"Don't film my mansion while you film your documentary on erosion." Now everyone knows about your mansion. If you had not complained, nobody would have known or cared about your mansion. Something to that effect.
Exactly ... if they wanted to limit the services or data available then they could have done so in the API definition. They are just trying to cover their collective ar*e having expected nobody would notice this interface. Just a shame there are few judges with any IT or development experience to hear such cases.
Not really. An API is not to expose functionality to external applications. There can be internal APIs that shouldn’t be accessed by others. HOWEVER. If an API is public, it should be Mazda’s responsibility to protect their APIs. A URL to your favorite website is also an API, you cannot force users not to visit a website. You can add authentication to gate such URLs. Just because the API isn’t protected well enough doesn’t mean it’s copyrighted. It can be added to terms of service to disallow users, but they won’t be able to catch such people. That’s like showing your balls in public and expecting people not to photograph them. If it’s in public domain, it’s not under your control anymore. Also, attacking a hammer company for empowering users to modify your car isn’t the right approach - it’s what Mazda is doing. The repositories are tools which don’t access the APIs until a user sets them up properly in their home assistant. No different than a hammer used to modify your Ferrari (after which you can’t buy a new Ferrari from what I hear)
@@vixrant **woosh** …and completely wrong. “External application” does not mean “public.” The point was that using the API itself is not the same as using code whether it is a private API or not, so you don’t get to claim that someone using your API is stealing your copyrighted code. The entire point of an API is to externally interface with some deliberately exposed function of the application without exposing bespoke internal code. “Expose” doesn’t mean “public” either. It’s from the perspective of the code base. The API is exposing itself for authorized use. In this case, it is unauthorized use but they likely have no authority to assert their authorization… and certainly not by claiming that API access is equivalent to stolen code when the entire point is to interface without knowing internal code or requiring bespoke code.
When Oracle published the Java APIs for programmers to use, they didn't foresee the possibility that others might offer competing implementations of their APIs and tool chain.
I love how when Louis says "I hope you're having a lovely day" it always sounds like he's trying to hold back his rage over whatever anti-consumer practice he's going to inform us about.
Hello Fellow Rotarian, I salute you from the land down under! Just gonna say that if this guy was checking the fuel levels in his shared Mazda and then he claimed that it was a rotary engine on E85 with limited access to fuel bowsers......in the current climate you'd hope that Mazda would say 'oh poor c***? C'mon guys just let him keep it' 🤣
As someone who always respected Mazda for not being like others, this made me sad :( Especially since they are such a gigantic part of the tuning szene, they should have no issues with people doing whatever they want on their cars.
@@mactalk2871 yep. Sad as I am looking at my RX7 project car sitting in the driveway. Mazda has been big part of my family? My grand father bought Mazda, my dad bought Mazda, I bought Mazda. It almost seems like out of character for them to do this? It's as if someone in the application development part of Mazda took offence to what someone else was capable of doing that they weren't? It seems to be a big factor of what goes on in large companies in the modern world? Tesla has done similar things and it was crazy to see people attacking Elon Musk personally for what his company's internal policies are? I don't blame Elon when someone has worked hard on something and then feels ripped off when a 3rd party offers something better than what they can produce? It starts to not look good for the brand, so the company legal teams get involved because they have investors to appease? Mazda investors don't want to hear that some free solution can do a better job than a solution that they have paid developers a lot of money to produce; it makes them look bad? So much of the response from all of this is a carried down over reaction to basic human emotion inadequacy? Whilst this occurs, simultaneously Mazda sends some of its engineers from Japan over to America just to attend a racing event to shake the hand of a competitor that has been doing his own development of the rotary engine? Actually thanking the guy for his efforts and contribution to making after market parts that Mazda themselves are no longer producing? They still own the parents and have all the blue prints to these parts........but some guy is straight up reproducing (and improving) Mazda's design and selling these parts for profit.......and yet Mazda supports that and is somehow 100% A-OK with this? Yet a guy taps into an API and Mazda won't have a bar of it? It's this that makes me think that there is someone within the company that has their "knickers in a twist" and is all offended by what's gone on because it makes them personally look like they haven't done a good enough job? If Mazda were smart they would simply fire that developer (and not give it a second thought) and then propositioned the developer of this open app to work (paid) to either fix their own application or at the very least offered it as an alternative under the Mazda brand and offered to have graphic design elements of all the "in-house" developers would have access to? It's a real shame to hear things have gone this way with Mazda and I really hope that someone realises this isn't right and course corrects the situation, cause it goes against the entire ethos of the brand doing what they are doing? I know within production and manufacturing business that there can often be a disconnect between the engineers and guys making sh!t happen and the big wigs in the corporate part of the business..... to the end where they are essentially 2 separate business entirely? I'm not saying that is the case here with Mazda, but it just seems like a growing trend seen across all kinds of industries? My questioning of this comes from the fact that Mazda have been the complete opposite behaviour to this in the past.......so there must be a reason for this 'out -of-character' behaviour we are seeing playing out now? I could be wrong, but I hope I'm not? Peace and Brap brap
@@GeomancerHTas a software engineer I can say, that it's not really possible to block the access except for disabling the API in the car completely. Changing client-id/client-secret will not necessarily help, because you could possibly sniff those out of a stream anyway. Disabling it would fix it, but neither Mazda nor any other manufacturer will stop doing so, because data is lucrative.
@@igordasunddas3377 They could rewrite the API to use different parameters. I can't understand why anyone would allow their car online in the first place. MAYBE a VPN tunnel to your network, but nothing for outsiders to access.
@@igordasunddas3377well they can just encrypt the actuall stream that leaves the car, so mitm attack would be just impossible. You CAN then reverse engineer it out of their firmware, but this is way more work than just sniffing traffic.
It's always made me happy that you pull this kind of bullshit in to the light. The whole DMCA system needs to be gutted and reworked, it's far too easy for giant companies to abuse, and as it stands it feels like that's what its primary purpose has become. And, I hate that.
@@MaxSixty-Three It feels like so many measures put in place to protect smaller creators are just abused by the entities they were supposed to protect creators from. A lot of these laws and avenues just need to flat out be redone, especially for the modern era with the web being so prevalent in day to day life.
@@MaxSixty-Three But that is *exactly* what the DMCA was about, right from the start. I'm old enough to vividly remember when the legislation was first passed. The DMCA was passed because every time a "giant" like Sony came up with a "foolproof" copy protection or "digital rights management" scheme, some hacker in his mom's basement came up with an easy way to defeat it. So the MAFIAA lobbied hard, meaning they bribed hard, and the DMCA was passed. On the surface, it sounds analogous to laws that prevent you from picking locks to property that doesn't belong to you. Sounds great and moral, right? Except this was intended to prevent you from doing anything to stuff you paid for and thought you owned, in principle. The way they justified that was to state you never really owned any digital media to begin with, all you purchased with your hard-earned buck was a licence that would grant you some very limited rights to consuming that media. A licence whose terms they could change unilaterally, but you couldn't touch. And a licence that often empowered "them" to spy on you or even corrupt and subvert your private stuff with spyware and rootkits. It was quite hellish, right from the get-go. The mistake a lot of people make is thinking governments ever worked for them, nope, they never have, and probably never will.
Definitely. The problem is businesses that receive fines just add them as a cost of doing business. Fines issued to corporations need to be based on a percentage of their profits received over a period of time(or their total within the past year), but that's unlikely to happen anytime soon. To a normal working person, these types of fines could very easily bankrupt them.
@liblevi45s53 I don't think they should be punished based on their income, but based on the scale of the unethical things they do. However, that requires actually figuring out how often they do things like that. It can be frequent, or cover a large number of people, but that requires the government to do its job, or at least reduce the barrier for the victims to sue them and win, so that a meaningful percentage actually do. I also think individual employees should personally be held responsible for more blatant things, like actual crimes. Arresting some employees and middle managers for things like fraud or perjury, because even if their employer told them to do it, they still committed crimes, and not just complex regulatory things, but often very blatant things, like when Wells Fargo employees opened up fake bank accounts.
Or even better, forfeiture of the copyright/patent/trademark the claim was based on. Make a false takedown claim for a movie you had the copyright to? It's now public domain. It's part of a franchise you have a trademark on? Double-whammy! Your trademark on that franchise is now void. You might still own the copyrights to the other entries, but your trademark on that franchise is gone. That'd really scare companies into doing their research.
You *have* to be shocked. These major companies are doing this to numb our senses and make us less likely to call them out when they do stuff like this. That's their goal: do something bad so much that it becomes the norm.
@@Operational117 Yeah, the problem is there isnt much to do about it. Even if you were to vote with your money, like you should often do, the economic space is so monopolistic that there really arent any alternatives
mazda is one of the least profitable of all the major car companies and had many features that most car companies had already done away with for cost cutting or better number figures, very sad to see mazda do this.
@@jimmmyjohns2853 Its crazy as they could actually win more customers by being the one company that actually has a more open approach to this sort of thing.
This channel has been very important for me and others. I knew about some of the dirty tricks companies were doing, but this channel has shown the problem is worse than I expected. For instance, learning that serialization was taking place, and learning how wide spread it is was an eye opener. There is no justification for that and I'm surprised it's legal. This channel has helped me avoid doing business with some of the worst of the companies. I hope this information continues to be presented to the public.
Thats what it is huh, it put me in conflict cause they bully,censure and i keep on watching. You tube and all the alphabet companies were heavy players through the pandemic and they should be recognized as some of the biggest corporate tyrants of the day. Way too powerful, their algorithms are whats dividing us as a country. The internet was such an awesome thing before they ruined it. Now algorithms bury the facts under pages of sponsored content. And they hide the truth and try to trick you into buying bullshit. You tube should be demonetized
Their monopoly is on the content providers. All the content providers should expand to alternatives and leave you tube on the same date. I hate bullys, why does you tube feel like they need to bully, they already own the market? Its not about money, its lust for power, we should turn the u tube off until they can play nicely with the citizens instead of manipulate everything.
i am not selfless, i am a person who reads the news then rants into a camera about what bothers him about the world. from time to time, i try to take action to change it. lobbying, making educational videos, starting a repair shop if i believe in repair & showing other people how to do it themselves w/out a paywall..... but it all starts with yelling at a cloud. i'm not special for clicking record when i yell at a cloud.
@@rossmanngroup To be honest i think you have far better problem solving skills and common sense than 99% of people. Also the majority of people probably don't take action, but still
i get this is not what you are meaning but just taking what you comment at face value " If youre doing something not for profit, it should be impossible to violate." then uploading a copyrighted work such as a movie for free would be consider perfectly legal something regularly considered piracy but yes DMCA and copyright needs a massive reworking that is for sure and not a reworking that only favors the "big players" like the current system does
@@durandle9226 Your argument is that piracy is somehow bad? What does legally buying game get you? Unplayable games, worse performance, mantadory online connection for singleplayer titles, incomplete games that often community has to fix by itself. What does paying for streaming services, or even DVD/Blu-Ray get you? Worse quallity, region-lock, ads in some cases if you go with lowest subscription plan. Not to mention that you have to pay for like 5 different streaming services, because S1 and S3 are on one, and S2 is on some other service. Piracy does better job of preserving everything, than any of these companies ever will, besides being more convenient.
The big change that needs to be made is on the "bad faith" claims. 1) It needs to be made clear that one must be correct in their fair use analysis, not merely prove that they considered it, and 2) one should be able to claim liquidated damages of, say, $25,000, for economic damages. Otherwise, it invites companies to be sloppy when DMCAing open source projects because there aren't any damages they'll have to pay out, just legal fees, which are probably going to add up to only a few thousand bucks by the time the company realizes it targeted someone willing file a bad faith DMCA suit.
The DMCA should never have been permitted to exist. It basically allows anyone to be prosecutor, judge and executor at the same time without due process.
@michaelscarportI wouldn’t say that. From 2017 and up they’re running with Toyota. Only quality control issue is the paint, but that’s about it.
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For those non technical viewers, you can understand API as a set of buttons on a device. It may be undocumented, hidden under the backpanel and unlabeled but it's there. You can push them, you can observe what they do and you can learn how to use it to do something. If they installed the button, you can use it and you can legally share instruction on the usage. That's exactly what plugins or apps use. They are made to push those hidden buttons to control stuff. Typically API (application programming interface) is documented and shared so that programmers can easily write programs that use it and integrate with it but it happens that this interface is there but was not documented properly. It's not even reverse engineering though. I don't know if that's some library with exported symbols or some network interface accepting certain undocumented messages but it doesn't matter. It is there, you can use it. We need some lawyers that would have some technical knowledge and take those cases to countersue them and rip as much money as they can from the copyright bully. That's the way to fight them. You want to sue some opensource developer for some bullshit knowing he can't afford fighting? Good, you will talk with lawyer who lives out of it, does this for living and he will make sure you will pay him and his customer for your wrongdoings. That's how it should really work.
@@RCLapCar Your statement is correct. However it isn't copyright that governs this permission. That is potentially CFAA or something as mundane as violating terms of service. The issue being discussed is a DMCA takedown (copyright).
When it comes to publicly exposed API's, FCC part 15 rules should apply. 1. Sender may not cause HARMFUL interference. 2. Receiver must accept any interference received, including interference that may cause undesired operation (aka 3rd party apps) The onus is on the receiver to protect their API's from undesired interference. DMCA takedowns is the lazy caveman approach.
They are claiming (incorrectly) that this is a copyright issue, so even if those FCC rules were in place this claim would supersede that regulation. The “issue” here isn’t about the usage of the API, it’s an erroneous claim that the only way they _could_ use the API is to have accessed copyrighted material and used it to create a derivative product. I agree with your argument about how usage of APIs might be regulated, but we first need to establish that it’s fully legal to reverse engineer an API
@@DarkViperus I’m not entirely following that argument. Is the idea here that Mazda can’t secure their own API? Mazda could certainly require people to have some sort of subscription while allowing them to access their backend via a 3rd party client, those 3rd party clients would just have to give users a way to provide their Mazda credentials for authenticating with the Mazda servers.
I'm glad you are learning C. Computer programming is one of my most favorite things to do. When you develop the mental pathways to write source code, and learn a few programming languages that have different structures, you get to the point where when you sit down to do programming you enter a singular mental focus when you're working on code. It's like a meditation, like being 'in the zone', a flow state (psychology). You might also enjoy picking up a used college book on "systems analysis" since you will need to understand how different pieces of code need to work together at multiple levels in defined ways. A basis in systems analysis helps you perceive the forest when the small sections of the code are working on are like the leaves of a tree. Finding an engineer that is good at managing their own time and resources, as well as understanding a how a system needs to work at the macro scale and the micro scale is rare find. You have a good start because you fairly acknowledge the things you don't (yet) know instead of bluffing your way through it. Good luck on your journey young-ish padawan.
I am shocked how many programmers have no idea how the software works under the hood. No wonder there are so many bugs. I was trying to help some students taking assembly, and was shocked they don't even do that now. They use emulators which do not let you flip register bits on IO busses. The entire reason you use assembly is access to the hardware. I will never trust self driving cars because the programmer ALSO needs to know how to drive a car. And I see very little evidence of that with all the car wrecks on the road every day. Astronauts are going to find out the hard way when something goes wrong, and no one knows what the computer is doing because it is all closed systems.
@@robertsmith2956 Don Petit an Engineer and Nasa Astro-not has stated, if you have a leak in the ISS, well you have a leak! He says he's sure there must be some way in the manuals to fix the situation but he had no clue what that was! In other words, he's a Fraud. Space as Nasa describes it is a fairy tale. Don doesn't understand pressure differentials nor can the ISS exist in a 2nd law of thermodynamics violation. You cannot ever have gas (atmosphere, an oxymoron because gas cannot form a sphere in a vacuum) can never fail to fully equalize with the available volume in the open system Nasa claims Earth is in. So you don't trust self driving cars for good reason.. you may want to give serious thought as to why you believe Nasa and their lies.
6:26 The whole copyrighting an API thing is a little fuzzy in some regards, but the general rule of thumb to be safe is as follows: If you are distributing a codebase that happens to include the API itself, then arguably you are potentially distributing someone else's code that they wrote and therefore own the copyright for. If you are distributing a codebase that remotely calls an external API, where the API in question is hosted externally by whomever owns it and the associated copyright to begin with; then that is fair game, as you aren't distributing the API itself (so long as it's used in line with whatever terms of service are associated with the API in question, if any exist). The bigger issue doing things this way for a developer is that if the external host changes the API, chances are your implementation may break.
makes sense, and the last part is to be expected as you arent the owner of the API (even if its your car...), its quite sad because reverse engineering api calls to be able to know what to receive and send its a painful process, specially in cars as ... that is still the wild west from what I know about its standards and communication protocols
Exactly, you aren't distributing their API code, just connecting to it! However I'm sure I read somewhere that code CANNOT be copyrighted unless as a whole 'project', everything as one! An API is an API! They're all pretty much the same code, work pretty much the same way and only a small part of the actual codebase/project. This DMCA is bull and they're abusing the process!
@@arashitempesta Somewhat, but as a programmer I can tell you it's pointless NOT to use a pre-existing protocol. That being so, Mazda (and all other auto companies) are worse than fools if they aren't simply using what's already in the vehicle's CAN bus and encoding that over a wifi or wireless connection (can be some ticklisness in the form of encoding, but anything too complicated merely adds fragility to the system). So my bet would be you get 90% of what you need taking your portable scope down to the garage and poking around with a cheap diagnostic hookup.
@terrencezellers9105 Yeah, I haven't worked on automotive projects, but even then, I've seen so much bs and bad practices, even in really big companies that I wouldn't be surprised if they have some weird bastardization because "we are the only ones making use of it"
Hold up! API isn't a code base, is it? I don't have an access to implementations. I cannot see the inner workings. What API allows me is to access a functionality, without knowing the inner workings. Similarly to how executable works. If I write a script in Autohotkey or AutoIt that directly operates on application, there's really not much of a difference from creating my own code that works with API, that I had to learn and reverse engineered.
I don't think a week goes by where I don't mention Right To Repair to someone new, and I can honestly say that your channel was the driving force to make me much more aware of the BS. I mean I've noticed the BS for a lot of years, but your channel genuinely made me aware of why it bothered me and to learn what "signs" to look for. Thank you Louis... thank you!
What sucks about these incidents is that companies don't see this as what people want or a sign that their product is in adequate and see this as an sign to improve
Actually, most companies (certainly all large ones that have been around for at least several years) are fully aware of what customers actually want! But they have learned that the customer's wishes become functionally irrelevant when they purchase the product despite its failures! They have collected copious quantities of data, and they have carefully & thoroughly analyzed it in search of how they can maximize their profit margin. And NOTHING else matters to them as long as their net profits outweigh the sum of all of the "costs" of doing business. My reason for my next assertion is not to be disparaging, rude, belittling, embarrassing or anything like that, it is to hopefully serve as an "alarm bell" to WAKE UP, and then to inspire others to begin to prioritize their education! Anyway, basically... Your comment exposes a very idealistic perspective which is sadly inconvenient with the actual current state of reality. Positivity & idealism become useless and actually backfire and have a very counter productive effect, undermining & sabotaging one's goals when they are based on & reliant upon a basic paradigm that is naive & ignorant. Many people might say or think how nice or great it is that you have this hopeful idealism; but that's delusional. In reality it sucks and it's terribly tragic and depressing because it demonstrates that the programming (propaganda/brain washing) was successful on you. Any threat you might have potentially posed had been neutralized, and you've been successfully reduced to a pathetic non-threat!
I made 3 videos talking about the awesome gray app but today TH-cam removed/banned all three videos due to "violation" of terms/policies. I've been on TH-cam for 10 years now and have never had this happen until Louis, FUTO, and team actually made something better. I hope Louis is able to get his gray video back up and then I can appeal mine as well as it's an app that more people need to know about. Thx Louis for everything and best wishes on journey ahead.
This is really sad. Mazda is a very small company compared to the competition and was one of the few good ones left. Then again, they share a bunch of factories and platforms with Toyota so it was only a matter of time before they started following in their footsteps.
Sounds to me like Mazda is trying to use the DMCA to enforce something that would fall under patent law, which is actually a violation of the DMCA. There is a clause in the DMCA outlining the penalties for sending a notice when something is not based in copyright law. I'd counterclaim it, after speaking with a lawyer. A letter on a lawyer's letterhead explaining why they are stupid would likely have them back down.
While they are claiming copyright, they actually are complaining about the functionality. You are right, the closest they could do would be patent or possibly trademark. Not copyright! Dumbasses.
I've been intermittently watching Louis since he was doing his mac repair vids - I watched through all of his New York real estate series and I can say without a doubt if there's any TH-camr I've learned from the most, it's Louis Rossman. Thank you for all you do man - keep it up, TH-cam or not.
I only found this channel a few weeks ago, but I have and am learning much from it. I genuinely appreciate the humility and tenacity of your efforts, man. Stay up!
I think I hit the subscribe button on Louis' channel about ~4-5 years ago, and over the years, that button has become one of the most important and impactful buttons I've ever clicked on the internet. Truly. I think if even 10% of people were as well informed and proactive as Louis is, our world would be about 86% less shitty.
Welcome to the honest facts. Sucks he needs to censor himself about his software to deplatform the idea of subscriptions that youtube has cracked down on.
Sad part is this will keep happening as those in management and legal team have almost no idea of how IT works and only thinks about money. The only way for us to stop these are to not buy products like these, maybe try a new brand.
That I've noticed, things like this tend to become a race to the bottom, where even if a company is reasonable today, that will eventually change (the argument from Cory Doctorow). I don't think the standard "vote with your wallet" approach works anymore because of how interconnected everything is. You literally need the man on the street overseeing legislation BEFORE it gets enacted.
Probably not, the developer quite likely might be a piss poor university student with time to spare. Corporate bastards like the ones working at Mazda probably know this well.
Thank you for all the great edutainment content over the years and for your very well spoken efforts regarding right to repair. Many of us will maintain our viewership of your content wherever you may publish. God bless.
I'm surprised Mazda would do something like this. I have purchased several vehicles from Mazda and every time I needed any parts it was super easy to obtain them from Mazda. Very disappointing. I literally rebuilt the front end of a car and it took like 20min to find all the parts I needed. I've also found Mazdas to be very easy to work on as well. Although one thing I have found annoying is that they sell the service manuals for cars on a time based subscription basis, like $24/hr or $50/day something like that.
Yeah, you can lilely find the PDF files for free. If not just pay for it for an hour, and screenshot everything they got. Sounds scummy of them though, people shouldn't have to use sketchy means to get around originally sketchy buisness models. If they make it too unfairly expensive, i think morals are already thrown out the window, so being what could be perceived as an immoral action normally, isn't is used against an immoral model.
Mazda is no longer the unique independent brand they used to be, a big chunk of it is now owned by Toyota Motors, a global W - E - F partner. I own new Toyota & Lexus vehicles and can confirm they are becoming what they sought to destroy. Subscription models and dealer-dependent repairs are becoming more and more common even with the Japanese models.
Louis, I'll never be able to thank you enough for bringing so many things to my attention. You gave me the opportunity to also be part of a solution. I'll follow you to whatever platform you wind up on man. Peace be with
I truly hope this channel, and Rossman repair group, stays afloat for a very long time! I don't know of ANY one thing that has woken so many people up to the freedom issues the world is battling at the time, and we really need to wake EVERYONE up. Also, Louis does his best to stay honest and truthful, come hell or high water, and I appreciate that effort more than anything! Thanks a bundle, Louis! 🙌 The world owes you a great debt. But please don't stop! 🙏
On behalf of all the voiceless, uninformed and hopeless - thank you Louis for educating countless followers and shining light on everything wrong with our modern world, even if that is your last video ever - you've done your part. Thank you
Mazda has also actively denied warranty claims for relatively new vehicles with less than 20,000 miles after looking at engine data taken from the MyMazda app and declaring that the vehicle was misused even though that was not the case most of the time.
Are you able to elaborate more on this or link some of the stuff you’re talking about? I’m a full time Mazda employee and I haven’t heard of this being the case through the app.
False claims are a crime. Known as perjury. Counter sue for mental anguish and loss of opportunity. Tell them you were so emotionally bothered by this huge company trying to sue you for something 100% legal That you couldn't pursue happiness and as a result lost opportunities to make millions. I guarantee they withdraw the suit.
@ It's not not a suit, it's a DMCA claim submitted to github, and it's enabled by the DMCA laws and statutes. It only becomes a suit if Github or the programmer responds. Yes, the DMCA is a joke.
“False claims are a crime” So is giving legal advice when you’ve not qualified as a lawyer - the bar organisation has a much better hit rate at prosecuting people who do that than suing someone who didn’t perjur for mental anguish. Your “advice” is sov cit nonsense and no one should listen to it.
Life coach, that's what you are Louis! As a HA user, I can vouch for the software and the community. Having the freedom to do whatever you want with your house - lights, HVAC, curtains, solar panel monitoring etc.. you understand the value it brings to you, so you naturally donate to the HA devs. Not the other way around- pay a massive fee for something that takes away your freedom and limits you to their own micro environments..
This kinda reminds me of my truck's uConnect garbage. The radio system is crap, I have actually gotten an ad (one of those "Hey, we noticed you're not paying our monthly sub! Why not sign up for $XX per month!) *WHILE I'M DRIVING* btw... That was the last straw for me. It is an extremely rare ad though, but I have gotten it twice since having this vehicle. (for reference, it's a 2014 RAM 1500 R/T) I'm soon going to CDL school and one of the first things I do on that truck is rip out the radio unit and put a new one in that has Android Auto available to it. No more of that uConnect garbage or anything. There's other things I need to do, but those will come in time. Car ownership is really starting to go the wayside it seems. They're getting harder to repair basic things. For example, my truck has a problem with the fuel level sensor when my tank starts getting kinda low. It used to turn on the check engine light around 1/8 of a tank, but now it's on at just shy of 1/2 tank. But in order to replace the fuel level sensor, because it's so tightly integrated with other fuel system components, that's north of $1,500 right there. Tail lights? I had to replace one at one point, and at the time since a coupe of the LED's were out, the other side were soon to follow, so I just replaced both taillights entirely. OEM tail lights will run you $600+ each. The aftermarket I got that look better anyway? $300 for the pair. The bad thing is that I live in an area that doesn't have public transit, so owning a car is pretty much a requirement to get to anywhere. I'm not going to spend $100/wk for Uber/Lyft to get somewhere if I have a job or something.
DO NOT BUY MAZDA - I have a relative that paid for the navigation software on the car screen display on a brand new lease. They were never given it, and were told they need an SD card from them to upgrade the firmware. They have been waiting for 5 months to be given said SD card, going back and forth.
That sounds like a dealer/seller problem, not with Mazda themselves. Not saying Mazda is *not* in the wrong, but most of the time, dealers are the cause of these headaches. Have you contacted Mazda directly?
Thank You for bringing it up. The topic is very disturbing, it brings emotions for sure and willingness to change things. Okay, I am a software engineer and actually create open source software as well - and am proud of that. I repair things when I can by using my own hands. I use Home Assistant because I find it useful and don't want to use cloud services that are located elsewhere and I want to own my information (however, from my personal POV HA is unreliable - it often has quite annoying issues). So, what I do right now is: as I have a bad feeling of the world going to hell I am continuing doing open source software in order to give people alternative to hell. I know there are things like these which I cannot affect directly which annoy and make world a worse place - okay, I can vote for different politicians which actually promote the better things; I can write comments like this or similar; I can take part in demonstrations on the topic in democratic societies. Is that enought? I have a feeling that it is not exactly enough but I have no idea where else to direct efforts to make things better tbh. I assume I am not the only one with this feeling. P.S. just in case, this is not written to hear "oh you do a lot, thanks!" - this is to get an answer to the last question.
Many of us are out here channeling the Streisand Effect. ;). Grey skies will be host to many flying jays, if you know what I mean. ;). Word of mouth is still a thing, slower than digital but this snow ball is rolling. Thank you for all you do.
Even if something happens on this platform, at least a whole lot of your audience have a way to continue to connect to you and your content. Please know that we really do appreciate it. Many of your fans are more than happy to pay for things they value. Keep up the great work!!
My repair shop was made in part because of you man, I'm an engineer with a masters in computer science and data science, I'm usually "the guy" when it comes to repairing stuff everyone thinks its impossible to repair here down in Mexico, let's say that they come to me and some get to "see the light", and oh man you have no idea how many times I fucking heard "Those asses wanted me to buy a brand new one!", you have helped my work too much so I do everything I can to make contributions to yours, even if small, we got your back man whatever happens, we won't let the corpo scums win as long as we breath!
The Software Freedom Law Center could be interested in this case. Still, the way the IBM BIOS was reverse engineered used two sets of engineers, one which looked at the IBM source code and discovered the API, and wrote a specification. The second set had no access to the IBM source, so they couldn't copy it, and implemented the specification. Doing both jobs by the same person has the potential to copy code from the the original material, or at least to be accused of it.
But here there is no second team needed: they are note creating a mazda clone, they just use the API to acces informations from the car. So for your comparison they just create a new operating system and use the API to call the orginal BIOS on an original IBM PC without accessing the source cobe of the BIOS. They are not using a single line of code of the BIOS. (Home assistant plugin vs mazda app linux vs PC/DOS)
@@frederichardy8844 It all depends on whether they copied code out of the Android or Apple app when they reverse engineered that app. Yes, it's just a web API call, but there's authentication and encoding in those apps. I doubt the API call is publicly documented anywhere. If they decompiled the code which generates the HTML request and parses the response and used that in their HA code, then a DCMA takedown is appropriate. Using a clean room which only extracts the actual API HTML and implements the code to generate that API call shows that no code was copied, and any similar is a result of limited ways to implement the same functionality. I highly doubt that a DMCA takedown request would be filed if the entirely different code was used to implement the call. But, given use of the same library functions to implement the API call, the code will look very similar. Using a clean room would prevent similar code from being accused of being a copy. Back in the early days of C, there was an alternate C compiler written by Whitesmiths. They were afraid of being accused of copying the code, so they implemented their own library with different names and parameters. This didn't encourage people to use their compiler unless they had no choice. This predated the IBM BIOS cloning, but showed the lengths people would go to to prevent copyright claims. More court cases have eliminated some of the precautions, but not all.
Great point. APIs usage is completely legitimate fair use. vehicle can bus and debug apis should be required to be documented and open; the wireless loophole is insane
In Cyberpunk edgerunners the main character had to pay a subscription to use his own laundry machine in his own home. I fear this will no longer be fictional in the future.
Personally what I think we need is penalties for false DCMA filings. As long as massive corporations can bury people using spammed DCMA's to scare them out of the market, the system will never be fixed. DCMA's need to be made with some sort of legal oath of affirmation attached that makes the filer and their legal counsel liable and prosecutable if DCMA claims are made falsely.
Making a false DMCA should end up in monetary compensation for the victim. Make it worthwhile to challenge these claims financially, so that we can make certain that false claims do get countered every single time.
The whole concept of copyrighting an API is BS We appreciate you Louis, I hope you're OK regarding the end of the video, sounded quite ominous. You do you my friend :)
They can simply host the code on another platform or on their own website. That way they would have to make a real court case against them, which would require actual evidence that the code was stolen. The only way they can lose the case is if someone actually leaked the code for the official app.
In the realm of code and digital skies, Where open source ideals begin to rise, A programmer, diligent and bright, Found their work facing a wrongful fight. Mazda, with a heavy-handed sleight, Sent a DMCA, causing a plight, Intimidation veiled in legal dress, Their actions causing needless stress. A false takedown, a chilling breeze, Striking at the heart of coding ease, Seeking to quiet the innovative hum, Yet failing to silence the creative drum. The open source spirit, a flame so strong, Defies the shadows of rights gone wrong, Creators unite, their voices loud, In defense of freedom, standing proud. For in this space where ideas unfurl, No falsehood can restrain the swirl, Of innovation, a force untamed, No intimidation can have it chained. Mazda's misstep, a cautionary tale, In the landscape where freedoms prevail, Let solidarity and truth resound, In the symphony of code, unbound.
Been watching for 10 of those 11 years. TH-cam is definitely not the same and i hear it from a few other channels too that TH-cam is on the verge of canceling there channels due to what they say. I say we should start a new video site where free speech is allowed, not censored for the sake of ad revenue. Its been a fun 10 years, i remember 10 years ago i was watching on my HTC sensation 4G and TH-cam was still free to watch and ad free. I also remember avoiding samsung phones cause the TH-cam app version they had allowed ads but my HTC or LG or iPhone version at the time didn't have any ads
Here's hoping you make a windows version of grayjay! I'm already loving how well the search gives me the channels I want by association of content, even though I did not search for them directly! thank you!
If you're leaving TH-cam, let us know where and we will follow. I too am getting sick of the alerts that ad blockers are not allowed. (I don't have an ad blocker) The bloody cheek!!
You've been an inspiration to me Louis, not just to fix things but to not give up, and when it's time to give up to move on having learned from my failure instead of lamenting myself endlessly or denying it. I think your usual ranting style of "ire through a smile" has rubbed off on me as well 😂
Im a software developer, I do freelance development, and often I’m said why I do not offer full cloud implementations, and I always tell them, you better keep ownership of your systems, use cloud for support and connectivity, not as a foundation of your system.
I had no idea there was a good software for cloud technology in the home. I heard about home assistant but didn't look into it because I just heard cloud, and assumed privacy invasive, and the way you described it to where you can host it yourself sounds really nice. 0:42
Thanks for the Gray Jay app. It's still a bit janky but I installed it and waiting for the future update. The Streisand effect is real. Thanks a lot Louis, you brought so much to so many people. I hope you keep going.
Thank you for all that you’ve done educating and sharing your viewpoint with all of us! You inspired me to start my own channel, instead of computers I fix mostly Yamaha’s. It’s sad to hear that the larger structure of the platform may prevent you from continuing to publish here. Thank you Louise!
A sentence in the the DMCA reads "MNAO analyzed some of the code and determined that the code provides functionality same as what is currently in Apple App Store and Google Play App Store.". Provide the same functionality is not the same as using copyrighted code. You could copyright an extremely lengthy and complicated algorithm that sums 2 numbers, but if I can provide a different algorithm that sums 2 numbers as well, maybe "number1 + number2" , does not mean im infringing in your copyright.
OMG, I just discovered your channel and I have to say I ❤ your ethos! I've been sharing them with friends - thank you for keeping us informed and encouraging us to push back against unethical business practices, poor customer service and questionable governmental "standards".
I don't think I've commented on a video before but thanks for putting yourself out there for us for so long Lious. Crazy to think how long its been and how much everything has changed. Started watching you when you where still in that small store fixing computers; i used to describe your channel to friends as a dentist but for computers.
Im a mechanic and i also design electronics and software as a mechanic one thing that always bothered me is that in order to do my job efficiently i need a 8k bi-directional scanner so i made my own and i reverse engineered the custom commands to do all sorts of things that i need like calibrations and abs automated bleed procedure also another thing that pissed me off was the fact that you cant re vin the pcm in most cars so i opened one up and found the eeprom dumped it and found how to reprogram a used 50 dollar pcm to work with a different car i went from charging my customers thousands for a new one and subcontracting the programing to a dealership its insanity especially now with these companies not even making older modules so if it fails your basically screwed and your car is a huge paperweight only part of a car that should be locked down is the security system obviously you don't want to make them easy to steal so f$+@ these car companies and im more than willing to share what ive found to anyone
That is probably the longest unpunctuated sentence ever published on TH-cam! How can anybody possibly be expected to read and understand whatever you are trying to say? 😢
@@Bokto1no, it's not. You are rewriting the VIN in the module so the other modules agree it belongs. Many can be done after paying for the OEM programming tools. The commenter just figured out where the VIN is stored in the code and rewrites it without the $$, pay per use OEM tools. What you can't do is change the VIN assigned to the vehicle (even then there are exceptions).
@@Bokto1 nope its perfectly legal only time it wouldn't is if you change the mileage but i more or less just dump the eeprom and program it into the new pcm so its more like cloning and will have the correct mileage
I literally installed HA last weekend to connect my garage door so I can see the garage door is open or closed. A plugin is available but I thought to myself, "what if the manufacturer wanted this plugin stopped". I now have my answer!
Thank you Louis for all you do with right to repair. I remember up until the mid 90s everything you purchased, came with schematics and part numbers inside the panels. Or you could send for them for most of the times free. Old CRT tvs. My grandpa would repair them all the time and if he didn't have the schematics to test and figure out what's bad, the manufacturer would send em. He also owns a arcade machine Co and had machines all over Phoenix and had filing cabinets full of schematics to all arcade and pinball machines. Can you get those today, hell no. You have an arcade machine and it's broken, most now report home with a computer and certificate USB stick and you can not repair it. Such a sad world we live in
You are doing a great service, Louis. To me, the operative words here are these apps to perform the following on "their vehicles". When I purchase the vehicle (phone, laptop, desktop, meal), it is MY vehicle. I am a retired software engineer, and the phrase "API", Application Programming Interface", is an exchange of information designed (in this case, in theory, Mazda) to protect the core functionality, the vehicle, and consumer. Mazda defines what can and cannot be exchanged - the Mazda vehicle "code" is protected. Now, if they expose more than they should, it is on them.
worth noting that "clean-room reverse engineering" i.e. finding by your own experiments and not by using illegally obtained code, has been defended in court several times by projects such as WINE and ReactOS when microsoft tried to shut them down
Wasn't intels number one competitor reverse engineering PC CPU chips for years?)(or was it intel doing it to IBM? lol it was awhile ago) Story goes company A sent a copy of their chip schematics to copy B trying to get them to open them there by not be able to prove they didn't copy them(or some such)
@@stusue9733 Iirc do you might mean AMD which did clone the X86 cpu but Intel ultimatly had to give them a proper licence as the US armed forces demanded at least 2 different supplier for there chips. So if Intel wanted that market did they need AMD to exist.
It wasn't very clear in this video but I truly do hope that you will continue posting content on other platforms. The content you post is incredibly informative and a beacon of hope given the current landscape for tech. I'm already subscribed to you on "the forbidden app" so I hope to see some new stuff on there wherever you may choose to go.
I am honestly amazed that people install nonsensical apps like this that are so completely and utterly useless. How about you just check before leaving your car whether your windows are closed or not? How about you just check your range indicator before leaving the car? How about you just not preheat your car? Takes like 2 minutes before your car reaches a comfortable temperate even if you live in a very cold climate. I used to be a software engineer myself and I can tell you I have 0 apps on my phone that interact with other devices. It's all so completely useless.
Car companies should be totally fine with giving people access to the internals, so long as they provide the necessary safety warnings, and do their due diligence to ensure that the method of accessing the internals is reasonably safeguarded so that if certain things are harmful to do while in certain operation modes, they disable them while in that mode (such as if a user instructs the car to go into reverse while the car is going really fast forward, etc)
Mazda, like most Japanese automakers, USED to be about modifications and a whole industry and scene was built on it. I used to be a part of the scene in the mid 2000s but saw that more cars and motorcycles were becoming very restrictive in what can be done esp with the engine. This is mainly with the American side of things as the Japanese still allow for some tinkering with their performance vehicles. Sadly the green movement is killing this slowly.
so if i get a diy cabinet that comes with a bad screw driver that rounds the screws and i find another screwdriver thats better and i start telling people dont bother with the one that you get given and use this one, the company wants to legally stop me from telling people theres a better screwdriver?
Wrong comparison. They want to block others from measuring the screwdriver and use this intellectual property to start making and selling (or giving) out competing screwdrivers. I assume that Mazda may plan to charge for use of their app (I didn't see any indication they currently charge - only that people finds the Android app *extremely* buggy) Reverse-engineering of the API allows customers to get remote control without using Mazda's own program. So if they want to charge, no one will pay.
Sorry for the situation you have gone through. I'm looking forward to using it soon. I just wish it was a little more user friendly. You're a standup guy and I'm proud to feel the same way. Thanks for your help.
Thanks for bringing awareness to this. I want to use Home Assistant in my next house, and I am a current Mazda3 owner. I sent an email to their customer service voicing my disappointment (for all the good it will do), but I'll be keeping an eye on the situation going forward.
These idiot management don't have enough brain that if this works correctly people will buy their car over other brand just because the HA aspect, without spending any money and be liable to the tradeoffs.
I hate to be the one saying it but it's not illegal to file a false DMCA claim due to the language of the law. The penalty hinges on text that basically says "I certify under penalty that I genuinely think this violates my copyright." There is no *practical* way to punish false claimants criminally. Filing a false claim is free and knocks out the content for a month regardless of the merits, and civil litigation is both expensive and will never make it to the first hearing before that time is up.
It seemed a lot worse than that last time I examined it. The certification is "I represent someone who holds a copyright", not that the claim in question even relates to that copyright, let alone a violation.
Don't know, but it's certainly EFF territory. Though I don't know if they care about their purpose anymore, considering their enthusiastic witch hunt on RMS ran entirely counter to that.
Thank you, Louis. I always appreciate your views. I was thinking of you the other day when the contract for my wedding photographer said I won't own the very pictures I'm paying them for. Every nook in life is someone trying to make it so you own less and less of what you pay for.
Hi, mabye not a good place, but today I thought of a saying to make people realise why we should have "right to own" How would you feel if you couldn't drink pepsi in a cocacola glass, just because cocacola restricts you from drinking any other drinks, aside from their own brands, and could sue you for that.
Mazda has stayed off my shit list for a long time. They have a lot of philosophies that I'm a big fan of. The Miata has been my favorite cheap car for longer than I've had a license, and I've been part of that community on and off for just as long. I even almost worked for them. I sincerely hope they openly condemn their legal team, but with how most companies run these days, unfortunately this will probably just get forgotten about.
After some brief analysis, I think the biggest problem is that the devs used the name Mazda in the repo title, as PyMazda is only 1 character away from MyMazda, and in this case Mazda is simply trying to protect their trademark\brand name\etc, it would have been nice if they had sent a cease and desist first, advising of the trademark infringement, and gave the devs time to rename the project rather than DMCAing the repo. The best path forward is to restart the project with a more generalise name, call the library pyVehicle or something similar, and add support for other vehicles, if it just so happens to work with a Mazda and they get upset about that then at that point Mazda can get fucked. - for an analogy, think of it like writing an emulator; this thing can run PlayStation 1 games, but you still need the proprietary BIOS from an original PlayStation 1 before it will work, a similar method could be implemented to bypass Mazda's bullshit if they try this shit again. Note: I am not a lawyer, (but I am a software guy who has had to skirt around patent trolling bullshit in the past, but don’t take my word for it, it’s a slippery slope).
You are exactly on point with the manufacture/consumer climate today referencing the car analogy. You better believe every one of us would be paying for starts on our cars, or radio use, or not being allowed to change the rims, etc, etc, etc. As the saying goes... " you will own nothing, and be happy". You are also on point about the DMCA claims, as I have some experience with those. Web Hosts and ISP's won't get in the middle of such claims, even if they are obviously fraudulent. They will simply cancel your account, web site, or whatever rather than get in the middle of such a dispute. Yes, one can fight the fraudulent claim, and there is even a fine mechanism for filing false claims... but that all takes money, and those filing the fraudulent claims know this very well. Please move to another platform because the world NEEDS to here your content ! "If you build it, they will come" (famous quote from the movie Field of Dreams). Yes, you have some videos on Rumble, but nothing that I can see as current. For instance, THIS video should be up on Rumble (or any other platform that favors free speech). Back up your videos on ScrewTube and port them over to Rumble. You might be surprised that your viewers will follow you over there. I hear all the time how content creators don't move to Rumble because the viewership is just not there. Well, they are not looking in the right spot... there are content creators will millions of followers on Rumble. Its about the CONTENT. If the content is not worthy of viewers and followers then the count will be low. If creators put as much effort in Rumple as they do ScrewTube, they would see similiar subs and viewers.
have you ever heard of the Streisand effect? edit: added timestamps since I ramble a lot, for easier viewing.
The Streisand effect brought me here. Just subbed.
fk yt xd
I just had to google that.
"Don't film my mansion while you film your documentary on erosion." Now everyone knows about your mansion. If you had not complained, nobody would have known or cared about your mansion. Something to that effect.
keep up the good work Louis
The whole point of an API is to expose some functionality to external applications without exposing any bespoke code.
Exactly ... if they wanted to limit the services or data available then they could have done so in the API definition. They are just trying to cover their collective ar*e having expected nobody would notice this interface. Just a shame there are few judges with any IT or development experience to hear such cases.
Not really. An API is not to expose functionality to external applications. There can be internal APIs that shouldn’t be accessed by others.
HOWEVER. If an API is public, it should be Mazda’s responsibility to protect their APIs. A URL to your favorite website is also an API, you cannot force users not to visit a website. You can add authentication to gate such URLs. Just because the API isn’t protected well enough doesn’t mean it’s copyrighted. It can be added to terms of service to disallow users, but they won’t be able to catch such people. That’s like showing your balls in public and expecting people not to photograph them. If it’s in public domain, it’s not under your control anymore. Also, attacking a hammer company for empowering users to modify your car isn’t the right approach - it’s what Mazda is doing. The repositories are tools which don’t access the APIs until a user sets them up properly in their home assistant. No different than a hammer used to modify your Ferrari (after which you can’t buy a new Ferrari from what I hear)
@@vixrant **woosh** …and completely wrong.
“External application” does not mean “public.” The point was that using the API itself is not the same as using code whether it is a private API or not, so you don’t get to claim that someone using your API is stealing your copyrighted code. The entire point of an API is to externally interface with some deliberately exposed function of the application without exposing bespoke internal code. “Expose” doesn’t mean “public” either. It’s from the perspective of the code base.
The API is exposing itself for authorized use. In this case, it is unauthorized use but they likely have no authority to assert their authorization… and certainly not by claiming that API access is equivalent to stolen code when the entire point is to interface without knowing internal code or requiring bespoke code.
When Oracle published the Java APIs for programmers to use, they didn't foresee the possibility that others might offer competing implementations of their APIs and tool chain.
I will just stop fighting here...
I love how when Louis says "I hope you're having a lovely day" it always sounds like he's trying to hold back his rage over whatever anti-consumer practice he's going to inform us about.
I hope you're having a lovely day, because I don't! 😄
I hope you're having a lovely day. Let me ruin it for you.
*Teeth clinched* I hope you're having a lovely day 😬
I hope you’re having a happy day in this corrupt world.
Here, have a free pencil. ✏
As a software engineer, a die hard rotary engine enthusiast, and an owner of 3 mazdas, this is informative and unfortunate.
Hello Fellow Rotarian, I salute you from the land down under!
Just gonna say that if this guy was checking the fuel levels in his shared Mazda and then he claimed that it was a rotary engine on E85 with limited access to fuel bowsers......in the current climate you'd hope that Mazda would say 'oh poor c***? C'mon guys just let him keep it' 🤣
As someone who always respected Mazda for not being like others, this made me sad :( Especially since they are such a gigantic part of the tuning szene, they should have no issues with people doing whatever they want on their cars.
@@mactalk2871 yep. Sad as I am looking at my RX7 project car sitting in the driveway. Mazda has been big part of my family? My grand father bought Mazda, my dad bought Mazda, I bought Mazda.
It almost seems like out of character for them to do this? It's as if someone in the application development part of Mazda took offence to what someone else was capable of doing that they weren't?
It seems to be a big factor of what goes on in large companies in the modern world? Tesla has done similar things and it was crazy to see people attacking Elon Musk personally for what his company's internal policies are? I don't blame Elon when someone has worked hard on something and then feels ripped off when a 3rd party offers something better than what they can produce? It starts to not look good for the brand, so the company legal teams get involved because they have investors to appease? Mazda investors don't want to hear that some free solution can do a better job than a solution that they have paid developers a lot of money to produce; it makes them look bad? So much of the response from all of this is a carried down over reaction to basic human emotion inadequacy?
Whilst this occurs, simultaneously Mazda sends some of its engineers from Japan over to America just to attend a racing event to shake the hand of a competitor that has been doing his own development of the rotary engine? Actually thanking the guy for his efforts and contribution to making after market parts that Mazda themselves are no longer producing? They still own the parents and have all the blue prints to these parts........but some guy is straight up reproducing (and improving) Mazda's design and selling these parts for profit.......and yet Mazda supports that and is somehow 100% A-OK with this? Yet a guy taps into an API and Mazda won't have a bar of it?
It's this that makes me think that there is someone within the company that has their "knickers in a twist" and is all offended by what's gone on because it makes them personally look like they haven't done a good enough job?
If Mazda were smart they would simply fire that developer (and not give it a second thought) and then propositioned the developer of this open app to work (paid) to either fix their own application or at the very least offered it as an alternative under the Mazda brand and offered to have graphic design elements of all the "in-house" developers would have access to?
It's a real shame to hear things have gone this way with Mazda and I really hope that someone realises this isn't right and course corrects the situation, cause it goes against the entire ethos of the brand doing what they are doing?
I know within production and manufacturing business that there can often be a disconnect between the engineers and guys making sh!t happen and the big wigs in the corporate part of the business..... to the end where they are essentially 2 separate business entirely? I'm not saying that is the case here with Mazda, but it just seems like a growing trend seen across all kinds of industries?
My questioning of this comes from the fact that Mazda have been the complete opposite behaviour to this in the past.......so there must be a reason for this 'out -of-character' behaviour we are seeing playing out now? I could be wrong, but I hope I'm not?
Peace and Brap brap
hahaha wankel
ok
I'm an embedded engineer, so literally a expert in this field, and I agree 100% with everything you've said with nothing left to add.
They could block access from the car, with a potential update, but ask gitlab to take down the source that only uses such API? outrageous.
@@GeomancerHTeven if they block it, you would still have the right to use it. as lomg as it does not directly affect their services remotely.
@@GeomancerHTas a software engineer I can say, that it's not really possible to block the access except for disabling the API in the car completely. Changing client-id/client-secret will not necessarily help, because you could possibly sniff those out of a stream anyway. Disabling it would fix it, but neither Mazda nor any other manufacturer will stop doing so, because data is lucrative.
@@igordasunddas3377 They could rewrite the API to use different parameters.
I can't understand why anyone would allow their car online in the first place. MAYBE a VPN tunnel to your network, but nothing for outsiders to access.
@@igordasunddas3377well they can just encrypt the actuall stream that leaves the car, so mitm attack would be just impossible. You CAN then reverse engineer it out of their firmware, but this is way more work than just sniffing traffic.
It's always made me happy that you pull this kind of bullshit in to the light. The whole DMCA system needs to be gutted and reworked, it's far too easy for giant companies to abuse, and as it stands it feels like that's what its primary purpose has become. And, I hate that.
It has become the very thing it swore to destroy 😔😔
@@MaxSixty-Three It feels like so many measures put in place to protect smaller creators are just abused by the entities they were supposed to protect creators from. A lot of these laws and avenues just need to flat out be redone, especially for the modern era with the web being so prevalent in day to day life.
just curious if your name is a burrough's reference?
@@AhPook I agree
@@MaxSixty-Three But that is *exactly* what the DMCA was about, right from the start. I'm old enough to vividly remember when the legislation was first passed. The DMCA was passed because every time a "giant" like Sony came up with a "foolproof" copy protection or "digital rights management" scheme, some hacker in his mom's basement came up with an easy way to defeat it. So the MAFIAA lobbied hard, meaning they bribed hard, and the DMCA was passed.
On the surface, it sounds analogous to laws that prevent you from picking locks to property that doesn't belong to you. Sounds great and moral, right? Except this was intended to prevent you from doing anything to stuff you paid for and thought you owned, in principle. The way they justified that was to state you never really owned any digital media to begin with, all you purchased with your hard-earned buck was a licence that would grant you some very limited rights to consuming that media. A licence whose terms they could change unilaterally, but you couldn't touch. And a licence that often empowered "them" to spy on you or even corrupt and subvert your private stuff with spyware and rootkits. It was quite hellish, right from the get-go.
The mistake a lot of people make is thinking governments ever worked for them, nope, they never have, and probably never will.
False DMCA claims should result in (at the very least) strong civil fines
It really needs perjury charges, unless the person who made a false accusation made a reasonable mistake. Because it is a legal document.
Definitely. The problem is businesses that receive fines just add them as a cost of doing business. Fines issued to corporations need to be based on a percentage of their profits received over a period of time(or their total within the past year), but that's unlikely to happen anytime soon. To a normal working person, these types of fines could very easily bankrupt them.
@@liblevi45s53The fines absolutely need to be a percentage of global revenue (not profit. Revenue) the same way GDPR does in the EU.
@liblevi45s53 I don't think they should be punished based on their income, but based on the scale of the unethical things they do. However, that requires actually figuring out how often they do things like that. It can be frequent, or cover a large number of people, but that requires the government to do its job, or at least reduce the barrier for the victims to sue them and win, so that a meaningful percentage actually do.
I also think individual employees should personally be held responsible for more blatant things, like actual crimes. Arresting some employees and middle managers for things like fraud or perjury, because even if their employer told them to do it, they still committed crimes, and not just complex regulatory things, but often very blatant things, like when Wells Fargo employees opened up fake bank accounts.
Or even better, forfeiture of the copyright/patent/trademark the claim was based on. Make a false takedown claim for a movie you had the copyright to? It's now public domain. It's part of a franchise you have a trademark on? Double-whammy! Your trademark on that franchise is now void. You might still own the copyrights to the other entries, but your trademark on that franchise is gone. That'd really scare companies into doing their research.
Your kidding? A major company abusing the DMCA? show me shocked.
You *have* to be shocked. These major companies are doing this to numb our senses and make us less likely to call them out when they do stuff like this. That's their goal: do something bad so much that it becomes the norm.
@@Operational117 Yeah, the problem is there isnt much to do about it. Even if you were to vote with your money, like you should often do, the economic space is so monopolistic that there really arent any alternatives
mazda is one of the least profitable of all the major car companies and had many features that most car companies had already done away with for cost cutting or better number figures, very sad to see mazda do this.
@@jimmmyjohns2853 Its crazy as they could actually win more customers by being the one company that actually has a more open approach to this sort of thing.
DMCA stands for Dick Move Corporate Action, yes?
This channel has been very important for me and others. I knew about some of the dirty tricks companies were doing, but this channel has shown the problem is worse than I expected. For instance, learning that serialization was taking place, and learning how wide spread it is was an eye opener. There is no justification for that and I'm surprised it's legal. This channel has helped me avoid doing business with some of the worst of the companies. I hope this information continues to be presented to the public.
Sounds like Google doesn't want Louis to talk about a certain app that they see as a big threat to their monopoly.
Keep up the great work!
Thats what it is huh, it put me in conflict cause they bully,censure and i keep on watching. You tube and all the alphabet companies were heavy players through the pandemic and they should be recognized as some of the biggest corporate tyrants of the day. Way too powerful, their algorithms are whats dividing us as a country. The internet was such an awesome thing before they ruined it. Now algorithms bury the facts under pages of sponsored content. And they hide the truth and try to trick you into buying bullshit. You tube should be demonetized
Their monopoly is on the content providers. All the content providers should expand to alternatives and leave you tube on the same date. I hate bullys, why does you tube feel like they need to bully, they already own the market? Its not about money, its lust for power, we should turn the u tube off until they can play nicely with the citizens instead of manipulate everything.
Louis is so selfless for covering this topic instead of being pissed at TH-cam for deleting the Grayjay videos. Amazing, i applaud that
i am not selfless, i am a person who reads the news then rants into a camera about what bothers him about the world.
from time to time, i try to take action to change it. lobbying, making educational videos, starting a repair shop if i believe in repair & showing other people how to do it themselves w/out a paywall..... but it all starts with yelling at a cloud.
i'm not special for clicking record when i yell at a cloud.
@@rossmanngroup To be honest i think you have far better problem solving skills and common sense than 99% of people. Also the majority of people probably don't take action, but still
@@rossmanngroup"yelling at clouds" has a funny double entendre considering you're yelling at google
They deleted the grayjay video?
yes
The whole DMCA needs to be vastly overhauled. If youre doing something not for profit, it should be impossible to violate.
i get this is not what you are meaning but just taking what you comment at face value
" If youre doing something not for profit, it should be impossible to violate."
then uploading a copyrighted work such as a movie for free would be consider perfectly legal
something regularly considered piracy
but yes DMCA and copyright needs a massive reworking that is for sure
and not a reworking that only favors the "big players" like the current system does
@@durandle9226 Your argument is that piracy is somehow bad? What does legally buying game get you? Unplayable games, worse performance, mantadory online connection for singleplayer titles, incomplete games that often community has to fix by itself. What does paying for streaming services, or even DVD/Blu-Ray get you? Worse quallity, region-lock, ads in some cases if you go with lowest subscription plan. Not to mention that you have to pay for like 5 different streaming services, because S1 and S3 are on one, and S2 is on some other service.
Piracy does better job of preserving everything, than any of these companies ever will, besides being more convenient.
@@durandle9226 non-profit piracy should be legal
The big change that needs to be made is on the "bad faith" claims. 1) It needs to be made clear that one must be correct in their fair use analysis, not merely prove that they considered it, and 2) one should be able to claim liquidated damages of, say, $25,000, for economic damages. Otherwise, it invites companies to be sloppy when DMCAing open source projects because there aren't any damages they'll have to pay out, just legal fees, which are probably going to add up to only a few thousand bucks by the time the company realizes it targeted someone willing file a bad faith DMCA suit.
The DMCA should never have been permitted to exist.
It basically allows anyone to be prosecutor, judge and executor at the same time without due process.
Mazda was one of the few that I still had faith in... I hope they get their shit together quick because we won't let this fly.
Its a lost cause.
That was the same thing that I thought when seeing the title... Never meet your heros I suppose. I had a good run with Mazda. RIP 2001 - 2023.
@michaelscarport plus, intense rust issues. that was under ford mind you, famous rust buckets, but still.
@michaelscarportI wouldn’t say that. From 2017 and up they’re running with Toyota. Only quality control issue is the paint, but that’s about it.
For those non technical viewers, you can understand API as a set of buttons on a device. It may be undocumented, hidden under the backpanel and unlabeled but it's there. You can push them, you can observe what they do and you can learn how to use it to do something. If they installed the button, you can use it and you can legally share instruction on the usage. That's exactly what plugins or apps use. They are made to push those hidden buttons to control stuff. Typically API (application programming interface) is documented and shared so that programmers can easily write programs that use it and integrate with it but it happens that this interface is there but was not documented properly. It's not even reverse engineering though. I don't know if that's some library with exported symbols or some network interface accepting certain undocumented messages but it doesn't matter. It is there, you can use it.
We need some lawyers that would have some technical knowledge and take those cases to countersue them and rip as much money as they can from the copyright bully. That's the way to fight them. You want to sue some opensource developer for some bullshit knowing he can't afford fighting? Good, you will talk with lawyer who lives out of it, does this for living and he will make sure you will pay him and his customer for your wrongdoings. That's how it should really work.
The existence of an api doesn't mean you are permitted to use it. Just like if I find a key to your house I'm not allowed to just enter it.
@@RCLapCar But if you are owner of a car or house you can do with it whatever you want.
@@RCLapCar Your statement is correct. However it isn't copyright that governs this permission. That is potentially CFAA or something as mundane as violating terms of service. The issue being discussed is a DMCA takedown (copyright).
@@RCLapCar Well, no, it's an API to a product that YOU own. That analogy is flawed, because you don't own the house.
When it comes to publicly exposed API's, FCC part 15 rules should apply.
1. Sender may not cause HARMFUL interference.
2. Receiver must accept any interference received, including interference that may cause undesired operation (aka 3rd party apps)
The onus is on the receiver to protect their API's from undesired interference. DMCA takedowns is the lazy caveman approach.
They are claiming (incorrectly) that this is a copyright issue, so even if those FCC rules were in place this claim would supersede that regulation. The “issue” here isn’t about the usage of the API, it’s an erroneous claim that the only way they _could_ use the API is to have accessed copyrighted material and used it to create a derivative product. I agree with your argument about how usage of APIs might be regulated, but we first need to establish that it’s fully legal to reverse engineer an API
It's harmful to Mazda because they can't charge you subscription on a monthly basis for a very very basic thing that costs them virtually nothing :D
@@DarkViperus I’m not entirely following that argument. Is the idea here that Mazda can’t secure their own API? Mazda could certainly require people to have some sort of subscription while allowing them to access their backend via a 3rd party client, those 3rd party clients would just have to give users a way to provide their Mazda credentials for authenticating with the Mazda servers.
@@0oShwavyo0 yes, they cant, as they openly admitted in the Dmca. But apparently, it doesnt matter because its easier to bully than to secure xD
"FCC part 15 rules should apply." - Those rules apply to radio waves/EMI and really can't be directly applied to software at all.
I'm glad you are learning C. Computer programming is one of my most favorite things to do. When you develop the mental pathways to write source code, and learn a few programming languages that have different structures, you get to the point where when you sit down to do programming you enter a singular mental focus when you're working on code. It's like a meditation, like being 'in the zone', a flow state (psychology).
You might also enjoy picking up a used college book on "systems analysis" since you will need to understand how different pieces of code need to work together at multiple levels in defined ways. A basis in systems analysis helps you perceive the forest when the small sections of the code are working on are like the leaves of a tree.
Finding an engineer that is good at managing their own time and resources, as well as understanding a how a system needs to work at the macro scale and the micro scale is rare find. You have a good start because you fairly acknowledge the things you don't (yet) know instead of bluffing your way through it. Good luck on your journey young-ish padawan.
Thank you!
He should Kick it up a notch and learn Holy C. I understand it's infallible.
I am shocked how many programmers have no idea how the software works under the hood. No wonder there are so many bugs. I was trying to help some students taking assembly, and was shocked they don't even do that now. They use emulators which do not let you flip register bits on IO busses. The entire reason you use assembly is access to the hardware.
I will never trust self driving cars because the programmer ALSO needs to know how to drive a car. And I see very little evidence of that with all the car wrecks on the road every day.
Astronauts are going to find out the hard way when something goes wrong, and no one knows what the computer is doing because it is all closed systems.
@@robertsmith2956 Don Petit an Engineer and Nasa Astro-not has stated, if you have a leak in the ISS, well you have a leak! He says he's sure there must be some way in the manuals to fix the situation but he had no clue what that was! In other words, he's a Fraud. Space as Nasa describes it is a fairy tale. Don doesn't understand pressure differentials nor can the ISS exist in a 2nd law of thermodynamics violation. You cannot ever have gas (atmosphere, an oxymoron because gas cannot form a sphere in a vacuum) can never fail to fully equalize with the available volume in the open system Nasa claims Earth is in. So you don't trust self driving cars for good reason.. you may want to give serious thought as to why you believe Nasa and their lies.
6:26 The whole copyrighting an API thing is a little fuzzy in some regards, but the general rule of thumb to be safe is as follows:
If you are distributing a codebase that happens to include the API itself, then arguably you are potentially distributing someone else's code that they wrote and therefore own the copyright for.
If you are distributing a codebase that remotely calls an external API, where the API in question is hosted externally by whomever owns it and the associated copyright to begin with; then that is fair game, as you aren't distributing the API itself (so long as it's used in line with whatever terms of service are associated with the API in question, if any exist). The bigger issue doing things this way for a developer is that if the external host changes the API, chances are your implementation may break.
makes sense, and the last part is to be expected as you arent the owner of the API (even if its your car...), its quite sad because reverse engineering api calls to be able to know what to receive and send its a painful process, specially in cars as ... that is still the wild west from what I know about its standards and communication protocols
Exactly, you aren't distributing their API code, just connecting to it! However I'm sure I read somewhere that code CANNOT be copyrighted unless as a whole 'project', everything as one!
An API is an API! They're all pretty much the same code, work pretty much the same way and only a small part of the actual codebase/project.
This DMCA is bull and they're abusing the process!
@@arashitempesta Somewhat, but as a programmer I can tell you it's pointless NOT to use a pre-existing protocol. That being so, Mazda (and all other auto companies) are worse than fools if they aren't simply using what's already in the vehicle's CAN bus and encoding that over a wifi or wireless connection (can be some ticklisness in the form of encoding, but anything too complicated merely adds fragility to the system). So my bet would be you get 90% of what you need taking your portable scope down to the garage and poking around with a cheap diagnostic hookup.
@terrencezellers9105 Yeah, I haven't worked on automotive projects, but even then, I've seen so much bs and bad practices, even in really big companies that I wouldn't be surprised if they have some weird bastardization because "we are the only ones making use of it"
Hold up! API isn't a code base, is it? I don't have an access to implementations. I cannot see the inner workings. What API allows me is to access a functionality, without knowing the inner workings. Similarly to how executable works.
If I write a script in Autohotkey or AutoIt that directly operates on application, there's really not much of a difference from creating my own code that works with API, that I had to learn and reverse engineered.
I don't think a week goes by where I don't mention Right To Repair to someone new, and I can honestly say that your channel was the driving force to make me much more aware of the BS. I mean I've noticed the BS for a lot of years, but your channel genuinely made me aware of why it bothered me and to learn what "signs" to look for. Thank you Louis... thank you!
What sucks about these incidents is that companies don't see this as what people want or a sign that their product is in adequate and see this as an sign to improve
Actually, most companies (certainly all large ones that have been around for at least several years) are fully aware of what customers actually want!
But they have learned that the customer's wishes become functionally irrelevant when they purchase the product despite its failures!
They have collected copious quantities of data, and they have carefully & thoroughly analyzed it in search of how they can maximize their profit margin.
And NOTHING else matters to them as long as their net profits outweigh the sum of all of the "costs" of doing business.
My reason for my next assertion is not to be disparaging, rude, belittling, embarrassing or anything like that, it is to hopefully serve as an "alarm bell" to WAKE UP, and then to inspire others to begin to prioritize their education!
Anyway, basically... Your comment exposes a very idealistic perspective which is sadly inconvenient with the actual current state of reality.
Positivity & idealism become useless and actually backfire and have a very counter productive effect, undermining & sabotaging one's goals when they are based on & reliant upon a basic paradigm that is naive & ignorant.
Many people might say or think how nice or great it is that you have this hopeful idealism; but that's delusional. In reality it sucks and it's terribly tragic and depressing because it demonstrates that the programming (propaganda/brain washing) was successful on you. Any threat you might have potentially posed had been neutralized, and you've been successfully reduced to a pathetic non-threat!
I made 3 videos talking about the awesome gray app but today TH-cam removed/banned all three videos due to "violation" of terms/policies. I've been on TH-cam for 10 years now and have never had this happen until Louis, FUTO, and team actually made something better. I hope Louis is able to get his gray video back up and then I can appeal mine as well as it's an app that more people need to know about. Thx Louis for everything and best wishes on journey ahead.
This is really sad. Mazda is a very small company compared to the competition and was one of the few good ones left. Then again, they share a bunch of factories and platforms with Toyota so it was only a matter of time before they started following in their footsteps.
Any halfway decent size company is looking for that monthly hit on your bank account sadly.
I thought Mazda is a Ford company?
there were part of ford for many years
@@myew8238 no that was a long time ago when ford had a controlling stake
@@myew8238 Ford hasn't owned Mazda in over a decade.
Sounds to me like Mazda is trying to use the DMCA to enforce something that would fall under patent law, which is actually a violation of the DMCA. There is a clause in the DMCA outlining the penalties for sending a notice when something is not based in copyright law. I'd counterclaim it, after speaking with a lawyer. A letter on a lawyer's letterhead explaining why they are stupid would likely have them back down.
While they are claiming copyright, they actually are complaining about the functionality. You are right, the closest they could do would be patent or possibly trademark. Not copyright! Dumbasses.
some people don't have the money to do that, and large companies tend to count on that fact in their shady legal shenanigans.
I've been intermittently watching Louis since he was doing his mac repair vids - I watched through all of his New York real estate series and I can say without a doubt if there's any TH-camr I've learned from the most, it's Louis Rossman. Thank you for all you do man - keep it up, TH-cam or not.
Thank you for all your efforts Louis, it really takes someone with a passion to try and educate the public. Keep the good fight 💪
I only found this channel a few weeks ago, but I have and am learning much from it. I genuinely appreciate the humility and tenacity of your efforts, man. Stay up!
I think I hit the subscribe button on Louis' channel about ~4-5 years ago, and over the years, that button has become one of the most important and impactful buttons I've ever clicked on the internet. Truly. I think if even 10% of people were as well informed and proactive as Louis is, our world would be about 86% less shitty.
Welcome to the honest facts. Sucks he needs to censor himself about his software to deplatform the idea of subscriptions that youtube has cracked down on.
Never let anyone keep you down or silence you Louis! You have courage we don't always have but we support your efforts to wade through the madness!
You're one of the most honest guy on youtube.
Sad part is this will keep happening as those in management and legal team have almost no idea of how IT works and only thinks about money. The only way for us to stop these are to not buy products like these, maybe try a new brand.
Yeah, that's one thing I noticed. All they know and care about is money, not technology.
That I've noticed, things like this tend to become a race to the bottom, where even if a company is reasonable today, that will eventually change (the argument from Cory Doctorow).
I don't think the standard "vote with your wallet" approach works anymore because of how interconnected everything is.
You literally need the man on the street overseeing legislation BEFORE it gets enacted.
Really surprised your strikes were corrected so quickly
Because the strikes aren't legitimate.
there's some re-education thing you do where you get asked weird questions and then you get a warning for 3 months.
Rossmann Re-education subchannel when?@@rossmanngroup
@@rossmanngroup Could you do a video on that, including the questions you were asked, please?
@@rossmanngroup A certain rebellious part of me thinks there should be an app that takes it for you lol
This is disgusting, and I hope this developer fights this in court. I'd be happy to donate!
Probably not, the developer quite likely might be a piss poor university student with time to spare. Corporate bastards like the ones working at Mazda probably know this well.
Another day, another great video from my favorite ‘right to repair’ advocate.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thank you for all the great edutainment content over the years and for your very well spoken efforts regarding right to repair.
Many of us will maintain our viewership of your content wherever you may publish.
God bless.
I'm surprised Mazda would do something like this. I have purchased several vehicles from Mazda and every time I needed any parts it was super easy to obtain them from Mazda. Very disappointing. I literally rebuilt the front end of a car and it took like 20min to find all the parts I needed. I've also found Mazdas to be very easy to work on as well. Although one thing I have found annoying is that they sell the service manuals for cars on a time based subscription basis, like $24/hr or $50/day something like that.
i bet you can tpb that
Yeah, you can lilely find the PDF files for free. If not just pay for it for an hour, and screenshot everything they got. Sounds scummy of them though, people shouldn't have to use sketchy means to get around originally sketchy buisness models. If they make it too unfairly expensive, i think morals are already thrown out the window, so being what could be perceived as an immoral action normally, isn't is used against an immoral model.
@@fss1704 Bet you can't
Mazda is no longer the unique independent brand they used to be, a big chunk of it is now owned by Toyota Motors, a global W - E - F partner. I own new Toyota & Lexus vehicles and can confirm they are becoming what they sought to destroy. Subscription models and dealer-dependent repairs are becoming more and more common even with the Japanese models.
No OEM makes it hard to find parts, I'm confused. Go to any dealer or service center and you can buy parts.
As a kid in school in the 80's technology was about limitless possibilities.
Now it is just a pathway to endless corporate (and government) servitude.
You will own nothing and be happy
Louis, I'll never be able to thank you enough for bringing so many things to my attention. You gave me the opportunity to also be part of a solution. I'll follow you to whatever platform you wind up on man. Peace be with
You've inspired me to not accept changes to technology usage that infringes on my freedoms and privacy. Thank you for that.
I truly hope this channel, and Rossman repair group, stays afloat for a very long time! I don't know of ANY one thing that has woken so many people up to the freedom issues the world is battling at the time, and we really need to wake EVERYONE up. Also, Louis does his best to stay honest and truthful, come hell or high water, and I appreciate that effort more than anything! Thanks a bundle, Louis! 🙌 The world owes you a great debt. But please don't stop! 🙏
Here here...
On behalf of all the voiceless, uninformed and hopeless - thank you Louis for educating countless followers and shining light on everything wrong with our modern world, even if that is your last video ever - you've done your part. Thank you
HOME ASSISTANT!!!!! (Humps air) See y'all at the release party tomorrow!
Mazda has also actively denied warranty claims for relatively new vehicles with less than 20,000 miles after looking at engine data taken from the MyMazda app and declaring that the vehicle was misused even though that was not the case most of the time.
Deserves its own video!
Are you able to elaborate more on this or link some of the stuff you’re talking about? I’m a full time Mazda employee and I haven’t heard of this being the case through the app.
False claims are a crime.
Known as perjury.
Counter sue for mental anguish and loss of opportunity.
Tell them you were so emotionally bothered by this huge company trying to sue you for something 100% legal
That you couldn't pursue happiness and as a result lost opportunities to make millions.
I guarantee they withdraw the suit.
Some lawyer has to team up with the programmer dude and sue their @$$e$ xD.
Would the company suing not count as a SLAPP suit?
@ It's not not a suit, it's a DMCA claim submitted to github, and it's enabled by the DMCA laws and statutes. It only becomes a suit if Github or the programmer responds. Yes, the DMCA is a joke.
“False claims are a crime”
So is giving legal advice when you’ve not qualified as a lawyer - the bar organisation has a much better hit rate at prosecuting people who do that than suing someone who didn’t perjur for mental anguish.
Your “advice” is sov cit nonsense and no one should listen to it.
Not going to change anything with our current legal system that favors big corpos that can afford to cheese around the courts.
If TH-cam takes down Louis' channel, there won't be much keeping me here.
I'm just glad you are able to upload content in this platform.
Life coach, that's what you are Louis!
As a HA user, I can vouch for the software and the community. Having the freedom to do whatever you want with your house - lights, HVAC, curtains, solar panel monitoring etc.. you understand the value it brings to you, so you naturally donate to the HA devs. Not the other way around- pay a massive fee for something that takes away your freedom and limits you to their own micro environments..
Good job, Louis... You've pissed off the right people, and now the machine is after you. Welcome, my Son... Welcome, to the machine.
This kinda reminds me of my truck's uConnect garbage. The radio system is crap, I have actually gotten an ad (one of those "Hey, we noticed you're not paying our monthly sub! Why not sign up for $XX per month!) *WHILE I'M DRIVING* btw... That was the last straw for me. It is an extremely rare ad though, but I have gotten it twice since having this vehicle. (for reference, it's a 2014 RAM 1500 R/T) I'm soon going to CDL school and one of the first things I do on that truck is rip out the radio unit and put a new one in that has Android Auto available to it. No more of that uConnect garbage or anything. There's other things I need to do, but those will come in time.
Car ownership is really starting to go the wayside it seems. They're getting harder to repair basic things. For example, my truck has a problem with the fuel level sensor when my tank starts getting kinda low. It used to turn on the check engine light around 1/8 of a tank, but now it's on at just shy of 1/2 tank. But in order to replace the fuel level sensor, because it's so tightly integrated with other fuel system components, that's north of $1,500 right there. Tail lights? I had to replace one at one point, and at the time since a coupe of the LED's were out, the other side were soon to follow, so I just replaced both taillights entirely. OEM tail lights will run you $600+ each. The aftermarket I got that look better anyway? $300 for the pair. The bad thing is that I live in an area that doesn't have public transit, so owning a car is pretty much a requirement to get to anywhere. I'm not going to spend $100/wk for Uber/Lyft to get somewhere if I have a job or something.
DO NOT BUY MAZDA - I have a relative that paid for the navigation software on the car screen display on a brand new lease. They were never given it, and were told they need an SD card from them to upgrade the firmware. They have been waiting for 5 months to be given said SD card, going back and forth.
That sounds like a dealer/seller problem, not with Mazda themselves. Not saying Mazda is *not* in the wrong, but most of the time, dealers are the cause of these headaches. Have you contacted Mazda directly?
@@brinksectionz Done through Mazda
Thank You for bringing it up. The topic is very disturbing, it brings emotions for sure and willingness to change things. Okay, I am a software engineer and actually create open source software as well - and am proud of that. I repair things when I can by using my own hands. I use Home Assistant because I find it useful and don't want to use cloud services that are located elsewhere and I want to own my information (however, from my personal POV HA is unreliable - it often has quite annoying issues). So, what I do right now is: as I have a bad feeling of the world going to hell I am continuing doing open source software in order to give people alternative to hell. I know there are things like these which I cannot affect directly which annoy and make world a worse place - okay, I can vote for different politicians which actually promote the better things; I can write comments like this or similar; I can take part in demonstrations on the topic in democratic societies. Is that enought? I have a feeling that it is not exactly enough but I have no idea where else to direct efforts to make things better tbh. I assume I am not the only one with this feeling.
P.S. just in case, this is not written to hear "oh you do a lot, thanks!" - this is to get an answer to the last question.
NO. I THANK YOU Louis! you have done so much good! and the community needs you as our voice!
Why would you write "NO THANK YOU" ?? That's quite rude 😮
@@johncoops6897 I agree that's was a bad way to say that.
@@digital-b4177 - it makes sense now, after the edit 👍
Many of us are out here channeling the Streisand Effect. ;). Grey skies will be host to many flying jays, if you know what I mean. ;). Word of mouth is still a thing, slower than digital but this snow ball is rolling. Thank you for all you do.
Even if something happens on this platform, at least a whole lot of your audience have a way to continue to connect to you and your content. Please know that we really do appreciate it. Many of your fans are more than happy to pay for things they value. Keep up the great work!!
My repair shop was made in part because of you man, I'm an engineer with a masters in computer science and data science, I'm usually "the guy" when it comes to repairing stuff everyone thinks its impossible to repair here down in Mexico, let's say that they come to me and some get to "see the light", and oh man you have no idea how many times I fucking heard "Those asses wanted me to buy a brand new one!", you have helped my work too much so I do everything I can to make contributions to yours, even if small, we got your back man whatever happens, we won't let the corpo scums win as long as we breath!
The Software Freedom Law Center could be interested in this case. Still, the way the IBM BIOS was reverse engineered used two sets of engineers, one which looked at the IBM source code and discovered the API, and wrote a specification. The second set had no access to the IBM source, so they couldn't copy it, and implemented the specification. Doing both jobs by the same person has the potential to copy code from the the original material, or at least to be accused of it.
But here there is no second team needed: they are note creating a mazda clone, they just use the API to acces informations from the car. So for your comparison they just create a new operating system and use the API to call the orginal BIOS on an original IBM PC without accessing the source cobe of the BIOS. They are not using a single line of code of the BIOS. (Home assistant plugin vs mazda app linux vs PC/DOS)
@@frederichardy8844 It all depends on whether they copied code out of the Android or Apple app when they reverse engineered that app. Yes, it's just a web API call, but there's authentication and encoding in those apps. I doubt the API call is publicly documented anywhere. If they decompiled the code which generates the HTML request and parses the response and used that in their HA code, then a DCMA takedown is appropriate. Using a clean room which only extracts the actual API HTML and implements the code to generate that API call shows that no code was copied, and any similar is a result of limited ways to implement the same functionality.
I highly doubt that a DMCA takedown request would be filed if the entirely different code was used to implement the call. But, given use of the same library functions to implement the API call, the code will look very similar. Using a clean room would prevent similar code from being accused of being a copy.
Back in the early days of C, there was an alternate C compiler written by Whitesmiths. They were afraid of being accused of copying the code, so they implemented their own library with different names and parameters. This didn't encourage people to use their compiler unless they had no choice. This predated the IBM BIOS cloning, but showed the lengths people would go to to prevent copyright claims. More court cases have eliminated some of the precautions, but not all.
Great point. APIs usage is completely legitimate fair use. vehicle can bus and debug apis should be required to be documented and open; the wireless loophole is insane
In Cyberpunk edgerunners the main character had to pay a subscription to use his own laundry machine in his own home. I fear this will no longer be fictional in the future.
Personally what I think we need is penalties for false DCMA filings. As long as massive corporations can bury people using spammed DCMA's to scare them out of the market, the system will never be fixed. DCMA's need to be made with some sort of legal oath of affirmation attached that makes the filer and their legal counsel liable and prosecutable if DCMA claims are made falsely.
Making a false DMCA should end up in monetary compensation for the victim. Make it worthwhile to challenge these claims financially, so that we can make certain that false claims do get countered every single time.
Please also make a desktop version of Grayjay to make it easier to escape the evil corp! Keep up the good work!
The whole concept of copyrighting an API is BS
We appreciate you Louis, I hope you're OK regarding the end of the video, sounded quite ominous. You do you my friend :)
Agree this video is ominous. Also the scientology video was worrisome....
Thanks for putting yourself out there. It's a breath of fresh air amongst all the corruption and people taking to their worst impulses.
They can simply host the code on another platform or on their own website.
That way they would have to make a real court case against them, which would require actual evidence that the code was stolen.
The only way they can lose the case is if someone actually leaked the code for the official app.
In the realm of code and digital skies,
Where open source ideals begin to rise,
A programmer, diligent and bright,
Found their work facing a wrongful fight.
Mazda, with a heavy-handed sleight,
Sent a DMCA, causing a plight,
Intimidation veiled in legal dress,
Their actions causing needless stress.
A false takedown, a chilling breeze,
Striking at the heart of coding ease,
Seeking to quiet the innovative hum,
Yet failing to silence the creative drum.
The open source spirit, a flame so strong,
Defies the shadows of rights gone wrong,
Creators unite, their voices loud,
In defense of freedom, standing proud.
For in this space where ideas unfurl,
No falsehood can restrain the swirl,
Of innovation, a force untamed,
No intimidation can have it chained.
Mazda's misstep, a cautionary tale,
In the landscape where freedoms prevail,
Let solidarity and truth resound,
In the symphony of code, unbound.
And nothing will be done about it…
society 😔😔
Been watching for 10 of those 11 years. TH-cam is definitely not the same and i hear it from a few other channels too that TH-cam is on the verge of canceling there channels due to what they say. I say we should start a new video site where free speech is allowed, not censored for the sake of ad revenue. Its been a fun 10 years, i remember 10 years ago i was watching on my HTC sensation 4G and TH-cam was still free to watch and ad free. I also remember avoiding samsung phones cause the TH-cam app version they had allowed ads but my HTC or LG or iPhone version at the time didn't have any ads
Here's hoping you make a windows version of grayjay! I'm already loving how well the search gives me the channels I want by association of content, even though I did not search for them directly! thank you!
If you're leaving TH-cam, let us know where and we will follow. I too am getting sick of the alerts that ad blockers are not allowed. (I don't have an ad blocker) The bloody cheek!!
You've been an inspiration to me Louis, not just to fix things but to not give up, and when it's time to give up to move on having learned from my failure instead of lamenting myself endlessly or denying it.
I think your usual ranting style of "ire through a smile" has rubbed off on me as well 😂
Im a software developer, I do freelance development, and often I’m said why I do not offer full cloud implementations, and I always tell them, you better keep ownership of your systems, use cloud for support and connectivity, not as a foundation of your system.
I had no idea there was a good software for cloud technology in the home. I heard about home assistant but didn't look into it because I just heard cloud, and assumed privacy invasive, and the way you described it to where you can host it yourself sounds really nice. 0:42
I have been using it for a few years now, and it has been great. It's constantly improving, too.
Thanks for the Gray Jay app. It's still a bit janky but I installed it and waiting for the future update. The Streisand effect is real. Thanks a lot Louis, you brought so much to so many people. I hope you keep going.
Thank you for all that you’ve done educating and sharing your viewpoint with all of us! You inspired me to start my own channel, instead of computers I fix mostly Yamaha’s.
It’s sad to hear that the larger structure of the platform may prevent you from continuing to publish here.
Thank you Louise!
That sounds more than a little ominous. I hope to see you again.
A sentence in the the DMCA reads "MNAO analyzed some of the code and determined that the code provides functionality same as what is currently in Apple App Store and Google Play App Store.". Provide the same functionality is not the same as using copyrighted code. You could copyright an extremely lengthy and complicated algorithm that sums 2 numbers, but if I can provide a different algorithm that sums 2 numbers as well, maybe "number1 + number2" , does not mean im infringing in your copyright.
OMG, I just discovered your channel and I have to say I ❤ your ethos! I've been sharing them with friends - thank you for keeping us informed and encouraging us to push back against unethical business practices, poor customer service and questionable governmental "standards".
I'm gonna share this with @stevelehto. Hey, Steve, any thoughts about Mazda using a perfunctory DMCA challenge to intimidate a developer?
I don't think I've commented on a video before but thanks for putting yourself out there for us for so long Lious. Crazy to think how long its been and how much everything has changed. Started watching you when you where still in that small store fixing computers; i used to describe your channel to friends as a dentist but for computers.
Im a mechanic and i also design electronics and software as a mechanic one thing that always bothered me is that in order to do my job efficiently i need a 8k bi-directional scanner so i made my own and i reverse engineered the custom commands to do all sorts of things that i need like calibrations and abs automated bleed procedure also another thing that pissed me off was the fact that you cant re vin the pcm in most cars so i opened one up and found the eeprom dumped it and found how to reprogram a used 50 dollar pcm to work with a different car i went from charging my customers thousands for a new one and subcontracting the programing to a dealership its insanity especially now with these companies not even making older modules so if it fails your basically screwed and your car is a huge paperweight only part of a car that should be locked down is the security system obviously you don't want to make them easy to steal so f$+@ these car companies and im more than willing to share what ive found to anyone
That is probably the longest unpunctuated sentence ever published on TH-cam!
How can anybody possibly be expected to read and understand whatever you are trying to say? 😢
@@johncoops6897 How's this? You're a dick!
Man, re-vining is probably illegal as fuck. But still, those parts should have never contained VIN in the first place.
@@Bokto1no, it's not. You are rewriting the VIN in the module so the other modules agree it belongs. Many can be done after paying for the OEM programming tools.
The commenter just figured out where the VIN is stored in the code and rewrites it without the $$, pay per use OEM tools.
What you can't do is change the VIN assigned to the vehicle (even then there are exceptions).
@@Bokto1 nope its perfectly legal only time it wouldn't is if you change the mileage but i more or less just dump the eeprom and program it into the new pcm so its more like cloning and will have the correct mileage
I literally installed HA last weekend to connect my garage door so I can see the garage door is open or closed. A plugin is available but I thought to myself, "what if the manufacturer wanted this plugin stopped". I now have my answer!
Your content is among the best in its categories, thank you for all you’ve done Louis
Thank you Louis for all you do with right to repair. I remember up until the mid 90s everything you purchased, came with schematics and part numbers inside the panels. Or you could send for them for most of the times free. Old CRT tvs. My grandpa would repair them all the time and if he didn't have the schematics to test and figure out what's bad, the manufacturer would send em. He also owns a arcade machine Co and had machines all over Phoenix and had filing cabinets full of schematics to all arcade and pinball machines. Can you get those today, hell no. You have an arcade machine and it's broken, most now report home with a computer and certificate USB stick and you can not repair it. Such a sad world we live in
You are doing a great service, Louis. To me, the operative words here are these apps to perform the following on "their vehicles". When I purchase the vehicle (phone, laptop, desktop, meal), it is MY vehicle. I am a retired software engineer, and the phrase "API", Application Programming Interface", is an exchange of information designed (in this case, in theory, Mazda) to protect the core functionality, the vehicle, and consumer. Mazda defines what can and cannot be exchanged - the Mazda vehicle "code" is protected. Now, if they expose more than they should, it is on them.
worth noting that "clean-room reverse engineering" i.e. finding by your own experiments and not by using illegally obtained code, has been defended in court several times by projects such as WINE and ReactOS when microsoft tried to shut them down
Wasn't intels number one competitor reverse engineering PC CPU chips for years?)(or was it intel doing it to IBM? lol it was awhile ago)
Story goes company A sent a copy of their chip schematics to copy B trying to get them to open them there by not be able to prove they didn't copy them(or some such)
@@stusue9733 Iirc do you might mean AMD which did clone the X86 cpu but Intel ultimatly had to give them a proper licence as the US armed forces demanded at least 2 different supplier for there chips. So if Intel wanted that market did they need AMD to exist.
@@rynobehnke8289 Yeah that could be them. Certainly the time frame I was thinking of. Didn't know that thanks.
Wow that ending came from the heart. You are a wonderful inspiring person and what you are doing is very important. Much love from sweden. ❤
It wasn't very clear in this video but I truly do hope that you will continue posting content on other platforms. The content you post is incredibly informative and a beacon of hope given the current landscape for tech.
I'm already subscribed to you on "the forbidden app" so I hope to see some new stuff on there wherever you may choose to go.
I am honestly amazed that people install nonsensical apps like this that are so completely and utterly useless. How about you just check before leaving your car whether your windows are closed or not? How about you just check your range indicator before leaving the car? How about you just not preheat your car? Takes like 2 minutes before your car reaches a comfortable temperate even if you live in a very cold climate. I used to be a software engineer myself and I can tell you I have 0 apps on my phone that interact with other devices. It's all so completely useless.
Car companies should be totally fine with giving people access to the internals, so long as they provide the necessary safety warnings, and do their due diligence to ensure that the method of accessing the internals is reasonably safeguarded so that if certain things are harmful to do while in certain operation modes, they disable them while in that mode (such as if a user instructs the car to go into reverse while the car is going really fast forward, etc)
Mazda, like most Japanese automakers, USED to be about modifications and a whole industry and scene was built on it. I used to be a part of the scene in the mid 2000s but saw that more cars and motorcycles were becoming very restrictive in what can be done esp with the engine. This is mainly with the American side of things as the Japanese still allow for some tinkering with their performance vehicles. Sadly the green movement is killing this slowly.
It's all about money.
Damnit Louis! Why did you have to go and get all vulnerable with us. You have a special place in our hearts too man! For realz!
so if i get a diy cabinet that comes with a bad screw driver that rounds the screws and i find another screwdriver thats better and i start telling people dont bother with the one that you get given and use this one, the company wants to legally stop me from telling people theres a better screwdriver?
Nope! They want to stop the second company from producing screwdrivers in the first place.
Yep
Wrong comparison. They want to block others from measuring the screwdriver and use this intellectual property to start making and selling (or giving) out competing screwdrivers.
I assume that Mazda may plan to charge for use of their app (I didn't see any indication they currently charge - only that people finds the Android app *extremely* buggy)
Reverse-engineering of the API allows customers to get remote control without using Mazda's own program. So if they want to charge, no one will pay.
Sorry for the situation you have gone through. I'm looking forward to using it soon. I just wish it was a little more user friendly. You're a standup guy and I'm proud to feel the same way. Thanks for your help.
A big company targeting a small and harmless person? A classic.
Thanks for bringing awareness to this. I want to use Home Assistant in my next house, and I am a current Mazda3 owner. I sent an email to their customer service voicing my disappointment (for all the good it will do), but I'll be keeping an eye on the situation going forward.
These idiot management don't have enough brain that if this works correctly people will buy their car over other brand just because the HA aspect, without spending any money and be liable to the tradeoffs.
I hate to be the one saying it but it's not illegal to file a false DMCA claim due to the language of the law. The penalty hinges on text that basically says "I certify under penalty that I genuinely think this violates my copyright." There is no *practical* way to punish false claimants criminally. Filing a false claim is free and knocks out the content for a month regardless of the merits, and civil litigation is both expensive and will never make it to the first hearing before that time is up.
It seemed a lot worse than that last time I examined it. The certification is "I represent someone who holds a copyright", not that the claim in question even relates to that copyright, let alone a violation.
Ha! And that's why I drive a 1999 car! Totally not because I am poor.
Could FUTO cover any legal fees if the developer decided to fight this?
Don't know, but it's certainly EFF territory. Though I don't know if they care about their purpose anymore, considering their enthusiastic witch hunt on RMS ran entirely counter to that.
Thank you, Louis. I always appreciate your views. I was thinking of you the other day when the contract for my wedding photographer said I won't own the very pictures I'm paying them for. Every nook in life is someone trying to make it so you own less and less of what you pay for.
API is like a wall plug. Imagine being sued for sharing information on how to connect to a wall.
You earned a like and a subscriber! I am so glad that someone is bringing attention to these important issues.
Hi, mabye not a good place, but today I thought of a saying to make people realise why we should have "right to own"
How would you feel if you couldn't drink pepsi in a cocacola glass, just because cocacola restricts you from drinking any other drinks, aside from their own brands, and could sue you for that.
Dude! Don’t give them any ideas…. 😂
Mazda has stayed off my shit list for a long time. They have a lot of philosophies that I'm a big fan of. The Miata has been my favorite cheap car for longer than I've had a license, and I've been part of that community on and off for just as long. I even almost worked for them.
I sincerely hope they openly condemn their legal team, but with how most companies run these days, unfortunately this will probably just get forgotten about.
After some brief analysis, I think the biggest problem is that the devs used the name Mazda in the repo title, as PyMazda is only 1 character away from MyMazda, and in this case Mazda is simply trying to protect their trademark\brand name\etc, it would have been nice if they had sent a cease and desist first, advising of the trademark infringement, and gave the devs time to rename the project rather than DMCAing the repo.
The best path forward is to restart the project with a more generalise name, call the library pyVehicle or something similar, and add support for other vehicles, if it just so happens to work with a Mazda and they get upset about that then at that point Mazda can get fucked. - for an analogy, think of it like writing an emulator; this thing can run PlayStation 1 games, but you still need the proprietary BIOS from an original PlayStation 1 before it will work, a similar method could be implemented to bypass Mazda's bullshit if they try this shit again.
Note: I am not a lawyer, (but I am a software guy who has had to skirt around patent trolling bullshit in the past, but don’t take my word for it, it’s a slippery slope).
You are exactly on point with the manufacture/consumer climate today referencing the car analogy. You better believe every one of us would be paying for starts on our cars, or radio use, or not being allowed to change the rims, etc, etc, etc. As the saying goes... " you will own nothing, and be happy". You are also on point about the DMCA claims, as I have some experience with those. Web Hosts and ISP's won't get in the middle of such claims, even if they are obviously fraudulent. They will simply cancel your account, web site, or whatever rather than get in the middle of such a dispute. Yes, one can fight the fraudulent claim, and there is even a fine mechanism for filing false claims... but that all takes money, and those filing the fraudulent claims know this very well.
Please move to another platform because the world NEEDS to here your content ! "If you build it, they will come" (famous quote from the movie Field of Dreams). Yes, you have some videos on Rumble, but nothing that I can see as current. For instance, THIS video should be up on Rumble (or any other platform that favors free speech). Back up your videos on ScrewTube and port them over to Rumble. You might be surprised that your viewers will follow you over there. I hear all the time how content creators don't move to Rumble because the viewership is just not there. Well, they are not looking in the right spot... there are content creators will millions of followers on Rumble. Its about the CONTENT. If the content is not worthy of viewers and followers then the count will be low. If creators put as much effort in Rumple as they do ScrewTube, they would see similiar subs and viewers.
I appreciate everything you've shared here as well Louis. Love ya ser