Adam neely does a comparison using a true temperament guitar, the difference is subtle but noticeable to someone with a keen musical ear th-cam.com/video/-penQWPHJzI/w-d-xo.html
As an electric player, I just try not to obsess over it. I keep my open strings and everything at the 12th fret in tune, and accept that the rest will never be perfect. It's easier for me than a classical player, since the music I listen to is fundamentally out of tune in the same way, so everything is normal. But when I try to play more classical stuff, it can feel kinda uncomfortable - I get this unsettling feeling, like something is just not quite right.
It's all about compromisation. Want an usual guitar with the best compatibility? You get straight frets and slight-off tunings in Equal Temperament. Want Tolgahan's movable fret guitar? You cannot bend strings (which is fine for classical guitar but deadly on electric). Want true temperament with bendable strings? You get True Temperament fretting system with curly frets but you are limited to a single tuning (e.g. E standard with half step up/down as maximum) and predetermined string gauge. Fretted string instruments are born with imperfections, but with Tolgahan's solution (along with other methods) we can achieve more with other compromisation. It might be still imperfect after all, but at least we broke with traditions, did something was never done in hundred years and got the best thing we can have at the moment.
I could always tell that it sounded a bit off when tuning my guitar. I would always switch between tuner or by ear. Never sounded quite right, but I play with distortion a lot. Acoustic is when it bothered me the most. Those adjustable frets make your guitar sound like a harp. Pretty damn amazing.
Just intonation. Adjust the saddles on your electric. Every fret can be in tune. The tuber was using the equally tempered system so the only adjustemt required int he video is the bridge. There are bridges with adjustable saddles. Our Western equally tempered system is working well. It has problems with every interval. But all octaves are perfect. This was the goal. It is not possible to tune it any toger way unless ypu had like 12*12 more frets or something. This is basically saddle adjustment but on frets. Which is pintless. It allows for awesome microtonal stuff so kudos for that and I love the concept. But it is not the solution to a problem explained.
0record0 I recognized some of those problems on a solid body guitar. Others I didn't. But accoustic is where the tones were bothering me the most. Thank you for the advice. Definitely other things to consider. 👍
@@0record0 please think about what you just said. Intonating the bridge should fix every issue? What about the fact that the relationship between frets remains the same for all strings despite different strings reacting differently to pressure and stretch?
Yeah. My bandmates thought there is something wrong with my ears... I got paranoid and not at ease hearing the tune imperfections.. Thanks this is the answer
@@pcfllms I think so. It troubles me everytime. It will make me tune each strings many times.. And eventually one chord got all perfected, but man! All other chords then are awful... So, I keep tuning every string that could perfectly tune all chords to the sound my ears can tolerate the imperfections.
Nice work i ask if its posible.Do you make the slot before glue the fingerboard or after on the guitar arm. Build the movable frets your self? Thank very interesting especial y for personas that have a fine sensible for tuning
es bueno saber que se puede aspirar a tener una guitarra realmente afinada,su trabajo es asombroso ya que en realidad esos ajustes permiten obtener la afinacion perfecta,,good job !
Yes, there's beauty in imperfection. But there's imperfection of all kinds in any music played by people, and the imperfection of being out of tune in a fixed way is not an imperfection that's human, so at least for me it's an imperfection I can do without.
Something else you dont consider is when you vibrate one string all the other strings vibrate a little too and adjusts the pitch and stability of the desired note. Also the item you use to pluck the string and how hard you do so also effects the pitch of the notes. Which is why people who play rougher sometimes sound out of tune.
The Guitar Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle: every tuning exists within an area of uncertainty... that drove me crazy after 40 years of playing the classical repertoire. Anyone know what tuner this brilliant guy uses? Thanks, Hal
Basically, what's done here is setting the frets to have true temperament. Do a google search for true temperament frets. Many companies are building guitars with them, licensing the system from the original creator. One advantage of having movable frets like Tolgahan's guitar has, is that you can use varying string gauges and just set up the fret shapes accordingly. True temperament frets are fixed and are built with a fixed set of string gauges in mind and they'll have varying tension, so you can't just use 8-9 in the high E and switch to 12-13.
Okay i have some data!! I play a 25" scale guitar, I tuned at the 7th fret and hit the strings soft, except for the low big string i play that hard and tune it to sound good with hard/heavy picking ... Basically all my strings stayed withing 5 cents of their original tuning from 1st fret to the 12th fret. They all dropped a few cents playing open, and they all raised a few cents when hitting the 12th fret. The pitch changes mostly because of fret wear and high action, the guitar is from 1972 so its expected. ... It would be worth noting that at least on my old guitar, tuning the strings open(no frets hit) or tuning by the harmonics, or even tuning to the 12th fret will yield; unplayable results, chords become dissonant, and the strings tune will vary by 10 cents at the octaves aaahhhhh!! ... I also tried tuning by hitting the strings hard and I found that: some of my strings stayed in Perfect tune no matter how hard i played. A few raised pitch by 5 cents momentarily when played hard but they returned to tune quickly this has to do with years of finding the right strings(boo string makers who combine a saggy B string next to a taunt G string wtf) ..... i play with ancient strings they were last changed a few years ago, i like them this way, if one breaks I simply attach it to another tuner and keep the old gold singing, no tin can sounding guitars here .... I play in DADGBe with these strings: These tensions are for 25.5" scaled guitar, mine is shorter, it has slightly less tension .010"/.254mm 16.2LBS/7.34Kg .013"/.3302mm 15.4LBS/6.98Kg .020"/.508mm 21.0LBS/9.54Kg .030"/.076mm 27.1LBS/12.29Kg .040"/1.016mm 27.6LBS/12.51Kg .062"/1.574mm 28 2LBS/12.79Kg didn't know I had a smooth tension transition until you asked for info haha, the tension is less than ddadario lights they feel good. .... The strings inner core diameters e = .010"/.254mm B = .013"/.3302mm G = .012"/.254mm D = .013"/.3302mm A = .014"/.3556mm D = .017"/.4318mm .... My string action(space between fret and string): .12"/3.048mm at 12th fret. except the lowest string, lowest string action is at .14"/3.556mm at the 12th fret. The lowest string is higher action so i can have more volume without the buzzing. all the strings are flat (the top of the lowest string is the highest each one below it is slightly lower I just measured, so its like a classical except it has a very slightly curved fretboard(favorable)) ..... My guitar is a fg230 modified yamaha 12 string (martin d28-12 copy), i only use 6 strings though. it has a nice wide fret board and most say its LOUD and deep. .... Now I got to put away my machinist calipers. You do good work man I've been watching you for years ... Edit: just rechecked the action at the 12th fret, but this time I held down the string at the first fret also. every single string has 0.12" of action( space between string and fret). my saddle is sanded flat and it's just a fret wire saddle now. my guitar pins are just rolled up receipt paper hahaha at one point i made this a 7 string
isaac tapia - Excellent measurements. You have well tempered solutions. Not sure if I should fret about my guitar in such depth. Funny thing is that somedays my guitar is in tune with the church piano and in tune with itself - all throughout the service. Other days I will battle with tuning throughout the service. Is it operator error? Humidity? Temperature? An out of tune piano? One or all of the above! This happens with three different guitars - a classical nylon, an acoustic steel and a Fender Stratocaster. When my guitar is out of tune, I sing louder and play quietly. The pianist always wants to be the loudest, anyway! My wife rarely hears my guitar at Mass unless I am soloing without piano.
Dear Tolgahan, this is a very interesting topic, that I am discovering in this period. I am very fascinated from all this, I want to study and understand more and more. The point is that I am not satisfied of the tuning I can get on my guitars. As you show on the video, if I use the tuner I have several notes that are not in tone, and this is frustrating to me. Moreover, I don't get a point. In this video you adjust the frets, so to have, using your words, "perfect intonation". By saying "perfect intonation", you mean that after the adjustment all the notes that you get from the whole fretboard fit with the tuner, that is are the same notes you could get playing a well tuned modern piano keyboard. Am I right? If my interpretation is correct, at the end of the video you have tuned the guitar so that you comply (without biases) the 12-tone equal-temperament standard. Actually this first result would be a great success for me. My concern is to play with other instruments that will be tuned according to the 12-ET standard. So, I would like to have at least a guitar perfectly tuned according to the 12-ET standard that at the moment, as my tuner and my ears confirm, is not happening. I would also like to experiment different temperaments and the possibility to use lower intervals, but this would be a second step of my path on the guitar. If you will answer me I would be very grateful. Thank you Massimiliamo
Hello, my father is a classical guitar maker and his guitars have detachable fretboards. Is it possible to buy a custom made moveable fret fingerboard like this one you are playing? That would be amazing.
I think sound already exists and musicians can't do anything to improve it. What is "in tune" for me is making whatever sounds I want to with whatever is available at the time.
Electric guitars have better tuning, but it’s still not perfect, due to the uneven fret heights and uneven nut&bridge height. Whenever you press down the string, it creates different angles on the bridge side, this can cause imperfect pitch depending on the materials of the string. Mathematically this can never be solved, because the fret distances on the fretboard are always mathematically perfect, while the angle created by the bridge varies from fret to fret. Electric guitars can adjust intonation easily, true temperament frets also makes it better. But the only perfect solution is adjustable frets: to create your customized true temperament frets.
however I don’t think an instrument has to be perfectly in tune.. Equal temperament is invented by human, not natural. Human ear can still accept imperfect harmony as “consonant”. Violins and vocal are never perfectly in tune.
I think it's good to remember that the 12 tone equal temperament is also a compromise. So I think the real question is, does the guitar have to be in perfect 12 tone equal temperament? Sure, I would say there is a problem if the fretted notes are way off. But I don't think that's the case - they are "close enough". We also need to remember that a lot of pieces weren't even originally meant to be played in 12 tone equal temperament. So I don't think obsessing over perfect 12 tone equal temperament makes that much sense. I do think it's a cool concept, though, and it could be used for different kinds of tunings. BTW, how do bends work on these frets?
I've seen guitars with compensated saddles and nuts that appeared to be in perfect tune across the board - never tested one personally, but would love to hear a comparison
Gabriel- the Evertune bridge is a clever idea, but it solves a different problem, that of strings changing tension and getting out of tune because of stretching. It has no effect on whatever your frets are tuned to.
Hi and thank you for your work! I have a question. Shouldent the nut ( and saddle?) be changeable for the induvididual strings aswell for the open chords and such? Best regards / J
Having just started learning guitar, I was trouble when tuning to an Android app. The strings when played open did not sound right or pleasing to the ear. I thought I must be doing something wrong. Or am I? Not to muddy the water further but upon listening to many professional musicians during their solos I have often thought they were not intune with the orchestra. I thought my ear must be wrong. So which is it?
I greatly admire the work you have done pursuing this ideal intonation solution. Your critics seem to be entirely missing the points you are making. We expect to fine tune every note of a piano, so why not also a guitar? Far too many excuses about just accepting imperfections, why not try to improve? Now, where can i get a Brahms guitar 8-string with such a fingerboard?
Great ! I have a Roriguez and Sons Classical and a Yamaha SLG200N silent guitar. Neither of them sound in tune to me at the high end of the fret board.
Just wondering: on the adjustable microtonal guitar, when you move the fret, what is the minimal distance between each microtone? 5 cents, 10 cents, more?
oh my god I thought I was watching "All stars but all guitars are out of tune but one" and was wondering where is the All Stars part. I guess I already watched too much today.
When I record music and some part sounds slightly out of tune, I re-tune the guitar to have better intonation on the frets used in that part. Then I tune back to normal for the rest of the song.
I took Sitar lessons when working in India for 4 months. I bought the instrument with my Sitar master and was amazed at the tuning of the frets. 1. Amazed that the concept existed 2. Amazed that he did that by ear. 3. Amazed how off the manufacture was in the instruments factory setup. There might be a chance that South Indian Sitar is different and mine was setup for North Indian, or maybe not. Anyways, being a guitarist first, your video was fascinating. I wonder if there’s a word and measurement for the variance of accuracy from open to fretted octave like you showed at the beginning. Assuming there are some instruments with more and less variance, like your $10K guitar compared to Yamaha plywood guitar, that measurement would be great when guitar shopping. Maybe a $1000 guitar has 4 hertz variance and a $2000 guitar has more volume or bass or mids but has a 9 hertz variance. Your guitar is where it’s at, just like my sitar. Great video.
*Intonation* cannot be reliably rated or bought out of the box. It's reasonable to expect to pay for a professional set up or do it yourself. Choice of string gauge & material makes a difference. Nylon or wound strings tend to require less adjustment than steel because they have lower tension & lower stiffness. String height height at both nut & bridge can be adjusted. The amount of bowing in the neck can be adjusted on guitars that have a truss rod. Individual string length & height can sometimes be adjusted, lower usually being better. Electric guitars often have bridges specially designed for such adjustments, because they *need* greater adjustment (unwound steel G string in particular). A perfectly intonated guitar will not stay intonated; at minimum heat & humidity cause shrinkage or expansion of the wood, particularly the neck. A well built $200 electric or classical might be intonated far better than a particular multiK$ steel string ever could be. But that multiK$ guitar may be intonated in the keys you play (where you play on the neck matters) & have tone that just can't be matched by anything else.
Every great work of art has a flaw... Part of what makes a great guitarist is the ability to overcome and adapt to this ever occurring event. If fact for certain songs I detune certain strings just 3-5 cents. For that unique flavor. I also believe you should know your instrument , if you play the same guitar a lot. You’ll find those bad areas and be ready to push a little harder or ease off a bit. To hit that sweet spot. 😎🎸🎶🙏🌎🌏🌍✌️
I play mostly tonal music. If, say, I'm playing mostly in the key of C, I make sure all of my Cs are in tune because I want all my octaves to be in tune. Thirds and sixths are a problem, but I'd rather hear a questionable third than an out of tune octave.
@0:40 Here we go. Fret 1, up tuned, Fret 2, up tuned, Fret 3, up tuned, Fret 12, half a semitone up... Really, I got used to this shit, but it always happened.
My guitar is slighty sharp when i press. I try to work it out with capo and cottonbutt, it perfectly tune until like 5 frets but in higher frets it out of tune again :/
It is because acoustic guitars have fixed bridge, we cannot adjust the distance between bridge and nut. You dont need to slice down the every fret. Just make a segmental bridge.
I have 1 thing to ask, what happen if we "zig-zag-ing" the fret like that and play some piece that there is quite many "barre" position? For example prelude BWV 1006 (as far as I know). Is that kind of fret still feel natural like a standard fret? Thank You
Preach it, brother! The next step is to get rid of the frets altogether and play harp, like I do! Great work again, Tolgahan. Cheers from cool Vienna, Scott btw- do you sell moveable fret fingerboards? I'm thinking about making a 12-string lap guitar that I would play polymetrically, with both hands plucking and fingering. I'd only need an octave, with a normal guitar mensur (say 65cm or so). Thanks. I hope the election goes well for you.
well, the thing about 12 Tet, Just intonation, and a guitar is that means some chords with an off note will sound more pleasant than with a spot on note because of the way the intervals work. a 5/4 interval in E major, would need to have a added 15.3 cents onto the higher note, or subtract 15.3 cents from the lower. if the notes are slightly off, they'll sound more pleasant to the ear. yes, this guitar is nice, i would buy one personally because i think it is a good idea and is a great way to set an example for TUNE YOUR FUCKING GUITAR PEOPLE, because it means it will be 100% spot on with the notes.
Does this mean we are playing un out of tuned guitar? Please search for andrew foy and listen to his covers, it's ok to play the orginal(should i say out of tuned guitar), right?
dude is on stage in the middle of a live performance 2:29 'excuse me fans while i tune my guitar for the next song, this might take anywhere between a few hours to a few days, if you like you can go get some dinner or catch a movie or something & i'll send a group text when i'm ready to continue the show, soz for the inconvenience but i'm rather epically doosh about my guitar tuning' :)
I actually did an academic study of this for school (guitar in general) Tl;dr basically all "regular" guitars are not completely in tune Longer version The "just intonation" we use on the guitars doesn't really work all that well (or it was equal temperament...) either way, the placement of the frets is not up to par with the notes. This is why we have the true temperament frets, which is just like your acoustic, but instead it's glued on with the "squiggly" frets. We also have the earvana nut which helps a litte bit. But ofc all this will wear down in time..
I understand the point of this guitar but the look of thise frets is more unaesthetic to me then the sound of slightly out of tune frets by a long shot.
@@microtonalguitar thanks so much for responding. Would be nice a short video to show the range. I can see some guitar players shying away if this is not clear. Also how is your guitar avaiable for people to purchase from any luthier you recommend?..thanks and keep the good work!
It is legitimate to invest efforts into creating a perfectly consonant guitar or composition. But if two C notes played together are "out of tune", it is not automatically a bad thing as some seem to assume. There are infinite possibilities how much the two notes can differ. These are like colors for a painter. Does a painter always use the pure colors only? Do we want to eliminate infinite possibilities for the sake of a single "in-tune" possibility? We learned to appreciate dissonance, I think some day we can appreciate "out of tune" in a similar way. So I just want to remind the artists out there, "explore the space" :)
Ao you're saying the standard guitar is out of tune because it needs new strings? Any fixed bridge guitar needs the correct set of strings or intonation will be off, that's not a problem with fret design...
If you have a staggered 12th fret it just shows you have some unevenly stretched strings. If the 12th fret and the harmonic at the 12th are not the same ... change the string.
Or you have a string of the wrong guage or wrong material to play in tune at that fret. Fixed frets will never give you the control over intonation and the flexibility in tuning and string choice that moveable frets will.
ENG: Can you bend with adjustable fretts though? Of course one or maybe two semitones are possible but how about more? TÜR: Ayarlanabilir perdelerle tel bükebiliyor muyuz? "BENDING"
Don't forget the warning voiced by a "replier" below, "micro frets are optimised for a particular tuning (E standard) with particular string gauges" Make sure you catch the last warning he gives.
What about stretch tunings? On a piano two strings in perfect octaves will sound out of tune due to the overtones. Don't all vibrating strings fall from perfection in this way? Piano octaves are tuned so that they are 4-5 beats out of tune so the overtones of the string stay in tune. There still a compromise with any kind of vibrating strings. If your notes are perfect half steps then the octaves will sound out of tune when played simultaneously.
Would tuning to a different frequency change a guitar with adjusted frets? Say you adjust frets for 440hz tuning, then tune to 528hz, will it still be in tune?
Gromm- that's not entirely true. The higher you tune strings, the relatively less they go up in pitch when fretted. This is because they stretch when pressed down to the frets, and stretching a certain amount affects the pitch of a higher tensioned string less than a lower tensioned string. But in practice, the small difference between, say, A=440 and A=444 (that's about C=528) would probably not be enough to notice. cheers from an instrumentmaker in Vienna, Scott
I'm primarily a bowmaker, but I also build many historical instruments, especially medieval harps, lyres, fiddles, and such. I also play weird polymetric music on harps and lyres. If you're interested, here's a sample: soundcloud.com/scott-wallace-189088488/truckin Are you a musician too? cheers, Scott
I think you need to watch this: th-cam.com/video/CDr6refSgg0/w-d-xo.html Movable-fretted guitars, in addition to the solution of semitone tunings, open you a new world. That's why the guitar needs to be improved forever.
Tolgahan Çoğulu it just adds unnecessary cost, unreliability and complexity for the instrument. This neck is more expensive and complex to make, takes an hour to tune and falls out of tune quickly when the fitment on the frets wears out, meaning you need to service/replace the neck. At the point when someone who has played guitar/bass professionally for 40+ years tells me that semitune isnt good enough anymore I will believe you. But so far all im seeing is a bad concept with a onesided presentation, you only focus on the few pros this system has and none of the cons.
Reyiz yeminle büyük bir gitar firmam olsa direk bu fikri alırdım. Zaten çoook uzun yıllardır endüstride bir gelişme yok. Bu çok dikkat çeker ve rağbet görürdü.
This is the trouble with every instrument that's scaled like in the middle-ages. Physically considered the scales are wrong. The solution isn't a well tempered instrument but working with those dissonances, because we are used to it and have the "Must" or the freedom to form a tone. This is what makes a good musician.
On this amazing guitar don’t you have to constantly adjust the adjustable frets plus the strings or do the frets stay put pretty much I wonder.Limited knowledge of this type of setup I will admit. Interesting though.
My Ibanez AS53 costs $400 and it’s 100% accurate on all frets. Pretty insane tuning stability as well, I can leave it without playing for half a year and except G all strings stay in tune insane
If music is all about the experimentation with sound, then you will definitely get some experimental sounds out of a traditional guitar. Take Jimi Hendrix for example. Most of his sounds came from technique. The guitar only facilitated in amplifying the technique. But without his Fender Stratocaster, he would just be another guitar player. It doesn't matter how much you spend on a guitar. Price does not always ensure quality. When you are buying a guitar, it should be treated like auditioning a new band member. Picking one up off the shelf that meets your price range, isn't always the best policy. And there are a lot of factors that go into the overall tuning of a string. For example, the roller bearing design on the nut of my Fender Stratocaster pretty much ensures true flexibility of the string. Eliminating string pressure issues. Plus, I can bend the string four and a half steps. And it comes right back to tune.
If you need to use a guitar tuner to know that some notes on each string might be just slightly sharp or just slightly flat then the difference is not even perceivable to your ears so I think it will be ok.
Any chance we can get a song with the guitar that's tuned perfectly compared to the regular non adjustable one? A blind test would be interesting.
I'll do it when I have time. Meanwhile check this experiment for a similar debate: th-cam.com/video/kyQaSFgnVI8/w-d-xo.html
and those compared to a guitar that's tuned to just intonation!
to a lay person & even most musicians it's indistinguishable... trust me
Agree with this, if a song demo for both guitars to really hear the difference. Thank you.
Adam neely does a comparison using a true temperament guitar, the difference is subtle but noticeable to someone with a keen musical ear th-cam.com/video/-penQWPHJzI/w-d-xo.html
As an electric player, I just try not to obsess over it. I keep my open strings and everything at the 12th fret in tune, and accept that the rest will never be perfect. It's easier for me than a classical player, since the music I listen to is fundamentally out of tune in the same way, so everything is normal. But when I try to play more classical stuff, it can feel kinda uncomfortable - I get this unsettling feeling, like something is just not quite right.
Thanks for your comment. I agree that it is more disturbing on classical.
Amen brother!
My guitar is always tuned "good enough".
GDENUF
Imposible
Are you sure?
“Good enough” doesn't mean “perfect”
It sounds perfectly like a harp
Nice to hear that.
Harps are tune using equal temperament
That's what I said. You've read my mind.
@@bencur7176 Modern concert harps are usually tuned to equal temperament. Other harps not necessarily.
@@bencur7176 this is also equal temperament.
It's all about compromisation. Want an usual guitar with the best compatibility? You get straight frets and slight-off tunings in Equal Temperament.
Want Tolgahan's movable fret guitar? You cannot bend strings (which is fine for classical guitar but deadly on electric).
Want true temperament with bendable strings? You get True Temperament fretting system with curly frets but you are limited to a single tuning (e.g. E standard with half step up/down as maximum) and predetermined string gauge.
Fretted string instruments are born with imperfections, but with Tolgahan's solution (along with other methods) we can achieve more with other compromisation. It might be still imperfect after all, but at least we broke with traditions, did something was never done in hundred years and got the best thing we can have at the moment.
Thanks!
Why can't you bend strings on Tolgahan's guitar?
It falls between two small frets.
Compromisation, is that a brand of ice cream?
Is your name really P. Ennis...
Title should be "how to tune your guitar for OCD people"
Or for people with extreme perfect pitch
I could always tell that it sounded a bit off when tuning my guitar. I would always switch between tuner or by ear. Never sounded quite right, but I play with distortion a lot. Acoustic is when it bothered me the most. Those adjustable frets make your guitar sound like a harp. Pretty damn amazing.
Glad to hear that! Distorsion covers well :)
Just intonation. Adjust the saddles on your electric. Every fret can be in tune. The tuber was using the equally tempered system so the only adjustemt required int he video is the bridge. There are bridges with adjustable saddles. Our Western equally tempered system is working well. It has problems with every interval. But all octaves are perfect. This was the goal. It is not possible to tune it any toger way unless ypu had like 12*12 more frets or something. This is basically saddle adjustment but on frets. Which is pintless. It allows for awesome microtonal stuff so kudos for that and I love the concept. But it is not the solution to a problem explained.
0record0 I recognized some of those problems on a solid body guitar. Others I didn't. But accoustic is where the tones were bothering me the most. Thank you for the advice. Definitely other things to consider. 👍
+0record0 intonatimg wont perfectly tune every fret
@@0record0 please think about what you just said. Intonating the bridge should fix every issue? What about the fact that the relationship between frets remains the same for all strings despite different strings reacting differently to pressure and stretch?
A mother, watching her son march in a parade, exclaimed very loudly, "MY SON IS THE ONLY ONE MARCHING IN STEP!"
:)
Jess i get your point but frequencies are stable provable non bias elements of the universe.
A mothers pride is not
Js
That's awesome
So I'm not crazy... I hear these imperfections all the time...
Ariel Briceño You are not 😀
Yeah. My bandmates thought there is something wrong with my ears... I got paranoid and not at ease hearing the tune imperfections.. Thanks this is the answer
Philcondo Ventures - you might have perfect pitch?
@@pcfllms I think so. It troubles me everytime. It will make me tune each strings many times.. And eventually one chord got all perfected, but man! All other chords then are awful... So, I keep tuning every string that could perfectly tune all chords to the sound my ears can tolerate the imperfections.
Philcondo Ventures - that’s crazy. I always thought of perfect pitch as something I’d want but it seems it can be quite frustrating, too.
Nice work i ask if its posible.Do you make the slot before glue the fingerboard or after on the guitar arm.
Build the movable frets your self? Thank very interesting especial y for personas that have a fine sensible for tuning
Thanks. For a brochure, send an email to info@microtonalguitar.org
es bueno saber que se puede aspirar a tener una guitarra realmente afinada,su trabajo es asombroso ya que en realidad esos ajustes permiten obtener la afinacion perfecta,,good job !
but the beauty is in imperfection, isn't it
It might be.
Tolgahan Çoğulu
but don't get me wrong
this video and your research is great
and you play guitar cok guzel
Thanks :)
Yes, there's beauty in imperfection. But there's imperfection of all kinds in any music played by people, and the imperfection of being out of tune in a fixed way is not an imperfection that's human, so at least for me it's an imperfection I can do without.
Yes, but not if you pay 10.000 dollars for a guitar...
Something else you dont consider is when you vibrate one string all the other strings vibrate a little too and adjusts the pitch and stability of the desired note. Also the item you use to pluck the string and how hard you do so also effects the pitch of the notes. Which is why people who play rougher sometimes sound out of tune.
Awesome, awesome vids. Excited to see more about microtonal guitars :)
This is the first time I hear a guitar in tune
The Guitar Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle: every tuning exists within an area of uncertainty... that drove me crazy after 40 years of playing the classical repertoire. Anyone know what tuner this brilliant guy uses? Thanks, Hal
Thanks! I use Cleartune.
LOVE Cleartune!
Basically, what's done here is setting the frets to have true temperament. Do a google search for true temperament frets. Many companies are building guitars with them, licensing the system from the original creator. One advantage of having movable frets like Tolgahan's guitar has, is that you can use varying string gauges and just set up the fret shapes accordingly. True temperament frets are fixed and are built with a fixed set of string gauges in mind and they'll have varying tension, so you can't just use 8-9 in the high E and switch to 12-13.
Thanks for your comment.
Okay i have some data!! I play a 25" scale guitar, I tuned at the 7th fret and hit the strings soft, except for the low big string i play that hard and tune it to sound good with hard/heavy picking
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Basically all my strings stayed withing 5 cents of their original tuning from 1st fret to the 12th fret. They all dropped a few cents playing open, and they all raised a few cents when hitting the 12th fret. The pitch changes mostly because of fret wear and high action, the guitar is from 1972 so its expected.
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It would be worth noting that at least on my old guitar, tuning the strings open(no frets hit) or tuning by the harmonics, or even tuning to the 12th fret will yield; unplayable results, chords become dissonant, and the strings tune will vary by 10 cents at the octaves aaahhhhh!!
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I also tried tuning by hitting the strings hard and I found that: some of my strings stayed in Perfect tune no matter how hard i played. A few raised pitch by 5 cents momentarily when played hard but they returned to tune quickly this has to do with years of finding the right strings(boo string makers who combine a saggy B string next to a taunt G string wtf)
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i play with ancient strings they were last changed a few years ago, i like them this way, if one breaks I simply attach it to another tuner and keep the old gold singing, no tin can sounding guitars here
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I play in DADGBe with these strings:
These tensions are for 25.5" scaled guitar, mine is shorter, it has slightly less tension
.010"/.254mm 16.2LBS/7.34Kg
.013"/.3302mm 15.4LBS/6.98Kg
.020"/.508mm 21.0LBS/9.54Kg
.030"/.076mm 27.1LBS/12.29Kg
.040"/1.016mm 27.6LBS/12.51Kg
.062"/1.574mm 28 2LBS/12.79Kg
didn't know I had a smooth tension transition until you asked for info haha, the tension is less than ddadario lights they feel good.
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The strings inner core diameters
e = .010"/.254mm
B = .013"/.3302mm
G = .012"/.254mm
D = .013"/.3302mm
A = .014"/.3556mm
D = .017"/.4318mm
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My string action(space between fret and string): .12"/3.048mm at 12th fret. except the lowest string, lowest string action is at .14"/3.556mm at the 12th fret. The lowest string is higher action so i can have more volume without the buzzing. all the strings are flat (the top of the lowest string is the highest each one below it is slightly lower I just measured, so its like a classical except it has a very slightly curved fretboard(favorable))
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My guitar is a fg230 modified yamaha 12 string (martin d28-12 copy), i only use 6 strings though. it has a nice wide fret board and most say its LOUD and deep.
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Now I got to put away my machinist calipers. You do good work man I've been watching you for years
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Edit: just rechecked the action at the 12th fret, but this time I held down the string at the first fret also. every single string has 0.12" of action( space between string and fret). my saddle is sanded flat and it's just a fret wire saddle now. my guitar pins are just rolled up receipt paper hahaha at one point i made this a 7 string
Thanks a lot for your detailed comment. I really appreciate it. Great information!
The thing is... your guitar should be intonated so that the open strings and the 12th fret are both perfect...
isaac tapia - Excellent measurements. You have well tempered solutions. Not sure if I should fret about my guitar in such depth. Funny thing is that somedays my guitar is in tune with the church piano and in tune with itself - all throughout the service. Other days I will battle with tuning throughout the service. Is it operator error? Humidity? Temperature? An out of tune piano? One or all of the above! This happens with three different guitars - a classical nylon, an acoustic steel and a Fender Stratocaster. When my guitar is out of tune, I sing louder and play quietly. The pianist always wants to be the loudest, anyway! My wife rarely hears my guitar at Mass unless I am soloing without piano.
Dear Tolgahan, this is a very interesting topic, that I am discovering in this period.
I am very fascinated from all this, I want to study and understand more and more.
The point is that I am not satisfied of the tuning I can get on my guitars.
As you show on the video, if I use the tuner I have several notes that are not in tone, and this is frustrating to me.
Moreover, I don't get a point.
In this video you adjust the frets, so to have, using your words, "perfect intonation".
By saying "perfect intonation", you mean that after the adjustment all the notes that you get from the whole fretboard fit with the tuner, that is are the same notes you could get playing a well tuned modern piano keyboard. Am I right?
If my interpretation is correct, at the end of the video you have tuned the guitar so that you comply (without biases) the 12-tone equal-temperament standard.
Actually this first result would be a great success for me.
My concern is to play with other instruments that will be tuned according to the 12-ET standard.
So, I would like to have at least a guitar perfectly tuned according to the 12-ET standard that at the moment, as my tuner and my ears confirm, is not happening.
I would also like to experiment different temperaments and the possibility to use lower intervals, but this would be a second step of my path on the guitar.
If you will answer me I would be very grateful.
Thank you
Massimiliamo
Hi, thank you! Please email info@microtonalguitar.org for our guitars. All best
ok I write you there thank you
The exact tuning makes sound more like a harp than a guitar
Hello, my father is a classical guitar maker and his guitars have detachable fretboards. Is it possible to buy a custom made moveable fret fingerboard like this one you are playing? That would be amazing.
Hi, it could be possible. Let's be in touch at microtonalguitarist@gmail.com
It sounds like an Harp. Beautiful.
I think sound already exists and musicians can't do anything to improve it. What is "in tune" for me is making whatever sounds I want to with whatever is available at the time.
That's why we play steel, and we bend 'em! (your tuning sounds fantastic! - probably better than any guitar I've ever heard)
Electric guitars have better tuning, but it’s still not perfect, due to the uneven fret heights and uneven nut&bridge height. Whenever you press down the string, it creates different angles on the bridge side, this can cause imperfect pitch depending on the materials of the string. Mathematically this can never be solved, because the fret distances on the fretboard are always mathematically perfect, while the angle created by the bridge varies from fret to fret. Electric guitars can adjust intonation easily, true temperament frets also makes it better. But the only perfect solution is adjustable frets: to create your customized true temperament frets.
however I don’t think an instrument has to be perfectly in tune.. Equal temperament is invented by human, not natural. Human ear can still accept imperfect harmony as “consonant”. Violins and vocal are never perfectly in tune.
Zero Chan I agree with you, thanks.
This guy sounds Vito from the godfather, it's unsettling yet makes me want to listen even more.
I think it's good to remember that the 12 tone equal temperament is also a compromise. So I think the real question is, does the guitar have to be in perfect 12 tone equal temperament? Sure, I would say there is a problem if the fretted notes are way off. But I don't think that's the case - they are "close enough".
We also need to remember that a lot of pieces weren't even originally meant to be played in 12 tone equal temperament. So I don't think obsessing over perfect 12 tone equal temperament makes that much sense.
I do think it's a cool concept, though, and it could be used for different kinds of tunings. BTW, how do bends work on these frets?
Thanks! Have you watched the Bach experiment: th-cam.com/video/kyQaSFgnVI8/w-d-xo.html
Bending doesn't work.
I've seen guitars with compensated saddles and nuts that appeared to be in perfect tune across the board - never tested one personally, but would love to hear a comparison
Yes, I'd like to see the tunings of individual frets.
The closest thing is the Evertune bridge, which mechanically adjusts string tension to the nearest note as you're playing.
Do you think Evertune bridge can solve all frets' accuracy?
Gabriel- the Evertune bridge is a clever idea, but it solves a different problem, that of strings changing tension and getting out of tune because of stretching. It has no effect on whatever your frets are tuned to.
Its called intonation
It's not out of tune, it's just lofi vibes
Would be nice to hear what open chords sound like on that
$10,000+ guitar. Just to see what the level of dischordency is.
Hi and thank you for your work! I have a question. Shouldent the nut ( and saddle?) be changeable for the induvididual strings aswell for the open chords and such? Best regards / J
Hi, if you have movable frets, you don't need to adjust them.
@@microtonalguitar thanks for your answer, suddenly it makes total sense😄
Why do you think lacote did compensate the nut on his Enharmonique guitar? 😅
Estetics? Thanks again 🙂🙂
@@JDRehn-ve2kd It is a good idea I think. Don't you think so?
I really liked the song you played while you were tuning the guitar. Do you have a link to a longer version of that song?
The third movement here: th-cam.com/video/p9z7qc4vGhQ/w-d-xo.html
Having just started learning guitar, I was trouble when tuning to an Android app. The strings when played open did not sound right or pleasing to the ear. I thought I must be doing something wrong. Or am I?
Not to muddy the water further but upon listening to many professional musicians during their solos I have often thought they were not intune with the orchestra. I thought my ear must be wrong. So which is it?
Because of the imperfection of 12 tone equal temperament, I think all great musicians find their own way of tuning.
So what temperament do you use and what concert pitch?
I greatly admire the work you have done pursuing this ideal intonation solution. Your critics seem to be entirely missing the points you are making. We expect to fine tune every note of a piano, so why not also a guitar? Far too many excuses about just accepting imperfections, why not try to improve? Now, where can i get a Brahms guitar 8-string with such a fingerboard?
Kurt Penner Thanks a lot! I’ll get back to your email.
Great ! I have a Roriguez and Sons Classical and a Yamaha SLG200N silent guitar. Neither of them sound in tune to me at the high end of the fret board.
Fanned frets on my Brahms Guitar does not completely fix this issue but offers a huge improvement.
If the fretboard has grooves to adjust frets, wouldnt you feel that when playing?
Good question, thanks. You don't feel them luckily.
Just wondering: on the adjustable microtonal guitar, when you move the fret, what is the minimal distance between each microtone? 5 cents, 10 cents, more?
If your finger fits in, it is somewhere between 4-7 cents.
Ok. Thanks for the reply. By the way, your arrangement for Gamelan was amazing.
I have to admit you are on to something good here. Even on electric guitar , adding compensated nut will not fix the problem.
I agree. Thanks!
Where can we get it? I need one guitar like the one you have.
Webpage is www.microtonalguitar.org
I appreciate the effort of adjustibg those frets but then how will i bend the strings?
oh my god I thought I was watching "All stars but all guitars are out of tune but one" and was wondering where is the All Stars part.
I guess I already watched too much today.
:)
When I record music and some part sounds slightly out of tune, I re-tune the guitar to have better intonation on the frets used in that part. Then I tune back to normal for the rest of the song.
I took Sitar lessons when working in India for 4 months. I bought the instrument with my Sitar master and was amazed at the tuning of the frets. 1. Amazed that the concept existed 2. Amazed that he did that by ear. 3. Amazed how off the manufacture was in the instruments factory setup. There might be a chance that South Indian Sitar is different and mine was setup for North Indian, or maybe not. Anyways, being a guitarist first, your video was fascinating. I wonder if there’s a word and measurement for the variance of accuracy from open to fretted octave like you showed at the beginning. Assuming there are some instruments with more and less variance, like your $10K guitar compared to Yamaha plywood guitar, that measurement would be great when guitar shopping. Maybe a $1000 guitar has 4 hertz variance and a $2000 guitar has more volume or bass or mids but has a 9 hertz variance. Your guitar is where it’s at, just like my sitar. Great video.
*Intonation* cannot be reliably rated or bought out of the box. It's reasonable to expect to pay for a professional set up or do it yourself. Choice of string gauge & material makes a difference. Nylon or wound strings tend to require less adjustment than steel because they have lower tension & lower stiffness. String height height at both nut & bridge can be adjusted. The amount of bowing in the neck can be adjusted on guitars that have a truss rod. Individual string length & height can sometimes be adjusted, lower usually being better. Electric guitars often have bridges specially designed for such adjustments, because they *need* greater adjustment (unwound steel G string in particular). A perfectly intonated guitar will not stay intonated; at minimum heat & humidity cause shrinkage or expansion of the wood, particularly the neck. A well built $200 electric or classical might be intonated far better than a particular multiK$ steel string ever could be. But that multiK$ guitar may be intonated in the keys you play (where you play on the neck matters) & have tone that just can't be matched by anything else.
Every great work of art has a flaw...
Part of what makes a great guitarist is the ability to overcome and adapt to this ever occurring event. If fact for certain songs I detune certain strings just 3-5 cents. For that unique flavor. I also believe you should know your instrument , if you play the same guitar a lot. You’ll find those bad areas and be ready to push a little harder or ease off a bit. To hit that sweet spot.
😎🎸🎶🙏🌎🌏🌍✌️
I play mostly tonal music. If, say, I'm playing mostly in the key of C, I make sure all of my Cs are in tune because I want all my octaves to be in tune. Thirds and sixths are a problem, but I'd rather hear a questionable third than an out of tune octave.
Ben Cur but still don’t you have some octave issues when strings get older?
What is the software you are using to measure the pitch?
I want fretboard like this. Where i can for buy???
@0:40
Here we go.
Fret 1, up tuned,
Fret 2, up tuned,
Fret 3, up tuned,
Fret 12, half a semitone up...
Really, I got used to this shit, but it always happened.
My guitar is slighty sharp when i press. I try to work it out with capo and cottonbutt, it perfectly tune until like 5 frets but in higher frets it out of tune again :/
It is because acoustic guitars have fixed bridge, we cannot adjust the distance between bridge and nut. You dont need to slice down the every fret. Just make a segmental bridge.
Does it really matter given that the thirds of 12tet are really out of tune?
I have 1 thing to ask, what happen if we "zig-zag-ing" the fret like that and play some piece that there is quite many "barre" position? For example prelude BWV 1006 (as far as I know). Is that kind of fret still feel natural like a standard fret? Thank You
I would like to have seen you do the same test after you had adjusted your microtonal frets
I’ve actually tried this on all my guitars and I’ve noticed this too!
Ryan Surace Glad to hear this.
Preach it, brother! The next step is to get rid of the frets altogether and play harp, like I do!
Great work again, Tolgahan. Cheers from cool Vienna, Scott
btw- do you sell moveable fret fingerboards? I'm thinking about making a 12-string lap guitar that I would play polymetrically, with both hands plucking and fingering. I'd only need an octave, with a normal guitar mensur (say 65cm or so). Thanks. I hope the election goes well for you.
Thanks Scott. Let's keep in touch through tolgahanus@yahoo.com about the fretboards. Cheers
The violin is a great instrument, but if I took it up, I wouldn't have enough time for harp.
How much cost this microtonal guitar? Where can I get it?
Amazing...! I hope you have as many patents in as many countries as posible.
3:12 👌
well, the thing about 12 Tet, Just intonation, and a guitar is that means some chords with an off note will sound more pleasant than with a spot on note because of the way the intervals work. a 5/4 interval in E major, would need to have a added 15.3 cents onto the higher note, or subtract 15.3 cents from the lower. if the notes are slightly off, they'll sound more pleasant to the ear. yes, this guitar is nice, i would buy one personally because i think it is a good idea and is a great way to set an example for TUNE YOUR FUCKING GUITAR PEOPLE, because it means it will be 100% spot on with the notes.
I don’t know what you’re talking about, but somehow I believe you. You sound like you know you’re good at what you do.
what material about the adjustable fretboard？tough plastic?
Where I can find that guitar? I NEED ONE
Fausto Hernandez Please email me at microtonalguitarist@gmail.com
How to buy this type of fretboard?
Does this mean we are playing un out of tuned guitar? Please search for andrew foy and listen to his covers, it's ok to play the orginal(should i say out of tuned guitar), right?
dude is on stage in the middle of a live performance 2:29 'excuse me fans while i tune my guitar for the next song, this might take anywhere between a few hours to a few days, if you like you can go get some dinner or catch a movie or something & i'll send a group text when i'm ready to continue the show, soz for the inconvenience but i'm rather epically doosh about my guitar tuning' :)
I wonder why tunner always showed diff reading of same note of open chord on other string
The micro tone missing got it
hum zaad Video’s goal achieved 👍🏻
I actually did an academic study of this for school (guitar in general)
Tl;dr basically all "regular" guitars are not completely in tune
Longer version
The "just intonation" we use on the guitars doesn't really work all that well (or it was equal temperament...) either way, the placement of the frets is not up to par with the notes. This is why we have the true temperament frets, which is just like your acoustic, but instead it's glued on with the "squiggly" frets. We also have the earvana nut which helps a litte bit. But ofc all this will wear down in time..
Thanks for your comment.
I understand the point of this guitar but the look of thise frets is more unaesthetic to me then the sound of slightly out of tune frets by a long shot.
I am not professional mucisian, but my and other guitars never satisfied me with tunings. There is always sense, that something wrong with it.
Single and straight frets are guilty :)
exactly :-)
@@microtonalguitar Regarding string bending..is it a %100 percent or can they bend a little?
@@paltieri11 You can bend a little.
@@microtonalguitar thanks so much for responding. Would be nice a short video to show the range. I can see some guitar players shying away if this is not clear. Also how is your guitar avaiable for people to purchase from any luthier you recommend?..thanks and keep the good work!
It is legitimate to invest efforts into creating a perfectly consonant guitar or composition. But if two C notes played together are "out of tune", it is not automatically a bad thing as some seem to assume. There are infinite possibilities how much the two notes can differ. These are like colors for a painter. Does a painter always use the pure colors only? Do we want to eliminate infinite possibilities for the sake of a single "in-tune" possibility? We learned to appreciate dissonance, I think some day we can appreciate "out of tune" in a similar way. So I just want to remind the artists out there, "explore the space" :)
I agree! Thanks.
Ao you're saying the standard guitar is out of tune because it needs new strings? Any fixed bridge guitar needs the correct set of strings or intonation will be off, that's not a problem with fret design...
Watch the video carefully.
If you have a staggered 12th fret it just shows you have some unevenly stretched strings. If the 12th fret and the harmonic at the 12th are not the same ... change the string.
Or you have a string of the wrong guage or wrong material to play in tune at that fret. Fixed frets will never give you the control over intonation and the flexibility in tuning and string choice that moveable frets will.
Does the adjustable fretboard allow for string bending? I would expect that it is rather limited in that regard.
gregvalou You are right, bending is not possible which is fine for classical guitars.
With equal temperament tuning most notes are out of tune anyways so it’s not a huge deal if your frets are a couple cents sharp or flat
Are flexible frets viable? What about a metal fingerboard(that the right term?)? I’d love a microtonal guitar, but I NEED my bends(blues).
If you want an adjustable microtonal fretboard, please email me at microtonalguitarist@gmail.com
wait, which guitar is in tune now?
And what about faned frets guitars
Does not fix that problem too?
Nahuel Farina It is a good solution but still not perfect.
ENG: Can you bend with adjustable fretts though? Of course one or maybe two semitones are possible but how about more?
TÜR: Ayarlanabilir perdelerle tel bükebiliyor muyuz? "BENDING"
You can't bend. On the classical guitar it is not a problem because we don't bend.
Don't know about the "best solution". But definitely A solution.
Glad to hear that!
Don't forget the warning voiced by a "replier" below, "micro frets are optimised for a particular tuning (E standard) with particular string gauges"
Make sure you catch the last warning he gives.
What about stretch tunings? On a piano two strings in perfect octaves will sound out of tune due to the overtones. Don't all vibrating strings fall from perfection in this way? Piano octaves are tuned so that they are 4-5 beats out of tune so the overtones of the string stay in tune. There still a compromise with any kind of vibrating strings. If your notes are perfect half steps then the octaves will sound out of tune when played simultaneously.
I think I understand what you mean but on this guitar the octaves were better than the standard guitar frets. I wonder why.
Does this applies to electric guitars even with distortion
Jesse 7797 Yes, it is.
Microtonal Guitar - Tolgahan Çoğulu ok
Would tuning to a different frequency change a guitar with adjusted frets? Say you adjust frets for 440hz tuning, then tune to 528hz, will it still be in tune?
Gromm- that's not entirely true. The higher you tune strings, the relatively less they go up in pitch when fretted. This is because they stretch when pressed down to the frets, and stretching a certain amount affects the pitch of a higher tensioned string less than a lower tensioned string. But in practice, the small difference between, say, A=440 and A=444 (that's about C=528) would probably not be enough to notice.
cheers from an instrumentmaker in Vienna, Scott
I'm primarily a bowmaker, but I also build many historical instruments, especially medieval harps, lyres, fiddles, and such. I also play weird polymetric music on harps and lyres. If you're interested, here's a sample: soundcloud.com/scott-wallace-189088488/truckin
Are you a musician too? cheers, Scott
Thanks guys. Good thing I like low action.
your saying I've been playing my guitar out of tune... the entire time.....
Does it matter if the frets are less than a quarter tone detuned if it still sounds good bro?
Also sounds like youre just trying to sell us something expensive that nobody has ever needed for any string instrument since the instruments birth
I am not trying to sell something. I am just doing an academic research and stating a fact about the imperfect nature of the guitars.
Tolgahan Çoğulu nobody is going to hire you if your field of work is complaining about something that doesnt need improving, the guitar.
I think you need to watch this: th-cam.com/video/CDr6refSgg0/w-d-xo.html
Movable-fretted guitars, in addition to the solution of semitone tunings, open you a new world. That's why the guitar needs to be improved forever.
Tolgahan Çoğulu it just adds unnecessary cost, unreliability and complexity for the instrument.
This neck is more expensive and complex to make, takes an hour to tune and falls out of tune quickly when the fitment on the frets wears out, meaning you need to service/replace the neck.
At the point when someone who has played guitar/bass professionally for 40+ years tells me that semitune isnt good enough anymore I will believe you. But so far all im seeing is a bad concept with a onesided presentation, you only focus on the few pros this system has and none of the cons.
Thats one perfect guitar
Reyiz yeminle büyük bir gitar firmam olsa direk bu fikri alırdım. Zaten çoook uzun yıllardır endüstride bir gelişme yok. Bu çok dikkat çeker ve rağbet görürdü.
Thank you for this......
Cheers. Try this one: th-cam.com/video/CDr6refSgg0/w-d-xo.html
How do you bend on a microtonal guitar?
You can't.
This is the trouble with every instrument that's scaled like in the middle-ages. Physically considered the scales are wrong. The solution isn't a well tempered instrument but working with those dissonances, because we are used to it and have the "Must" or the freedom to form a tone. This is what makes a good musician.
How do you play the blues with this? You can't bend any notes
jim mayors We don’t bend on classical guitars
id rather know how you played that music thats in the backround 😬 it sounds so interesting .
Here it is: th-cam.com/video/p9z7qc4vGhQ/w-d-xo.html
On this amazing guitar don’t you have to constantly adjust the adjustable frets plus the strings or do the frets stay put pretty much I wonder.Limited knowledge of this type of setup I will admit. Interesting though.
This video might answer your point: th-cam.com/video/MYK_PF9WTRE/w-d-xo.html
My Ibanez AS53 costs $400 and it’s 100% accurate on all frets. Pretty insane tuning stability as well, I can leave it without playing for half a year and except G all strings stay in tune insane
Cap
If music is all about the experimentation with sound, then you will definitely get some experimental sounds out of a traditional guitar. Take Jimi Hendrix for example. Most of his sounds came from technique. The guitar only facilitated in amplifying the technique. But without his Fender Stratocaster, he would just be another guitar player. It doesn't matter how much you spend on a guitar. Price does not always ensure quality. When you are buying a guitar, it should be treated like auditioning a new band member. Picking one up off the shelf that meets your price range, isn't always the best policy. And there are a lot of factors that go into the overall tuning of a string. For example, the roller bearing design on the nut of my Fender Stratocaster pretty much ensures true flexibility of the string. Eliminating string pressure issues. Plus, I can bend the string four and a half steps. And it comes right back to tune.
Real Person I agree with you. I just made a research video about the imperfect nature of guitars.
I'm like morty when he experienced true levelness for the first time. LAMB TO THE COSMIC SLAUGHTER AHHHHHHHHHHHH
Is the phone app tuner very accurate?
KillSwitchNY Yes. Try it. It is clear tune.
If you need to use a guitar tuner to know that some notes on each string might be just slightly sharp or just slightly flat then the difference is not even perceivable to your ears so I think it will be ok.
Canaan usually true, aside from the G string. Fuck that string, anyone can hear how bad that sounds on regular guitars