Excellent, if I had discovered your channel before, I would certainly have a lot less problems with the restoration I am doing at home. I really like your way of teaching, showing detail by detail of the whole process. As I always say: who knows do it, who knows a lot teaches.
This one popped up at the perfect time. I'm going to section in a patch on my son's jeep, rusted around the high mount stop light. We cut a piece out of a boneyard jeep that is + 3-6" on what i expect the final patch will be.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge Wray. A couple questions: 1. What is the benefit of using the blue tape when you already have the marker line? Best I can tell you are following the marker line with the tape (i.e. not using it to make a gap). 2. Do you have a preference for square corners because it is an easier cut? Do you find them easier to fit than a rounded patch panel? 3. Why do you grind the tacks off before running the bead, rather than weld through or over them? For the initial bead weld run, it would have been nice if it wasn't sped up. That way we can see how fast your hands are moving in real-time. After that, absolutely thanks for the speed up. Thank you for not editing out where you dip your tungsten. It's good to know that it happens to everyone.
Hi Dennis, The blue tape cleans up small mistakes in the marker line. Square corners or round corners both have their place. I often grind my tacks and then run the panel through the planishing hammer to level the weld seam.
Thanks for taking the time to share your knowledge mate. Your tips and trick will help me to become a better armature auto body worker. Thanks very much :)
I’ve watched many of your videos and the only real comment I would like to make about your welding process is that if you did not have “ANY” gaps what so ever there is much less chance of any distortion of the material. This is coming from a metal fabricator with 40 years of experience in the trade. That’s me just being “NITPICKING” otherwise well done in showing a VERY GOOD way of putting in a patch. The copper backing is a great tip for the beginner to get and understand how much of a difference that makes in the total out come in the end product.
Thank you Mark and Wray. Really nice with the filter for the camera lens while welding. This answered some issues I had while trying on a test piece. Also I learnt something with that folded edge and the arragment. Loads of practical tips throughout the video. I like it
I'd used sharpies for years and bought one of those Milwaukee brand markers just to check them out. No joke they last 50 times longer than the sharpies. Definitely worth the extra cost. The tips are also stronger and don't deform like the sharpies.
Wray, just wanted to say thanks for all the great videos done with steel lately!! Hands down, you are my favorite youtube channel. Would you consider doing a video on torch shrinking on steel?? There seem to be a few different methods, so I would like to see how you do it.
Wray. I have done literally hundreds of patches like this . I radius the corners , for me it helps lessen distortion. To be honest unless your fitting,or in your case, making new panels l wouldn't go the extra mile . You end up making the metal too thin and it can fracture on the joints . Thanks Wray.
Thank you. Your closing line "... I hope you all learned something." After watching one of your (recent) previous videos, I cut a couple of strips of sheetmetal (.033" IIRC, I used 40 amps...) to try my hand at TIG'ing them back together. I did good on the welding, never burning through (and only a couple of "sticks" not too bad for a guy that ) but I sure has some work to do on stretching the metal back out__or rather, knowing when to stop! I still need to do more skill-building practice runs before I get to the bodywork portion of the '67 MGB GT I'm restoring, so I'll be tuning in to watch more of your generously produced videos. Again, my thanks.
Absolutely stellar! The best on youtube for this topic; (and there are some tough competitors out there) Kudos to the cameraman as well; very nice work.
another outstanding video , looking at the back side and seeing some of the surface rust i thought the patch would have been longer , but a great video.
@@proshaper By the way. Wray, I made this 20 sec clip for you. Try this method for Tig tacking. See what you think. I love it! th-cam.com/video/uK8afziX1j4/w-d-xo.html
Wray. One other thing you could make a video on, is single sided, Tig, pulse spot welding. Very very effective. Works better than my single sided gun on my spot welder. Supercedes plug welding. I love Tig!
Thank you so much for taking the time to make these instructional videos Wray ! Great job as usual...When welding the long beads, would you have been able to limit the shrink by welding an inch and a half at a time and let the metal cool ? I'm learning this fine art of Tig welding sheet metal and just seeing what you are welding is half the battle for me... Love the copper backing plate also, great idea. PLEASE keep up the awesome work !
I have learned a lot from your movies Wray a BIG thanks for sharing your knowledge. I kind of have the same problem on the roof of my car, two steel plates with some kind of blanket in between. Should I remove the blanket completely or replace it with something that does not absorb moisture? If replace with what? Thanks for all help
Inspirering workmanship! Could you show the positioning of the dolly to hammer/slapper for shrinking and raising the metal? Maybe on some clear plastic or gladwrap. Thanks.
I need to master the art of the slap file. There's still something I don't "get" about it (like, why hitting down makes the metal come up...lol) but it's really cool how it works. The other thing I took from this was that "edge of dolly" trick to bring the low spots of the weld up. I have them all the time, but usually just run another few welds to fill those spots in. I'm looking forward to trying this technique. Thanks for the expertise!
It lifts the metal because you're only "on dolly" on the low point. So you use a corner of the dolly, or whatever part of it fits behind the low, and when the slapper hits the metal it crushes the low spot between the dolly and slapper and stretches it, thus bringing it up. So it's not so much the slapper, you could use a hammer too, it's just that you're localizing the stretch to the low spot so it gets lifted, but the metal around it doesn't.
Question: I've seen others hammer the welds on dolly before grinding down to flatten the weld and stretch the area that naturally shrinks from welding. I noticed you grind down the welds before doing any slapping/hammering on dolly. What is the advantage of doing it this way vs stretching/flattening the weld before grinding down? I'm reasonably good at TIG welding (for an amateur), but I still have a lot to learn when it comes to correcting weld distortion.
If you hit the welds when they are hot that is very effective. Like every process there are at least three or four ways that provide excellent results and a million ways to screw stuff up. I believe it is best to learn several ways to do every task.
@@proshaper I completely agree with that statement....like everything....everyone that’s been doing this for any length of time has there own little ways of fine tuning the process to fit there own way to get the same results...PERFECTION!
Great video, Wray. I've been using different shaped copper plumbing fixtures from Home Depot as heat sinks behind my welds but will definitely be heading to my nearest roofing supply store to get some sheets of copper too. Does the dolly you were using have a specific name (or is it a specific brand?) - I could do with adding one of those to my collection too.
I know they are using silicon bronze today a lot in body shops but that is on lap joints not butt welds. High quality coachbuilding panel joining is always butt joints.
Very informative thanks Wray. I've just had a skin cancer removed from my hand that looks very much like that lump on the back of your hand. Perhaps you should get it checked out? What pulse settings and amps did you use?
Hi Joel, Patch panels can have one seam ( a bottom door skin) two seams ( a corner of the bottom of a door) three seams ( a patch in the middle of the bottom of the door) four seams ( a patch in the middle of the door skin). Basic rule the more seams the more trouble and time. Once you master the needed skill sets nothing can stump you it just takes time to get it right and a shrinking disc ( shameless plug www.proshaper.com) Do rounded corners help? I haven't noticed any major differences.
wow, what a great video. Your skill is priceless sir. Question, I need to do something like this but I only have mig weld. can that be used instead of tig for this kind of work?
I noticed you were grinding across the weld more often here ,instead of with the weld, than you have done in previous videos. Is that because it is steel and you are less worried about thinning it than with aluminum or is it something else?
On the inside of the curved panel it is more difficult to grind with the weld. When videoing I'm always concerned with the time. I didn't grind any parent metal or make and eyebrows in the process and that is what is important.
I have a 914 fender flare job coming and that is EXACTLY how I would have welded it with the copper backing to prevent oxidation on the back side. However I would have used a thicker copper for better heat absorption. my question: would a hand held English wheel be faster and better since the access on the plane part is very good (no sharp angles)? lastly why not using MIG with the same low amp setting since TIG has a higher heat input ?
Any English wheel would be bumping into the fender flange. A planishing hammer would work, I prefer slapper and dolly. Once you master a tig you will seldom use a mig. There is so much more control, and it is easy to learn.
Great video Wray. When you were tacking did you use a constant 40 Amps or were you adjusting the heat with the pedal. I don't have a pedal on my Miller Diversion.
Great job as always from a master but I have a question, I would make the repair panel first on this simple job then marker or dykem the area and scribe around the new part to mark the cut and have a perfect fit very quickly. any reason you do it in reverse of my method ?
I have a question, should we focus on finishing the repair before fixing the highs and lows or is it better to reshape as you complete the welding process?
Would you have had less distortion if you didnt run the strait beads? I'm a novice welder doing MIG, and when I do a panel like this, I alternate around the panel to not warp the project. I know nothing about TIG, but would alternating around the panel while letting it cool have prevented the warping? Thanks for all the time you put into these videos.
When you weld in a patch panel with welds on four sides it is going to distort from shrinkage. I have total control over any distortion that might arise by using a torch and shrinking disc. Minimize the distortion but don't be fearful of it, you can control it with the right tools and techniques.
@@proshaper Thanks for taking the time to respond. Since only being around welding for just over a year, and all of it being OJT, finding people like you on youtube has given me a ton more confidence. I have had pretty good success on my car restoration project. Floor pans, frame components, etc. I wish I could by you a beer.
Great video as always Wray. Was wondering if you were to tig weld smaller sections at a time (say 25mm/1 inch at a time), would it produce less distortion in a case like this?
Considering the real time obviously involved, I hope that job wasn't priced on area affected. :-)* If a panel's being inset, would it be practical or worthwhile to bevel the edges slightly, so that the outer edge of the patch is slightly larger than the inside, (i.e. the patch wouldn't actually fall through)?
Great Video Wray. I would like to know what Filler rods you are using Look like mild steel soft rods to match the parent metal What's the filler rod code please
I feel like I can get this same result with tack welding using mig, but it requires a lot more precision grinding. Probably because this is 20 gauge it warped, I don’t tend to see this on the 18 gauge I use. How do you do a patch like this if you don’t have access to the back?
The mounting flange is in the way. You can use a planishing hammer, but you should know how to butt weld in a panel and be able to level it with just hand tools.
Wray is , of course, correct. Fiber lasers will work on automotive thickness panels but you are looking in the $18,000 range for a machine with the wattage to handle this gauge range. I’ve looked into this a fair amount and spoken with the companies who produce these machines. Depending on the machine , some will allow the use of filler wire ; however some at the moment are fusion only machines . Adjustment of the parameters for some metal alloys isn’t quite so straight forward as with a TIG machine either. I’m sure it will be the norm one day, but not practical for most shops at this time.
@@proshaper as long as you don't weld near them there fine get within half an inch or so and it will do some funny stuff though. with the magnets it will move aswell but that's sort of how I gauge it the gap will close as it shrinks then I hammer the tack until the gap opens up again then move onto the next one.
@@proshaper I only tried to use a magnet with a TIG once, and quickly realized that the arc was now in the next lane over than the one I was driving in! I like clamps; the more, the better!
Thanks for you videos. I have watched some other. In those, they plannish the beads themselves add metal back into the shrunk area. What are your thoughts on this?
I see a lot of this but I would like to see a repair where access to back is not possible. If you can't get back there to bring up the metal what then do you do if you don't want to use filler?
I'm assuming you are mig welding? With the tig welder I use all of the time I use 100% argon for steel welding. I have two of the tig welders I use all the time the second one I use for aluminum welding with 50% argon 50% helium as the shielding gas. For mig welding the standard practice is 25% carbon dioxide/75% argon
Looks OK I thought you was going to actually make that patch blend away where the people with bad eyesight would not see the repair I think your welding and just alittle bonds would have that thing perfect I don't mean kill it with bonds but just ever so slight you do pretty good work
Will the heat from shrinking disc temper the 20 gauge and strengthen to shape. My E type fender there is a bit of an issue below the front lense opening.
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Excellent, if I had discovered your channel before, I would certainly have a lot less problems with the restoration I am doing at home. I really like your way of teaching, showing detail by detail of the whole process.
As I always say: who knows do it, who knows a lot teaches.
“Total mastery of the process” best line ever
Thanks for turning down the volume on the power tool operations.
👍👍
Love your shrinking disk
I been welding for 42 years I've wire feeded cooler than his tig
Love to see the full process! Thanks for sharing this knowledge
My pleasure!
I've never had a car I felt warranted that level of metal work.....but I sure do appreciate seeing it in action.
Thanks again Wray for a very informative lesson. You’re right. Bondo is too dusty.
This one popped up at the perfect time. I'm going to section in a patch on my son's jeep, rusted around the high mount stop light. We cut a piece out of a boneyard jeep that is + 3-6" on what i expect the final patch will be.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge Wray. A couple questions:
1. What is the benefit of using the blue tape when you already have the marker line? Best I can tell you are following the marker line with the tape (i.e. not using it to make a gap).
2. Do you have a preference for square corners because it is an easier cut? Do you find them easier to fit than a rounded patch panel?
3. Why do you grind the tacks off before running the bead, rather than weld through or over them?
For the initial bead weld run, it would have been nice if it wasn't sped up. That way we can see how fast your hands are moving in real-time. After that, absolutely thanks for the speed up.
Thank you for not editing out where you dip your tungsten. It's good to know that it happens to everyone.
Hi Dennis, The blue tape cleans up small mistakes in the marker line. Square corners or round corners both have their place. I often grind my tacks and then run the panel through the planishing hammer to level the weld seam.
Thanks for taking the time to share your knowledge mate. Your tips and trick will help me to become a better armature auto body worker. Thanks very much :)
I’ve watched many of your videos and the only real comment I would like to make about your welding process is that if you did not have “ANY” gaps what so ever there is much less chance of any distortion of the material. This is coming from a metal fabricator with 40 years of experience in the trade. That’s me just being “NITPICKING” otherwise well done in showing a VERY GOOD way of putting in a patch. The copper backing is a great tip for the beginner to get and understand how much of a difference that makes in the total out come in the end product.
Your patience is appreciated!
Nice patch, well done.
Thank you Mark and Wray. Really nice with the filter for the camera lens while welding. This answered some issues I had while trying on a test piece. Also I learnt something with that folded edge and the arragment. Loads of practical tips throughout the video. I like it
I'd used sharpies for years and bought one of those Milwaukee brand markers just to check them out. No joke they last 50 times longer than the sharpies. Definitely worth the extra cost. The tips are also stronger and don't deform like the sharpies.
Wray, just wanted to say thanks for all the great videos done with steel lately!! Hands down, you are my favorite youtube channel. Would you consider doing a video on torch shrinking on steel?? There seem to be a few different methods, so I would like to see how you do it.
Thank you for posting!
loving true craftsman, and no filler. Beautiful sir!!
It's only the weld that's shrunk, so only the weld needs planishing out to get rid of distortion. You have more machines than I have. Lucky man.
Wray. I have done literally hundreds of patches like this . I radius the corners , for me it helps lessen distortion. To be honest unless your fitting,or in your case, making new panels l wouldn't go the extra mile . You end up making the metal too thin and it can fracture on the joints . Thanks Wray.
@Sauli Luolajan-Mikkola Correct ! 👍
Thank you. Your closing line "... I hope you all learned something." After watching one of your (recent) previous videos, I cut a couple of strips of sheetmetal (.033" IIRC, I used 40 amps...) to try my hand at TIG'ing them back together. I did good on the welding, never burning through (and only a couple of "sticks" not too bad for a guy that ) but I sure has some work to do on stretching the metal back out__or rather, knowing when to stop!
I still need to do more skill-building practice runs before I get to the bodywork portion of the '67 MGB GT I'm restoring, so I'll be tuning in to watch more of your generously produced videos.
Again, my thanks.
Absolutely stellar! The best on youtube for this topic; (and there are some tough competitors out there) Kudos to the cameraman as well; very nice work.
My arms are sore Wray ! I felt every one of those hammer strokes ! Thanks for the video , I feel a better body guy every video , thumbs up !
21:30 shows the benefit of buying, applying, and removing tape, and cutting shy of it. Carefully done here, and only about a 1/32 gap in places.
Excellent excellent excellent👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Wray, thanks for another great educational video by the Master
Thanks for taking the time to share your knowledge. I look forward to taking one of your classes in person someday.
Thanks Wray for a great video!
I'm spending sooooo much time watching Wray; luvit!!
Beautiful work Wray! Cheers, Doug
Awesome video, better each night. really enjoyed tonight, Thank You Sir Fred Barnes
It just goes to show that even with a perfect fit up, Mr. weld shrinkage is always knocking at the door. Thanks Wray for another great video.
There is no such thing as a butt weld that needs no attention.
Brilliantly done
Damn! Well done.
another outstanding video , looking at the back side and seeing some of the surface rust i thought the patch would have been longer , but a great video.
Excellent excellent excellent excellent👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Looks nice! #8 gas lense would help alot with the heat soak.
I use a number 10 gas lens. Watch my new welding video coming out today.
Great stuff.
Perfect,thanks.
Brilliant to see, thanks for sharing, really appreciated as always.
Another great video thanks wray
Master buenísimo gracias saludos desde Bs As Argentina
That thin copper backing is a good tip. I’ve got a thick piece I use. But I haven’t got a thin sheet strip that can curve like that.
The thin copper is used in the roofing industry on roof valleys. .023" thickness.
@@proshaper
Just ordered a 250mm square piece on eBay. Thanks.
@@proshaper By the way. Wray, I made this 20 sec clip for you. Try this method for Tig tacking.
See what you think. I love it!
th-cam.com/video/uK8afziX1j4/w-d-xo.html
Wray. One other thing you could make a video on, is single sided, Tig, pulse spot welding. Very very effective. Works better than my single sided gun on my spot welder. Supercedes plug welding.
I love Tig!
Great job! Thank you!
Thank you very informative I now see what I was doing wrong.
That's good but not too difficult because access is really easy both side of the panel. good anyway for beginers
Thank you so much for taking the time to make these instructional videos Wray ! Great job as usual...When welding the long beads, would you have been able to limit the shrink by welding an inch and a half at a time and let the metal cool ? I'm learning this fine art of Tig welding sheet metal and just seeing what you are welding is half the battle for me... Love the copper backing plate also, great idea. PLEASE keep up the awesome work !
When your welding on camera sometimes you don't do your best work.
I have learned a lot from your movies Wray a BIG thanks for sharing your knowledge.
I kind of have the same problem on the roof of my car, two steel plates with some kind of blanket in between. Should I remove the blanket completely or replace it with something that does not absorb moisture?
If replace with what?
Thanks for all help
now HE is the metal whisperer....
Inspirering workmanship!
Could you show the positioning of the dolly to hammer/slapper for shrinking and raising the metal?
Maybe on some clear plastic or gladwrap.
Thanks.
Bet he could if he had a clear plastic fender to repair.
Excellent thank you Wray that was a very helpful video.
I need to master the art of the slap file. There's still something I don't "get" about it (like, why hitting down makes the metal come up...lol) but it's really cool how it works. The other thing I took from this was that "edge of dolly" trick to bring the low spots of the weld up. I have them all the time, but usually just run another few welds to fill those spots in. I'm looking forward to trying this technique. Thanks for the expertise!
It lifts the metal because you're only "on dolly" on the low point. So you use a corner of the dolly, or whatever part of it fits behind the low, and when the slapper hits the metal it crushes the low spot between the dolly and slapper and stretches it, thus bringing it up.
So it's not so much the slapper, you could use a hammer too, it's just that you're localizing the stretch to the low spot so it gets lifted, but the metal around it doesn't.
@@JR-iy7pb So it's as if it's acting on the "outside rim" of the low spot. That makes sense, thanks!
I is more fulcrum and lever. There is some stretching but mostly rearranging the metal.
Would be helpful for me if you mentioned when hammering on and off dolly.
For those smaller lows could you have used a bullseye pick with a blunted tip to bring those up?
I have tried them and I'm not a fan of them.
Question: I've seen others hammer the welds on dolly before grinding down to flatten the weld and stretch the area that naturally shrinks from welding. I noticed you grind down the welds before doing any slapping/hammering on dolly. What is the advantage of doing it this way vs stretching/flattening the weld before grinding down? I'm reasonably good at TIG welding (for an amateur), but I still have a lot to learn when it comes to correcting weld distortion.
If you hit the welds when they are hot that is very effective. Like every process there are at least three or four ways that provide excellent results and a million ways to screw stuff up. I believe it is best to learn several ways to do every task.
@@proshaper Thanks!
@@proshaper I completely agree with that statement....like everything....everyone that’s been doing this for any length of time has there own little ways of fine tuning the process to fit there own way to get the same results...PERFECTION!
Great video, Wray. I've been using different shaped copper plumbing fixtures from Home Depot as heat sinks behind my welds but will definitely be heading to my nearest roofing supply store to get some sheets of copper too.
Does the dolly you were using have a specific name (or is it a specific brand?) - I could do with adding one of those to my collection too.
I call that dolly the bar of soap, I have one original and three copies we made. I use that the most of all of my dollies.
Have you every tried using silicon bronze, the idea is that its more brazing like and using less heat, maybe not better just another option
I know they are using silicon bronze today a lot in body shops but that is on lap joints not butt welds. High quality coachbuilding panel joining is always butt joints.
Nice job. Learned a lot. I'll definitely be checking out your other videos. First time on your channel. Can I get close results with a mig?
Very informative thanks Wray.
I've just had a skin cancer removed from my hand that looks very much like that lump on the back of your hand. Perhaps you should get it checked out?
What pulse settings and amps did you use?
I have. No problem there except for super dry hands from over washing. That spot was tested and now is scar tissue.
can you address the advisability of rounded corners when welding patch panels. Thanks
Hi Joel, Patch panels can have one seam ( a bottom door skin) two seams ( a corner of the bottom of a door) three seams ( a patch in the middle of the bottom of the door) four seams ( a patch in the middle of the door skin). Basic rule the more seams the more trouble and time. Once you master the needed skill sets nothing can stump you it just takes time to get it right and a shrinking disc ( shameless plug www.proshaper.com) Do rounded corners help? I haven't noticed any major differences.
wow, what a great video. Your skill is priceless sir. Question, I need to do something like this but I only have mig weld. can that be used instead of tig for this kind of work?
I'll address that issue on part two of my recent tig welding video. See my TH-cam homepage. th-cam.com/users/proshaper
Was for many years
IVE DONE MANY WITH MIG,NO PROBLEM
I noticed you were grinding across the weld more often here ,instead of with the weld, than you have done in previous videos. Is that because it is steel and you are less worried about thinning it than with aluminum or is it something else?
On the inside of the curved panel it is more difficult to grind with the weld. When videoing I'm always concerned with the time. I didn't grind any parent metal or make and eyebrows in the process and that is what is important.
@@proshaper Thanks for taking the time to explain. I appreciate it.
Thank you, this is good stuff. You've mentioned in other vids how much you like your Snap-on hammer. Do you know the model number on that one?
I'm not a person that remembers numbers, I remember the shape. It has a standard low crown primary head and a chisel shaped secondary end.
@@proshaper Thanks!
I have a 914 fender flare job coming and that is EXACTLY how I would have welded it with the copper backing to prevent oxidation on the back side. However I would have used a thicker copper for better heat absorption. my question: would a hand held English wheel be faster and better since the access on the plane part is very good (no sharp angles)? lastly why not using MIG with the same low amp setting since TIG has a higher heat input ?
Any English wheel would be bumping into the fender flange. A planishing hammer would work, I prefer slapper and dolly. Once you master a tig you will seldom use a mig. There is so much more control, and it is easy to learn.
Great video Wray. When you were tacking did you use a constant 40 Amps or were you adjusting the heat with the pedal. I don't have a pedal on my Miller Diversion.
I use the pedal. You can pulse the pedal. I believe you can install a pedal on a diversion.
I appreciate the details about the finishing process... when do you remove the extra bead from the back side, before taking out the top weld dimples ?
I ground most of the bead off the back side.
Great job as always from a master but I have a question, I would make the repair panel first on this simple job then marker or dykem the area and scribe around the new part to mark the cut and have a perfect fit very quickly. any reason you do it in reverse of my method ?
I like blue tape because it is easier to see. If scribing works well for you go for it.
I have a question, should we focus on finishing the repair before fixing the highs and lows or is it better to reshape as you complete the welding process?
You can do it both ways. No matter how wacky the panel will go you can fix it with a slapper, dolly and shrinking disc.
Would you have had less distortion if you didnt run the strait beads? I'm a novice welder doing MIG, and when I do a panel like this, I alternate around the panel to not warp the project. I know nothing about TIG, but would alternating around the panel while letting it cool have prevented the warping? Thanks for all the time you put into these videos.
When you weld in a patch panel with welds on four sides it is going to distort from shrinkage. I have total control over any distortion that might arise by using a torch and shrinking disc. Minimize the distortion but don't be fearful of it, you can control it with the right tools and techniques.
@@proshaper Thanks for taking the time to respond. Since only being around welding for just over a year, and all of it being OJT, finding people like you on youtube has given me a ton more confidence. I have had pretty good success on my car restoration project. Floor pans, frame components, etc. I wish I could by you a beer.
Great Work. The time is just under 1 hour. How long did it take in Real Time? Around hours ( ? ) #STAYSAFE
I think most of it was done on camera. Maybe two hours total.
Great video as always Wray. Was wondering if you were to tig weld smaller sections at a time (say 25mm/1 inch at a time), would it produce less distortion in a case like this?
Distortion will happen no matter what you do to fend it off. The skill that needs to be learned is how to correct the distortion.
@@proshaper agreed 100%.
When using dollie and slapper, when are you “on Dollie?”
When raising the low up and final planishing.
Considering the real time obviously involved, I hope that job wasn't priced on area affected. :-)*
If a panel's being inset, would it be practical or worthwhile to bevel the edges slightly, so that the outer edge of the patch is slightly larger than the inside, (i.e. the patch wouldn't actually fall through)?
Great Video Wray.
I would like to know what Filler rods you are using
Look like mild steel soft rods to match the parent metal
What's the filler rod code please
Hello wray.What do you think about fitzee s fabrications says is using only 18 gauge in every repair patch panel to prevent wrapping
He has a lot to learn yet....
I feel like I can get this same result with tack welding using mig, but it requires a lot more precision grinding. Probably because this is 20 gauge it warped, I don’t tend to see this on the 18 gauge I use. How do you do a patch like this if you don’t have access to the back?
i'm really considering one of the Chinese tig welders so maybe your next few repairs you could use that ?
The Everlast welder is a Chinese tig welder.
Wray, Could the English Wheel have achieved the same leveling and smoothing as the hand planishing tools you have been using here?
The mounting flange is in the way. You can use a planishing hammer, but you should know how to butt weld in a panel and be able to level it with just hand tools.
Have you ever tried laser welding material is cool touch when finished welding with next to no distortion
Haven't tried laser welding. As far as I know there are no inexpensive laser welders for auto panel work available. I know most jeweler use them now.
Wray is , of course, correct. Fiber lasers will work on automotive thickness panels but you are looking in the $18,000 range for a machine with the wattage to handle this gauge range. I’ve looked into this a fair amount and spoken with the companies who produce these machines. Depending on the machine , some will allow the use of filler wire ; however some at the moment are fusion only machines . Adjustment of the parameters for some metal alloys isn’t quite so straight forward as with a TIG machine either. I’m sure it will be the norm one day, but not practical for most shops at this time.
I use magnets to hold the patch i hate juggling clamps I just get frustrated 🤣
Magnets deflect the tig torch electron flow.
@@proshaper as long as you don't weld near them there fine get within half an inch or so and it will do some funny stuff though. with the magnets it will move aswell but that's sort of how I gauge it the gap will close as it shrinks then I hammer the tack until the gap opens up again then move onto the next one.
@@proshaper
I only tried to use a magnet with a TIG once, and quickly realized that the arc was now in the next lane over than the one I was driving in!
I like clamps; the more, the better!
For something like this repair would you be able to bring that into the English wheel to correct all the highs and lows in micro imperfections?
No the flange is too close. Dolly and slapper work or the planishing hammer.
Tell us about the file you used in this video. I would like to pick one up.
Thanks for you videos. I have watched some other. In those, they plannish the beads themselves add metal back into the shrunk area. What are your thoughts on this?
I would have to watch them to see what you are referring to.
I see a lot of this but I would like to see a repair where access to back is not possible. If you can't get back there to bring up the metal what then do you do if you don't want to use filler?
Good question, I will come up with a video addressing that .
@@proshaper This is always my issue as well nearly never acess to the back side
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Is that scratch start or lift?
Wray-- do you have a ball micrometer to measure the thickness of panels that have a curve ?
I try to make an accurate reading with a standard micrometer.
Wray, I use 75Argon/ 25CO2 mix for my welding gas on sheet metal, is that ok or should I switch to pure Argon?
I'm assuming you are mig welding? With the tig welder I use all of the time I use 100% argon for steel welding. I have two of the tig welders I use all the time the second one I use for aluminum welding with 50% argon 50% helium as the shielding gas. For mig welding the standard practice is 25% carbon dioxide/75% argon
Looks OK I thought you was going to actually make that patch blend away where the people with bad eyesight would not see the repair I think your welding and just alittle bonds would have that thing perfect I don't mean kill it with bonds but just ever so slight you do pretty good work
That patch was primer ready.
So if this is for beginners, I'm not sure I want to see the advanced stuff ;)
There is only one way to fix stuff of value. Make it look like it was when it was new.
Will the heat from shrinking disc temper the 20 gauge and strengthen to shape. My E type fender there is a bit of an issue below the front lense opening.
There will be no hardening or softening.
@@proshaper thank you
Whoops, different definition of patch panel. Thought you were making electrical patch panel.
Can this be solider instead of weld?
Not if you want the repair to be as good as you can possibly do.
Hey Wray don't you fusion weld cheers
Fusion welding works perfect if you do it perfectly. Most days you end up having to fill divots.
Sandwich Rust... mmm.. tastes like chicken.
The down thumb is back! Maybe you weren’t persnickety enough!
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I swear in the video you said you fusion welding with no filler welding rod... then your usung welding filler rod...
I mentioned fusion, which often leaves a lot of divots, that is why I chose to use a rod.
How do you spell jaguar - it’s not jagwaar is it - say it properly jag you got that right U AR - see it’s not like believing in your governments story about 9/11- which IS impossible
The hole top half of the guard dipps in like it's lost its shape when the long straight edge is put up against it
video above 29 min into vid..is that long tig weld real time or sped up please..its very fast