Nice work, thanks! What about mounting a powermeter, try to pedal uphill at constant power with and without SS and check the time difference over the same distance?
mohinda yes good idea. We definitely considered using a power meter but it’s quite difficult to maintain a constant power output off-road on a climb. One to try in the future though.
Good review guys. I have last years Strive. I think the Shapeshifter is great but as a in between stages mode change. The efficiency difference is massive for climbing. Makes a big difference. Just a shame they didn’t keep a 650b option.
Good and interesting test! A thought that comes to mind when looking at the Strive, could this be the bike to rule them all for us that like to own only one bike? I guess many like me usually does trail riding, occasionally runs an enduro race and once in a while take the bike to a DH bike park. With the climb switch set in trail mode, is the bike a competent trail bike or should we just see it as a better climber than other enduro bikes? It would be interesting to see a comparison between a Spectral for example and a Strive set in trail mode out on a trail.
What about the travel-adjust forks? After having many TALAS back on the 26” era I tried the fIs position Pike and got back to a dual position Pike instead. The position becomes much better for climbing or sprints and the angles change with 1° on the HA and about the same at the effective seat angle (harder to measure the effective SA). The difference on feel on the forks is at least for me impossible to notice...
Le Germain yes travel adjust forks had their benefits but never performed as well as fixed travel forks when descending. They also lower the BB height when actually you want to raise it ideally.
Could you comment on what I'm actually accomplishing by maxing-out my "compression" (RS Revelation)? Is it anything like what the Canyon is doing? What percentage (if any) of this effect could a rider achieve if both front and rear suspension had "climb" options? Your efforts are appreciated!!!
John Davis adding compression damping will help prevent the fork from bobbing up and down while pedalling. This will prop the front end of the bike up somewhat, when actually you want the rear to ride higher relative to the front end on climbs. A climb mode on the shock usually firms the low speed compression damping so the suspension remains more stable. Canyon’s system doesn’t change the damping at all - it changes the geometry, the leverage on the shock and the influence of the drivetrain on the suspension.
Thanks so much for a clear and concise answer... It's a rare and wonderful thing! ;) I'm thinking MBR might need some representation on my local trails so I'm off to your shop as a kind of a "thank you". Oh... do you sell the MBR products that I see you wearing?!?!
Another issue is that it's just more air seals in there so that's friction where it's definitely not wanted and more stuff to go wrong, I had a travel adjust (DPA-Dual Position Air) Lyric and somehow the air shaft got scratched so it was sinking through the travel, turned out to be way more expensive and way more technical to fix than if I had a a regular fixed travel fork where I don't think the issue would have developed in the first place.
Would locking out the rear shock on any other bike would have the same effect on the climb? Like do the test on any enduro bike with the shock locked and unlocked
zeus dreadbeard No, locking the shock does nothing similar to the shapeshifter. SS changes the geometry - raises BB height, steepens seat tube angle an head angle - and changes the suspension kinematics. Locking the shock just locks the shock that’s all.
@@tamasvarga67 i know. But in terms onthe short climb. Id like to see a test without the geo change and just locking out the shock. Ive a feeling 150m of travel locked out is faster than shapeshifting...?
@@zeusdreadbeard8990 To change betwween XC and DH mode with the handlebar remote is exactly the same time as locking out the shock with a handlebar remote.
This is very cool, but with no LBS network, I’d be a little worried about after sales support. The UK weather always tests the most durable of components, and this is something else to go wrong. Still very cool and innovative 👍
weird shot of him explaining the technical details and the other guy just nodding. I think them looking into the camera would've been slightly less awkward. Still flipping great video thought, loved it.
Could this bike be the "one for everything" Instead of a trail bike? How does being a Enduro bike translates when using the shapeshifter on flow trails and long pedaling days? Does it compare/compete with Trail bikes or is just a sturdy Enduro that pedals better?
We haven't done any timed runs with the 2020 Enduro yet, sorry. But look out for a full test of the new Enduro in a video dropping in the next few days.
Ummmm no like maybe for some people but a one second difference one and a half second difference is inconclusive but for the second test it actually helped... don’t know it’s 2 am
Want to discuss how you were both equally fast on a smaller bike on what appears to be a gnarly downhill for several minutes? Does the full enduro rig only serve to save a rider from mistakes? That's how I feel about my bikes atm.
Cory Davis between the two of us our best times were quite different for the downhill. Using the Shapeshifter gained around half a second, but we actually only activated it for less than ten seconds during the flat fire road at the midway point. That was such a straight forward section it’s no surprise that we both did it in near identical times.
Most probably just a placebo effect. When they know they are in the XC mode they probably sprint more aggressively. Best shapeshifter is losing that belly.
JbLee in DH every Strive comes with the Shapeshifter. The only time we used the XC mode on the downhill was on the flat fire road. Hope that clears it up.
Cool that you tested it but I have to say I am very skeptical because of all the other reviews that said it pedals just fine and the shapeshifter is an unnecessary gimmick. Also the "in partnership with Canyon" at the beginning makes me a little dubious.
Billy Burn VanDusen hi Billy, we can totally understand that. We did record all of Danny’s runs on Strava and with a Go Pro - you can check out the climb times on Strava - we’ll dig out the segment name. We’d be happy to post the full Go Pro runs too if people wanted to check them out 👍
Matthew Plummer very similar idea to Scott but different method. Scott shuts off chamber in shock making it so progressive it’s very difficult to get full travel and it increases low speed compression damping.
this test shows, that shapshifter might works. And also it shows that 170/150 suspension is probably not needed for this dh trail xD Maybe Neuron cf is much better?
The old one was crap, extra weight and it wouldn't even go on easily. Heavy pos, often problems and warranty was slow. Useless. New one idk, but probably useless.
Jesus man how many commercials are you going to put in your video? Not only that but every single one was a set of 2 commercials where you can't skip the first one. No offense, I've turned off my adblocker to help channels, but don't push me away by putting in 25 commercials.
Tomi Saaranen hi Tomi, we can understand that. As posted on another comment we have the Strava records and every run Danny did on Go Pro and happy to upload them. 👍
@@MBRmagazine Oh yeah. And I do believe it makes a difference, I'm also a huge fan of Canyon! But all the positive things you listed about it unfortunately made it sound like a... Well paid promotion. And great video
so what i take from this test is modern geometry gains you not much or nothing for decending, but makes pedalling or climbing much more crappy. in other words, bike manufacturers are making bikes shitter with modern geometry.
We didn't ride the downhill in the steep/high setting, so not sure how you're coming to the conclusion that modern geometry doesn't gain you anything on the descents. And remember the Shapeshifter changes the travel, leverage and anti-squat as well.
@@MBRmagazine at 3:10. there are times posted with and without shapeshifter for downhill for both riders. the difference in times are very small or negligible.
Try riding down a steep track on a 2004 stumpjumper then a 2021 stumpjumper with the same quality suspension and try to say that the new geometry is shittier. I'll wait.
Nice work, thanks! What about mounting a powermeter, try to pedal uphill at constant power with and without SS and check the time difference over the same distance?
mohinda yes good idea. We definitely considered using a power meter but it’s quite difficult to maintain a constant power output off-road on a climb. One to try in the future though.
@@MBRmagazine but average output is measurable
Good review guys. I have last years Strive. I think the Shapeshifter is great but as a in between stages mode change. The efficiency difference is massive for climbing. Makes a big difference. Just a shame they didn’t keep a 650b option.
Simon Taylor do you ever take it to Bike park?
Well done dudes.
Good and interesting test! A thought that comes to mind when looking at the Strive, could this be the bike to rule them all for us that like to own only one bike? I guess many like me usually does trail riding, occasionally runs an enduro race and once in a while take the bike to a DH bike park. With the climb switch set in trail mode, is the bike a competent trail bike or should we just see it as a better climber than other enduro bikes? It would be interesting to see a comparison between a Spectral for example and a Strive set in trail mode out on a trail.
Things I didn't even know I needed
Great video, very informative banter. Glad you did it because I was considering this bike. 👍🏽
Was thinking of getting of the strive cf8 or this Mm
very nice test :) good work ps. i still waiting on swoop 29 review
Peter Marek hi Peter, not sure when the Radon will be reviewed but appreciate your patience!
Cool video wish I could have that bike
Great review and now I’m on a strive 🤙🏼
Nathan Libot do you ever take it to the bike park?
Test the Bionicon system! It changes geometry much more. Would be interesting.
But it is about 1Kg more than a comparable bike. Is the Shapeshifter compensating the additional wight???!
It’s 1kg get a fucking grip
the problem with Canyon bikes is that in 2022 there are no parts to repair my bike, parts that have fallen on the same ride, i miss my santa cruz bike
Can you tell us the size of frame used and rider heights, cheers and great video btw.
Kenneth Mullen hi Kenneth, Danny is 5ft10in riding a large and James is 6ft on the XL. Cheers
Mountain Bike Rider 6’1” actually😉
James Bracey every little bit helps!
What about the travel-adjust forks? After having many TALAS back on the 26” era I tried the fIs position Pike and got back to a dual position Pike instead. The position becomes much better for climbing or sprints and the angles change with 1° on the HA and about the same at the effective seat angle (harder to measure the effective SA). The difference on feel on the forks is at least for me impossible to notice...
Le Germain yes travel adjust forks had their benefits but never performed as well as fixed travel forks when descending. They also lower the BB height when actually you want to raise it ideally.
Could you comment on what I'm actually accomplishing by maxing-out my "compression" (RS Revelation)? Is it anything like what the Canyon is doing? What percentage (if any) of this effect could a rider achieve if both front and rear suspension had "climb" options? Your efforts are appreciated!!!
John Davis adding compression damping will help prevent the fork from bobbing up and down while pedalling. This will prop the front end of the bike up somewhat, when actually you want the rear to ride higher relative to the front end on climbs. A climb mode on the shock usually firms the low speed compression damping so the suspension remains more stable. Canyon’s system doesn’t change the damping at all - it changes the geometry, the leverage on the shock and the influence of the drivetrain on the suspension.
Thanks so much for a clear and concise answer... It's a rare and wonderful thing! ;)
I'm thinking MBR might need some representation on my local trails so I'm off to your shop as a kind of a "thank you".
Oh... do you sell the MBR products that I see you wearing?!?!
Another issue is that it's just more air seals in there so that's friction where it's definitely not wanted and more stuff to go wrong, I had a travel adjust (DPA-Dual Position Air) Lyric and somehow the air shaft got scratched so it was sinking through the travel, turned out to be way more expensive and way more technical to fix than if I had a a regular fixed travel fork where I don't think the issue would have developed in the first place.
Does anyone know how much the whole bike is in the model they used with the parts
Can be used for technical XC race or marathon XC race , compared to Canyon Lux ??
Somebody able to answer this? Or even compared to a spectral
Would locking out the rear shock on any other bike would have the same effect on the climb? Like do the test on any enduro bike with the shock locked and unlocked
You could also lock the shock out with the shape shifter in xc mode and be more efficient
zeus dreadbeard No, locking the shock does nothing similar to the shapeshifter. SS changes the geometry - raises BB height, steepens seat tube angle an head angle - and changes the suspension kinematics. Locking the shock just locks the shock that’s all.
@@tamasvarga67 i know. But in terms onthe short climb. Id like to see a test without the geo change and just locking out the shock. Ive a feeling 150m of travel locked out is faster than shapeshifting...?
@@zeusdreadbeard8990 To change betwween XC and DH mode with the handlebar remote is exactly the same time as locking out the shock with a handlebar remote.
@@tamasvarga67 apart from the additional weight, additional cost, and additional maintenence?
Teinloc vs Shapeshifter would be an awesome video
The Shapeshifter on my Strive had to be replaced 4 times in 6 months. Just more to go wrong. Sold my Strive shortly after.
The 2018 strive?
New one or old one ?
This is very cool, but with no LBS network, I’d be a little worried about after sales support. The UK weather always tests the most durable of components, and this is something else to go wrong. Still very cool and innovative 👍
Jim 86 UK has Canyon service center so it’s not really an issue and the SS doesn’t require more attention than your shock... it requires less.
Strive shapeshifter with a MRP ramp control sounds even more interesting
Nice bike
weird shot of him explaining the technical details and the other guy just nodding. I think them looking into the camera would've been slightly less awkward. Still flipping great video thought, loved it.
Could this bike be the "one for everything" Instead of a trail bike? How does being a Enduro bike translates when using the shapeshifter on flow trails and long pedaling days? Does it compare/compete with Trail bikes or is just a sturdy Enduro that pedals better?
I was ur 150k sub 🔥
Can't U tell me, which better for Decending, Strive, Megatower or SPC Enduro 2020 ?
Have a look at our video ‘which is the fastest enduro bike?’ In it we do timed runs on the Strive and Megatower.
@@MBRmagazine ya..but I mean the Specialized Enduro 29 2020 bike, how fast between Strive & Megatower
We haven't done any timed runs with the 2020 Enduro yet, sorry. But look out for a full test of the new Enduro in a video dropping in the next few days.
Ummmm no like maybe for some people but a one second difference one and a half second difference is inconclusive but for the second test it actually helped... don’t know it’s 2 am
Do the jeffsy pro race
Peyton B Jeffsy 29 test is incoming very shortly.
Want to discuss how you were both equally fast on a smaller bike on what appears to be a gnarly downhill for several minutes? Does the full enduro rig only serve to save a rider from mistakes? That's how I feel about my bikes atm.
Cory Davis between the two of us our best times were quite different for the downhill. Using the Shapeshifter gained around half a second, but we actually only activated it for less than ten seconds during the flat fire road at the midway point. That was such a straight forward section it’s no surprise that we both did it in near identical times.
@@MBRmagazine Ah, I was thinking you had attempted the entire thing with shapeshifter on as well.
15 millilitres?
Most probably just a placebo effect. When they know they are in the XC mode they probably sprint more aggressively. Best shapeshifter is losing that belly.
Perhaps, but we used XC mode for the second run, when we were a lot more tired.
nice review guys btw the dude on the right takes care of urself r u having a cold？
So when you say w/o SS on DH mode/downhill, the bike's geo is steeper and high bb? And vice versa on XC mode/uphill w/o the SS?
JbLee in DH every Strive comes with the Shapeshifter. The only time we used the XC mode on the downhill was on the flat fire road. Hope that clears it up.
Cool that you tested it but I have to say I am very skeptical because of all the other reviews that said it pedals just fine and the shapeshifter is an unnecessary gimmick. Also the "in partnership with Canyon" at the beginning makes me a little dubious.
Billy Burn VanDusen hi Billy, we can totally understand that. We did record all of Danny’s runs on Strava and with a Go Pro - you can check out the climb times on Strava - we’ll dig out the segment name. We’d be happy to post the full Go Pro runs too if people wanted to check them out 👍
Billy Burn VanDusen segment is ‘climb to first fireroad’ near Edge End, UK.
those are nice
Sounds like what Scott are doing.
Matthew Plummer very similar idea to Scott but different method. Scott shuts off chamber in shock making it so progressive it’s very difficult to get full travel and it increases low speed compression damping.
That second you are talking about is nonsense for enduro race. It's really about fatigue.
They used the shapeshifter afterwards so they were more fatigued
@@harrystephenson5446 that's right
roi k. Agreed, fatigue is super important, that’s what we said in the summing up.
this test shows, that shapshifter might works. And also it shows that 170/150 suspension is probably not needed for this dh trail xD Maybe Neuron cf is much better?
The old one was crap, extra weight and it wouldn't even go on easily. Heavy pos, often problems and warranty was slow. Useless. New one idk, but probably useless.
Jesus man how many commercials are you going to put in your video? Not only that but every single one was a set of 2 commercials where you can't skip the first one. No offense, I've turned off my adblocker to help channels, but don't push me away by putting in 25 commercials.
Please give me one mountain bike gift bro
Only one that worked was kona magic link.
Are you OK? Have you taken a bump to the head recently?
@@MBRmagazine i still have mine and it works. When was the last time you had a go on one?
Probably 2007 or 8. If you like your bike and enjoy riding it, then that's all that matters at the end of the day. 👍
But I don't think you can be completely honest, because this is a paid promotion?
Tomi Saaranen hi Tomi, we can understand that. As posted on another comment we have the Strava records and every run Danny did on Go Pro and happy to upload them. 👍
@@MBRmagazine Oh yeah. And I do believe it makes a difference, I'm also a huge fan of Canyon! But all the positive things you listed about it unfortunately made it sound like a... Well paid promotion. And great video
so what i take from this test is modern geometry gains you not much or nothing for decending, but makes pedalling or climbing much more crappy. in other words, bike manufacturers are making bikes shitter with modern geometry.
We didn't ride the downhill in the steep/high setting, so not sure how you're coming to the conclusion that modern geometry doesn't gain you anything on the descents. And remember the Shapeshifter changes the travel, leverage and anti-squat as well.
@@MBRmagazine at 3:10. there are times posted with and without shapeshifter for downhill for both riders. the difference in times are very small or negligible.
On the DH runs we only used the Shapeshifter (XC mode) for the fireroad sprint, not the whole descent. Hope that clears it up.
@@MBRmagazine oh riiiiight. thanks for clearig that up.
Try riding down a steep track on a 2004 stumpjumper then a 2021 stumpjumper with the same quality suspension and try to say that the new geometry is shittier. I'll wait.