What I did to shim an early-‘80s used Kramer bass I bought: I cut out a full-pocket shim using a cereal box, then I made two copies of it. I cut one of the copies to 2/3rds length, another to 1/3rd length, and stacked them all together to create the needed ramp effect.
THANK YOU very much !! Shimmed a brand new Tele Vintage II 60's with doubled Fanta box papper. The saddles were so low and screws were cutting my skin. Now at normal height the screws work like stilts. The feel and sustain are now normal. 👆👆😄😄💯💯🎵🎵
OMG, you're absolutely RIGHT!! Shimming a guitar neck does nothing to the tone! What it does do is give you a much more playable guitar in cases where it is needed. The most common example is you change the bridge on you stock Tele or Strat (more so on Tele's). You will inevitably need to shim the neck if you lower the saddles--bottom them out actually, and your action is still equal to or greater than 2.5mm. Most guitar players will not think of shimming but instead will try adjusting the truss rod until they're ready to smash the guitar into a million pieces--because truss rod adjustment will NEVER give you the action and buzz-free playability you're looking for. Don't Fear the Shim!!!!!
People just talk, I’m a machinist CNC programmer parts designer and I built and modified crazy guitars and I use mechanical concepts that people have not idea. I’ve been successful in all my project. I’m not a luthier by any mean but I know how things work and this instrument is one of them. Don’t be afraid I’ll find it so fun…
My favorite shim material is aluminum foil. I can get it to any thickness I need. I did work on one guitar that actually had a slice of credit card as a shim. From the factory.
Cool I did some Bob Ross paintings years and years ago lol.. Anyway I agree neck shims are not bad unless it's too thick which is what I've got. I'll be taking that neck off again. Damn.
So I messed with my neck (took it off & inspected what this micro tilt was). Anyways I don't know what I did but the action used to be super low. Like 1.1-1.5mm high E low with no bending buzz issues. Now it buzzes only when bending the 15th fret high e string 1 1/2. And it wont-not-buzz unless the high E is at 2mm or higher (that's wayyy too high for a tele imo). My gibsons sits around 1.3mm high E and I could easily lower it even more with no issues. Do you have a fix for my Fender tele 15th fret buzz issue knowing what I've told you?
I have to raise my Saddles up as high as they go. Or I will get fret buzz. Does that mean I should put a shim in the front of the neck pocket. What do you think would cause this. The neck pocket not cut deep enough?
I bet that those complaining about loss of tone or whatever don't even own a guitar. If you own a mid-priced guitar that has some playability issues and you are afraid to even get near the neck bolts, here's my 2 cents of advice: unscrew that neck and be ready for a surprise. I just did that with my Ibanez and it turns out that the professional, high-tech, super-precise final factory-setup was done with a shim. Oh, and they didn't even bother to use paper or cardboard, they just used a small strip of sandpaper - no kidding. And they didn't even put it in straight, it covered the diagonal of the neck pocket and went across one bolt hole! Unfortunately I still haven't solved my issue (high action) but one thing I can confirm: a shim does not affect the tone at all (tried a small cardboard and a bigger wooden one so far). It does however affect the geometry of your guitar, which in turn seems to affect things like string tension etc.
Many guitars use the screw to plate method and named it dumb shit like "accu tilt" or whatever. I agree with you if it's a relatively small taper, but depending on your climate, it could put a small warp in it. I've seen it happen, though extremely rare. I still prefer hardwood complete neck plate shims, but to each his own. The best way is still to taper the actual neck joint in the body, but most dont have the skill to do it.
Hi Thanks for you video. I have paint in my Strat Neck Pocket from new. The Paint is flat. Should I remove it with paint remover to make wood to wood contact for better tone and sustain please ?
Hey Dylan, I have an Fender Acoustasonic Telecaster. It’s perfect for what I do and love the tones that I can get from it. The issue is that the string action was way off spec (way too high). It comes with a Micro-Tilt adjustment but I can easily tell that the sound changes when I use it to change the neck angle. I decided to try to make my own shim. I used some Basswood to make about a 1 degree angle. Action fixed but to my surprise, I could easily tell a difference in the sound/tone. Dylan, you say that no one could tell the difference in tone... maybe the acoustic nature of my guitar is different? To me it is like night and day... without the shim or micro-tilt, I love playing my guitar (except for the action) and with the adjustment, it is so sadly uninspiring, I play for a couple minutes and put the guitar down. I am also going to try to adjust my bolt/screws on the neck as per your other video, I am probably tightening them a little too much...maybe that will help? My next try will be a harder wood shim (pre-made from Stew-Mac)... maybe that will be the difference but I don’t have a lot of hope. Any thoughts? Thanks, Kevin
Guitar techs don't know how there confused, and the nut and the shim go together. My Affinity Tele needed be a shim in the neck but a small piece of paper was good enough. A .025 shim was too much
Exactly. Don't buy into the StewMac's (and others') BS. PS. A lot of their stuff is great and a lot of their stuff is just a way to get you pay for something you don't need.
You can't convince the "Golden Ear" crowd, even with double-blind proof otherwise. They love their snake-oil. Its even worse in the hifi audio world. My favorite is the high end speaker cable aficionados, who can't tell the difference between $900 per foot KimberKable, and a coat hanger.... many examples of this out there. Hilarious.
With a milling machine that is totally doable, in fact we make our higher end custom teles that way. To suggest to people to “sand” their neck pocket to a precise two degrees of neck angle is beyond what most people are capable of so it is not reasonable. It is also not consistent without jigs and/or a machine.... sure anything could be done, but it’s outside the realm of actual reasonable reality.
rythmosrythmos people aren’t idiots at all, but a lot of people are very unreasonable about the traditions they hold to even when there is no basis for them. It is Especially annoying when they y’all disparagingly against people that don’t agree.
Deliberately adjusting a neck to have relief is NOT NECESSARY. Neck is off. Straighten it to best of your ability. Now, LEVEL THE FRETS. Do NOT use a levelling beam. Too harsh. Use rocker & a "points" file. (Ignition points like in a car distributor. Amazon.) One at a time. Check & recheck. Polish frets. Reinstall neck. NOW, experiment with small paper shims till you get action low & right. No buzz. String tension will introduce relief. Toss the Alan wrench.
What I did to shim an early-‘80s used Kramer bass I bought: I cut out a full-pocket shim using a cereal box, then I made two copies of it. I cut one of the copies to 2/3rds length, another to 1/3rd length, and stacked them all together to create the needed ramp effect.
THANK YOU very much !! Shimmed a brand new Tele Vintage II 60's with doubled Fanta box papper. The saddles were so low and screws were cutting my skin. Now at normal height the screws work like stilts. The feel and sustain are now normal. 👆👆😄😄💯💯🎵🎵
6 years later and still finding value here. Thanks for the tip on the tightness of the bolt on the neck and plate.lossen that bad boy and plays better
He does it again!!..straight up no bull info!!...he’s the “go to” for us Guitarst/Builder enthusiasts!!..✨🎸🎶👍🏾
OMG, you're absolutely RIGHT!! Shimming a guitar neck does nothing to the tone! What it does do is give you a much more playable guitar in cases where it is needed. The most common example is you change the bridge on you stock Tele or Strat (more so on Tele's). You will inevitably need to shim the neck if you lower the saddles--bottom them out actually, and your action is still equal to or greater than 2.5mm. Most guitar players will not think of shimming but instead will try adjusting the truss rod until they're ready to smash the guitar into a million pieces--because truss rod adjustment will NEVER give you the action and buzz-free playability you're looking for. Don't Fear the Shim!!!!!
I had a crappy Squier II strat that I had to put a lot of shim in... That thing had sustain for days.
I don't really consider those crappy at all. I've owned two; both are very playable and sound great.
Well done Dylan! Love debunking myths! A lot of the guitar industry is just smoke and mirrors!!!
People just talk, I’m a machinist CNC programmer parts designer and I built and modified crazy guitars and I use mechanical concepts that people have not idea. I’ve been successful in all my project. I’m not a luthier by any mean but I know how things work and this instrument is one of them. Don’t be afraid I’ll find it so fun…
Shim saves my beloved American standard strat from sell and I be grateful and does it work great
My favorite shim material is aluminum foil. I can get it to any thickness I need. I did work on one guitar that actually had a slice of credit card as a shim. From the factory.
cause the rat aluminum foil is a new one! No reason why it wouldn’t work! That’s awesome
Great video! Always willing to learn something new.
Cool I did some Bob Ross paintings years and years ago lol..
Anyway I agree neck shims are not bad unless it's too thick which is what I've got. I'll be taking that neck off again. Damn.
This was extremely helpful! Thank you!
Stew mac sells tapered full pocket shims.
So I messed with my neck (took it off & inspected what this micro tilt was). Anyways I don't know what I did but the action used to be super low. Like 1.1-1.5mm high E low with no bending buzz issues. Now it buzzes only when bending the 15th fret high e string 1 1/2. And it wont-not-buzz unless the high E is at 2mm or higher (that's wayyy too high for a tele imo). My gibsons sits around 1.3mm high E and I could easily lower it even more with no issues. Do you have a fix for my Fender tele 15th fret buzz issue knowing what I've told you?
good stuff
I have to raise my Saddles up as high as they go. Or I will get fret buzz. Does that mean I should put a shim in the front of the neck pocket. What do you think would cause this. The neck pocket not cut deep enough?
Can I use masking tape instead? And mine has a little bit of space on the side. Should i shim that as well? Hope you'll reply. Thanks
Dylan, Thanks for the insight. Can I use a credit card? I wonder how thick shims I have to use.
Junho Park that is probably too thick. A playing card or business card is more like it
How thick is that carbon fibre sheet ?
Hey Dylan how much angle increase would you recommend for a wraparound (gotoh) to have it fit a telecaster
I bet that those complaining about loss of tone or whatever don't even own a guitar. If you own a mid-priced guitar that has some playability issues and you are afraid to even get near the neck bolts, here's my 2 cents of advice: unscrew that neck and be ready for a surprise. I just did that with my Ibanez and it turns out that the professional, high-tech, super-precise final factory-setup was done with a shim. Oh, and they didn't even bother to use paper or cardboard, they just used a small strip of sandpaper - no kidding. And they didn't even put it in straight, it covered the diagonal of the neck pocket and went across one bolt hole! Unfortunately I still haven't solved my issue (high action) but one thing I can confirm: a shim does not affect the tone at all (tried a small cardboard and a bigger wooden one so far). It does however affect the geometry of your guitar, which in turn seems to affect things like string tension etc.
If you own a non tilt bolt on, your gonna shim it. Eventually
Cork sniffing kinda stuff.😁 stop the wine-ing! You tell ‘em Dylan.
Many guitars use the screw to plate method and named it dumb shit like "accu tilt" or whatever. I agree with you if it's a relatively small taper, but depending on your climate, it could put a small warp in it. I've seen it happen, though extremely rare. I still prefer hardwood complete neck plate shims, but to each his own. The best way is still to taper the actual neck joint in the body, but most dont have the skill to do it.
Hardwood shim 👍
Hi Thanks for you video. I have paint in my Strat Neck Pocket from new. The Paint is flat. Should I remove it with paint remover to make wood to wood contact for better tone and sustain please ?
Bret Ames as long as the pocket is clean and flat, the paint won’t hurt anything. You just don’t want it “holding anything up”
Great Thanks. So maybe I should just give it a very light sanding and leave it at that?
Bret Ames like a scuff with a scotch brite would do perfectly
Thank You so very much. And for getting back to me so quickly. God Bless You Sir
Hey Dylan,
I have an Fender Acoustasonic Telecaster. It’s perfect for what I do and love the tones that I can get from it. The issue is that the string action was way off spec (way too high). It comes with a Micro-Tilt adjustment but I can easily tell that the sound changes when I use it to change the neck angle. I decided to try to make my own shim. I used some Basswood to make about a 1 degree angle. Action fixed but to my surprise, I could easily tell a difference in the sound/tone.
Dylan, you say that no one could tell the difference in tone... maybe the acoustic nature of my guitar is different? To me it is like night and day... without the shim or micro-tilt, I love playing my guitar (except for the action) and with the adjustment, it is so sadly uninspiring, I play for a couple minutes and put the guitar down.
I am also going to try to adjust my bolt/screws on the neck as per your other video, I am probably tightening them a little too much...maybe that will help?
My next try will be a harder wood shim (pre-made from Stew-Mac)... maybe that will be the difference but I don’t have a lot of hope.
Any thoughts?
Thanks,
Kevin
Guitarists make up a lot of things that have never happened. 😂
Is that a Tele Noventa body?
No
Whats with the Moto Helmet?
Hmm, I should do a video on that
Whats problem with shim? None at all
Ive seen this process done in both sides of the neck pocket, how do you know where to put the shim???
across the back ... not on the sides
Guitar techs don't know how there confused, and the nut and the shim go together. My Affinity Tele needed be a shim in the neck but a small piece of paper was good enough. A .025 shim was too much
Exactly. Don't buy into the StewMac's (and others') BS.
PS. A lot of their stuff is great and a lot of their stuff is just a way to get you pay for something you don't need.
StewMac logic: $10 Shim, $15 shipping.
Me: That's gonna be a no from me, dawg.
Stew Mac full pocket shims for the win
Too expensive for no real benefit... gimmick
You can't convince the "Golden Ear" crowd, even with double-blind proof otherwise. They love their snake-oil. Its even worse in the hifi audio world. My favorite is the high end speaker cable aficionados, who can't tell the difference between $900 per foot KimberKable, and a coat hanger.... many examples of this out there. Hilarious.
333rd like
and 57th, 58th comment
Come on, There is no doubt that shims are not a good thing or something you want if given a choice, SOOO.....
lol... enjoy being wrong
have to disagree .; there are other ways to achieve your goal without shims . guitar were not designed for shims .;it is a short cut to save money .
What would you suggest?
@@DylanTalksTone How about sanding the higher part of the pocket, gradually towards the bottom end, enough to create an angle ?
With a milling machine that is totally doable, in fact we make our higher end custom teles that way. To suggest to people to “sand” their neck pocket to a precise two degrees of neck angle is beyond what most people are capable of so it is not reasonable. It is also not consistent without jigs and/or a machine.... sure anything could be done, but it’s outside the realm of actual reasonable reality.
@@DylanTalksTone Exactly
Cool Rene suppose your neck broke and you wanted a new style neck. You’d be screwed because your neck pocket has been permanently sanded
so he thinks we are idiots- listen how he imitates people who disagree
rythmosrythmos people aren’t idiots at all, but a lot of people are very unreasonable about the traditions they hold to even when there is no basis for them. It is Especially annoying when they y’all disparagingly against people that don’t agree.
too much talking...
René Kok well... we could do it like a silent movie, but that wouldn’t be very effective.
Deliberately adjusting a neck to have relief is NOT NECESSARY. Neck is off. Straighten it to best of your ability. Now, LEVEL THE FRETS. Do NOT use a levelling beam. Too harsh. Use rocker & a "points" file. (Ignition points like in a car distributor. Amazon.) One at a time. Check & recheck. Polish frets. Reinstall neck. NOW, experiment with small paper shims till you get action low & right. No buzz. String tension will introduce relief. Toss the Alan wrench.