You made all the "mistakes" i made when switching to Dorico, but now i don't miss Sibelius one bit. Popovers are so handy, Shift + M= Meter Change (you can input Notes without Meter aswell), Shift + B= How many Bars do you want/remove?, Shift + K=Key Signature Sh.+L=Lyrics, Sh.+Q= Chord Symbols, Sh.+V= Add a new Voice (for polyphonic writing) ... Q= change between Chord and Single Note Entry .. pressing the Return Key lets you enter Notes, with the Left/Right Arrows you navigate in a Bar.. Shift + Arrows, you navigate from Bar to Bar .. and so on. With Alt + Arrows you can move Notes in a Bar, the increments you can decide with the little icon in the bottom left .. The Play Section lets you tweak Velocity etc. independently from the actual Score View..
@@RyanLeach Absolutely! Otherwise you end up comparing software you know inside out with software you don't know at all - you're bound to come to the conclusion that the software you already know how to use is easier to use, because you already know how to use it. Any sufficiently complex software will have a learning curve, and you won't be as fast with it when you first start as you are with something you already know. I made the switch from Sibelius to Dorico after using Sibelius professionally for decades (literally since you could only use it on an Archimedes!), and it took me about a year to become as fluent as I was in Sibelius. After about 18 months, I was doing things in Dorico in about 50-60% of the time they used to take in Sibelius - and also doing some things that were never possible in Sibelius too. The scores I produce now are better looking, easier and faster to create, and the whole process is easier. It takes a shift of mindset, but that shift is well worth making.
Hello Hans, can you tell me where can I found the "Renotate Performance" function in Dorico? If its exist at all. I record for instance a piano part for two hands but what I see after that is not really correct. Thank you in advance.
@@RyanLeachno, you did it perfect. I was hoping it literally was what you said the video would be, never seen it before and just open and try it. Loved it
This is the most incredible video! And I mean it… the goal is to be able to open up Dorico and see how easy and intuitive it is to plug and write… the most honest video and I genuinely enjoyed it.
@@RyanLeach I literally searched for a while to find a follow up video after 30 days!! Please please make a new video what its like after a year of working on it from moving from sibelius to Dorico...Thanks a mill!!
The thing I love about Dorico with note entry and editng is how easily you can move the notes within a measure and also adjust the note lengths. Select a note the use alt and the arrow keys to move it by the current grid amount. Use Shift-Alt and the arrow keys to alter the length. Admittedly I'm not so great at Dorico or Sibelius but I always found this simple task so maddening in Sibelius, having to re-input entire measures. It's great seeing how fluidly you use notation in Sibelius. You've inspired me to up my game in this area, whether in Dorico or Sibelius.
I probably wasn't very fluid at entering notes in Sibelius at first either, I just don't remember! Going from Digital Performer to Logic required a similar mindset shift that took some getting used to. The whole idea of regions in Logic was very odd at first. I think it's a bit like going from an instrument tuned in 4ths like guitar to one tuned in 5ths like mandolin. You feel like you should be able to make music but it just keeps coming out slightly off!
One of the great note input features is the ability to set a grid, adjust values by the grid via a key command and have the following music shift to accommodate the updated value. Using this, you can quickly type a bunch of music at the same duration then go back and quickly adjust notes to make the durations correct. When you get used to this, it's extremely fast; much faster than I was ever able to accomplish in Sibelius.
Thanks for the video. I have been using Dorico for a few years now, coming from Sibelius and Finale. When working with these complex programs I think it is a must to take a look at the manual before you start looking around and testing methods based on earlier workflow. Good luck🤗
Ha, yea if I didn't have the camera rolling I wouldn't be quite so haphazard. But a video of me watching the Dorico videos just didn't have the same ring to it 😉. Those were great though, that's where I point people to who want to know how to get started, and the manual is solid too.
8:23 Half step non-diatonic trill. «Sibelius failed me on that». Select the trill, then use Inspector and select 1 half step. Then select the appropriate accidental from Symbols.
Besides whatever you mentioned, Dorico's superpower is its output. The notation you get out of it is if such high standard and importantly, you don't require manual adjustment to do it.
I switched to Dorico last year. Still using Sib for legacy clients, change takes time, unfortunately. But the difference is astounding, I'm never going back.
I'm even considering switching from Logic to Cubase based on rumors that Cubase and Dorico will be integrated in the future, do you have a preferred DAW?
@@RyanLeach I'm on Reaper at the moment, but might consider the switch if that is true. Right now Reaper really does it for me, I've coded tons of custom scripts that make my life easier and it's a pretty tall order for Cubase. In fairness, though, I haven't researched extensively whether if it's possible to replicate those functions on Cubase or not
Hi Ryan - I've just seen this (3 yr old) video of yours. Thanks for your candid comments about your initial Dorico experience - I had very similar reactions to a demo trial also, and for the life of me I can see No sensible reason why I would ever change to Dorico. Musescore 4 , perhaps? However, I have found that Studio One 's linked score function (ie, within the DAW itself, not the separate notation program called "Notation"), does the vast majority of what I need for complex orchestral scores, directly from within the DAW environment. Of course its not as refined as Sibelius or Finale, but for 90% of things, its certainly good enough.
Thanks for the video. Because of the Steinberg sale, I'm just about to jump in myself. You have just answered a couple of questions I had on my mind. I also noticed that you have the wonderful Henry Mancini 'Sounds and Scores' in the background. 😀
I haven't used this yet. However, I think the note input separate from the engraving is good. That way, when making a mistake while engraving, it will not interfere with the notes. Non-linear editing always a good thing. I'm glad you did this video, because you know your stuff. If you like it, that carries noteworthy weight. (Yes, I had to use the pun:)
There’s key commands in Dorico 3.5 to move frame by frame - for Video - 15:45 much improved version. There’s a video button / menu in right side now too. what version did you use ?
Sibelius after all these years doesn’t notate accidentals on trills. It’s really stupid. Dorico does indicate trill interval which is nice. Most notation apps do actually so it’s absence on Sibelius is puzzling
I just checked. It works just fine for me. Add the note, add the trill (Line), add an accidental (Symbol). I thought I might have had to go to the Inspector to adjust the size of the trill, but it plays just fine. While you might think you could use a note accidental, it's worth remembering that a trill is treated as a Line, not a Note. That's why we need to put a Symbol. Also, remember that just about anyting in Sibelius can have some sort of playback.
Thanks for your thoughts, this was helpful. I used to use Finale many years ago but switched to a DAW because it was so much faster to create music for me-I agree with you, I remember fighting with Finale just to get a 5 minute orchestration ready. I'm checking out Dorico and so far I'm really impressed. I will probably still use a DAW as my primary composition tool, but Dorico definitely is nicer than Logic's clunky score editor. Unfortunately, Sibelius' subscription model and lack of a perpetual cross grade from Finale is a non-starter. BTW, any thoughts on Noteperformer? I downloaded the demo (running inside the Dorico Pro trial) and I have to say I'm on the fence. It definitely sounds better than the Halion orchestra patches, but I don't find it better than either VSL, Spitfire's BBCSO, or Berlin Orchestra (in kontakt). Sadly, Dorico doesn't seem to support Orchestral Tools' SINE player.
I LOVE Noteperformer! Programming synth patches might be my least favorite part of the whole process, and so to be able to have things sound so good so easily is great for me.
I'm having to leave Finale. Dorico was suggested. Notation is big for me. But so is the abiulity to create sounds for short animations (new for me). I'm now at the point of converting all my Finale files to .xml (20 years of files). It better work. thanks for letting me see the struggles. I want to know how it turns out for you.
I began testing Sibelius and it was terrible. I came from Notion. I think I try Dorico, because I used Cubase some time ( and Logic too). Finale and Sibelius have any issues with VST plugins.
I love how a lot of these videos make a conclusion on a complex piece of software after an hour... I can guarantee that you didn't learn Sibelius in an hour... Or logic. Or whatever your video software is. It took me probably 2-3 months to get properly fluid with Sibelius. With Dorico, less than a month, and most of that time was getting out of the Sibelius habits. What's more, any time you take to learn Dorico will be made up very quickly with the time you save over Sibelius when it comes to laying out your parts...
This is my main complaint. It seems to me everything requires so many more keystrokes and it also requires both hands on the keyboard sometimes. Hitting up/down and not being able to move the notes is obnoxious. Holding a key + up and down is so counterintuitive to me. In general it feels like Dorico is just too micro-managey for it's own good. Sibelius is good for starting off simple, especially if you work fast, and when you need the complicated features, they are under the hood a bit but they are there. This reminds me more of Finale..... and that sucks.
With a bit of practice it actually became second nature, I wonder if I'd get tripped up if I was trying to write in Sibelius now! Hitting up or down to move to a different staff is now just expected.
@@RyanLeach that would be cool. Some things in Dorico seem at odds with workflow if you come from Sibelius (I did too). But for composing, it seems much better generally speaking. My issues with it is more on the engraving side but they are quickly fixing a lot of those niggles too.
Thank you for this video. I actually found Sibelius so much more intuitive than Finale, but I’m stuck on Sibelius 7 since I refuse to subscribe. So we’ll see if you can convince me that Dorico is even better. 2:29
I guess my difference is that I primarily notate and seldom use audio functions. I don’t know why commenters think Sibelius is convoluted. I guess they never used Finale? I wanted to love Dorico but it’s not happening yet.
Hi Ryan, I am trying to use Dorico but when setting the key signature on my scores (from DAW), not all notes are affected by the key signature. In E major I can still see loads of Eb and Ab notes. Do you know how to solve the problem?
try selecting the notes you want to fix, go to the Write menu and choose respell, respell notes automatically. Hit OK and hopefully that does the trick.
If you're expecting setting a new key signature to transpose existing notes into your new key, you do that using the Edit > Transpose function, and tick the box that says "Transpose key signature as well?" (or something similar). Dorico seems to believe that your choice of key signature is a recognition of the key the notes are already in.
I’m a beginner and wanted to know is there anything that I can plug my guitar into my laptop and play it and the software will turn my tab into music notation?
I haven't found any videos of composing scores in Dorico then exporting audio stems (not MIDI) for final mix in DAW then export for delivery as final film cue track or film trailer track. Meanwhile there are a zillion videos showing DAW piano roll tetris for creating film cues. It makes me wonder if it is even possible to do at all.
Well the whole reason to put the tracks into the DAW is for better production, so it makes sense to me to output MIDI and then have more control in Logic. It's certainly possible, I just don't think people are doing it for final delivery of tracks.
Violin should not be below the piano, were you able to move the violin above the piano? Were you able to load any of your Sibelius instrument libraries into Dorico? Re: MuseScore - it would be great to load any instrument library or VST library, rather than buying/subscribing to different proprietary libraries for each notation platform (Finale, StaffPad, Sibelius, etc.)
a urgent question: i use Sibelius now, all big pieces are notated over there. When I switch to Dorico (suppose I don't continue subscribing it any more), how can I move all my previous pieces from Sibelius to Dorico? Many thanks.
That's a great question. As far as I know, there is no way to open a Sibelius file in Dorico. What you'll need to do is export it out of Sibelius as a MusicXLM file, and then open that file in Dorico. Good luck!
Great & interesting video ! It'd be nice to see you doing a similar video for GuitarPro...maybe a video comparing the "intuitiveness" of note entry methods in GuitarPro, Sibelius, MuseScore
Do you have to have Dorico? No. Is it smart to switch to Dorico from Sibelius? Maybe. For me, I decided that I do not like the direction of Sibelius since Avid took over. I'm not a fan of the subscription idea, for example (although I am a fan of the subscription route with Adobe software). Dorico seems like it has the most going for it moving forward. I think that's reason enough to make a permanent switch, or at least to start relying on Dorico more often than Sibelius. I am a Cubase user, but that doesn't come into play for me. I use my DAW and notation software independent from each other. Good video! I think you're going to like Dorico after using it longer.
These are some great points, especially about considering the company behind the product and how that effects support and the future. I'll make a quick video on this soon but my main thought is that if I was trying to decide on my first notation software 100% I would go with Dorico. I probably won't buy it right now, there's nothing Dorico can do to help me that I can't already do in Sibelius. But when it comes time to renew my bloody subscription for Sibelius, then it will probably be time to make the switch.
@@RyanLeach Yes, sir! And I would put some time into Dorico a couple months before that happens. Purchase it a couple months ahead. That way you can start projects in Dorico that won’t cost you time and money while you’re learning your new workflow lifestyle. Nothing is more maddening than learning on the job. Best to you!
You might come here looking for a comparison of these programs, but so far this vid just documents the struggles of someone switching from his 'old shoes' to a new pair he hasn't even begun to work in, yet. A predictable series of "I could just do it _X_ way in Sibelius, why can't I do it that way here??"
Of course Sibelius can playback half step trills...Just use the Inspector...also keyboard shortcuts make most functions in Sibelius such as inputting tempos and dynamics an absolute cinch.
Interesting! I see you just have to change it from diatonic to fixed. It makes sense, it seemed weird to me to not be able to do something relatively simple like that. But I still think "just use the inspector" is not exactly intuitive. I did a decent amount of Googling on this and none of the forum posts I found came close to this quick solution.
Fair enough, but when I said "I couldn't do it" that was true lol. It seems like to get it to actually show the flat (not just play it back) you still have to either create a custom symbol or create the flat in a different context and drag it over the trill which feels like a lot of friction.
@@RyanLeach Simply type ctrl 8 or 9 and you'll get the cue sized sharp or flat symbol. Not hard in the slightest! Or simply use the right click text menu for even more options. These are really basic operations to be honest. I really recommend the Sibelius manual as your first stop for these types of things, all of the most common operations are available as a keyboard shortcut or right click menu. And by the way video editing in Sibelius is perfectly fine. I haven't done it for about 10 years as I don't write films any more but when I did I was perfectly able to input hit points and marry up to them easily with large scale scores. Final rendering to the video was also easy too. The only issues I ran into back then was with some codecs not working but I imagine it's far better now. However, thanks for the video, I am interested in watching Dorico's development and would consider supporting them at some stage, seeing as many of them used to work for Sibelius! Just don't be too quick to write off Sibelius, it's a very sophisticated piece of software that can double as a DAW as well as engraving software.
@@RyanLeach No wonder you had troubles using Sibelius! The Inspector is where you get all the fine control, for just about everything. I have it open all the time.
I've also been using Sibelius since version 5 and know it's stupid and convoluted, but I've gotten used to how terrible it is and got fast and efficient at it despite all its flaws. But I just got a new Mac with the M1 chip and Avid have been dragging their feet to get Sibelius working natively but Dorico and Finale are ready to go and I'm still hesitant to learn a new workflow. But I see a lot of really good things from Dorico.
I'm in the same boat. Used Sibelius for years but after moving to Mac I'm not really wanting to deal with Avid anymore. Years ago I bought an edu crossgrade to Dorico, today I updated that to v5. Let's see how it'll go.
Hey Ryan, first off, love the channel! Lots of great stuff here. One thought on your Sibelius v. Dorico comparison: I feel that you were actually comparing "how intuitive is this program without consulting the manual (or a tutorial video) extensively." There's a big difference. In my case, I've been a Finale user since it came out, and even though Finale is notorious for its tough learning curve (better in recent years), nonetheless once you learn something, you know it (you hinted at this with your Sibelius experience a couple of times in the video). I think some other questions are helpful as well: can a given program do a certain thing AT ALL? 🙂 My experience with Finale has been that I can pretty much do anything; then, the question becomes "how readily can I find it?" So capability is really different from "readily apparent." Having said all that, kudos on a great video--you got my interest piqued. A good composer friend of mine has basically switched wholesale to Dorico because he's so impressed with what it can do. (He's a Logic guy just as you are and I am.) Sorry to go on, YMMV. Good job!
I always found it a bit odd that I would have to choose Metronome Mark in the text menu, type in something like "q = 100", and then still have to change to a music font afterwards so it didn't read "q = 100". Simple enough but how are people supposed to know they need to change the font? Why isn't Metronome Mark automatically in the music font?
I didn’t look through the comments to see if anyone mentioned this, but there’s also a huge incentive to move from Sibelius, to Dorico … it’s a four-letter word that often makes me want to scream another four-letter word. AVID … I’ve been using Sibelius, since 2005 (version 3, I think?) … mostly a good experience, until AVID converted to their subscription (ie rental) model. Now, like many, I pay EVERY year, JUST to have access to the thousands of arrangements and compositions I’ve done over the past 17 years … I’ve had enough of Sibelius crashing, the utility but otherwise uninspiring updates, and being an “AVID-hostage”… In 2009 (maybe 2010?), I ran into an old friend (from my band days), who at the time was an AVID sales rep. I asked him, friend to friend, for his thoughts. He didn’t openly criticize AVID, their sales model, nor Sibelius … but I KNEW he wanted to … He left soon after. I’m going to pull the string, with DORICO (at 50% off discount I anticipate for Black Friday 2022) … I’m ok with a new learning curve, and I look forward to NEVER dealing with AVID again …
🎹 Why is everyone using MUSESCORE for music notation? th-cam.com/video/05f6fzmOu7A/w-d-xo.html
Musescore us free!
its free
Its better.
You made all the "mistakes" i made when switching to Dorico, but now i don't miss Sibelius one bit.
Popovers are so handy, Shift + M= Meter Change (you can input Notes without Meter aswell), Shift + B= How many Bars do you want/remove?, Shift + K=Key Signature
Sh.+L=Lyrics, Sh.+Q= Chord Symbols, Sh.+V= Add a new Voice (for polyphonic writing) ... Q= change between Chord and Single Note Entry ..
pressing the Return Key lets you enter Notes, with the Left/Right Arrows you navigate in a Bar.. Shift + Arrows, you navigate from Bar to Bar .. and so on.
With Alt + Arrows you can move Notes in a Bar, the increments you can decide with the little icon in the bottom left ..
The Play Section lets you tweak Velocity etc. independently from the actual Score View..
Yea there are a lot of nice things, I'm sure the smarter approach would've been to start with some tutorials right at the beginning!
@@RyanLeach Absolutely! Otherwise you end up comparing software you know inside out with software you don't know at all - you're bound to come to the conclusion that the software you already know how to use is easier to use, because you already know how to use it. Any sufficiently complex software will have a learning curve, and you won't be as fast with it when you first start as you are with something you already know. I made the switch from Sibelius to Dorico after using Sibelius professionally for decades (literally since you could only use it on an Archimedes!), and it took me about a year to become as fluent as I was in Sibelius. After about 18 months, I was doing things in Dorico in about 50-60% of the time they used to take in Sibelius - and also doing some things that were never possible in Sibelius too. The scores I produce now are better looking, easier and faster to create, and the whole process is easier. It takes a shift of mindset, but that shift is well worth making.
Hello Hans, can you tell me where can I found the "Renotate Performance" function in Dorico? If its exist at all. I record for instance a piano part for two hands but what I see after that is not really correct. Thank you in advance.
@@RyanLeachno, you did it perfect. I was hoping it literally was what you said the video would be, never seen it before and just open and try it. Loved it
This is the most incredible video! And I mean it… the goal is to be able to open up Dorico and see how easy and intuitive it is to plug and write… the most honest video and I genuinely enjoyed it.
Thanks. What you don’t see in this video is that I decided to switch to Dorico and love it, never going back!
@@RyanLeach I literally searched for a while to find a follow up video after 30 days!! Please please make a new video what its like after a year of working on it from moving from sibelius to Dorico...Thanks a mill!!
The thing I love about Dorico with note entry and editng is how easily you can move the notes within a measure and also adjust the note lengths. Select a note the use alt and the arrow keys to move it by the current grid amount. Use Shift-Alt and the arrow keys to alter the length. Admittedly I'm not so great at Dorico or Sibelius but I always found this simple task so maddening in Sibelius, having to re-input entire measures.
It's great seeing how fluidly you use notation in Sibelius. You've inspired me to up my game in this area, whether in Dorico or Sibelius.
I probably wasn't very fluid at entering notes in Sibelius at first either, I just don't remember! Going from Digital Performer to Logic required a similar mindset shift that took some getting used to. The whole idea of regions in Logic was very odd at first.
I think it's a bit like going from an instrument tuned in 4ths like guitar to one tuned in 5ths like mandolin. You feel like you should be able to make music but it just keeps coming out slightly off!
Hi Ryan, how about making an new updated video about Dorico, about your usage of it and pointing out his advantages in your workflow? Thank you!
One of the great note input features is the ability to set a grid, adjust values by the grid via a key command and have the following music shift to accommodate the updated value. Using this, you can quickly type a bunch of music at the same duration then go back and quickly adjust notes to make the durations correct. When you get used to this, it's extremely fast; much faster than I was ever able to accomplish in Sibelius.
Yes! I'm finding more and more I'll just quick input pitches with quarters or eighths and then adjust the rhythm after
the inspector tool in Sibelius will save your life.
Finale is gone. RIP
Thanks!
Thanks for the video. I have been using Dorico for a few years now, coming from Sibelius and Finale. When working with these complex programs I think it is a must to take a look at the manual before you start looking around and testing methods based on earlier workflow. Good luck🤗
Ha, yea if I didn't have the camera rolling I wouldn't be quite so haphazard. But a video of me watching the Dorico videos just didn't have the same ring to it 😉. Those were great though, that's where I point people to who want to know how to get started, and the manual is solid too.
8:23 Half step non-diatonic trill. «Sibelius failed me on that». Select the trill, then use Inspector and select 1 half step. Then select the appropriate accidental from Symbols.
It's amazing how fast you're figuring it out intuitively. Most people will have a much harder time.
Besides whatever you mentioned, Dorico's superpower is its output. The notation you get out of it is if such high standard and importantly, you don't require manual adjustment to do it.
I’m 63 years old, finale took me forever with salsa songs. I don’t have enough years to relearn Dorico! I’m sticking to what I have…
I switched to Dorico last year. Still using Sib for legacy clients, change takes time, unfortunately. But the difference is astounding, I'm never going back.
I'm even considering switching from Logic to Cubase based on rumors that Cubase and Dorico will be integrated in the future, do you have a preferred DAW?
@@RyanLeach I'm on Reaper at the moment, but might consider the switch if that is true. Right now Reaper really does it for me, I've coded tons of custom scripts that make my life easier and it's a pretty tall order for Cubase. In fairness, though, I haven't researched extensively whether if it's possible to replicate those functions on Cubase or not
Hi Ryan - I've just seen this (3 yr old) video of yours. Thanks for your candid comments about your initial Dorico experience - I had very similar reactions to a demo trial also, and for the life of me I can see No sensible reason why I would ever change to Dorico. Musescore 4 , perhaps? However, I have found that Studio One 's linked score function (ie, within the DAW itself, not the separate notation program called "Notation"), does the vast majority of what I need for complex orchestral scores, directly from within the DAW environment. Of course its not as refined as Sibelius or Finale, but for 90% of things, its certainly good enough.
To follow up, I absolutely love Dorico now. It just took some getting used to!
Finale ENDING. Can you do an updated review of Dorico, please?
Really useful 👍
Thanks for the video. Because of the Steinberg sale, I'm just about to jump in myself. You have just answered a couple of questions I had on my mind. I also noticed that you have the wonderful Henry Mancini 'Sounds and Scores' in the background. 😀
I haven't used this yet. However, I think the note input separate from the engraving is good. That way, when making a mistake while engraving, it will not interfere with the notes. Non-linear editing always a good thing. I'm glad you did this video, because you know your stuff. If you like it, that carries noteworthy weight. (Yes, I had to use the pun:)
There’s key commands in Dorico 3.5 to move frame by frame - for Video - 15:45 much improved version. There’s a video button / menu in right side now too.
what version did you use ?
How are you getting on with it now? Still need any help showing you how the Dorico note input is much smarter than what you've used before?
Just finished a video game score in Dorico, yea it’s going quite well!
Nice review and info! Thanks
Sibelius after all these years doesn’t notate accidentals on trills. It’s really stupid. Dorico does indicate trill interval which is nice. Most notation apps do actually so it’s absence on Sibelius is puzzling
Yup that was one of those "one too many annoyances" for me, minor as it might seem
I just checked. It works just fine for me. Add the note, add the trill (Line), add an accidental (Symbol). I thought I might have had to go to the Inspector to adjust the size of the trill, but it plays just fine.
While you might think you could use a note accidental, it's worth remembering that a trill is treated as a Line, not a Note. That's why we need to put a Symbol. Also, remember that just about anyting in Sibelius can have some sort of playback.
You must be a god to be able to set it up and install this
Thanks for your thoughts, this was helpful. I used to use Finale many years ago but switched to a DAW because it was so much faster to create music for me-I agree with you, I remember fighting with Finale just to get a 5 minute orchestration ready.
I'm checking out Dorico and so far I'm really impressed. I will probably still use a DAW as my primary composition tool, but Dorico definitely is nicer than Logic's clunky score editor.
Unfortunately, Sibelius' subscription model and lack of a perpetual cross grade from Finale is a non-starter.
BTW, any thoughts on Noteperformer? I downloaded the demo (running inside the Dorico Pro trial) and I have to say I'm on the fence. It definitely sounds better than the Halion orchestra patches, but I don't find it better than either VSL, Spitfire's BBCSO, or Berlin Orchestra (in kontakt). Sadly, Dorico doesn't seem to support Orchestral Tools' SINE player.
I LOVE Noteperformer! Programming synth patches might be my least favorite part of the whole process, and so to be able to have things sound so good so easily is great for me.
I'm having to leave Finale. Dorico was suggested. Notation is big for me. But so is the abiulity to create sounds for short animations (new for me). I'm now at the point of converting all my Finale files to .xml (20 years of files). It better work. thanks for letting me see the struggles. I want to know how it turns out for you.
I began testing Sibelius and it was terrible. I came from Notion. I think I try Dorico, because I used Cubase some time ( and Logic too). Finale and Sibelius have any issues with VST plugins.
I love how a lot of these videos make a conclusion on a complex piece of software after an hour... I can guarantee that you didn't learn Sibelius in an hour... Or logic. Or whatever your video software is. It took me probably 2-3 months to get properly fluid with Sibelius. With Dorico, less than a month, and most of that time was getting out of the Sibelius habits. What's more, any time you take to learn Dorico will be made up very quickly with the time you save over Sibelius when it comes to laying out your parts...
This is my main complaint. It seems to me everything requires so many more keystrokes and it also requires both hands on the keyboard sometimes. Hitting up/down and not being able to move the notes is obnoxious. Holding a key + up and down is so counterintuitive to me. In general it feels like Dorico is just too micro-managey for it's own good. Sibelius is good for starting off simple, especially if you work fast, and when you need the complicated features, they are under the hood a bit but they are there. This reminds me more of Finale..... and that sucks.
With a bit of practice it actually became second nature, I wonder if I'd get tripped up if I was trying to write in Sibelius now! Hitting up or down to move to a different staff is now just expected.
You can have a ruler set up over the bar to more accurately add a note at a certain beat.
Yea a lot of things became easier after more use and figuring out how it all worked! Maybe I should do a follow up.
@@RyanLeach that would be cool. Some things in Dorico seem at odds with workflow if you come from Sibelius (I did too). But for composing, it seems much better generally speaking. My issues with it is more on the engraving side but they are quickly fixing a lot of those niggles too.
Thank you for this video. I actually found Sibelius so much more intuitive than Finale, but I’m stuck on Sibelius 7 since I refuse to subscribe. So we’ll see if you can convince me that Dorico is even better. 2:29
I guess my difference is that I primarily notate and seldom use audio functions. I don’t know why commenters think Sibelius is convoluted. I guess they never used Finale? I wanted to love Dorico but it’s not happening yet.
Will Dorico support Simplified Notation (i.e., 1. 2. 3 , etc) entered above the 5 line Staff?
Hi Ryan, I am trying to use Dorico but when setting the key signature on my scores (from DAW), not all notes are affected by the key signature. In E major I can still see loads of Eb and Ab notes. Do you know how to solve the problem?
try selecting the notes you want to fix, go to the Write menu and choose respell, respell notes automatically. Hit OK and hopefully that does the trick.
If you're expecting setting a new key signature to transpose existing notes into your new key, you do that using the Edit > Transpose function, and tick the box that says "Transpose key signature as well?" (or something similar). Dorico seems to believe that your choice of key signature is a recognition of the key the notes are already in.
This is how dinossaurs learned to walk! great video
what kontakt versoin? now Kontatk is only vst3 Dorico support?
this videos's coming up on two years old, so any software or plugins will be out of date
I’m a beginner and wanted to know is there anything that I can plug my guitar into my laptop and play it and the software will turn my tab into music notation?
6 months later, are you still using Dorico, Ryan? Is it working out for you?
Yes! I’ve used it quite a bit since making this video and am getting pretty fluent. Very happy to have made the switch
@@RyanLeach Thanks Ryan, it would be great to see a vid on how you achieved ‘fluency’ in Dorico.
Nice idea
@@DCPImages Yeah... please do!
@@RyanLeach You should!
I haven't found any videos of composing scores in Dorico then exporting audio stems (not MIDI) for final mix in DAW then export for delivery as final film cue track or film trailer track. Meanwhile there are a zillion videos showing DAW piano roll tetris for creating film cues. It makes me wonder if it is even possible to do at all.
Well the whole reason to put the tracks into the DAW is for better production, so it makes sense to me to output MIDI and then have more control in Logic. It's certainly possible, I just don't think people are doing it for final delivery of tracks.
Totally possible. Best thing for that is to use NotePerformer and export each instrument separately in one command.
Violin should not be below the piano, were you able to move the violin above the piano? Were you able to load any of your Sibelius instrument libraries into Dorico? Re: MuseScore - it would be great to load any instrument library or VST library, rather than buying/subscribing to different proprietary libraries for each notation platform (Finale, StaffPad, Sibelius, etc.)
a urgent question: i use Sibelius now, all big pieces are notated over there. When I switch to Dorico (suppose I don't continue subscribing it any more), how can I move all my previous pieces from Sibelius to Dorico? Many thanks.
That's a great question. As far as I know, there is no way to open a Sibelius file in Dorico. What you'll need to do is export it out of Sibelius as a MusicXLM file, and then open that file in Dorico. Good luck!
Great & interesting video ! It'd be nice to see you doing a similar video for GuitarPro...maybe a video comparing the "intuitiveness" of note entry methods in GuitarPro, Sibelius, MuseScore
What types of files can you import?
Musescore 4 just came out. Check it out.
Do you have to have Dorico? No. Is it smart to switch to Dorico from Sibelius? Maybe. For me, I decided that I do not like the direction of Sibelius since Avid took over. I'm not a fan of the subscription idea, for example (although I am a fan of the subscription route with Adobe software). Dorico seems like it has the most going for it moving forward. I think that's reason enough to make a permanent switch, or at least to start relying on Dorico more often than Sibelius. I am a Cubase user, but that doesn't come into play for me. I use my DAW and notation software independent from each other. Good video! I think you're going to like Dorico after using it longer.
These are some great points, especially about considering the company behind the product and how that effects support and the future.
I'll make a quick video on this soon but my main thought is that if I was trying to decide on my first notation software 100% I would go with Dorico. I probably won't buy it right now, there's nothing Dorico can do to help me that I can't already do in Sibelius. But when it comes time to renew my bloody subscription for Sibelius, then it will probably be time to make the switch.
@@RyanLeach Yes, sir! And I would put some time into Dorico a couple months before that happens. Purchase it a couple months ahead. That way you can start projects in Dorico that won’t cost you time and money while you’re learning your new workflow lifestyle. Nothing is more maddening than learning on the job. Best to you!
I tried to switch from MuseScore to Sibelius and I just found everything so difficult I gave up
You might come here looking for a comparison of these programs, but so far this vid just documents the struggles of someone switching from his 'old shoes' to a new pair he hasn't even begun to work in, yet. A predictable series of "I could just do it _X_ way in Sibelius, why can't I do it that way here??"
Does it recognize vst 2?
absolutely dorico!!
Really useful video Ryan. Definitely do the follow up video!
Thanks, I've been making a little bit of progress with it today so honestly I have no idea what my opinion will be after a few weeks!
I´ll keep waiting for the Logic User tries Cubase (and switches?! 😉😂)
Indeed, keep waiting!
@@RyanLeach 😂😂😂
Reading all these comments I'm so glad I'm not into anything big and can afford to switch 💀
Dorico really makes Sibelius look very clunky - Finale too
When I switched from Finale to Sibelius it was a revelation. Switching to Dorico has been a great experience but not quite as earth shattering 😄
@@RyanLeach I switched from Sibelius to Finale and found it a major step up, but Dorico leaves both behind in the dust.
Can Dorico get this Sibelius user to switch ? Never !
Great Video Ryan.
Most schools are forcing students to move to Dorico.
I use an old version of Sibelius and probably never will change.
I might need to make a more current follow up because I committed to the switch to Dorico and love it!
Of course Sibelius can playback half step trills...Just use the Inspector...also keyboard shortcuts make most functions in Sibelius such as inputting tempos and dynamics an absolute cinch.
Interesting! I see you just have to change it from diatonic to fixed. It makes sense, it seemed weird to me to not be able to do something relatively simple like that.
But I still think "just use the inspector" is not exactly intuitive. I did a decent amount of Googling on this and none of the forum posts I found came close to this quick solution.
@@RyanLeach Well the excellent Sibelius manual would have saved you much time as for most other things you are saying you 'can't' do in Sibelius.
Fair enough, but when I said "I couldn't do it" that was true lol. It seems like to get it to actually show the flat (not just play it back) you still have to either create a custom symbol or create the flat in a different context and drag it over the trill which feels like a lot of friction.
@@RyanLeach Simply type ctrl 8 or 9 and you'll get the cue sized sharp or flat symbol. Not hard in the slightest! Or simply use the right click text menu for even more options. These are really basic operations to be honest. I really recommend the Sibelius manual as your first stop for these types of things, all of the most common operations are available as a keyboard shortcut or right click menu.
And by the way video editing in Sibelius is perfectly fine. I haven't done it for about 10 years as I don't write films any more but when I did I was perfectly able to input hit points and marry up to them easily with large scale scores. Final rendering to the video was also easy too. The only issues I ran into back then was with some codecs not working but I imagine it's far better now. However, thanks for the video, I am interested in watching Dorico's development and would consider supporting them at some stage, seeing as many of them used to work for Sibelius! Just don't be too quick to write off Sibelius, it's a very sophisticated piece of software that can double as a DAW as well as engraving software.
@@RyanLeach No wonder you had troubles using Sibelius! The Inspector is where you get all the fine control, for just about everything. I have it open all the time.
Kinda bummed you didn't do a pickup measure, as that's how the Indiana Jones theme goes.
Yea I was just experimenting with inputting notes not trying to write the theme
I've also been using Sibelius since version 5 and know it's stupid and convoluted, but I've gotten used to how terrible it is and got fast and efficient at it despite all its flaws. But I just got a new Mac with the M1 chip and Avid have been dragging their feet to get Sibelius working natively but Dorico and Finale are ready to go and I'm still hesitant to learn a new workflow. But I see a lot of really good things from Dorico.
A little tricky at first but with some practice I got the hang of Dorico and am very happy with it!
Of course I purchase Dorico and now Sibelius, as of 5 days ago, are now natively running on the new Mac chips.
I'm in the same boat. Used Sibelius for years but after moving to Mac I'm not really wanting to deal with Avid anymore. Years ago I bought an edu crossgrade to Dorico, today I updated that to v5. Let's see how it'll go.
yes, I have switched.
Hey Ryan, first off, love the channel! Lots of great stuff here. One thought on your Sibelius v. Dorico comparison: I feel that you were actually comparing "how intuitive is this program without consulting the manual (or a tutorial video) extensively." There's a big difference. In my case, I've been a Finale user since it came out, and even though Finale is notorious for its tough learning curve (better in recent years), nonetheless once you learn something, you know it (you hinted at this with your Sibelius experience a couple of times in the video). I think some other questions are helpful as well: can a given program do a certain thing AT ALL? 🙂 My experience with Finale has been that I can pretty much do anything; then, the question becomes "how readily can I find it?" So capability is really different from "readily apparent." Having said all that, kudos on a great video--you got my interest piqued. A good composer friend of mine has basically switched wholesale to Dorico because he's so impressed with what it can do. (He's a Logic guy just as you are and I am.) Sorry to go on, YMMV. Good job!
Going in cold is not helpful. Watch some tutorial videos, my friend.
Changing tempo in Sibelius is simple...
I always found it a bit odd that I would have to choose Metronome Mark in the text menu, type in something like "q = 100", and then still have to change to a music font afterwards so it didn't read "q = 100". Simple enough but how are people supposed to know they need to change the font? Why isn't Metronome Mark automatically in the music font?
@@RyanLeach you can right click text>tempo ctrl+4 = whatever tempo you want but maybe this info came too little too late hahaha
@@jakewu8298 lol oh well, tempo wasn't really a major motivator anyway
Come on, in order to make a custom trill in Sibelius you select the trill line, open the inspector and select how many semitones do you want.
Yes because avid fired the sibelius development team and Spielberg hired them and they build dorico....
My God, he is criticizing Sibelius!!! How dare he
Of course you should The rest of us have done so
Sibelius the best
No! Sibelius much better. Maybe Dorico V7
no
“Who needs figured bass?” ‽! ??
Heretic.
I didn’t look through the comments to see if anyone mentioned this, but there’s also a huge incentive to move from Sibelius, to Dorico … it’s a four-letter word that often makes me want to scream another four-letter word.
AVID …
I’ve been using Sibelius, since 2005 (version 3, I think?) … mostly a good experience, until AVID converted to their subscription (ie rental) model. Now, like many, I pay EVERY year, JUST to have access to the thousands of arrangements and compositions I’ve done over the past 17 years … I’ve had enough of Sibelius crashing, the utility but otherwise uninspiring updates, and being an “AVID-hostage”…
In 2009 (maybe 2010?), I ran into an old friend (from my band days), who at the time was an AVID sales rep. I asked him, friend to friend, for his thoughts. He didn’t openly criticize AVID, their sales model, nor Sibelius … but I KNEW he wanted to … He left soon after.
I’m going to pull the string, with DORICO (at 50% off discount I anticipate for Black Friday 2022) … I’m ok with a new learning curve, and I look forward to NEVER dealing with AVID again …
I have no regrets! Actually I'm so glad I switched to Dorico that I'm attempting to learn Cubase now because it has the same parent company
should I buy dorico? the 50% off sale is going on!
@@luisjimenez4986 I’ve been using Dorico since I made this video a year ago and I love it!