ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ก.ย. 2012
- Robert Neuwirth spent four years among the chaotic stalls of street markets, talking to pushcart hawkers and gray marketers, to study the remarkable "System D," the world's unlicensed economic network. Responsible for some 1.8 billion jobs, it's an economy of underappreciated power and scope.
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All I am saying (as my opinion) is that future is in inclusive economy/culture. From family to tribe to nation to the whole world. As we take unconditional care of our own bodies and children and help them grow, we should do (and will) with the whole world. Not for money but because we can, with ease. Distributed and automated informational, energy and production technologies will help us immensely in that.
Thank you for taking part in this discourse.
What exactly does he mean by "This is the pickle economy" (min 3:28)
What kind of economy is he referring to?
This guy is amazing, I love his lecture.
Thank you for being open to new ideas! I'm glad to run into someone who doesn't start a flame war when their beliefs are challenged. For the record, I'm certain that we can reach the global community that you envision. I just see us getting there through technological advancement brought about by market solutions rather than central planning. TVP has the same end goal as anarcho-capitalists. Different paths with the same destination in mind. We'll just have to wait and see which works better!
You, gentlemen, dispite disagreeing, have put up an excellent exchange of ideas.
I am glad if you liked it and found it even a bit thought provoking.
This is Awesome
I didn't understand the example of Siemens. Can someone please explain it to me?
great talk
Who is here from 9y
English teacher sent me here :')
skylar blusterx my geography teacher sent me here 😂
My geography teacher also sent me here 😂
He looks like Quark from Star Trek. i cant unsee it!
'System D' does *not* best translate as 'self-reliance!' It's when you have no choice but to go around the system, as a last resort when you are basically desperate. Very convenient as the authorities can choose to turn a blind eye, but if they want to, they can penalise you because you broke the law. Even though you most likely did so to survive.
If only these TEDTALKS ideas ACTUALLY were implemented in today's world. This world would be a better place. I would even consider bringing a son or daughter into it, but right now, I would not dare do this at this time.
I appreciate Your thoughts.
Do you think that human being is free from causality of environment and its own bodily physiology?
the power of the free market continues to amaze me, I hate to say it but we could really learn something from these countries
An advice: See a documentary called 'Welcome to Lagos'. It's fantastic.
I'm distracted by the suit he clearly stole from the Joker.
Impresionante como grandes empresas aprovechan de la economía informal o_O!
Indeed!
I do see your point, but his outfit didn't distract me at all. In fact, I didn't really notice it until I read SnerdWilliams' comment. Maybe I don't pay attention to details.I just found out that he wore a similar outfit for his PopTech talk. He's trolling us. Lol
His book seems very controversial...think I need to read it.
The real deal is just in the NAME on the product not the quality. Pleather hand bags don't have the same quality of Leather hand bags. But they are cheaper to make, its also a great opportunity to gain more customers and broaden your brand.
Reminds me of the 'cash for gold' episode of southpark.
If you pay attention he states that the shoe company considers people who buy their pirated shoes are not considered part of their market segment. People who want name brand will actually pay for it. Music piracy may be different, but as far as the shoe companies go. people who want THEIR shoes are not buying cheap knock-offs.
Would you mind rephrasing your first sentence? I am understanding it as superfluous. And please tell me what is your conclusion (in plain English) based on that strong evidence.
1) I've worked as cash paid construction labor in the past and I made $10/hr. If I had been hired "on the books" my labor would have cost about $25/hr (including the cost of mandated insurance, social security, payroll tax, etc) and I would get about $8/hr after paying personal income tax. 2) The only difference between the formal and informal economies is that in the informal economy there is no third party setting rules for peaceful exchange. Have you never bought something from a flea market?
Can moral code (BS crutch for insane people, IMO), on its own, sufficiently influence behavior of such organisms without arbitrary, sporadic, frequently very violent application of force?
Is it just me or did he choose his tie color to match his lips??
didn't this guy play the warlock in Game of Thrones ?
good
Certainly not, and I look forward to seeing where you are going with this...
Suit suits the Talk.
Would you like to be a part of informal economy (flea market peddling, if you ever saw or been a part of one) as a mean of survival?
Exactly
If you pay attention he states that the shoe company does not consider people who buy pirated shoes part of their market. those who want a certain brand of shoe will actually pay for the real deal. For example, I have $100 and need new shoes. If I really wanted Nike brand shoes I would spend my money on Nike. The fact that I don't and I choose to spend my money on a knock-off does not mean that Nike lost money. I wasn't their customer in the first place. Millions of dollars are NOT being lost.
Hello person 6 years ago. I basically agree with this, although customer is literally someone who buys off of you so of course someone who doesn't buy off of you is not a customer. But I get what you mean. A true fan/customer would buy the real deal, a mediocre fan, or a non customer would not. However, they lose potential customers if the customers could buy their product but choose not to. This can be seen in pirated movies. A fan might not necessarily buy a movie ticket even though they could. So, it's not an absolute lost but it's not effectless either
This guy sounds like Saul Goodman from Breaking Bad. Close your eyes!
Ever heard of Underwriter Laboratories (electronics safety)? How about CCOF (organic foods trade organization)? Or Fair Trade International (wage and working condition certification)? Any of the thousands of private security firms available? Maybe judge.me (small claims arbitration)? Private organizations can provide all of the services a state can. The big difference is that with a state, you have to pay for services regardless of whether you need them or not.
Jokely's Sunglasses and Jokex Watches are the future economy.
silk marketplace
There is strong evidence that the arbiter is almost always a competitor attempting to stifle competition. This is well documented by the new left historian Gabriel Kolko in his book "The Triumph of Conservatism." Others such as Rothbard, DiLorenzo, and Mises have done some very important work in proving the above assertion. It is hard to understand this point with so many conservatives referring to corporatism/fascism as capitalism.
wth is alternate currency?
Just out of curiosity, what do you do with people that makes you such an astute judge of character? Disregard my opinion of him and others who may or may not present themselves visually to the liking of potential employers.
You clearly have sight, or you wouldn't have mentioned his appearance. What would a client who is visually impaired do if he/she couldn't see his visual presentation?
That's not the point of 0:15.
maybe
This guy for President!
Why the yellow shirt and the purple tie...?
as I said, even if I did I would not even consider it, no need to worry
Funny that he thinks that the 'unregulated' market isn't the free market, when it's really the truest example of an actual free market.
Free-Dom comes with responsibilities that, if not enforced, can create problems! An absolute free economy, unregulated, undocumented has potential for chaos and abuse.
I wouldn't let anyone knock off my products. In addition I would make an inexpensive version and sale them where knock off's are sold. Truth is No one wants to buy a knock off, its just that they can't afford the real deal. So....take those profits that are being stolen from your ideas. Give them the real deal by putting your name on it.
Not really. Taking something that is copyrighted and giving away is stealing. fishing a fish. and then making it ready to eat and then sell it without paying tax is not stealing.
The point is that NONE of the commerce he studied is counted toward the numbers that governments use for central planning. What's so great about the formal economy that states should be pointing guns at people to force a list of rules on them? As far as the state is concerned, if you aren't producing tax revenue then you're not producing value. How many people were irreparably harmed by having their shop closed (2:50 minutes)? Be happy that they're peddling "shit" rather than starving to death.
TVP huh? How much do you know about food production? The reason we have mono-crops blanketing the land right now is mechanization of the food production system.... " 99% of people would not be able to afford them." Even in Somalia there is private arbitration available to those who want it. Many times free of charge. They also have the best telecom system in Africa, the most improved death rate when compared to neighboring (state run) regions and the most improved economic conditions as well.
Why does he look like the sorcerer from the game of thrones that Daeny's dragons kill?
this guy looks like a frail bond villain
Warlock*
Isn't he talking about free enterprise?
People who work in the informal economy do so because they cannot access the formal one. Workers in the informal economy have no legal protection. They make no contributions to social security and pay no taxes. How can these workers save for their retirement, deal with unfair dismissal, fund their maternity leave and sick pay, receive assistance after workplace injury? How can they combat workplace discrimination and exploitation? With no taxation how can governments build and maintain infrastructure, fund schools, hospitals, protect the environment?
The final point made in this video is worrying. The speaker tries to justify bribery because it is pervasive across both informal and formal economies. This is the fallacious argument called argumentum ad populum - the appeal to the majority - that is, it is right because everyone else is doing it. The problem with bribery is that any legal protection to workers, children, women, the environment can easily be undermined by bribing an official not to enforce those laws. Any advancement to achieve Sustainable Development in particularly Decent Work can be impeded b bribery - this means our ability to solve global problems is undermined.
This talk also appears to suggest that there are just two black and white choices for people in developing countries: informal work or poverty. This is another fallacious argument this time called the false dilemma. It was an argument used in support of child labour inthe US a hundred years ago (see www.ft.com/content/95569d5e-1b39-11db-b164-0000779e2340)
For a more balanced and realistic video account of the informal economy please watch: th-cam.com/video/oj-8huJKxzo/w-d-xo.html
Thank you very much for this comment. Excuse my ad hominem attack, but this presentation is as shady as the guy looks.
@@emmanueloluga9770 How about this just cut taxes following the the laffer curve instead of killing them through taxes/red tape stop trying to force the world to conform to your bad economic standards.
@@peromiestiloesunico Jokes on you for not even knowing WTH I'm talking about, and deciding to jump to conclusions with such an irrelevant reply. Im African, and this guy IS truly out of his depth here and in his other endeavors.
OP is right in all 3 paragraphs. The first and second being the govts of these developing countries don't even recognize the informal economy, heck they usually barely recognize the formal one lol due to blatant and rampant corruption. Thus all this silly tax talk is irrelevant in the meantime anyway.
The third paragraph is the most important because it reveals a mechanism used by many westerners (the easterners are seldom as guilty of this) to undermine the legitimacy and value of the workforce in developing countries. Libertarians are most guilty of this fallacy of justifying the options available to the labourforce in developing countries as limited to either informal economics activities or poverty.
So please, don't discuss on matters outside your depth such as invoking a tax argument thats not relevant and accusing me of imposing a system of which I have no idea what you are referring.
@@emmanueloluga9770 Hey i am from Latam we suffer the same problems nice so at leas I'm not talking with a naive first world person.
Do you know what a laffer curve is?
Look "OP" is wrong he even adds the global problems and matters of education/health in to the mix, responsibilities the government should have never taken.
Would you recognize informal labor?
Recognizing informal labor would imply you as the government failed to spot the needs of your people if they have to use the informal sector instead of the regular economy there is something wrong in the laws, the taxes, the certifications, the education and health departments of your government.
Taxes are a very relevant because last time i cheeked the government is the one collecting tax revenue and the one dictating tax policy.
I'm not a lolbertarian but usually the point is that when it comies in the west try to add more taxes/regulations many economists say that would lead to massive black/informal markets like in for example Guatemala where informality in non Agricultural labor is 70% and regulations and taxes can took years for anyone to start a bussines.
If people really hated bribery/corruption they would nullify the regulations so the government won't extort force over them sometimes companies lobby the government to add regulations but governments have the final say on the matters.
Limiting the economy into informal/formal happens because a lot of people think of the economy as ship/car with engines parts and thing that the government can regulate to improve it so forgive them for having such a bad assessment on the economy in general.
So you want a total free market with no regulations whatsoever? I'm accusing you of being a commie but why this assumption over your person is wrong?
@@peromiestiloesunico ok I stand corrected then, and forgive my earlier Faux pas and banter. You do also have a nuanced understanding of the situation. One thing we agree upon the the responsibility of the govt to their nations especially in Africa. I don't know however if we agree on all the factors that play into the overall dynamics of each country in the continent. I'm Nigerian, so I would only understanding the affairs of my country and neighboring countries the most.
U think discussions about economic systems in African countries are impotent in the immediate effects of such discussions, because the people themselves are still in requirement of a paradigm shift both from the govt and private sectors
I do visit flea markets and I fail to find anything to be admired about people's condition there. Those people, as human beings, deserve better and beyond corrupt state vs free markets empty talk. "Peaceful exchange" lasts only as long as sums are sufficiently low. Beyond that comes conflict and that's world's history. How to preserve "free markets" without arbiter who will keep them free? Contradiction.
We have resources to create unconditional well-being of all world's people.
A comment, that gives you a button, that puts you instantly at the start of the video.
(faster and simpler than any other way)
I think that those who are raised violently (spanking, yelling, menacing/etc. by their parents) are more likely to respond only to violent control. Those who are raised peacefully, and those who are raised with violence, are almost a different species in my opinion (and there is much scientific evidence to support that assertion).
Has Pyat Pree drunk Shade of the Evening again?
yeah exactly. I think bitcoin will be the main currency for the informal economy.
Please elaborate.
0:15
I prefer Seth with glasses, that's all I'm sayin
I asked you for your view/opinion.. but never mind.
99% of customers of ANY business (especially complex such as pharma) have almost no information on inner workings and subtle qualities of products. They (We) are literally small children compared to them. I do need (as well as you) someone to protect my interests from other people desperately trying to profit at all costs. Or do you know everything about medicine, food, anatomy, electricity and all the rest?
Village anarchism cannot be a model for modern, high-tech world economy.
This talk is another proof we need Bitcoin so much.
hello person 5 years ago. I think he meant they could use currencies that could be adapted for trade and not necessarily limited to numbers. Bitcoin is basically regular money but more convenient
Rather than rephrasing the first sentence of my comment, I'll quote Nobel Laureate George Stigler, who of course says it better: "As a rule, regulation is acquired by the industry and is designed and operated primarily for its benefit." I'd love to elaborate, but TH-cam is not the correct forum, due to the small number of chars available in comments. That is why I cited a very important work, as well as some additional authors that cover the topic, in my original comment.
So you have no issues with the use of force by a third party? If I want to sell you something and you want to buy it then we should be able to make an agreement between us. No third party can morally interfere in that transaction. I recommend that you read up on the anarcho-capitalist position before attempting to critique it... A good place to start is the free ebook "Practical Anarchy". It answers your question about arbitration. There is no reason for arbitration to be funded by coersion.
SALIVA!
Lol... It's pretty cool, actually.
OK: My opinion is that society is better off with free markets. I believe that govt. regulation is effectively a cartelization mechanism, which stifles competition, and in fact destroys free markets. I'm expressing this opinion in response to your statement: "How to preserve "free markets" without arbiter who will keep them free?" Thus far, the arbiter always turns out to be a single point of failure.
Great presentation, But why dress like Lex Luthor?
is not black market, is the African market.
money is just a big game of make-believe.
"Black markets" are the governments competition.They don't like that much.
You'll never get a chance to hire him. Don't worry.
"in the uk OR in europe” ..?? the uk is IN europe w h a t
not anymore
Andres Karam it’s still in europe just not the eu wdym
@@opheliawkjbfkjb638 they usually refer to europe as the EU
isn't the title just another way to say capitalism ? unregulated, people making decisions for themselves based on their self interest ?
black economy sure would be a the nice way for third world developement if it didn't leave the door open to racket and corruption. If nothing is consigned and nothing can be proven, there is less trust between economical actors and big buisiness is impossible.
He obviuoslly tried his best to be unorthodox. IMO, if you are going to wear a suit like that, you may just go with a shirt. It is distracting, after all.
10:52 ..giant semen...
i make my living through entrepreneurship and hard work. I value everything he said and appreciate it but I could never work with him is my point, no offense really, but promote my product looking like that, no way, come again.
go africa!
That's a whole lot of propaganda.
making poverty work for business
knowledge of business... street markets... potential aside, I would never in my life hire someone who dresses like this guy unless I really need somebody to go out and by 'fake designer glasses, cloned cologne, pirated DVD's etc.' In that case he'd by my man, to the fullest.
this is AWFUL!!!! the message is. now we can get richer by selling stuff to the poor!!!!
surely, but the process of selling the stuff affects all stakeholders (workers, they families, production cycle) and therefore improves standards of living/increases gdp. Other than that it is usual that informal economy provides job for the ones that would be excluded from job market.
You don't want to sell things to the poor?
The Office is an awesome show :D