Sorry, I think this is completely wrong. Gain staging in DAWs does matter because of many reasons. Firstly, you might want to clip, limit or compress a track to -1db to get rid of any dynamics (This is most dubstep, EDM producers). If you do that and don't gain stage each track, you will quickly end up with distortion going over 0db. Secondly, your example is bad. Try that again with a big chord, playing notes from 40hz up to 15khz. See how far you get then. Finally, gain staging is part of work flow that leads to better mixes. I used to be lazy and not bother gain staging, allowing 32bit float in Ableton to give me +20db over 0 headroom. But when I exported, my tracks sounded flat. Most professionals start the sound sources for each track at either -12db or -7db on each track. Decap just did a video about this. Sorry mate, you're totally wrong on this one. You're encouraging bad habits and work flows.
Viewing it from a technical angle he is not wrong. But as you said, it builds up bad habits if you don't worry about gain staging. For linear plugins like EQ, faders, or delays the input level really does not matter in a 32 bit float environment. But there are other plugins like compressors or distortion where the input level makes a big difference. Often times those plugins have a sweet spot where they sound best. It's generally a good idea to optimize for those non-linear plugins, because the linear ones won't sound worse with lower input signals. Some plugins even can be switched between both types. So if in doubt which type of processing a particular plugins uses, better keep your levels low throughout the complete signal chain.
@@markuskopter A technical angle for one high EQ spectrum example. That is nowhere near enough to prove gain staging isn't needed in Ableton! As you say, there are so many plugins out there that will internally distort when pushed past their limit. So this video really should be taken down as it sends out all the wrong messages. I'm a sub and have enjoyed other videos. This one is totally wrong. Objectively.
Perhaps I ought to re-title the video, which is fair enough (I've done this now). But the whole point of the video was to say that being hyper-particular about gain staging workflow isn't necessary, and there's a lot of flexibility in the digital realm that isn't talked about. Hence why I made this video. Also, many of the things you mentioned were addressed in the 'Exceptions' section of the video ;) again, the master channel is what matters here when you export, so technically you can go +20 on the faders, as long as you manage the loudness on the front end. Of course, going +20 is hard to do anyway unless you're specifically doing something wrong (like I demonstrated), but even then, the fidelity still holds up in the 32bit float environment and again, if you don't clip on your master, you're sweet. RE: encouraging bad habits, again it's context-specific. This video is trying to break the stigma that the only way to work is the whole '-12dB to -7dB' thing. It's not - there are many ways of working that lead to a good end result. But hey, at the end of the day, we can agree to disagree.
Almost EVERY SENTENCE of this is Wrong! Even if you were foolish enough to try to follow this advice, he just made so many exceptions to his own nonsense that there's No scenario left in which you wouldn't gainstage. He's not alone though, there's a crop of dead wrong advice in the TH-cam abyss. Without actually explaining gainstaging properly, which is easily searchable, let me offer 2 points: 1) this advice is like saying "the highway has no speed limit anymore, so you can drive as fast as you want!" "Unless you're car has an engine or tires or brakes or a suspension, and you actually need to get on the on ramp or off the off ramp, or maybe turn the steering wheel to follow the road, or avoid collisions with any other traffic that might be on that road. But drive as fast as you want." 2) Look at your hand and grab a Sharpie. Write on your pinky "Acoustic", your ring-finger "Analog", your middle-finger "Digital", your index-finger "Analog", and your thumb "Acoustic". If you wanna be an Audio Engineer, head to the tattoo shop and fully commit. Now, your job is to manage that process. Between an Acoustic source and destination. Between a mouth and an ear. The smart-asses among you are probably thinking "well my sources are already in the computer ". Okay, well A) are they ever coming out? Into say, speakers or headphones. And B) how did they get in there? I bet a real audio engineer, one that knew gainstaging had something to do with it. Last point: This guy is talking into a microphone, and listening on headphones. What would happen if he cranked the gain All the way up on either the Mic Amp or the Headphone Amp? Okay last last thought: Those "electronic" producers, the ones producing brain-splittingly loud mixes... There not ignoring gainstaging, they've absolutely mastered it!
When I master the song I just make sure that at no moment it marks zero. Always orange but never red. Is that ok? It’s a pity that when I bounce the track to itunes the sound is not exactly the same. Maybe it’s just me but on the LPX the tracks sound better? Thanks for the heads up in advance. I’ve just started making music like 2 years ago and mixing and mastering is for me the worst part. Such a headache 😅
![เปิดใจ “ต้นหอม ศกุนตลา” หลังโดนพาดพิงธุรกิจที่เคยทำ และผลกระทบทำถูกปลดฟ้าผ่า! | แฉ 24 ต.ค.67 [2/3]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/vCi5OIqlxaE/mqdefault.jpg)
Sorry, I think this is completely wrong. Gain staging in DAWs does matter because of many reasons. Firstly, you might want to clip, limit or compress a track to -1db to get rid of any dynamics (This is most dubstep, EDM producers). If you do that and don't gain stage each track, you will quickly end up with distortion going over 0db. Secondly, your example is bad. Try that again with a big chord, playing notes from 40hz up to 15khz. See how far you get then. Finally, gain staging is part of work flow that leads to better mixes. I used to be lazy and not bother gain staging, allowing 32bit float in Ableton to give me +20db over 0 headroom. But when I exported, my tracks sounded flat. Most professionals start the sound sources for each track at either -12db or -7db on each track. Decap just did a video about this. Sorry mate, you're totally wrong on this one. You're encouraging bad habits and work flows.
Viewing it from a technical angle he is not wrong. But as you said, it builds up bad habits if you don't worry about gain staging.
For linear plugins like EQ, faders, or delays the input level really does not matter in a 32 bit float environment. But there are other plugins like compressors or distortion where the input level makes a big difference. Often times those plugins have a sweet spot where they sound best.
It's generally a good idea to optimize for those non-linear plugins, because the linear ones won't sound worse with lower input signals. Some plugins even can be switched between both types.
So if in doubt which type of processing a particular plugins uses, better keep your levels low throughout the complete signal chain.
yeh this kind of clickbait video makes me want to unsubscribe. It's wrong on a few levels as you mentioned.
@@markuskopter A technical angle for one high EQ spectrum example. That is nowhere near enough to prove gain staging isn't needed in Ableton! As you say, there are so many plugins out there that will internally distort when pushed past their limit. So this video really should be taken down as it sends out all the wrong messages. I'm a sub and have enjoyed other videos. This one is totally wrong. Objectively.
@@Gino_567 I almost did unsubscribe. But I held off to see if he would respond. Some of the other videos on the channel are good.
Perhaps I ought to re-title the video, which is fair enough (I've done this now). But the whole point of the video was to say that being hyper-particular about gain staging workflow isn't necessary, and there's a lot of flexibility in the digital realm that isn't talked about. Hence why I made this video.
Also, many of the things you mentioned were addressed in the 'Exceptions' section of the video ;) again, the master channel is what matters here when you export, so technically you can go +20 on the faders, as long as you manage the loudness on the front end. Of course, going +20 is hard to do anyway unless you're specifically doing something wrong (like I demonstrated), but even then, the fidelity still holds up in the 32bit float environment and again, if you don't clip on your master, you're sweet.
RE: encouraging bad habits, again it's context-specific. This video is trying to break the stigma that the only way to work is the whole '-12dB to -7dB' thing. It's not - there are many ways of working that lead to a good end result. But hey, at the end of the day, we can agree to disagree.
Almost EVERY SENTENCE of this is Wrong!
Even if you were foolish enough to try to follow this advice, he just made so many exceptions to his own nonsense that there's No scenario left in which you wouldn't gainstage.
He's not alone though, there's a crop of dead wrong advice in the TH-cam abyss.
Without actually explaining gainstaging properly, which is easily searchable, let me offer 2 points:
1) this advice is like saying "the highway has no speed limit anymore, so you can drive as fast as you want!" "Unless you're car has an engine or tires or brakes or a suspension, and you actually need to get on the on ramp or off the off ramp, or maybe turn the steering wheel to follow the road, or avoid collisions with any other traffic that might be on that road. But drive as fast as you want."
2) Look at your hand and grab a Sharpie. Write on your pinky "Acoustic", your ring-finger "Analog", your middle-finger "Digital", your index-finger "Analog", and your thumb "Acoustic".
If you wanna be an Audio Engineer, head to the tattoo shop and fully commit.
Now, your job is to manage that process.
Between an Acoustic source and destination.
Between a mouth and an ear.
The smart-asses among you are probably thinking "well my sources are already in the computer ".
Okay, well A) are they ever coming out? Into say, speakers or headphones. And B) how did they get in there? I bet a real audio engineer, one that knew gainstaging had something to do with it.
Last point:
This guy is talking into a microphone, and listening on headphones.
What would happen if he cranked the gain All the way up on either the Mic Amp or the Headphone Amp?
Okay last last thought:
Those "electronic" producers, the ones producing brain-splittingly loud mixes...
There not ignoring gainstaging, they've absolutely mastered it!
The best thing about making stupidly loud music is that you'll go deaf by the time you're 45 and then you won't hear how bad it is.
Thank You master i will return here when i will get lots of stream in future ,Thank you master!
I started getting on this concept when I learned about guillotine mixing... Modern day EDM music just works differently than the old days... Period.
Why don't you use a vu meter? you can apply it to any channel, if you choose peak instruments on drums as vu
In Ableton, the lower line on the meters acts as an RMS-type meter, or more of an average. This is similar to what a VU meter would do anyway :)
When I master the song I just make sure that at no moment it marks zero. Always orange but never red. Is that ok? It’s a pity that when I bounce the track to itunes the sound is not exactly the same. Maybe it’s just me but on the LPX the tracks sound better? Thanks for the heads up in advance. I’ve just started making music like 2 years ago and mixing and mastering is for me the worst part. Such a headache 😅
Spot on! Such a simple concept, yet many mastering engineers (in the box) will still ask for a -6dB peak pre-master 🙄
Spot on meaning dead wrong right?
If you follow this it may take years to un-learn. Time you could have spent improving your skills.
The thumbnail gave me a panic attack.
Gracia 😊