Great video! Thanks for taking the time to isolate the parts and return the parts to stock after every test. I can imagine that takes a ton of time and effort
To be fair, it was standing on some soft foam tiles. On solid ground, no wobble. Other desks I've used will wobble for a second after something simple like typing on a keyboard 😂
I have to say at the minute these videos are the highlight of my TH-cam week. Your channel has come on loads since the start and I love it. You and Chad are nailing it 💪🤘 I replaced a 175mm AXS post with a OneUp 210, but ended up going back to the AXS because it's just better. Once you get used to the lack of effort to press the button there's no going back.
Oh dang you went back! Last High Low season I had a Reverb AXS, but sold it quickly. I plan to hold onto this one for a while to see how it does long term
Was nice running into you at the castle the other day - I asked about the Mavens and loam wolf. I’m super happy with the DB8 brakes on my electric trail bike. Code power with mineral oil reliability. I hope SRAM continues to release more mineral oil brakes in the future. I think there is room for a DB8 “ultimate” with more flash and adjustments.
That dropper is quick! I didn't think there would be one as quick as I had on my old specialized stumpy, it used air pressure so you could increase or decrease it to change the speed, nearly got neutered a few times with it.
Personally it would be the RaceFace Turbine. We called it the nutcracker. It even made a very audible "THUNK" every time it would extend and the entire bike would shake from the force it generated.
"The table doesn't wobble" as the tabling is wobbling. Haha. Great concept video with contact points. The axa post is a tempermental temptress. When it's good, it's the best. It needs a lot of TLC. It's easy to introduce air and I've had to send it back to SRAM a couple times. My Bike Yoke is way easier to reset or work on and is even faster going up.
So question would mine be considered a dowduro ? I purchased a polygon N7 turned the fork to 190mm/170mm rear, and went mullet TRP brakes and a whole lot of other upgraded goodies
Good to hear some back to back on the new aluminum bars vs. the carbon! A steeper black trail would probably make the Mavens shine too. Can you add tokens to the stock fork? A token, 2-5% more sag, and a 2-3 clicks slower rebound might do a lot.
Really liking this series! My biggest takeaway is the law of diminishing returns. Especially for a lower spec bike, upgrading is definitely a worthwhile investment of time and money. But a lot of people (personally guilty of this) get hung up looking at the best of the best parts and trying to completely optimize everything. For the average weekend warrior rider, the difference between mid level upgrades and ultra high-end upgrades is very minimal. Most people would benefit more from "rider upgrades" like how to corner better, line choice, etc than spending $2500 on top end suspension. I wonder if that's something you could work in somehow, attending a skills clinic or private coaching, change nothing on the bike and do a before and after run. Anyways, great work on the series!
I do that, too. But I work in a bikeshop, so I don't have any labour cost, nor do I pay retail prices. So, why it's still unnecessary, especially in this super flat part of Germany, I like nice things, so I put them on my bikes. The "dumbest" thing I did was putting Magura MT7 with 203mm discs on my commuter ebike. The reason: I like the way they look. I absolutely advise customers against such upgrades, though. If you have pretty much the most basic shimano disc brakes, and all you do is commuting and maybe shopping, I'm happy to sell you a Maven, sure. But I'm also gonna mention that it's absolutely overkill and unnecessary. Some customers want it anyway, because, like you and me, they like nice things.
Hey Evan, FYI for the future, the seatpost collar having a crack obviously isn't good, but shouldn't be a safety concern. With those posts, the air cartridge actually screws into the top and bottom of the bodies, so the collar shouldn't affect it. but good to replace it still and easy to do yourself.
13:35 the specialized command dropper is significantly faster since it doesn’t contain a damper to slow it down which is probably why everyone hated them
Hi Evan, the only comment I have on the braking test is that you should have done 2 or 3 runs back to back and averaged it out after "bedding them in", Now I will caveat this by saying I am fairly ignorant on "MTB knowledge" BUT...if its anything like disc brakes on cars and motorbikes the friction material on brake pads will sometimes get better once they have some heat in them, also doing multiple repeated runs helps the "bedding in process" where once you get some heat into the disc and pad it'll actually start whats called "pad transfer" and start laying friction material onto the disc itself, and THAT is what gives you your real braking performance, its not just "fitting performance brakes" that gives you better performance they need bedded in through a specific process. Maybe you did this and just decided to not edit it in, just wanted to say incase yu didnt know. Btw Great video.
I like how you keep your video going at the same time as paying the bills. What is that sander/grinder tool for the bars and fork you use? I take it you and the family are safe after that storm...
That tool can be found at hardware/plumbing stores. It’s to remove the sharp burrs on the inside and outside of the handlebars. Alternatively you can use sandpaper.
A suspension upgrade comparison would be very interesting. So maybe start with two used Yaris and test stock vs SKF dust wipers and budget vs premium aftermarket damping cartridges.
I 100% agree that bars and stem are a CORE part of the setup on a bike, the slightest tweak on thoose are hard to ignore, went from 2 inches of rise to 3.5, and 5 milimeters shorter on the stem. It made an extremely notizable difference.
I appreciate the brake comparison, but it would have been even better if you had previously done a stock run just to establish a baseline. I get the one set of brakes was better than the other, but how do they compare to stock?
That squeaking when you were doing the brake stopping test is a result of oil or grease on the pads and rotors. Take a propane torch to the pads and the rotors and you will see the oil burn off. They will bite so much better after that.
@@EvansMTBSaga Maybe they do, but that's not a "squeak a little" sound. That noise is oil or grease. Those brakes were barely biting if at all. The fact that you never even skidded when trying to stop proves that there was something wrong. Even though I think Sram brakes are trash, they should still at a minimum, skid.
Hi what’s the name of the tool you used to sand down the alloy bars? Says rigid on side but can’t find it on google. Also is that just a standard pipe cutter you used on bars. Thanks.
Great vid, what do you think is the most important upgrade for a mid travel trail bike, i have a giant trance 2 2017 i got for only $700 I want to upgrade it but I have to stay kn a budget, any suggestions?
Wheels would be a killer upgrade. I'm assuming it's a non boost front and rear end, so if you check Pinkbike, I bet you could find some insane deals on wheels
I have Fox Rythm forks on my carbon Stumpy, and run lowish tyre pressures...would I REALLY be able to feel any difference (Extra vibration damping wise) to the factory aluminium bars it came with if replaced with the OneUp Carbon bars? - I've been thinking of upgrading to those very bars for a while, but I just cant help thinking that with 140mm of travel, plus the give in the tyres, a slight flex in the bars would make no difference at all.
I think so. I always swap to OneUp carbon bars on all my builds and its a big difference with small bump compliance and also has a snappy feel in turns that I really like
@@EvansMTBSaga Thank you so much for your reply! I really do appreciate it! and thank you for making such awesome content too! ...I think its time I treat myself to an upgrade 😊❤
My full power ebike came with DB8 brakes. I thought they stopped and felt good. My main complaint was that the pistons didn't retract well enough and rubbed the rotors... And I can't stand a noisy bike. I swapped them with pair of second hand Shimano MT520, just to feel them and buy higher end Shimanos if I liked them. They will stay in the bike until they break apart. I would say they bite with the same force as DB8, but with WAY less force applied. I don't feel arm pump anymore.
While the SRAM DB8's certainly aren't the most powerful brakes out there, or the most adjustable, I don't think SRAM expected a set of entry level brakes to be incredibly consistent and reliable. I've been using mine for a whole year, and I've even crashed on the levers themselves, but they still work the same since day one. Same modulation, same bite point, same lever feel. They're completely leak-free too. Most surprisingly, if you accidentally pull them too hard, you will lock up and OTB. They don't drag when they're warmed up. After seeing Evan's stock TRP DHR Evo video, I'm now thinking about upgrading the consumables in my DB8 instead. The braking distance stock for stock between the DB8 and DHR Evo is practically the same. I do like the linear braking application of the DHR Evo, but its price and inclusions don't really make me want to switch. I don't want to be buying separate metallic brake pads and scarce 2.3mm rotors as soon as my set arrives, especially not a $550-600 brake set. At least I can make the case for the $200 DB8. Add some MTX Gold pads and HS2 rotors, and I'm gucci. The stock SwissStop Disc 29 RS organic pads (from Canyon) are already quite powerful for general trail riding, but they do run out of steam quickly in high-speed, extended straight descents. If all it takes to make DB8's excellent is some metallic pads (like the Shimano Deore M6120), then I'm willing to take my time and experiment on that. It's always worth it to find good deals when the result is genuine performance improvement.
I appreciate the well thought out comment! Like I said in the TRP video, DB8 with metallic pads and 200mm rotors are amazing cost to performance. Glad to hear yours have been rock solid. The user manual says they only need a full bleed every 2 years
Yeah I am due for new grips any suggestions for the Marin San Quentin 2 2022, kept the original brakes, and am usually not a sram person with the DB8 I would love to try them out. This is an excellent video of explaining the difference between Maven vs DB8.
Personally I would have gone with the Wolftooth dropper lever, which can be had for less if you know where to look and it's made in Minnesota. Plus, it looks bling.
Haha right after I typed that, I searched the Wolftooth lever and realized that I own a gold lever from them. After using that for years, I prefer the rubber pad on the dropper remote compared to the gnurled medal that Wolftooth uses. Just a small preference, still a great option
OK bro. I'm feeling the... uh... inspiration from Donut's Hi-Lo series. But I approve. It's some of the best stuff they ever did as a channel. This is a great video in its own right and answers an important question for us mountain bikers.
Hi I need a new shock for my bike on my bike the dimensions are a bit specific, it's 210 x 50mm trunnion I have a question, do you know any damper with these dimensions?
What’s up Evan I can’t believe Bentonville is so tore up because of the tornado. I hit a tree with my head and fell off a cliff into a river yesterday. Lol
Haha yeah trails are closed all over. I smacked my head on a tree the other day. Luckily didn't feel a thing cuz of my helmet haha. Hope you're good after falling off the cliff! Sounds gnarly
@@mihaichiriac480 XT's have nothing on Mavens... I have both and yeah XT are ok, especially compared to el cheapo stuff that comes on these bikes, but nowhere near Maven performance.
@@mihaichiriac480 they're way overkill for my usual rides as well haha if you're coming from XT's then the lever feel will take some getting use to but any SRAM brakes will, much firmer feel than Shimano.
I have DB8's on my Fezarri Delano Peak and I've like them so far. I think the brake test clearly shows the mavens are better but I wonder what the difference is riding on the trails between the two. My guess is the performance of the maven on a trail doesn't justify the extra $$ amount.
Minimize arm pump by not death gripping the bars. Thicker grips encourage me to squeeze harder than I need to. ODI Troy Lee Designs are thinner and sticky. Carbon bars are worth the $ imo. I have Renthal FatBar Lite carbon on both on my trail bikes. They were $150 apiece for 780mm. That dropper looks like it could do some damage to that nuts with that speed. It reminds me of my 2013 Specialized Command Post. That thing would donkey kick you in the balls every time you were not paying attention. Great vid and demos.
Someone else commented that thick grips cause arm pump. They didn't elaborate so I was confused. Thanks for explaining that. My go-to grips are Ergons, but I liked the OneUp colors for the sake of these builds. maybe I'll try thinner grips for the finale 😁
@@EvansMTBSaga There is no science behind my experience, just something I noticed by trying different grips over the years. I also have the carbon bars, so a thicker grips aren't needed for chatter and small bump compliance. Great vids and keep em coming.
tried those new sram brakes. Those new levers are fatiguing on the arms...they look good coz they are low profile but it seems it has compromised leverage, making u apply more force than norma specially if u are used to shimano levers...
reviewers say its the dead stroke thats the problem. When the pads contact the rotor the mavens take less force than any other brake for the same power but they're the stiffest brakes until the pads contact the rotor wich is a huge problem.
I got 2 sets of mavens and the power is incredible but im having a pumping up lever issue it seems pretty common on the forums, if you pull your levers fast a few times in a row does the bite point go farther out?
Yes it does. I didn't mention it in the video because I felt like it was my fault from a poor bleed. I actually bled them twice before I filmed the video but the problem persists. What forum? Did anyone find a solution?
@EvansMTBSaga I have tried everything I have bleed them every which way I could think off after the factory way wasn't helping. I tried taking the pads out and using 2 rotors to cycle the pistons and push them back in to "massage" them and they got a little better but still not right it seems like the pistons can't retract fast enough. I have ridden one set for a few hundred miles and it is alot better then the set I have limited miles on but still bad. It's hard to control speed on steep stuff when you never know where the bite point will be! So frustrating because they are awesome other than that and I'm 240 pounds so I really want them to work. I forgot to add 3 set when to my local shop I bought 2 and did self install and the 3rd set was bought and installed from the shop the head mechanic tried everything aswell and even rebuilt the calipers and after that he ended up sanding a set of pistons down and they still were sticky per him. If you google sram maven pump up you can find a few posts on mtb sites. I have been asking everyone that has installed a set and so far everyone has this issue I'm about to try a warranty claim with sram and see what happens
Dang man. I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one. I'm gonna Google that and see what my options are. I bought them cuz they were red and the kit came with so many goodies. If I can't get them working right, I'll just sell them and go to my Codes haha
@EvansMTBSaga I totally agree I live the look and such a deal with everything in the kit and they are crazy powerful just the bite point thing is impossible to get used to I think sram will figure it out soon tho they have too
Thanks for asking about this. After much thought, I decided to scrap the drivetrain episode because I couldn't figure out a compelling way to test it. So next week I'm combining the drivetrain and wheelset upgrade videos and shortening the series from 6 episodes to 5 episodes. There's always an option to upgrade frames after the finale though
I’ve used low end and high end components and I choose high end everytime. Yes it costs more, but they are just more durable and performs like Day 1 much better than the cheap stuff. The cheap stuff get worse over time fast!
Interesting that you spent a quarter of the cost of the high bike and yet the high bike only shed .8lbs while the low bike shed 2.2lbs. Not that weight should really be a concern in the overall picture but that is pretty surprising. I suppose that could be chalked up to durability of the parts maybe?
I'm still not sure why the High Bike is consistently heavier. I make sure to zero out the scale every time. I think the Reverb AXS and Maven brakes were heavier than Low Bike's parts
It’s insane how department stores still pumping out 3x and 2x drivetrains. More moving parts, more things to service, more things to go wrong, more weight. Once I switched to 1x, I’m never going back to anything else. It’s simple and minimalistic.
Yeah, 1x is truly the best. 2x and 3x it's cheapest for them to make, so they just keep making it even though it's bad. And they use the extra money they make from making cheap 3x or 2x drivetrains to putting the worlds crappiest rear shock and other useless features.
I was in my LBS saturday and they said the maven had so much stopping force, ppl where going to smaller rotors and organic pads to lessen their strength. Absolutely insane.
So what I find REALLY intresting is literally how mm’s of height and length can go a mile, for example my BMX, I tried one that was 2-3 mm taller than mine, wow, that made a diffrence, same goes for someone running the same mtb as mine, just taller stem, makes a mile of diffrence in feel
Great video! Production is top-notch. But Evan please, can you add weight in kilos under lbs? That would be very helpful as I wouldn't need to google it every time. Thank you very much! 😁
I wanted to make the test kinda close. Both Sram 4 piston & mineral oil, but I think your idea would have been better. But then it's up to the cost. I wanted to keep the brake cost at $150 for Low Bike
Isnt low bike lighter coz in the first episode you changed the tyres to a tubeless pair which saved over 2lbs and youre keeping them the same through the whole testing??
I like the series but I don't understand this comparison. You're picking a DOT downhill brake vs. a mineral trail/am brake. Why would you not compare parts that are at least in the same category?
@@EvansMTBSaga 100% my mistake, they do both use mineral oil. I just don't understand the comparison off brakes for 2 different purposes as opposed to the same purpose
Great video! Thanks for taking the time to isolate the parts and return the parts to stock after every test. I can imagine that takes a ton of time and effort
Without filming the bike being returned to stock, it only takes like 15 minutes per bike haha. Man filming bike work takes forever 😭😅
Great edit and those animations are insane. Happy to have helped contribute to the production of this one! Cheers to you! 🍻
Thanks for helping film!
Production is seriously insane, appreciate all the hard work you put into these Evan!!
It won't wobble! *Proceeds to wobble the desk violently*
To be fair, it was standing on some soft foam tiles. On solid ground, no wobble. Other desks I've used will wobble for a second after something simple like typing on a keyboard 😂
@@EvansMTBSagayou should probably have the desk on solid ground next time lol. Might make the desk more appealing
I have to say at the minute these videos are the highlight of my TH-cam week. Your channel has come on loads since the start and I love it. You and Chad are nailing it 💪🤘
I replaced a 175mm AXS post with a OneUp 210, but ended up going back to the AXS because it's just better. Once you get used to the lack of effort to press the button there's no going back.
Oh dang you went back! Last High Low season I had a Reverb AXS, but sold it quickly. I plan to hold onto this one for a while to see how it does long term
I'm glad youre loving the series and thanks for the compliment. Keeps me driven for the next episode!
Was nice running into you at the castle the other day - I asked about the Mavens and loam wolf.
I’m super happy with the DB8 brakes on my electric trail bike. Code power with mineral oil reliability.
I hope SRAM continues to release more mineral oil brakes in the future. I think there is room for a DB8 “ultimate” with more flash and adjustments.
That dropper is quick! I didn't think there would be one as quick as I had on my old specialized stumpy, it used air pressure so you could increase or decrease it to change the speed, nearly got neutered a few times with it.
Haha someone commented the same time as you about a Specialized dropper being insanely fast
Personally it would be the RaceFace Turbine. We called it the nutcracker. It even made a very audible "THUNK" every time it would extend and the entire bike would shake from the force it generated.
"The table doesn't wobble" as the tabling is wobbling. Haha. Great concept video with contact points. The axa post is a tempermental temptress. When it's good, it's the best. It needs a lot of TLC. It's easy to introduce air and I've had to send it back to SRAM a couple times. My Bike Yoke is way easier to reset or work on and is even faster going up.
I've been wanting to try a Bike Yoke for years! I may hold onto the Reverb AXS this time and actually see how it does long term
OMG, laughed my ass off ar "ejecto seato cuz" 😂😂
Same 🤣🤣🤣
When you get the chance you should build a downduro bike that is an enduro bike with downhill suspension
AKA “parkduro”
It’s funny how nothing is standardized for bikes down to language.
Nah, DownCross. It's not what you think, a DH fork on an XC bike. It's a DH fork on a cyclocross bike
i got one and it is grrrreat.. singlespeed Torque with a Boxxer.. indeed a parkduro as Willy mentions
So question would mine be considered a dowduro ?
I purchased a polygon N7 turned the fork to 190mm/170mm rear, and went mullet TRP brakes and a whole lot of other upgraded goodies
Good to hear some back to back on the new aluminum bars vs. the carbon!
A steeper black trail would probably make the Mavens shine too.
Can you add tokens to the stock fork? A token, 2-5% more sag, and a 2-3 clicks slower rebound might do a lot.
Really liking this series! My biggest takeaway is the law of diminishing returns. Especially for a lower spec bike, upgrading is definitely a worthwhile investment of time and money. But a lot of people (personally guilty of this) get hung up looking at the best of the best parts and trying to completely optimize everything. For the average weekend warrior rider, the difference between mid level upgrades and ultra high-end upgrades is very minimal. Most people would benefit more from "rider upgrades" like how to corner better, line choice, etc than spending $2500 on top end suspension. I wonder if that's something you could work in somehow, attending a skills clinic or private coaching, change nothing on the bike and do a before and after run. Anyways, great work on the series!
I do that, too. But I work in a bikeshop, so I don't have any labour cost, nor do I pay retail prices. So, why it's still unnecessary, especially in this super flat part of Germany, I like nice things, so I put them on my bikes. The "dumbest" thing I did was putting Magura MT7 with 203mm discs on my commuter ebike. The reason: I like the way they look.
I absolutely advise customers against such upgrades, though. If you have pretty much the most basic shimano disc brakes, and all you do is commuting and maybe shopping, I'm happy to sell you a Maven, sure. But I'm also gonna mention that it's absolutely overkill and unnecessary. Some customers want it anyway, because, like you and me, they like nice things.
Hey Evan, FYI for the future, the seatpost collar having a crack obviously isn't good, but shouldn't be a safety concern. With those posts, the air cartridge actually screws into the top and bottom of the bodies, so the collar shouldn't affect it. but good to replace it still and easy to do yourself.
Every Video feels like a mini Cinema Film, keep it Up🔥🔥
Thank you so much!
man, these video are the coolest. It's so fun and well made! Tks for sharing!
Stock db8 pads are crab. I use Galfer E-Bike or Trickstuff. Little more xpensive but way better
Is nobody gonna talk about Evan's flat tire at 5:00?
Haha that was filmed after the riding segment
I don’t think I need a desk that will distract me even more from being actually productive. Sounds like an awesome desk thought, lol
13:35 the specialized command dropper is significantly faster since it doesn’t contain a damper to slow it down which is probably why everyone hated them
Wow! This men definitely puts so much work into his videos! Respect!
Excellent video! I was really hoping to bump into you at the bike fest! Oh well. There is next year.
Nice job dude! I got a new flexispot desk a couple of months ago and its amazing!
Hi Evan, the only comment I have on the braking test is that you should have done 2 or 3 runs back to back and averaged it out after "bedding them in",
Now I will caveat this by saying I am fairly ignorant on "MTB knowledge"
BUT...if its anything like disc brakes on cars and motorbikes the friction material on brake pads will sometimes get better once they have some heat in them, also doing multiple repeated runs helps the "bedding in process" where once you get some heat into the disc and pad it'll actually start whats called "pad transfer" and start laying friction material onto the disc itself, and THAT is what gives you your real braking performance, its not just "fitting performance brakes" that gives you better performance they need bedded in through a specific process.
Maybe you did this and just decided to not edit it in, just wanted to say incase yu didnt know.
Btw Great video.
I like how you keep your video going at the same time as paying the bills. What is that sander/grinder tool for the bars and fork you use? I take it you and the family are safe after that storm...
That tool can be found at hardware/plumbing stores. It’s to remove the sharp burrs on the inside and outside of the handlebars.
Alternatively you can use sandpaper.
one of my cars got totaled from that storm and completely ripped my bike off of the rack
From Montreal Canada! Love this channel Evan. Keep it up 💪
A suspension upgrade comparison would be very interesting. So maybe start with two used Yaris and test stock vs SKF dust wipers and budget vs premium aftermarket damping cartridges.
Just started the video! So hyped
I 100% agree that bars and stem are a CORE part of the setup on a bike, the slightest tweak on thoose are hard to ignore, went from 2 inches of rise to 3.5, and 5 milimeters shorter on the stem. It made an extremely notizable difference.
Love the Cheesy Chad😂 hi -lo is really good. I also think depends on the bike geo too. Rider+Geo=speed
Love this series just have to fix my bike
I appreciate the brake comparison, but it would have been even better if you had previously done a stock run just to establish a baseline. I get the one set of brakes was better than the other, but how do they compare to stock?
The stock time is displayed above all timed runs. The text is a little small, but it's there
@EvansMTBSaga, I meant the brake distance, but yes I saw the times!
Oh yeah braking distance with stock brakes would've been really good to include. I didn't think of that, good idea for sure
I have aluminum “one up” bars on my DH and Carbon “one up” on my trail bike. I prefer the carbon feel as well 👌
That squeaking when you were doing the brake stopping test is a result of oil or grease on the pads and rotors. Take a propane torch to the pads and the rotors and you will see the oil burn off. They will bite so much better after that.
I will do that! But I always thought that SRAM brakes squeak a little
@@EvansMTBSaga Maybe they do, but that's not a "squeak a little" sound. That noise is oil or grease. Those brakes were barely biting if at all. The fact that you never even skidded when trying to stop proves that there was something wrong. Even though I think Sram brakes are trash, they should still at a minimum, skid.
@@rileybox2498 🤣🤣🤣
Hi what’s the name of the tool you used to sand down the alloy bars? Says rigid on side but can’t find it on google. Also is that just a standard pipe cutter you used on bars. Thanks.
Im 6ft and still ride a medium, its amazing, my trail full sus feels like a dirtjump while still being supp.e and supportive
Yeah the sizing isn't set in stone. It's all about the vibe you're wanting from the bike
Great vid, what do you think is the most important upgrade for a mid travel trail bike, i have a giant trance 2 2017 i got for only $700 I want to upgrade it but I have to stay kn a budget, any suggestions?
@@larrylamb3250 if i were you i would go for contact points like in the video. like he said just get what you want and can afford
Wheels would be a killer upgrade. I'm assuming it's a non boost front and rear end, so if you check Pinkbike, I bet you could find some insane deals on wheels
@@EvansMTBSaga It is boost spacing front and rear, I will definately check out pinkbike for deals thanks.
I have Fox Rythm forks on my carbon Stumpy, and run lowish tyre pressures...would I REALLY be able to feel any difference (Extra vibration damping wise) to the factory aluminium bars it came with if replaced with the OneUp Carbon bars? - I've been thinking of upgrading to those very bars for a while, but I just cant help thinking that with 140mm of travel, plus the give in the tyres, a slight flex in the bars would make no difference at all.
I think so. I always swap to OneUp carbon bars on all my builds and its a big difference with small bump compliance and also has a snappy feel in turns that I really like
@@EvansMTBSaga Thank you so much for your reply! I really do appreciate it! and thank you for making such awesome content too!
...I think its time I treat myself to an upgrade 😊❤
My full power ebike came with DB8 brakes. I thought they stopped and felt good. My main complaint was that the pistons didn't retract well enough and rubbed the rotors... And I can't stand a noisy bike.
I swapped them with pair of second hand Shimano MT520, just to feel them and buy higher end Shimanos if I liked them. They will stay in the bike until they break apart.
I would say they bite with the same force as DB8, but with WAY less force applied. I don't feel arm pump anymore.
While the SRAM DB8's certainly aren't the most powerful brakes out there, or the most adjustable, I don't think SRAM expected a set of entry level brakes to be incredibly consistent and reliable. I've been using mine for a whole year, and I've even crashed on the levers themselves, but they still work the same since day one. Same modulation, same bite point, same lever feel. They're completely leak-free too. Most surprisingly, if you accidentally pull them too hard, you will lock up and OTB. They don't drag when they're warmed up.
After seeing Evan's stock TRP DHR Evo video, I'm now thinking about upgrading the consumables in my DB8 instead. The braking distance stock for stock between the DB8 and DHR Evo is practically the same. I do like the linear braking application of the DHR Evo, but its price and inclusions don't really make me want to switch. I don't want to be buying separate metallic brake pads and scarce 2.3mm rotors as soon as my set arrives, especially not a $550-600 brake set.
At least I can make the case for the $200 DB8. Add some MTX Gold pads and HS2 rotors, and I'm gucci. The stock SwissStop Disc 29 RS organic pads (from Canyon) are already quite powerful for general trail riding, but they do run out of steam quickly in high-speed, extended straight descents. If all it takes to make DB8's excellent is some metallic pads (like the Shimano Deore M6120), then I'm willing to take my time and experiment on that. It's always worth it to find good deals when the result is genuine performance improvement.
I appreciate the well thought out comment! Like I said in the TRP video, DB8 with metallic pads and 200mm rotors are amazing cost to performance. Glad to hear yours have been rock solid. The user manual says they only need a full bleed every 2 years
Yeah I am due for new grips any suggestions for the Marin San Quentin 2 2022, kept the original brakes, and am usually not a sram person with the DB8 I would love to try them out. This is an excellent video of explaining the difference between Maven vs DB8.
Personally I would have gone with the Wolftooth dropper lever, which can be had for less if you know where to look and it's made in Minnesota. Plus, it looks bling.
I'd like to try those some time! But when gathering all the parts, I just made a massive order with OneUp and that covered a lot of the parts I needed
Haha right after I typed that, I searched the Wolftooth lever and realized that I own a gold lever from them. After using that for years, I prefer the rubber pad on the dropper remote compared to the gnurled medal that Wolftooth uses. Just a small preference, still a great option
@@EvansMTBSaga that's fair.
Another great video. Enjoying the series
Thanks Morgan!!
OK bro. I'm feeling the... uh... inspiration from Donut's Hi-Lo series. But I approve. It's some of the best stuff they ever did as a channel.
This is a great video in its own right and answers an important question for us mountain bikers.
Thanks man!
Hi I need a new shock for my bike
on my bike the dimensions are a bit specific, it's 210 x 50mm trunnion
I have a question, do you know any damper with these dimensions?
Fox and Rockshox should have a couple options depending on the shock model. Should be listed on their website.
210x50 is pretty standard, like
RS SID , RS Deluxe+, Fox X, Suntour EDGE LOR etc
Oneup lever seemed like an odd choice to me. Why that and not wolf tooth remote (which is available cheaper)
I just made a gigantic OneUp order when preparing for the season
@@EvansMTBSaga oh lmao
Me and my $150 bike be like:
👁️👄👁️👁️👄👁️
It's nice to not be alone in this
What’s up Evan I can’t believe Bentonville is so tore up because of the tornado. I hit a tree with my head and fell off a cliff into a river yesterday. Lol
Haha yeah trails are closed all over. I smacked my head on a tree the other day. Luckily didn't feel a thing cuz of my helmet haha. Hope you're good after falling off the cliff! Sounds gnarly
I was just looking into the mavens 🎉
Have a look into XT 4 pot, with ventilated pads and rotors. Perfect combo imo
@@mihaichiriac480 XT's have nothing on Mavens... I have both and yeah XT are ok, especially compared to el cheapo stuff that comes on these bikes, but nowhere near Maven performance.
@@senditsamuel damn, now I'm also looking into mavens (way overkill for my usual rides)
@@mihaichiriac480 they're way overkill for my usual rides as well haha if you're coming from XT's then the lever feel will take some getting use to but any SRAM brakes will, much firmer feel than Shimano.
These vids are incredible! So much work has go to into this! But worth it! So entertaining!
The hope V4’s are still my favorite brake to run
I have DB8's on my Fezarri Delano Peak and I've like them so far. I think the brake test clearly shows the mavens are better but I wonder what the difference is riding on the trails between the two. My guess is the performance of the maven on a trail doesn't justify the extra $$ amount.
My boys signal peak has the db8 brakes on them. Overall the times I've road his bike I'm very happy they way the db8 brakes preform for what you get.
You'll prolly only start to notice if you're riding a continuous descent, say like 300-600ft. The DB8's run out of steam by then.
Those 1UP Thick Grips are my absolute favorite! I really liked the DMR Death Grips too but the 1UP is just slightly better imo
Minimize arm pump by not death gripping the bars. Thicker grips encourage me to squeeze harder than I need to. ODI Troy Lee Designs are thinner and sticky. Carbon bars are worth the $ imo. I have Renthal FatBar Lite carbon on both on my trail bikes. They were $150 apiece for 780mm.
That dropper looks like it could do some damage to that nuts with that speed. It reminds me of my 2013 Specialized Command Post. That thing would donkey kick you in the balls every time you were not paying attention.
Great vid and demos.
Someone else commented that thick grips cause arm pump. They didn't elaborate so I was confused. Thanks for explaining that. My go-to grips are Ergons, but I liked the OneUp colors for the sake of these builds. maybe I'll try thinner grips for the finale 😁
@@EvansMTBSaga There is no science behind my experience, just something I noticed by trying different grips over the years. I also have the carbon bars, so a thicker grips aren't needed for chatter and small bump compliance.
Great vids and keep em coming.
Finally! been waiting for your upload.
tried those new sram brakes. Those new levers are fatiguing on the arms...they look good coz they are low profile but it seems it has compromised leverage, making u apply more force than norma specially if u are used to shimano levers...
reviewers say its the dead stroke thats the problem. When the pads contact the rotor the mavens take less force than any other brake for the same power but they're the stiffest brakes until the pads contact the rotor wich is a huge problem.
I felt the stiff initial stroke after I installed them, but it was gone after the first ride. I still prefer SRAM brakes over Shimano 😁
@@EvansMTBSagasame im a huge guide/code fanboy
My friend gave me his Code RSCs. They're probably my favorite brakes. I love the ergonomics and power delivery
@@EvansMTBSagayep, i like the codes, definitely one of the best
Kinda skipped right over the seat post collar being cracked. How? Why? Common problem with that post?
Dude I have no clue. The bike has a few other issues too which I'll get to next video
Why completely pull the fork if all you're changing are the contact points?
Are you talking during the installation? If so, I do that because I have to pause to move the camera and lights with every shot
@EvansMTBSaga ah, gotcha. I was like, "just throw some extra spacer rings on top for a moment while the bar/stem are removed."
Makes sense now.
"What is that!? How much did you spend!?"
iconic
Haha I love it 😅
I got 2 sets of mavens and the power is incredible but im having a pumping up lever issue it seems pretty common on the forums, if you pull your levers fast a few times in a row does the bite point go farther out?
Yes it does. I didn't mention it in the video because I felt like it was my fault from a poor bleed. I actually bled them twice before I filmed the video but the problem persists. What forum? Did anyone find a solution?
@EvansMTBSaga I have tried everything I have bleed them every which way I could think off after the factory way wasn't helping. I tried taking the pads out and using 2 rotors to cycle the pistons and push them back in to "massage" them and they got a little better but still not right it seems like the pistons can't retract fast enough. I have ridden one set for a few hundred miles and it is alot better then the set I have limited miles on but still bad. It's hard to control speed on steep stuff when you never know where the bite point will be! So frustrating because they are awesome other than that and I'm 240 pounds so I really want them to work.
I forgot to add 3 set when to my local shop I bought 2 and did self install and the 3rd set was bought and installed from the shop the head mechanic tried everything aswell and even rebuilt the calipers and after that he ended up sanding a set of pistons down and they still were sticky per him.
If you google sram maven pump up you can find a few posts on mtb sites. I have been asking everyone that has installed a set and so far everyone has this issue I'm about to try a warranty claim with sram and see what happens
Dang man. I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one. I'm gonna Google that and see what my options are. I bought them cuz they were red and the kit came with so many goodies. If I can't get them working right, I'll just sell them and go to my Codes haha
@EvansMTBSaga I totally agree I live the look and such a deal with everything in the kit and they are crazy powerful just the bite point thing is impossible to get used to I think sram will figure it out soon tho they have too
What’s the red piece ontop of the stem at 2:45 ?????
That is a OneUp EDC Lite. Top cap that lets you store a multi tool in your steer tube
Imagine crashing really bad being rushed to the ER and you’re being treated by Evan. I’d probably think im dead
In the suspension episode you teased a derailleur upgrade for this episode, when is the comparison coming? Next week will be about the wheels?
Thanks for asking about this. After much thought, I decided to scrap the drivetrain episode because I couldn't figure out a compelling way to test it. So next week I'm combining the drivetrain and wheelset upgrade videos and shortening the series from 6 episodes to 5 episodes. There's always an option to upgrade frames after the finale though
Great, looking forward to it!
Nice video evan, i have a set of level tl brakes on my bike. They feel similar to my mayes db8s
Evan are you still considering building up a lightweight emtb?
Im so amazed at how well these are done lol.
5:45 what kinda ratchet/torque wrench is tthat
Shimano mt201 seem to have more bite and would have done better on the braking test
Depends on size of pots in brakes sram guide smaller than code
Sorry I meant did you reuse the old dropper cable?
Oh yeah I did
I have db8 brakes on my yt Capra and they are amazing
I rode some db8s on a yt decoy... Not impressed coming from my older shimano br-m785s even with my smaller 180mm rotors
Lol. EC90 carbon bars are 40-50$ 😂. I've had the same bars for 4 years. No issues! ☺️.
Best brakes on the market. Hayes.
What wheel did you get for next time?
I’ve used low end and high end components and I choose high end everytime. Yes it costs more, but they are just more durable and performs like Day 1 much better than the cheap stuff. The cheap stuff get worse over time fast!
much better then the pinkbike series, a more realistic hi-lo :D
no aliexpress parts
what is that screen thing on your stem?
Love your channel keep up the great work man
Bro said "Crapy suspension" like bro that suspensions costs like my whole bike
Dude youre so chill and production is suberb. Keep going.
Love this series. Always love the components on the high bike.
Did you reuse the old shifter cable?
I didn't mess with shifters in this video. Going to do drivetrain and wheels next episode
Interesting that you spent a quarter of the cost of the high bike and yet the high bike only shed .8lbs while the low bike shed 2.2lbs. Not that weight should really be a concern in the overall picture but that is pretty surprising. I suppose that could be chalked up to durability of the parts maybe?
I'm still not sure why the High Bike is consistently heavier. I make sure to zero out the scale every time. I think the Reverb AXS and Maven brakes were heavier than Low Bike's parts
Next video is the wheels so I expect High Bike to be lighter for once
I love the look of low bike! Great video evan
It’s insane how department stores still pumping out 3x and 2x drivetrains. More moving parts, more things to service, more things to go wrong, more weight. Once I switched to 1x, I’m never going back to anything else. It’s simple and minimalistic.
Yeah, 1x is truly the best. 2x and 3x it's cheapest for them to make, so they just keep making it even though it's bad. And they use the extra money they make from making cheap 3x or 2x drivetrains to putting the worlds crappiest rear shock and other useless features.
Arm pump after a 40 second run down a baby butt smooth Bentonville trail. That's more an indictment of the stock suspension than anything.
I showed the surface. It's very rocky right now. Nonstop 2-3" rocks embedded in the hard packed dirt
Lol just watched 2 fast 2 furious. Loved that reference.
Haha I gotta go back and rewatch that. Was it worth watching again?
I was in my LBS saturday and they said the maven had so much stopping force, ppl where going to smaller rotors and organic pads to lessen their strength. Absolutely insane.
High low 3 on enduro bikes?
High Low is retired after this season. Too much work! And now I'm injured because of it 😡😂
So what I find REALLY intresting is literally how mm’s of height and length can go a mile, for example my BMX, I tried one that was 2-3 mm taller than mine, wow, that made a diffrence, same goes for someone running the same mtb as mine, just taller stem, makes a mile of diffrence in feel
Donut Media HiLow with Mountainbikes 😂😂 love it
The arm pump is from the thicker grips
I would be interested in hi low bearing tests
Great video! Production is top-notch. But Evan please, can you add weight in kilos under lbs? That would be very helpful as I wouldn't need to google it every time. Thank you very much! 😁
Why didn’t you use SLX 4 Piston brakes?! They cost plusminus the same as these aweful DB8, but have full power…
I wanted to make the test kinda close. Both Sram 4 piston & mineral oil, but I think your idea would have been better. But then it's up to the cost. I wanted to keep the brake cost at $150 for Low Bike
Isnt low bike lighter coz in the first episode you changed the tyres to a tubeless pair which saved over 2lbs and youre keeping them the same through the whole testing??
Both bikes are tubeless with the same tires. I found out why in the episode coming out tomorrow!
Okay, thank you, In the first episode I swear low bike went tubeless and high bike didn't
I think you didn’t bed the brake pads in before the stopping test…
I did
I like the series but I don't understand this comparison. You're picking a DOT downhill brake vs. a mineral trail/am brake. Why would you not compare parts that are at least in the same category?
Did you watch the video? I explained that both brakes use mineral oil. I would've loved to use Code R instead of the DB8
@@EvansMTBSaga 100% my mistake, they do both use mineral oil. I just don't understand the comparison off brakes for 2 different purposes as opposed to the same purpose
Yo! The dropper wouldn’t just deploy, as the collar doesn’t retain anything functionality wise, but you probably will get a lot more dirt in there
i would go for xtr brakes and rotors or at least xt with freeza tech
Why not the zeb?
Minimum travel for a Zeb is 150mm and these bikes are 140mm. Zeb is overkill for a trail bike too
The perfect application for Mavens is not on MTB but heavy e Cargo bikes and trikes .
I just pulled my db8’s off my new enduro bike!
Yeah it's silly that DB8's are sold on high end bikes or ebikes. They're decent, but I don't think they have as much power as regular Code R