@@AndreA-yq4cu Electric drivetrains are becoming cookie cutter. Fuel driven is just impractical upside down life. For such a SHORT drive, like a minute tops of which just a small number of seconds at high power, a really small power cell battery can be used. I'd borrow the Rimac 3.5 kWh battery from the Koenigsegg Regera (700 hp), and the Koenigsegg Dark Matter (800 hp/38kg?) motors. Those two plus HV cables ought to be lighter than most 700hp fuel systems, let alone with upside down provisions. And really, for just one upside down pass, that 75 kg Rimac battery is overkill. A one time use battery would be lighter and cheaper.
All the regs are heavily about safety, fair competition, cost control so it’s economically sustainable (big reason why CanAm failed), no pursuit of dangerous/impractical tech, ethical concerns… You'd just end up back with F1.
These days it feels like I'm always looking forward to Pikes peak and Goodwood, to see cars like the McMurtry and Travis Pastrana's Subaru being run in anger. But i agree a league or series would be amazing.
In terms of cost, you have to keep in mind that most of the money that an F1 team spends out of that 150 million is on salaries and operations like logistics, rather than on the car itself. The car itself is worth around the same as this one, around 10 million pounds
But it's only 10 million because the F1 teams already have the infrastructure, so you either need a lot more money or an F1 team that can afford to stop producing its own parts and build it for you.
I think it's more for the drivers. They trialed an enclosed cockpit and they said it made them feel sick by impairing their vision. The dirt and marks on the windscreen were distracting etc. Drivers have said, due to the design of the halo and the centre bar being in between their vision, they don't notice it.
A curved windscreen with such a pronounced curvature would likely distort the view of the road ahead, leading to difficulty judging distances and potentially causing eye strain due to the uneven focus required to see through the curved glass... I suspect looking past something like the central Halo piller is much less intrusive to ones vision when focusing way beyond it... than actually looking through a very curved lens that would distort your view. Tbh... I think 'no rules' cars would soon end up being severely limited by the bag of bones and tissues trying to pilot it... kind of like how they have to use fly by wire controls on modern fighter jets to ensure they don't pull more G's than the airframe and pilots can handle.... If they ended up with jet turbines with side nozzle thrust vectoring the potential cornering G's could break people never mind cause them to pass out and it would probably become necessary to remove the driver from the car and to have him operate it remotely via ultra low latency FPV cams and possibly VR.
@@EarlHare Probably. Modern F1 cars can get to around 6.5g in the corners. It's more about neck muscles than blacking out. Blacking out usually occurs in pilots due to maneuvers like sudden climbs that cause the blood to go to their feet. F1 cars don't do that.
@@ObnoxiusBrat true but a fighter pilot experiences mainly vertical g's while F1 drivers experience mainly lateral g's. So less chance of blacking out but it will be absolutely exhausting to drive with all the muscle you need to even keep your wheel pointing in the right direction
Exactly right... Might as well call it Red Bull X2025... In other words. Adrian Newey's original concept is seen as the fundamental solution. Designs that followed it are just developmental versions...
Sometimes I wish that we'd go in the other direction. What do you think race fans would rather see. A car that is 15 seconds a lap faster than current cars or a race where there are 3 or 4 racers fighting for the lead coming out of the last corner.
Consider.... 1. Does the tyre technology cope that 7G? 2. If there's no front wing.. how driver change the setup needed to suit his need. 3. Will the change between fan suction downforce and regular downforce will make the car unstable it self..
@@benoit9874 ....HOW IS IT TOO HARD TO UNDERSTAND? ........IT'S JUST basic STUFF!!! .....FIRST OF ALL......ACTIVE SUSPENSION WILL allow to set different clearences!!!SO DOWNFORCE CONTROL ALREADY WILL GET HUGELY IMPROVED!!!ALSO..... *_THAT SKIRT DESIGN DOESNT WORK SO FAN ISNT EFFECTIVE AS IT SHOULDVE BEEN_* .......BESIDES,THESE VORTEXES ARE APPEARING ONLY AT huge SPEED......AND IF SPEED IS LOW, the suck is laughable....THAT'S WHY THIS CHAPPAREL WITH FANS WAS USING SKIRTS .....ANOTHER THING ABOUT active suspension .....COMES FROM *_it allows to keep angle to help skirt get properly sealed_* ......AM I CORRECT???.......AS WELL AS...... ACTIVE SUSPENSION IS VITAL FOR tire management AS IT DOES ALLOW TO DISTRIBUTE LOAD evenly SO PIT STOPS ARE less FREQUENT........ ....AND ACTIVE SUSPENSION IS ABOUT CONTROL OVER pitch AS WELL,RIGHT?????.....SO PERFECT CONTROL OVER STUFF DURING both ACCELERATION/BRAKING ...........is it correct??? .......NOW'S ABOUT ACTIVE AERODYNANICS.......THIS CHOICE OF flexible wing IS EXTRA LAUGHABLE......BECAUSE EVEN perfectly FLEXIBLE WING GOT the same drag AT ALL SPEEDS.......NOT MORE OR LESS,same!!!.....BECAUSE THERE'S ALWAYS A BALANCE BETWEEN drag AND flex....RIGHT??BECAUSE OF AT high SPEED AMOUNT OF AIR PARTICLES IS higher AND AT LOW SPEED IT'S lower.........AM I CORRECT??!.......SO DUDE basically DOESNT UNDERSTAND *_physical principle behind_* AS HE JUST SAW HOW MCLAREN'S WING FLEXES AND LIKE wow okay........ ....AND what ACTUALLY ACTIVE AERODYNAMIC GIVES????....A *_TOTAL CONTROL_* ........SO IT actually CREATES *variable* DOWNFORCE,SO AT CORNERS IT CAN SET HIGHER,AND AT STRAIGHTS IT CAN LITERALLY GET flat TO CREATE *NO DRAG AT ALL* ........RIGHT?????.........IN ADDITION, *_active aerodynamics can start work at ANY speed,greatly improving car's behavior during braking and EVEN COULDVE BEEN USED AS ADDITIONAL BRAKING SYSTEM TO HELP FURTHER REDUCE BRAKING TIME_* ...........SO ..... *_AM I SCIENTIFICALLY CORRECT???_* ............
1: great question, guess its time to make kevlar-vibranium alloy reinforced tires or something like that 💀 2: great point, as soon as I saw it I knew it was gonna struggle with that and defo with Understeer 3: dont think so, they can engineer a way to transition smoothly
1) wow that’s cool 2) nice video 3) i was first thinking about the Rodin F-Zero, which is already more than just a computer model 4) 9:22 thanks for showing a clear shot of the rear of the x2014, showing that there isn’t a fan there. There is a fan variant, but this particular video seems to be of the version without it. Yes, very minor nitpick, sorry
The scenes with the old F1 cars remind me of when I was a kid and watched the races with Emerson Fitipaldi, Niki Lauda, Clay Regazzoni, and later Airton Senna, Nelson Piquet, Alain Prost, Michael Schumacher, etc.
For the uninitiated, all f1 designers tried to build this car in their early years before realizing that it was infeasible to make the pit stops work (safely) with the wheel covers. Works for a hillclimb though.
But again, surely that's a rules issue? If I'm allowed to drive my car into a pitting robot, and I'm not constrained as to what exactly disconnects, I should be able to get sub-second wheel changes, regardless.
Surely the transition between fans and ground effect at 150kph would be totally unmanageable in practice? Also, the biggest challenge to all of this would be to develop some tyres that would deal with the performance and aero load.
The real struggle is not the car , its a fighterjet on wheels.... the driver is the limit. 7 positive G is already insane. Doing 7g sideways, for 1.5h is suicide on a body
This sounds an awful lot like the Red Bull X2010. Ground effects? Check. Fan? Check. 1600 hp? Check. Wheels enclosed in faring? Check. Enclosed cockpit? Er, no, apparently. Given that this project has taken 15 years, and it's now 2025, is it actually an evolution of the X2010 using more sophisticated CFD analysis?
3:10 I too think that the best powertrain is a turboshaft engine with a CVT transmission. My idea is to control the transmission ratio electronically and not as it is on a scooter. This way you can keep the engine at the same rpm, or even slow down the engine during accelerations and accelerate it during decelerations, this way you can use it to store energy, like with kers
All those rules are understandable, but there should really be a chagegory that's just "anything goes, the crazier, more out of the box the better". They should make a formula X or something where every year is more a show of new developments without constraints than whoever wins.
Feel like this has been done before. The “formula one car without formula one limitations” idea never takes into account how bad the races are going to be if merely approaching the car in front of you sends you into an aerodynamic tornado, or any of the other million reasons they have added rules for.
So many commentators here try to negatively pick this apart instead of looking in awe at what theoretically could be. Could you imagine super fast cars that could hug those crazy corners at both low and high speed?
Great video. This has answered the question I’ve had in my head for a long time and finally I get it answered! Very interesting to see that most of the solutions have actually existed in f1 already!
When the AMG One was announced, it was to weigh 1200 kg. The specs never changes, apart from the weight, that's now 1700 kg. How does one prevent this, if it happened to AMG that used an F1 team to design it, and used parts from F1 they'd worked with for year?
I'm... extremely skeptical. He hasn't added nearly enough structure to those little hole covers, and they'd probably immediately come off. Similarly, the skirting trapdoor thing would be ripped to pieces at even low speeds. There's probably tons of these issues that would need to be fixed, and those fixes would completely ruin the performance of the car. Additionally, the "I can do it cheaper than everyone else" claim is obviously wrong and extremely Musk-esque
I think the idea of switching from fan car to ground effect is brilliant but the danger of the hydraulics failing to activate on when you want to do a 7G curve might be too dangerous. I think considering all of the aero of the car and what it wants to achieve the fan is not ideal
100%. I mean if this was practical F1 would already be doing it. They could absolutely design higher-performance cars but the trade-offs around safety and other factors understandably aren't acceptable.
That's a really cool excercise, but if you ask me, the thing that makes an F1 car distinct from any other kind of prototype style race car is: a) an open cockpit and b ) wheels without any real covering. The second one of these two things is not present it does not really feel like an F1 car anymore.
I’ve always dreamed of a true American unit “One-to-One” series…one horsepower per pound of vehicle weight. It will put an end to the disturbing flat-out laps around the Indianapolis Motor Speedway. I want to see heavy breaking down from 300 mph in order to make the corners. 1700 lbs and 1700 reliable HP should be no big deal. I’m 66….don’t wait too long!
How much more wear (in laps) does the increased downforce/gforce in turns cause on the tires? How much time is lost during each pit due to those tire covers impeding tire swapping? How much hotter do the breaks get, affecting break fade, due to being completely enclosed? Are the parts that are prone to damage easily replicable during a pit? Cool pet project but there are some practical aspects that might make this more trouble than it's worth.
Seems like a very interesting thing, but a more detailed video about it would be fantastic. I have heard about some random defining an F1 that is unrestricted, and so using techs that are banned in F1, like active suspensions, four wheels drive and so on. Might be interesting to analyse as well !
Someone should start a F1 racing without rules and give green light to innovation and technology and have all these gigantic companies bring whatever all of them can think of . That would be an amazing thing to see.
Aren't pit stops going to be annoying? How fast can those tires be changed? Dp they have a quick release and just drop out of the bottom of the enclosures or something?
Seeing as the wheels are inserted into axles where the Centerlock lockrings would thread onto, they can't simply drop out from the bottom. The wheel covers have clasps.
So the only a couple seconds long long pit stop wouldn't happen. How quickly could the wheels be changed? Wish they would have covered that. Performance of the vehicle is probably the biggest factor of a winning race, but there are other factors, too.
@@kevinbarnard3502 it would be a second or two longer when nailed down the procedure to pop them off, however a 5-7 seconds stop minimum seems feasible.
@@MayumiTheKimura 1 month Race Ban,30k fine and -5 Points If you swear, do an religious or political Statement and If you criticize the FIA in any kind of Form.
11:33 How would smaller rear wheels help with managing the high torque? Smaller wheels would usually mean more torque goes to the road. I'm curious if anyone knows what he means.
If you allow side skirts that touch the track surface, internal mass dampners, active aero, rear extruder fans, and active suspensions you could decrease the available horsepower by half and achieve lap times better then what were possible in the 2024 F-1 spec
i mean its as "sustainable" as f1 aims to be. f1 only cares about those synthetic fuels to claim the race itself doesnt dump carbon into the air, f1 ignores the massive carbon demand of travelling globally to arrive at each race. we gotta be more critical of f1 on the multiple valid fronts before getting mad at a pipe dream like this. f1 has major issues with greenwashing, while this guy just throwaway mentioned his fuel source being a future looking one. synthetic fuels dont solve every issue immediately, but compared to the issues f1 has i dont care what fuel a concept of a vehicle uses
Pikes peak is actually very interesting. The race is run from the bottom of a mountain to the top. The air is much thinner at the top. So the aero that works at the bottom, might not be enough at the top. Also using much more aero, will create too much drag at the bottom. That's why Pikes peak cars look so weird and different.
@@yongling9825 afaik, F1 cars hit 5g lateral at the apex of corners as highest in motorsports. These top pro drivers spend much of their training on their necks to be able to last for a race.
@FacelessBillions They don't deal with lateral Gs at all. All forces are along the body axis (vertical G forces), positive G's drain blood from brain and can cause loss of consciousness.. Negative g's are very rare and avoided, during pitch down and would damage the eyes. In contrast cars don't deal with Vertical G's at all, and all forces are horizontal along the ground plane. Bodies handle different directions of G forces very differently, so irrelevant to compare, cars to airplanes, as there is no overlap in G force directions.
If there're no rules, why doesn't it use 2 jet engines for downforce generation without a drag and gas turbine hybrid for propulsion? 😉 Also 4 wheels create too much weight and drag. So yup there were some rules, obviously. (Like 4 wheels)
I'm sorry but I have to chuckle a bit here. F1 - the F stands for Formula, "THE Formula", which is the set of rules and regulations governing the sport. So saying someone is building an F1 car without rules is non-sensical. Without F1 rules it can not be an F1 car. It's just an open-wheeler.
What a great concept. Those variable cooling inlets have me anxious about longevity. I wonder if any aero is designed like fish gills - with layers of flexible material that spread at speed and compress during braking.
I would be interested to see some sim runs of it riding bumps and curves or how it reacts in collisions/bumps and scraps. My guess is instability riding curbs disturbing the seal for airflow under the car and certain fragility in small collisions or bumps with other cars when it comes to those wheel covers running as close as they are to the tyres.
This is what I wish the Indy 500 was… an independent race outside any series, mandate a wheelbase, and minimum weight, and require the car to pass safety standards, and nothing else.
This is basically optimized to fully drain the clean wind and completely ignore what tornadoes are sent back towards the driver behind you. Races wouldn't be possible as people are suggesting.
I find it quite interesting Scott, you haven't mentioned tyre wear at all. Given the downforce the tyres will wear off much more rapidly. After seeing the design it is obvious to me the tyre change will add 15 seconds if not more (currently 2s) to the race time at least two times. So what I see is is amazing engineering but avoiding some key elements in a race scenario. Tyre change is not only a rule in F1, it is a necessity. If you can make Michellin or Pirelli to make a tyre for this design, I am all for it.
I'd have to wonder what would change if you added the simple constraint of reliability: How different would it look if you had to make sure it would survive a race weekend and not need to be completely rebuilt every week for an entire season?
I feel like turbine drive could still be a possibility. Either through turbine electric, or differential power. With differential power, as you let off the throttle, it just transfers the drive to the rear fan. With turbine electric, you’re basically just generating electricity that goes directly to an electric motor on each tire, creating perfect traction control too. Turbine electric generators are insanely powerful. For comparison, the US military has large turbine generators to start large aircraft engines and other ground operations. The average small or older American house has a 100amp panel. The average modern mid-size house has a 200amp panel. (Not including Tesla houses). That’s around 10-24Kw capability per household (following the 100-120v standard). This AGE carts produce more power than the modern mid size American house, and you could definitely arrange it to just barely fit inside a car.
Full turbine electric, instead of a transmission, means you need a generator and a motor both capable of taking the full >1MW power output from the engine. That’s fine on ships where weight is of little concern, and trains where weight is a benefit, but it’s just too heavy for a race car. The reality is you don’t need a CVT, and you don’t need to worry about the turbine spinning up and down. Engine speed is already uncoupled from tire speed by the fundamental design of the turboshaft. Variable stators in the compressor and turbines give you wide latitude to provide the power you need, at the RPM you need, whenever and however you want it.
the aero on this car is on another level, only thing is wondering is would there be a way to move the rear suspension of of the venturi tunnels and rear diffuser and get rid of the fan for a hybrid system
Chapman strut suspension seems viable if you can compress the damper assembly to no taller than the wheel hub, then it will only be 1 wishbone that disrupt the airflow instead of a whole suspension. Also a benefit you get is stiffening that diffuser to act as mounting for the dampers, (heave spring can go on the gearbox but 2 dampers outside)
@@Dakkyun make that an active suspension and break lap records, I would love to see a no rules grand prix racing again like can-am and can-am is way before my time I just really enjoy the technical aspect of racing and car design
bringing up how it's cheaper than f1 is missing the point that the cost is of engineers spending a long time interpreting the rules and finding new ways to get around them, and not to mention that this guy isn't counting (or only partially) how much he'd cost the project too, then testing it instead of bench racing it. Cool project, but that tid bit was an unfair comparison
You mentioned the wheel covers are physically connected to the tires (pretty sure thats what was said) so does the mean the whole wheel cover has to be taken off for a new set of tyres to be put on?
Lovely video. Thanks Scott. The fan at 8:30 that is supposed to suck air from the underfloor is visually shown blowing air into the underfloor area. Ladies and gentlemen, may I present a 1600 hp Flymo!
In the animation at @9:13, the fan is not even spinning in the correct/driven direction. I feel like this sums up the reasonability of this project, its just another talented Aerodynamics Engineer with a pipedream, and an unfathomable number of problems that are going to bankrupt him long before he sets a track record, if he ever tries to make the car. I'd still donate a tenner to the kickstarter though.
I've been telling my dad for years, that the only powertrain that could be faster than a piston engine is a gas turbine system in some form (I was thinking lighter end hybrid with capacitors, but a CVT is a brilliant idea).
7 lateral G's? Jesus. You would have Scrambled Brains for breakfast. 😂 A Pegasus turbine from a Harrier is the best option. Then you can move the nozzles several different directions to optimize braking, cornering, and acceleration.
That car is insane:) From the front view it reminds me of the" mark 5" from the "Speed racer" cartoon. Just incredible. I love the way you think about futuristic racing 😊 this model is much more feasible than the Redbull or Ferrari version. Beautiful,pure and sexy. That's racing 🤗
I can see one glaring weakness which will bite Sebastian if this is ever built - weight. This thing will weigh substantially more than an F1 car, so all the sims in the world can't tell how this will compromise the braking and cornering performance. Then there's the human factor. You can setup an F1 car to find a good balance for your driver. Without any front wing here, adjusting that balance will be really limited.
Looks very interesting, my question is how much race distance would the engine survive with it's absolutley insane 1hp per cc ratio? Also how much turbo pressure would it produce and what would be the max rpm?
I've always said that F1 should return to open class. Safety is now inherent and it was the innovators and not the spenders that were successful in the past. It would mean Adrain Newey is no longer a cheat with hidden features. If not then I would add more specific design restraints to the current format of races: 1) Drivers have to run and fit themselves in the cockpit from across the track 2) A 20kg shopping load has to be carried after the first pit stop 3) An additonal item, the weight of a jar of coffee, is to be picked up after the car has reached the end of the pitlane and reverses down a seperate track to the rear of the pits 4) The start finish straight has the red lights relit at lap 13 and all cars must wait 4.25 minutes whilt a cyclist move to the front of the grid 5) All drivers to refuel themselves and present a certificate at the marshalls office. One person at a time. 6) A mandatory speed limit will be applied and various points around the track at any given time and a drive through given to those transgressing that limit. 7) If the race starts at 14:00, additional touring cars will enter the track at 15:30 and block all racing lines throughout. 8) 3 laps from the end, all qualifying cars on that lap must pick up another member of their team and an addional 'friend' for two laps and not exceed 90kph.
Get this man 30 million so he can build it
There are 1.3 million subscribers on this channel, all we need is everyone giving him 23 quid and off you go. :D
It'll cost a lot more than that.
And 30 more million so he can buy an accent...
It'll cost at the very least 300 million
@@MuppetsSh0wbased on what?
Now with this you can drive easily upside down in a tunnel :))
😂
You could this already. This Main issue is the engine with the o ans the fuel...
@@AndreA-yq4cu Electric drivetrains are becoming cookie cutter. Fuel driven is just impractical upside down life. For such a SHORT drive, like a minute tops of which just a small number of seconds at high power, a really small power cell battery can be used. I'd borrow the Rimac 3.5 kWh battery from the Koenigsegg Regera (700 hp), and the Koenigsegg Dark Matter (800 hp/38kg?) motors. Those two plus HV cables ought to be lighter than most 700hp fuel systems, let alone with upside down provisions. And really, for just one upside down pass, that 75 kg Rimac battery is overkill. A one time use battery would be lighter and cheaper.
@@AndreA-yq4cu Fuel pick up? If they can succesfuly do it on aerobtic planes, it's do able here too.
It's got a fan... That'd be cheating!
I would watch the crap out of an unlimited race series where engineers could go wild.
You do, that’s F1 and MotoGP
@@RyanMcIntyre Nah, that's nowhere near free to design whatever lol. Not that neither lack any sort of innovation, not that they're slow.
I think that's the CanAm series btw lol, from back in the 70's and 80's lol
All the regs are heavily about safety, fair competition, cost control so it’s economically sustainable (big reason why CanAm failed), no pursuit of dangerous/impractical tech, ethical concerns… You'd just end up back with F1.
These days it feels like I'm always looking forward to Pikes peak and Goodwood, to see cars like the McMurtry and Travis Pastrana's Subaru being run in anger. But i agree a league or series would be amazing.
In terms of cost, you have to keep in mind that most of the money that an F1 team spends out of that 150 million is on salaries and operations like logistics, rather than on the car itself. The car itself is worth around the same as this one, around 10 million pounds
But it's only 10 million because the F1 teams already have the infrastructure, so you either need a lot more money or an F1 team that can afford to stop producing its own parts and build it for you.
Also testing the actual car. This car hasn’t even been built
The engine alone in and F1 car is about 20 million.
“F1 car with no rules” is an oxymoron. The rules are what defines F1.
@@davidwiles6042 Exactly
Looks like if it formula one had a vision gt car
Dude it looks like a Poweranger Robot from the visuals.
So flashy.
That car already exists, it's called the Red Bull X2010.
@@pedinhuh16 X2010 is also 15 years old now lol
@@oblied i wonder how the two would compare in speed on track
@Nicholas-m7p this should be slightly quicker depending on what version x2010 used
Interesting that he still chose to have a halo and not just enclose the cockpit - which I imagine has more potential aerodynamically.
I think it's more for the drivers. They trialed an enclosed cockpit and they said it made them feel sick by impairing their vision. The dirt and marks on the windscreen were distracting etc.
Drivers have said, due to the design of the halo and the centre bar being in between their vision, they don't notice it.
Its also easier to get out of the halo than a broken closed cockpit
...AGREED.....
...AND ALL "but" THINGS ARE A bout STUFF WASNT GET MUCH DEVELOPMENT
@@Jimmy_Moonnot too sure about this, I mean LMP1 cars are closed cockpit cars and would run for a long time before each stop.
A curved windscreen with such a pronounced curvature would likely distort the view of the road ahead, leading to difficulty judging distances and potentially causing eye strain due to the uneven focus required to see through the curved glass...
I suspect looking past something like the central Halo piller is much less intrusive to ones vision when focusing way beyond it... than actually looking through a very curved lens that would distort your view.
Tbh... I think 'no rules' cars would soon end up being severely limited by the bag of bones and tissues trying to pilot it... kind of like how they have to use fly by wire controls on modern fighter jets to ensure they don't pull more G's than the airframe and pilots can handle.... If they ended up with jet turbines with side nozzle thrust vectoring the potential cornering G's could break people never mind cause them to pass out and it would probably become necessary to remove the driver from the car and to have him operate it remotely via ultra low latency FPV cams and possibly VR.
So much faster than F1, question is can a driver take it over a race distance physically?
Even more important question, can an F1 driver even take it around certain corners at the maximum possible speed without blacking out?
Also, how long will tires hold up
@@EarlHare this is a level of g-force of fighter jets. So it's possible to handle for a while.
@@EarlHare Probably. Modern F1 cars can get to around 6.5g in the corners. It's more about neck muscles than blacking out. Blacking out usually occurs in pilots due to maneuvers like sudden climbs that cause the blood to go to their feet. F1 cars don't do that.
@@ObnoxiusBrat true but a fighter pilot experiences mainly vertical g's while F1 drivers experience mainly lateral g's. So less chance of blacking out but it will be absolutely exhausting to drive with all the muscle you need to even keep your wheel pointing in the right direction
Would tire manufacturers be able to create a tire that can handle the high loads of downforce this car creates?
Kevlar reinforced tires maybe?
good question, tyres are also holding back Rodin in this regard
How do you even get to the tires to change them?
That's only twice as much per tyre as each tyre on a Bugatti standing still.
@@TylerHarris-yy7ufa lot of tires already are. Not sure if racing tires are, but I know some road tires are.
So a modern day RedBull X2010/11
There was even the gameplay of the x2010 in the video ahah
My exact thought.
Exactly right... Might as well call it Red Bull X2025...
In other words. Adrian Newey's original concept is seen as the fundamental solution. Designs that followed it are just developmental versions...
@@Jojo_Bee IIRC, the details for the X2010 was it was powered by a gas turbine.
@@IIGrayfoxII The X2010 had a v6.
This is crazy imagine if there was a league for that
Have it like Group B in rally racing that would sick
F0
Formula 0
CanAm II DJT series
Its back!
F1 is on the limit of human abilitys. F1 would be way faster by now, but we slow them down every couple of years to not pass out
Looks kinda like the red bull x2010 but with a halo not a fighter cockpit canopy.
15:15, so basically this would be F0
F-1 if anything, since it's 2 steps
Nope it would be a F car
Ahh now I wanna play F-zero! quality game on the snes and N64
@@headcrab980n64?
Captain Falcon is very happy to see this car
So like the redbull x thing
Except without the enclosed cockpit and front wing.
Sometimes I wish that we'd go in the other direction. What do you think race fans would rather see. A car that is 15 seconds a lap faster than current cars or a race where there are 3 or 4 racers fighting for the lead coming out of the last corner.
Speed Racer Mach 6 type beat
Yes.
Yeah exactly. This literally looks like something outta the Speed Racer movie
Or Future GPX Cyber Formula.
the T-180s XD
Consider....
1. Does the tyre technology cope that 7G?
2. If there's no front wing.. how driver change the setup needed to suit his need.
3. Will the change between fan suction downforce and regular downforce will make the car unstable it self..
@@robotnikkkk001 easy to talk, less to produce. we're waiting for your car as you seem so intelligent
@@benoit9874 ....HOW IS IT TOO HARD TO UNDERSTAND?
........IT'S JUST basic STUFF!!!
.....FIRST OF ALL......ACTIVE SUSPENSION WILL allow to set different clearences!!!SO DOWNFORCE CONTROL ALREADY WILL GET HUGELY IMPROVED!!!ALSO..... *_THAT SKIRT DESIGN DOESNT WORK SO FAN ISNT EFFECTIVE AS IT SHOULDVE BEEN_* .......BESIDES,THESE VORTEXES ARE APPEARING ONLY AT huge SPEED......AND IF SPEED IS LOW, the suck is laughable....THAT'S WHY THIS CHAPPAREL WITH FANS WAS USING SKIRTS
.....ANOTHER THING ABOUT active suspension .....COMES FROM *_it allows to keep angle to help skirt get properly sealed_* ......AM I CORRECT???.......AS WELL AS...... ACTIVE SUSPENSION IS VITAL FOR tire management AS IT DOES ALLOW TO DISTRIBUTE LOAD evenly SO PIT STOPS ARE less FREQUENT........
....AND ACTIVE SUSPENSION IS ABOUT CONTROL OVER pitch AS WELL,RIGHT?????.....SO PERFECT CONTROL OVER STUFF DURING both ACCELERATION/BRAKING ...........is it correct???
.......NOW'S ABOUT ACTIVE AERODYNANICS.......THIS CHOICE OF flexible wing IS EXTRA LAUGHABLE......BECAUSE EVEN perfectly FLEXIBLE WING GOT the same drag AT ALL SPEEDS.......NOT MORE OR LESS,same!!!.....BECAUSE THERE'S ALWAYS A BALANCE BETWEEN drag AND flex....RIGHT??BECAUSE OF AT high SPEED AMOUNT OF AIR PARTICLES IS higher AND AT LOW SPEED IT'S lower.........AM I CORRECT??!.......SO DUDE basically DOESNT UNDERSTAND *_physical principle behind_* AS HE JUST SAW HOW MCLAREN'S WING FLEXES AND LIKE wow okay........
....AND what ACTUALLY ACTIVE AERODYNAMIC GIVES????....A *_TOTAL CONTROL_* ........SO IT actually CREATES *variable* DOWNFORCE,SO AT CORNERS IT CAN SET HIGHER,AND AT STRAIGHTS IT CAN LITERALLY GET flat TO CREATE *NO DRAG AT ALL* ........RIGHT?????.........IN ADDITION, *_active aerodynamics can start work at ANY speed,greatly improving car's behavior during braking and EVEN COULDVE BEEN USED AS ADDITIONAL BRAKING SYSTEM TO HELP FURTHER REDUCE BRAKING TIME_*
...........SO ..... *_AM I SCIENTIFICALLY CORRECT???_* ............
@robotnikkkk001 first step that you learn, is to write things appropriately and scientifically.
@@benoit9874 yeah, robotnikk´s comments are impossible to read
1: great question, guess its time to make kevlar-vibranium alloy reinforced tires or something like that 💀
2: great point, as soon as I saw it I knew it was gonna struggle with that and defo with Understeer
3: dont think so, they can engineer a way to transition smoothly
1) wow that’s cool
2) nice video
3) i was first thinking about the Rodin F-Zero, which is already more than just a computer model
4) 9:22 thanks for showing a clear shot of the rear of the x2014, showing that there isn’t a fan there. There is a fan variant, but this particular video seems to be of the version without it. Yes, very minor nitpick, sorry
The scenes with the old F1 cars remind me of when I was a kid and watched the races with Emerson Fitipaldi, Niki Lauda, Clay Regazzoni, and later Airton Senna, Nelson Piquet, Alain Prost, Michael Schumacher, etc.
For the uninitiated, all f1 designers tried to build this car in their early years before realizing that it was infeasible to make the pit stops work (safely) with the wheel covers.
Works for a hillclimb though.
But again, surely that's a rules issue? If I'm allowed to drive my car into a pitting robot, and I'm not constrained as to what exactly disconnects, I should be able to get sub-second wheel changes, regardless.
Surely the transition between fans and ground effect at 150kph would be totally unmanageable in practice?
Also, the biggest challenge to all of this would be to develop some tyres that would deal with the performance and aero load.
And can do 70 laps without being changed, not sure how they quickly swop tyres with the enclosed wheels
The real struggle is not the car , its a fighterjet on wheels.... the driver is the limit. 7 positive G is already insane.
Doing 7g sideways, for 1.5h is suicide on a body
This sounds an awful lot like the Red Bull X2010.
Ground effects? Check.
Fan? Check.
1600 hp? Check.
Wheels enclosed in faring? Check.
Enclosed cockpit? Er, no, apparently.
Given that this project has taken 15 years, and it's now 2025, is it actually an evolution of the X2010 using more sophisticated CFD analysis?
Yeah, makes me think....
FYI: The fan appears to be installed and running backwards in the render. Would also work better with a stator.
Lots of flaws ahaha definitely a concept designer 😅
So what exactly sets this apart from the X2010 and its variants?
Ignorance of the channel author)😂
3:10 I too think that the best powertrain is a turboshaft engine with a CVT transmission. My idea is to control the transmission ratio electronically and not as it is on a scooter. This way you can keep the engine at the same rpm, or even slow down the engine during accelerations and accelerate it during decelerations, this way you can use it to store energy, like with kers
All those rules are understandable, but there should really be a chagegory that's just "anything goes, the crazier, more out of the box the better".
They should make a formula X or something where every year is more a show of new developments without constraints than whoever wins.
What if the driver is not sitting in the car, but lying head first in the car, which could shorten the height of the car to the height of the wheels?
Feel like this has been done before. The “formula one car without formula one limitations” idea never takes into account how bad the races are going to be if merely approaching the car in front of you sends you into an aerodynamic tornado, or any of the other million reasons they have added rules for.
Or have a load of Mark Webber Le Mans crashes when the Aero lets go down one of the longer straights.
So many commentators here try to negatively pick this apart instead of looking in awe at what theoretically could be. Could you imagine super fast cars that could hug those crazy corners at both low and high speed?
Red Bull has done something like this before in the 2010s. (4:53) And it's in the Gran Turismo games of that era. The Red Bull X2010/2011/2014
RedBull even built full scale model.
Great video. This has answered the question I’ve had in my head for a long time and finally I get it answered! Very interesting to see that most of the solutions have actually existed in f1 already!
When the AMG One was announced, it was to weigh 1200 kg.
The specs never changes, apart from the weight, that's now 1700 kg.
How does one prevent this, if it happened to AMG that used an F1 team to design it, and used parts from F1 they'd worked with for year?
I'm... extremely skeptical. He hasn't added nearly enough structure to those little hole covers, and they'd probably immediately come off. Similarly, the skirting trapdoor thing would be ripped to pieces at even low speeds. There's probably tons of these issues that would need to be fixed, and those fixes would completely ruin the performance of the car. Additionally, the "I can do it cheaper than everyone else" claim is obviously wrong and extremely Musk-esque
I think the idea of switching from fan car to ground effect is brilliant but the danger of the hydraulics failing to activate on when you want to do a 7G curve might be too dangerous. I think considering all of the aero of the car and what it wants to achieve the fan is not ideal
100%. I mean if this was practical F1 would already be doing it. They could absolutely design higher-performance cars but the trade-offs around safety and other factors understandably aren't acceptable.
That's a really cool excercise, but if you ask me, the thing that makes an F1 car distinct from any other kind of prototype style race car is: a) an open cockpit and b ) wheels without any real covering. The second one of these two things is not present it does not really feel like an F1 car anymore.
Can’t wait to see it on track one day as a demonstration
Someone designed the perfect F1 car (without the F)
1:30 Nearly spilled my tea all over me when that engine roar came on 😂
Well well well
Well well well…
I’ve always dreamed of a true American unit “One-to-One” series…one horsepower per pound of vehicle weight. It will put an end to the disturbing flat-out laps around the Indianapolis Motor Speedway. I want to see heavy breaking down from 300 mph in order to make the corners. 1700 lbs and 1700 reliable HP should be no big deal. I’m 66….don’t wait too long!
i mean this in the best way possible, Sebastian is sooooo French and i love listening to his English pronunciations lmao
How much more wear (in laps) does the increased downforce/gforce in turns cause on the tires? How much time is lost during each pit due to those tire covers impeding tire swapping? How much hotter do the breaks get, affecting break fade, due to being completely enclosed? Are the parts that are prone to damage easily replicable during a pit? Cool pet project but there are some practical aspects that might make this more trouble than it's worth.
Would be nice if Gordon Murray reacted to this
or William Toet
2:45 proud to hear a French compatriot here 😂😂❤
Are there even tires for this level of performance?
Can the wheels and suspension handle 4.5 tons of downforce?
But how do you do a pitstop?
Have a look at 2009 cars with wheel covers
Why isn't it a CVT? Genuine question because of how much faster they are, even if they do sound super lame.
7:54 And you know what else is massive?
Looowwwwww taperrrr fadeeee
Seems like a very interesting thing, but a more detailed video about it would be fantastic.
I have heard about some random defining an F1 that is unrestricted, and so using techs that are banned in F1, like active suspensions, four wheels drive and so on. Might be interesting to analyse as well !
3:01 massive you say
yeah no massive
Someone should start a F1 racing without rules and give green light to innovation and technology and have all these gigantic companies bring whatever all of them can think of . That would be an amazing thing to see.
Yet another, f1 no rules video. I love it ❤
Aren't pit stops going to be annoying? How fast can those tires be changed? Dp they have a quick release and just drop out of the bottom of the enclosures or something?
Seeing as the wheels are inserted into axles where the Centerlock lockrings would thread onto, they can't simply drop out from the bottom. The wheel covers have clasps.
So the only a couple seconds long long pit stop wouldn't happen. How quickly could the wheels be changed? Wish they would have covered that. Performance of the vehicle is probably the biggest factor of a winning race, but there are other factors, too.
@@kevinbarnard3502 it would be a second or two longer when nailed down the procedure to pop them off, however a 5-7 seconds stop minimum seems feasible.
Let me drive it.
Why? You’d probably just crash it into another driver.
I think pullrod front suspension would be better than pushrod as it's aerodynamically more efficient and it would have a lower centre of gravity.
Colin Chapman + Gordon Murray = Sebastian LaMore.
Lamour*
Or he ripped off Adrian Newey. Look up the Redbull x2010
@@PatSharpsMullett the car functions and looks nothing like the x2010.
@@aominnomad the concept car by Adrian newey in gran turismo?
The point about automatic gearshifts stood out to me. At what point would the only limiting factor to a cars performance be the pilot?
Please talk about the new FIA rules 🙏🙏
You mean the 2026 rules or no swearing rules, question ?
@Dakkyun The new swearing Rules
The fuck they said now??? Can't turn the car on anymore or some shit?
@@MayumiTheKimura 1 month Race Ban,30k fine and -5 Points If you swear, do an religious or political Statement and If you criticize the FIA in any kind of Form.
11:33 How would smaller rear wheels help with managing the high torque? Smaller wheels would usually mean more torque goes to the road. I'm curious if anyone knows what he means.
If there are no rules it's not a formula.
The development of this is incredible. Just wow
This looks interesting
If you allow side skirts that touch the track surface, internal mass dampners, active aero, rear extruder fans, and active suspensions you could decrease the available horsepower by half and achieve lap times better then what were possible in the 2024 F-1 spec
LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, LA FRANCE!
😂😂
Based off these downforce figures would the driver be able to cope with the g forces?
Saying a 1600 hp racecar aims to be "sustainable" because it uses synthetic fuels is pretty rich.
95% Ethanol is much cleaner than Gasoline, if the car has to warm the engine up anyway, then it would work just fine.
Well, it is. It's not new carbon going to the atmosphere, rather it's carbon that was captured recently, hence close to neutral.
i mean its as "sustainable" as f1 aims to be. f1 only cares about those synthetic fuels to claim the race itself doesnt dump carbon into the air, f1 ignores the massive carbon demand of travelling globally to arrive at each race. we gotta be more critical of f1 on the multiple valid fronts before getting mad at a pipe dream like this. f1 has major issues with greenwashing, while this guy just throwaway mentioned his fuel source being a future looking one. synthetic fuels dont solve every issue immediately, but compared to the issues f1 has i dont care what fuel a concept of a vehicle uses
Where can I buy the stocks?
I hate to point out the obvious, but with no rules (formula) it's not F1!
Absolutely. "Let's play football but with no rules"...😂
Pikes peak is actually very interesting.
The race is run from the bottom of a mountain to the top. The air is much thinner at the top. So the aero that works at the bottom, might not be enough at the top. Also using much more aero, will create too much drag at the bottom.
That's why Pikes peak cars look so weird and different.
Now let's find a human who can handle 7g lateral loads. Not sure if that's even drivable.
What car pulls the highest lateral load so far and how high?
@@yongling9825 afaik, F1 cars hit 5g lateral at the apex of corners as highest in motorsports. These top pro drivers spend much of their training on their necks to be able to last for a race.
fighter jet pilots, however they are more used to sustained Gs and not going from a 5G corner to a 1.5G straight to a 5.5G braking zone in 6 seconds
@@FacelessBillions What about air racing pilots? I think they can hold 9 Gs (Red Bull Air Race's regulated limit) for a short while.
@FacelessBillions They don't deal with lateral Gs at all. All forces are along the body axis (vertical G forces), positive G's drain blood from brain and can cause loss of consciousness.. Negative g's are very rare and avoided, during pitch down and would damage the eyes.
In contrast cars don't deal with Vertical G's at all, and all forces are horizontal along the ground plane.
Bodies handle different directions of G forces very differently, so irrelevant to compare, cars to airplanes, as there is no overlap in G force directions.
If there're no rules, why doesn't it use 2 jet engines for downforce generation without a drag and gas turbine hybrid for propulsion? 😉 Also 4 wheels create too much weight and drag. So yup there were some rules, obviously. (Like 4 wheels)
I'm sorry but I have to chuckle a bit here. F1 - the F stands for Formula, "THE Formula", which is the set of rules and regulations governing the sport. So saying someone is building an F1 car without rules is non-sensical. Without F1 rules it can not be an F1 car. It's just an open-wheeler.
It's easier to figure out for the profane individual. One knows what an F1 is, and so is easier to give this image as a starting point.
Fun at parties?
Then let’s call it… * play Mute City soundtrack* … F0.
Ok Nigel..
🤓
What a great concept. Those variable cooling inlets have me anxious about longevity. I wonder if any aero is designed like fish gills - with layers of flexible material that spread at speed and compress during braking.
How would the car handle tire changes during pit stops?
I would be interested to see some sim runs of it riding bumps and curves or how it reacts in collisions/bumps and scraps. My guess is instability riding curbs disturbing the seal for airflow under the car and certain fragility in small collisions or bumps with other cars when it comes to those wheel covers running as close as they are to the tyres.
What the time required to change the tires ?
Does all this aero worth the trade ?
This is what I wish the Indy 500 was… an independent race outside any series, mandate a wheelbase, and minimum weight, and require the car to pass safety standards, and nothing else.
Build this Pinnacle and the RedBull in something known as Formula Limitless and let them break records 😎
What about a rotary engine, as I believe there is somebody in the states that is building one four block
This is basically optimized to fully drain the clean wind and completely ignore what tornadoes are sent back towards the driver behind you. Races wouldn't be possible as people are suggesting.
I find it quite interesting Scott, you haven't mentioned tyre wear at all. Given the downforce the tyres will wear off much more rapidly. After seeing the design it is obvious to me the tyre change will add 15 seconds if not more (currently 2s) to the race time at least two times. So what I see is is amazing engineering but avoiding some key elements in a race scenario. Tyre change is not only a rule in F1, it is a necessity. If you can make Michellin or Pirelli to make a tyre for this design, I am all for it.
I'd have to wonder what would change if you added the simple constraint of reliability: How different would it look if you had to make sure it would survive a race weekend and not need to be completely rebuilt every week for an entire season?
I feel like turbine drive could still be a possibility. Either through turbine electric, or differential power. With differential power, as you let off the throttle, it just transfers the drive to the rear fan. With turbine electric, you’re basically just generating electricity that goes directly to an electric motor on each tire, creating perfect traction control too. Turbine electric generators are insanely powerful. For comparison, the US military has large turbine generators to start large aircraft engines and other ground operations. The average small or older American house has a 100amp panel. The average modern mid-size house has a 200amp panel. (Not including Tesla houses). That’s around 10-24Kw capability per household (following the 100-120v standard). This AGE carts produce more power than the modern mid size American house, and you could definitely arrange it to just barely fit inside a car.
Full turbine electric, instead of a transmission, means you need a generator and a motor both capable of taking the full >1MW power output from the engine. That’s fine on ships where weight is of little concern, and trains where weight is a benefit, but it’s just too heavy for a race car.
The reality is you don’t need a CVT, and you don’t need to worry about the turbine spinning up and down. Engine speed is already uncoupled from tire speed by the fundamental design of the turboshaft. Variable stators in the compressor and turbines give you wide latitude to provide the power you need, at the RPM you need, whenever and however you want it.
11:39 why not close off the top of the tyre all the way? To give water somewhere to go? Seems like it'd have more drag.
To counter lift
Add 4wd, all wheel steering/braking, cvt, dynamic ride control and 'unlimited' car would be unstoppable
the aero on this car is on another level, only thing is wondering is would there be a way to move the rear suspension of of the venturi tunnels and rear diffuser and get rid of the fan for a hybrid system
Chapman strut suspension seems viable if you can compress the damper assembly to no taller than the wheel hub, then it will only be 1 wishbone that disrupt the airflow instead of a whole suspension. Also a benefit you get is stiffening that diffuser to act as mounting for the dampers, (heave spring can go on the gearbox but 2 dampers outside)
@@Dakkyun make that an active suspension and break lap records, I would love to see a no rules grand prix racing again like can-am and can-am is way before my time I just really enjoy the technical aspect of racing and car design
How do you change the wheels in pitstops if the wheels are covered?
bringing up how it's cheaper than f1 is missing the point that the cost is of engineers spending a long time interpreting the rules and finding new ways to get around them, and not to mention that this guy isn't counting (or only partially) how much he'd cost the project too, then testing it instead of bench racing it. Cool project, but that tid bit was an unfair comparison
You mentioned the wheel covers are physically connected to the tires (pretty sure thats what was said) so does the mean the whole wheel cover has to be taken off for a new set of tyres to be put on?
I’m guessing no matter what, pit stop time will be increased as there is no way to access the wheels directly
Lovely video. Thanks Scott.
The fan at 8:30 that is supposed to suck air from the underfloor is visually shown blowing air into the underfloor area. Ladies and gentlemen, may I present a 1600 hp Flymo!
Would you currently find tires to be able to take this?
In the animation at @9:13, the fan is not even spinning in the correct/driven direction.
I feel like this sums up the reasonability of this project, its just another talented Aerodynamics Engineer with a pipedream, and an unfathomable number of problems that are going to bankrupt him long before he sets a track record, if he ever tries to make the car.
I'd still donate a tenner to the kickstarter though.
I've been telling my dad for years, that the only powertrain that could be faster than a piston engine is a gas turbine system in some form (I was thinking lighter end hybrid with capacitors, but a CVT is a brilliant idea).
Fascinating stuff! Would the tire be able to be easily changed during a pit stop?
7 lateral G's? Jesus. You would have Scrambled Brains for breakfast. 😂 A Pegasus turbine from a Harrier is the best option. Then you can move the nozzles several different directions to optimize braking, cornering, and acceleration.
That car is insane:) From the front view it reminds me of the" mark 5" from the "Speed racer" cartoon. Just incredible. I love the way you think about futuristic racing 😊 this model is much more feasible than the Redbull or Ferrari version. Beautiful,pure and sexy. That's racing 🤗
amazing but what happens with the tyres? how will they by able to last?
I can see one glaring weakness which will bite Sebastian if this is ever built - weight. This thing will weigh substantially more than an F1 car, so all the sims in the world can't tell how this will compromise the braking and cornering performance. Then there's the human factor. You can setup an F1 car to find a good balance for your driver. Without any front wing here, adjusting that balance will be really limited.
He didn't mention how high safety standards will follow. Making the carbon body "hollow" would make it much much lighter
It’s a twin turbo v6 that doesn’t use hybrid technology so I’d assume it would weigh less or just as much as the current cars
Very clever solutions all around the car.. I love it! 👏 It insipred me to design my own fantasy F1 concept too.. 🏎
Looks very interesting, my question is how much race distance would the engine survive with it's absolutley insane 1hp per cc ratio? Also how much turbo pressure would it produce and what would be the max rpm?
I've always said that F1 should return to open class. Safety is now inherent and it was the innovators and not the spenders that were successful in the past. It would mean Adrain Newey is no longer a cheat with hidden features.
If not then I would add more specific design restraints to the current format of races:
1) Drivers have to run and fit themselves in the cockpit from across the track
2) A 20kg shopping load has to be carried after the first pit stop
3) An additonal item, the weight of a jar of coffee, is to be picked up after the car has reached the end of the pitlane and reverses down a seperate track to the rear of the pits
4) The start finish straight has the red lights relit at lap 13 and all cars must wait 4.25 minutes whilt a cyclist move to the front of the grid
5) All drivers to refuel themselves and present a certificate at the marshalls office. One person at a time.
6) A mandatory speed limit will be applied and various points around the track at any given time and a drive through given to those transgressing that limit.
7) If the race starts at 14:00, additional touring cars will enter the track at 15:30 and block all racing lines throughout.
8) 3 laps from the end, all qualifying cars on that lap must pick up another member of their team and an addional 'friend' for two laps and not exceed 90kph.