So now that we have a translation of 'Sacred and Terrible Air' (the 2013 novel set years after Disco Elysium) we can confirm that Harry is right, about basically everything he says here and a lot of what he says or is told by his skills elsewhere. This is an origin point for Pale and this church was almost certainly built to contain it. By turning it into a Nightclub, Harry bought Revachol more time, as the novel presents that only two philosophies in Elysium can reliably slow or even stop the expansion of Pale. These are communism and being absolutely Hardcore (in part because both have a big focus on believing that things can get better and optimism seems to keep the Pale at bay, while nihilism accelerates it's growth). These dance kids are maybe not stopping the end of the world, but they are almost certainly slowing it down. The novel also makes it retroactively pretty clear that Harry IS attuned to the Pale unconsciously and that is where his impossible insights are coming from. SHIVERS isn't just incredible guesses or amazing deductions, Harry really is sensing things from other times and places, through this connection to the Pale. MAJOR BOOK SPOILER ALERT: Most worryingly he is right when he is the Cop of the Apocalypse, the Pale is expanding and consuming the world, no one knows how to stop it. Furthermore, Revachol will be the first to go, not to the Pale, but to exactly what the City herself warned it would: this city will be Nuked approximately 20 years after the events of this game. Why is unknown. Whether Harry, attuned to the future through the Pale and thus forewarned, could have prevented it somehow, is something only the original creators could have told us.
I always wondered if Harry had gone off to spend some time with the pale in the church after crashing his car, the footprints lead north at least, and maybe that's part of why he is able to do what he does.
@@Femroe Even if he didn't do that at the time, he has a memory of doing a raid on, if not that church, a very similar church shortly before the beginning of the case. Either way that could have left him exposed to the Pale and given that the Whirling is right across from the Doomed Commercial Area and he crashed near the church, he was in subtly Pale active areas multiple times in the lead up to his total breakdown, all while being Pale sensitive (and having plenty of problems of his own). Some have speculated that his very abilities are what is causing the trauma of him and Dora's relationship ending to extend so long. That it's not simply Harry not knowing how to let go, but that his abilities keep summoning the memory of her leaving; in which he experiences all the pain of it all over again as if it happened only yesterday, which is why Harry is struggling to really heal from it, because the wound keeps getting ripped open again as he relives that memory again and again.
@@Sugbaable It's implied, when Ziggy and his imaginative 'friend' Ignus Nilsen talk about the pale and when Nilsen argues with Ziggy about communism and Nilsen screams about the beauty, positivity and optimism and ideas of communism the pale recedes heavily around them for a moment.
I find this scene hopeful. If this point of origin of pale (If it really is that) had been contained within a church, that means it is indeed possible to stop it's expansion. And since that is possible, humanity WILL stop the Pale from swallowing reality, and perhaps even reverse it. I have similiar hope for the heat death of universe, but there is no proof it can be stopped, so I'm a bit less hopeful for our real world than for the Elysium.
@@juasjuasi4750 Then again, it were communists who burned down churches that were apparently keeping the local Pale at bay. And communism loses all it's appeal after your family is starving to death or repressed for knowing how to read, I'm afraid.
It was also shown in Sacred and Terrible air that someone sincerely espousing their beliefs in people and communism was capable of visibly receding the pale
In a weird way, it kind of reminds me of Dr. Manhattan’s soliloquy about thermodynamic miracles from Watchmen. Pale feels like nihilism given form, and when everything feels discovered and all ground has been broken, then it cumulates in the same sort of ennui that Dr. Manhattan and Revachol feel and espouse. And yet, it’s the sheer unpredictable human bond and the collective spirit of true belief that helps fight it and give a truly combative form against that “unstoppable” force of the Pale. It’s that idea of binding two entirely unlike groups, like Soona and the Anodic Dance crew into one common purpose that provides the greatest “miracle”. In this case, a true viable way to fight the Pale.
![[UNCUT] ชาวบ้านถาม “นายกอุ๊งอิ๊งค์” ประชาชนมีกิน มีใช้ กี่โมง? I คนดังนั่งเคลียร์ I 16 ส.ค. 67](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tKZvOzLIJJc/mqdefault.jpg)
So now that we have a translation of 'Sacred and Terrible Air' (the 2013 novel set years after Disco Elysium) we can confirm that Harry is right, about basically everything he says here and a lot of what he says or is told by his skills elsewhere.
This is an origin point for Pale and this church was almost certainly built to contain it. By turning it into a Nightclub, Harry bought Revachol more time, as the novel presents that only two philosophies in Elysium can reliably slow or even stop the expansion of Pale. These are communism and being absolutely Hardcore (in part because both have a big focus on believing that things can get better and optimism seems to keep the Pale at bay, while nihilism accelerates it's growth).
These dance kids are maybe not stopping the end of the world, but they are almost certainly slowing it down.
The novel also makes it retroactively pretty clear that Harry IS attuned to the Pale unconsciously and that is where his impossible insights are coming from. SHIVERS isn't just incredible guesses or amazing deductions, Harry really is sensing things from other times and places, through this connection to the Pale.
MAJOR BOOK SPOILER ALERT: Most worryingly he is right when he is the Cop of the Apocalypse, the Pale is expanding and consuming the world, no one knows how to stop it. Furthermore, Revachol will be the first to go, not to the Pale, but to exactly what the City herself warned it would: this city will be Nuked approximately 20 years after the events of this game. Why is unknown. Whether Harry, attuned to the future through the Pale and thus forewarned, could have prevented it somehow, is something only the original creators could have told us.
I always wondered if Harry had gone off to spend some time with the pale in the church after crashing his car, the footprints lead north at least, and maybe that's part of why he is able to do what he does.
@@Femroe Even if he didn't do that at the time, he has a memory of doing a raid on, if not that church, a very similar church shortly before the beginning of the case. Either way that could have left him exposed to the Pale and given that the Whirling is right across from the Doomed Commercial Area and he crashed near the church, he was in subtly Pale active areas multiple times in the lead up to his total breakdown, all while being Pale sensitive (and having plenty of problems of his own).
Some have speculated that his very abilities are what is causing the trauma of him and Dora's relationship ending to extend so long. That it's not simply Harry not knowing how to let go, but that his abilities keep summoning the memory of her leaving; in which he experiences all the pain of it all over again as if it happened only yesterday, which is why Harry is struggling to really heal from it, because the wound keeps getting ripped open again as he relives that memory again and again.
Encyclopedia [Medium: Success] - _Sacred_ and Terrible Air
Where in the book does it say hardcore pushes the pale back? Been trying to find it
@@Sugbaable It's implied, when Ziggy and his imaginative 'friend' Ignus Nilsen talk about the pale and when Nilsen argues with Ziggy about communism and Nilsen screams about the beauty, positivity and optimism and ideas of communism the pale recedes heavily around them for a moment.
Some existential angst right there
My favorite line "Egg Heads waves his hand up in the air, waiting for the beat to drop".
Faith contains existential abyss
Externally coherent!
Also super hardcore to the mega.
Faith in greater power, if not than faith in your fellow man.
You know you're in some real shit, when egg head is the one saying it's " *too* hardcore"
MAXIMUM IS THE ONLY WAY
Thanks for letting us relive this moment
I find this scene hopeful.
If this point of origin of pale (If it really is that) had been contained within a church, that means it is indeed possible to stop it's expansion. And since that is possible, humanity WILL stop the Pale from swallowing reality, and perhaps even reverse it.
I have similiar hope for the heat death of universe, but there is no proof it can be stopped, so I'm a bit less hopeful for our real world than for the Elysium.
I feel that a systemic change towards the hardcore or communism would regress the pale where a localised hope can only keep it at bay.
@@juasjuasi4750
Then again, it were communists who burned down churches that were apparently keeping the local Pale at bay. And communism loses all it's appeal after your family is starving to death or repressed for knowing how to read, I'm afraid.
It was also shown in Sacred and Terrible air that someone sincerely espousing their beliefs in people and communism was capable of visibly receding the pale
In a weird way, it kind of reminds me of Dr. Manhattan’s soliloquy about thermodynamic miracles from Watchmen.
Pale feels like nihilism given form, and when everything feels discovered and all ground has been broken, then it cumulates in the same sort of ennui that Dr. Manhattan and Revachol feel and espouse. And yet, it’s the sheer unpredictable human bond and the collective spirit of true belief that helps fight it and give a truly combative form against that “unstoppable” force of the Pale.
It’s that idea of binding two entirely unlike groups, like Soona and the Anodic Dance crew into one common purpose that provides the greatest “miracle”. In this case, a true viable way to fight the Pale.
thx. so sad i wasnt able to resolve this quest in the game when i was playing
this is beyond fucked up... great lore
Damn i missed so much. I got a happy ending but still feel so bad 😢
4:40
"The night is almost over now
I don't want the day to find out how
We're up agaist it…"
Ive watched half a doz play throughs from as many channels. Never enough. Hadnt seen this encounter
I... might have arrested them... oops
Lacan’s Real?
Because in the silence, there is nothing but your thoughts. Thoughts manifested in the pale as the wastes of humanity.
you choke on those thoughts,.
Who is the "crab man?"
Tiago, the man who climbs around the rafters in the church. I think it was a perception check I had to make for him to show up
@shelovedesoooo gotcha, thanks man. You never know in Elysuim, I was thinking crazy thoughts lol