This really is the truest statement.. ever since I got out on my own and got married.. aka paid my own bills.. I gained a ton of common sense! the kids should be alright as long as everything isn’t handed to them and they don’t have the parents take care of their problems.. I’m hopefulish anyway..😂
A delay / freeze response in calling is believable. A 7-8 hour delay? PLUS you don’t call 911 you first call friends AND the friends come over to your house first? Literally wtf.
Thats not what happened. Unfortunately the news keeps telling that story but she was on the phone with 911 and ran out of the house and passed out on the front lawn. Ethan is a triplet and the other surviving room mate knew the other one was calling 911 so she called Ethan's brother. Not friends, she called the victims brother because he also goes to the same school.
If she had been consuming alcohol earlier, she may have simply passed out or gone to sleep. Was she frozen in fear? Who knows? Perhaps she could be hypnotized and taken back to that moment in time for further validation of her experience.
@@stewpot6998 even his Reddit post was more about how the offender felt during, before, after…. He wasn’t so much interested in getting away or attempting the perfect crime as he was in what he would feel once he had committed the crime. How the crime would make him feel. It almost seems like his actions going back to the crime scene, driving across country, changing the tags on the car, cleaning it with fined tooth comb, was an afterthought. Once he come down from the high, of what it made him feel like, he realized he had a gigantic mess on his hands.
do you guys think he ever thought about dealth penalty or this may be a shock for him? I'm confused. Does he want the attention? Did he want to get caught? Or he genuinely thought he could get away with murder?
@@edum.6353 I really think it was about needing to understand what it felt like. He was so completely enthralled with the criminal aspect, their mindset, it was hard for him to look past other details that he probably knew he should have. I think he was only looking to kill one person, but the dog, the girls being in the same room, Ethan and Xana, it all went awry. I can understand the allure of needing to understand what criminals feel like, and I’m sure others can too, but I don’t see us crossing the line like BK did, because most everyone aren’t psychopaths or sociopaths. Most of us are okay just speculating.
I had no idea they ordered door dash at 4 am and supposedly he struck within moments of that??? And the roommate saw him and went to bed?? Nothing in this makes sense. I felt fairly certain he did it the way they said. Now it all feels like total bs.
I am remembering when my daughter was in college and she roomed with 3 other young ladies in off campus apartments. She was sorta shy so she stayed to herself. She was not big friends with the other three young ladies who would have our parties, have people in and out etc.. However, the rent was split 4 ways and the place was really nice and spacious and she had a large corner room with her own private bath and this was appealing to her. I'm saying this, to state that maybe the roommate who peered out the door and glanced at the guy clad in black, probably may have thought that he was another random just visiting and she didn't want to make a scene and call out the other 4 for having any person just walking through their shared space! The other two girls may not have been as close as the Utah 4 were to each other. So in her head, she will deal with it later in the day. She goes to sleep and does not wake until later mid day where she actually finds people murdered and then when questioned tells police what she saw and now it's on another level... Just my thoughts!
This long response doesn’t make any sense. SHE OPENED DOOR 3 TIMES!!!!! AND SHE HEARD EVERYTHING!!!!!!! And anybody will be aware of situation and SAW A GUY walk right pass her. She was AWARE of things going on. No matter how much anybody try to sugar coat it, it is strange and abnormal. Because of her abnormal reaction, her witnessing guy in black is doubtful.
NOTHING about this whole story makes sense, not just the crime scene. Something smells extremely fishy and doesn't add up after reading the affidavit, more red flags, sounds shady.
@@joelhague5515 More like out of a Hollywood action crime movie, all scripted and all the evidence lined up pointing straight to him. Was the crime scene, the house prepared for clean up just hours before announcing they got the suspect?.The dramatic of transporting the suspect, airplane, departure and landing with the entire national, International news outlets out there, all cameras lights up...What a show! Just my thought.
IMO, I cannot see anyway that knife sheath fell off his belt. It's looped into the belt. He would have to take his belt loose and purposely remove the sheath. I believe he walked into the house with the knife in the sheath and just in his hand, not on his belt. So the first time he used it the sheath has to come off and he just dropped it on the bed and then forgot about it. Assuming this is true, that means Kaylee and Maddie were attacked first. As with Bryan and Dylan. IMO, Bryan did not see Dylan. Many reasons why. She could have been in her room with the door cracked open. IMO, if Bryan did see Dylan she would have been victim 5. I thank God it's a miracle she survived. And now she is an eyewitness to the attack, in the moment that the defense cannot overcome. This girl is the key evidence in this case.
It doesn't have anything to do with "not seeing her" He went into the house not knowing how many are in and who lives in which room. (except the upstairs girls maybe). If he walks the kitchen bedroom near the stairs and the door is blacked out semi open. why wouldn't he look there to make sure?? that makes no sense especially when he came back down he would seen the door is now "closed"
Im sure even with what the surviving roommate saw and heard it never computed in her head in any way that her roommates had just been slaughtered. It was past 4 a.m. She locked her door. Probably listened for any other noises or someone trying to get in her room and didnt hear anything else and went to sleep. Sleeping till the afternoon because she didnt go to bed until 4:30-5 am. I absolutely know that all her friends being murdered wasnt ever a thought in her mind even if she seen a guy. Its cold in Idaho this time of year. I bet theres pranking going on around campus with these kids all the time. My point is, never in a million years would she have thought that 4 of her friends, 3 roommates were being slaughtered. I hope she is able to heal from this trauma.
Absolutely! They'd had the cops there a few times recently for noise complaints and since after the creepy guy who had her frozen in fear left she locked herself in and was not about to go out into the house. That house had people coming in and out and was basically a sorority house. Lots of shenanigans all hours of the day and night. There were no blood curdling screams. A little noise from the dog upstairs, probably very normal. Someone crying for a very short time and then quiet. But there wasn't enough loud alarming sounds for her to think there was a massacre! Poor Dylan! RIP to all the victims and their families 💔
Right before they released the arrest affidavit , I read a quote from whom I thought was police saying the roommate said it looked like his black turtle neck shirt had been pulled up over his mouth and nose as if he’d come in from the cold outside so the covering of the mouth and nose seemed normal . At least that makes sense . I remember the commentator then answering Oh the old turtleneck trick , I guess meaning Ted Bundy always wearing turtlenecks . I assumed that info would be in the affidavit but it wasn’t ? The whole roommate thing is so bizarre though , - in the middle of the night she’s woken up and nosey worried enough to get up and open the door THREE times but then just goes back to bed ? I do think what she thought was Kaylee playing with the dog upstairs noise and Xana crying were unconnected , it’ll probably make more sense what she was thinking when she testifies , if it goes to trial .
@spacecalander totally agree. I also think her testimony won't hold up in court...she stated it was dark, a masked face, dressed in black and bushy eyebrows, that's not a 100% ID of suspect. Could be anyone else.... I'm not here defending him at all. If he committed the crime, then he will def face the consequences coming his way and all will be well deserved.
It’s a party house, I live in a party house in college rn and i wouldn’t think twice if I saw someone walking around at 4 am because people are always coming and going. So I definitely can see how she didn’t realize till after she woke up
@@Denominator-zc3sethat would make sense if she didn’t state how terrified she was after opening and closing the door 3-times and admitting to hearing crying and chaos. The story doesn’t add up no matter how you cut it.
You're arguing against yourself. It's people without 'book smart' intelligence that think they know better than the experts. Uneducated people argue with professionals all the time.
I guess he used up all drugs on victims and was exhausted by using a knife to kill four people. If he had attacked the fifth victim, he would've been caught at the scene.
How could he not see her if she was close enough to able to give an accurate description of his eyebrows. The affidavit says he was walking right in her direction so she was definitely within his field of vision
Yep 'shrooms and/or plethora of mind alterers readily available in Idaho let alone a college town - DoorDash delivery is just crazy - there's way more to this - party house, guy comes out of the house with one of the victims during the day with a zip tie on his wrist while LE investigates a noise complaint ? Killer a scorned boy toy?
And that's why she is a terrible witness. People saying she is a good witness and key to the case lmao.. yes such a good witness she heard no screaming or anything serious enough to make her call the police in that moment, but we are going to trust her recollection of some guy she thought she saw in the dark..
I'm thrilled that she made that statement about "'book smart people' lacking common sense" because I've been saying that all along. I think he's not very bright at all but apparently can memorize for his learning.
i've been always saying he's an intelligent idiot. i just can't see a person planning this for so long, but then making all these silly blunders. it makes me think he wanted to be caught, because that level of dumbness, i can't comprehend it.
@@kimberlylewis5165 Mortensen said that she heard crying again later and opened her door for the third time, investigators said in the document. When she looked out, Mortensen told police that she "saw a figure clad in black clothing and a mask that covered the person's mouth and nose walking towards her." She described the person as a man, standing at either 5 feet 10 inches or taller, who was "not very muscular, but athletically built with bushy eyebrows." The roommate told police that the man walked past her while she stood at her bedroom doorway "in a 'frozen shock phase,'" and proceeded to exit the home through a sliding glass door at the back entrance. Mortensen told police that she locked herself inside of her room after seeing the masked individual. She must have got a very good look because the way she described him and his body build. How do you notice that much detail in the dark?
DM frozen in great fear but didn't check on her roommates or call police after a masked killer leaves the home? Went to sleep, woke up and called friends to come over? This is very sketchy. No matter what the circumstances.
@@barbarahudson2573 she was froze in fear she knew something was wrong she could have texted the roommates from her locked room or call the cops not 8 hours later
It’s explainable… Remember when Elizabeth smart was kidnapped her sister saw it happen and she was so scared she closed her eyes and stayed in bed.. fell asleep until the next morning when her parents woke her up. We are looking at this in hindsight… in a party house with multiple roommates she may have had an overwhelming feeling of fear or something not being right but might have talked herself out of it by explaining things… at least a couple girls in the home were single at the time so maybe she thought it could be a friend or late night hookup… hearing crying she prob thought her roomie had gotten into a drunken argument with her BF… she thought she heard Kaylee playing with the dog… I mean honestly people need to lighten up on this poor girl. The amount of guilt and survivors remorse she feels must be extraordinary. The last thing she needs or her friends would want is random people blaming her and attacking her online.
@@barbarahudson2573 right which makes it weird that she froze for that long. If she saw the bodies and then froze for 8 hours i can understand that more
Anyone ask themselves how one man allegedly could stab four people to death with the only witness hearing, what she thought, was one victim playing with the dog? Just a thought
This occur in Idaho and not one of these girls' daddy didn't provide them with a weapon loaded with hollow points ? C'mon I go to the post office, grocery store and see little old guys packin' like they're right outta fucking Dragnet, smh
Anybody that has never been jumped, shot at, robbed and kidnapped including hunted which has happened to me do not know what they would do in any of those situations like mine. When I was being chased after I escaped a kidnapping I ran and hid in the front of a friend's house and didn't leave until his parents came home because no one was there. I either just turned eighteen or was about to. I was scared to death because they were searching and driving around for me.
Ummmm cell phone! Did you have a cell phone on you! Cause she did! Did you go to sleep while you were hiding!? Cause she did! Your defending the fact that girl waited 8 more hours to call the police? One of those kids could have been clinging to life still. Its just crazy im sorry. She obviously knew someone could be hurt or something! Theres no excuse for that im sorry.
None of those things you mentioned happened to her. So far all we know is she heard noises and saw a guy she didn’t know walking out of her apartment. Hopefully we get the full story so that it makes sense.
I don’t doubt being in shock, but not too act is the real worry. The dog must have been going crazy? Originally the 2 other house mates slept through it & now it’s been released that she can describe him
I don't think she was and I don't think that's what she's going to say. I think she blew it off because of her being used to seeing people in there while she was drunk on top of it. Anyone, even someone you know, would scare the crap out of you if you opened a door and they were waking at you immediately in the dark. We'll see
It'll be interesting to see if there's more DNA in the house besides the knife sheath. Killing 4 people In 16 minutes he had to have worked up a sweat or left some blood behind himself. Plus the car is a whole other ball game, no way he was able to purge all the DNA from the car
He could have done it in 16 mins. Kaylee and Maddie were both asleep. Xana was awake because she was ordering food which is why her and Ethan had defensive wounds.
@@itzhexen0 He did. Less. And considering two were in bed together and small girls, he definitely could. That probably took a few mins. He brutally stabbed them. Then he went into the others rooms, areas. One was awake. Probably took one out, maybe one ran at him and he ran right into the blade in his chest. Then he takes out another girl. That knife was big. I've seen a big guy die from a small knife and by a small dude, in mins. One stab to the heart. Started wheezing and then died on the spot. If you stab people with a large knife in the right area its over almost immediately. Now I agree it was fast, but I think that's why he left the sheath. I think be went all out, but wasn't being smart, which makes sense. Hard to be perfect when moving that quickly. He was also sober, 28 years old in his physical prime, used to box which I'm sure helped when swinging that knife, and caught a bunch of 20 year old drunk girls at 4am and one guys. I mean all the time lines up. The girl was on TikTok, then the friend heard her a few mins earlier, then she's crying, then silence. All within 5 mins. She's already gone probably and he's moving on. It adds up. It's just crazy how fast he did it I agree
It's chilling how calm he seems considering all the details we know now and that in fact, he seems to be the one who has committed these horrendous crimes!
Wonder if he was ever hx of aspergers abuse head trauma. Hes indeed got a flat affect. Guilty angered ie hurt fear frustration about his countenance. Hes shocked he got caught. Its insulting that hes being called intelligent, when he lacks both common sense and wisdom. Not to mention his lack of sympathy and empathy. Praying for everyone. Praying he repents and confesses. Praying he gets visited by angels, and gets to truly know the Lord.
Didn't the police say originally that there was a large amount of water used . More then normal. Thaught he washed up or took a shower? If he was in and out in 15 min and there was all that water used , who used it? Alot of weird stuff going on with this case.
What I wanna know is why the neighbor said the FRONT door (on the first floor) was WIDE open that day and that he noticed it around 8.30 am and that it stayed open.
How do we know DM believed something bad enough to call the police had happened? We're analyzing with full knowledge of the murders. She didn't have that. Did she think "there's someone here" represented a threat, given the amount of outside traffic regularly reportedly at the residence? With the male voice, did she think one of the other women had a male visitor and it wasn't her business? It could have been embarassing to intervene or go to a friends' room to check if it looked like she had a secret relationship going on. I'm guessing the house was dark since everyone was in their rooms for the night, and Kohberger would have turned out any lights. Nothing unusual about locking your door before going to sleep. It seems most likely he did not see DM, but she saw him by the ambient outside light coming in through the windows. Interestingly, the affadavit says nothing about her hearing the "distorted audio" or the dog barking that was picked up by a neighbor's security camera. Don't overlook her description of being in a "frozen shock phase" not necessarily describing her being in fear. It could merely describe the manner in which she stood so as not to draw attention to herself. Additionally, any expression of fear in the affadavit is a description AFTER she knows the four have been savagely murdered. She now knows how close she came to being a victim and it's impossible for that to not influence her description.. Were it possible to go back in time and observe the incident itself and ask her how she felt at the time, it might not exactly match the affadavit. Also, with people coming in at 2:00 a.m. and still being active at 4:00 a.m., once they go to sleep, I wouldn't expect anyone to be up until noon. If, for whatever reason, DM did not interpret the events she described as something to call the police about and, instead, went to sleep, is it all that strange that she didn't discover what had happened until later the next morning?
I agree. I lived in a six-person unit with 3 bedrooms when I was in college. If I had seen a random dude walking by me in the middle of the night, I would have thought, hmm, who’s that…but that would NOT have prompted me to call 911 because it’s normal in a co-ed college environment to constantly have people going in and out of a place. Some random guy walking past you in the house would not have led this girl to conclude “oh, that must mean that some of my housemates have been stabbed to death by this person”. This is a house that supposedly had parties while none of the residents of the house were even present - so random foot traffic was obviously the standard there.
Exactly, a few times I have been in bed and terrified by noises I couldn't make sense of, then I try and dialogue myself out of my fear and eventually fall asleep. People react like she should have known. As if!
Not strange at all. Tack on possible terror, possible intoxication, and living in a party house and it’s better to not judge anything as absolute until all of the facts are known. The locking of the door seems unnecessary to me if they all had those coded locks on their doors. All she’d have had to do is shut the door, right?
You don't know that's what really happened. It's very likely that the timeline provided to the public in the beginning was a white lie to protect her from being targeted as a witness and to avoid spooking the perpetrator into fleeing the country by revealing that someone saw him clearly, along with other withheld evidence that would have made him realise he could be traced. That would also explain the initial claim that everyone in the house was asleep, which was obviously a lie now.
Until 30, I slept with the door unlocked. I didn't care, and had zero confidence anyone would break in. Teach your kids to lock their doors and have an available weapon. If you don't like guns, at least have a bat or large knife within 3 seconds reach. This world is full of crazies on prescription meds
That roommate made a really bad mistake. If she was fearing for her life, she'd call the police. Yeah, maybe she was in shock. But for EIGHT HOURS?????
THANK YOU!! idk why they keep making excuses babying her, taking about 'maybe she passed out"??... she's a grown adult college student.. even 5 year olds that have seen their families slaughtered call 911 or go for help to their neighbors...But really I'd have to learn more about any ties they had with the suspect cuz something isn't sounding right
I Agree! Panic, yes, shock, yes, fear absolutely.......for 8 hrs, not likely. At some point, survival instincts set in, I don't care who you are. If she had her cell phone with her, as most young people do, what is it to dial 911, text your roommates, call your parents, neighbors, Door Dash for god sake! She had the presence of mind to close and lock her door though......so, why not pick up the cell and call or text someone?? I'm so dumbfounded by this, I don't mean to sound cruel, but come on 🤦♀
@holdingplace DM's own words were that she "was frozen with fear." If it was just some random guy leaving her roommate, she wouldn't have had that reaction. You can't have it both ways, it doesn't add up
@@KaleidoscopicPalindromehow did she know what he did? She just saw him, not him killing her roommates . She didn’t have a clue what he had done when she saw him.
I had a neighber who turned out to be a mass killer of young boys in the 70s and 80s he told his sister he killed them so they would not have to live in this terrible world.That he was saving them doing them a favor.Mental illness rarely makes sense to most people and WHY they do things Rarely is a good reason.
I’m pondering as to WHY would the roommate be so traumatized by seeing the person dressed in black with the mask on walking past her be in great fear if she , at that time, know nothing about her roommates being murdered…. So why be traumatized to the point she passes out. No call the police until 12:00 noon! If she knew there was an intruder, CALL THE POLICE AND SAY “THERE IS A MASKED INTRUDER IN THE HOUSE!!!!!!!” This is fishy.
Exactly! You can't have it both ways. She can't be aware of the danger in one scenario (to explain her passing out/hiding) but then not call for help until noon and only report someone passed out.
Clearly Dylan had no idea that her roommates were murdered. She was ‘in shock’ that some rando was walking around her house with a mask on at that ungodly hour but it sounds like she chalked it up to (again) a random dude walking around and not a mass murdering psychopath. It would be scary seeing that but many minds wouldn’t automatically go to deaths door (literally). She probably freaked out and then laid down and passed out, slept in, woke up and realized clearly late in the day (bc she was most likely inebriated) what happened.
Not believable. Allegedly strangers would be walking around the dark house at 4 am. She makes no sense. The defence team will tear her apart for these stupidity statements.
I think these college students need some street knowledge. I cant imagine a stalker around 12 times and no one noticing! I am 56 and still look out my windows to see wth is going on outside . I used to be a stripper for 30 yrs so yeah I know stalking. I have been on serial killer kill lists and followed home ect. Alcohol can leave your guard down but if you are a good looking female you better be watching your surroundings at all times! These girls just seemed completely oblivious you know this guy most likely was behind their house parked watching many times how did they not notice? And this social media doesnt help. Yeah let's just tell everyone who our new roommates are ect. Um no! Please kids stop doing this. They look like they are sexualized in their videos,photos. Not good. Makes me sick more needs to be done like teaching classes how not to be a damn victim! And for Gods Sake please put up curtains ! Ugh
Now that I know more I think there is something not right with this whole thing. Think it's a whole different deal not stalking more like drug distribution with way more going on like covering their asses. Including the Town , and dirty cops involved in drug distribution.
That’s what I was thinking saved that girls life, he was panicking and wanted to get out of there because things weren’t going like he expected, like coming across a big strong male in one the girls bedroom, plus two girls in another bedroom, plus the dog, he probably decided ahead of time he needed to get in and out in 5 or 10 minutes, but the extra people had stretched it out to over 15 minutes and in his mind alarm bells were going off so he just ignored the girl poking her head out the door on his way out.
roommate probably intoxicated and since the house was apparently a party spot, saw all kinds of weird stuff while living there. Why 911 wasn't the first call she made is also odd...
@@aulusagerius7127 I don’t think anyone WANTS police at their home, not everything is an elaborate theory: There’s been a lot of body cam footage released of police there for noise complaints so they’ve certainly been there many times before without issue.
I was really questioning Dylan’s delay in calling also..but after more thought, I’m thinking her statement was partially misunderstood by police..or they intentionally wrote it to sound that way. She may not have actually suspected anything other than some drunk frat guy in her house who was up to some prank..old school panty raid or something. If you’ve ever lived in a party house crazy things happen. Perhaps the last thing from her mind was that this guy was a psychotic killer in her house. There’s no mention of any screaming in terror..just whimpering/crying and someone saying “..I’ll help you” . Man I sure hope they give Bryan whatever her fears the most. Somehow I don’t think that’s death penalty- although I want him under the ground asap. I wish they’d give him the electric chair and then revive him, then repeat 3 more times. (Once for each victim)
Great analogy. I think she didn't know what happened. She heard something and saw a guy with a mask. Period. No dead people, no blood, no scream. She didn't know.
Think it was Bryan telling Xana that he’d help her or Ethan telling Xana he’d help her after Bryan left them to bleed to death? I agree with you. It’s kind of a shame these people can’t feel the same suffering that they inflicted
Ikr, she never said anyone was screaming or anything, my guess all along is that she had no idea what had happened and went back to sleep, until sunrise.
Kohberger's right hand has been noticeably swollen in various pictures and video, I wonder if he broke something in that hand during the murders, given that's an incredible amount of force and times 4, and could be why he just walked past the surviving roommate
@@jacksondrake-lost Its not really redness, its swelling, but if he does have some condition that affects his hands that could also explain why he stopped and just left
What's bugging me is when he murdered the victims he would have been drenched in blood the car that he drove was fifty at the stop so there must have been blood in the car and his father was in the car how did he not notice
Since you mentioned that. I was at work one day and an acquaintance broke his nose. He was covered in blood just from a broken nose. He looked like a painter, just from a broken nose. Whoever murdered those four people, would have had an enormous amount of blood on them.
The grangegorman killer observed a woman sleeping, told law enforcement about her headphones and TV type. She slept through his unhumanly viscous attack on her housemates. Anything is possible and we know about 5 percent of the facts. If your having impulses to hurt people please tell the hospital emergency room staff. You will get help before you damage ordinary mams and dads and neighbourhoods. And your own life and freedom, your humanity.
They don't have the wrong person. This is news media generating a new narrative so that you'll pay attention. It's actually a very simple case, even without the DNA he should be convicted. She even mentions it briefly - theres a very tight correlation between his car and phone activity that puts him stalking the location in advance, leaving where he lives in his vehicle about an hour or so before the murders were committed, his phone activity then goes silent during the time-frame of the murders, then magically becomes active after that time-frame, which also correlates with his vehicle reappearing on camera leaving the scene. Insanely, he drives back there around 9 am the next morning and leaves. He did it.
I thought the same thing. Why would LE have the crime scene cleaned just hours before announcing they had a suspect? Is preserving the crime scene a SOP?
People live in, or work in, many if not most homicide scene. People have to get back in there, so it's not unusual for them to only hold such a place for a day or two. But it _is_ unusual to have a murder scene this long.
Yes , it appears someone knew it was wrong and the cops did not listen to their reason that it took a Judges Court Order to stop the police from having the house chemically sanitized which would remove all DNA🥴🤪thats a serious RED FLAG of something fishy.
Thank you, Jennifer Coffindaffer!! I'm so shocked that the public-at-large is so horrific in judging her and they understand nothing about Freeze-response and Shock.
Anyone who has spent time responding to 911 calls will tell you that not calling 911 after seeing a masked intruder exiting your house is in the extremely low percent, but sadly it does happen. Also, if you live in a house full of people, you would most likely want to share that observation with your friends. Five year olds have called 911 while hiding under beds, in closets, the list goes on. The details around why she didn’t call are not yet fully understood, maybe there was a plausible reason. But those plausible reasons are very few.
I think she simply thought it was some bloke they brought back to party and he was wearing a covid mask ( not that unusual) ,that house was known as a bit of a party house with lots of comings and goings so she just assumed it was just another after party young man, what she heard could be put down to drunkenness, a bit of crying and a thud. Maybe she didn't want to call the police to her shared home incase it pissed off the other tennants.The only thing i find strange is why not text her fellow tenants and just say " are you girls ok? I've just seen a guy leave and i heard crying "? She probably didn't want to be a busy body !!
The only reason i could think of that would make sense to me (besides being paralyzed with fear and not wanting to make any sound) is if she did not have her phone in her room with her. She locked herself in her room out of fear when the man was walking towards the door, but he wasn't gone yet when she closed it. Imagine being that afraid, you wouldn't open the door and search for your phone anytime soon, thinking he might still be there. If she did have her phone, it would also have made sense for her to text the others in the house to see if they were okay. Did she not dare leave the room until she heard the other girl coming up from the first floor and is that why it took so long to call for help? The other girl apparently didn't hear anything.
@Queen Of Swords right she was scared enough to go hide and and lock her door but not make sure her roommates she just heard crying were ok and seeing g and unknown person
Im not having it. She should have called 911 as soon as her door was closed. Can you Imagen if that lunatic went on a killing spree what the conversation would be then.
@@KaleidoscopicPalindrome its more than just seeing him, she was disturbed 3 times, she heard voices , his face was covered, he had bushy eyebrows, im still not having it. Respect
Go listen to Nancy Grace earlier….DM stated on affidavit 3x that she was in her bedroom in the basement…then how could she see him upstairs and see his bushy eyebrows. It’s a fact he never made it to the basement since he allegedly did the murders upstairs and left his knife sheath on the second floor
@@trick1838 exactly. If he killed 4 people, he won’t leave her alive. If she saw his eyebrows then he saw her - plus, she was in basement - no way could she see a whole other floor
I don’t mean to bash the FBI agent, but her hypothesis is way off. I think a body language expert can come up with something better than her. Geez. The murderer studies crimes yet leaves so many evidence and killing 4 people at once. He is fully aware that he will get caught. He’s probably thinking why it took so long for them to figure things out. 1. Letting a witness live 2. Leaving a knife sheath 3. Didn’t get rid of his car 4. His demeanor at the court house He wants to be famous and possibly write a book is my hypothesis. As for the surviving roommate… she saw him, said WTF another weirdo friend of my roommates, locked her door, and went to sleep.
I honestly think he didn’t see her. If she only cracked the door open, she could see him but perhaps because of the angle of him coming from Xanas room, he might not have even noticed the door cracked open. He was in a rush and with adrenaline, combined with the angle - I think thank goodness he didn’t see her.
The fact that people are giving these 2 surviving roommates flack is so upsetting. They are kids. This case is getting so much attention because of how shocking it is. How random it is. Yet some people think the 2 roommates should of known everything that happened immediately, and then call 911. The knife used is so brutal that one stab wound is supposedly worse than a gunshot wound. They were probably all killed rather quickly (they were because the timeline says so), and already dead by the time the guy left. DM saw a stranger in a mask walk by. No knife. No blood. It's dark. 2 weeks after they had a Halloween party, so a mask might not immediately tell someone "Hey, I just committed a quadruple murder." Remember all the noise complaint videos? I can assure you that house has seen many random things occur during late night hours. I'm sure after DM locked her door the house returned to being completely quiet. Without any knowledge of what happened, I can understand why a 20 year old female wouldn't immediately go walking around the house to investigate if she was afraid. The house now being completely quiet would want her to assume that was a good thing and everyone is asleep. It was 4:20 AM and her nerves probably kept her awake for a while. Calling 911 just before noon is only 7 1/2 hours later. It's actually not that crazy that the call happened when it did. What is crazy is the random, horrifying act committed by a stalker. A loser who acted alone. There is nothing suspicious about the roommates to imagine anymore! Now it's just criticizing kids who are completely traumatized. Anyone who is still hung up on the roommates needs to get over it, and really think about what they went through.
Great writeup Chris! Wasn't there whimpering and crying that caused DM to open the door a second time that caused DM to open the door a 2nd time when masked guy walked by? But DM went back to sleep?
I think it was Xana saying someone is here And she just may thought it was Kaylie I think he had already did what he did on the 3rd floor he was quick and fast I think that’s why he went in on her and Ethan I think he heard her say someone was there Poor babies I hate this happened to everyone involved Poor Kid and family’s gonna be traumatized for life for what…..he so wrong for this he don’t deserve to even breath the day of light again
I have had severe panic attacks as a result of trauma so bad that i had to sit or lay down to focus on breathing and completely fallen asleep for hours almost as if subconsciously hoping that it was a bad dream and things would be ok in the morning. The events that triggered me was my coworker I shared an office with I discovered had been sabotaging my work and tried to get me fired that day only to drop dead of a heart attack in the bathroom and police had searched our office after that and the same day police stopped at my apartment asking my bf questions about any security cameras in our apartment or building. Then when I was home and awoke the next morning I look out my bedroom window and building is surrounded by news vans and police cars and yellow police tape and i completely hyperventilated and froze in place kept saying why are we surrounded by cops over and over again and I then bf made me lay down and call in sick for me and come to find out a man has been found murdered across the street that morning with an axe and it was our towns first homicide ever and made big national news. My brain thought I was being framed for murdering my coworker.
Nowhere in that affidavit it says she was panicked, traumatized or in fear for her life. NOWHERE. It said she "in a frozen shock like phase" which I actually think was a typo for "frozen shock like FACE". Which makes more sense with the context of the affidavit. She was startled, not going into shock. You are speculating on evidence that doesn't exist so far.
I used to scoff about people who had panic attacks. Get it together, be strong I would say. Then something traumatic in my life happened. Poetic justice, I had a series of panic attacks. Over trn years has now passed, and LOT more empathy for others who are under stress. Can totally undestand why she panicked and then went to sleep. Used to happen to me too.
@@B_BodziakThe 911 call was made the NEXT day when they dicovered the bodies when she in fact went into shock, panicked, fainted etc. Which is the normal response to realizing what happened. It's absurd people think she was aware of the danger or saw the bodies and went back to sleep. Again, NOTHING in the affidavit says she was afraid, traumatized or in tfaumatic shock before she went to sleep or that she was aware of what had happened.
Go listen to Nancy Grace earlier….DM stated on affidavit 3x that she was in her bedroom in the basement…then how could she see him upstairs and see his bushy eyebrows. It’s a fact he never made it to the basement since he allegedly did the murders upstairs and left his knife sheath on the second floor
People in here saying the Feds, State Police and Locals are all in on a conspiracy with the witness to frame this guy, have legit gone off the deep end. And it's embarrassing. First you're pissed they're not doing enough, now you're mad that they were doing alot behind the scenes and are calling it a frame job? All we have is the affidavit. Which btw was extremely detailed for an affidavit. But it's just an affidavit. So I can only imagine how much other evidence they have. Wait for the rest to come out. Just because it was done quickly and you aren't happy with a witness doesn't mean he was framed. Ffs. The fact he was quick was probably the reason for his mistakes. Sure he was efficient in what he came to do, unfortunately, but because of him moving quickly and leaving quickly, he made a mistake. It actually makes perfect sense. And anyone saying he couldn't do that, that quick, doesn't understand the damage a knife can do in the right spot. It's over in a min. This guy went in there on a rampage and intended to kill on the spot and cleary was swinging with all his force. A guy who used to box mind you
@@zzz7zzz9 Maybe. I mean I'm not some obsessed cop lover or anything. I'm not a defunder either. I think there are good and bad ones. But LE did an dam good job here. These comments are getting absolutely absurd. I just read someone say it's going to get thrown out of court because it took them too long to get him. Lol wtf Another one said they thought he was guilty until they read the affidavit, and now it's clear his innocent! Lol idk of these people are trolling or sick in the head but it's honeslty creepy af
Exactly. He was, without a doubt, the perpetrator. The DNA evidence is just icing on the cake. The extremely tight correlation between his phone activity and vehicle movements caught on camera are alone enough to convict him. He's the only person in both towns to have not only a vehicle that matches in terms of both make and model but is also missing a front license plate/tag. Literally no one else there has that combination of incriminating factors. Let that sink in... Dude is driving a car that not only is the right make and model, but does not have a front tag because he was using Pennsylvania plates. Exactly like the car caught on all those security videos. They had identified him as the prime suspect in just two weeks, we just didn't know.
@@GarretGrayCamera If he got spooked by the other resident he booked it.. but when he saw that the police hadn't arrived yet, he was just too scared to attempt to return to get it, is what I'm thinking? Probably could not face the bodies he had left behind. I'm also still curious why these two girls. His tower pings show he'd been in their neighborhood before in the months prior, right?
DID SHE FREEZE FOR 7-8HRS? NO ONE IS TRYING TO VICTIM SHAME, BUT THIS JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE 😕 MAYBE IF HE THREATENED HER WE COULD ALL MAKE SENSE OF IT, BUT TO BE SO TERRIFIED AND NOT TRY TO GET HELP IS CRAZY.
I’m glad she mentioned how the survivor’s reaction and possible response was. A lot of people are judging her and it’s unfair. Unless you have been in a situation like this- YOU DON’T KNOW what response or action you would have.
True, but they might as well leave that part out of the case because his attorneys are going to tear her up if they put her on the stand. If you think the comments are bad wait til they dive into it.
I don't buy that, not at all, the threat was gone, she heard a scream, plus she heard dog barking, heard crying and talking, saw a man with a mask on walking through the house, then I lock my door and go to sleep for eight hours... Idk, not saying Bryan is not the murderer, but I have to wonder, if a call was made immediately to 911, could any of those victims have been saved. As a parent of one of the victims, that would be an overwhelming thought...
She hit the nail right on the head. Most people with smarts and high degrees have no common sense. My sister has a master’s degree and she has no common sense whatsoever. So true unfortunately.
What do you think causes it? maybe they tell themselves "i've got a high degree so by default i'm automatically smart with everything" and therefore they stop using their common sense?
I'd put Hot Dogs on his plate and tell him "Thats all we have ". When he gets hungry enough he'll eat it . I would not cater to him and his vegan diet .
These interviews has been nothing but very dismissive against suspicions with the roommates. They all are like "we should not judge" why the fuc* should we not? We should just automatically roll them out as suspects? Is that wise? We're all judging Kohburger, why not the roommates? Are they that special? It's normal to be suspicious with them, they're technically part of the crime. They were at the crime scene, for God's sake!
There's also the chance that he didn't even see her. She probably wasn't standing in her doorway with her door wide open. I'd imagine she was hearing things and was scared and probably only had it cracked open a tiny bit just enough to peek out. A lot of people have also been questioning why she waited until almost 8 hrs later to call the police. I think she may have waited a little bit until she knew he was gone and then went to check on her friends and found them and passed out running away from what she found. The other roommate Bethany apparently slept through everything. When Bethany woke up, she would have found Dylan on the floor. I think that's where the call to 911 saying a roommate was unconscious came from. Bethany had to have still been unaware of what had happened on the floors above her to her roommates. The whole thing is so heartbreaking and insane. So many questions. Why didn't anyone scream or yell or say anything at all after Kaylee saying someone's here?? How did he not track blood through the entire house all the way to his car? He wasn't carrying a bag or anything according to DMs statement in the affidavit. He didn't have a hazmat suit or booties on covering his shoes. So much just doesn't make sense.
I thought you could see blood in the kitchen from the pics when police were in the residence? Detectives said it was the worst they’ve ever seen. I wonder if it was light in the house or dark. I don’t know if she passed out but that’s a long time that went by with nothing. Didn’t d Dylan and Bethany end up together on the first floor? I’m so confused but I can’t understand how she was awake when all of this happened. Unless she was on something or very drunk I just don’t get it.
@@Marcia.Marcia.Marcia sorry I should have worded it better… originally they lied and said they both were downstairs. That way he thought no one saw him and he continued thinking he got away with it. But as far as never knowing anything, yeah who really knows what the hell goes on out there
Sooo I wonder how many snowmobiles and fancy TVs and cars and luxury vacations ... those in the legal profession, ajudicating this case, will be able to squeeze out of it while insisting, "We just want to make sure he gets a fair trial"?
Something tells me he wanted to be caught. He chose to enter a house with so many people living in it and other people coming and going. He stalked the house, he was there at least 12 times. This was not impulsive. He went in there, risked being seen, he used his own car, this was planned. It just doesn't make sense. He is playing games with us.
@@oldironsides4107 yep but if this had to do with drugs and dealers…the hit man would be a “professional” killer who could easily do it in 15 mins. When this first broke…I read Kaylees mom sold heroine…now this much later Bryan is said to have done heroine in hs. Maybe he still dabbled. Would explains them pings near the “party house” Also would explain the male voice saying “it’s okay I’m going to help you.” If he went over to buy some drugs…and found them that way…also might explain his return at 9am…to see if they had been found. Maybe freaked out and ran cos how could explain why he was there, and would he be believed…might be in authorities best interest to arrest him rather than an assasin for a drug dealer/cartel. If the mother of Kaylee did have dealings in heroine…maybe it was a revenge killing…since it was stated Kaylee had the worst wounds. Not sure what that family does to make income, but dealing on the side would explain also one of the initial questions: how did a waitress afford the vehicle she had gotten. Also how in the world is that family affording to have that lawyer retained for that long. Not shaming the victim or the family…but my gut just says something is way wrong.
It’s possible that the alleged killer never even saw Dylan. My heart goes out to Dylan and I pray that god give her strength to heal, as much as she can! 🫶🏻🫶🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🫶🏻
It's VERY possible... particularly if you read his writings on "visual snow," written a decade ago. He describes being plagued by a problem which causes night-blindness and tunnel-vision. ;)
@@ThisEpicLife Judging by what he wrote back when he was 16, he has had mental illness for a long time, along with the visual snow. How incredibly sad, for all involved, that he didn't get the help he needed back then. Who knows how many others there are feeling this way, around us?😥😳
Some victims did struggle Xana was one of those victims that fought until she could no longer fight I guess DM just heard crying and whimpering and after seeing the murder she went to sleep DM is about one of the most stupidest coward I have ever heard of to scared to even dial 911 most fear sobers people up
It's hard to kill a flopping fish with a pocket knife or club. Killing 4 people was probably more gruesome and harder than he anticipated. He wanted out of there without getting caught. Tunnel vision under stress is normal. The witness was driven by fear x1000000. It's not uncommon to have random people walking through your house and hearing noise all night when you live in a party house in college. I know first hand! 🍻
Nobody can imagine how horrific it must have been for roommate. What many aren't understanding is that when she called friends on her cell phone, why she didn't call police, 911... So much isn't known yet. Praying for the families.
What to her was horrific? Her hearing a guy saying " Im going to help you" possible crying or a strange guy walking towards her? She obviously didn't know her roomates were murdered. She was scared because of the guys appearance Im sure but I highly doubt she knew what happened. It makes sense she didn't call the police, she called friends to gossip about some guy going to her roommates room late at night but probably was worried they weren't up yet. If you ever lived in a "party" house you would understand.
Dylan's statements are inconsistent. She made it sound as if she was I. The lose level 2x. 1) when he passed by 2) the next day after 10 am she states she did not know anyone was dead until she and Beth went UPSTAIRS to the kitchen. The affidavit states she was in a room on the second one floor. That is where the kitchen is???
DM froze because she didn't expect to see anyone, it simply startled her and in 2 seconds he was past her. She obviously didn't think it cause for concern even though it did startle her. She didn't wanna fuss at any roommates about the noises disturbing her, so she just locked her door and went to sleep. It was the wee hours of the night and so she slept in late. I think three things contributed to this mystery: 1) BCK wanted to get outta there, before he ran into more people & the time factor overall; 2) He was exhausted and injured and didn't think he could fight/kill more people; and 3) She wasn't his main target. I think his main target was Kaylee and I think he could have been in the house before. He killed Maddie because she was in the room with her BFF. He killed Evan and Zana because they awoke as K & M were attacked, and he was confronted by Evan, with Zana behind him. She ran back into her room as BCK attacked Evan. She had no where, nor time, to escape to. This guy is like other arrogant killers before him; he's death penalty bound.
Criminology has nothing to do with crime scene forensic science. He's at best an amateur criminal wannabe serial killer who think he'd get away with murders but made many mistakes leading this his arrest.
Why would she be in shock? People were in and out that house all the time, and another dude letting himself out wouldn't seem to raise a lot of alarm bells.
Maybe i watch too many horror movies but when you see a homeowner lock themselves in a bedroom from an intruder they don't usually go to sleep for 8 hours and then call the police.
@@stellarwind1946 DM had no idea that anything had happened at the time or in the moments immediately before she saw the guy. Again, "shock" seems to be an unwarranted response.
I think the “she was in shock and passed out” narrative is coming out because a) it makes the story more sensational b) i think people and possibly dm herself do not want to accept that she went to bed while her friends were dead upstairs (gruesome) The reality is, she didnt know who he was and didnt care. It was a frat house and she just assumed it was someones friend or hookup.
@@TheItFactorMMA "The reality is, she didnt know who he was and didnt care. It was a frat house and she just assumed it was someones friend or hookup." Agreed. (Except not a "frat" house, but a party house.)
I’m just putting this out there: 8 hours is plenty of time to clean, shower and get rid of evidence. What if the roommate didn’t go back to sleep? What if that’s the reason the killer went back? What if Dylan had something to do with it?
That house never lock, anybody can walk in. Party, drinking, orgies sex, loud music, neighbor constant complaining and called cop on the past. Anybody can come in and out like a whore house.
The house has code but its never locked or everyone knew it. I can't remember. But the occupants of the house had people coming and going. It was like an off campus frat house.
If these items were toxic and needed to be bio cleaned. How can defense just go in there and haul these bloody bedding out and it’s not even in contained truck????
Omg she is so on the money. A lot of people who are booksmart and get “good grades” have zero common sense. That is the truest statement ever.
That's true. Im booksmart.... a geek... but I struggle to even boil eggs properly... and toasting bread is a stretch...
Many people in Pennsylvania like that
@@myronsmith2114 Lies 😂 Really dude 🫤
I Totally Agree with her!!
This really is the truest statement.. ever since I got out on my own and got married.. aka paid my own bills.. I gained a ton of common sense! the kids should be alright as long as everything isn’t handed to them and they don’t have the parents take care of their problems.. I’m hopefulish anyway..😂
8 hours is enough time to be sure that the stabbing victims had bled to death and also time to tamper with the evidence.
A delay / freeze response in calling is believable. A 7-8 hour delay? PLUS you don’t call 911 you first call friends AND the friends come over to your house first? Literally wtf.
Thats not what happened. Unfortunately the news keeps telling that story but she was on the phone with 911 and ran out of the house and passed out on the front lawn. Ethan is a triplet and the other surviving room mate knew the other one was calling 911 so she called Ethan's brother. Not friends, she called the victims brother because he also goes to the same school.
Are you telling me she passed out for nearly 7 hours come on people something is not right here😮
If she had been consuming alcohol earlier, she may have simply passed out or gone to sleep. Was she frozen in fear? Who knows? Perhaps she could be hypnotized and taken back to that moment in time for further validation of her experience.
Forensics and criminology are two very different things 🥴
That's what I said. If he studied criminalistics, he probably wouldn't have tried to do murder.
@@stewpot6998 even his Reddit post was more about how the offender felt during, before, after…. He wasn’t so much interested in getting away or attempting the perfect crime as he was in what he would feel once he had committed the crime. How the crime would make him feel. It almost seems like his actions going back to the crime scene, driving across country, changing the tags on the car, cleaning it with fined tooth comb, was an afterthought. Once he come down from the high, of what it made him feel like, he realized he had a gigantic mess on his hands.
do you guys think he ever thought about dealth penalty or this may be a shock for him? I'm confused. Does he want the attention? Did he want to get caught? Or he genuinely thought he could get away with murder?
@@kimmiedoesmakeup5024 I completely agree. No real logic in any of it. And his dad blabbing away.
@@edum.6353 I really think it was about needing to understand what it felt like. He was so completely enthralled with the criminal aspect, their mindset, it was hard for him to look past other details that he probably knew he should have. I think he was only looking to kill one person, but the dog, the girls being in the same room, Ethan and Xana, it all went awry.
I can understand the allure of needing to understand what criminals feel like, and I’m sure others can too, but I don’t see us crossing the line like BK did, because most everyone aren’t psychopaths or sociopaths. Most of us are okay just speculating.
I had no idea they ordered door dash at 4 am and supposedly he struck within moments of that??? And the roommate saw him and went to bed?? Nothing in this makes sense. I felt fairly certain he did it the way they said. Now it all feels like total bs.
He should have just taped his drivers license to the Fridge on the way out. So much evidence was left like a trail for law enforcement 😮
I think he left the sheath because he heard xana and the dog, went to deal with her and once Ethan got involved he really freaked out and forgot it
@@manager4409 sheath came off accidentally in the dark during first attack he prob had no idea it was gone
Almost seems too easy for the prosecution doesn't it.
Dang, this made me laugh. Am I a horrible person to laugh at a joke at a tragedy? For an apparent genius, he's not too bright. What a waste.
I bet his computer is going to be FULL of incriminating information!
You go ask why the dog is barking, and no one is making it be quiet. She's involved! I hope the defence team uncovers her lies!
I don't think he saw Dylan
I agree. Tunnel vision.
She said he did
maybe she lied about seeing him for attention
Impaired?
Exactly I think he in a trans no pun intended.
I am remembering when my daughter was in college and she roomed with 3 other young ladies in off campus apartments. She was sorta shy so she stayed to herself. She was not big friends with the other three young ladies who would have our parties, have people in and out etc.. However, the rent was split 4 ways and the place was really nice and spacious and she had a large corner room with her own private bath and this was appealing to her. I'm saying this, to state that maybe the roommate who peered out the door and glanced at the guy clad in black, probably may have thought that he was another random just visiting and she didn't want to make a scene and call out the other 4 for having any person just walking through their shared space! The other two girls may not have been as close as the Utah 4 were to each other. So in her head, she will deal with it later in the day. She goes to sleep and does not wake until later mid day where she actually finds people murdered and then when questioned tells police what she saw and now it's on another level... Just my thoughts!
That does make sense. 👍
Finally a common sense logical explanation giving her the benefit of the doubt.
This long response doesn’t make any sense. SHE OPENED DOOR 3 TIMES!!!!! AND SHE HEARD EVERYTHING!!!!!!!
And anybody will be aware of situation and SAW A GUY walk right pass her. She was AWARE of things going on. No matter how much anybody try to sugar coat it,
it is strange and abnormal.
Because of her abnormal reaction,
her witnessing guy in black is doubtful.
That is exactly what I thought of, well said.
@Vanessa exactly maybe she was a real student and not a party trouble maker…
D.M. knows more than what she's telling.
NOTHING about this whole story makes sense, not just the crime scene. Something smells extremely fishy and doesn't add up after reading the affidavit, more red flags, sounds shady.
More will be released.
Nothing shady about this...
Lol, it all makes sense, this guy was caught within 14 days.
@@joelhague5515 More like out of a Hollywood action crime movie, all scripted and all the evidence lined up pointing straight to him. Was the crime scene, the house prepared for clean up just hours before announcing they got the suspect?.The dramatic of transporting the suspect, airplane, departure and landing with the entire national, International news outlets out there, all cameras lights up...What a show! Just my thought.
IMO, I cannot see anyway that knife sheath fell off his belt. It's looped into the belt. He would have to take his belt loose and purposely remove the sheath. I believe he walked into the house with the knife in the sheath and just in his hand, not on his belt. So the first time he used it the sheath has to come off and he just dropped it on the bed and then forgot about it. Assuming this is true, that means Kaylee and Maddie were attacked first. As with Bryan and Dylan. IMO, Bryan did not see Dylan. Many reasons why. She could have been in her room with the door cracked open. IMO, if Bryan did see Dylan she would have been victim 5. I thank God it's a miracle she survived. And now she is an eyewitness to the attack, in the moment that the defense cannot overcome. This girl is the key evidence in this case.
I agree with you
It doesn't have anything to do with "not seeing her"
He went into the house not knowing how many are in and who lives in which room. (except the upstairs girls maybe).
If he walks the kitchen bedroom near the stairs and the door is blacked out semi open. why wouldn't he look there to make sure?? that makes no sense
especially when he came back down he would seen the door is now "closed"
@@SimplyTheBestCSGO yes but if the closed door is also locked, he might have just cut his losses and left.
It could have broken off in a struggle
Who,said it was attached to his belt, he could have been carrying it in his hand and not attached to his belt.
Im sure even with what the surviving roommate saw and heard it never computed in her head in any way that her roommates had just been slaughtered. It was past 4 a.m. She locked her door. Probably listened for any other noises or someone trying to get in her room and didnt hear anything else and went to sleep. Sleeping till the afternoon because she didnt go to bed until 4:30-5 am. I absolutely know that all her friends being murdered wasnt ever a thought in her mind even if she seen a guy. Its cold in Idaho this time of year. I bet theres pranking going on around campus with these kids all the time. My point is, never in a million years would she have thought that 4 of her friends, 3 roommates were being slaughtered. I hope she is able to heal from this trauma.
I agree with you completely!
Absolutely! They'd had the cops there a few times recently for noise complaints and since after the creepy guy who had her frozen in fear left she locked herself in and was not about to go out into the house. That house had people coming in and out and was basically a sorority house. Lots of shenanigans all hours of the day and night. There were no blood curdling screams. A little noise from the dog upstairs, probably very normal. Someone crying for a very short time and then quiet. But there wasn't enough loud alarming sounds for her to think there was a massacre! Poor Dylan! RIP to all the victims and their families 💔
Oh please no excuse for not calling 911 for 8 hours
Nobody sees somebody walking around their house in a mask and just goes to sleep after, COME ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
remember though, dylan, herself, likes wearing a mask too. wasn't hers pink?
Right before they released the arrest affidavit , I read a quote from whom I thought was police saying the roommate said it looked like his black turtle neck shirt had been pulled up over his mouth and nose as if he’d come in from the cold outside so the covering of the mouth and nose seemed normal . At least that makes sense . I remember the commentator then answering Oh the old turtleneck trick , I guess meaning Ted Bundy always wearing turtlenecks . I assumed that info would be in the affidavit but it wasn’t ? The whole roommate thing is so bizarre though , - in the middle of the night she’s woken up and nosey worried enough to get up and open the door THREE times but then just goes back to bed ? I do think what she thought was Kaylee playing with the dog upstairs noise and Xana crying were unconnected , it’ll probably make more sense what she was thinking when she testifies , if it goes to trial .
@spacecalander totally agree.
I also think her testimony won't hold up in court...she stated it was dark, a masked face, dressed in black and bushy eyebrows, that's not a 100% ID of suspect. Could be anyone else....
I'm not here defending him at all. If he committed the crime, then he will def face the consequences coming his way and all will be well deserved.
It’s a party house, I live in a party house in college rn and i wouldn’t think twice if I saw someone walking around at 4 am because people are always coming and going. So I definitely can see how she didn’t realize till after she woke up
@@Denominator-zc3sethat would make sense if she didn’t state how terrified she was after opening and closing the door 3-times and admitting to hearing crying and chaos. The story doesn’t add up no matter how you cut it.
Book smart doesn't equal Street smarts. Like reading a recipe for a cake and thinking you can bake better than a baker.
?
You're arguing against yourself. It's people without 'book smart' intelligence that think they know better than the experts. Uneducated people argue with professionals all the time.
True
For some reason the fact that he walked past one of the roommates is somehow even more terrifying.
I guess he used up all drugs on victims and was exhausted by using a knife to kill four people. If he had attacked the fifth victim, he would've been caught at the scene.
I really don’t think he saw her. He got rattled after one of the girls had screamed loudly.
@@bf6048 if you look at the layout of the second floor, I highly doubt he saw her as he walked by.
How could he not see her if she was close enough to able to give an accurate description of his eyebrows. The affidavit says he was walking right in her direction so she was definitely within his field of vision
@@stellarwind1946 she could have barely opened the door, the layout of the second floor explains it all.
She was on a bad trip. Woke up in the morning and called the cops after realizing it wasn't all a dream.
Yep 'shrooms and/or plethora of mind alterers readily available in Idaho let alone a college town - DoorDash delivery is just crazy - there's way more to this - party house, guy comes out of the house with one of the victims during the day with a zip tie on his wrist while LE investigates a noise complaint ? Killer a scorned boy toy?
Tripping makes more sense than being drunk.
And that's why she is a terrible witness. People saying she is a good witness and key to the case lmao.. yes such a good witness she heard no screaming or anything serious enough to make her call the police in that moment, but we are going to trust her recollection of some guy she thought she saw in the dark..
That would be a horrible thing to live with for a lifetime. If true, I hope others will learn from it.
I'm thrilled that she made that statement about "'book smart people' lacking common sense" because I've been saying that all along. I think he's not very bright at all but apparently can memorize for his learning.
At last you've been vindicated. Thank God
Possibly if he was studying at an undergraduate level but at a PhD level? I think your abilities have to go beyond just memorisation.
I been saying this for years. Lol It's sooooo true!!!
@@OhCrumbs96you are correct, memory will only get you so far, you have to be able to reason your way in and out of situations/problems.
i've been always saying he's an intelligent idiot. i just can't see a person planning this for so long, but then making all these silly blunders. it makes me think he wanted to be caught, because that level of dumbness, i can't comprehend it.
"Walked past me" doesn't necessarily mean the she was standing in plain sight. She could have been peeking out of her door and he walked past it.
Exactly. She was probably in the dark too.
True, but it says their eyes met.
Wonder how she saw his “bushy” eyebrows if he wasn’t close to her and facing her at least…
Wonder how she saw his “bushy” eyebrows if he wasn’t close to her and facing her at least…
@@kimberlylewis5165 Mortensen said that she heard crying again later and opened her door for the third time, investigators said in the document. When she looked out, Mortensen told police that she "saw a figure clad in black clothing and a mask that covered the person's mouth and nose walking towards her." She described the person as a man, standing at either 5 feet 10 inches or taller, who was "not very muscular, but athletically built with bushy eyebrows."
The roommate told police that the man walked past her while she stood at her bedroom doorway "in a 'frozen shock phase,'" and proceeded to exit the home through a sliding glass door at the back entrance. Mortensen told police that she locked herself inside of her room after seeing the masked individual.
She must have got a very good look because the way she described him and his body build. How do you notice that much detail in the dark?
DM frozen in great fear but didn't check on her roommates or call police after a masked killer leaves the home? Went to sleep, woke up and called friends to come over? This is very sketchy. No matter what the circumstances.
What would you think you would have done?
She didn't even know there were 4 dead people in the house.
@@barbarahudson2573 she was froze in fear she knew something was wrong she could have texted the roommates from her locked room or call the cops not 8 hours later
It’s explainable… Remember when Elizabeth smart was kidnapped her sister saw it happen and she was so scared she closed her eyes and stayed in bed.. fell asleep until the next morning when her parents woke her up. We are looking at this in hindsight… in a party house with multiple roommates she may have had an overwhelming feeling of fear or something not being right but might have talked herself out of it by explaining things… at least a couple girls in the home were single at the time so maybe she thought it could be a friend or late night hookup… hearing crying she prob thought her roomie had gotten into a drunken argument with her BF… she thought she heard Kaylee playing with the dog… I mean honestly people need to lighten up on this poor girl. The amount of guilt and survivors remorse she feels must be extraordinary. The last thing she needs or her friends would want is random people blaming her and attacking her online.
@@barbarahudson2573 right which makes it weird that she froze for that long. If she saw the bodies and then froze for 8 hours i can understand that more
Anyone ask themselves how one man allegedly could stab four people to death with the only witness hearing, what she thought, was one victim playing with the dog?
Just a thought
Easy, one by one hand over the mouth and a slash to the throat
This occur in Idaho and not one of these girls' daddy didn't provide them with a weapon loaded with hollow points ? C'mon I go to the post office, grocery store and see little old guys packin' like they're right outta fucking Dragnet, smh
Anybody that has never been jumped, shot at, robbed and kidnapped including hunted which has happened to me do not know what they would do in any of those situations like mine. When I was being chased after I escaped a kidnapping I ran and hid in the front of a friend's house and didn't leave until his parents came home because no one was there. I either just turned eighteen or was about to. I was scared to death because they were searching and driving around for me.
Ummmm cell phone! Did you have a cell phone on you! Cause she did! Did you go to sleep while you were hiding!? Cause she did! Your defending the fact that girl waited 8 more hours to call the police? One of those kids could have been clinging to life still. Its just crazy im sorry. She obviously knew someone could be hurt or something! Theres no excuse for that im sorry.
@@TruthAddiction1975 She had probably been drinking...hence falling asleep and word has it she left her phone in another room
None of those things you mentioned happened to her. So far all we know is she heard noises and saw a guy she didn’t know walking out of her apartment. Hopefully we get the full story so that it makes sense.
Congratulations about making this about you.
@@TruthAddiction1975 he wasn’t driving around for her. He left. Was gone. For hours. And being drunk isn’t an excuse.
I don't buy being in shock for 8 hours
DITTO
Exactly 👍
I don’t doubt being in shock, but not too act is the real worry. The dog must have been going crazy?
Originally the 2 other house mates slept through it & now it’s been released that she can describe him
The media is speculating shock. When It might just be sleep
I don't think she was and I don't think that's what she's going to say. I think she blew it off because of her being used to seeing people in there while she was drunk on top of it. Anyone, even someone you know, would scare the crap out of you if you opened a door and they were waking at you immediately in the dark. We'll see
It'll be interesting to see if there's more DNA in the house besides the knife sheath. Killing 4 people
In 16 minutes he had to have worked up a sweat or left some blood behind himself. Plus the car is a whole other ball game, no way he was able to purge all the DNA from the car
I agree. If they don't find some of the victims DNA in the car, I've got to start thinking they got the wrong person.
No way he could have killed 4 people in 16 minutes.
It was less than 16 minutes
He could have done it in 16 mins. Kaylee and Maddie were both asleep. Xana was awake because she was ordering food which is why her and Ethan had defensive wounds.
@@itzhexen0 He did. Less. And considering two were in bed together and small girls, he definitely could. That probably took a few mins. He brutally stabbed them. Then he went into the others rooms, areas. One was awake. Probably took one out, maybe one ran at him and he ran right into the blade in his chest. Then he takes out another girl. That knife was big. I've seen a big guy die from a small knife and by a small dude, in mins. One stab to the heart. Started wheezing and then died on the spot. If you stab people with a large knife in the right area its over almost immediately.
Now I agree it was fast, but I think that's why he left the sheath. I think be went all out, but wasn't being smart, which makes sense. Hard to be perfect when moving that quickly.
He was also sober, 28 years old in his physical prime, used to box which I'm sure helped when swinging that knife, and caught a bunch of 20 year old drunk girls at 4am and one guys.
I mean all the time lines up. The girl was on TikTok, then the friend heard her a few mins earlier, then she's crying, then silence. All within 5 mins. She's already gone probably and he's moving on. It adds up. It's just crazy how fast he did it I agree
It's chilling how calm he seems considering all the details we know now and that in fact, he seems to be the one who has committed these horrendous crimes!
Wonder if he was ever hx of aspergers abuse head trauma. Hes indeed got a flat affect. Guilty angered ie hurt fear frustration about his countenance. Hes shocked he got caught. Its insulting that hes being called intelligent, when he lacks both common sense and wisdom. Not to mention his lack of sympathy and empathy. Praying for everyone. Praying he repents and confesses. Praying he gets visited by angels, and gets to truly know the Lord.
Finding the Lord is good thing. However, anyone who is convicted of murder should have the same happen to them by getting the death penalty imo.
@@moniquemonet6476 how quaint
@@moniquemonet6476 Who cares. Convict, execute, cremate and forget him. His father looks like the accomplice in those car pictures.
He lives in his own imaginary world
I call BS! The roommates are LYING!
Didn't the police say originally that there was a large amount of water used . More then normal. Thaught he washed up or took a shower? If he was in and out in 15 min and there was all that water used , who used it? Alot of weird stuff going on with this case.
Maybe Dylan was an accomplice and washed from 4 am to noon..
@@joinjen3854 lol
Where did you hear that?
Or someone tried cleaning up who knows.
@@joinjen3854 LOL! Oh my.....
What I wanna know is why the neighbor said the FRONT door (on the first floor) was WIDE open that day and that he noticed it around 8.30 am and that it stayed open.
Wow, hadn't heard that one. 🙄
When she moved in her roomies instructed her: "NEVER call the cops because WE'RE HOLDING!"
You know this, or are you guessing?🤷♀️
How do we know DM believed something bad enough to call the police had happened? We're analyzing with full knowledge of the murders. She didn't have that. Did she think "there's someone here" represented a threat, given the amount of outside traffic regularly reportedly at the residence? With the male voice, did she think one of the other women had a male visitor and it wasn't her business? It could have been embarassing to intervene or go to a friends' room to check if it looked like she had a secret relationship going on. I'm guessing the house was dark since everyone was in their rooms for the night, and Kohberger would have turned out any lights. Nothing unusual about locking your door before going to sleep. It seems most likely he did not see DM, but she saw him by the ambient outside light coming in through the windows. Interestingly, the affadavit says nothing about her hearing the "distorted audio" or the dog barking that was picked up by a neighbor's security camera.
Don't overlook her description of being in a "frozen shock phase" not necessarily describing her being in fear. It could merely describe the manner in which she stood so as not to draw attention to herself. Additionally, any expression of fear in the affadavit is a description AFTER she knows the four have been savagely murdered. She now knows how close she came to being a victim and it's impossible for that to not influence her description.. Were it possible to go back in time and observe the incident itself and ask her how she felt at the time, it might not exactly match the affadavit.
Also, with people coming in at 2:00 a.m. and still being active at 4:00 a.m., once they go to sleep, I wouldn't expect anyone to be up until noon. If, for whatever reason, DM did not interpret the events she described as something to call the police about and, instead, went to sleep, is it all that strange that she didn't discover what had happened until later the next morning?
I agree. I lived in a six-person unit with 3 bedrooms when I was in college. If I had seen a random dude walking by me in the middle of the night, I would have thought, hmm, who’s that…but that would NOT have prompted me to call 911 because it’s normal in a co-ed college environment to constantly have people going in and out of a place. Some random guy walking past you in the house would not have led this girl to conclude “oh, that must mean that some of my housemates have been stabbed to death by this person”. This is a house that supposedly had parties while none of the residents of the house were even present - so random foot traffic was obviously the standard there.
Exactly, a few times I have been in bed and terrified by noises I couldn't make sense of, then I try and dialogue myself out of my fear and eventually fall asleep. People react like she should have known. As if!
Not strange at all. Tack on possible terror, possible intoxication, and living in a party house and it’s better to not judge anything as absolute until all of the facts are known. The locking of the door seems unnecessary to me if they all had those coded locks on their doors. All she’d have had to do is shut the door, right?
@@yukikowu5695 and seeing people in a mask covering their mouth and nose in this COVID-pandemic era has become like second nature to most.
I am glad Dylan and Bethany were not murdered also they could not have prevented what happened I hope they can find peace eventually
There's literally no excuse why she didn't call 911 until lunchtime the following day!! Defense lawyers are going to destroy her on the stand
guess what. you dont get it. it is party house.
You don't know that's what really happened. It's very likely that the timeline provided to the public in the beginning was a white lie to protect her from being targeted as a witness and to avoid spooking the perpetrator into fleeing the country by revealing that someone saw him clearly, along with other withheld evidence that would have made him realise he could be traced. That would also explain the initial claim that everyone in the house was asleep, which was obviously a lie now.
This might be Bryan’s out right there. It’s just too weird
Until 30, I slept with the door unlocked. I didn't care, and had zero confidence anyone would break in. Teach your kids to lock their doors and have an available weapon. If you don't like guns, at least have a bat or large knife within 3 seconds reach. This world is full of crazies on prescription meds
And not just "prescription" meds.
All these "former" FBI agents all over TH-cam.
Did they get fired or asked to resign?
so what jerk.
Stood down without pay as many had Jack the ex boyfriend & hoodie guy publicly hung already.
I noticed that.. since Gabby Pettito
They're everywhere
That roommate made a really bad mistake. If she was fearing for her life, she'd call the police. Yeah, maybe she was in shock. But for EIGHT HOURS?????
THANK YOU!! idk why they keep making excuses babying her, taking about 'maybe she passed out"??... she's a grown adult college student.. even 5 year olds that have seen their families slaughtered call 911 or go for help to their neighbors...But really I'd have to learn more about any ties they had with the suspect cuz something isn't sounding right
I Agree! Panic, yes, shock, yes, fear absolutely.......for 8 hrs, not likely. At some point, survival instincts set in, I don't care who you are. If she had her cell phone with her, as most young people do, what is it to dial 911, text your roommates, call your parents, neighbors, Door Dash for god sake! She had the presence of mind to close and lock her door though......so, why not pick up the cell and call or text someone?? I'm so dumbfounded by this, I don't mean to sound cruel, but come on 🤦♀
@holdingplace DM's own words were that she "was frozen with fear."
If it was just some random guy leaving her roommate, she wouldn't have had that reaction.
You can't have it both ways, it doesn't add up
@@KaleidoscopicPalindromehow did she know what he did? She just saw him, not him killing her roommates . She didn’t have a clue what he had done when she saw him.
@@lizk1780 Absolutely!
"You can't have it both ways" is exactly what I've been saying.
I had a neighber who turned out to be a mass killer of young boys in the 70s and 80s he told his sister he killed them so they would not have to live in this terrible world.That he was saving them doing them a favor.Mental illness rarely makes sense to most people and WHY they do things Rarely is a good reason.
What was the mass killers name?
Sounds like the perverse mentality of abortion people..
Mothers will do the same...ppd
We need more Jennifer updates. She's no-nonsense and appreciated.
I’m pondering as to WHY would the roommate be so traumatized by seeing the person dressed in black with the mask on walking past her be in great fear if she , at that time, know nothing about her roommates being murdered…. So why be traumatized to the point she passes out. No call the police until 12:00 noon! If she knew there was an intruder, CALL THE POLICE AND SAY “THERE IS A MASKED INTRUDER IN THE HOUSE!!!!!!!” This is fishy.
Exactly! You can't have it both ways. She can't be aware of the danger in one scenario (to explain her passing out/hiding) but then not call for help until noon and only report someone passed out.
@@cocokai9661 that’s the point
You can’t have it both ways
There is lot to what we do t know and everyone is speculating
Clearly Dylan had no idea that her roommates were murdered. She was ‘in shock’ that some rando was walking around her house with a mask on at that ungodly hour but it sounds like she chalked it up to (again) a random dude walking around and not a mass murdering psychopath. It would be scary seeing that but many minds wouldn’t automatically go to deaths door (literally). She probably freaked out and then laid down and passed out, slept in, woke up and realized clearly late in the day (bc she was most likely inebriated) what happened.
Not believable. Allegedly strangers would be walking around the dark house at 4 am. She makes no sense. The defence team will tear her apart for these stupidity statements.
@@LisaPeterson227 this was a party house with rando's there all the time. You just tune into this case?
@@LisaPeterson227 They have his DNA at the scene. They have his car near the house, and his cell phone pinging in the area twelve times since August.
Yea I think there just hasnt been enough information and context released yet to be critical of anyone involved. I agree 100%.
Freaking out 8 hours? Not realizing a couple were slaughtered in the room next to her, in the same floor? no juror will believe that
This contributer has had the most level headed and concise take on this case ive come across so far
I think these college students need some street knowledge. I cant imagine a stalker around 12 times and no one noticing! I am 56 and still look out my windows to see wth is going on outside . I used to be a stripper for 30 yrs so yeah I know stalking. I have been on serial killer kill lists and followed home ect. Alcohol can leave your guard down but if you are a good looking female you better be watching your surroundings at all times! These girls just seemed completely oblivious you know this guy most likely was behind their house parked watching many times how did they not notice? And this social media doesnt help. Yeah let's just tell everyone who our new roommates are ect. Um no! Please kids stop doing this. They look like they are sexualized in their videos,photos. Not good. Makes me sick more needs to be done like teaching classes how not to be a damn victim! And for Gods Sake please put up curtains ! Ugh
Ms. Mortensen may have been more obsessed with checking out her assets: heavy.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/dylan3.jpg?quality=65&strip=all&w=531
That particular tower pings up to 25 miles away.... so where's ur proof?
Many good points here, Lori !
Now that I know more I think there is something not right with this whole thing. Think it's a whole different deal not stalking more like drug distribution with way more going on like covering their asses. Including the Town , and dirty cops involved in drug distribution.
That’s what I was thinking saved that girls life, he was panicking and wanted to get out of there because things weren’t going like he expected, like coming across a big strong male in one the girls bedroom, plus two girls in another bedroom, plus the dog, he probably decided ahead of time he needed to get in and out in 5 or 10 minutes, but the extra people had stretched it out to over 15 minutes and in his mind alarm bells were going off so he just ignored the girl poking her head out the door on his way out.
Frankly it is BS that DM didn't hear what was going on. Nor, didn't see blood all over the floor, and walls. Her bedroom was just across Xana's.
Yes, none of her story makes any sense.
roommate probably intoxicated and since the house was apparently a party spot, saw all kinds of weird stuff while living there. Why 911 wasn't the first call she made is also odd...
Maybe because they had drugs there.
@@overkillblackjack2910 Maybe clean the place up a bit before the cops come ...
There is a reason the residents didn't want the cops there Very Much. What is that reason?
@@aulusagerius7127 I don’t think anyone WANTS police at their home, not everything is an elaborate theory: There’s been a lot of body cam footage released of police there for noise complaints so they’ve certainly been there many times before without issue.
Your so far off. She froze in fear. More happened that is not said .
I was really questioning Dylan’s delay in calling also..but after more thought, I’m thinking her statement was partially misunderstood by police..or they intentionally wrote it to sound that way.
She may not have actually suspected anything other than some drunk frat guy in her house who was up to some prank..old school panty raid or something. If you’ve ever lived in a party house crazy things happen.
Perhaps the last thing from her mind was that this guy was a psychotic killer in her house.
There’s no mention of any screaming in terror..just whimpering/crying and someone saying “..I’ll help you” .
Man I sure hope they give Bryan whatever her fears the most. Somehow I don’t think that’s death penalty- although I want him under the ground asap. I wish they’d give him the electric chair and then revive him, then repeat 3 more times. (Once for each victim)
Well said Frosty.
PERFECT WAY FOR HIM TO DIE!
Great analogy. I think she didn't know what happened. She heard something and saw a guy with a mask. Period. No dead people, no blood, no scream. She didn't know.
Think it was Bryan telling Xana that he’d help her or Ethan telling Xana he’d help her after Bryan left them to bleed to death? I agree with you. It’s kind of a shame these people can’t feel the same suffering that they inflicted
Ikr, she never said anyone was screaming or anything, my guess all along is that she had no idea what had happened and went back to sleep, until sunrise.
What she said about book smart but lacking common sense....yep...I've got one of those in my family.
Kohberger's right hand has been noticeably swollen in various pictures and video, I wonder if he broke something in that hand during the murders, given that's an incredible amount of force and times 4, and could be why he just walked past the surviving roommate
Handcuffs will do that to your hands. And thats what yoire seeing
@@Jack-russell103 Yes, it can but the video of the traffic stop in Indiana shows a similarly swollen hand
@@MG-ot2yr They are saying his hands are red in his graduation pic.. like he has a condition or something Reynaud's disease was mentioned.
So sick to think about this. I mean is this true, that all those things would happen to the person commuting the crime?
@@jacksondrake-lost Its not really redness, its swelling, but if he does have some condition that affects his hands that could also explain why he stopped and just left
What's bugging me is when he murdered the victims he would have been drenched in blood the car that he drove was fifty at the stop so there must have been blood in the car and his father was in the car how did he not notice
Maybe he had plastic down or a tarp.
Since you mentioned that. I was at work one day and an acquaintance broke his nose. He was covered in blood just from a broken nose. He looked like a painter, just from a broken nose. Whoever murdered those four people, would have had an enormous amount of blood on them.
Hint: Because he didn't do it :)
“A comedy of error after error” the most honest opinion so far
The grangegorman killer observed a woman sleeping, told law enforcement about her headphones and TV type. She slept through his unhumanly viscous attack on her housemates. Anything is possible and we know about 5 percent of the facts. If your having impulses to hurt people please tell the hospital emergency room staff. You will get help before you damage ordinary mams and dads and neighbourhoods. And your own life and freedom, your humanity.
These 2 are making me think they have the wrong person
They don't have the wrong person. This is news media generating a new narrative so that you'll pay attention. It's actually a very simple case, even without the DNA he should be convicted. She even mentions it briefly - theres a very tight correlation between his car and phone activity that puts him stalking the location in advance, leaving where he lives in his vehicle about an hour or so before the murders were committed, his phone activity then goes silent during the time-frame of the murders, then magically becomes active after that time-frame, which also correlates with his vehicle reappearing on camera leaving the scene. Insanely, he drives back there around 9 am the next morning and leaves. He did it.
I thought the same thing. Why would LE have the crime scene cleaned just hours before announcing they had a suspect? Is preserving the crime scene a SOP?
You would think so but this case is a bit crazy.
People live in, or work in, many if not most homicide scene. People have to get back in there, so it's not unusual for them to only hold such a place for a day or two. But it _is_ unusual to have a murder scene this long.
Very questionable timing. The defense is probably looking into it.
Spot on. So the defense won't have the opportunity to verify the crime scene, due diligence. I find it FISHY and questionable.
Yes , it appears someone knew it was wrong and the cops did not listen to their reason that it took a Judges Court Order to stop the police from having the house chemically sanitized which would remove all DNA🥴🤪thats a serious RED FLAG of something fishy.
That sheath wouldn't fall off a belt. It has a loop for a belt.
He most likely put the sheaf in his jacket pocket, then it fell out.
Absolutely.
As usual, these so-called pundits as well as the so-called "journalists" are clueless.
Yep, real bright. Dang....
Masters degree at work
No. The sheath didn't fall off. It was left there on purpose with Bryan's DNA inside to frame Bryan.
@starztvnetwork9579 Soooo, #Free Bryan then?
Thank you, Jennifer Coffindaffer!! I'm so shocked that the public-at-large is so horrific in judging her and they understand nothing about Freeze-response and Shock.
Freeze respone and shock for 5-10 minutes, not 8 hours
@@overkillblackjack2910 have you experienced what she did?
@@ninabobina2006 no, but that is not a requirement. But perhaps I am wrong about her behavior.
Anyone who has spent time responding to 911 calls will tell you that not calling 911 after seeing a masked intruder exiting your house is in the extremely low percent, but sadly it does happen. Also, if you live in a house full of people, you would most likely want to share that observation with your friends. Five year olds have called 911 while hiding under beds, in closets, the list goes on. The details around why she didn’t call are not yet fully understood, maybe there was a plausible reason. But those plausible reasons are very few.
I think she simply thought it was some bloke they brought back to party and he was wearing a covid mask ( not that unusual) ,that house was known as a bit of a party house with lots of comings and goings so she just assumed it was just another after party young man, what she heard could be put down to drunkenness, a bit of crying and a thud. Maybe she didn't want to call the police to her shared home incase it pissed off the other tennants.The only thing i find strange is why not text her fellow tenants and just say " are you girls ok? I've just seen a guy leave and i heard crying "? She probably didn't want to be a busy body !!
@@daisymaisy4877ut she said she froze in fear when she saw him and locked her door. So she knew.
The only reason i could think of that would make sense to me (besides being paralyzed with fear and not wanting to make any sound) is if she did not have her phone in her room with her. She locked herself in her room out of fear when the man was walking towards the door, but he wasn't gone yet when she closed it. Imagine being that afraid, you wouldn't open the door and search for your phone anytime soon, thinking he might still be there. If she did have her phone, it would also have made sense for her to text the others in the house to see if they were okay. Did she not dare leave the room until she heard the other girl coming up from the first floor and is that why it took so long to call for help? The other girl apparently didn't hear anything.
She likely passed out from the shock, otherwise she would've called. I'm guessing she passed out.
@Queen Of Swords right she was scared enough to go hide and and lock her door but not make sure her roommates she just heard crying were ok and seeing g and unknown person
Im not having it. She should have called 911 as soon as her door was closed. Can you Imagen if that lunatic went on a killing spree what the conversation would be then.
@@KaleidoscopicPalindrome its more than just seeing him, she was disturbed 3 times, she heard voices , his face was covered, he had bushy eyebrows, im still not having it. Respect
Go listen to Nancy Grace earlier….DM stated on affidavit 3x that she was in her bedroom in the basement…then how could she see him upstairs and see his bushy eyebrows. It’s a fact he never made it to the basement since he allegedly did the murders upstairs and left his knife sheath on the second floor
@@beautymaven3952 thats very true.
Wouldn't he have killed her, if they were that close, somethings not right.
@@trick1838 exactly. If he killed 4 people, he won’t leave her alive. If she saw his eyebrows then he saw her - plus, she was in basement - no way could she see a whole other floor
I don’t mean to bash the FBI agent, but her hypothesis is way off. I think a body language expert can come up with something better than her. Geez.
The murderer studies crimes yet leaves so many evidence and killing 4 people at once. He is fully aware that he will get caught. He’s probably thinking why it took so long for them to figure things out.
1. Letting a witness live
2. Leaving a knife sheath
3. Didn’t get rid of his car
4. His demeanor at the court house
He wants to be famous and possibly write a book is my hypothesis.
As for the surviving roommate… she saw him, said WTF another weirdo friend of my roommates, locked her door, and went to sleep.
I honestly think he didn’t see her. If she only cracked the door open, she could see him but perhaps because of the angle of him coming from Xanas room, he might not have even noticed the door cracked open. He was in a rush and with adrenaline, combined with the angle - I think thank goodness he didn’t see her.
Good point!
or she lied about seeing him
The fact that people are giving these 2 surviving roommates flack is so upsetting. They are kids. This case is getting so much attention because of how shocking it is. How random it is. Yet some people think the 2 roommates should of known everything that happened immediately, and then call 911. The knife used is so brutal that one stab wound is supposedly worse than a gunshot wound. They were probably all killed rather quickly (they were because the timeline says so), and already dead by the time the guy left. DM saw a stranger in a mask walk by. No knife. No blood. It's dark. 2 weeks after they had a Halloween party, so a mask might not immediately tell someone "Hey, I just committed a quadruple murder." Remember all the noise complaint videos? I can assure you that house has seen many random things occur during late night hours. I'm sure after DM locked her door the house returned to being completely quiet. Without any knowledge of what happened, I can understand why a 20 year old female wouldn't immediately go walking around the house to investigate if she was afraid. The house now being completely quiet would want her to assume that was a good thing and everyone is asleep. It was 4:20 AM and her nerves probably kept her awake for a while. Calling 911 just before noon is only 7 1/2 hours later. It's actually not that crazy that the call happened when it did. What is crazy is the random, horrifying act committed by a stalker. A loser who acted alone. There is nothing suspicious about the roommates to imagine anymore! Now it's just criticizing kids who are completely traumatized. Anyone who is still hung up on the roommates needs to get over it, and really think about what they went through.
Great writeup Chris!
Wasn't there whimpering and crying that caused DM to open the door a second time that caused DM to open the door a 2nd time when masked guy walked by?
But DM went back to sleep?
These people are/were not kids, but young adults. Why infantilize them?
Sorry for repeating the line folks, I'm not JB.
@@aulusagerius7127 Chris was just trying to shorten the post by a few letters, IMHO.
Well said Chris! This happens so very often to crime witnesses and also crime victims. "Fight or Flight has become, Fight, Flight or Freeze".
Very informative! Thank you!
I think it was Xana saying someone is here And she just may thought it was Kaylie I think he had already did what he did on the 3rd floor he was quick and fast I think that’s why he went in on her and Ethan I think he heard her say someone was there Poor babies I hate this happened to everyone involved Poor Kid and family’s gonna be traumatized for life for what…..he so wrong for this he don’t deserve to even breath the day of light again
Downplaying the only witness actions is irresponsible
Do you have personal experience with traumatic events, such as this one? If so, what would you have done?
@@jennifermariejoyceit's so easy to judge others when you did not experience what they experienced.
@@bmoshareholderappleshareho855 Exactly. I've experienced similar trauma, and I would still never pretend to know how these survivors felt or feel.
I have had severe panic attacks as a result of trauma so bad that i had to sit or lay down to focus on breathing and completely fallen asleep for hours almost as if subconsciously hoping that it was a bad dream and things would be ok in the morning. The events that triggered me was my coworker I shared an office with I discovered had been sabotaging my work and tried to get me fired that day only to drop dead of a heart attack in the bathroom and police had searched our office after that and the same day police stopped at my apartment asking my bf questions about any security cameras in our apartment or building. Then when I was home and awoke the next morning I look out my bedroom window and building is surrounded by news vans and police cars and yellow police tape and i completely hyperventilated and froze in place kept saying why are we surrounded by cops over and over again and I then bf made me lay down and call in sick for me and come to find out a man has been found murdered across the street that morning with an axe and it was our towns first homicide ever and made big national news. My brain thought I was being framed for murdering my coworker.
Nowhere in that affidavit it says she was panicked, traumatized or in fear for her life. NOWHERE. It said she "in a frozen shock like phase" which I actually think was a typo for "frozen shock like FACE". Which makes more sense with the context of the affidavit. She was startled, not going into shock.
You are speculating on evidence that doesn't exist so far.
@@fernandaolivares7926 According to the 911 call, it sounds like is EXACTLY what happened.
I used to scoff about people who had panic attacks. Get it together, be strong I would say. Then something traumatic in my life happened. Poetic justice, I had a series of panic attacks. Over trn years has now passed, and LOT more empathy for others who are under stress. Can totally undestand why she panicked and then went to sleep. Used to happen to me too.
I do believe D was in complete shock imo
@@B_BodziakThe 911 call was made the NEXT day when they dicovered the bodies when she in fact went into shock, panicked, fainted etc. Which is the normal response to realizing what happened. It's absurd people think she was aware of the danger or saw the bodies and went back to sleep.
Again, NOTHING in the affidavit says she was afraid, traumatized or in tfaumatic shock before she went to sleep or that she was aware of what had happened.
dont believe for a minute dylan passed out ! for 8 hours until she decided to ring her friends, !!
Go listen to Nancy Grace earlier….DM stated on affidavit 3x that she was in her bedroom in the basement…then how could she see him upstairs and see his bushy eyebrows. It’s a fact he never made it to the basement since he allegedly did the murders upstairs and left his knife sheath on the second floor
Yeah no way someone falls asleep at 4am. After being out that night.
People in here saying the Feds, State Police and Locals are all in on a conspiracy with the witness to frame this guy, have legit gone off the deep end. And it's embarrassing.
First you're pissed they're not doing enough, now you're mad that they were doing alot behind the scenes and are calling it a frame job?
All we have is the affidavit. Which btw was extremely detailed for an affidavit. But it's just an affidavit. So I can only imagine how much other evidence they have. Wait for the rest to come out.
Just because it was done quickly and you aren't happy with a witness doesn't mean he was framed. Ffs. The fact he was quick was probably the reason for his mistakes. Sure he was efficient in what he came to do, unfortunately, but because of him moving quickly and leaving quickly, he made a mistake. It actually makes perfect sense.
And anyone saying he couldn't do that, that quick, doesn't understand the damage a knife can do in the right spot. It's over in a min. This guy went in there on a rampage and intended to kill on the spot and cleary was swinging with all his force. A guy who used to box mind you
those people are just the 'defund the popo' crowd.
💯 agree!
Exactly, can’t please these people, hope Moscow wins in the end
@@zzz7zzz9 Maybe. I mean I'm not some obsessed cop lover or anything. I'm not a defunder either. I think there are good and bad ones. But LE did an dam good job here. These comments are getting absolutely absurd. I just read someone say it's going to get thrown out of court because it took them too long to get him. Lol wtf
Another one said they thought he was guilty until they read the affidavit, and now it's clear his innocent! Lol idk of these people are trolling or sick in the head but it's honeslty creepy af
Exactly. He was, without a doubt, the perpetrator. The DNA evidence is just icing on the cake. The extremely tight correlation between his phone activity and vehicle movements caught on camera are alone enough to convict him. He's the only person in both towns to have not only a vehicle that matches in terms of both make and model but is also missing a front license plate/tag. Literally no one else there has that combination of incriminating factors. Let that sink in... Dude is driving a car that not only is the right make and model, but does not have a front tag because he was using Pennsylvania plates. Exactly like the car caught on all those security videos. They had identified him as the prime suspect in just two weeks, we just didn't know.
Apparently he came back to scene afterwards, I suspect he realized he had lost the knife sheath and was hoping to retrieve it
He knew he had lost it after he exited and got home to his apartment.. which is why he drove by there again..
I think it may have been too risky in his mind to actually go back in...
@@GarretGrayCameraHe got nervous and chickened out. This guy has impulsive behaviour, like the lady FBI said “no common sense”.
@pkb9237 Being arrogant he vastly understimated the abilities of the local police.
@@GarretGrayCamera If he got spooked by the other resident he booked it.. but when he saw that the police hadn't arrived yet, he was just too scared to attempt to return to get it, is what I'm thinking? Probably could not face the bodies he had left behind.
I'm also still curious why these two girls. His tower pings show he'd been in their neighborhood before in the months prior, right?
Didn’t a witness walking past at 9 something in the morning report that the front door was open? Maybe he did go back and look for it.
DID SHE FREEZE FOR 7-8HRS? NO ONE IS TRYING TO VICTIM SHAME, BUT THIS JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE 😕 MAYBE IF HE THREATENED HER WE COULD ALL MAKE SENSE OF IT, BUT TO BE SO TERRIFIED AND NOT TRY TO GET HELP IS CRAZY.
She clearly knew something was off to open close and lock her door multiple times but didn’t think to call for help? I’m sorry but no
Fear until NOON THE FOLLOWING DAY? IF THAT DOES NOT SOUND WAY FISHY, THEN WHAT DOES??? WTF???
I’m glad she mentioned how the survivor’s reaction and possible response was. A lot of people are judging her and it’s unfair. Unless you have been in a situation like this- YOU DON’T KNOW what response or action you would have.
I think it's a completely fair and reasonable question to raise, as do a lot of people obviously.
True, but they might as well leave that part out of the case because his attorneys are going to tear her up if they put her on the stand. If you think the comments are bad wait til they dive into it.
I don't buy that, not at all, the threat was gone, she heard a scream, plus she heard dog barking, heard crying and talking, saw a man with a mask on walking through the house, then I lock my door and go to sleep for eight hours... Idk, not saying Bryan is not the murderer, but I have to wonder, if a call was made immediately to 911, could any of those victims have been saved. As a parent of one of the victims, that would be an overwhelming thought...
She hit the nail right on the head. Most people with smarts and high degrees have no common sense. My sister has a master’s degree and she has no common sense whatsoever. So true unfortunately.
Yes. Look at the shape of this country and my state of CA. No common sense!!!!
What do you think causes it? maybe they tell themselves "i've got a high degree so by default i'm automatically smart with everything" and therefore they stop using their common sense?
This is the kind of thing that someone who never went to college likes to tell themselves...LOL
Same with a few of my siblings......
I have a PhD and no common sense at all :(
I'd put Hot Dogs on his plate and tell him "Thats all we have ". When he gets hungry enough he'll eat it . I would not cater to him and his vegan diet .
Sorry. Prisons cater to kosher, Muslim, carb and all dietary needs.
Yeah, yeah, OK.
There are rules in prison, and even prisoners have rights, whether you like it or not.
Please, grow up.
These interviews has been nothing but very dismissive against suspicions with the roommates. They all are like "we should not judge" why the fuc* should we not? We should just automatically roll them out as suspects? Is that wise? We're all judging Kohburger, why not the roommates? Are they that special? It's normal to be suspicious with them, they're technically part of the crime. They were at the crime scene, for God's sake!
You know this is only a affidavit...not everything is step by step what happened! This is only a paper to arrest someone!
There's also the chance that he didn't even see her. She probably wasn't standing in her doorway with her door wide open. I'd imagine she was hearing things and was scared and probably only had it cracked open a tiny bit just enough to peek out. A lot of people have also been questioning why she waited until almost 8 hrs later to call the police. I think she may have waited a little bit until she knew he was gone and then went to check on her friends and found them and passed out running away from what she found. The other roommate Bethany apparently slept through everything. When Bethany woke up, she would have found Dylan on the floor. I think that's where the call to 911 saying a roommate was unconscious came from. Bethany had to have still been unaware of what had happened on the floors above her to her roommates. The whole thing is so heartbreaking and insane. So many questions. Why didn't anyone scream or yell or say anything at all after Kaylee saying someone's here?? How did he not track blood through the entire house all the way to his car? He wasn't carrying a bag or anything according to DMs statement in the affidavit. He didn't have a hazmat suit or booties on covering his shoes. So much just doesn't make sense.
Police probably released just a fraction of the evidence. They are surely developing much more. Far more will come out at trial.
I thought you could see blood in the kitchen from the pics when police were in the residence? Detectives said it was the worst they’ve ever seen. I wonder if it was light in the house or dark. I don’t know if she passed out but that’s a long time that went by with nothing. Didn’t d Dylan and Bethany end up together on the first floor? I’m so confused but I can’t understand how she was awake when all of this happened. Unless she was on something or very drunk I just don’t get it.
@@pamelasmith6221 I read they lied about the girl being on the second floor and seeing him to make him think no one had seen him.
@@letsgomets07 I doubt they'd tell that in the affidavit and chance screwing up a conviction with a lie. Who knows though
@@Marcia.Marcia.Marcia sorry I should have worded it better… originally they lied and said they both were downstairs. That way he thought no one saw him and he continued thinking he got away with it. But as far as never knowing anything, yeah who really knows what the hell goes on out there
Sooo I wonder how many snowmobiles and fancy TVs and cars and luxury vacations ... those in the legal profession, ajudicating this case, will be able to squeeze out of it while insisting, "We just want to make sure he gets a fair trial"?
Something tells me he wanted to be caught. He chose to enter a house with so many people living in it and other people coming and going. He stalked the house, he was there at least 12 times. This was not impulsive. He went in there, risked being seen, he used his own car, this was planned. It just doesn't make sense. He is playing games with us.
Well it’s a pretty tough task to kill 4 people in a house with a knife. The guy looks so frail as well.
Leaving dna that could be traced through GEDMATCH baffles me. 🤷🏻♀️
I think it was planned but not by him…I think he is a fall guy
The thing is it has to be proved in court. He knows this and he knows it won't be easy. OJ anyone?
@@oldironsides4107 yep but if this had to do with drugs and dealers…the hit man would be a “professional” killer who could easily do it in 15 mins. When this first broke…I read Kaylees mom sold heroine…now this much later Bryan is said to have done heroine in hs. Maybe he still dabbled. Would explains them pings near the “party house” Also would explain the male voice saying “it’s okay I’m going to help you.” If he went over to buy some drugs…and found them that way…also might explain his return at 9am…to see if they had been found. Maybe freaked out and ran cos how could explain why he was there, and would he be believed…might be in authorities best interest to arrest him rather than an assasin for a drug dealer/cartel. If the mother of Kaylee did have dealings in heroine…maybe it was a revenge killing…since it was stated Kaylee had the worst wounds. Not sure what that family does to make income, but dealing on the side would explain also one of the initial questions: how did a waitress afford the vehicle she had gotten. Also how in the world is that family affording to have that lawyer retained for that long. Not shaming the victim or the family…but my gut just says something is way wrong.
It’s possible that the alleged killer never even saw Dylan. My heart goes out to Dylan and I pray that god give her strength to heal, as much as she can! 🫶🏻🫶🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🫶🏻
It's VERY possible... particularly if you read his writings on "visual snow," written a decade ago. He describes being plagued by a problem which causes night-blindness and tunnel-vision. ;)
@word wizard where does it say she went on tik tok?
@@ThisEpicLife Judging by what he wrote back when he was 16, he has had mental illness for a long time, along with the visual snow. How incredibly sad, for all involved, that he didn't get the help he needed back then. Who knows how many others there are feeling this way, around us?😥😳
This is absolutely heartbreaking,
I really appreciate Jennifer. Please have her on more.
Also, if you ask her a question please let her finish speaking.
I think one of them struggled with him and may have pulled the sheath off of him.
Exactly what I was thinking!
Some victims did struggle Xana was one of those victims that fought until she could no longer fight I guess DM just heard crying and whimpering and after seeing the murder she went to sleep DM is about one of the most stupidest coward I have ever heard of to scared to even dial 911 most fear sobers people up
what doesnt make to much sense is what Jennifer talks several minutes per day in tvs
Poor Dylan. I’m so sorry for her. Gratefull, She survived. What horror she felt. Prayers for her and the other girl
Yes, her life has forever been changed. I do feel for her, no one deserves to be fearfully forced into reality. Wait til she gets on the stand....
7 hours of freezing from fear what nonsense
Very fishy
arrest her immediately
This fact the Defence are gonna have a field day.....
It's hard to kill a flopping fish with a pocket knife or club. Killing 4 people was probably more gruesome and harder than he anticipated. He wanted out of there without getting caught. Tunnel vision under stress is normal. The witness was driven by fear x1000000. It's not uncommon to have random people walking through your house and hearing noise all night when you live in a party house in college. I know first hand! 🍻
Some people wouldn't call 911 for someone, why isn't this a possibility. Her storys don't add up.
Party house, party house rules - mind your own fucking business and we'll meet up when rents due, bruh
@@jrey6186 Common sense, see a stranger in your dark house at 4am, call 911.
Nobody can imagine how horrific it must have been for roommate. What many aren't understanding is that when she called friends on her cell phone, why she didn't call police, 911... So much isn't known yet. Praying for the families.
Garbage.
I CALL BS! THE ROOMMATES ARE LYING!
What to her was horrific? Her hearing a guy saying " Im going to help you" possible crying or a strange guy walking towards her? She obviously didn't know her roomates were murdered. She was scared because of the guys appearance Im sure but I highly doubt she knew what happened. It makes sense she didn't call the police, she called friends to gossip about some guy going to her roommates room late at night but probably was worried they weren't up yet. If you ever lived in a "party" house you would understand.
How could she lock herself in the room and not call for hours like 6-7 hours. What's dumb broad could have saved someone.
@@MellowAlchemist finally someone who believes what I believe. It’s BS SOMETHING IS NOT RIGHT
Why did it take the roommate so long to call the police
high AF?
Dylan's statements are inconsistent. She made it sound as if she was I. The lose level 2x. 1) when he passed by 2) the next day after 10 am she states she did not know anyone was dead until she and Beth went UPSTAIRS to the kitchen. The affidavit states she was in a room on the second one floor. That is where the kitchen is???
That’s what I’ve trying to figure that out.
She is so suspicious.
DM froze because she didn't expect to see anyone, it simply startled her and in 2 seconds he was past her. She obviously didn't think it cause for concern even though it did startle her. She didn't wanna fuss at any roommates about the noises disturbing her, so she just locked her door and went to sleep. It was the wee hours of the night and so she slept in late.
I think three things contributed to this mystery: 1) BCK wanted to get outta there, before he ran into more people & the time factor overall; 2) He was exhausted and injured and didn't think he could fight/kill more people; and 3) She wasn't his main target. I think his main target was Kaylee and I think he could have been in the house before. He killed Maddie because she was in the room with her BFF. He killed Evan and Zana because they awoke as K & M were attacked, and he was confronted by Evan, with Zana behind him. She ran back into her room as BCK attacked Evan. She had no where, nor time, to escape to. This guy is like other arrogant killers before him; he's death penalty bound.
Criminology has nothing to do with crime scene forensic science. He's at best an amateur criminal wannabe serial killer who think he'd get away with murders but made many mistakes leading this his arrest.
Why would she be in shock? People were in and out that house all the time, and another dude letting himself out wouldn't seem to raise a lot of alarm bells.
Maybe i watch too many horror movies but when you see a homeowner lock themselves in a bedroom from an intruder they don't usually go to sleep for 8 hours and then call the police.
Clearly this person was an intruder for that to happen. Were there phone calls made to the other housemates to warn them or make sure they were ok?
@@stellarwind1946 DM had no idea that anything had happened at the time or in the moments immediately before she saw the guy. Again, "shock" seems to be an unwarranted response.
I think the “she was in shock and passed out” narrative is coming out because
a) it makes the story more sensational
b) i think people and possibly dm herself do not want to accept that she went to bed while her friends were dead upstairs (gruesome)
The reality is, she didnt know who he was and didnt care. It was a frat house and she just assumed it was someones friend or hookup.
@@TheItFactorMMA "The reality is, she didnt know who he was and didnt care. It was a frat house and she just assumed it was someones friend or hookup." Agreed. (Except not a "frat" house, but a party house.)
I’m just putting this out there: 8 hours is plenty of time to clean, shower and get rid of evidence. What if the roommate didn’t go back to sleep? What if that’s the reason the killer went back? What if Dylan had something to do with it?
Exactly 👍
Or maybe it was a drug-related thing?
Yet more victim blaming. Lovely.
@@smoocher I’m not. It’s a theory.
How did Brian get inside the house ? doors were not locked ? someone opened the door for him ?
That house never lock, anybody can walk in. Party, drinking, orgies sex, loud music, neighbor constant complaining and called cop on the past. Anybody can come in and out like a whore house.
It was 'the party house'... the doors were always open...
The house has code but its never locked or everyone knew it. I can't remember. But the occupants of the house had people coming and going. It was like an off campus frat house.
Many possibilities. Doors unlocked, Xana allegedly had a door dash delivery at 4 am and the crimes happened right after that.
@@mannym.3248 The perfect storm! He probably knew this. That's why it was easy for him to enter
If these items were toxic and needed to be bio cleaned. How can defense just go in there and haul these bloody bedding out and it’s not even in contained truck????
It wasn't the defense team. Pay attention
It's dry
She could have phoned 911!
Jennifer was fighting the urge to laugh as the news lady started listing BKs mistakes. 😂
Took a long time to catch him
Fear….you would call the police.
Yet you call friends 1st !!!
@@saywhatyouwant888 and friends wait 8 hours to come help
Police had her as #1 witness from the start and wisely told the media that they both slept through it
Apparently college kids don't have common sense.