Update- A few days short of 1 year later, two of the nails fell off as the bondic glue gave up. It was an easy fix, however I used a two part epoxy this time. They will never come off again.
Makes sense. UV cure adhesive is tricky to cure where no light can reach it. If the sleeves were also transparent plastic you could probably make it work.
I think it would be somewhat simpler, and less power consuming, if the nail gets caught by a ramp (nose shaped hooking ramp). And the magnet pulls the "hooking-ramp" back so the nail can snap back into off-position. If the ramp is not too steep on the lockingside, you can still disable the switch manually. That way you do not need to have the magnets activated all the time, to keep the switch in position! I assume the original switches work in a similar fashion, instead of having an active magent consuming power all time while in on-position?!
I have a suggestion. Suppose you use permanent magnets to hold the switches in the on position, but *counteract* them with electromagnetic windings when you want them to disengage. This would greatly reduce the current draw of the setup as well as eliminate the need for cooling. Instead of applying constant current to keep the switches engaged, you'd only need a short pulse to disengage them.
If that's the case, you don't need permanent magnets, just some self-lock switch + a disengage elecmag. IRL jets use holding mechanism to make sure it'll always jump back to OFF as soon as the power was lost, but I have seen some low-end sim hardware for 737 use switches as what your suggestion is, my guess that type of switch is cheap anyway.
For this use, permanent magnets are not a bad idea. But for anyone thinking about using this for other purposes, you need to consider the failure mode. This has a "fail-safe" mode, in that when power is lost, it returns to its off position. Using permanent magnets would create a "fail-secure" mode, which means the switches would remain on even in the event of a power failure, which may cause issues if something needs to be off when the power is first turned restored.
Might be easier to take apart a cheap china linear solenoid. Many of them are push pulls so if you swap out the mosfet for a motor controller chip, you could flick the switch on and off. Though not sure how much force you need to pull a switch though, 15 newtons dosn't seem enough and the cheap ones don't have a pull more than 10mm
You could still make it secure by adding a switch that opens when power is lost, a capacitor would be enough to reset the manual switch. It's arguable if it's more complex since you get rid off the fan.
Wow. The WAF (wife acceptance factor) of your hobby is nearing zero. You are my hero, great stuff as usual. Makes my pathetic sim-racing cockpit look pretty sad (I still love it even if my wife doesn't)
I do not have anything built yet. I just live vicariously through others and wonder what sort of face my wife will make if I buy the warthog hotas and throttle.
@@WarrenPostma In my experience, and not knowing your wife, I'd say at first she would look skeptical with a hint of disapproval but also some resignation like she's thinking "boys will be boys". Once she learn what they cost, indignation and disbelief that you will waste so much money on kids toys. When you tell her this is just a very small fraction of the cost of the cockpit you are going to build, it's going to be the sofa for a week at least. Oh and if you try to hide the cost... Lets just say it's probably better she knows from the beginning rather than finding out the reason your kids university funds seems to have gone AWOL is because of your toys in the basement...
oh no.... I was running out of inspiration in sim racing as I've gone as far as i've been able to find online re: DIY electronic tinkerers. Your complexity just blew that away haha looking forward to this rabbit hole
Why that sounds like: Oh no, I thought I had done everything that can be done with my sim setup, now I have to reconsider everything... anyway, back to tinkering. To me?
Worth adding - a lot of the cheap mosfet boards don't have a back emf protection diode (should be one inside the mosfet but easy to blow out) - inductive loads like that magnet could have an appreciable pulse that the mosfets won't like.
OH, shit, I completely forgot about that part. This is actually a massive thing for this video yeah. For TWP: any transistor connected to an inductive load, like a motor, electromagnet, straight up inductor etc, will HAVE to have a diode connected to the source and drain pins, because inductors will store current during charge, then release all of that when the charge stops (electromagnet turns off, in this case), and that current will likely be going straight back to the mosfet as there's nothing else connected after the electromagnet, and the electromagnet IS the inductor, so it wont be sending the current to itself. And to the mosfet this will be a reverse current, which is what a diode would help redirect to protect the mosfet. So the arduino isn't in any danger from this necessarily, but 1 diode per mosfet can still save TWP a lot of work down the line if a mosfet dies because of this. The arduino does connect to the gate of the mosfet as well though, and one thing is important to note here. If the mosfet dies, the drain's leakage current to gate can increase a lot, so assuming the arduino has pins connected directly to gate, this EMF could end up reaching the arduino. I've even had mosfets straight up just short both drain and gate to source (ground) when they die, which in this case could mean the arduino pin drawing way too much current and the circuitry connected to that pin dying. If the arduino is powered by a PC's USB, the PC's OS might actually detect the large current draw and shut off the USB though, but it can take a bit of time, and I wouldn't want to count on that. Honestly though I would just use BJTs and a diode, that way anything that breaks will be extremely cheap. but i understand that TWP chose what he did. Still really, really do need a diode though. Won't be hard to implement, just put it across drain and source, line facing the positive side, and you should be safe. Gate already seems to have resistors judging from the appearance of that board, so that one is okay at least. Diodes for gate can be a hassle sometimes because of voltage drop, and adding another resistor there would just make a voltage dividor which ends up being the same thing.
And if there was more metal at the bottom of the nail (ie a ferrous washer attached) it would need much less current to hold it since the cockpit design is not that it can be switched ON automatically. It just has to hold the switch in on position once it reaches it. In fact a permanent magnet and a small “off kick” solenoid would also work. It would only need power when tripping the switch off.
I was about to write exactly this. Some of the aviation contactors I deal with even have extra coils that are only switched on when the contacts are open.
Could also potentially only turn the electromagnet on for a switch when that switch moves to the hold position, rather than always having them powered Edit: just continued watching and he already does this 👌
@@lexeindhoven i think he was more referring to have the switches on in the position they are least likely to be in all the time. SAS switches, for instance, are always on... so inverting the setup to hold them for SAS off and spring loading to SAS on week help because they won't be on except aircraft start... if course, he'd have to reset them to the off position every restart.
Regarding the electro magnets getting too hot, you can pwm modulate the powerdraw so it pulses on and off quickly with a mosfet and tune it so it will still hold the switch but use less power overall and thus not get as hot. Edit: I see below someone has suggested a dedicated solenoid IC and it would be an even better option. Another way to reduce power draw is to increase the surface of the part to hold, seeing as its a small rod it has a very small surface compared to the magnet, if you could have a flat wider surface you would need less power to hold it
As you're using an Arduino to do the switchng I'd definately consider PWM-ing the solonoids. So for example pulse ON for 1 second to actuate then switch to percentage PWM to hold (you'll need to do a bit of trial & error so it feels right). As a benefit you can probably do away with the fan. NOTE don't even try PWMing without flywheel diodes though!!
@@modmen. Yes same thing, different name. I personally prefer the term freewheeling as [to me] it describes the current path through the diode+coil while the mag field collapses.
@@modmen. yeah I was bout to ask wtf a flywheel diode was. I Was like "great, just when you think you know your diodes..." is that a map makers fish? or whatever. red herring to weed out the unworthy. I find it hard to believe someone who knows electronics enough to suggest pwm and know inductive loads require a flyback diode. flywheel makes no sense and I might imagine one to be a backward flyback diode. it might help to think of the diode as a flyback arrestor. the flyback being when current to the coil stops flowing, the magnetic feild collapses, forcing current to move in the other direction burning out the FET/s
I love the amount of work you have done on this project. Making all this public and open is awesome . I made a similar switch setup but I use a permanent magnet on the end of the nail. This magnet sticks to the electromagnet by default to hold the ON position. Simply pulsing the electromagnet in the same N/S polarity as the permanent magnet will push the magnet away. This means only a brief pulse is needed on the electromagnet.
If you are worried about the magnets dieing, one standard technique with electro magnets is to lower the voltage. You might be surprised how low you can go. Fantastic job!
This is an insanely clever design. I've been thinking for a while about toggle switches that will actuate themselves and could never come up with a way to do it. Really dig this.
Great stuff! You might want to look into using flyback diodes at the output since this is an inductive load, there will be massive voltage spikes at turn off time, those can damage the mosfet, putting a diode in parallel of the solenoid but in reverse polarity will prevent that
If you put a small flat plate on the nail, free to "float" a bit so it self aligns to the magnet then you could use a much smaller/lower powered magnet eg a cannibalised relay coil . You can also get energise to release magnets but not sure if you can get them that small.
Always loved those switches on the various aircraft that I've worked on. Of course the trick was figuring out which one clicked to off when you were running checks.
Well, the algorithm offers up another gem. This is wild! As an ex-RAAF avionics guy, this speaks to me. Obviously your simulator is the bomb, but I'm also super impress by your mad hacking skillz. I think I'll be here for a while ...
I think the sky jump would be to redirect air flow, from jets leaving the hanger, so not to wipe out people/vehicles passing behind. (Just my guess), super work.
I've seen a lot of stuff on "makter" youtube...woodworking, metal working, cars, off the wall vehicles, smart homes that feel like they're from the 22nd century, diy-ultralight airplanes, (ya'll know which channels I am talking about haha) but the quality of your work (I mean there is nothing bodged there) and dedication that you put into this project over this many years is something I've never come across. Not on YT, not in my private life, not in my professional life. Keep it up!
Thanks for this. I know don't how this seemed to have showed up at random on the suggested videos to look at. But, many decades ago, I recalled seeing a magnetic switch. I forgot the context of how that switch was used. But there is no way it would have cost thousands, or even a hundred dollars. Years later, when I wanted to find one, I could not. Though, at the time I didn't know to use the word "magnetic". My purpose was because when everything switched to electronic playback of music, Puppeteers lost the ability to feel when a playback device was actually playing. With old cassette tape players, you could reach to the player in the dark, and press the play button, and know it was playing. The fact that you often added some silence before a sound cue (to give time to put that free hand into another puppet) means you can't hear if it is playing. Worse yet, the play button on an MP3 player often serves double-duty as the pause button. So, if you are not sure if you pressed the button firmly enough the first time, you can't press it again to insure it is playing, since you may be pausing it. I was going to design an MP3 player that would recreate the play button of an old cassette tape player. It could even "auto stop" at the end of a sound effect.
i skipped through the video, but your genius knows no bounds. that is an excellent solution to a problem, and to be honest, i reckon you could sell those switches to like minded sim users. well done. bloody impressed. really nice job and solution for your needs.
Great Stuff. Always love the ideas you come up with. One idea for "bulkier stuff" that might cause heat-problems: If you need to hold stronger stuff you might be able to use a latch-mechanism with springs. Basically a car-door lock style lock that snaps in place when you flick it on but the clasp is controlled by a solenoid and can be retracted. This will prevent you from constantly powering the magnets. ANd if the clasp is a V-Shape you can still "unlock" it by just flicking the switch. Might mess with the feedback / feeling of the switch though.
Man, this takes me back! In the early 90s the company I worked for did a startup simulator for the Harrier so they could practice procedures for hot and hung starts, etc. We got a cockpit built and installed instruments and displays. The two impossible tasks were barrel gauges and these switches. Both extremely expensive and impossible to find used. This was long before Internet and Ebay. We eventually subcontracted to have the gauges built for us. I don't know where we eventually found a start switch. Our engineering manager spent his weekends going round aircraft scrap yards, and aviation museums looking to buy one somewhere.
I got an idea for you!!, though you are extremely creative with your own. But perhaps this will work great for a DC Bus/distribution system: If you use a relatively low current DC breaker toggle switch (you can get small 1amp DC breakers that look and act like toggles) - you can trigger a trip from ON to OFF using a simple crowbar circuit driven by either a MOSFET or relay. The crowbar circuit will cause a momentary short/load through an appropriate resistor when triggered, ultimately disengaging the load connected and tripping the toggle. This will work excellent and reliable for ON to OFF situations but not vice versa.
Blown away by your ingenuity! One way I have used in days gone by with current hungry solenoids is to provide the initial "attract" pulse from a capacitor. What you do is put a resistor from the supply in series with the coil to set the required holding current (typically one third of the attract current). From the junction of coil and resistor, you connect an electrolytic capacitor to ground. (Probably a few hundred microfarads would be required.) The mosfet switches the coil to ground, When the mosfet is off, the capacitor charges up to supply voltage via the series resistor. When the mosfet turns on, an initial high pulse of current flows from the capacitor, dropping after a few milliseconds to the holding current supplied via the resistor. When the mosfet goes off again, the capacitor charges up via the resistor again, probably taking just a few milliseconds.
Great work! Very impressive results. The "ramp" is a jet deflector. People need to access the area between the rows of hangars without being barbequed.
Those "ramps", or "ski jumps", as you call them are Jet Blast Deflectors. When rapid response aircraft power up in those aircraft bays you want to allow people and vehicles to be able to move behind them without getting damaged, so the engine exhaust hits them and gets deflected upward. You see the same on aircraft carriers behind an aircraft that is about to take off. -- US Air Force Veteran
I saw your comments on other videos years ago showing envy for these switches… awesome to see when you finally do it, you do it well. Nice work. Freaking awesome.
I have nothing to do with flight sims but glad that I was recommended this video randomly! That is super neat that it works exacly like the real thing. Gave me another idea: with linear solenoids instead of the electromagnet, it would be possible to make a switch that works manually and automatically in both directions.
I clicked on this video after reading the channel name, in the hopes of seeing a guy build a real A-10 in his backyard. I was only partially disappointed.
The mounting of the flush mounted switches look better than seeing the mounting threads and mounting nut. Wery cool build, thanks for the video and explanation.
Absolutely ingenious to a rookie like myself. I would love to have a go at building a simulator like this, but unfortunately, I don't have steady enough hands, only one decent eye (the spare one) and conceivably the years left to contemplate a project like this. My admiration and envy goes out to you for what you have shared, I even purchased a K40 to have a go at cutting some simpler panels myself, but what you have succeeded in building is massive. Congratulations to you, I hope you enjoy it.
One of my recommendations is the same that a lot of model railroaders should do. If you have a lot of stuff on 12V, buy a bunch of extension cords for a PC Power Supply (PCI-E extensions, motherboard 24 pin and the like) and then you hack the extensions and use the ATX power supply to give you power. This will give you a common 12V provider with decent amperage, and if it fails you have a common part to exchange for that would be plug and play without having to do any modifications, and you can still get it RMAed :D
my suggestion for extracting the key contact points by the right way at the beginning of the video is: DO NOT hit it with a punction and a hammer... this could break the key body... use the drill system right away, as he himself showed in the next step... first remove the stitches with the drill and then drill the new holes! I think if you already have an arduino board and if it is NOT so IMPORTANT to have a visual aspect of the key activated and held by the magnet, in that case I would use that same momentary contact key and leave it up to the arduino to undo this "contact" which is made by the magnet. if you want visual information, you could use green led for "on" and red led for "off" my sincere congratulations, your cockpit is AMAZiNG!!! ;)
You can mount a permanent magnet to the end of switch shaft, then you can polarize the solenoid to pull magnet close enough to make it attracted, then it could hold the position without any current running in solenoid, and when you would want to release the switch just power the solenoid in reverse to repel the permanent magnet🧲
I love the way the complexity of your solutions are increasing over time. Please keep it up! I'm looking to translate what you have done to Elite Dangerous.
Appreciation. Instead of the nails I have small metal sheets that cover the whole magnet. In the line to the magnet, two 100 ohm resistors serial and a 2.7KOhm came in parallel to the magnet. Now the switches hold the on position at 12V / 45mA and the magnet no longer heats up! Due to the parallel resistance, the induction voltage is cut when switching off. That protects the electronics. :)
Once the solenoid (electromagnet) has reach the end of stroke the amount of power it takes can be cut. I have a solenoid here that it takes the full 12vdc to pull in, but then it will stay in with only 3vdc. With an 11Ω coil that's 12 watts worth of heat (very hot after 1 hour) cutting back to 3 volts is only 0.75 watts worth of heat. The power cut can be done with PWM.
That's not the normal part prices obviously, military contractors might buy thousands of them at the same time, at a part cost of $150-300 each, pricey but if your $130 cost-reduction by hacking together a $20 version crashes a 20 million dollar aircraft and kills the pilot you'll be embarrassed to say the least. It's just that sourcing a single part as a consumer is hideously expensive.
fyi, all drills naturally wobble. it's why centre punching holes to be drilled in metal is important. the divot created by the punch helps to centre the drill in order to make a more accurate hole. for higher precision, reaming or boring tools are used on holes started with drilling.
Awesome swtiched! May I make a suggestion; add protection diodes (flyback protection) on each electromagnet. Don't really see any on the mosfet driver board. The electromagnets are zapping themosf ets everytime they are turned off which will cause the mosfets to fail over time. Protection diodes are reversed diodes in parallel with the electromagnets, this will allow the current generated when the magnetic field collapses in the coils to go thru the diode and not thru the mosfets. Very important.
Wow, I stumbled onto this, while the switches in and of themselves are somewhat impressive, I find myself wondering more about the overall project than the damn switches! Amazing!
Just a tip, Dremel rotary tool with a cut off wheel and other attachments would make some of the operations you did in the video easier/faster. Great content!
In the early 2000,we didn’t have have any DC solar light switches , the fines for not having your mast light on at night was around $85 ,(I’m a liveaboard) LEDs were out and expensive ,with no solar switches, I got my magnetic switches from the junk yard, in side the hood,over the wheel well,you have a black plastic box,inside,you have 4 to 5 magnetic switches,(12volt) I would hook my cheap Harbor freight solar panel to the leads that control the magnetic switch and the other leads to the LED mast light via the 12 volt battery , when the sun went down ,the energy dropped and the magnet would release,closing a circuit and turning on my LED mast light , today we have DC solar activated LED lights ,
This is awesome. A linear push pull solenoid paired with a switch with no spring would probably fix your heating issues since it will only need powered momentarily.
![HIWWHEE | OHM [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/OJJLtTLqLag/mqdefault.jpg)
Update- A few days short of 1 year later, two of the nails fell off as the bondic glue gave up. It was an easy fix, however I used a two part epoxy this time. They will never come off again.
You are a legend.
@@CAL1MBO he is for real
Makes sense. UV cure adhesive is tricky to cure where no light can reach it. If the sleeves were also transparent plastic you could probably make it work.
I think it would be somewhat simpler, and less power consuming, if the nail gets caught by a ramp (nose shaped hooking ramp). And the magnet pulls the "hooking-ramp" back so the nail can snap back into off-position. If the ramp is not too steep on the lockingside, you can still disable the switch manually.
That way you do not need to have the magnets activated all the time, to keep the switch in position!
I assume the original switches work in a similar fashion, instead of having an active magent consuming power all time while in on-position?!
When I saw you using UV curing I was thinking "that will only cure the surface". Epoxy a much better idea.
I have a suggestion. Suppose you use permanent magnets to hold the switches in the on position, but *counteract* them with electromagnetic windings when you want them to disengage. This would greatly reduce the current draw of the setup as well as eliminate the need for cooling. Instead of applying constant current to keep the switches engaged, you'd only need a short pulse to disengage them.
If that's the case, you don't need permanent magnets, just some self-lock switch + a disengage elecmag.
IRL jets use holding mechanism to make sure it'll always jump back to OFF as soon as the power was lost, but I have seen some low-end sim hardware for 737 use switches as what your suggestion is, my guess that type of switch is cheap anyway.
Had the same thought. Essentially making a large latching relay.
For this use, permanent magnets are not a bad idea. But for anyone thinking about using this for other purposes, you need to consider the failure mode. This has a "fail-safe" mode, in that when power is lost, it returns to its off position. Using permanent magnets would create a "fail-secure" mode, which means the switches would remain on even in the event of a power failure, which may cause issues if something needs to be off when the power is first turned restored.
Might be easier to take apart a cheap china linear solenoid. Many of them are push pulls so if you swap out the mosfet for a motor controller chip, you could flick the switch on and off. Though not sure how much force you need to pull a switch though, 15 newtons dosn't seem enough and the cheap ones don't have a pull more than 10mm
You could still make it secure by adding a switch that opens when power is lost, a capacitor would be enough to reset the manual switch. It's arguable if it's more complex since you get rid off the fan.
Wow. The WAF (wife acceptance factor) of your hobby is nearing zero. You are my hero, great stuff as usual. Makes my pathetic sim-racing cockpit look pretty sad (I still love it even if my wife doesn't)
I do not have anything built yet. I just live vicariously through others and wonder what sort of face my wife will make if I buy the warthog hotas and throttle.
@@WarrenPostma In my experience, and not knowing your wife, I'd say at first she would look skeptical with a hint of disapproval but also some resignation like she's thinking "boys will be boys".
Once she learn what they cost, indignation and disbelief that you will waste so much money on kids toys.
When you tell her this is just a very small fraction of the cost of the cockpit you are going to build, it's going to be the sofa for a week at least.
Oh and if you try to hide the cost... Lets just say it's probably better she knows from the beginning rather than finding out the reason your kids university funds seems to have gone AWOL is because of your toys in the basement...
Just tell her he saved 20,000 by not buying the real switches... ouch
this comment section is definitely what i think how my girl looks at me when i tell her about anything related to the sim or real life 🤣🤣
@@blahorgaslisk7763 and that's one of the many reasons why I'm not having kids. I want both me and my partner to be able to afford our expensive toys.
oh no.... I was running out of inspiration in sim racing as I've gone as far as i've been able to find online re: DIY electronic tinkerers. Your complexity just blew that away haha looking forward to this rabbit hole
Why that sounds like:
Oh no, I thought I had done everything that can be done with my sim setup, now I have to reconsider everything... anyway, back to tinkering.
To me?
@@youkofoxy flight sim folks tend to do that to sim racing folks haha I'm big enough to admit that happily :)
Worth adding - a lot of the cheap mosfet boards don't have a back emf protection diode (should be one inside the mosfet but easy to blow out) - inductive loads like that magnet could have an appreciable pulse that the mosfets won't like.
Better the mosfets than the arduino!
Yeah diode every coil you ever use. Ever.
i did notes it either
OH, shit, I completely forgot about that part. This is actually a massive thing for this video yeah. For TWP: any transistor connected to an inductive load, like a motor, electromagnet, straight up inductor etc, will HAVE to have a diode connected to the source and drain pins, because inductors will store current during charge, then release all of that when the charge stops (electromagnet turns off, in this case), and that current will likely be going straight back to the mosfet as there's nothing else connected after the electromagnet, and the electromagnet IS the inductor, so it wont be sending the current to itself. And to the mosfet this will be a reverse current, which is what a diode would help redirect to protect the mosfet.
So the arduino isn't in any danger from this necessarily, but 1 diode per mosfet can still save TWP a lot of work down the line if a mosfet dies because of this.
The arduino does connect to the gate of the mosfet as well though, and one thing is important to note here. If the mosfet dies, the drain's leakage current to gate can increase a lot, so assuming the arduino has pins connected directly to gate, this EMF could end up reaching the arduino. I've even had mosfets straight up just short both drain and gate to source (ground) when they die, which in this case could mean the arduino pin drawing way too much current and the circuitry connected to that pin dying.
If the arduino is powered by a PC's USB, the PC's OS might actually detect the large current draw and shut off the USB though, but it can take a bit of time, and I wouldn't want to count on that.
Honestly though I would just use BJTs and a diode, that way anything that breaks will be extremely cheap. but i understand that TWP chose what he did.
Still really, really do need a diode though. Won't be hard to implement, just put it across drain and source, line facing the positive side, and you should be safe. Gate already seems to have resistors judging from the appearance of that board, so that one is okay at least. Diodes for gate can be a hassle sometimes because of voltage drop, and adding another resistor there would just make a voltage dividor which ends up being the same thing.
Would recommend looking into solenoid driver ic's. They limit the current after a set time. The hold current is much lower thus less heat
And if there was more metal at the bottom of the nail (ie a ferrous washer attached) it would need much less current to hold it since the cockpit design is not that it can be switched ON automatically. It just has to hold the switch in on position once it reaches it. In fact a permanent magnet and a small “off kick” solenoid would also work. It would only need power when tripping the switch off.
I was about to write exactly this.
Some of the aviation contactors I deal with even have extra coils that are only switched on when the contacts are open.
Could also potentially only turn the electromagnet on for a switch when that switch moves to the hold position, rather than always having them powered
Edit: just continued watching and he already does this 👌
@@StephenHoldaway he does that.
@@lexeindhoven i think he was more referring to have the switches on in the position they are least likely to be in all the time. SAS switches, for instance, are always on... so inverting the setup to hold them for SAS off and spring loading to SAS on week help because they won't be on except aircraft start... if course, he'd have to reset them to the off position every restart.
Ha, amazing work. Just when I think you are basically done you go and add another level of realism.
The magnetic switches are like ASMR. So satisfying! Bravo!
Dude.
You
Da
Man
Doing OZ ingenuity proud.
Regarding the electro magnets getting too hot, you can pwm modulate the powerdraw so it pulses on and off quickly with a mosfet and tune it so it will still hold the switch but use less power overall and thus not get as hot. Edit: I see below someone has suggested a dedicated solenoid IC and it would be an even better option. Another way to reduce power draw is to increase the surface of the part to hold, seeing as its a small rod it has a very small surface compared to the magnet, if you could have a flat wider surface you would need less power to hold it
As you're using an Arduino to do the switchng I'd definately consider PWM-ing the solonoids. So for example pulse ON for 1 second to actuate then switch to percentage PWM to hold (you'll need to do a bit of trial & error so it feels right). As a benefit you can probably do away with the fan. NOTE don't even try PWMing without flywheel diodes though!!
You mean a flyback diode?
@@modmen. Yes same thing, different name. I personally prefer the term freewheeling as [to me] it describes the current path through the diode+coil while the mag field collapses.
Yeah makes sense. Wouldn't it just turn into a stepdown converter?
@@modmen. Yep that's basically it - add a bit of smoothing & regulation and you have a good old buck converter...
@@modmen. yeah I was bout to ask wtf a flywheel diode was. I Was like "great, just when you think you know your diodes..." is that a map makers fish? or whatever. red herring to weed out the unworthy. I find it hard to believe someone who knows electronics enough to suggest pwm and know inductive loads require a flyback diode. flywheel makes no sense and I might imagine one to be a backward flyback diode. it might help to think of the diode as a flyback arrestor. the flyback being when current to the coil stops flowing, the magnetic feild collapses, forcing current to move in the other direction burning out the FET/s
I love the amount of work you have done on this project. Making all this public and open is awesome . I made a similar switch setup but I use a permanent magnet on the end of the nail. This magnet sticks to the electromagnet by default to hold the ON position. Simply pulsing the electromagnet in the same N/S polarity as the permanent magnet will push the magnet away. This means only a brief pulse is needed on the electromagnet.
If you are worried about the magnets dieing, one standard technique with electro magnets is to lower the voltage. You might be surprised how low you can go.
Fantastic job!
This is an insanely clever design. I've been thinking for a while about toggle switches that will actuate themselves and could never come up with a way to do it. Really dig this.
Great stuff! You might want to look into using flyback diodes at the output since this is an inductive load, there will be massive voltage spikes at turn off time, those can damage the mosfet, putting a diode in parallel of the solenoid but in reverse polarity will prevent that
Sorry all- I fixed the broken links in the description!
Thanks :)
and the wall??? :D :D
Only big thing missing now is a mechanism to move the cockpit to simulate flying
Why do those switches cost 4k ?
You ever think about converting to a motion rig
If you put a small flat plate on the nail, free to "float" a bit so it self aligns to the magnet then you could use a much smaller/lower powered magnet eg a cannibalised relay coil . You can also get energise to release magnets but not sure if you can get them that small.
dude, the level of effort and workmanship and ingenuity is off the charts.
fuck me it's impressive.
Always loved those switches on the various aircraft that I've worked on. Of course the trick was figuring out which one clicked to off when you were running checks.
I don't know why I'm watching this or why it was recommended, but... Damn. Amazing work!
Well, the algorithm offers up another gem. This is wild! As an ex-RAAF avionics guy, this speaks to me. Obviously your simulator is the bomb, but I'm also super impress by your mad hacking skillz. I think I'll be here for a while ...
Being directed here having no experience in flight sim builds this all looks amazing to me, I admire your dedication to the craft thumbs up :D
I think the sky jump would be to redirect air flow, from jets leaving the hanger, so not to wipe out people/vehicles passing behind. (Just my guess), super work.
I've seen a lot of stuff on "makter" youtube...woodworking, metal working, cars, off the wall vehicles, smart homes that feel like they're from the 22nd century, diy-ultralight airplanes, (ya'll know which channels I am talking about haha) but the quality of your work (I mean there is nothing bodged there) and dedication that you put into this project over this many years is something I've never come across. Not on YT, not in my private life, not in my professional life.
Keep it up!
This is inspiring be to go back to designing the Mech Cockpit I theorized many moons ago!
I've been following this series for years and you still amaze me with attention to detail and in house manufacturing. 👍👍
First of all... BOMBASTIC Cockpit :D and really nice technique you are showing us, with the magnetic switches - really like this Project :D!
Thanks for this. I know don't how this seemed to have showed up at random on the suggested videos to look at. But, many decades ago, I recalled seeing a magnetic switch. I forgot the context of how that switch was used. But there is no way it would have cost thousands, or even a hundred dollars. Years later, when I wanted to find one, I could not. Though, at the time I didn't know to use the word "magnetic".
My purpose was because when everything switched to electronic playback of music, Puppeteers lost the ability to feel when a playback device was actually playing. With old cassette tape players, you could reach to the player in the dark, and press the play button, and know it was playing. The fact that you often added some silence before a sound cue (to give time to put that free hand into another puppet) means you can't hear if it is playing. Worse yet, the play button on an MP3 player often serves double-duty as the pause button. So, if you are not sure if you pressed the button firmly enough the first time, you can't press it again to insure it is playing, since you may be pausing it.
I was going to design an MP3 player that would recreate the play button of an old cassette tape player. It could even "auto stop" at the end of a sound effect.
i skipped through the video, but your genius knows no bounds. that is an excellent solution to a problem, and to be honest, i reckon you could sell those switches to like minded sim users. well done. bloody impressed. really nice job and solution for your needs.
Oh god, oh man... new to my freaky repertory 😉 What an impressive job you're doing!!
Great Stuff. Always love the ideas you come up with.
One idea for "bulkier stuff" that might cause heat-problems:
If you need to hold stronger stuff you might be able to use a latch-mechanism with springs. Basically a car-door lock style lock that snaps in place when you flick it on but the clasp is controlled by a solenoid and can be retracted. This will prevent you from constantly powering the magnets. ANd if the clasp is a V-Shape you can still "unlock" it by just flicking the switch. Might mess with the feedback / feeling of the switch though.
Won’t turn them off when the power is lost though right?
Man, this takes me back! In the early 90s the company I worked for did a startup simulator for the Harrier so they could practice procedures for hot and hung starts, etc. We got a cockpit built and installed instruments and displays. The two impossible tasks were barrel gauges and these switches. Both extremely expensive and impossible to find used. This was long before Internet and Ebay. We eventually subcontracted to have the gauges built for us. I don't know where we eventually found a start switch. Our engineering manager spent his weekends going round aircraft scrap yards, and aviation museums looking to buy one somewhere.
The superior man is modest in his speech, but exceeds in his actions.
Just what I’ve been looking for. Bravo!
My F-14 pit will need (on) off (on) so I imagine I could make a double bracket with a magnet either side.
I was just thinking the same for the mosquito bomb bay, gear and flaps levers.
You may use permanent magnets for holding position and electromagnets just to release switches. It will reduce heating.
I got an idea for you!!, though you are extremely creative with your own. But perhaps this will work great for a DC Bus/distribution system:
If you use a relatively low current DC breaker toggle switch (you can get small 1amp DC breakers that look and act like toggles) - you can trigger a trip from ON to OFF using a simple crowbar circuit driven by either a MOSFET or relay. The crowbar circuit will cause a momentary short/load through an appropriate resistor when triggered, ultimately disengaging the load connected and tripping the toggle. This will work excellent and reliable for ON to OFF situations but not vice versa.
Really appreciated the TOOL in the background!
Truly impressive! I love seeing your project cockpit develop over time and the ways you are finding to bring it to completion.
Blown away by your ingenuity! One way I have used in days gone by with current hungry solenoids is to provide the initial "attract" pulse from a capacitor. What you do is put a resistor from the supply in series with the coil to set the required holding current (typically one third of the attract current). From the junction of coil and resistor, you connect an electrolytic capacitor to ground. (Probably a few hundred microfarads would be required.) The mosfet switches the coil to ground, When the mosfet is off, the capacitor charges up to supply voltage via the series resistor. When the mosfet turns on, an initial high pulse of current flows from the capacitor, dropping after a few milliseconds to the holding current supplied via the resistor. When the mosfet goes off again, the capacitor charges up via the resistor again, probably taking just a few milliseconds.
Great work! Very impressive results. The "ramp" is a jet deflector. People need to access the area between the rows of hangars without being barbequed.
I've been going pretty ham on my own sim cockpit. But nothing compared to this. This channel is like ASMR to me. It's so satisfying.
Clicking a button in game and having it actually do something in real life is absolutely amazing!
Jaw dropping. It must be so much fun to let nothing stand in your way. Well done!!!
Those "ramps", or "ski jumps", as you call them are Jet Blast Deflectors. When rapid response aircraft power up in those aircraft bays you want to allow people and vehicles to be able to move behind them without getting damaged, so the engine exhaust hits them and gets deflected upward. You see the same on aircraft carriers behind an aircraft that is about to take off.
-- US Air Force Veteran
I saw your comments on other videos years ago showing envy for these switches… awesome to see when you finally do it, you do it well. Nice work. Freaking awesome.
Awesome!
Yes, A10 warthog replacement part prices have just gone crazy😎
what a time to be alive... I am so happy that a man like you exists and I can be aware of your work
For a long time , i`ve searched for the magnetic switch. Thank you for your knowledge-sharing.
Cheeky bit of Tool playing in the background :P
Sick build tho man, remaking expensive things for cheap is my favourite!
I didn't know these switches existed... now I have so many ideas to use them.
I have nothing to do with flight sims but glad that I was recommended this video randomly! That is super neat that it works exacly like the real thing.
Gave me another idea: with linear solenoids instead of the electromagnet, it would be possible to make a switch that works manually and automatically in both directions.
have you tried flight simulators?
i mean the whole project is, but THIS IS BRILLIANT!
Dear lord. THAT is a impressive set up. WOW
This is seriously, seriously impressive.
I clicked on this video after reading the channel name, in the hopes of seeing a guy build a real A-10 in his backyard. I was only partially disappointed.
The mounting of the flush mounted switches look better than seeing the mounting threads and mounting nut. Wery cool build, thanks for the video and explanation.
I'll say it untill I die: you're a genius!
Cheers from an Italian aircraft engineer
genius solution for us - the budget cockpit builders :) many thanks for the great idea!!
You, sir... are a scholar and a gentleman. Thanks for sharing this. I plan to use this in my AV-8B cockpit... if and whenever I actually build it!
Absolutely ingenious to a rookie like myself. I would love to have a go at building a simulator like this, but unfortunately, I don't have steady enough hands, only one decent eye (the spare one) and conceivably the years left to contemplate a project like this. My admiration and envy goes out to you for what you have shared, I even purchased a K40 to have a go at cutting some simpler panels myself, but what you have succeeded in building is massive. Congratulations to you, I hope you enjoy it.
One of my recommendations is the same that a lot of model railroaders should do.
If you have a lot of stuff on 12V, buy a bunch of extension cords for a PC Power Supply (PCI-E extensions, motherboard 24 pin and the like) and then you hack the extensions and use the ATX power supply to give you power.
This will give you a common 12V provider with decent amperage, and if it fails you have a common part to exchange for that would be plug and play without having to do any modifications, and you can still get it RMAed :D
That was a fantastic modification, well done!
I've heard of people using toggle switch style circuit breakers for this purpose, but this seems easy enough!
my suggestion for extracting the key contact points by the right way at the beginning of the video is:
DO NOT hit it with a punction and a hammer... this could break the key body...
use the drill system right away, as he himself showed in the next step...
first remove the stitches with the drill and then drill the new holes!
I think if you already have an arduino board and if it is NOT so IMPORTANT to have a visual aspect of the key activated and held by the magnet, in that case I would use that same momentary contact key and leave it up to the arduino to undo this "contact" which is made by the magnet.
if you want visual information, you could use green led for "on" and red led for "off"
my sincere congratulations, your cockpit is AMAZiNG!!! ;)
You can mount a permanent magnet to the end of switch shaft, then you can polarize the solenoid to pull magnet close enough to make it attracted, then it could hold the position without any current running in solenoid, and when you would want to release the switch just power the solenoid in reverse to repel the permanent magnet🧲
Talk about taking it to level 11. Kudos to you!!
I love the way the complexity of your solutions are increasing over time. Please keep it up! I'm looking to translate what you have done to Elite Dangerous.
Appreciation.
Instead of the nails I have small metal sheets that cover the whole magnet. In the line to the magnet, two 100 ohm resistors serial and a 2.7KOhm came in parallel to the magnet.
Now the switches hold the on position at 12V / 45mA and the magnet no longer heats up! Due to the parallel resistance, the induction voltage is cut when switching off. That protects the electronics. :)
So the positive to the magnet you have 2 100ohm in series, and then a 2.7kohm in parallel to those 2?
@@Lohrenz737 two 100 Ohm in series in the plus line and one 2k7 parallel to the magnets coil.
Wow!
I was just looking for a button box for sim racing...... this is outstanding 👏
Brilliant, Have been trying to think how to handle this issue for a while, and had almost decided not to bother but will try this now.
Don't know how I got here, but I love this! Nice work!
Awesome!!! Thanks a lot :) Everybody loves magnetic switches.
Once the solenoid (electromagnet) has reach the end of stroke the amount of power it takes can be cut. I have a solenoid here that it takes the full 12vdc to pull in, but then it will stay in with only 3vdc. With an 11Ω coil that's 12 watts worth of heat (very hot after 1 hour) cutting back to 3 volts is only 0.75 watts worth of heat. The power cut can be done with PWM.
Absolute game changer! There are quite a few of these in the Tomcat pit.
Very clever solution to magnetic switches. Nice work. thanks for sharing bro.
Amazing hack. Also, those prices for the official switches are outright outrageous!
Welcome to the Defence industry vortex.
That's not the normal part prices obviously, military contractors might buy thousands of them at the same time, at a part cost of $150-300 each, pricey but if your $130 cost-reduction by hacking together a $20 version crashes a 20 million dollar aircraft and kills the pilot you'll be embarrassed to say the least.
It's just that sourcing a single part as a consumer is hideously expensive.
Impressive! You make it look so easy to make my own cockpit.
Btw the link to the 4 channel mosfet is going to the magnets.
Thanks!
Wow first time seeing your channel. This project is next level.
I had no idea what a magnetic switch was but $20 sounded like a fair price so I had to watch! You build incredible stuff!
An A-10 Haynes manual!?!!! 😃 THAT IS SO BAD ASS! 🤣 How do you change the blinker fluid? 🤣
I have to say this is impressive! First of your videos I have seen surly need to get up to speed on your project by watching more. Cheers!
fyi, all drills naturally wobble. it's why centre punching holes to be drilled in metal is important. the divot created by the punch helps to centre the drill in order to make a more accurate hole. for higher precision, reaming or boring tools are used on holes started with drilling.
i luv the way you're making these panels! thanks for sharing
Awesome build!
That's awesome! I wish this was posted last year when I still had my F-18 cockpit. Well, at least now I can make up some switches for something.
You’re a mad lad. Of the best sort. Two thumbs and two big toes up!
Awesome swtiched! May I make a suggestion; add protection diodes (flyback protection) on each electromagnet. Don't really see any on the mosfet driver board. The electromagnets are zapping themosf ets everytime they are turned off which will cause the mosfets to fail over time. Protection diodes are reversed diodes in parallel with the electromagnets, this will allow the current generated when the magnetic field collapses in the coils to go thru the diode and not thru the mosfets. Very important.
Wow, I stumbled onto this, while the switches in and of themselves are somewhat impressive, I find myself wondering more about the overall project than the damn switches!
Amazing!
Nice, thanks mate. You're a legend. I'll definitely have to use some of the panels as I keep adding to my cockpit. They still go with my X-55 HOTAS.
The Haynes manual was above and beyond in a different type of way...
Good stuff...lol
dude, you are freakin' nuts. I love it, a friggin' wart-hog cockpit, what a hobby!!
Just a tip, Dremel rotary tool with a cut off wheel and other attachments would make some of the operations you did in the video easier/faster. Great content!
You can use a better solenoid driving circuit, adjust the holding current, and add absorption elements for the inductive kickback
Brilliant. Simple and elegant modification. Thanks for sharing!
In the early 2000,we didn’t have have any DC solar light switches , the fines for not having your mast light on at night was around $85 ,(I’m a liveaboard) LEDs were out and expensive ,with no solar switches, I got my magnetic switches from the junk yard, in side the hood,over the wheel well,you have a black plastic box,inside,you have 4 to 5 magnetic switches,(12volt) I would hook my cheap Harbor freight solar panel to the leads that control the magnetic switch and the other leads to the LED mast light via the 12 volt battery , when the sun went down ,the energy dropped and the magnet would release,closing a circuit and turning on my LED mast light , today we have DC solar activated LED lights ,
This is awesome. A linear push pull solenoid paired with a switch with no spring would probably fix your heating issues since it will only need powered momentarily.
Daimn! I'm impressed. Great work and respect.
I couldnt believe my eyes when I saw the price for the real magnetic switches dude!
So inspiring as usual! I love how you find small fixed to everything.
i really don t think a fan is necessary even at 70 degree, the magnet will work fine and the plastic will not deform or bent. Really cool video!