There are physics limits to this concept and they multiply with size. Going from a circular path to a straight line instantly is a huge challenge and the G forces encountered are very destructive.
This narrator is MUCH better than the other one. Please keep this one narrating your videos and keep the other one in video B-roll development. Please!
Use the Boring Company to dig the proper length tunnel for a magnetic accelerator. The whole thing can be evacuated for launch except the exit, which is directed in the proper orientation for insertion. Bulkheads will have time to open and close to maintain the vacuum. (This will be a LONG tunnel). The problem I see, which also applies to Spinlaunch, is heating before it leaves the atmosphere.
This is one of your better videos. Not just old news available everywhere, not inflated with a lot of fluff, not presented in repetitive, overblown magniloquence by a mawkish, effusive narrator.
There seems to be a problem with the whole spinlaunch concept. They seem to have forgotten about the conservation of angular momentum. When the projectile is released it has angular momentum (measured about its centre of mass) imparted from the catapult. Moreover, this angular momentum is in the direction orthogonal to the main axis of the projectile. In short, the projectile will tumble end-over-end at an angular velocity roughly equal to the angular velocity of the catapult at the moment of release. Spinlaunch's idea is to ignite rockets during its ascent. How can they do this while it is rotating at such an incredible rate? To make matters worse, the projectile seems to have moments of inertia that mean it is stable while rotating along its axis of symmetry. This is not the direction of the imparted rotation, since the second and third largest moments of inertia are the same (or very close to being the same), the rotation will be unstable (rigid body rotation about the second largest moment of inertia is unstable. Spacecraft rotate about the principal axis corresponding to the largest moment of inertia so that energy losses do not send the axis of rotation towards the unstable axis). Maybe they have a mechanism to remove the angular momentum in some way (how???). Scaling the catapult up to reach the desired heights (and increasing its angular velocity) would only make matters worse.
Has anyone in these comments watched the slow motion video of the projectile exiting the centrifuge? How about the trajectory video? On exiting the centrifuge the projectile's trajectory shows a bit of wabble during the first few hundred yards as the fins cancel out the angular momentum and after that the trajectory is very stable.
I’m not an engineer but it seems the system would need to be perfectly balanced with the payload. Once the payload is launched it now becomes grossly Un balanced. This seems impossible.
Consider this: A similar concept of launching materials from the Moon but not in a circle but in a long (magnetically propelled) cylinders to ship things back to Earth. Also, remember how cell phone manufacturers had to bid on acquiring certain frequencies of a particular radio spectrum? What if the skies of Earth get so congested that nations will have to pay to fly at certain orbital heights? I think Rod Serling of "The Twilight Zone" might "conjecture" such things too, maybe?
Might be a great way to launch rocket fuel into space, and to counteract the rotational spin ... It's in a vacuum chamber have it counterspin so that it maintains the same orientation as it's rotating around on the circle so that when you release it it's not spinning at all.
this is a good concept with only one complication that I am aware of. The rocket would have ocsilating forces on it just like the piston in a car motor. In every revolution it would accelerate in one direction then reverse that acceleration by 180 degrees. As long as it could handle those forces it would be golden.
In German 'spinnen' means to be mad. If one has some knowledge of physics, in special mechanics and aerodynamics, he knows that the ideas of Spinlaunch company are really mad.
I don't care what people say if they can get something like this to launch people 100s of miles with a parachute to deploy at the end I really think it could become really popular with people trying to bypass their long travel time to work
Hi, physicist here. The reason this thing is terrible is due to what happens to the vehicle during the spin up process. Do the math on paper to figure out what the forces the payload feels during that whole spin up process haha. You'd have a garbled mess of a pancake being thrown out of a chamber, and also this object, with all it's liquids and untethered internal solids, sloshes around as soon as it is released from the centrifuge. Even though the payloads would be inorganic they still would not survive this ordeal haha
While spinning, one side is going faster than the other in their arc trajectories. Undue stress on one size compared to the other side? Works ok on a small scale, but what are the competing velocities when the increase to full size? When releases is one side moving faster than the other side and screwing up the resulting vector?
Yes, one side is moving faster than the other with respect to the center of the centrifuge. Not sure why the induced stresses would be "undue". They are physics. Scaling up would not in itself cause more stress. That would be determined by the radius of the centrifuge and the angular speed. A longer radius with the same angular speed would result in less force and stress. Longer radius and more angular speed would result in more force and stress (and thus more height for the rocket when released). The angular speed of the rocket about its own center of mass when released will be canceled out by the aerodynamic tail fins.
A quick google and I found this Aerospace pioneer and investor Dómhnal Slattery appointed to Chairman of the SpinLaunch Board of Directors Investor and Bolt General Partner Greg McAdoo joins the SpinLaunch Board of Directors As of 31 October so 6 days ago 5 days before you posted this video.
LEO velocity is 27,000 kph this only achieves 8,000 kph and that is straight up. The 27,000 kph is horizontal to the ground. How is the horizontal component introduced ?
@@RickDeNatale8000 is still way below. They still have a long way to go before I consider them viable. This was purely an answer to how do you convert vertical to horizontal.
Definitely on Earth it will be a failure, but possibly could be used in other applications, such as Moon bases or other planets/moons with lower gravitational and atmospheric hinderances. Either way it will only be viable for non-living cargo.
Thunderf00t busted spin launch. Though I think it would be more viable if they made a small rocket that fires at the optimal time to finish the job and put it into orbit.
For Earth, but I can see potential applications for a moon base, or planets and moons with much lower gravitational influences or lower atmospheric resistances.
USN has proven a better solution than this. On a small scale it’s 100% fully operational today. The USN calls the small scale version EMALS Electromagnetic Aircraft Launch System
aren't you trying to hypersonically blast through something like 10+metres of water over integrated atmospheric resistance before even get to orbit effectively?
It would be much easier to build a SpinLauncher on the Moon, since 1) lunar gravity is only 1/6 of Earth's, meaning a much lower velocity would suffice to "escape' the Moon; 2) there is essentially no atmosphere at the lunar surface, so all the additional measures taken to deal with air within the terrestrial SpinLauncher itself could simply be eliminated from a lunar version; AND 3) once launched, a payload would lose less of its initial velocity, owing to the absence of aerodynamic drag, further reducing the initial velocity the machine would have to impart to the payload. Actually, it it likely a 'SpinLauncher" would really come into its own precisely in places like the Moon, on large asteroids, even Mars.
Meh. Every night humanity witnesses the fiery deaths of countless meteors as they encounter Earth's thinner, upper atmoshere at orbital speeds. I also recall that when I was a small child I read a critique of the Space Cannon employed by Jules Verne in his classic, From Earth to the Moon, in which the scientific community had asserted how any capsule launched at the necessary orbital speeds would be shredded to bits by air friction before it could leave the gun barrel. It's an interesting video, but I haven't seen anything yet that would make me think this is a workable concept. 👎
This structure WILL NEVER OPERATE ECONOMICALLY!.. with every single "launch" the structure is damaged to such an extent that the repair and restoration costs far exceed the economic level. You should not waste money on this..👎
There are physics limits to this concept and they multiply with size. Going from a circular path to a straight line instantly is a huge challenge and the G forces encountered are very destructive.
Definitely not for humans, or G sensitive loads
This narrator is MUCH better than the other one. Please keep this one narrating your videos and keep the other one in video B-roll development. Please!
Use the Boring Company to dig the proper length tunnel for a magnetic accelerator. The whole thing can be evacuated for launch except the exit, which is directed in the proper orientation for insertion. Bulkheads will have time to open and close to maintain the vacuum. (This will be a LONG tunnel). The problem I see, which also applies to Spinlaunch, is heating before it leaves the atmosphere.
This is one of your better videos.
Not just old news available everywhere, not inflated with a lot of fluff, not presented in repetitive, overblown magniloquence by a mawkish, effusive narrator.
There seems to be a problem with the whole spinlaunch concept. They seem to have forgotten about the conservation of angular momentum. When the projectile is released it has angular momentum (measured about its centre of mass) imparted from the catapult. Moreover, this angular momentum is in the direction orthogonal to the main axis of the projectile. In short, the projectile will tumble end-over-end at an angular velocity roughly equal to the angular velocity of the catapult at the moment of release. Spinlaunch's idea is to ignite rockets during its ascent. How can they do this while it is rotating at such an incredible rate? To make matters worse, the projectile seems to have moments of inertia that mean it is stable while rotating along its axis of symmetry. This is not the direction of the imparted rotation, since the second and third largest moments of inertia are the same (or very close to being the same), the rotation will be unstable (rigid body rotation about the second largest moment of inertia is unstable. Spacecraft rotate about the principal axis corresponding to the largest moment of inertia so that energy losses do not send the axis of rotation towards the unstable axis). Maybe they have a mechanism to remove the angular momentum in some way (how???). Scaling the catapult up to reach the desired heights (and increasing its angular velocity) would only make matters worse.
PT Barnum once said there is a sucker born every minute, Spin launch is a company helping to relieve others of their money
The angular momentum cancelation mechanism that you are wondering about is called by the simple name of "tail fins".
@@appliedfacts They will only be effective if the tumbling is not too excessive to begin with. not rotating at the induced by the centrifuge.
Has anyone in these comments watched the slow motion video of the projectile exiting the centrifuge? How about the trajectory video? On exiting the centrifuge the projectile's trajectory shows a bit of wabble during the first few hundred yards as the fins cancel out the angular momentum and after that the trajectory is very stable.
@@appliedfactsIs the projectile moving at the supersonic speeds necessary to reach the upper atmosphere?
I’m not an engineer but it seems the system would need to be perfectly balanced with the payload. Once the payload is launched it now becomes grossly Un balanced. This seems impossible.
Failure no, joke...yes. scientific payloads in a centrifuge just doesn't work for me. Compete with SpaceX...🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
They should just make spin launch a munitions platform. The gravitational force created excludes most satellites,
Consider this: A similar concept of launching materials from the Moon but not in a circle but in a long (magnetically propelled) cylinders to ship things back to Earth.
Also, remember how cell phone manufacturers had to bid on acquiring certain frequencies of a particular radio spectrum?
What if the skies of Earth get so congested that nations will have to pay to fly at certain orbital heights?
I think Rod Serling of "The Twilight Zone" might "conjecture" such things too, maybe?
Might be a great way to launch rocket fuel into space, and to counteract the rotational spin ... It's in a vacuum chamber have it counterspin so that it maintains the same orientation as it's rotating around on the circle so that when you release it it's not spinning at all.
this is a good concept with only one complication that I am aware of. The rocket would have ocsilating forces on it just like the piston in a car motor. In every revolution it would accelerate in one direction then reverse that acceleration by 180 degrees. As long as it could handle those forces it would be golden.
In German 'spinnen' means to be mad. If one has some knowledge of physics, in special mechanics and aerodynamics, he knows that the ideas of Spinlaunch company are really mad.
I don't care what people say if they can get something like this to launch people 100s of miles with a parachute to deploy at the end I really think it could become really popular with people trying to bypass their long travel time to work
I was honestly only thinking yesterday "How long has it been sine anybody uttered the name Spinlaunch?"!
Spin launch is more successful than blue origin.
How much cargo and crew launched?
@RocketPal yeah I get your point.... but it has had no malfunctions since deployment.
Hi, physicist here. The reason this thing is terrible is due to what happens to the vehicle during the spin up process. Do the math on paper to figure out what the forces the payload feels during that whole spin up process haha. You'd have a garbled mess of a pancake being thrown out of a chamber, and also this object, with all it's liquids and untethered internal solids, sloshes around as soon as it is released from the centrifuge. Even though the payloads would be inorganic they still would not survive this ordeal haha
While spinning, one side is going faster than the other in their arc trajectories.
Undue stress on one size compared to the other side?
Works ok on a small scale, but what are the competing velocities when the increase to full size?
When releases is one side moving faster than the other side and screwing up the resulting vector?
Yes, one side is moving faster than the other with respect to the center of the centrifuge. Not sure why the induced stresses would be "undue". They are physics. Scaling up would not in itself cause more stress. That would be determined by the radius of the centrifuge and the angular speed. A longer radius with the same angular speed would result in less force and stress. Longer radius and more angular speed would result in more force and stress (and thus more height for the rocket when released).
The angular speed of the rocket about its own center of mass when released will be canceled out by the aerodynamic tail fins.
Better suited as Lunar launch system.
They should be a defense contractor. Hopefully they are already!
A quick google and I found this
Aerospace pioneer and investor Dómhnal Slattery appointed to Chairman of the SpinLaunch Board of Directors
Investor and Bolt General Partner Greg McAdoo joins the SpinLaunch Board of Directors
As of 31 October so 6 days ago 5 days before you posted this video.
Thank you for your comment! I will fix this!
They cannot get an instant release of payload, so there's a wee bit of sideways translation, which is enough to futz up the flight plan.
LEO velocity is 27,000 kph this only achieves 8,000 kph and that is straight up. The 27,000 kph is horizontal to the ground. How is the horizontal component introduced ?
45 degree launch angle instead of 90 to get horizontal velocity.
8000 x cos 45 is about 5660 k.p.h. horizontal velocity, even farther short of orbit.
@@RickDeNatale8000 is still way below. They still have a long way to go before I consider them viable.
This was purely an answer to how do you convert vertical to horizontal.
Thats why it also has 2 regular rocket stages.
This will never work
Agreed.
Definitely on Earth it will be a failure, but possibly could be used in other applications, such as Moon bases or other planets/moons with lower gravitational and atmospheric hinderances. Either way it will only be viable for non-living cargo.
Cant say for sure yet.
Will it ever reach orbit? Probably
Will it ever compete with SpaceX? No
Needs 5 miles/ second.
Exit velocity.
End of spin.
Please show an animation of a launch!
Thunderf00t busted spin launch. Though I think it would be more viable if they made a small rocket that fires at the optimal time to finish the job and put it into orbit.
That's exactly what they were planning to do, though? But maybe Thunderf00t doesn't know that; it wouldn't surprise me.
How many thousand G will the payload have to withstand in the full size centrifuge? This is just not practical.
For Earth, but I can see potential applications for a moon base, or planets and moons with much lower gravitational influences or lower atmospheric resistances.
USN has proven a better solution than this. On a small scale it’s 100% fully operational today. The USN calls the small scale version EMALS
Electromagnetic
Aircraft
Launch
System
aren't you trying to hypersonically blast through something like 10+metres of water over integrated atmospheric resistance before even get to orbit effectively?
Earth is probably the worst planet to try this on, but I think it would work really well on the moon or Mars.
Linear based accelerators would be much better their.
Yes. Less gravity and/or less atmosphere would both help this launch method.
Question, what if we build on of these things on the moon? Will it work on the moon?
It would be much easier to build a SpinLauncher on the Moon, since 1) lunar gravity is only 1/6 of Earth's, meaning a much lower velocity would suffice to "escape' the Moon; 2) there is essentially no atmosphere at the lunar surface, so all the additional measures taken to deal with air within the terrestrial SpinLauncher itself could simply be eliminated from a lunar version; AND 3) once launched, a payload would lose less of its initial velocity, owing to the absence of aerodynamic drag, further reducing the initial velocity the machine would have to impart to the payload.
Actually, it it likely a 'SpinLauncher" would really come into its own precisely in places like the Moon, on large asteroids, even Mars.
The launch concept is flawed, the Hawaii vacation was real.
I have been saying from the beginning that this will never work
Gonna blowup.
Maybe they can't afford the electricity bills?
Shot put at high school🎉...will it go to Mars?😮
Meh. Every night humanity witnesses the fiery deaths of countless meteors as they encounter Earth's thinner, upper atmoshere at orbital speeds. I also recall that when I was a small child I read a critique of the Space Cannon employed by Jules Verne in his classic, From Earth to the Moon, in which the scientific community had asserted how any capsule launched at the necessary orbital speeds would be shredded to bits by air friction before it could leave the gun barrel.
It's an interesting video, but I haven't seen anything yet that would make me think this is a workable concept. 👎
This structure WILL NEVER OPERATE ECONOMICALLY!.. with every single "launch" the structure is damaged to such an extent that the repair and restoration costs far exceed the economic level. You should not waste money on this..👎
Would work on the moon
Yeah! Interesting!
🤣 fine if your launching a bullet however, the centrifugal force would destroy any satellite payload ..
Spock to captain Kirk...."that is illogical" 😛
Just plain useless ..Like the Artemis missions .. yesh .😅
Not useless
So that Hawaiin vacation was useless?
It takes everybody not just one