Another famous pithy Spartan response was when Philip of Macedon sent a message to the Spartan army in 345BCE saying: "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city." The Spartans sent back a one-word reply: "If" Admittedly that story is a lot cooler if you leave out the second part of it where Philip of Macedon did *exactly* what he said he was going to do and gave the Spartans such a brutal pummelling that they never really recovered from it.
A few years later, when Alexander and the bulk of the Macedonian army are away conquering Persia, the Spartans try to rise up again. And the Macedonian general left behind to mind the store crushed them again in a matter of months.
@@digitaljanus And Alexander referred to it as a "clash of mice," because he was off fighting a real war and couldn't be bothered to care what the children back in Greece were doing.
And people try to argue because Sparta wasn’t destroyed or fully conquered it showed they were badass. When really Sparta wasn’t really a big prize and Phillip didn’t see it worth the fight so instead destroyed most there lands and took there territory
I kind of like this new angle on the "Come and get them" and "If" replies where instead of badass defiance it's just a pithier version of fucking around before finding out lol
@@TheZombifiedGuy It's even worse than that. Before Philip came down and ravaged the Spartan countryside, Sparta was pummeled by Thebes who was capably led by two generals. But the Theban - Spartan War cost both sides so much. Once that was over, that was when Philip invaded.
"Xerxes sends a letter to Leonidas saying surrender your weapons. And Leonidas says, you know, come and get them. And then, of course, the Persians came and took their weapons." I love him!
@@BobInGreek no, Persians still exist, and Parthians came 70 years after Alexander in 250BC and took Persia back. and then what happened to greeks, lol, Romans ensIaved Greeks for sixteen hundred years and then Muslim Ottomans ensIaved Greeks for almost five hundred years, while Persian became a Superpower 70 or 80 years after Alexander and then they had Parthains who defeated roma ton of times, most famous "battle of carhea" and then the even more powerful Sassanian Empire. but greece suffered two thousand years of sIavery. lol Greeks are the most cucked race on earth.
@@MarcFun Tell me: what part of 300 suggests that it's trying to be an accurate historical film? Was it the Xerxes being seven foot tall? Was it the literal giant with huge blades for hands? Was it the goat man?
@@Cailus3542 I am always surprised people think there was any attempt to make this a historical account - the story in the comic/movie is told as a pre-battle propaganda piece by one spartan to hype up his comrades for the next battle XD Analyzing 300 without keeping that in mind is a bit of a miss. Still I love listening to Roel Konijnendijk simply to get more historical details :)
@@Cailus3542 The historic setting. The names of countries and people. The weapons, the clothes... Lots of things suggested that this is based on a historic event. Not knowing much about that event, the average viewer has no idea what apart from the fantastical aspect would be historically accurate or what wouldn't.
@@erih2934 Yeah I was kind of surprised he didn't pick up on that, even if you somehow miss the ending to connect the dots, the narrator (Dilios) regularly gives away how allegorical and embellished his storytelling is, like when he refers to the Persian's using incendiary weapons (fire pots) as "magic".
Professor Konijnendijk never ceases to make history intriguing and deliver his fact-checks with an amazing wit and politeness. "I really hope I don't need to specify that war rhinos aren't a real thing..." His almost apologetic delivery had me howling!
War rhino makes as much sense as a war elephant, the Persians used war elephants and both lived within the empire. I know it didn’t happen but I don’t think it’s that retarded of a suggestion.
@@jakeybball It's very much a stupid suggestion and doesn't make as much as a war elephant at all but you gotta have some knowledge of animal husbandry to know this. But most people now don't have that considering it's not necessary in modern times for the most part.
@@jakeybball War elephants make already very little sense because they are cumbersome and easily spooked at which point they become as much of a danger for their own army then the enemy. They were of course used but its often mentioned how they were not quite as effective as one migt think and quite dangerous to their own armies. Elephants at least can be ridden and steered whereas rhinos are not really tamable and quite agressive. They cant easily be ridden, have poor eyesight and are way less agile then horses ... so as depicted in the movie if you let loose a rhino to charge at your enemy ... best case scenario it would just get scared and turn around and worst case run through your own troops. They are also not very intelligent when compared to elephants or horses. It would be way more sensible to release wild bulls but even that we dont do because animals dont tend to charge headfirst into danger on their own.
You can imagine it as the narrator saying "A spartan was taken from his home" and then a SpongeBob title card with that French accent voice: "later that day" as the boy comes back home for dinner.
I'm an avid history enthusiast and deeply value historical accuracy, but 300 is one of the few films where the over-the-top fantasy elements don't bother me. I think this is because it's clearly framed as a story being narrated around a campfire, like an ancient legend told to inspire soldiers-where the protagonists are mythical heroes, the enemies are supernatural creatures, and the enemy king is ten feet tall. It's more of a fairy tale than a historical account, and I actually appreciate it for that reason. The exaggerated depictions of the foreign enemy feel fitting, capturing the feverish, distorted way soldiers might have described an unknown foe in a time before photographs or the internet-a world shaped by superstition and myth, where anything beyond Greece was shrouded in legend. In that sense, it feels more authentic to the era than something like Braveheart, which purports to depict actual history but takes far more liberties with the truth.
That's the thing, Hollywood versions won't be historically accurate period, and most likely won't even be 100% authentic for source material (like legends, which aren't historically accurate in first place). So why don't go all out? I hate this 2000s trend of doing everything "realistic", like whose idea was to make superheroes more grounded? Or Troy without mythology despite it being a myth book... worst offender is Ridley Scott's Exodus IMO, trying to make a Biblical allegory without supernatural (but with whitewashing). Just make fiction stories actually fantastical, the crown won't fall off your head.
@@KasumiRINA I agree with you except I do enjoy a good well done grounded historical story too, and there are some. Outlaw King had inaccuracies as well, but I also enjoyed it as a direct contrast to Braveheart with historically arcuate clothing and weapons. I really enjoyed HBO's Rome series, and It is definitely best off being as realistic and grounded as possible. I enjoy seeing something closer to what these real stories must have looked like in real life. However I totally agree in the case of fiction, you may as well run with it, and I would love to see a heavily stylized version of the Iliad gods and all. There is definitely room for both.
One thing Roel didn't mention: the historical Leonidas was actually about 60-years-old during the Battle of Thermopylae; definitely not as young as he was portrayed in this film. Xerxes was about 38, more than two decades younger than Leonidas.
Also, another fun fact, the Greeks were actually the ones who invented war elephants. The first war elephants were trained during Alexander's conquests in Asia and then they were used for the first time in the civil wars between Alexander's generals after Alexander died. Ironic since the movie depicts the Greeks as seeing war elephants as mysterious, exotic beasts they've never encountered before.
@@MisterJang0 Greeks didn't invent war elephants. The Indians had the war elephants first, since elephants are literally from India and areas of Africa. It was called the Indian war elephant and Darius had them in the battle of Gaugamela. Later on Alexander's generals used them as well. The persians definitely had them way before the greeks. There are sources that track the use of war elephants by the Persians even further that this, but in 331BC the persians guaranteed had 15 indian war elephants on the battle of Gaugamela against Alexander. The first time Alexander actually fought against war elephants was in the battle of Hydaspes river against the Indians. So greeks did not invent the war elephant.
@@HiveFleetUlfang1 I think they were more implying that Roel probably didn't realize how accurate his joke about "what he was snorting" actually was lol Frank Miller notoriously did a shitload of cocaine when he wrote this lmao
@@Batchall_Accepted And university professors (and a lot of academics of various stripes) have been known to take said extra-curriculars, so I believe the commenter was making a pithy remark about Roel's likely knowledge of this.
@@chengkuoklee5734Or tshirts with an embroidered shovel on the front upper side, and on the back in big letters "WHERE IS YOUR DITCH?"! Is someone able to make these? Or maybe we can ask the University of Oxford where Dr. Roel works to make it official department merch? Trust me, their admission numbers would skyrocket if they did this!
I guess that was a reference to the building of the great wall of China, where dead builders were used in the wall itself. (dunno if this is bs or not, but I heard it many many years ago)
Well, Sparta didn't have city walls. It was their first attempt. "Old proverb says 'Sparta's fortifications are a wall of men'. Instructions unclear. Built wall from dead Persians. Please advise."
I see where the confusion is. That's not Robert Pattinson. That's Edward Cullen. They selected Robert Pattinson to play Edward Cullen because of the likeness. Edward Cullen is very well versed in history because of the thousands of high school classes he has attended.
I love Roel, but I always feel bad that he's having to critique mostly movies that are obviously ahistorical. He deserves a historically accurate movie to break down
Unfortunately those types of films are few and far between. On the first Insider video, however, I think he comments that Alexander got close to being correct as they had an Oxford professor advising on it.
Rhinos have poor eyesight and low intelligence. There is a video of a Rhino trying to defend her calf from Hyenas.... she charged her own calf by mistake and sent it to oblivion. I guess they can't be trained for battles, but still cool to see because they are magnificent.
“You should be digging ditches! Many many ditches! When you’re done digging one- dig another one!” My husband and I literally yell this at the TV now 😂
The idea of Xerxes arriving and departing e-v-e-r s-o s-l-o-w-l-y on his dais is hilarious. It reminds me of the guy getting run over by the road-roller in Austin Powers.
Me: Hey I think I'm gonna attend Lincoln College Oxford Society: Cool, to study at a prestigious school? Me: No, to listen to Roel Konijnendijk PhD about digging ditches
@@TheYogesh7777 It actually deserves a lot of credit for at least getting the main story across. Honestly a lot of the silly stuff in it at least is based on some sort of history. Obviously its a fantasy blockbuster movie with ridiculousness in it, but it also is clearly not trying to be 100% historically accurate with monsters and such etc.. Its a really interesting battle and point in history which I would not have looked up and read about if not for this movie!
The ancient historical accounts of this battle are legendary for their iconic quotes, some of which I believe appear in the movie, perhaps most famously when Xerxes demanded Leonidas and his men lay down their weapons, to which Leonidas replied, "Molon labe"..."come and take them". At a similar encounter, a Persian emissary threatened "our arrows will block out the sun", to which a lieutenant of Leonidas replied, "so much the better, then we will have our battle in the shade." My personal favorite, however, is when Leonidas was marching off to battle, Gorgo asked him what she should do if he doesn't return. Leonidas said, "Marry a good man and have good children." And she did, by all accounts, becoming a very prominent figure in Spartan society. These quotes are all fanciful inventions of these ancient chroniclers, but are a big part of why these events have so captivated our imagination. These ancient "historians" were master storytellers.
@@TheYogesh7777 thats because it is, its based on a graphic novel that is told by a spartan, it was never meant to be accurate. At the end of the movie when he is giving that speech he is telling them all the story in a glorified way to get them pumped
Dear Dr. Roel, can you PLEASE look at the fact that this video is online since 3hrs and already got 15.000views. And most if not all of us are here for our favorite, kind and knowledgeable Ditch-guy. ❤❤❤ Please either do more of those videos or please upload more of your lectures, which by now, I am certainly not the only one who knows them by heart. Pretty please? I promise to build an extra ditch in front of my appartment's ditch.
Favorite, kinda and knowledgeable? You forgot to add funny and lighthearted. :) Also, I'm going on a limb here, but I guess your existing apartment ditch wasn't there before you started watching Dr. Konijnendijk? 😄
@@Pancake_Nix You are absolutely right,- I indeed forgot funny, lighthearted and witty, too. And also, yes, my existing appartment ditch was dutifully dug after Dr.Roel enlightened me in two famous movie reviews about the necessity of having a ditch,- even though, he admittedly mentioned that he wasnt entirely sure whether a ditch and a second ditch would actually work that well when facing the massive horde of undead ice zombies of the Night King. But,- as he recommended I made sure to place my trebuchets not outside my ditch perimeter to make up for the zombie issue. Do you think, he will read our comments and realize that our common dedication to ditches in general and ditching everything as soon as we see his videos, will entice him to take part in more videos or even upload his lectures, so we can follow along? Maybe we could petition for a Patreon? Might be an idea, dont you think?
@@nachtschatten8710 We'll have to go with Patreon as the chance of him reading this are near zero. Maybe let's also make another petition to have mandatory education for Hollywood producers that artillery does indeed go behind the line and skirmishers actually go *in front* of the battle-line. You don't want to accidentally hit your fellow soldiers in the back and lobbed arrows are very inaccurate and actually lose a lot of kinetic energy traveling up, fighting gravity. But Hollywood just doesn't get tired of arrows flying in long arches (while also on fire). In all seriousness tho, I don't see him being a full TH-camr, it would seem he likes his job more than some YT likes, but it would be cool to have some more dedicated content from our favorite Dutch Ditch Guy. Like you said, they can be lectures and other historical dives, not just movie reactions.
Hehe, same here. As soon as I saw that it was him in the thumbnail, I dropped whatever else I originally wanted to watch. Dr.Roel is historical click bait!
As a Greek I find 300 entertaining, but I actually think Roel goes way too easy on it here! One thing he doesn’t mention in this video is the biggest flaw of 300. “You have many slaves Xerxes, but few soldiers”. Or the line at 7:58. This movie is obsessed with depicting the Spartans as “free men” in response to the great slave empire that is Persia. But the Spartans were a major slave state, very few people living in Sparta were free. Most of them were helots, ethnically Greek slaves who were sometimes ritualistically killed by Spartan warriors. Meanwhile the Achaemenid Empire, while not perfect, was pretty open to the freedoms of people under the empire. This movie also over-emphasizes the unity of Greeks - the Spartans would team up with the Persians to sack Athens during the Peloponnesian War a few years later. If you want history, don’t trust 300 at all haha, it’s just a crazy graphic novel.
What Leonidas means with " you have many slaves " is from a Spartan perspective who valued their indepedence and freedom above everything else. Most of the soldiers here except for the " immortals " are being under the rule of a foreign conquerer, forced to traval abroad to fight Persian wars with their blood is like being a slave, just not the chain around wrist working in a field one. " This movie also over-emphasizes the unity of Greeks - the Spartans would team up with the Persians to sack Athens during the Peloponnesian War a few years later. " This comment doesnt make any sense, the movie is only based on events happening during the second persian invasion, and during this time they were united, and the movie is bad for showing only this because the Peleponnesian war happend later in history many years AFTER the movie ends? What were you thinking here?
The Spartans were free men. Them keeping other people as slaves didn't make the Spartans themselves less free. In fact, it gave them even more free time since the slaves were working instead. As for unity, the victory at Plateea came exactly from the Greek unity. That it didn't last long only proves that Greeks were as human as we are today, and prone to being bribed and corrupted by wealth and power.
@@andrew3203 but the spartan slaves outnumbered the spartan citizens, so its stupid for leonidus to criticize xerxes while sparta is even worse lol. its silly everytime leonisdus crticizes others while sparta and himself are the same- if not worse lol
@@terrycruise-zd5tw This is where so many people missunderstand. Leonidas is not criticizing or taking any moral highground here, he is just mocking Xerxes army for being composed of mostly slaves. Basically you got the quantity but we got the quality.
I remember studying ancient history at uni and we covered the ancient world in film. I did NOT realise how many oriental tropes this film had as a young boy Shout out to Orientalism by Ed Said
@@Imortalcat Ok I know, but essentialy it's the same thing. Iran is your original name and how you called yourselves for the most centuries of your history. Only the west called you Persia
Exactly, ever since I saw his first video I always ask myself why don’t these movies and tv shows hire guys like him? There is no way being more accurate would mean less cinematic
If they did it would be boring as hell. If they actually did that then the movie would bomb cause actual history isn't as exciting as Hollywood makes it out to be. Are there cool moments? Absolutely but not like the movies portray stuff
Because it would usually only interest history dorks like us. Just look how popular this ridiculous movie was. I was so excited to see this in theaters and can't explain how disappointed I was.
Yes! He will have the Spartans dig 8000 ditches (including up the mountains and under the sea) and when the Persians attack, the song played will be Dragula with the lyric " Dig through the ditches and burn through the witches" on loop.
Good ole' Ditch Man. Literally never let's us down. The amount of sass within the first 2 minutes is everything I want when watching a movie with someone who is an expert in the topic. 2:00 "Yeah, until like, later that day!"
“You should be digging ditches! Many many ditches! When you’re done digging one- dig another one!” My husband and I literally yell this at the TV now 😂
As much as i love 300 it’s essentially Greek Braveheart. Honestly the story of the “300” really needs its own “outlaw king” where it’s essentially the same story/historical period but it’s more grounded in the real history. The only other piece of media to even remotely tackle the story of the 300 Spartans and the battle of Thermopylae was Assasins creed Oddessy and it is just as Accurate as 300 is.
@@MichalKaczorowski On what Greek propaganda? Frank Miller invented a lot of these depictions from thin air. Most of it is not based on any actual greek propaganda that we know of.
@@dormikdelronExactly. Herodotus doesn't present the Persians in this way, he shows through his work a fascination and respect for Persian history so "is just Greek propaganda" isn't an accurate argument.
Exactly. I am literally reading Tom Holland's excellent translation of The Histories and one thing that stands out, actually, is Herodotus' admiration for the Persians
Oh yeah, then there's the whole "free men stood against a tyrant" line. Like, the ratio of the population of Sparta of citizens and slaves was overwhelmingly slaves. There were way more slaves than citizens and, whether it was taken from the graphic novel or Snyder wrote the line himself, the idea that the Spartan society is a society of "free men" fighting against "a tyrant" is so shamefully laughable it's insane.
Come to think of it, this film could easily be about the Athenians instead, like the sequel. Athens was hardly "free" as we would describe it in 2024, but they were a heck of a lot closer than Sparta.
Yeah but I suppose to him the only actual Spartans _were_ citizens so it's _technically_ true in his eyes (kinda fun to see the "no true Scotsman" fallacy being committed over a thousand years before Scotland even existed :).
One of those movies I remember watching with my dad as a kid, had me and my friends running around being “Spartans” in the woods. Good times. Still my favourite movie.
300 is one of those movies I always give a pass on realism. It was one of those movies I'd sneak up at night when I was probably too young and watch on the family TV with the volume on 1 or 2%. The inaccuracies, to me, are almost better because it takes the form of a mythical story being told within a mythical story. The details are bound to get skewed and embellished. I love it!
20:39 I thought the reason the immortals are portrayed as demonic scary creatures in this movie is because the whole thing is a story told around a campfire by the narrator, who is talking to fellow Spartans who are yet to face the persians. The weird Persian monsters are not literal, they are the narrator exaggerating things and making their enemies out to be literal ghouls and exotic beasts so that the men will fight harder.
Can we all just take a moment to appreciate the fact that we have this much reliable or semi-reliable recordings of these historical events. We need people like this to teach us what our ancestors and predecessors went through.
I really like Roel, partly because of his delightfully smug attitude, so his first sigh at the baby myth is an excellent way of getting things started. 😊 Love seeing such an elaborate deep dive!!
I always got the impression from the sources that the rationale between the 300 (and 700 Thespians) staying behind, was to cover the retreat of the rest of the allies at the pass.
Always a pleasure to hear Dr. Roel's detailed historical insight. I'm a huge ancient history buff, especially Greece and Persia, and I dug so many ditches in anticipation of this! This movie gets zero points for no ditches dug, but 100 points for David Wenham: Faramir, Captain of Gondor, who showed his quality! I just noticed now, after watching Zach Snyder's Rebel Moon movies, how much slow-mo he uses and frankly its draggy (although when I first watched 300 when it first came out it was novel).
Yes yes, we all know the movie is adapted from a comic book, especially when it's mentioned in the beginning of the video. While the movie and the comic lean more towards fantasy, this video provides a look on the more historical side of the story that inspired them. So I don't know what some people shitting their diapers about.
In tabletop RPGs, skimpy female adventurer outfits are often called "distract-the-monsters armor". This Spartan army in "300" is obviously wearing "distract-the-Persians" armor. ;)
Honestly, the skimpy Spartans is about the only thing I think this movie got totally right. The ancient greeks would've been all over it lol Maybe they could've been just a bit more lubed up in olive oil? But other than that, perfectly captures the spirit
As a iranian I would like to add some things to this the first and most important is the Persians were famous for being merciful Syrus the great is the oldest known in history that created human rights ( syrus cylinder) so the fact that they show Persians as this barbaric kings and generals is just disrespectful second thing is about the immortals they were called immortals beacuse they looked similar to each other when one died in the field one other person took the others place so in the fight it looked like their not dying atleast what our history books said the last thing is persian cavalry is exactly very old and was a persian version of the cataphract it so basically the cataphract which was a roman was romes response to the persian caverly.
I also like to add one last thing Persians were zerastrians (spelling might be off) the 3 most famous qoutes of ahora mazda was say no evil do no evil hear no evil
I heard some Iranians saying the word " immortal " is in fact wrong, they were called something more similiar to " companions " like the Macedonian cavalry, but no idea whats correct. Persians were indeed famous for being merciful with human rights, and should have much credit for it. But they were also a global expanding empired who waged war all over the known world, so Persians being the " bad guy " in some movies is just normal, just like the Brittish empire, Romans etc. Also many people revolted against them, Egyptians were treated very poorly for example which lead to one of the many uprisings that happend.
@@jimmyandersson9938 I've heard that also but in our history books they are called az "javidan" as in never dying or immortal but I know what your saying it's very uncommon
The elite Persian force was called "immortals" because they replaced the dead soldiers as soon as they could,so the force had always the same number of soldiers,so they were typically "immortals"
As an Iranian you may have been presented with a somewhat whitewashed version Persian history when you were raised. The Persian’s granted more autonomy than other empires of their era to those who surrendered to them, but those who resisted (i.e. tried to maintain their independence/freedom) were still colonised, massacred and enslaved. They may have been more lenient to the people who accepted subjugation, but they were just as brutal as others to those who defended themselves from Persian imperialism. People would probably be less inclined to show ancient Persian kings and generals as barbaric if their ancestors hadn’t been attacked and enslaved by them. This is a stylized depiction of a fairly barbaric slave-empire (even if others at the time were barbaric too by modern standards).
this was so good! 47 minutes seemed long at the start, but it went by in a flash and i watched the whole thing in one sitting. Subscribed to binge!! Cheers!
I love that if you are disgraced you are picked last at ball games and that the sources specifically mention this! That was my favorite moment of the video.
He doesnt have one. 😢 Only those fortunates who study at his university get to listen to him all the time,- which I find is a shame as even his lectures arent all uploaded. We clearly need more Dr.Roel
@@jerry12314 Not like there wasn't ample American involvement prior to 9/11 in the Middle East right? Not like the timing of this film as soldiers were being deployed to Iraq was a factor right? Stay quiet, adults are speaking.
I read a very interesting seven part disquisition about Sparta by a historian, and I came away with the lasting impression that it's a miracle the Spartans survived long enough as a distinct cultural group to leave a legacy of any kind, let alone the one they seem to enjoy among the hoi polloi.
I love this guy. I think he is so unique and entertaining because you can see how interested and in love he is with his subject, and that intrinsic motivation is contagious. For me at least.
There are a number of points in this video that are already disputed by other historians: 1) The religious festival of Carneia _did_ cause the Spartan elders to forbid an expedition north, so Leonidas went on 'manouevres' with his personal guard. 2) The Hot Gate _was_ thinner then. In 2500 years the sea _has_ moved a mile out from the shore. 3) No reason for that final battle? It was known to be a delaying tactic while waiting for Carneia to finish and the main Sparta army could come north. Leonidas did sent a messenger back into Greece to go to Sparta with his last words: ‘Go tell the Spartans, thou who pass by, that here, obedient to their laws, we lie.’ So they created a plaque from his fiinal words. I suggest anyone who is interested to also look elsewhere for information. But otherwise a good explanation.
This guy needs his own youtube channel at this point
Yes please. I rewatch his videos all the time. Fascinating and so many ditches
He should call it "diggin' ditches"
He should call it "diggin' ditches"!
i like so too, still not sure if there is a too much about a good thing. if he has the material, sure bring them on, or some recordings of lectures.
Hes picking on a graphic novel for Christ's sake...not the encyclopedia brittanica....this guy should chill out and realise that
Q: How do i win ancient battles?
A: Dig ditches
Q: How many?
A: Yes.
And when you thought you had dug enough ditches, dig a lot more.
"Where's your ditch?" 😄
Honestly, I dont really understand how Europe isn't just one big ditch.
"They're just...going around, sir"
"But.....the ditches"
"Just going around, sir"
@@Marauder99991 we tryed. got half way from the North sea to the alps. maybe next time.
Another famous pithy Spartan response was when Philip of Macedon sent a message to the Spartan army in 345BCE saying: "You are advised to submit without further delay, for if I bring my army into your land, I will destroy your farms, slay your people, and raze your city."
The Spartans sent back a one-word reply: "If"
Admittedly that story is a lot cooler if you leave out the second part of it where Philip of Macedon did *exactly* what he said he was going to do and gave the Spartans such a brutal pummelling that they never really recovered from it.
A few years later, when Alexander and the bulk of the Macedonian army are away conquering Persia, the Spartans try to rise up again. And the Macedonian general left behind to mind the store crushed them again in a matter of months.
@@digitaljanus And Alexander referred to it as a "clash of mice," because he was off fighting a real war and couldn't be bothered to care what the children back in Greece were doing.
And people try to argue because Sparta wasn’t destroyed or fully conquered it showed they were badass. When really Sparta wasn’t really a big prize and Phillip didn’t see it worth the fight so instead destroyed most there lands and took there territory
I kind of like this new angle on the "Come and get them" and "If" replies where instead of badass defiance it's just a pithier version of fucking around before finding out lol
@@TheZombifiedGuy It's even worse than that. Before Philip came down and ravaged the Spartan countryside, Sparta was pummeled by Thebes who was capably led by two generals. But the Theban - Spartan War cost both sides so much. Once that was over, that was when Philip invaded.
"Xerxes sends a letter to Leonidas saying surrender your weapons. And Leonidas says, you know, come and get them. And then, of course, the Persians came and took their weapons."
I love him!
Persians lost the war and disappeared from map of the earth by Alexander
@@BobInGreek That's crazy man. How did the Spartans do when they fought the Macedonians? Did they win?
@@BobInGreek no, Persians still exist, and Parthians came 70 years after Alexander in 250BC and took Persia back. and then what happened to greeks, lol, Romans ensIaved Greeks for sixteen hundred years and then Muslim Ottomans ensIaved Greeks for almost five hundred years, while Persian became a Superpower 70 or 80 years after Alexander and then they had Parthains who defeated roma ton of times, most famous "battle of carhea" and then the even more powerful Sassanian Empire. but greece suffered two thousand years of sIavery. lol Greeks are the most cucked race on earth.
@@BobInGreek lol, you greeks have done nothing, lost 90% of the war you fought, even now look at the size of your country
@@aksheygupta6237 It is not the size of his country that matters. It is the amount of debt they need to cancel off their books lol
"Taken from their homes and plunged into a world of violence!" Yeah, until later that day. HA! That's given me a right good chuckle.
Yeah, Day Camp sounds less "hooya"!
You've shown half the film here. The editor is a madman.
Madness???….. THIS IS SPARTA!!!
Considering that if we remove slow-mo scenes the movie gets half of its feature length, the official Ditch guy has reacted to the whole movie.
@jammysmears4077
Yeah! (Re)Spoiler alert!...about an 18 year old movie about a thousand year old conflict that we know the end of...but still!
@@fernandoaugustoribeiro3288somebody actually did this, the movie only got 6 or 8 minutes shorter
The best kind of madman. Giving us as much as possible of what we wanted.
"I have no idea what Frank Miller was snorting when he came up with this."
Gave me a good giggle.
Just another super hero movie disguised into a story happened in history. which is false
@@MarcFun Tell me: what part of 300 suggests that it's trying to be an accurate historical film? Was it the Xerxes being seven foot tall? Was it the literal giant with huge blades for hands? Was it the goat man?
@@Cailus3542 I am always surprised people think there was any attempt to make this a historical account - the story in the comic/movie is told as a pre-battle propaganda piece by one spartan to hype up his comrades for the next battle XD
Analyzing 300 without keeping that in mind is a bit of a miss. Still I love listening to Roel Konijnendijk simply to get more historical details :)
@@Cailus3542
The historic setting. The names of countries and people. The weapons, the clothes... Lots of things suggested that this is based on a historic event. Not knowing much about that event, the average viewer has no idea what apart from the fantastical aspect would be historically accurate or what wouldn't.
@@erih2934 Yeah I was kind of surprised he didn't pick up on that, even if you somehow miss the ending to connect the dots, the narrator (Dilios) regularly gives away how allegorical and embellished his storytelling is, like when he refers to the Persian's using incendiary weapons (fire pots) as "magic".
48 minutes with dr. Konijnendijk? Heck yes, please.
I think you mean the *DITCH* *DIGGER*
He is a legend
He is a leg
Google offered to translate your message to English! 🤣
@@ctakitimu Wonderful :DD
Professor Konijnendijk never ceases to make history intriguing and deliver his fact-checks with an amazing wit and politeness. "I really hope I don't need to specify that war rhinos aren't a real thing..." His almost apologetic delivery had me howling!
War rhino makes as much sense as a war elephant, the Persians used war elephants and both lived within the empire. I know it didn’t happen but I don’t think it’s that retarded of a suggestion.
@@jakeybball It's very much a stupid suggestion and doesn't make as much as a war elephant at all but you gotta have some knowledge of animal husbandry to know this. But most people now don't have that considering it's not necessary in modern times for the most part.
@@jakeybball War elephants make already very little sense because they are cumbersome and easily spooked at which point they become as much of a danger for their own army then the enemy. They were of course used but its often mentioned how they were not quite as effective as one migt think and quite dangerous to their own armies. Elephants at least can be ridden and steered whereas rhinos are not really tamable and quite agressive. They cant easily be ridden, have poor eyesight and are way less agile then horses ... so as depicted in the movie if you let loose a rhino to charge at your enemy ... best case scenario it would just get scared and turn around and worst case run through your own troops. They are also not very intelligent when compared to elephants or horses. It would be way more sensible to release wild bulls but even that we dont do because animals dont tend to charge headfirst into danger on their own.
Roel: I specialize in ...
me: DITCHES!!
Roel: Greek warfare and Sparta.
me: 😮
We need Dr. Ditch videos at least weekly.
Roel was also a part-time standup comedian in college, which explains a lot LOL
Really? God that makes so much sense
Please tell me this is real
Tell us more!
Oh God tell us more about this!
Sadly this is not true, I just participated in Bright Club during the final year of my PhD
th-cam.com/video/0S7oi1Xn59c/w-d-xo.html
I'm only in the beginning of the video and already cackling over the "Until like later that day" line.
Dude has a really awesome dry wit.
You can imagine it as the narrator saying "A spartan was taken from his home" and then a SpongeBob title card with that French accent voice: "later that day" as the boy comes back home for dinner.
I'm an avid history enthusiast and deeply value historical accuracy, but 300 is one of the few films where the over-the-top fantasy elements don't bother me. I think this is because it's clearly framed as a story being narrated around a campfire, like an ancient legend told to inspire soldiers-where the protagonists are mythical heroes, the enemies are supernatural creatures, and the enemy king is ten feet tall. It's more of a fairy tale than a historical account, and I actually appreciate it for that reason. The exaggerated depictions of the foreign enemy feel fitting, capturing the feverish, distorted way soldiers might have described an unknown foe in a time before photographs or the internet-a world shaped by superstition and myth, where anything beyond Greece was shrouded in legend. In that sense, it feels more authentic to the era than something like Braveheart, which purports to depict actual history but takes far more liberties with the truth.
This is bullshtaa
That's the thing, Hollywood versions won't be historically accurate period, and most likely won't even be 100% authentic for source material (like legends, which aren't historically accurate in first place). So why don't go all out? I hate this 2000s trend of doing everything "realistic", like whose idea was to make superheroes more grounded? Or Troy without mythology despite it being a myth book... worst offender is Ridley Scott's Exodus IMO, trying to make a Biblical allegory without supernatural (but with whitewashing). Just make fiction stories actually fantastical, the crown won't fall off your head.
@@KasumiRINA I agree with you except I do enjoy a good well done grounded historical story too, and there are some. Outlaw King had inaccuracies as well, but I also enjoyed it as a direct contrast to Braveheart with historically arcuate clothing and weapons. I really enjoyed HBO's Rome series, and It is definitely best off being as realistic and grounded as possible. I enjoy seeing something closer to what these real stories must have looked like in real life. However I totally agree in the case of fiction, you may as well run with it, and I would love to see a heavily stylized version of the Iliad gods and all. There is definitely room for both.
One thing Roel didn't mention: the historical Leonidas was actually about 60-years-old during the Battle of Thermopylae; definitely not as young as he was portrayed in this film. Xerxes was about 38, more than two decades younger than Leonidas.
Also, another fun fact, the Greeks were actually the ones who invented war elephants. The first war elephants were trained during Alexander's conquests in Asia and then they were used for the first time in the civil wars between Alexander's generals after Alexander died. Ironic since the movie depicts the Greeks as seeing war elephants as mysterious, exotic beasts they've never encountered before.
@@MisterJang0 Greeks didn't invent war elephants. The Indians had the war elephants first, since elephants are literally from India and areas of Africa. It was called the Indian war elephant and Darius had them in the battle of Gaugamela. Later on Alexander's generals used them as well. The persians definitely had them way before the greeks. There are sources that track the use of war elephants by the Persians even further that this, but in 331BC the persians guaranteed had 15 indian war elephants on the battle of Gaugamela against Alexander. The first time Alexander actually fought against war elephants was in the battle of Hydaspes river against the Indians. So greeks did not invent the war elephant.
@@MisterJang0 And you assume your average Greek from Greece would've ever seen an elephant just because Alexander "Invented" war elephants?
"I had no idea what Frank Miller was snorting when he did this...."
Ohhhh, you sweet summer child.
He's a University professor. I'm sure he can imagine what Miller was on...
i laughed out loud when he said that.
I was chuckling before, but this line absolutely killed me.
@@HiveFleetUlfang1 I think they were more implying that Roel probably didn't realize how accurate his joke about "what he was snorting" actually was lol
Frank Miller notoriously did a shitload of cocaine when he wrote this lmao
@@Batchall_Accepted And university professors (and a lot of academics of various stripes) have been known to take said extra-curriculars, so I believe the commenter was making a pithy remark about Roel's likely knowledge of this.
I see a video with this guy, I get my ‘build more ditches’ T-shirt ready and click play.
Dude, I built a ditch...from which I watched this video.
We should have t shirts: Dig Ditch Throw Stones.
There are t-shirts? (Googling intensifies)
@@chengkuoklee5734 Boil water; costs you nothing.
@@chengkuoklee5734Or tshirts with an embroidered shovel on the front upper side, and on the back in big letters "WHERE IS YOUR DITCH?"!
Is someone able to make these? Or maybe we can ask the University of Oxford where Dr. Roel works to make it official department merch? Trust me, their admission numbers would skyrocket if they did this!
"I don't think Persians would make very good mortar"
😂😂
acktshually Apparently adding blood makes better cement :)
I guess that was a reference to the building of the great wall of China, where dead builders were used in the wall itself. (dunno if this is bs or not, but I heard it many many years ago)
Well, Sparta didn't have city walls. It was their first attempt.
"Old proverb says 'Sparta's fortifications are a wall of men'. Instructions unclear. Built wall from dead Persians. Please advise."
Ask the aztecs how they could! because they did it with other tribes hahaha.
300: "the boy was taken from his mother and plunged into a world of violence"
Roel: yeah until later that day
I love this man
It's amazing that Robert Pattinson is so well versed in history.
I see where the confusion is. That's not Robert Pattinson. That's Edward Cullen. They selected Robert Pattinson to play Edward Cullen because of the likeness. Edward Cullen is very well versed in history because of the thousands of high school classes he has attended.
@@matthewbrown5228 Come on. That's Cedward.
He looks nothing like Pattinson
I love Roel, but I always feel bad that he's having to critique mostly movies that are obviously ahistorical. He deserves a historically accurate movie to break down
A documentary, the Cleopatra "My grandmother told me..."
Unfortunately those types of films are few and far between. On the first Insider video, however, I think he comments that Alexander got close to being correct as they had an Oxford professor advising on it.
CinemaSins NEEDS to hire Roel.
@@timothytinsumli8098 cinemaSins needs to stop existing.
@@luvahadowsdolls hell yeah a full Alexander movie breakdown by Roel? That would be a dream
"War Rhinos are not a thing"
- Roel Konijnendijk, 2024
In Wakanda, maybe ;)
My favorite line, "I don't think Persians would make very good mortar"
Rhinos have poor eyesight and low intelligence.
There is a video of a Rhino trying to defend her calf from Hyenas.... she charged her own calf by mistake and sent it to oblivion. I guess they can't be trained for battles, but still cool to see because they are magnificent.
To sum up
“I don’t know what Frank Miller was snorting”
Neither do we 🤣
@@valeforyoru well duh, it they had high intelligence they wouldn't go to war
Legend states that "300" refers to the number of ditches dug by the Spartans.
Never heard that.
@@xScooterAZx its a joke
😂The Persians weren't prepared to do a steeplechase!
@@A0A4ful 🤣
@@TheGrumbliestPuppy Ahh
“You should be digging ditches! Many many ditches! When you’re done digging one- dig another one!”
My husband and I literally yell this at the TV now 😂
The idea of Xerxes arriving and departing e-v-e-r s-o s-l-o-w-l-y on his dais is hilarious. It reminds me of the guy getting run over by the road-roller in Austin Powers.
Spartans lose not because they were outnumbered but because they didn't dig ditches 😢
But, you gotta admit, they built at least one wall.
@@Pan_BlazejYeah, but as Dr.Roel stated... "Persians dont make up good mortar." so, they had better dug a ditch
They were not loose. Their formations were tight. But they did lose the battle.
They did build a wall, though, and a wall is just a ditch that goes up instead of down.
Lose
Me: Hey I think I'm gonna attend Lincoln College Oxford
Society: Cool, to study at a prestigious school?
Me: No, to listen to Roel Konijnendijk PhD about digging ditches
A near hour long video of this man talking. 1000% down for it. Loved it.
44:10 prof. farted and thy left it in 😂😂. He cracked a smile to 😂😂
I caught that too! 😂😂😂😂
It's no surprize Leonidas was betrayed.
Ephialtes apparently couldn't have stood his disregard to trenches.
Every lost battle has to have his traitor. It’s good for nationalism. Good drama and all…
Every time the movie actually gets something semi-historically accurate I'm pleasantly surprised lol
I am surprised how many things were actually correct. I thought it was total fictional.
@@TheYogesh7777 It actually deserves a lot of credit for at least getting the main story across. Honestly a lot of the silly stuff in it at least is based on some sort of history. Obviously its a fantasy blockbuster movie with ridiculousness in it, but it also is clearly not trying to be 100% historically accurate with monsters and such etc.. Its a really interesting battle and point in history which I would not have looked up and read about if not for this movie!
The ancient historical accounts of this battle are legendary for their iconic quotes, some of which I believe appear in the movie, perhaps most famously when Xerxes demanded Leonidas and his men lay down their weapons, to which Leonidas replied, "Molon labe"..."come and take them". At a similar encounter, a Persian emissary threatened "our arrows will block out the sun", to which a lieutenant of Leonidas replied, "so much the better, then we will have our battle in the shade."
My personal favorite, however, is when Leonidas was marching off to battle, Gorgo asked him what she should do if he doesn't return. Leonidas said, "Marry a good man and have good children." And she did, by all accounts, becoming a very prominent figure in Spartan society.
These quotes are all fanciful inventions of these ancient chroniclers, but are a big part of why these events have so captivated our imagination. These ancient "historians" were master storytellers.
@@TheYogesh7777 thats because it is, its based on a graphic novel that is told by a spartan, it was never meant to be accurate. At the end of the movie when he is giving that speech he is telling them all the story in a glorified way to get them pumped
When I heard the double-flute was accurate I was stoked.
Dear Dr. Roel, can you PLEASE look at the fact that this video is online since 3hrs and already got 15.000views.
And most if not all of us are here for our favorite, kind and knowledgeable Ditch-guy. ❤❤❤
Please either do more of those videos or please upload more of your lectures, which by now, I am certainly not the only one who knows them by heart.
Pretty please?
I promise to build an extra ditch in front of my appartment's ditch.
Favorite, kinda and knowledgeable? You forgot to add funny and lighthearted. :)
Also, I'm going on a limb here, but I guess your existing apartment ditch wasn't there before you started watching Dr. Konijnendijk? 😄
@@Pancake_Nix You are absolutely right,- I indeed forgot funny, lighthearted and witty, too.
And also, yes, my existing appartment ditch was dutifully dug after Dr.Roel enlightened me in two famous movie reviews about the necessity of having a ditch,- even though, he admittedly mentioned that he wasnt entirely sure whether a ditch and a second ditch would actually work that well when facing the massive horde of undead ice zombies of the Night King. But,- as he recommended I made sure to place my trebuchets not outside my ditch perimeter to make up for the zombie issue.
Do you think, he will read our comments and realize that our common dedication to ditches in general and ditching everything as soon as we see his videos, will entice him to take part in more videos or even upload his lectures, so we can follow along?
Maybe we could petition for a Patreon? Might be an idea, dont you think?
@@nachtschatten8710 We'll have to go with Patreon as the chance of him reading this are near zero.
Maybe let's also make another petition to have mandatory education for Hollywood producers that artillery does indeed go behind the line and skirmishers actually go *in front* of the battle-line.
You don't want to accidentally hit your fellow soldiers in the back and lobbed arrows are very inaccurate and actually lose a lot of kinetic energy traveling up, fighting gravity. But Hollywood just doesn't get tired of arrows flying in long arches (while also on fire).
In all seriousness tho, I don't see him being a full TH-camr, it would seem he likes his job more than some YT likes, but it would be cool to have some more dedicated content from our favorite Dutch Ditch Guy. Like you said, they can be lectures and other historical dives, not just movie reactions.
This could've lasted 3 hours and I would've watch it till the end
I'll aspire my whole life to the low-key sass in Roel's delivery of "Um, there's no oracle at Sparta."
ANOTHER new video featuring Dr. Dig-a-Ditch? My morning just improved drastically!
"I got 99 problems but a DITCH aint one."
Missed an opportunity to use 300 instead of 99.
underrated comment 🙌👌
On behalf of all history buffs: “don’t ditch this guy; he Roels.”
Dr. Konijnedijk is always an instant click on the Video for me. Thanks for having him again. Back to digging more ditches !
Hehe, same here. As soon as I saw that it was him in the thumbnail, I dropped whatever else I originally wanted to watch. Dr.Roel is historical click bait!
I like that you don't get angry about historical inaccuracy, but you use it to teach us :)
Despite a serious lack of ditches, this guy remains my favourite of all the history experts that pop up on these channels.
As a Greek I find 300 entertaining, but I actually think Roel goes way too easy on it here! One thing he doesn’t mention in this video is the biggest flaw of 300. “You have many slaves Xerxes, but few soldiers”. Or the line at 7:58.
This movie is obsessed with depicting the Spartans as “free men” in response to the great slave empire that is Persia. But the Spartans were a major slave state, very few people living in Sparta were free. Most of them were helots, ethnically Greek slaves who were sometimes ritualistically killed by Spartan warriors. Meanwhile the Achaemenid Empire, while not perfect, was pretty open to the freedoms of people under the empire.
This movie also over-emphasizes the unity of Greeks - the Spartans would team up with the Persians to sack Athens during the Peloponnesian War a few years later. If you want history, don’t trust 300 at all haha, it’s just a crazy graphic novel.
What Leonidas means with " you have many slaves " is from a Spartan perspective who valued their indepedence and freedom above everything else. Most of the soldiers here except for the " immortals " are being under the rule of a foreign conquerer, forced to traval abroad to fight Persian wars with their blood is like being a slave, just not the chain around wrist working in a field one.
" This movie also over-emphasizes the unity of Greeks - the Spartans would team up with the Persians to sack Athens during the Peloponnesian War a few years later. "
This comment doesnt make any sense, the movie is only based on events happening during the second persian invasion, and during this time they were united, and the movie is bad for showing only this because the Peleponnesian war happend later in history many years AFTER the movie ends? What were you thinking here?
The Spartans were free men. Them keeping other people as slaves didn't make the Spartans themselves less free. In fact, it gave them even more free time since the slaves were working instead. As for unity, the victory at Plateea came exactly from the Greek unity. That it didn't last long only proves that Greeks were as human as we are today, and prone to being bribed and corrupted by wealth and power.
@@andrew3203 but the spartan slaves outnumbered the spartan citizens, so its stupid for leonidus to criticize xerxes while sparta is even worse lol. its silly everytime leonisdus crticizes others while sparta and himself are the same- if not worse lol
@@terrycruise-zd5tw This is where so many people missunderstand. Leonidas is not criticizing or taking any moral highground here, he is just mocking Xerxes army for being composed of mostly slaves. Basically you got the quantity but we got the quality.
Roel usually goes more into detail regarding the slaves topic when he writes on Reddit. He is a regular of r/askhistorians.
We're just getting blessed at this point by his presence on youtube
I remember studying ancient history at uni and we covered the ancient world in film. I did NOT realise how many oriental tropes this film had as a young boy
Shout out to Orientalism by Ed Said
As a Persian I’ll forgive this exactly because of what frank miller was snorting
@@hosseinnoor392 always glad to meet a true immortal from the days when Persia still existed.
Persia still stands 🙄@@andrew3203
Persians is what only Greeks called you, your are called Iranians
@@TMPOUZI Persian is our ethnicity and Iranian is our nationality
@@Imortalcat Ok I know, but essentialy it's the same thing. Iran is your original name and how you called yourselves for the most centuries of your history. Only the west called you Persia
I love learning little details like being picked last in a ballgame. It’s not epic, but the silly pettiness is so relatable on a human level.
The Scottish spartan accent is biblically accurate
😂😂😂
Sure is
😆
😂😂 gold
Someone needs to make a historically authentic movie about Thermopylae and hire Roel as historical advisor.
Exactly, ever since I saw his first video I always ask myself why don’t these movies and tv shows hire guys like him? There is no way being more accurate would mean less cinematic
History isn't as cool or plot willing always,there's a reason why they don't do it
If they did it would be boring as hell. If they actually did that then the movie would bomb cause actual history isn't as exciting as Hollywood makes it out to be. Are there cool moments? Absolutely but not like the movies portray stuff
Because it would usually only interest history dorks like us. Just look how popular this ridiculous movie was. I was so excited to see this in theaters and can't explain how disappointed I was.
Yes! He will have the Spartans dig 8000 ditches (including up the mountains and under the sea) and when the Persians attack, the song played will be Dragula with the lyric " Dig through the ditches and burn through the witches" on loop.
Man I could listen to Roel talk about this kind of stuff for years straight....
Good ole' Ditch Man. Literally never let's us down. The amount of sass within the first 2 minutes is everything I want when watching a movie with someone who is an expert in the topic. 2:00 "Yeah, until like, later that day!"
“You should be digging ditches! Many many ditches! When you’re done digging one- dig another one!”
My husband and I literally yell this at the TV now 😂
As much as i love 300 it’s essentially Greek Braveheart.
Honestly the story of the “300” really needs its own “outlaw king” where it’s essentially the same story/historical period but it’s more grounded in the real history.
The only other piece of media to even remotely tackle the story of the 300 Spartans and the battle of Thermopylae was Assasins creed Oddessy and it is just as Accurate as 300 is.
@@MichalKaczorowski On what Greek propaganda? Frank Miller invented a lot of these depictions from thin air. Most of it is not based on any actual greek propaganda that we know of.
@@dormikdelronExactly. Herodotus doesn't present the Persians in this way, he shows through his work a fascination and respect for Persian history so "is just Greek propaganda" isn't an accurate argument.
Exactly. I am literally reading Tom Holland's excellent translation of The Histories and one thing that stands out, actually, is Herodotus' admiration for the Persians
@@MichalKaczorowskiand yet it’s the only film out there that actually depicts the events of the Persian Greek war literally no one else has since,
@@MichalKaczorowski I don't even think it would even be Greek propaganda given how anglicized Sparta is in the movie.
Never realised Michael Fasbender was in this movie lol.
Also McNutty...did not recognize him he was so tan here lmao
Yeah it's like "Blackhawk Down" where every time I watch it I notice another actor and think "he was in this? How didn't I realize that?"
The casting for that movie was _wild_ in retrospect
@@PeterTeal77 Yeah or Band of Brothers. Every time I watch that series I see another actor who made a breakthrough later.
I also forgot that Cersei was Gorgo lol
Oh yeah, then there's the whole "free men stood against a tyrant" line. Like, the ratio of the population of Sparta of citizens and slaves was overwhelmingly slaves. There were way more slaves than citizens and, whether it was taken from the graphic novel or Snyder wrote the line himself, the idea that the Spartan society is a society of "free men" fighting against "a tyrant" is so shamefully laughable it's insane.
Yeah... kind of echoes the whole "slaveowners who wanted to be free" vibe of the declaration of independence
Come to think of it, this film could easily be about the Athenians instead, like the sequel. Athens was hardly "free" as we would describe it in 2024, but they were a heck of a lot closer than Sparta.
And every year, Sparta declared war on its slaves. To give a legal (and religious) reason for keeping its slaves in slavery.
Yeah but I suppose to him the only actual Spartans _were_ citizens so it's _technically_ true in his eyes (kinda fun to see the "no true Scotsman" fallacy being committed over a thousand years before Scotland even existed :).
@@TheZombifiedGuy reading your comments makes it clear how absolutely clueless you are.
One of those movies I remember watching with my dad as a kid, had me and my friends running around being “Spartans” in the woods. Good times. Still my favourite movie.
Leonidas: *requests no poems or monuments*
Spartans: *puts a poem on a monument*
This is real big Spreckels energy
21:05 - "I have no idea what Frank Miller was snorting when he came up with this".
I see a Roel video, I watch a Roel video.
One hundred points for the proper pronunciation of "Darius."
300 is one of those movies I always give a pass on realism. It was one of those movies I'd sneak up at night when I was probably too young and watch on the family TV with the volume on 1 or 2%. The inaccuracies, to me, are almost better because it takes the form of a mythical story being told within a mythical story. The details are bound to get skewed and embellished. I love it!
20:39 I thought the reason the immortals are portrayed as demonic scary creatures in this movie is because the whole thing is a story told around a campfire by the narrator, who is talking to fellow Spartans who are yet to face the persians. The weird Persian monsters are not literal, they are the narrator exaggerating things and making their enemies out to be literal ghouls and exotic beasts so that the men will fight harder.
Yes! Everyone forgets 300 is framed as and crafted as Spartan propaganda
“I have no idea what Frank Miller was snorting, when he came up with this….”
Kinda explains the whole movie tbh lol
It's an action movie based of a graphic novel never once did Frank Miller say the graphic novel was historical accurate
@theworldswickedestclown He was also a racist nut job that explains a lot of things we see in the movies.
@@theworldswickedestclown Nobody thinks that it is. The movie still has major crack head energy
Idk either but man it was so much fun
that explains Herodotus.
After you build a ditch...you build another...on a serious note this guy is very informative
Ah, fijn. Roel heeft er verstand van! Go Roel, you rule!
Does anyone else appreciate how sassy Roel Konijnendijk is in this video?
As an Iranian, thank you for at least proving to me by making this video that there are people who tell the truth ❤
Iran sucks
Greeks were practically barbarians compared to Persia.
Give us more of this guy please we love the Ditch guy
Ditchman: The Chronicles
Can we all just take a moment to appreciate the fact that we have this much reliable or semi-reliable recordings of these historical events. We need people like this to teach us what our ancestors and predecessors went through.
I really like Roel, partly because of his delightfully smug attitude, so his first sigh at the baby myth is an excellent way of getting things started. 😊 Love seeing such an elaborate deep dive!!
I always got the impression from the sources that the rationale between the 300 (and 700 Thespians) staying behind, was to cover the retreat of the rest of the allies at the pass.
Always a pleasure to hear Dr. Roel's detailed historical insight. I'm a huge ancient history buff, especially Greece and Persia, and I dug so many ditches in anticipation of this!
This movie gets zero points for no ditches dug, but 100 points for David Wenham: Faramir, Captain of Gondor, who showed his quality! I just noticed now, after watching Zach Snyder's Rebel Moon movies, how much slow-mo he uses and frankly its draggy (although when I first watched 300 when it first came out it was novel).
Poor Roel! He's exhausted correcting everything 😂😂
Taking signatures to petition Dr. Ditch to have his own channel here 👇🖋️📜
Yes yes, we all know the movie is adapted from a comic book, especially when it's mentioned in the beginning of the video. While the movie and the comic lean more towards fantasy, this video provides a look on the more historical side of the story that inspired them. So I don't know what some people shitting their diapers about.
How to spin a total defeat into a "valiant stand". Herodotus, the ultimate fantasy boy, who lived in Persia lol
Absolutely loved this, Roel is fantastic as always.
In tabletop RPGs, skimpy female adventurer outfits are often called "distract-the-monsters armor". This Spartan army in "300" is obviously wearing "distract-the-Persians" armor. ;)
Honestly, the skimpy Spartans is about the only thing I think this movie got totally right. The ancient greeks would've been all over it lol
Maybe they could've been just a bit more lubed up in olive oil? But other than that, perfectly captures the spirit
@@maybeyourbaby6486I would also like more olive oil on them... for historical reasons
As a iranian I would like to add some things to this the first and most important is the Persians were famous for being merciful Syrus the great is the oldest known in history that created human rights ( syrus cylinder) so the fact that they show Persians as this barbaric kings and generals is just disrespectful second thing is about the immortals they were called immortals beacuse they looked similar to each other when one died in the field one other person took the others place so in the fight it looked like their not dying atleast what our history books said the last thing is persian cavalry is exactly very old and was a persian version of the cataphract it so basically the cataphract which was a roman was romes response to the persian caverly.
I also like to add one last thing Persians were zerastrians (spelling might be off) the 3 most famous qoutes of ahora mazda was say no evil do no evil hear no evil
I heard some Iranians saying the word " immortal " is in fact wrong, they were called something more similiar to " companions " like the Macedonian cavalry, but no idea whats correct. Persians were indeed famous for being merciful with human rights, and should have much credit for it.
But they were also a global expanding empired who waged war all over the known world, so Persians being the " bad guy " in some movies is just normal, just like the Brittish empire, Romans etc. Also many people revolted against them, Egyptians were treated very poorly for example which lead to one of the many uprisings that happend.
@@jimmyandersson9938 I've heard that also but in our history books they are called az "javidan" as in never dying or immortal but I know what your saying it's very uncommon
The elite Persian force was called "immortals" because they replaced the dead soldiers as soon as they could,so the force had always the same number of soldiers,so they were typically "immortals"
As an Iranian you may have been presented with a somewhat whitewashed version Persian history when you were raised.
The Persian’s granted more autonomy than other empires of their era to those who surrendered to them, but those who resisted (i.e. tried to maintain their independence/freedom) were still colonised, massacred and enslaved. They may have been more lenient to the people who accepted subjugation, but they were just as brutal as others to those who defended themselves from Persian imperialism.
People would probably be less inclined to show ancient Persian kings and generals as barbaric if their ancestors hadn’t been attacked and enslaved by them. This is a stylized depiction of a fairly barbaric slave-empire (even if others at the time were barbaric too by modern standards).
this was so good! 47 minutes seemed long at the start, but it went by in a flash and i watched the whole thing in one sitting. Subscribed to binge!! Cheers!
"I don't think Persians would make very good mortar."
That was a sentence I didn't know I needed to hear.
The Flintstones: How accurate is it?
They’re the modern Stone Age family! 😂
Give us more of Roel deepdives!
i just love this guy..
I love that if you are disgraced you are picked last at ball games and that the sources specifically mention this! That was my favorite moment of the video.
300: Says first sentence.
Prof Roel: *long sigh*
I could watch him speak on Ancient Greek history all day long. Seriously...where is his youtube channel??
He doesnt have one. 😢 Only those fortunates who study at his university get to listen to him all the time,- which I find is a shame as even his lectures arent all uploaded. We clearly need more Dr.Roel
An interesting review. You're enthusiastic but sober, unlike a lot of reviewers.
This movie has very big "made relatively soon after 9/11" vibes
Yep...
Sure lets just forget how its from 1998 comic book.
@@jerry12314 Not like there wasn't ample American involvement prior to 9/11 in the Middle East right?
Not like the timing of this film as soldiers were being deployed to Iraq was a factor right?
Stay quiet, adults are speaking.
@@jerry12314 I said "movie".
@@naan-jf9gh What's that got to do with 300? The movie was scene-by-scene word for word from the comics in 1998.
That long list of punishments for the Spartan that survived and the fact that he ultimately didn’t get redeemed was hilarious.
I read a very interesting seven part disquisition about Sparta by a historian, and I came away with the lasting impression that it's a miracle the Spartans survived long enough as a distinct cultural group to leave a legacy of any kind, let alone the one they seem to enjoy among the hoi polloi.
Sounds interesting
Can one find it online?
Thoroughly enjoyed that, quality stuff.
The 'Long War' series by Christian Cameron is a great historical fiction for those interested in the Persian Wars.
I love this guy. I think he is so unique and entertaining because you can see how interested and in love he is with his subject, and that intrinsic motivation is contagious. For me at least.
Yaay my favorite Historian is back !! ❤❤
"I dont know what he was snorting when He came up with this" 😂 line of the the video.
History hit is awesome and we like this guy
Pedantic tvvat
@@hissingsidll750You? Maybe. Dr.Roel? NEVER EVER. 😅 He is awesome.
I absolutely loved this deep dive. More please!
That was really interesting. More of this please
This 45 minutes flew by. Wonderful.
There are a number of points in this video that are already disputed by other historians:
1) The religious festival of Carneia _did_ cause the Spartan elders to forbid an expedition north, so Leonidas went on 'manouevres' with his personal guard.
2) The Hot Gate _was_ thinner then. In 2500 years the sea _has_ moved a mile out from the shore.
3) No reason for that final battle? It was known to be a delaying tactic while waiting for Carneia to finish and the main Sparta army could come north.
Leonidas did sent a messenger back into Greece to go to Sparta with his last words:
‘Go tell the Spartans, thou who pass by, that here, obedient to their laws, we lie.’
So they created a plaque from his fiinal words.
I suggest anyone who is interested to also look elsewhere for information.
But otherwise a good explanation.
why do i have such a huge crush on this man? sigh
hey get in line pal
You aren't alone honey 😂
Perhaps because you have a ditch fetish?
No idea but you arent alone in that. 😂😅
Cuz he's a ditch expert?