No truer words ever said. We just played a game and I had 6 peacekeepers. All dead from close combat. They would have survived with 3 wounds. The change makes no sense. But we must persevere. Thanks Kingo.
I agree that the Pathfinders really lost their identity with this. I don't think TAG was too busted, except I can't remember if you could TAG and then EVERYONE got the +1. I think If it was just "the next shot" or something would have helped them keep their identity. If it weren't for the Fusion Rifle and the Missile Bike, I would say that they really lost a lot of their already limited AP. Overall, I'm interested to try Enforcers still, but I feel like list-building is just so dramatically different for them now.
I've played a few games with them and it is really tough. It was really a shame, They were at a good place, but the RC (Now that I'm gone), don't play Enforcers, so they get the Nerf Bat. Tag was for models with the TAG riffle, the Splat let overtone use it. I'm gonna keep trying. Look for the next Bat Rep and see. Thanks for watching, as always!!!
I presume the base change on the DOG is due to the LOS changes and any part of the model that overhangs the base no longer counting as a valid target. I've not got any enforcers but I guess it would overhang a fair amount on a 25mm?
The dog drone hangs over a little bit, but not more than any other model. The thing is a size 1 should be on a 25mm base. That’s my main issue. Thanks Ian!
Great review of the Enforcers. I agree with on a lot of things. Pathfinders losing TAG is a big deal, I hope it's loss is countered by new rules like purchasing a reroll with a command dice. The pathfinders are at least a cheap 4+ RA unit, which is good to have. The Dog being a size 1 on a 40mm is strange, and probably an error.
Don’t know if you can tell in the video that I’m upset with the loss of Tag. It crippled the Pathfinders. Not happy. The Dog Drone thing, not sure. Im not changing my bases. It doesn’t make any sense. Thanks Lordnovas.
So i normally agree with you but pathfinders were a bit of a problem. You could literally spam pathfinders and slaughter opponents. The pathfinder sargeant was a shoe in and you picked the wrong leader if you didnt choose him. Scout plus tag meant you basically had a sniper rifle shooting all enemies round 1. (1 die for scouting to height and 1 for tag). For how they are now they are still amazing. Compare them to a commando. You shoot better and have scout to gain height. All for just 2 more points. I also think no AP on any sniper rifles is a good thing. What i like about this is they took the AP but gave you something by allowing moving and shooting or steady aiming. 2 extra dice is already powerful. To give AP seemed compounding power too much. That said they really needed more options. Like what does an enforcer do if the enemy just uses smoke? Without the frag shot for the missile launcher smoke is just a huge counter. The thermal rifle is the only option i guess. The jetbike missile launcher is beastly. Far better than the strider to me. Id really like to see some oddball changes to help with area of effect. In my opinion the sentry gun could have a long range blast shot option. Blast does no damage but can knock stuff out of smoke. Living legends are expensive but some are worth it for sure. Forward observer is the only one i could see taking for enforcers since it gives a scout frag weapon plus the value of comms relay.
I agree with almost everything you wrote, but the pathfinders. They were fine the way they were. There were plenty of counters for them, but the RC couldn’t figure that out so they needed them, unnecessarily. Why do GCPS riot troopers fight on 4, but pathfinders on 6. Also, you can’t compare them to Commandos, the Enforcers are supposed be the elite of the galaxy, who are no better than the Commandos. I think that’s just wrong, and doesn’t make sense. Scout wasn’t a problem is you could get up in there face early. With a 6+ fight, that was their weakness. Why do Khalishi move on a 2-3 and fight on a 3+, with AP 1 and go up 1 point. How can you justify the nerf to the Pathfinders? AP on Sniper was good. It was a good counter and worth the price. I do like the sniper scope change. It makes sense. You always had a problem with too much AP, so you should be happy. Living legends aren’t worth it.
@@familyofgamers777 yeah i didnt like so much AP. As far as kalyshi go i do think they are too good but pathfinders were the best troop. Asterians are definately the strongest list in 3rd with all of their insane options like the nigh unstoppable spectre. That list is too good but kalyshi did at least get a nerf with the dervish splat so that helps. They do need toned down though. I guess i feel like commandos are a good comparison because they were the enforcers before the enforcers existed. Those orcs were supposed to be pretty elite. If you gave pathfinders all of that stuff back how would you justify taking any of the other troop options? Whenever i played enforcers the issue i had with them is yeah i could try this troops but pathfinders are better so why would i do that? Then add in a couple of jetbikes with missile launchers for frag and AP weapons and that was it nothing else in the list. I just dont like the idea of one option being SO much more viable than every other option in the list. You are right enforcers need more. Maybe some new models are in the works to help them get elite again. I hope some good stuff makes it in.
@@familyofgamers777 As someone who WAS keen on Enforcers before seeing this (possible new player), think I'll wait it out and see what happens in the coming months. Who know, rats may be the way to go after all :(
Rats are super strong! They have a lot of answers to a lot of the battlefield situations. Enforcers are still good, with the armor and lack of AP in the game. Also, a good faction to get into when you are learning the game.
I had tons of success with the pathfinder spam. It’s takes a while to set up the correct sequence of Tag, but it really worked. I agree, no reason to take them now. Thanks Chris.
@@familyofgamers777 What's TBE? I'm pondering adding a sci fi skirmish game to my, mostly historicals, collection and have been wavering between Deadzone & Malifaux. Played my first fame of DZ the other day against a guy who loves it. I tend to prefer the human aesthetic in these games, so the rats do nothing for me, but in all honesty, I was a bit underwhelmed with the Enforcers. It's as if Mantic have gone the opposite way with these than GW went with Marines. On the TAG front, when I look at Easy Army, Pathfinders have TAG pistols and rifles, did it come back? Or am I missing something, do they have the weapons but missing a special ability? Have to say I'm edging towards Malifaux more and more :(
@@Edward-Plantagenet What's up Ed! TBE is Team Building Exercise, where Rob, Jack and I (Coach) each make a list and talk about them. It's a monthly show, with a little Tom Foolery, but we do go through the factions. Check them out on this channel : th-cam.com/play/PLk6-0NqdCuDuYgjpGCb_pzLlFQCjpBilo.html The enforcers had a leader in 2nd edition, had a splat that gave everyone with Tag riffle an extra dice. That has been taken out and I'm not happy about it. There was no logical reason to take it out. This is the only issue I had with them, other than Pathfinders fighting on 6+. Check out some of the other Deadzone videos on this channel. I think you will enjoy Deadzone more than Malifux. Ask any question you want, I answer all questions. Welcome to the fold brother!
@@familyofgamers777 Thanks for that, I'll take a look at the TBE. I like the idea of Malifaux and I think it could be fun game but it does seem a bit too much like a deck building game with minis and to cary the game more you need, well, more boxes LOL. Deadzone I like though, just on the look out for any alarm bell stuff so I don't end up making the mistakes I did of buying into 40K, Kill Team and Necromunda (Fail, fail, fail). I'm now even pondering the Firefight starter given that it gives 40+ of the factions I like, but possibly way too many9 other than perhaps having the option to build multiples of all the different weapon configurations. So it's Firefight or DZ unit boxes. Hmmmmm. Does seem odd to have nerfed Pathfinder CC. You'd think they'd be better (Ranger / SAS types), not more wimpy.
If you do get the FF starter, it’s good to have all the options in place for DZ. You could even play more points to get more models on the table. Yea, still upset with the Pathfinder nerf, but not so much that’s I won’t play the game.
I agree that the peacekeepers should be hp 3,humanitys finest soldier deserves more!
No truer words ever said. We just played a game and I had 6 peacekeepers. All dead from close combat. They would have survived with 3 wounds. The change makes no sense. But we must persevere. Thanks Kingo.
I agree that the Pathfinders really lost their identity with this. I don't think TAG was too busted, except I can't remember if you could TAG and then EVERYONE got the +1. I think If it was just "the next shot" or something would have helped them keep their identity.
If it weren't for the Fusion Rifle and the Missile Bike, I would say that they really lost a lot of their already limited AP. Overall, I'm interested to try Enforcers still, but I feel like list-building is just so dramatically different for them now.
I've played a few games with them and it is really tough. It was really a shame, They were at a good place, but the RC (Now that I'm gone), don't play Enforcers, so they get the Nerf Bat. Tag was for models with the TAG riffle, the Splat let overtone use it. I'm gonna keep trying. Look for the next Bat Rep and see. Thanks for watching, as always!!!
I presume the base change on the DOG is due to the LOS changes and any part of the model that overhangs the base no longer counting as a valid target. I've not got any enforcers but I guess it would overhang a fair amount on a 25mm?
The dog drone hangs over a little bit, but not more than any other model. The thing is a size 1 should be on a 25mm base. That’s my main issue. Thanks Ian!
The change of Tag to a splat really highlights the power of the Prey keyword, which is nearly the same.
Yes, I agree! But then give the pathfinders prey. Or just leave them with Tag. Really bad deletion. Thanks Champ
Wow that is a good solution. Give pathfinders prey. That would make them work well with the new melee enforcers too.
@@adamkinne6467 Exactly!
Great review of the Enforcers. I agree with on a lot of things. Pathfinders losing TAG is a big deal, I hope it's loss is countered by new rules like purchasing a reroll with a command dice. The pathfinders are at least a cheap 4+ RA unit, which is good to have. The Dog being a size 1 on a 40mm is strange, and probably an error.
Don’t know if you can tell in the video that I’m upset with the loss of Tag. It crippled the Pathfinders. Not happy. The Dog Drone thing, not sure. Im not changing my bases. It doesn’t make any sense. Thanks Lordnovas.
In summary; change bad.
Pretty much.
I don't play these guys much so I forgot how tag works. was that like extra wound die or something???
It gave anyone with a Tag rifle 1 extra die while shooting. You had to Tag the target first, with a short action.
So i normally agree with you but pathfinders were a bit of a problem. You could literally spam pathfinders and slaughter opponents. The pathfinder sargeant was a shoe in and you picked the wrong leader if you didnt choose him. Scout plus tag meant you basically had a sniper rifle shooting all enemies round 1. (1 die for scouting to height and 1 for tag).
For how they are now they are still amazing. Compare them to a commando. You shoot better and have scout to gain height. All for just 2 more points.
I also think no AP on any sniper rifles is a good thing. What i like about this is they took the AP but gave you something by allowing moving and shooting or steady aiming. 2 extra dice is already powerful. To give AP seemed compounding power too much.
That said they really needed more options. Like what does an enforcer do if the enemy just uses smoke? Without the frag shot for the missile launcher smoke is just a huge counter. The thermal rifle is the only option i guess.
The jetbike missile launcher is beastly. Far better than the strider to me.
Id really like to see some oddball changes to help with area of effect. In my opinion the sentry gun could have a long range blast shot option. Blast does no damage but can knock stuff out of smoke.
Living legends are expensive but some are worth it for sure. Forward observer is the only one i could see taking for enforcers since it gives a scout frag weapon plus the value of comms relay.
I agree with almost everything you wrote, but the pathfinders. They were fine the way they were. There were plenty of counters for them, but the RC couldn’t figure that out so they needed them, unnecessarily. Why do GCPS riot troopers fight on 4, but pathfinders on 6. Also, you can’t compare them to Commandos, the Enforcers are supposed be the elite of the galaxy, who are no better than the Commandos. I think that’s just wrong, and doesn’t make sense. Scout wasn’t a problem is you could get up in there face early. With a 6+ fight, that was their weakness. Why do Khalishi move on a 2-3 and fight on a 3+, with AP 1 and go up 1 point. How can you justify the nerf to the Pathfinders?
AP on Sniper was good. It was a good counter and worth the price. I do like the sniper scope change. It makes sense. You always had a problem with too much AP, so you should be happy.
Living legends aren’t worth it.
@@familyofgamers777 yeah i didnt like so much AP. As far as kalyshi go i do think they are too good but pathfinders were the best troop. Asterians are definately the strongest list in 3rd with all of their insane options like the nigh unstoppable spectre. That list is too good but kalyshi did at least get a nerf with the dervish splat so that helps. They do need toned down though.
I guess i feel like commandos are a good comparison because they were the enforcers before the enforcers existed. Those orcs were supposed to be pretty elite.
If you gave pathfinders all of that stuff back how would you justify taking any of the other troop options? Whenever i played enforcers the issue i had with them is yeah i could try this troops but pathfinders are better so why would i do that? Then add in a couple of jetbikes with missile launchers for frag and AP weapons and that was it nothing else in the list. I just dont like the idea of one option being SO much more viable than every other option in the list.
You are right enforcers need more. Maybe some new models are in the works to help them get elite again. I hope some good stuff makes it in.
They are coming out with the Peacekeeper with Phase claws, but I don’t think that’s enough. I hope we have more models on the way.
@@familyofgamers777 As someone who WAS keen on Enforcers before seeing this (possible new player), think I'll wait it out and see what happens in the coming months. Who know, rats may be the way to go after all :(
Rats are super strong! They have a lot of answers to a lot of the battlefield situations. Enforcers are still good, with the armor and lack of AP in the game. Also, a good faction to get into when you are learning the game.
A shame. Used to love my pathfinder/D.O.G. lists. Not the most successful, but still fun to play. No reason to take them now.
I had tons of success with the pathfinder spam. It’s takes a while to set up the correct sequence of Tag, but it really worked. I agree, no reason to take them now. Thanks Chris.
Why do Mantic hate Enforcers? Listen to TBE to find out!
Yes, everyone must listen to this months TBE!!!
@@familyofgamers777 What's TBE? I'm pondering adding a sci fi skirmish game to my, mostly historicals, collection and have been wavering between Deadzone & Malifaux. Played my first fame of DZ the other day against a guy who loves it. I tend to prefer the human aesthetic in these games, so the rats do nothing for me, but in all honesty, I was a bit underwhelmed with the Enforcers. It's as if Mantic have gone the opposite way with these than GW went with Marines. On the TAG front, when I look at Easy Army, Pathfinders have TAG pistols and rifles, did it come back? Or am I missing something, do they have the weapons but missing a special ability? Have to say I'm edging towards Malifaux more and more :(
@@Edward-Plantagenet What's up Ed! TBE is Team Building Exercise, where Rob, Jack and I (Coach) each make a list and talk about them. It's a monthly show, with a little Tom Foolery, but we do go through the factions. Check them out on this channel : th-cam.com/play/PLk6-0NqdCuDuYgjpGCb_pzLlFQCjpBilo.html
The enforcers had a leader in 2nd edition, had a splat that gave everyone with Tag riffle an extra dice. That has been taken out and I'm not happy about it. There was no logical reason to take it out. This is the only issue I had with them, other than Pathfinders fighting on 6+.
Check out some of the other Deadzone videos on this channel. I think you will enjoy Deadzone more than Malifux. Ask any question you want, I answer all questions. Welcome to the fold brother!
@@familyofgamers777 Thanks for that, I'll take a look at the TBE. I like the idea of Malifaux and I think it could be fun game but it does seem a bit too much like a deck building game with minis and to cary the game more you need, well, more boxes LOL.
Deadzone I like though, just on the look out for any alarm bell stuff so I don't end up making the mistakes I did of buying into 40K, Kill Team and Necromunda (Fail, fail, fail). I'm now even pondering the Firefight starter given that it gives 40+ of the factions I like, but possibly way too many9 other than perhaps having the option to build multiples of all the different weapon configurations. So it's Firefight or DZ unit boxes. Hmmmmm.
Does seem odd to have nerfed Pathfinder CC. You'd think they'd be better (Ranger / SAS types), not more wimpy.
If you do get the FF starter, it’s good to have all the options in place for DZ. You could even play more points to get more models on the table.
Yea, still upset with the Pathfinder nerf, but not so much that’s I won’t play the game.