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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ส.ค. 2024
- Effective Tram Intersections in Cities Skylines
➤Tricky trams can make it tough to tune traversing traffic. This is the truth. Here are several ways to Tame you Trams realistically in intersections.
➤Sinking Tram Road
steamcommunity.com/sharedfile...
➤Mods Used:
Traffic Manager: steamcommunity.com/sharedfile...
Fine Road Tool/Anarchy steamcommunity.com/sharedfile... steamcommunity.com/sharedfile...
Node Controller: steamcommunity.com/sharedfile...
Intersection Marking Tool: steamcommunity.com/sharedfile...
➤Mods Collection: steamcommunity.com/sharedfile...
0:00 Intro
0:49 Typical Tram Intersection
4:00 Tram Priority Intersection
11:31 Tram Priority Roundabout
18:02 Grade Separated Tram Intersection
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➤Steam Workshop Collections: tinyurl.com/y4u7lcnn
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Cities Skylines 2 must have the ability for smaller, actualy realistic roundabouts. Most places dont have an entire state like Wyoming to waste for a single roundabout.
Wyoming is a giant roundabout ?
Huh, you learn something new everyday …
This has a 32m radius. Hardly “Wyoming”. Not unusual for a major junction, especially if it supports a tram through the middle.
@@YUMBL It doesnt look like 32. Maybe I guess thats my problem. The scale.
I literally say in the vid that its a “4 unit radius”. At 8m per unit its not overly large.
@@YUMBL Im not criticing you. It just doesnt match up in scale to real life.
I live in a European city with a lot of tram routes.
The.first two intersections are pretty much how it works in reality too.
We don't use any barriers in the roundabouts,.it would take too much time to lower and raise them.
The traffic lights in the roundabout don't have a green light in them, only yellow and red, and are only for the the traffic inside the roundabout. Entering traffic have a yield sign.
The last intersection isn't used in reality, not here at least.
It's because trams have a difficulty dealing with steep gradients, so this type of intersection would use up too much space.
France has rubber tire trains and trams that can probably deal with that tunnel slope.
Calgary uses tunnels with their C-Train to navigate intersections. They do fine with the grade changes.
@@LittleRedLemon04 You could argue that the C-train is a light rail system and not a tram system.
But judging from Google Maps the C-train illustrates what I mean here. Those intersections where it tunnels under it are huge to keep the gradients at at a reasonable level.
There is no room for that in the city center.
@@EgnachHelton Nancy right? It's the thing of the past as now the whole system will be made for normal trolleybuses.
We have a few cases of trams through roundabouts in Melbourne. Most of them aren’t nearly busy enough to need lights, let alone barrier gates; signs saying GIVE WAY TO TRAMS are enough. Melbourne drivers of course are used to dealing with trams sharing the road; in a city with a less extensive network it might be harder. The exception is the enormous and notorious Haymarket roundabout, which has a tram junction in the middle and several sets of lights. St Kilda Junction used to be similar, but the tram junction and highway were both grade separated decades ago, so it’s now a three-level monstrosity.
Haymarket is an absolute nightmare sometimes. I remember when I moved to Melbourne a few years ago, it confused the hell out of me. That exit onto Peel St is super slippery on the bike, too.
Did you happen to notice the Adelaide Metro trams in this video?
@@OzzieJeza02 Yes indeed. I was wondering why they were still moving, though, and not broken down in the middle of an intersection. Or being blocked by a beached fire truck.
Szczecin and Krakow do have some prettt crazy tram junctions. Tram under roundabout and another line up. It's a mess
timed light is so underrated amongst the Cities: Skyline players it's the most efficient way to introduce realism and traffic management to a city.
I agree :)
I mean, in real life they're awful but if imitating real life is all you're going for then they're a great way to add some realism
Not only have you got me back into Cities Skylines, you've made me feel guilty about having terrible traffic and terrible looking intersections. I now spend more time designing intersections and coercing nodes into doing my bidding than I do actually building the city. Thanks for breathing new life into the game for me.
The intersections ARE the city :)
+1
Same I spent way too long marking a single intersection the other day zoomed out and couldn't find it again for the life of me.
I would love to see even more complicated junction or a roundabout combining car traffic with trams and bikes. I have tried to do that myself but it doesnt even come close to your work :)
Same!
A Dutch junction 👍👍
It doesn't seem that there are many roads in the game or the workshop that accommodate bikes and trams.
17:05 I actually managed to fix this. So what you can do is give the incoming traffic a red light but also the ability to turn right on a red light. This makes them behave as if there was a blinking yellow light and the traffic in the roundabout is prioritized.
I live pretty much in front of "tram roundabout". I actually use it almost everyday (either as a pedestrian, driving or in the tram).
It works exactly as you programed it. And I have to say I disagree about the need for the rail barrier (the one here doesn't have it).
And this is because the tram goes through the roundabout very slowly and would easily be able to stop in time if needed. A barrier would slow the whole process a lot.
I actually found the hardest as a driver until you get used to that light that is always green but can sometimes be red. I think 19 out of 20 times I drive around it, it's green.
In Amsterdam we actually have a tram priority roundabout just like this.
Calling a collision between two high-capacity steel boxes at moderate speeds filled with people a "unique interaction" is possible the funniest thing I can imagine in city planning. I hope to avoid having too many unique interactions in my own city
You can improve the traffic lights setup by splitting the 5 seconds for tram timing into two. For the trams: first make a 1 sec phase for only trams entering the roundabout, that followed up by a 4 sec phase with only the inner tram lights green, so that trams can exit the circle. This way there will be no trams entering the roundabout at the last moment of the tram sequence.
Great idea!
I use that a lot and it works great but in this case the cars will have to stop again after one second to let the next tram through. You could try a longer maximum time and 'no one is driving' though. By the way, traffic manager has a setting to 'follow traffic rules at timed traffic lights'. Maybe that + a yield sign could work for the cars? Haven't tested that though
No, i would have them remain stopped.
I love seeing these transit focused tutorials by you. I love that roundabout with the tram through the center
That was hands down the BEST and most useful tutorial on Traffic Manager’s timed traffic lights. Thank you so much. I love using public transit in my cities but have had issues with getting the tunnels right and running them under roads without bumps and the ability to continue the road. Here in Toronto the streetcars fo into tunnels at two places- one running in the middle of a road and one on the side. One of those even has a stop underground before getting to the subway station.
We have a new light rail line going in that’s underground for a ton of stops across the middle of the city.
I don't even play Cities Skylines, but damn these videos are relaxing
Such a soothing voice. Yumbl ASMR anyone?
A great guide for some more advanced concepts. Especially multi-node timed traffic lights. I would be more than happy to see a few more guides like this.
I really like trams and used them for my last few builds, but the awkwardness of the junctions were always an issue - for my new build I decided to exclusively use busses because of that. Well now I have to go back and change everything to trams in my new build. Thanks a lot, YUMBL 😉
This really helped me understand the timed traffic light conditions better. Thank you, YUMBL.
Awesome vid and perfect timing, I was struggling with tram intersections! 😄
this more advanced stuff is amazing. your best vid yet!
Yes, usually trams go through roundabouts. In Stockholm there is a tram going around it. Or well, to be honest its not a real roundabout as it has traffic lights but it looks like a roundabout and the tram goes around it. Maybe because there is a superellipse-shaped fountain and a glass obelisk in the middle :)
But then, again, in Oslo they have trams going through a fountain. The water stops flowing as the tram enters. Or at least its supposed to :)
Awesome content! The introduction of the tram lights at each cycle for an intersection cleared up many issues for me!
I was planning to use trams in my next city, which i struggled a lot to incorporate into. That's perfect. Thanks !
Sinking Tram is OP for real. Great stuff as always, trams are bae
Yumble! Yumble! Yumble, now I have to redo most of my traffic intersection with the last option of tram under the highway. You're THE BEST Bro. Thanks
Keep these videos up man, your Parclo video was the reason why I got into modded Cities Skylines and your videos have been nothing but quality. Oh and that Adelaide Metro livery looking nice, don't let the name fool you though, unfortunately we don't actually have a metro in Adelaide haha
I like the euphemism you made when the bus was about to T-bone the tram.
Another very good video Yumbl, thanks for keeping up the quality.
Damn never would have guessed I would see an Adelaide tram in cities skylines
This is great! Definitely going to be incorporating this into my city. Might take awhile given the amount of intersections my tram lines cross but will be totally worth it. I just recently did an extensive overhaul of my bus routes and saw an increase to traffic flow and a good population bump. I'm hoping/imagining this would have a similar effect.
For the yields at the roundabout, theres a setting in TMPE for allowing yield rules to apply to timed traffic lights
Thank you for sharing this with us and showing how to do it. Also a special thank you to you for telling us the name of the individual who created this mod that you also used in this video.
More than often I come across content creators showing us the work that they do in city skylines introducing a new mod but never mentioning the person who created that mod and in my opinion this is wrong. You are one of the few people out there that actually tells other people who created this mod and you take a time out to thank them for it which is great. More content creators should learn from your example.
I have learned about so many other great creators thanks to Yumbl! Clus is hands down one of my favorites
NOW THIS! Is what I was really looking for
super cool use of game mechanics to facilitate transit ! Love it
Wow! Awesome job! I think this needs to sent to my transit agency and the local cities we run through. Our light rail was built haphazardly. There's a few intersections where there should've been an overpass. One intersection is a very busy, multi lane road. The last few days, I've lost 2 to 4 minutes off my schedule at that intersection. The cities in the area treat us like a redheaded stepchild. Sometimes we get the timing and sometimes we don't. There's a few places we get our signal a few seconds before the parallel traffic does to our right.
A little background on how our light rail system works (not sure about others) is we have "loops" between the tracks. These loops read a device under the head end of the train. They have set up two loops in each direction at intersections, one before and one after. We call them recall loops. The one after the intersection sends a signal to set up the next intersection, based on our speed. The one before the intersection recalls the signal as we pass through. You also mentioned a crossing gate, the CPUC (California Public Utilities Comission) regulates light rail in California. They require the use of a controlled gate when speeds exceed 40 mph and where the tracks cross a road on a separate right of way.
Now, for one of my cities, I did what you did here and built a couple round abouts with the Tram going through the middle and a couple where I build it the wrong way. I did that because I was trying to save a few rocks. I will fix those
In my experience in C:S I avoid use Trams/Trolleybus in high density regions. I leave these to use in low density areas only. In high density I use Monorail instead. They do not suffer problems in crossings and so on (if you are trying to make your public transportation at surface level). Or subway if you not care about maintain everything on underground. I prefer to play with little to no mods at all. But is a great video, for sure. Thanks again to share your knowledge and experiences with us!
Really nice, but you need to turn the tram lights to red in all your 3.8 steps (otherwise an arriving tram would have a green light, and potentially interfere with car traffic).
Keep the advanced stuff coming!!
Did I not? edit: i did not.
Heh @@YUMBL was the same comment I was gonna post, but checked to see if someone else cauight it.
But otherwise a good video as always Yumbl
A small mistake on my part. I certainly intended to stop the trams when cars are moving.
Your loyal subjects know it was a small bubu on your part@@YUMBL 😋
That traffic light trick is gold!
"Secret tram tricks the BRT mafia doesnt want you to know about" haha
Not the BRT Lobby! 😂
This was a great informative video. Loved it, keep it up
I've had ideas of what it would be like to recreate major cities as accurately and faithfully as possible, and your command of the mods that do finer control of nodes and custom multi-modal roads that split in weird ways has shown me how it could possibly be tackled
Super cool to see the old Adelaide Metro livery on the tram!
Fantastic video once again! I don't even have the game but watching your tutorials is still super fun! Looking forward to more possible future variations, maybe with bikes and trams combined? 🤔😅
:) Almost a advertising for public transport :9 Thank you!
I wish TM:PE would have seperate priority signs for certain modes like traffic lights
That's pretty fancy mate. Great!
Really interesting and very useful, thank you.
Incredible! Really nice tutorial!
Oh that's a great idea!
5b1c!!! Excited to see what you do with the networks in the series!
😆 OUTSTANDING! DEFINITELY tunnel trams are the way to go for me! 👍
I have to point out that here in Germany Roundabouts with Trams arent having any railway barriers. We just have traffic lights here. Your Tram Roundabout is almost perfectly Simulating a German Tram Roundabout.
The city I'm most familiar with with mixed modal traffic is Bonn Germany. There are no barriers to non-light rail traffic, only lights are used to control flow.
This is great.
This is great info! My issue also be pedestrians, from this I just need to give them their own light. So simple 🤦🏽♀️🤣
Perfect timing lol, I just put up a tram overpass and am expanding the network rn.
Phenomenal video! Subbed
Good info, thanks
yippy, fun with trams now. :)
I JUST picked up Snowfall because it was on sale in Steam. Perfect timing lol.
Snowfall is totally worth it!
I want more ideas for trams because I use them all the time in my cities. I love watching them move around the city vs metros that aren't visible. I'd particularly like intersections where the tram turns rather than continuing straight, or intersections where multiple different tram lines cross through the intersection perpendicularly or with some of them turning.
You speak of adding a rail barrier on the roudabout to protect the tram, but unfortunately it isn't the case in real life, or at least in France for tram crossings on roundabouts. There is only a red light for people already on the roudabout at the level of the tram crossing (and yeah, accidents happen unfortunately for people not used to it and not paying attention...)
I believe some places use rail barriers, and I’m sure its safer for everyone.
@@YUMBL I'm sure it is, but it may be too much for a place that needs the trafic to flow as it could block all the other entries of the roundabout with backing trafic for too long
I would only stop traffic crossing the tram line.
Yeah, I've never seen it anywhere in reality. Trams aren't trains... they're expected to mix with traffic, and traffic is expected to deal with that... barriers would just be a pain in the ass for everyone, an expensive bit of machinery to maintain, for little real benefit.
Hey, I recognise those trams!
I don't think barrier gates on a roundabout are a good idea. Having the barriers go up and down will add to the time of cars not being able to move through the roundabout and at that point a fully lighted junction probably is a better option for traffic flow.
Instead of barriers it seems more reasonable to add sound with the traffic light signaling a tram will be coming through. it will create alertness in the drivers and doesn't increase the time cars will have to stop.
Yeah, I don't think I've ever seen barrier gates for a tram anyway. The only exception being the rare train/tram intersection where the gates stop trams and cars going onto train tracks.
Nice !
3:30 In the Netherlands Trams always have priority over any situation. Trams always go first.
The traffic in my city is horrible but you're videos help out
Trams are my favorite public transit method. Both in cities skylines and real life.
I found a great solution, I used your pinwheel and a 2 lane + 1 tram one way road.
Nice, Adelaide Metro Trams.
Trams don't need barriers, as they can stop quickly, and are also generally slower, and easier to see coming than trains.
That's just overkill to start using barriers, and makes trams seem way more dangerous than they are, psychologically.
An idea for an at-grade intersection with trams I haven't had an opportunity to really mess with: a hybrid continuous flow/Michigan left. Cars turning left from the tram road cross the tram tracks and opposing traffic before the intersection proper as in a CFI, while cars turning left from the cross street turn right and then make a U-turn across the tracks. These two crossings could potentially use a reverse-traffic road.
And yeah it'd be nice if TM:PE traffic lights had the option of flashing yellow yield and flashing red stop-sign phases.
So in my city there is a tram "roundabout" in a district and there the tram actually goes around the roundabout as well and sharing lanes with traffic. It goes from three lanes to two lanes I think. Gotta take a look at it. And then all of them enter a big intersection as well.
Congratulations, I think you published the first video that uses TM:PE's conditionals.
🤣
Always interesting videos!
I use no one is driving for pretty much all of my timed traffic lights. I have found it resolves many of my congestion issues when you have one road that constantly stacks up compared to all the other lines.
In option #2, you describe you would want a railroad crossing style bar. I've never seen these anywhere for trams. In The Netherlands we use only lights. And sometimes a bell to alert pedestrians and cyclists. But I've never seen a bar anywhere in Europe. We do use railroad crossing style bars for metros crossing at ground level, but their speed is much greater and the crossings are less integrated in the normal road, a metro is basically just a fast light train when driving on ground level...
In Nantes (France) you guys can see interesting examples of roundabouts and trams integration.
A surprising one is a double round about with through tram lanes next to station "Michelet Sciences"!
An example of the grade separated version can be found just south of the Red Bull Arena in Leipzig
Nice! They’re around. It’s just expensive.
I'd be curious to see a video exploring the different traffic light "tactics" for regular intersections. For example, at the end of this video, you showed the intersection working where all the lanes from each individual side were green at the same time (so East was all green, then North, then West, then South, etc). What are the pros and cons of that method, vs, say, North-South left and right turns + East-West right turns are all green, then the left turns switch off in favor of the straight traffic, then the whole concept rotates 90deg and repeats.
nice
Ive never actually seen cars being stopped by a rail barrier on a tram crossing, it may be a thing outside of Europe, but here trams are more often than not treated as busses in terms of how they flow with the traffic, these kinds of traffic circles with trams crossing straight through them are quite common in Poland and they do not really have barriers like that
Nice
Thank you for your videos they're always very informative. I personally dont understand the difference between a tram and a trolley.
You’re welcome! No difference. Regional names.
there are loads of accidents involving cars and trams with no barriers. I think things flow better id imagine without barriers and trams go relatively slowly so collisions with cars are probably relatively safe.
Damn!! I haven’t play Cities in a while, this makes me want to play again. When will Cities 2 release???!!!!
For your tram roundabout light phase two you should have made the interval 5 to 12 seconds, with the exit condition of nobody driving.
That configuration means that any one tram can get through independently, and there's no way that two trams end up with one going through late and messing up the flow.
That maximum interval gives the trauma chance to take its five seconds to make its trip, a second for the switch over to be considered in which a tram can be arriving, then five more seconds for that tram to go through and we're at 11 seconds. So you said it 12 so that it can decide early or tune that last bit. You don't know how much slack you get for when the rules engine will consider the tram present.
So you'll never stop the trams passing through that intersection.
I swear, the major intersections of the 5B1C bout to be epic
The opening bridge mod has lowering barriers to stop traffic just before the point the bridge moves. Check it out.
Maybe a modification of either TMPE or Node Controller would add lowering barriers as both of those Mods are QOL mods that almost everyone uses.
Only things I'd have to say is for the roundabout; 1) Upgrade the roundabout itself to a 3 lane for the 1 through 2 on flow of it. 2) Make the roundabout a little wider, maybe a 5 or 6 unit radius instead of 4. 3) Small slip lanes for right turns so they don't interfere with people trying to go straight through, though its less important if you have a 3 lane instead of a 2 lane.
I think 3 lane roundabouts are dangerous. If it needs that much capacity a light is definitely better.
1:44 actually, this is realistic. This is exactly how it is set up in my city. As soon as a tram arrives, the signal turns green, often even before it stops. The cars that go in the direction also get a turn though. We don't have roundabouts at major intersections where the trams are, however.
YUMBL! Have you heard of hook turns? they're a staple in my city of melbourne australia. they tend to trip up new folk but they're pretty good IRL. no clue how you would make them in city skylines haha
I would have done a very minor adjustment to this, I would keep the tram underpass, but I would lift the terrain so that the tram doesn't slope down and up again, this will punish car traffic just a little more, to a greater adventage of the tram. Sloping the tram down like that is even more expensive to construct, and actually do impact both travel speed and maintenance on the fleet
Generally railroad crossings provide 20-40 seconds of warning, so the whole barrier sequence would interrupt traffic for up to a minute.
This probably only applies to train railroad crossings, because trains shouldn't stop too often. Trams however stop very frequently, so I guess the warning times could be reduced quite a bit. Lowering and raising the barriers would still require a lot of time though.
I wish Metro did our light rail lines like this (well C/Green is the exception and could fully go automated with their Siemens train sets)
I was hoping you would go for an asymmetrical road at the intersection for left turning traffic. Seems like a better use of a space than the grass median.
That would take some doing. The “sinking tram” road is quite special, and doesn’t come with that piece.
@@YUMBL Using node controller to change a node to nodeless might work. I'll give it a shot.
All of the nodeless pieces seem to freak out if a nearby node is even touched with node controller.
@@YUMBL might be something that can be 'adjusted' in the road editor. Maybe a suggestion for the mod author
No, i think its the nature of nodeless pieces and node controller. They arent friends. Build something with “vanilla overpass” and click it with node controller. Then enjoy rebuilding it 😂
i discovered clus's tram roads about a week ago , and my literal only gripe with it is ... the texture doesn't match perfectly with vanilla roads , and i dont use them at all , i guess thats what happens when you are an artist with OCD lol
The worn textures are great but you’re right, they dont mesh with vanilla well.
You actually can remove traffic lights on one road of the intersection (at least visually) using network skins :)
I usually end up having to grade separate my trams at really busy intersections; the vanilla overpass method seems nice, but I don't use that mod, so I tend to end up just building a big, elevated half-circle like 10 units back from where the car road is. Problem with that is the bit where the separate tram track merges back into the main road, since the trams have to completely cross over one half of the car traffic...
I really wish you could run trams in the outer lanes, rather than the middle of the road...
You can, that road exists.
Now, Michigan left, with trams in the middle lane and through the crossing, also being able to turn each way.
Or less if you really just do not need that, will only make the 1 or at most 2 phase tram signals easier.
The cars in the Michigan Left bit will just always give priority to trams i think.
Should be doable.
Will get slightly bigger.
At that point you might do it differently, letting trams go from the middle to the outside well before you enter the whole Michigan Left intersection, and they cross the road just before the Michigan Left bit so they do not interfere. Still big, BUT, only a small bit where trams cross the road, and might be just handled with priority and not even traffic lights. Depending on the amount of trams.
Even easier is adding an underpass on all sides, and since the middle node is quite big you can have a tram only underground roundabout or just each way going each way since it will generally not be too busy with trams there and they will figure it out most likely anyway.
I just like cool intersections, even when they're not always the best. Looks can count too.
Can you link the asset for the trams you used? I can't see them anywhere in your mods or asset collections. Didn't know there were any Adelaide trams and now I need them :D