, or for self practice where it won't bother others in the living room. Great job on the arm carve and the cit away off the neck. Maybe a trip to the Gibson or Martin factory may give you some great ideas, not to mention something to scratch off your bucket list, perhaps. lol
Hey Dan, I’m a part time luthier and an engineer. I really like the proof concept here! Plywood is not a deal breaker, Yamaha, Ibanez, and many other companies have made some fairly respectable guitars out of plywood over the years. Luan is essentially a variety of of mahogany, it has been used as a “tonewood “ for decades. The bracing is what’s killing your tone. The top should probably be thinner, but if you had carved or even sanded down the bracing a bit, it can really open up the sound.
I’d like to see you do the top half and back half like you did, but screw them together so you can open it back up and shave down the top bracing a bit at a time
Agreed. Maximising strength and minimising mass is the name of the game. Triangulating the braces on the top could really get the sound better.
I wouldn't call myself a professional luthier, but I've made enough guitars and agree. As you said, I think the tone could be radically improved with a proper vertical bracing. Additionally, the top could be something like cedar - not too expensive and tonally good.
I would note that the sound you're hearing is mostly coloured pickup noise. That is, the sound of the string. In that regard, it isn't much different from an electric. For a good natural sound the ribs could afford to be significantly thinner too.
At some point, I wonder if it isn't cheaper to get some quarter sawn tin bits of wood and just build it that way. That thing must weight a tonne, and with laser cut ribs, back, front and bracing this thing would sound (and look) magnificent.
I'd like to see another one made with a proper top. I think it would sound ok.
Do you think that the guitar side thickness is also affecting the resonance?
Dude this is crazy dan. I remember when you were reviewing chunti chinese pedals. Now youre freaking building your own guitars out of cnc machines!!! Your dedication to continual learning is really inspiring.
I miss the filters.
you have such a dan-style of playing you're such a good luthier that it's easy to forget that you're a pretty good player
I'd like to see another attempt at this idea with only single layer bracing on the top and bottom.
Dude, this is so freaking awesome! Congratulations!
I think that main problem is over bracing. It would be interesting to see this all plywood version lightly braced. The sides don’t matter as much because they acoustically inert. If the plywood back has a radius it would do the job reflecting the sound. It would fun to see just those changes to give the plywood version a chance.
Hmmm…maybe I will give it another shot!
I love the 2+4 tuner layout.
Thanks for the feedback!
Awesome experiment! You’re up to something there. Next iteration will be even more interesting given everything you learned.
I hope so!
Hi Dan, you were talking about putting a Strat pickup near the bridge, however, seeing as how the acoustic sound is not that good and the 3-disc-piezos sound is carrying a higher frequency, why not go for a humbucker across the sound hole for some warmth to add to the piezo ensemble. Might even end up getting a 335ish sound out of it with greater access to the higher notes on the fretboard. I would totally use this live where the acoustic sound was not so important but the acoustic vibe was (and it's probably a super strong body for life on the road). Thanks for your creativity as ever!! Can't wait to see how this goes forward.
Fascinating project and experiment! We all learned a lot! Thanks for your efforts! Looking forward to seeing version 2! :)
Brilliant. You’re definitely on to something. Very eager to see the next iteration.
Awesome! Thank you!
Sounds pretty good already and I am sure the next one will do fine!! Love you brother!!
Love all your videos! Please keep them coming!
Man! This is awesome. Booth as a proof of concept and as a viable hybrid guitar. The fact that you could build this in a couple of days, with accessible materials, and with minimal power tools is impressive! Now I want a laser machine haha
the layers make the cutaway amazing. Looking forward to the e.g. spruce top version
I love the look and I think that you're on the right track. Can't wait to see the next iteration of this concept.
Its a neat proof of concept if anything else. I LOVE the look and the shape of it. I prefer small acoustics. They never sound as good as a full on dreadnaught or etc. but a small bodied acoustic is WAY more ergonomic and much more fun to sit on the couch with and strum some song ideas. I have an old 60s Kent acoustic thats only slightly bigger than a parlor sized guitar and its my favorite acoustic I own because of how comfortable it is. My dream acoustic would be one in the shape of an SG. Maybe someday someone will deliver
I love the sleek design and overall look of the guitar, especially the cutaway. I've made two solid wood acoustic guitars and the hardest part is bending the wood (especially the cutaway) but this gives me an idea.
Really amazing watching you develop from a tinkerer to a skilled luthier over the past few years! Keep it up, Dan!
Great! Videos explaining all the learning process of composing a hole guitar with god and bad done things through the way, are very very helpful for all level of viewers!
Congrats and thank you very much dude!👍
This concept is very cool, Dan. I'm looking forward to watching the prototyping process play out over time and seeing where things land in the end. I've been building electrics for around a decade now, and have done some semi-hollow builds, but never a full on hollow body or acoustic. I've been toying around with building something kind of along the lines of the Fender Acoustasonic series guitars. Anyway, seeing this was good motivation to get on it already!
Dude, the guitar looks awesome so nice work and great proof of concept. Just gotta work on that tone 🤣
Look forward to seeing the evolution
Love the look! Great concept 🤘
Way awesome concept! Super jealous!
Heck of a first effort. Thanks, Dan.
Great job Dan, I love how you've tried, and Alpha tested it, and you now know what you want for the Beta test.
Through my Desk set up, which is 5.1, and very neutrally balanced, the Saddle and the discs together sounded awesome, Perhaps a parallel stack/DI with their own unique chain would work great for stage use.
Keep on truckin' bro!
I actually find this is a VERY useful guitar.
The Piezo takes care of the brightness,- for the first time ever without sounding harsh and piercing.
The transducers gives you all the low mids and body the sound needs.
Blend them to taste with a little eq and a dash of comp. and you´ve got a fullbodied perfectly balanced acoustic guitar sound.
Especially for recording in your home studio.
The acoustic sound of the guitar is perfectly just right for a lo-fi Depression Era style low down dusty railroad tracks trash can fire blues band ala Skip James´s Hard Times Killing Floor Blues.
Nothing wrong about it,- just find it´s perfect use.
Sounds a bit like a resonator. Awesome build!!
Love the headstock
Thanks!
Awesome! 👊🏻 love it
You need to put a acoustic pre amp with a volume and tone like ovation guitars have . Looks good.
I really like how honest you are about what was learnt, actually in every video you don't present yourself as a know-it-all expert. I tell you the sides made the way you did them is very very nice.
Yes I agree you will get a better sounding one just making the top and bottom with wood and same thickness as a traditional acoustic, plus bracing also traditional way. Let us see that Prototype #2!!!
Cool it works that’s what’s important
I love it and think the bridge saddle pickup sounds great. Let’s see version 2.0
driftwood guitars have a great and very fun youtube channel with great content on how to build an acoustic guitar
I do love the design, but another factor to improve its acoustic sound is to make it bigger overall. Thicker body and a more sizeable design will get a bigger and louder acoustic sound. Go for it!!
Many lessons to learn and that's the beauty of it. You could try the concept with less reinforcements all around and see how well plywood (and the design) can resonate before you commit to better woods.
Good idea!
I mean it's a playable guitar with some usable sounds. Checks out with me. Looks rad too!!
Thanks Sean!
The plywood look is really cool. Maybe try a plywood out of birch or maple?
I actually thought about this. I think birch plywood for the sides would work well.
Very interested in seeing the next iteration. Hey, did you get the chance to look at Freecad that I sent the link to you earlier?
Garrison Guitars were crafted using innovations including the Griffiths Active Bracing System, a revolutionary method of guitar construction that took over six years to perfect. The single unit brace combined all the acoustic guitar's top braces into a single unit to allow for resonance to have an uninterrupted path of travel throughout the instrument and provided enhanced structural stability. From Wikipedia
I'm really hoping you do make another one. This is a supper cool looking guitar and if you could get it to sound decent it would be an awesome little guitar to tote around.
About the sides, I believe your line of though is wrong... I've seen some whitepaper in the past that shows that mass is the more important thing on the side for sustain and sound projection... So the fact that your sides are thicker than expected is working for a better sound than anything in the other direction.
Interesting. I need to research this more
Definitely a good starting point. With some tweets you will have something interesting. With a thinner top and back and better shaped bracing to allow for vibration you can probably get something good sounding as well as looking.
Thanks Peter!
I really enjoyed the proof of concept, I've been wanting to try some kits, and guitar tools that you've made over the years. Just difficult with a military schedule haha. But awesome stuff!
I think the look of this acoustic guitar is killer. I like your idea of using a an electric guitar neck and agree that the bracing is too thick and is deadening the vibration. Drop humbucker in there and have fun with it. 👍👍👍
Good first try and important learning experience. As far as I know, there are two basic approaches regarding the back and sides. One is to design them to contribute to the sound production, and the other is to isolate the from sound production and use them to "reflect" the sound of the top.
I had the opportunity to play a Fleta Classical Guitar which was very rigid/stiff and heavy for that type of guitar. It was the loudest and best sounding Classical guitar I ever played. These guitars, if you can find one, sell for about $50,000, and I worked in a guitar store that specialized in selling top of the line Classical, Flamenco, and Acoustic Guitars from all around the World.
I don't think you need any tonewoods for the back and sides, and are better off making them stiff and reflective. For the top, a good tonewood is a necessity. Avoid the excessive arm carve, as a .5 - 1 inch radius should be comfortable. Looking forward to your next Acoustic CNC build. Moo
I’m glad you have the perspicacity to recognize that it doesn’t actually sound good. If you are interested in making a guitar that sounds good, I recommend to you the books ‘Contemporary Guitar Design and Build’ by Trevor Gore and Gerard Gilet.
Love the concept and, I think it sounds decent. Yes, it could be far better but, it's not completely terrible.
I'd love to see a version 2.
This was awesome Dan. Keep on trying!
Great concept Dan. The top needs to be thinner probably around 3mm or even 2.5 mm. The sound bars could have been shaped into a more triangular style, carved and sanded down. That would take more material away so less material for the strings to vibrate. Also the triangle shape keeps your sound bars strong. Also use solid woods so you're not wasting material. Unless you're using the cutouts for cnc projects down the road. If you choose to use plywood for the sides, you might want to look into a side bender. Either using the Foil heated blanket method with mold and clamps or you could make your own very cheap and hand bend the sides yourself. Cool project overall !
The design of that guitar is amazing! I would totally buy one of those if the sound was fixed and if I could afford it.
I'd like to throw in my 2 cents on this build. First of all, I agree with your comments on the bracing. Its a little too much. I think the bracing is preventing the wood from vibrating and killing the sound. Also the sides are definitely too thick. Things to consider changing are the width of the sides and size of the body. I think increasing both of these, along with the other changes, will thicken up the sound and make it sound better. Anyway, nice concept and looking forward to the next version and videos.
Thanks for the input, I was limited on size with the laser I was using, but I have a larger laser now and I agree, I’m going to make the next one a little bigger
I must say it is a nice looking acoustic. I also agree with your opinion of its sound. Trying is the on,y was in succeeding. Eventually you’ll figure it out. Again it looks cool. 👍🤘
Seems pretty good and may sound really good in a mix with a band which would be a plug-in scenario.
V2 is going to be a huge improvement
Jesus that's gorgeous.
I really like how it sounds acounstically and with the 3 transducer piezo, but I am a cigar box guitar guy as well. I bet it would sound glorious into a Pignose 7-100 with a slide at max volume. Gimme that crusty swamp sound.
Great Video series The guitar is still cool.would like to see a hollow body guns N guitars electric guitar, and a refined tone wood acoustic guitar.
Is it bad that i kind of want it?
The side thickness isn't really a problem. In fact, the more stable it is, the better the top and back resonance will be. Think of the top and back like a drum head. If the sides of a drum are too thin and unstable, you'll never get a good tight drum head. But yeah, you're spot on about the rest, top and back thickness, the bracing is way overkill, especially the back. Also, I would laser cut the bridge plate from a separate piece of rosewood and glue that to the top instead of integrating that into the braced piece you cut. that's definitely killing the sound. Interesting project though and cool to see the end result, even if it doesn't sound very good, lol.
Good concept and learning project. There's a reason the old masters worked for decades learning instrument design. Yes - plywood sides, thinner with glue and alignment points. Yes, reduce bracing, use different mounting, and tune. Yes, thinner top and bottom. Yes, electric guitar neck. No, disc piezo. Yes, bridge piezo. Maybe, electric guitar pickups. Or whatever you think is right. I'm just spit-balling.
you should make an acoustic bass
Sounds better than the first guitar I ever had
I can't wait to have this beauty in a few weeks. Hurry up time. 😂🤣
My thoughts. No, it does not sound good but that is where the negative stops. The design is great. The cuts ways are unique to me and I really like the variance of the headstock and the tuner placement. If you don't plan to keep it I would suggest giving it to someone looking to learn guitar. The look and playability could inspire a new player that doesn't understand tone yet to keep playing with the joy of having a cool looking guitar. Good job. Keep on building, bro!
Thanks for the encouragement!
I think it sounds rustic. Sides should be thin too if you do it again. Also for the placement of the piezos, near the neck for treble and near the bridge for bassier.
Very cool sounds. I can see a use for each individual sound. I'm curious to know how much it weighs and how balanced it is?
It’s very light (lighter than an electric guitar, but a little heavier than most acoustics). It’s very balanced in my opinion, more balanced than a normal acoustic
Though of trying to use a metal soundboard and making a hybrid resonator?
I wonder if installing different pickup types onto wooden discs that would slot into the sound hole would make this a really versatile chambered(?) electric. Feel like it'd suit jazz. Plus swapping pickups would take a few minutes
I think it sounds fun I hear of the benefits of each technique for reproducing the sound my question is how are you mixing the 3 together or all the signals in phase or are you playing with the phase inversion have you tried electrically too Shift the Phase by 45ﾟ.
I didn’t do any phase shifting for this, to my ears it didn’t sound like I was getting too much phase cancellation, but it could have been there
@@GunsandGuitars Well I didn't have my headphones on it just when you incurred the under the saddle and the piezo you know actually physically in the guitar , It sounded like you were getting some mid range suck out of that.
I actually thought it sounded quite nice especially in the bridge pick up.
It would not be very hard to add back some mid range with a small coil Acting as a Choke.
I have a plug in frequency analyzer when I say plug in I mean it's actually a one design for cars but it was designed to equalize out the car so you could determine which frequency to reward so it actually has a microphone input as well as an audio input.
I utilize it all the time because it's very nice as a standalone piece of equipment to give me a frequency response That I can see.
I also created a simple streaming device that will stream the same way and the same hardness every time.
It's nothing fancy it's just a pendulum with a rubber band and a stop for either side.
Anyway my point is I think you have a very viable instrument right there in a course there's room for improvement like anything but you are a wonderful builder and I would love to have something like that personal.
But if you're interested in finding out exactly more on how to makee that instrument sound better or closer to what you were looking for.
Why not take some samples of acoustic guitars that you like and the same type of sample with that guitar and then you were able to manipulate the frequencies artificially.
I did this with my electric guitar years ago it had a piezo saddle and a mahogany body, I never used the 2 pickups together so I used the acoustic side for Is my middle pick up combination.
No preamp just straight to the output.
We took my classic guitar and my seduct I played the same things on my electric and my acoustic.
We used the graph function in my friend's computer printed everything off and digital copy as well I was able to take and make a transfer overlay for overhead projector and see exactly where the frequencies crossed more they didn't and then I used gyraters to create the appropriate notches and Boost.
It was a little bit work and of course it wasn't perfect As I was effectively trying to get a solid guitar to sound more like an acoustic a classical.
In the end it worked out quite well and made a very flexible preamp.
If you ever have any ideas I would like to chat I extend myself to you.
I buildt 2 but I'm more of an electronics and pick up Guy.
Oh myyyyy. That is uh. So do people still camp at Woods Canyon Lake or Christopher Creek? Used to love camping there as a kid and up in the white mountains. Yeah that was way too much bracing. Just glue some tone bars in parallel or in an x brace.
An interesting POC would be hollowing out a block of wood to make the back and sides and then carving a spruce top on a CNC to fit that and build an arch top acoustic or hybrid. A laser cutter would probably start a fire doing that though.
Haha I’ve seen people do exactly what you’re talking about!
Put a couple of electric pickups and make a hybrid Hollow Body.
Do a proper 25/27 multiscale next
Interesting. I bet that would sound really beefy!
still sounds better than the stella that I learned play on when I was a kid.
Been a while since I looked at an acoustic, but do they even need back bracing at all?
You also need to sand inside where the arm carve and cutaway are, the layers are making sound baffles probably
That’s a good point
Excellent build. Question.... would finding a way to measure the amount of adhesives used also make for a more predictable sound? Maybe make a glue station with gauge blocks to get a consistent glue pattern. Man great job going outside the box!!
Honestly, you could be correct, but I have no idea how to measure that
Awesome guitar but some thoughts on the tone. Perhaps the body should be scaled up in size. The soundhole seems very close to the edges at the waist area. The soundboard would be too stiff when it is too close.
Agreed, I was limited on size with the laser I was using. But I have a bigger laser now and plan to scale it up a bit
The bridge piezo doesn't sound bad
Really fun project!
It would be interesting if you try it with Nylon strings!
What song were you playing after the standard G C and D chords? .. Cool lookin' guitar at least
There are many factors that play apart to the "dead" sound of the acoustic. The thick walls like you mentioned is a big one. Material for acoustics is planed to between 2.5mm - 4.5 depending on the maker. Your bracing wasn't necessarily overkill. There just wasn't any shaping done to it. Braces a lot of times are carved like arches. And the shaping can shape(pun intended 😅) the sound in the end. And plywood is definitely not a tone wood. The layers and adhesive they use makes it's much denser than an average wood, in theory to make it would less material or thickness would be ideal and would help it sound better
I wonder what it would sound like if you cncd the top out of spruce and the sides and back out of east indian rosewood? Like a taylor
One of the pickup mixes really didn't work. How was it without the pickups?
WOW Dan, the more I see you developing your methods and inventiveness, I'm starting to think you might be the re-incarnation of Leo Fender. Keep up the great work bro. OH and BTW, did you try Phosphor Bronze strings? They can really bring out the low end in an acoustic. Maybe even making the body thicker for next time too. I love the 24 frets!!!
Wow, your comment about Leo fender is the best compliment I’ve ever gotten. Thanks for the encouragement!
With either of the transducers it sounds pretty good on my computer. Just have a set of 2 pretty good computer speakers for my system. Played acoustically it is bit like a banjo sound
not fully but more like the Banjo than just a guitar. I think one thing that made a difference is the bracing inside. Most acoustic guitars I have seen the bracing is tapered at the ends where it connects to the sides as well the are shaved from fat closest to the op and back and toward the inside of the guitar they narrow down and in some cases the have a kind of scalloped shape. With the braces being left the full width and height top to bottom and sided to side it muted a little too much of the sound. At least that's what I'm thinking.
Hi Dan I found this very interesting acoustic guitar tops need to be able to move freely-ish some builders lock the bracing into the top others wouldn't dream of it also the bridge plate has a significant affect as well as preventing damage from the strings it supports the top and helps the vibration so as you said your guitar is over built and too stiff but if you recorded a track with it panned to one side and a *good" acoustic on the other it would blend beautifully you guitar has many of the higher frequencies of a twelve sting I've done this in the past with my old Gibson one side and a cheap ply guitar ( my first guitar in Nashville tuning actually!) On the other it actually sounds really good . Be watching development from London England.👍😃👌
Looking forward to the refinements! I'm not sure I'd do anything different other than thin down your top and back and carve the braces.
Great work Dan. I was considering a very similar design. As you may be aware the depth of the guitar adds to bass and yes wood/thickness. I did not see a eq-preamp which may be needed for bridge pickup.
Not sure I would bother with 3 peizo. But an excellent start. Personally I would shoot for thin no hole acoustic guitar that is more electric feel with amplified acoustic sound. very hard to make both. just ask Ovation.
I am 100% not an acoustic type of player, like, at all. I'd play that though. The scalloped lower horn give me ESP Eclipse vibes. I dig it mate, good luck with the improvements!! :)
From a laser enthusiast with more than a decade of cnc programming/operating allow me to make a suggestion if you want to try this again with possibly better results. First and foremost let me save you a LOT of wood and suggest you make the sides out of a single piece of wood stood on its side with living hinge cuts instead of a lot of layers layer flat. You would want to start and stop at the top edge where that sharp corner is because it won't wrap around that sharply but should handle all of the other bends just fine. This would leave a lot of small slits in the side of the guitar but you can remedy this with a layer of thin wood vener on the inside and outside blocking the holes up.
An outstanding learning experience, now go forward with your findings and superior brain.
😎 wow Dan looks great the bridge sounds good..
Im sure you guys will suss out the little gremlins to make it a great guitar...
Glad I got to watch ,been a bit rough down here in New Zealand with the Cyclone damage..
✌😎👍
Stay safe out that man!
@@GunsandGuitars thank you Brother, things are happening slowly for Families and Friends .
A lot of work to do ,some people are still without power and housing ,but all the locals gather up and picth in..
Any how much Love n Respect to all watching,
Loving your Journey with all you do on TH-cam. ✌😎👍..
I actually like the acoustic sound the most. Followed by the saddle pickup, the 3 discs are naff though. Great idea though, be interesting g to see vesion 2 in the future
It could make a great baritone for as bright as it is.
With all that bracing... best acoustic guitar for bar fights!
You can make a cool 3D wall art with this
Overall, I admire your concept for buiding it and the design choice. But you are spot on for the sound. it sounds like a cheap Rogue acoustic, which are not made from tone woods. But on the upside, it could be used in a small group at a campfire, or for self practice where it won't bother others in the living room. Great job on the arm carve and the cit away off the neck. Maybe a trip to the Gibson or Martin factory may give you some great ideas, not to mention something to scratch off your bucket list, perhaps. lol