This episode is coming to you as the TimeGhost Team works 24/7 to put the finishing touches on our 24-hour D-Day Programme. You'll be able to watch the full event here on the World War Two Channel, and bite-sized episodes over on our special D-Day Channel youtube.com/@D-Day24Hours-sm5pe/videos Join the project on DDay.TimeGhost.tv
Virgin take Rome to get overshadowed in the news by D day vs Chad desteoy the Germans and Italy and force them to send troops from France to indirectly aid D-day
I dunno, things in China and Burma have really been kicking off lately. We could see some big battles coming soon that would dwarf the Italian campaign.
My grandfather was shot down over France, May 27th 1944 in a B-17 fortress bomber. He attempted to rescue the pilot unsuccessfully after the rest of his crew scattered when the plane crash landed, fending only for themselves. Eventually all survivors on the plane were captured by German soldiers including my grandfather who spent the rest of world war II in a pow camp ran by the Nazis.
My guess would be that they’re putting everything they have into the D-Day program and setting other content aside for now. I wouldn’t be surprised if things pick back up next month
I would really like to hear Spartacus talk about the Nazi mentality to proceed, even intensify their genocide at this point. I don't think I would exaggerate if this is the darkest page in the complete history of humanity, the absolute deepest the human soul has sunk, and it needs to be laid bare for everyone to see.
he'll have a lot to cover on the day even, with the preemptive retribution attacks ze germans were carrying out to the point of slowing down troop movements. It's like a switch was flicked and went from 'we're in conquered territory' to 'ok it's a warzone now, start shooting everything that moves'
A side note this week on May 25 1944 is that Charles Hunter will personally hand to Joseph Stilwell (who had flown to Myitkyina Airfield) a letter listing all the grievances from the field officers and men of the U.S. 5307th Composite Unit (Provisional). They noted that the area commanders had betrayed them by depriving them of rest and treating them as expendable, leading to the whole of 5307th Composite Unit (Provisional) becoming practically ineffective as a combat unit.
Stilwell ruined Merrils Marauders and Mad Mike was adamant he was not going to do the same to his troops. In fact he told his comms people not to take any calls from Stilwell .
Thanks for covering Anzio. My father fought there; he never talked about the war, and we have no idea about his service other than he was at Anzio. His records were among those destroyed in the St. Louis fire, so we can't even get information from there.
Rumor has it that the biggest carrier battle of all time(24 carriers, 1300+ aircraft) may happen soon after D Day. I hope there will be some detailed coverage of Forager vs. A-Go.
Side note in the Pacific:! Admiral Nimitz has called for a major conference with top navy army and marine commanders on which islands will be attacked in the central Pacific! At roughly the same time the Japanese high command have known for some time that a large strike force is headed for somewhere in the central Pacific and are training new pilots and enforcing every islands from the Jima islands to Palau! Some 2000 aircraft and one hundred thousand men are spread all over these islands for the upcoming invasions.... There navy is stationed in three key locations to stop it!
Worth noting that Slim's view of the Japanese fighting man was more nuanced than was implied. He had no time at all for the Japanese Empire, and a pretty dim view of their high command. He had a pretty strong respect for the fighting capabilities of the individual soldiers. He though they were incredibly tenacious, brave, and could withstand conditions and fighting that Western armies would blanche at. His lack of respect was for the offensive tactics and strategy (at divisional level and higher), not their defensive prowess (at battalion level and lower).
Slim was correct in his assessment. The British soldier has been called a lion led by donkeys but I would say that that particular quote is more apt of the Japanese soldier. A lion led by complete Cabbage Heads. The retreat from Kohima/Imphal was one of the greatest catastrophes in Japanese military history, one that gets ignored in the histories from what I've read. Tens of thousands of men disappeared into the Burmese jungle to become fertiliser. Cannibalism was a known feature of the Japanese retreat.
He had respect for their offensive tactics. Slim, along with the rest of the British army, had been easily defeated by the Japanese in 1942. Slim, to his credit, was the only western allied general to ask the Chinese how the Japanese fought and how China had won their occasional victories. The defense of Imphal took all of that knowledge and was adapted to negate Japanese offensive advantages.
@@Conn30Mtenor agree with your assessment of (some) Japanese higher command. Just be aware that the "lions led by donkeys" quote is made up by Alan Clark (I think he attributed to Hindenburg or Ludendorf, but it was made up by whole cloth). It's also completely incorrect in spirit as well as fact, but that's the sort of "historian" Clark was...
@@porksterbob as always, yes and no, and I totally get what you are saying and why, and it's got a lot of force behind it. Just to start off, Slim himself wasn't really defeated - in 1942 he inherited a lost position where victory wasn't possible and at least managed to extract his army back to India. And you are right in saying he learned a lot of lessons along the way. I think a nuanced relating of Slim's views of the Japanese senior command is that he respected their ability to move fast and attack unexpectedly, and the force they could bring to bear, and the risks they were willing to run to do all of that. But he thought that they took serious logistical risk, and that therefore if you could hold out against the initial onslaught you could defeat them, if not relatively easily, at least relatively certainly. Deny them the opportunity to resupply off Allied logistics and you were going to be in good shape. He absolutely was caught off balance by the start of the Kohima / Imphal battle, so score one to Japanese higher command (he admits this in Defeat into Victory), but the overall course of both Admin Box and Kohima / Imphal went broadly to his plan and delivered the stategic triumph he needed to recapture Burma within the year. So yes, you are right - I was probably wrong to say he had contempt for the Japanese - but he had confidence that they were broadly predictable and he had a method to defeat them (in which he was right)
He has been quoted as saying that commanders of all armies have talked about their troops fighting to the death, but that the Japanese actually did it.
I hadn't heard of Clark's insubordination before this. If that is true, he should have been relieved of command, court martialed, and dishonorably discharged. No matter that his commanding officer was British, he still must obey orders and keep to the strategy. I can understand a little bit the desire for glory that some of these big heads want but to allow so many soldiers and so much armor to escape, all for personal recognition, was a huge dereliction of duty. I said if that is all true. I'm going to have to read up on it.
I think the day AFTER would be better.Just as Hitler thinks "Phew,at least Stalin isnt attacking yet,lets move some Panzers West.What do you mean they are breaking through in Belorussia!"
7:25 - this answers the question of why no one in the US Army tried to deflect the investigation into Clark’s “Murderous Blunder” at the Rapido [Gari] River battle until it reached Congress in 1946 and the War Department intervened
I once took a class in university on American Military History. The textbooks were written by the US Army. In the WW2 chapters, there’s a part that lists some of the famous generals and how skilled they were, some of the best US Army generals in the nation’s history. Eisenhower, Bradley, Patton… And Clark. Somehow the authors thought Mark Clark deserved to be listed as one of the greatest WW2 US Army generals. Wow.
Well, on the plus side he did not lose a battle or an entire campaign. And he was the liberator of Rome. So his gamble to disobey Alexander did pay off.
@@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623 Except making a very shoddy landing operation at Salerno that was almost pushed back to sea , trying to cross Rapido three times only to be repulsed each time then letting eight German divisions to slip away by switching the route of advance after Anzio breakut with his direct insubordination to his superiors therefore wasting all laurels of Operation Diadem plan
@@merdiolu I don't think Salerno was that shoddy. It was just the most northern place the Allies could land and also a very obvious place. It wasn't like the Germans could not see this coming and they weren't taking the bait of 8th Army landing in Calabria and Tarento of trying to fight them there. I'd sooner blame Clark for Anzio, but I reckon considering there was only enough shipping to land 2 divisions there and it was Churchill's meddling that pushed it through that was just a clusterf*** waiting to happen.
@@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623 It was Clark who caused Salerno landings such an almost on brink of disaster. He assigned Ernest Dawley to VI Corps who failed tolead properly , rejected naval bombardtment from sea before landing to achieve suprise when suprise advantage was forfeited already due to German air recon of Allied fleet before landings etc...He and Dawley should share the blame.
Just before my father was transferred from the Mediterranean to the Pacific theatre, his ship dropped anchor in Damietta. On his ship was this fellow from Lithuania; he worked as the main ship's cook and was a master at pastry making, as well as being a nut for crossword puzzles. My dad, then all of 18, ran into the sailor's hall and grabbed up as many papers with crossword puzzles as he could, no matter what language, as a little reward for great food. The cook was very pleased and got to work on them. He was working on one puzzle in English and ran across a clue he did not understand, so he asked what word the clue could be referring to. One of the sailors, a fellow out of Florida, laughed at the cook and said, "Don't you know any English?" The cook then said, "My first language is Lithuanian. After that I picked up Estonia and Latvian, then Russian and Finnish. After that I learned Swedish and Danish, along with some Dutch, Norwegian, and enough French, Spanish, Turkish, and English to get by. How many languages do you know?" After that, everyone helped him with his crossword puzzles.
This week on May 25 1944, after 6 months of rest, reinforcements and trainings, the French fighter regiment "Normandie" joined its base in Doubrovka (70km north-west of Smolensk) and returned on the frontline for active duty. On November 4 1943, the squadron and its pilots are in the spotlight because the group was named "Compagnon de la Liberation" by General De Gaulle and the nominations finally arrived. First Lieutenant Béguin is appointed Captain, Second Lieutenants Albert and Lefevbre First Lieutenants, Chief Warrant Officers Risso, Mathis (severely burned and repatriated to England) and Schick named SecondLieutenants. On November 12, what remained of the squadron after its first campaign was repatriated exhausted to its winter quarters in Tula. On December 22 1943, arrival of Lieutenants Amarger, Bertrand and Cuffault and Chief Warrant Officers André, Cazaneuve and Feldzer. On December 29, the French Air Force finally granted to the "Normandie" squadron the "official" status of a Fighter Regiment R (R for Russian) with 4 squadrons ; The Russians already called "Normandie" a regiment since July 1943 but the French side still refered to it as "GC3 (Fighter group n°3) Normandie" until now. On December 30, arrival of Chief Warrant Officer Carbon. On January 7 1944, the first reinforcement of 14 pilots arrived. it included: Lieutenants de Faletans, de Seyne, Sauvage (Jean) and Verdier, the Chief Warrant Officers Déchanet, of Geoffre, Delin, Douarre, Marchi, Martin, Mertzizen, Penverne, of Saint Marceaux and Sauvage (Roger). On January 26, Captain Brihaye and Chief Warrant Officer Pierrot arrived. On February 6, Lieutenant Moynet, Second Lieutenant Le Martelot and Chief Warrant Officers Bagnères, Bourdieu, Iribarne and Lebras arrived. "Normandie" received 11 Yaks 9T with 37mm cannon. On February 7 the "Normandie" regiment was organized into 3 squadrons. On February 24, Lieutenant Charras, Second Lieutenant Castin, Chief Warrant Officers Monier and Schoendorff and Captain Didier Béguin returned to Moscow. Béguin was then repatriated to Algiers. He will participate in other fights within the "Alsace" fighter group over France. On February 28, arrival of Captain Louis Delfino and delivery of another Yak9T. On March 18 1944, 12 pilots arrived as reinforcements (Captain Challe (Mauritius) and Chief Warrant Officers Challe (René, his brother), Emonet, Gaston, Genès, Manceau, Menut, Miquel, Perrin, Pinon, Querné). But that same day, the regiment deplored the disappearance of Second Lieutenant Joire (just nominated) and Chief Warrant Officer Bourdieu whose planes collided in training flight. On April 3 1944, Captain Matras, Chief Warrant Officers Bayssade, de la Salle, Lorillon, Taburet and Versini arrived. On April 8, reinforcement of 8 Yak9T. On April 21st, death of the Chief Warrant Officer Foucaud in flight exercise. The very heterogeneous reinforcement, both in its origin and in its quality, had to undergo training in combat conditions in the USSR and this caused a lot of material damage. On May 6 1944, delivery of 20 yak 9 with 20mm cannon + 1 yak9T. Finally on May 25, after a stopover in Borovskoye, the "Normandie" regiment (with 4 squadrons and 58 pilots) joined its base in Doubrovka. The maintenance of the flying fleet (51 Yaks 9, 2 Ya7 used for training, a Yak 6 and a U2) was entrusted to Russian mechanics under the direction of Captain Engineer Sergueï Agavélian. The first missions did not see any fightings but... on May 28, following an engine failure, First Lieutenant Lefèvre crashed and was seriously burned. Marcel Lefèvre was among the first pilots who volunteered to join the "Normandie" squadron back in 1942 and fight in Russia. By this point he was a flying ace with 14 aerial victories, 11 of which have been confirmed. He died from his wounds in hospital, at the age of 26, a week later on 5 June 1944, at the very moment when the Allies launched their assault on the beaches of his native Normandy... He was buried in Moscow, near Napoleon's Old Guard soldiers, surrounded by honors in the presence of his combat comrades and the highest Russian and French authorities. Posthumously and by order of Stalin, he was made a Hero of the Soviet Union with the Order of Lenin.
@@JohnJohn-pe5kr How they got to the USSR, and in some numbers, was quite a feat in wartime conditions. Members of the unit tended to wear a mixture of French and Soviet uniform items. I have seen a photo of one pilot who is wearing a French Air Force peaked cap and tunic, but Soviet trousers and boots. Free French troops in North Africa had often mixed French and British uniforms, and in 1944 the tendency was to mix and match French and US uniforms.
Even today the Normandie regiment is still remembered in Russia, funny how the USSR and post USSR Russia was more kind to Free French Forces than the allies themselves, especially after the US entered the war.
it’s just that the Normandy regiment did not fit into the templates of the allies: the heroes of France could not successfully fight against the German aces on "shitty" Soviet aircrafts and under general command of "brainless" Stalinist generals
8:58 ah, one of the Lend-Lease Shermans. I remember reading translated accounts from a soviet tanker, they mentioned the upholstery on the crew seats being a target for theft. Also that they did a supply raid later on in the war and a german vehicle managed to tag along on the end of the convoy as they withdrew back to soviet lines
It is crazy to think that on this day, all those years ago, so much has happened on the same day I have finally graduated college, today in 2023. I have learned much in other areas thanks to Indy and the many teams. The Great War, in-between two wars, and World War Two have taught me so much. You have been a sort of an attached education to me over these years of schooling, and you will continue doing so until the end. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for making this knowledge free, open, unbias (besides shining humanism on the topics), and making this series so well done. I am forever grateful to the teams work. From the bottom of my heart, thank you.
Just found this channel today, good stuff. Thank you for mentioning the Canadian effort in Italy. I recently discovered that my grandmother had a cousin who died at Pontecorvo on the 21st of May 1944. He was a trooper with the 4th Princess Louise Dragoon Guards.
They aren't that rare, though Soviet captions often did not mention their foreign origin. American and British tanks usually entered the USSR via Iran and tended to be sent to southern parts of the front. SPOILER A number of Shermans with Red Army crews will be photographed entering Bucharest, Romania, later in the year.
And here is my last (for now, it'll come back in roughly a year's time) post on the story of USS England. Last week saw her score four more submarine kills, bringing her total up to five. This week sees her sink the sixth and final submarine of her legendary spree. Where we left off on the 28th, our destroyer escorts (England, George, Raby, and now Spangler) had just departed from their replenishment stop at Manus and were resuming their search for the remaining Japanese submarines on Scouting Line NA. Two days later in the early hours of May 30, two of Hoggatt Bay's tin cans, USS Hazelwood (DD-531) and USS Heermann (DD-532), gained radar contacts and moved to investigate. Heermann lost hers and began conducting a search for it, but Hazelwood began making depth charge attacks on hers. Just prior to making her attack, Hazelwood contacted Raby to inquire about the DEs' positions, and replied with an affirmative when Commander Hains asked if she desired their assistance. Since George and Raby were the two closest ships they would respond to the destroyers' contacts while England and Spangler would continue patrolling the line, much to England's chagrin. George and Raby would take over for Hazelwood and Heermann, but for much of the day would have no luck with this apparent submarine. Numerous attacks were made and several dubious hits were claimed by both ships, but neither of them achieved anything concrete and the entire time neither were entirely confident they were actually attacking a submarine and not just a reef, since the target was moving very infrequently and only over a relatively small area. Additionally the two's efforts would be marred by mechanical failures, with both ships suffering steering casualties and Raby suffering a malfunction in her recorder that would necessitate the use of a stopwatch to time at least one of her attacks. George would also periodically leave Raby alone with the contact to go and examine another oil slick which had formed nearby and created more confusion over if there was more than one submarine in the area. But finally at 1945, all doubts were removed when their submarine made a sudden and explosive entrance. George was off investigating the aforementioned oil slick, having ordered Raby to hold the contact for the rest of the night, when Raby reported that it had begun moving again. George immediately began heading back to Raby, but before she got there, their target would strike. This was none other than Ro-105, the flagship of Submarine Division 51. Apparently having taken advantage of the growing darkness and the two destroyer escorts operating separately from one another, Ro-105 surfaced to fire a spread of torpedoes at Raby. The destroyer escort was suddenly rocked by seven to eight violent explosions in groups of two or three in her vicinity, Ro-105 having likely fired two to four torpedoes, though fortunately none had managed to hit her. These explosions were felt clearly on both ships, with Raby likening them to the explosions felt after England's kills and George to depth charges exploding in close proximity to her. George arrived on-scene shortly after to find Raby had been given a bit of a scare but was otherwise unharmed, and gained contact on Ro-105 shortly after. As she circled the submarine she noted a definite smell of diesel oil, possibly indicating that she had managed to score a non-fatal hit on Ro-105 earlier in the day. But along with potentially leaking fuel, Ro-105 had another urgent problem: her batteries. WWII-era submarines had two methods of propulsion; while on the surface, they would use their standard diesel engines. But while underwater, they had to rely on electric batteries due to submarines having a limited oxygen supply that couldn't be spent burning diesel. The only way these batteries could be recharged at sea was to surface and charge them with the diesel engines. The time was now shortly after 0300 on the 31st, Ro-105 had been underwater for potentially over 24 hours straight, and George had impressively maintained sonar contact with her for over six hours. Even though she had limited her movements as much as possible to conserve her batteries for as long as she could, they were undoubtedly running low at this point. She would have to find some way to recharge them. At 0302, George and Raby were sailing around 4000 yards apart from one another when simultaneously George began to lose sonar contact and Raby reported that she thought there was something in-between them. Two minutes later, George would also pick up a surface contact between her and Raby. The two ships threw on their searchlights, and were shocked to see Ro-105 on the surface, sailing directly in-between them. Ro-105 had gambled that if she stayed within the two ships' lines of fire, they wouldn't dare to shoot for fear of damaging one another. She had guessed correctly. George and Raby had their searchlights and 3" guns trained on Ro-105, and for several tense minutes tried to maneuver out of one another's way while Ro-105 tried to stay in-between them. After several minutes at around 0305, realizing she had overstayed her welcome, Ro-105 slipped back beneath the surface around 1800 yards in front of the pair. George fired off one desperate shot from her forward 3" gun as Ro-105 submerged, but missed. Ro-105's batteries were likely only barely recharged, but nonetheless, she had bought herself a little more time. During all this, England and Spangler's search had been much less eventful. The two had reached the southern end of Halsey's portion of the NA Line with only a few false contacts reported by Spangler, and were working their way back North when they began picking up radio transmissions from George and Raby just before Ro-105 surfaced. They put together that George and Raby had been hunting this submarine for some time but hadn't been having any success, and naturally, England got in touch to ask where they were and if they wanted her and Spangler to come help. This was rebuked by a presumably very tired and frustrated radio operator on George, who responded to England's offer with "We're not telling you where we are! We have a damaged sub, and we're going to sink him! Do not come near us!" Since it seemed like George wasn't exactly in the talking mood at the moment, the pair were going to just continue patrolling up the line. But when Ro-105 surfaced and Raby's searchlight operator went to train his light on her, his hand slipped, briefly sending the beam of light up into the sky and inadvertently telling England and Spangler exactly where they were. Electing to ignore the rather rude and probably unauthorized transmission from George, England and Spangler began steaming towards the beam at full speed. Once within range at around 0500, Commander Hains got in contact and gave them a much more reasonable order to standby at 5000 yards and wait for orders. Both George and Raby had regained contact with Ro-105 after she submerged, and with the entire hunter-killer group now on-station, Hains brought England and Spangler up to speed on the situation and the four ships laid out a plan for sequential attacks on Ro-105 until she was destroyed once the sun rose. At first light at around 0649 George kicked things off, making an attack but scoring no hits. Raby was brought in next, and likewise she failed to connect with her attack at 0659. Perhaps trying to stave off what felt like the inevitable for as long as possible, Hains had decided to save England for last and had Spangler make the next attack at 0713. Much to everyone except England's displeasure, she too missed. Finally, Hains' resigned voice rang in over England's radio, "Oh, hell. Go ahead, England. It's your turn." Before Hains had even finished his sentence, England had gotten to within 2,000 yards and registered a solid contact on Ro-105 at 0729, pinging through the sub’s wake. As she closed to 1350 yards she began getting back a low doppler, indicating that Ro-105 was setting up for a stern chase, which was confirmed when they closed to 900 yards at 0734. And finally, at 0736:05, England let her hedgehogs fly on a center bearing from 235 yards. England’s bridge was silent as seventeen seconds ticked by, and then - “V-R-R-R-OOM!” Six to ten detonations were heard loud and clear, as the audacious and elusive Ro-105 finally met her match. The submarine that George and Raby had potentially spent over a day chasing, was sunk by England in a matter of minutes. “God damn it! How do you do it?” Hains’ frustrated and astonished voice barked over the radio; to which Captain Pendleton, still seated in his chair off to the side on the bridge, chuckled and said, “Tell him we take out our pins.” Pulling the pins was what allowed the hedgehog mortar’s propeller to turn, which armed the projectile. For obvious reasons, this rather insulting reply was not transmitted to George. Five minutes later at 0741, Ro-105’s demise was confirmed with a resounding deep water explosion. England had just sunk six submarines in less than two weeks, an achievement which remains unmatched in the history of naval warfare. As one of England's sailors wrote in his diary, "They must really be seeing red on the George right now."
Later on George and England would depart to patrol and leave Raby and Spangler with the wreck, and the group would reform on the 1st. They would remain on Scouting Line NA, working with Hoggatt Bay and her rotating squadrons of escorting destroyers. On the 4th Commander Hains moved his flag over to Spangler during a return to Seeadler Harbor to refuel and restock, and on the 10th one of the tin cans, USS Taylor (DD-468), claimed to have sunk another submarine, but otherwise, their days were uneventful in comparison to the previous weeks. England departed the next day on the 11th for Blanche Harbor in the Treasury Islands, before returning to Purvis Bay for more boiler cleaning and repairs to her sonar. George, Raby, and Spangler remained with Hoggatt Bay until George detached on the 18th and was replaced by another DesDiv39 member in Osmus, a newcomer to the Pacific, and Raby, Spangler, and Osmus left on the 20th. No more submarines were sunk. But at the conclusion of the operation, it was a great success and had dire consequences for the Imperial Japanese Navy. The destruction of Scouting Line NA convinced Admiral Toyoda that an American attack on The Philippines was imminent, and therefore allowed the US Navy’s 5th Fleet to advance effectively unimpeded towards the Marianas. When Vice Admiral Takagi appealed to Admiral Owada for his submarines to attack and destroy the American transports at any cost, Owada allegedly could only respond with, "This squadron has no submarines to station east of Saipan." And from there, America’s own submarines and carriers dealt a crippling blow to the Imperial Japanese Navy’s carrier forces in the Battle of the Philippine Sea. American subs brought down two of Japan’s finest fleet carriers in Shōkaku and Taihō, and the carrier aviation forces Japan had spent years rebuilding in the wake of the precipitous losses faced during the Battle of Midway and Guadalcanal Campaign were torn apart by American carrier aircraft and air defenses to such an extent that the battle would come to be known as “The Great Marianas Turkey Shoot.” It was a blow from which the IJN would never recover, and it was all possible thanks in no small part to the actions of USS England; who would add more titles to her name as the “Ace of the DE Fleet” and “Ace of the Pacific.” Once word got out of the hunter-killer group’s, and specifically England’s, achievement, congratulations came pouring in from across the US Navy. Even England’s crew, headstrong and immodest as they were, began to feel embarrassed from all the attention. Admiral Halsey sent radiograms reading, “Submarine operation results gratifying x the game is won by this kind of teamwork x for a job well done all hands are heartily congratulated.” and, “The magnificent performance x Com Third Fleet sends action ComCortDiv Three Nine and Forty [...] England George Raby Spangler [...] Is a matter of great pride to the whole South Pacific team x May there always be an England x well done and congratulations to all hands.” Admiral Chester Nimitz’s read, “for their splendid accomplishments against the Japanese submarines, Admiral Nimitz sends warm congratulations to all concerned.” Admiral Ernest King’s, “There will always be an England in the United States Navy.” She garnered praise from Secretary of the Navy James Forrestal and even Prime Minister Winston Churchill himself, after President Franklin Roosevelt mentioned England in a letter to him. Even Commander Thorwall, for all his apparent grudges against Williamson, temporarily shelved them in light of the accomplishments of England and her crew; and his reports on the operations always commended their conduct and aptitude. Later that year, Williamson even managed to leverage England’s reputation to get his ship (and USS Foreman (DE-633), Thorwall’s flagship at the time, much to his dismay) a well-deserved 10-day leave in one of the primo liberty destinations, Sydney, Australia. The request was initially denied by Admiral Arliegh Burke, but Burke’s superior, probably Admiral Marc Mitscher, overruled him, strongly recommending he approve “Sub-Killer England’s” request. England would return to performing her standard escort duties in the South Pacific for the rest of 1944, screening convoys throughout the Solomon Islands, Papua New Guinea, the Caroline Islands, and later The Philippines. Operations in the Ryukyu Islands in 1945 would result in England seeing much more action and having a number of close calls with Japanese bombers and kamikazes, giving her the opportunity to add a handful of aircraft kills to her resume. Back to 1944, due to having to rely on a Dutch map of Seeadler Harbor from the 1790s England ran aground on approach to the harbor that July, resulting in her starboard propeller shaft having to be replaced and her port shaft being stuck at 90/1000, later corrected to 13/1000, out of line. That August, Captain Pendleton was promoted to Commander and given command of a destroyer escort division, and Williamson took his place as England’s commanding officer. Pendleton, despite his many quirks, had grown on England’s crew, and they were sad to see him leave. Likewise, England had enraptured him as well. The captain of one of the destroyer escorts from Pendleton’s division would later complain to Williamson that England was all he would ever talk about. And that's where I'll leave things off for now. Like I said at the beginning, tune in in May 1945 for the conclusion to England's story.
re Operation Bagration, I was always impressed by the parade of German prisoners, some 50,000 of them, through the streets of Moscow, after the defeat of Army Group Centre in Bielorussia. What I read somewhere was that there were doubts as to the veracity of Soviet reports on the number of prisoners taken, so the Soviet authorities decided to show the world. A number of the generals mentioned in different episodes led the "parade".
@@elausraliano Smaller ones were conducted, sometimes the POWs' heads were shaved before being made to march. I have seen a photo of one such parade, which looks like it was carried out in a fairly small town.
The mountainous terrain of Italy was the reason why General Mark Clark was able to get away with disobeying orders. The Cassino pass is only 4 kilometers wide with much of the open ground turned into cratered water filled shell holes and ruins from months of stalemated fighting intermixed with extensive minefields. The Liri valley is only 8 to 14 kilometers wide. General Leese made the mistake of trying to shove the entirety of the Canadian 1st Corps, British 13th Corps, and the 1st Polish Corps into the Liri valley. The result was a massive 14,000 vehicle traffic jam around the ruins of Cassino extending into the roads in the Liri valley. Most of the tanks, tank destroyers, infantry tanks, self--propelled artillery, field artillery, and anti-tank guns were stuck in the traffic jam around the ruins of Cassino. As a result, the frontline units of British 8th Army were only advancing an average of 1500 meters per day. The Germans added further to the slow advance through the use of extensive demolitions and the laying of minefields and deployment of anti-tank guns to impede the advance. The slow advance of the British 8th Army is one of the main factors that some military historians highlight about the low possibility of the German army being encircled if General Clark had obeyed orders and sent the majority of the US 5th Army into the Liri valley.
The Germans were partial to booby traps - this is touched on in the film "The English Patient", though that is set in the autumn 1944 fighting in Italy.
Thank you for actually providing some nuance to the comments section and not just blindly following the usual British historiography that tries to pin everything on Clark.
Clark did not have sattalite image from above to see traffic jam of Eighth Army and nor concluded "brilliantly" that he should capture Rome before British who had to overcome both traffic jam, mountains and 10th German Army deployed on Hitler Line. Clark was actually planning this insubordination way before Diadem and Buffolo offensives (Buffolo is Anzio breakout) since he was determined to take army group command from Alexander
@@merdiolu You don't need to see British advance at a glacier pace to know that trying to fling your army through a tiny pass is not conducive to rapid operations.
@@enterprise9001 Clark did not object before the start of operation about it , nor put any complaints about narrowness of pass (which he could not overcome for months) instead switched the axis of advance uniliterally on his leisure without informing his superiors in the middle of offensive on 25th May. Trusscott , VI Corps commander in Anzio later complained on this
I wish this episode had been posted early on the Patron so I could get my reply in early as I have been saying something similar to the below over the last few weeks leading up to this weeks fall of Rome. My main issue when people are talking about Mark Clark and taking Rome instead of going for the possible encirclement is they never mention that George Marshall the highest ranking US Army officer DIRECTLY ORDERS Clark to take Rome and Clark's direct superior British General Harold Alexander tells Clark "to take Rome if possible" as well. People now like to make it out that Clark could have encircled multiple German divisions if he didn't go for Rome which isn't correct. Maybe the US 5th army surrounds 5-15k German troops (the most likely result) or maybe they get more lucky and get 50k tops if they went for the encirclement, but doing so would have risked the Germans again creating a new defensive line in front of Rome or just behind Rome resulting in the historic city becoming a battle ground. Additionally taking Rome was a bigger goal and moral effect towards the end of the war then surrounding a small number German troops (small number for WW2s scale) would be. Rome was the first capital to fall of the Axis powers and one of the big 3 Axis powers at that. Additionally people forget that the goal of the Italian campaign was NEVER to push all the way up through Italy and the Alps into Germany. Fighting in the Alps would have resulted in far to high casualties. The goal in fighting in Italy was to occupy German divisions so that then could not be used on the Eastern or Western fronts. Whenever the Germans would try to take divisions away from the Italian front to use elsewhere is when Alexander and then later Clark would order further offensives against the German line in Italy. Lastly, saying Clark wanted Rome for "glory" is the most silly argument ever. Not only is there everything I just mentioned above but further Clark is one of the few US or British officers of a high enough rank to know that D-Day is about to come. So he literally knows D-Day is coming the next day after he takes Rome. If he wanted max glory he would have gone for the encirclement of German troops and then pushed for Rome. But that is not what he did because the fall of Rome was a much bigger deal to ending WW2 then capturing some more German troops along a path that could never end the war ever would have been.
From what I've read I agree with you as well. The Italy campaign never had a chance to end the war. The goal of the front was just to pull Axis troops away from the main Eastern and Western fronts which it did. Whenever the Germans would try to move troops away from the Italian front is when Alexander and later Clark would launch attacks up Italy. Taking Rome had a far greater result in ending WW2 then capturing a small number (like you said, small for WW2) of German troops.
There is something of a tradition that no matter what your rank, you salute first whenever you meet a medal of honor recipient. After the war, Audie Murphy became an actor. And one day Clark was visiting a studio. Audie hunted for him and found Clark in the commissary. Audie stood in front of Clark. And stood. Until Clark saluted. Then Audie returned the salute and walked away without a word to Clark. Asked why he did it that way, Audie replied something along the lines of, "that bastard got a lot of good men needlessly killed." Audie legit hated him.
LIBERATION OF ROME: LANDINGS IN FRANCE HC Deb 06 June 1944 vol 400 cc1207-111207 §The Prime Minister (Mr. Churchill) I must apologise to the House for having delayed them, but Questions were gone through rather more rapidly than usual. The House should, I think, take formal cognisance of the liberation of Rome by the Allied Armies under the Command of General Alexander, with General Clark of the United States Service and General Oliver Leese in command of the Fifth and Eighth Armies respectively. [HON. MEMBERS: "Hear, hear."] This is a memorable and glorious event, which rewards the intense fighting of the last five months in Italy. The original landing, made on 22nd January at Anzio, has, in the end, borne good fruit. In the first place, Hitler was induced to send to the south of Rome eight or nine divisions which he may well have need of elsewhere. Secondly, these divisions were repulsed, and their teeth broken, by the successful resistance of the Anzio bridgehead forces in the important battle which took place in the middle of February. The losses on both sides were heavy-the Allies losing about 20,000 men, and the Germans about 25,000 men. Thereafter, the Anzio bridgehead was considered by the enemy to be impregnable.
@@AceMoonshot The Germans had a similar tradition with Knight's Cross winners. On the day they got the award, they saluted nobody, but even superior officers saluted them.
None. Clark wasn’t necessarily wrong in going for Rome, and he was almost certainly right not to go for Valmontone, for the very simple reason that the Germans weren’t there.
Korea was a frustrating stalemate. Being handed off the duty was no favour to him. Signing the armistice at Panmunjom in 1953, Clark is notably sullen-looking in every photo of the occasion I have seen.
I reckon the Rome controversy happened only later, when historians started to do their jobs. And in his favor, as commander of 5th Army and later 15th Army Group he commanded the most multinational Allied force in WW2. 5th Army he commanded in addition to American forces British, French, New Zealand, Indian and South African units. As 15th Army Group commander in addition to those also the Poles, Canadians and Brazilians. His beef was with the British commanders, like Alexander. When he took over Alexander's job that beef was basically over and 15th Army Group performed very well in it's 1945 spring offensive. with the US 5th Army not being favored over the British 8th Army. So I guess that made him a candidate to command 8th Army in Korea.
@@himoffthequakeroatbox4320 By the time Clark became involved it was a stalemate, and he was not delighted to be the US commander by then. Hence his behaviour at Panmunjom. In both US and Chinese photos (the Chinese cameramen were on the other side of the signing table) he clearly isn't happy about what he is doing.
Just a thought, but maybe after an episode has been up for 6 weeks, you could add time codes for each front. That would really help with binge watching. I'm currently rewatching the Guadalcanal segments and really enjoying it!
In Clarke's defense Alexander was not a military genius either. Clarke had reason to belive that the Germans would not be trapped. Kesselring was the best commander of the three. Italy was made for defense especially if the attack started from the toe of the boot. The capture of Rome was a great victory. It was overshadowed the next day by the Normandy invasion, but Clarke could not know that
I think this is interesting. My paternal grandfather grew up close to back then Insterburg, today Chernyakhovsk in the East of Russian East Prussia. He and his mother fled during the summer of 1944 to family in a village on the Neisse river, because his father warned them that the front would soon reach them. From what I know, my great aunt (passed away last summer in her late 90s) loved the strawberries they were eating and wanted to plant some for next year. My great grandfather then told them that the Russians would be there next summer and that they should leave, but they had to cover it up by styling it as visiting family (because fleeing was forbidden for a long time, leading to the trains of refugees in the winter of 44/45). And reportedly my great aunt was shocked when my great grandfather asked them what they would do if the Russians reached them at the Neisse, claiming it was "South of Berlin". And while my grandfather was still a child (born 1935), his sister was a bit older (born 1925, they also had a younger sister born 1945, but she didn't survive the time after the defeat) and she worked for the harbour authority in Königsberg, which meant she left with the last German ship leaving the harbour. And to loop back why it's interesting: We are close to reaching that point on this channel
Missing a bit in the Pacific, granted the look is at D-Day, Rome/ Italy and Bagation and historic victories Destruction of Take No.1 convoy in late April - early May which was bigger than Bismarck Sea or Naval Battle of Guadalcanal with nearly 5000 IJA killed by US wolf packs, stopped all further major reinforcement of New Guinea. No small feat. USS England eliminating the Japanese picket ine sent out to discover the next big offensive in Pacific which both Japan and US knew was coming. Japanese by now had a good read on US codes and radio traffic and direction findings. Hence, they could send out snoopers who inevitability find the US Fleet when it was leaving base or at sea. Biak was start of KON operations which was MacArthur plan to speed up his offensives because he knew Marianas was happening next month, and he had to be in a favourable position to return to the Philippines when the JCS started askimg for next offensive in the Pacific. MacArthur used Ultra to attack as he had done in Admiralties invasion, and ran into the same problem, that Ultra didn't pick up all the Japanese army units on the island. Nor did he realise, it triggered mini A-Go as he stumbled in the Japanese of inner defensive Empire which was defended at any cost (ie naval and air Fleets counterattacks). Some of the 1st Air Fleet was relocated to Palau and Davao to launch counter-attacks but unfortunately for the Japanese, most of them came down with Malaria. So there was very limited attacks. Operation Kon was activated on the 27th with Australian and US cruiser screening force scaring off Kon No 1 destroyer reinforcement run for loss of 1 DD via air attacks. Kon No.2 (another reinforcement run) and Kon No.3 (reinforcement run escorted by BatDiv 1 - the Yamatos and CruDiv 5, Myokos) will be launched over the next fortnight. With Marianas invasion and subsequent destruction of naval (1st Mobile Fleet) and land based (1st Air Fleet) air forces, this saved MacArthur bacon and he could defeat the Japanese in his own time, and launch further landings up the Vogelkop to make sure he was in a favourable position for a return to the Philippines
7:20 how on earth, if he advances deep inland to "Valmontone' (sp?) do the British somehow come up from way back south, loop around him and whatever Germans are there and move on Rome?
You are right. It can’t. Which is one of the many, many reasons that his decision NOT to go to Valmontone had nothing to do with keeping the Brits out of Rome. His logic was (broadly) that the Germans weren’t at Valmontone, that he had an open flank, that destroying the 10th Army (which he did) had as much value as trapping the 14th (which he didn’t think he could do), and that as war is politics capturing the enemy capital has value of its own. If ego was involved in going for Rome, it was only a (probably small) part of the story.
It's the third of June 1944, 20:00 CEST and a new episode still isn't out. Either the World War Two studio in Berlin had been bombed by another Harris' raid or the war is over and we just haven't been informed yet. ;-)
@@WorldWarTwo No need to apologise. I was just making a joke. I hope that all is fine with your team and the delay isn't caused by some serious issues.
You might like to read (Flashman author) George MacDonald Fraser’s book “Quartered Safe Out Here”. He was with the Borderers of 17th Indian Div (Punch Cowan). He wasn’t at Kohima/Imphal, but served in the final six months of the war. It’s an excellent memoir.
Reading Rick Atkisons “ the day of battle “ now after finishing “ an army at dawn” I’m trying to have my reading coincide with the videos. Will catch up soon. So amazing. Just finished Ian Tolls pacific trilogy, I beg all of you reading this to get those books to supplement this great …. nay, Amazing production, so worth it.
With the Allies advancing and stemming the tide against the Axis; Axis Powers are struggling to maintain their defenses. They only have a vague idea of where the Allies plan to strike. But they will severely underestimate their opponent’s abilities. For when the attacks come, it will be a testament to how the Allies have grown in their offensive capabilities since the beginning of the war. All the while, as the major Axis leaders realize how the war is going, they will now make sure that what the Allies liberate is a destroyed landscape. Godspeed to those who perished.
So what does happen when the war is over? Does this channel just end? I hope you guys can still find more history on WWII in the future and keep things going. As the son of a WWII veteran, I look forward to every video you guys do. Good luck, Mike
I have been to the area of the Anzio bridgehead just last week. Hard to believe, this was the place of a fierce battle in the war. And so close to Rome, the Alban Hills (or Mountains) would not seem to be a threat in my view, they can be passed by on the way to Rome along the coast. And it really looks like Germany will face three major fronts soon - the one in Italy, the Eastern front and in France. Plus minor fronts on the Balkans. By now every german general must have realized, the war is lost. Maybe they should try to get rid of Hitler, to prevent the total destruction of Germany.
General Clark might have had the right friends in life, and gotten all those shiny promotions, but I don't know if it would be worth it given the reputation that has come with it.
The brutal logic of war: The Death Trains were intentionally not attacked by the Allies as those Death Trains were consuming limited logistical capacity of the railroad system under German control. The Death Trains also were often given priority of draw upon equipment and priority of movement above all other traffic save the private trains of the Party officials of Germany. Remember them. My uncle was in a unit which was the first to encounter such a camp. Until his death he refused to speak of that experience other than to acknowledge he had been there.
This is correct, but the Allies still should have put more effort into damaging targets like the German rail network instead of wasting so many lives and resources in pointless city raids and re-attacking areas which had been rebuilt and hardened against air attack.
The British-American alliance in the field was feckless and characterized by Generalship so incompetent (by British and American) that to this day more effort has been spent trying to shift blame than was spent trying to fight the Germans. This was especially true in the Mediterranean theater where bad commanders were left to make Kesselring look like a genius (and smile, of course). Kesselring's best defense was Allied offense.
Not really. Kesselring’s best defence was the utterly terrible Italian terrain, and the fact that the Allies fundamentally did not commit enough force to Italy to achieve what they wanted. Allied generalship was not nearly as bad as is made out - I would argue it was good (Alamein), quite good (Tunisia), very good (Sicily), and a curate’s egg in Italy.
On top of that, during the parade of the Allied troops in the center of Rome, when the Jeep of an american general arrived in front of the Colosseo, he looked at the monument and seeing it partly damaged (by 2000 years of history, but he had no idea it was built by a Roman Emperor), he said with satisfaction to his attendant: "Good job have done our bombers!!" The missing parts of the Colosseo have been intentionally dismantled during the centuries to use the marble as building material for other buildings. This went on until XIX century, when it was restored in its current state. Not a single bomb hit the monument (the Germans left the city without a fight), but pretending that american general to know the History (with capital H), was too much!
I am missing Sparty and the WAH series; I know he is probably busy with the D-Day preparations. Keep telling the stories of who we lost and how, it's very important! Also not sure if you have any plans for Memorial day special.
We know! We miss him too, he’s just very busy with prep for DDAY! We promise to return to our regularly scheduled programming soon! We know how important remembering those stories is! Never Forget!
This week in French news. The 21st, the Resistance activates the FFI and orders attacks on several points. The 22nd, the BBC asks to help the allied forces after the landing. The same day, Pétain meets in Voisins Carl -Henrich von Stülpnagel, commander of Germans troops in France, and Rundstedt. This is only about the military situation and Rundstedt invites Pétain to visit the Atlantic Wall, but he refuses. He continues to meet politicians, administrative personnel, delegates of organization and meets the ex-Queen of Portugal, Amélie d’Orléans. He visits towns affected by Allied bombardments. The 24th, the COMIDAC becomes the COMAC (Comité d'action militaire) to direct all resistance forces under the CNR. But like the leadership of the FFI in London (Koenig) it has little power over resistance cells. L'Humanité asks to form Patriotic Militias. The 26th, Pétain visits Nancy and proclaims that “two armies” are going to ledge war in France and that the French should “take neither party”. He then goes to Épinal, Dijon and then to Lonzat near Vichy. L'Humanité and the Communists tries to have for the CNR more power in the GPRF. It creates the Central Council of the Patriotic Militias to supersede the CNR. The 11th of August, it will be dismantled by the CNR.
@@loveroffunnyy depends of where and who. I dont talkcabout it about war against Humanity is going to continue and catch up by talking about the resistance. Vut as of right now there is a guerrilla warfare inchte Vercor
Regarding Overlord, I am concerned as to when, in Eastern Daylight Savings Time, the coverage starts. The first troops...American and British Airborne troops are supposed to arrive at 12 midnight, local time. That would be 7pm, on the East Coast of North America (I am in New York City)
Everything will be viewable on the channel after it airs live, if you're worried about missing something. I had to watch the whole Pearl Harbor series that way because of bandwidth issues, my local network just couldn't keep up and the premiere episodes kept stalling and glitching out.
@@Raskolnikov70 I understand this, but as a 'fan', I would like to catch things when they start. I was also wondering if they were going to mention the Verlaine poem...the signal to the Resistance that the invasion was imminent ["Les sanglots longues de les violins d'auttome...blessant mon coeur avec un langour monototone"...and I know I misspelled some of that]?
What’s everyone reading ?? I’m on Shattered Sword right now. Tryin to get Lundstroms work but it ain’t cheap. Did get to order another Citino book on the way
Even as isolated between January May 1944 , Anzio beachead tied down eight German divisions to besiege it (eight less German divisions to fight in France after D-day)
That's an impossible question. What was more valuable, the German divisions tied at Anzio, or the Allied divisions tied in the beachhead and the air and naval resources tied supporting them? At the very least is evident the original plan was incredibly bad, the landing force was far too small... how were just two divisions expected to a) consolidate the beachhead b) advance to the Alban Hills and c) from there threaten to envelop the German rear? Such an operation would have demanded at the very least 4 divisions, and probably more, including at least an armoured division! In other words, as an arrow on the map the Anzio landing idea was good, but the resources needed to make it a reality didn't exist.
@@isidroramos1073 Tying down only two Allied divisions in a narrow beachead and eight German divisions (later increased to nine for counter attack that failed in February) was a much better investment for Allies when only one of German divisios deployed in Anzio perimeter was sent to Normandy in 1944 spring ,D-Day might have been a defeat for Allies. I agree initial landing plan of Shingle was bad when the assets in hand would only land VI Corps in three waves therefore forfeiting suprise advantage but still the net result was Allies used this narrow beachead eventually to breakout and reach Highway 6 from flank in May , only four months late though when rest of 5th and 8th Army battling to breakthrough Senger Line further south
@@merdiolu Two divisions was only the initial force. The Allies had to send more and more units until by May 1944 there were 7 divisions at Anzio and another one (British 56th ID) had been withdrawn due to heavy losses, so Anzio ended up tying 8 Allied divisions and forcing the Allied navies to send supplies for five months to a force that in the last stage of the battle reached at least 150,00 men. That kept occupied a very large number of unvaluable landing craft. And by then the German force surrounding the beachhead had been reduced to just five divisions.
@@isidroramos1073 True , VI Corps was swelled seven division in order to initiate Buffolo breakout but that was thanks to Operation Diadem planning (thanks to General John Harding , Chief of Staff of Alexander in 15th Army Group command) of stripping Eight Army corps north of Cassino , shifting and concentrating them on Fifth Army front on left flank of Allied front in secret and diverting German reserves to coast with deception plan previously in order to achieve local superiorty so Fifth Army could overwhelm Gustav Line between Cassino , Highway 6 and coast (which they did). No extra divisions were diverted from Overlord build up in UK , on the contrary several divisions wre lost from 15th Army Group in Italy , transferred to UK for Cross Channel attack in November 1943 and for Operation Dragoon in June 1944 and Allied armies broke though under dimishing resources , priorties , under a difficult mountain terrain AND increasding number of German divisions ( German Army Group C swelled from 18 divisions 22 German divisions between January and May 1944 and incoming Italian Salo republic units collaborating Germans). The naval support of supplying reinforcing Anzio beachead might have seem big but considering the main build up for Operation Overlord or Pacific Campaign (considering that Germany First policy of Allies , shifting landing craft there was controversial when there were more Germans in Italy than Pacific islands) , the Allied naval assets and landing craft were meager (landing craft in Mediterranean were mostly shifted to UK for Cross Channel invasion in February 1944 after Shingle and Anvil/Dragoon landings would not be initiated before mid or end of August anyway) And the number of German divisions reduced to six divisions before Buffolo breakout on 23 May again thanks to Diadem previous breakthrough at Aurinci mountains and fall of Cassino , since Kesselring and Von Vienthigoff had to shift several divisions and reserves from Von Mackensen's 14th Army at Anzio to Senger line to contain Allied advance. It was always two way stage attack for Allied attack on Gustav Line on May 1944 (Diadem and Buffolo) one leveraging another.
Can you cover project X-Ray and other wacky projects going on during the war. Most people don't realize that in a very similar timeline to our WW2 would have involved the use of swarms of bats armed with napalm bombs, turning into devastating weapons of mass destruction.
@@Raskolnikov70 actually the army air corp found that while conventional bombs caused 150-500 fires, the same payload of bats (which were armed with napalm) would cause around 3600-4700 fires. They only stopped due to rising cost and shifting focus to the Manhattan project
@T WE that actually could be really interesting! We’ll have time for more side specials like that once our special June 6 event passes ;) Maybe it could be something like I cover over on our Twitter!! Sure sounds fascinating either way 😄 -Will
@@WorldWarTwo I'd definitely watch that. Other animal themed projects in development during WW2 include using trained pigeons to guide bombs onto specific targets (as crazy as it sounds it actually worked, the only problem was the lack of light while going through the clouds disoriented the pigeons), and the dogs who were armed with bombs and trained by the soviets to go under tanks. Feel free to credit me for the idea lmao, I'm Tyler Weaver-Escobar
Court marshalling especially a publicly known press favorite US general would be almost impossible (especially in press and home front) in an alliance during 1944 when US was major partner along with USSR and UK became junior partner. Besides his was not really a court marshall offense. Relief from duty maybe yes (was not done but instead they promoted Clark to army group command replacing Alexander) burt court marshall could be done in face of treason for which Clark was not guilty of.
@@qjnmh I see. Plus there's the problem the americans were not about to put one of their generals on trial for giving a Brit the finger. Still, if a complete encirclement wasn't possible due to alternative routes of widrawal by the germans, it sounds like he could've still inflicted a lot more damaged had not been more interested in glory than results.
Marcus Aurelius Clarkus..... The one I would vote for as the single most incompetent allied general of WWII.... This self serving narcissistic insubordination by Clark actually changed the political map of Europe for the next 75 years.... By not destroying the German 10th Army, and letting Kesserrling escape, it would cost tens of thousands of more needless military and civilian deaths, from another entire year of the war, which had to be fought all over again, in the northern Appenine mountains, and not on the border of Austria, closing the Lubjana gap and the Iron Gate....
I agree that he's a worthless gloryhound, but as Indy correctly said, there is no guarantee that the Germans would have been cut off, there were other roads out there. Kesselring was still a crafty bugger and a blitz through Italy was just impossible. Also, at this point of the war Italy was a sideshow, and there was just NO WAY IN HELL that Roosevelt would funnel more troops and resources to send Allied forces into the Balkans. If anything he was going to order US troops out of theater. Juin's Expeditionary Corps and Truscott's VI Corps were slated to be withdrawn for Operation Dragoon. So any success in Italy would not be exploited by the US. And the British had no additional forces available to reinforce 8th Army, unless they would take away troops slated for Overlord. Which the Americans would not allow to happen. Sorry, but what you are suggesting is an illusion.
There are Lloyd Fredendall, Gamelin, Weygand, Arthur Percival, Semyon Buddiony, Kliment Voroshilov, Grigory Kulik, Lev Mekhlis, and then there's the asshole that stayed in the theater in Kiev during Barbarossa.
My grandparents live in September the 13th road here in Rovereto (northern Italy) the road is called like that because on that day in 1944 the allies launched a bombardment mission against the railroads near there. One of the pilots had problems dropping his bombs on target and had to drop them after having flown over the objective, because if he didn’t he would not have made it back to base. Those bombs hit the countryside and killed many civilians (my grandfather witnessed everything) and destroyed many homes. Maybe if Clark had made the right choice Rovereto would have been liberated by that time or the allies would not have ordered that bombing run. Who knows.
@@SteelLegionnaire I live in Nijmegen, the Netherlands and we got bombed by the USAAF too, 800+ people died and the historic city center forever ruined. Don't wreck your brain thinking about what might have happened, or who was to blame. Mark Clark, some USAAF bomb group not hitting their target right that day, or mistaking one city for another. Mistakes happen in war and the Allies were conducting a concerted campaign throughout occupied Europe to hit any rail junction. It might still have happened, or not. We will never know.
18:42 I am no military expert but hearing the news makes me think that maybe, maybe the Germans will loose the battle if not the war. Whenever that happens.
This episode is coming to you as the TimeGhost Team works 24/7 to put the finishing touches on our 24-hour D-Day Programme. You'll be able to watch the full event here on the World War Two Channel, and bite-sized episodes over on our special D-Day Channel youtube.com/@D-Day24Hours-sm5pe/videos
Join the project on DDay.TimeGhost.tv
Just asking... whatever happened to WaH? Missing it really a lot.
Thanks.
At 56.35 74% landed on US beaches, 83% on Brit/Can beaches.
The Disaster of the DD Tanks on DDay
th-cam.com/video/2nabCopaVrY/w-d-xo.html
Interesting that you've named it 24 Hour D-Day Programme rather than Program. Are there more Brit subscribers than American?
@@chrisvowell2890 No, that's the way it is spelled.
Wow. Surely nothing can overshadow the impending fall of Rome
Virgin take Rome to get overshadowed in the news by D day vs Chad desteoy the Germans and Italy and force them to send troops from France to indirectly aid D-day
I dunno, things in China and Burma have really been kicking off lately. We could see some big battles coming soon that would dwarf the Italian campaign.
And don't call me Shirley.
Agree D-Day stands for Distraction from Rome day! 🎉🎉. Will Mark Get the glory and outshine some podunk beaches ???
Well, it’s Rome! Obviously nothing can top liberating the city nearly unharmed
My grandfather was shot down over France, May 27th 1944 in a B-17 fortress bomber. He attempted to rescue the pilot unsuccessfully after the rest of his crew scattered when the plane crash landed, fending only for themselves. Eventually all survivors on the plane were captured by German soldiers including my grandfather who spent the rest of world war II in a pow camp ran by the Nazis.
That ending made me realize we haven't had a War Against Humanity episode in a long time. Is Sparty doing ok?
My guess would be that they’re putting everything they have into the D-Day program and setting other content aside for now. I wouldn’t be surprised if things pick back up next month
I would really like to hear Spartacus talk about the Nazi mentality to proceed, even intensify their genocide at this point. I don't think I would exaggerate if this is the darkest page in the complete history of humanity, the absolute deepest the human soul has sunk, and it needs to be laid bare for everyone to see.
He’s taking a break until they can get the D-day specials finished, WAH should return sometime in July or August
he'll have a lot to cover on the day even, with the preemptive retribution attacks ze germans were carrying out to the point of slowing down troop movements. It's like a switch was flicked and went from 'we're in conquered territory' to 'ok it's a warzone now, start shooting everything that moves'
@Josh Siegel that would be the correct guess! We promise we’ll be back on top of WAH soon!
RIP Captain William Galt, MOH, 1/168 Inf, 34th Infantry Division. KIA May 29,1944 Villa Crocetta, Italy.
I just read his citation. Pretty heroic stuff. Mowed down 40 Fascists with a .30 cal before the M10 he was on was taken out by an 88.
A side note this week on May 25 1944 is that Charles Hunter will personally hand to Joseph Stilwell (who had flown to Myitkyina Airfield) a letter listing all the grievances from the field officers and men of the U.S. 5307th Composite Unit (Provisional). They noted that the area commanders had betrayed them by depriving them of rest and treating them as expendable, leading to the whole of 5307th Composite Unit (Provisional) becoming practically ineffective as a combat unit.
Stilwell ruined Merrils Marauders and Mad Mike was adamant he was not going to do the same to his troops. In fact he told his comms people not to take any calls from Stilwell .
So....they mutinied more or less?
@@MM22966 Yes it could be construed that way. It beats me why they had Stilwell there at all he was extremely Anglophobic
Indy, your on-screen charisma is second to none. You'd be great in a Godfather remake
That is a part I would love to take!
Sadly my Uncle was killed on the 23rd as his tank was supporting the Canadians in the taking of Pontecorvo.
It's crazy how the war is unraveling week by week. Feels like yesterday when the 13th Guards Rifle Division were sent to hold the line at Stalingrad.
I still do that, not realizing how much time has passed. "Boy, can't wait until this series gets to Stalingrad...... oh, wait a sec....."
The feeling when I realised that the war is over four and half years old...
Thanks for covering Anzio. My father fought there; he never talked about the war, and we have no idea about his service other than he was at Anzio. His records were among those destroyed in the St. Louis fire, so we can't even get information from there.
Thanks for your Dad's service 🙏🇺🇲. My Grandfather was also there as a Member of The First Special Service Force (The Black Devil's).
Rumor has it that the biggest carrier battle of all time(24 carriers, 1300+ aircraft) may happen soon after D Day. I hope there will be some detailed coverage of Forager vs. A-Go.
Side note in the Pacific:! Admiral Nimitz has called for a major conference with top navy army and marine commanders on which islands will be attacked in the central Pacific!
At roughly the same time the Japanese high command have known for some time that a large strike force is headed for somewhere in the central Pacific and are training new pilots and enforcing every islands from the Jima islands to Palau! Some 2000 aircraft and one hundred thousand men are spread all over these islands for the upcoming invasions.... There navy is stationed in three key locations to stop it!
Worth noting that Slim's view of the Japanese fighting man was more nuanced than was implied. He had no time at all for the Japanese Empire, and a pretty dim view of their high command. He had a pretty strong respect for the fighting capabilities of the individual soldiers. He though they were incredibly tenacious, brave, and could withstand conditions and fighting that Western armies would blanche at. His lack of respect was for the offensive tactics and strategy (at divisional level and higher), not their defensive prowess (at battalion level and lower).
Slim was correct in his assessment. The British soldier has been called a lion led by donkeys but I would say that that particular quote is more apt of the Japanese soldier. A lion led by complete Cabbage Heads. The retreat from Kohima/Imphal was one of the greatest catastrophes in Japanese military history, one that gets ignored in the histories from what I've read. Tens of thousands of men disappeared into the Burmese jungle to become fertiliser. Cannibalism was a known feature of the Japanese retreat.
He had respect for their offensive tactics.
Slim, along with the rest of the British army, had been easily defeated by the Japanese in 1942. Slim, to his credit, was the only western allied general to ask the Chinese how the Japanese fought and how China had won their occasional victories.
The defense of Imphal took all of that knowledge and was adapted to negate Japanese offensive advantages.
@@Conn30Mtenor agree with your assessment of (some) Japanese higher command.
Just be aware that the "lions led by donkeys" quote is made up by Alan Clark (I think he attributed to Hindenburg or Ludendorf, but it was made up by whole cloth). It's also completely incorrect in spirit as well as fact, but that's the sort of "historian" Clark was...
@@porksterbob as always, yes and no, and I totally get what you are saying and why, and it's got a lot of force behind it.
Just to start off, Slim himself wasn't really defeated - in 1942 he inherited a lost position where victory wasn't possible and at least managed to extract his army back to India. And you are right in saying he learned a lot of lessons along the way.
I think a nuanced relating of Slim's views of the Japanese senior command is that he respected their ability to move fast and attack unexpectedly, and the force they could bring to bear, and the risks they were willing to run to do all of that. But he thought that they took serious logistical risk, and that therefore if you could hold out against the initial onslaught you could defeat them, if not relatively easily, at least relatively certainly. Deny them the opportunity to resupply off Allied logistics and you were going to be in good shape.
He absolutely was caught off balance by the start of the Kohima / Imphal battle, so score one to Japanese higher command (he admits this in Defeat into Victory), but the overall course of both Admin Box and Kohima / Imphal went broadly to his plan and delivered the stategic triumph he needed to recapture Burma within the year.
So yes, you are right - I was probably wrong to say he had contempt for the Japanese - but he had confidence that they were broadly predictable and he had a method to defeat them (in which he was right)
He has been quoted as saying that commanders of all armies have talked about their troops fighting to the death, but that the Japanese actually did it.
I hadn't heard of Clark's insubordination before this. If that is true, he should have been relieved of command, court martialed, and dishonorably discharged. No matter that his commanding officer was British, he still must obey orders and keep to the strategy. I can understand a little bit the desire for glory that some of these big heads want but to allow so many soldiers and so much armor to escape, all for personal recognition, was a huge dereliction of duty. I said if that is all true. I'm going to have to read up on it.
There was a lot of competition between the British and the Americans over who got the plum assignments that would reflect well on the commanders.
@@mathswithgarry7104 - I understand that and that’s what I’m criticizing. Internal competition is detrimental to the achievement of the goal.
@@jerometaperman7102 Especially with thousands and thousands of lives at stake ....
@@Elmaestrodemusica - All for one guy's ego and lust for glory.
@@jerometaperman7102 I've learned so much from this series!
Launching Bagration on the same day as Overlord would have been amazing.
Launching Bagration against the enemy on the same day the enemy attack you would be even more awesome
I think the day AFTER would be better.Just as Hitler thinks "Phew,at least Stalin isnt attacking yet,lets move some Panzers West.What do you mean they are breaking through in Belorussia!"
'Tripling' is up 200% not 300%. 9:05
Thanks for catching this! I’ll put a note in!
It's insane to think Overlord is in two weeks and Bagration not long after.
7:25 - this answers the question of why no one in the US Army tried to deflect the investigation into Clark’s “Murderous Blunder” at the Rapido [Gari] River battle until it reached Congress in 1946 and the War Department intervened
I've waited so long for Finland to be mentioned again.
Wait - Finland is involved in the war? Jk....
I once took a class in university on American Military History. The textbooks were written by the US Army.
In the WW2 chapters, there’s a part that lists some of the famous generals and how skilled they were, some of the best US Army generals in the nation’s history. Eisenhower, Bradley, Patton…
And Clark. Somehow the authors thought Mark Clark deserved to be listed as one of the greatest WW2 US Army generals. Wow.
Well, on the plus side he did not lose a battle or an entire campaign. And he was the liberator of Rome. So his gamble to disobey Alexander did pay off.
@@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623 Except making a very shoddy landing operation at Salerno that was almost pushed back to sea , trying to cross Rapido three times only to be repulsed each time then letting eight German divisions to slip away by switching the route of advance after Anzio breakut with his direct insubordination to his superiors therefore wasting all laurels of Operation Diadem plan
@@merdiolu I don't think Salerno was that shoddy. It was just the most northern place the Allies could land and also a very obvious place. It wasn't like the Germans could not see this coming and they weren't taking the bait of 8th Army landing in Calabria and Tarento of trying to fight them there. I'd sooner blame Clark for Anzio, but I reckon considering there was only enough shipping to land 2 divisions there and it was Churchill's meddling that pushed it through that was just a clusterf*** waiting to happen.
@@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623 It was Clark who caused Salerno landings such an almost on brink of disaster. He assigned Ernest Dawley to VI Corps who failed tolead properly , rejected naval bombardtment from sea before landing to achieve suprise when suprise advantage was forfeited already due to German air recon of Allied fleet before landings etc...He and Dawley should share the blame.
American military history needs to be written by non-Americans, it seems.
‘Operation Chattanooga Choo Choo’ I love this name
Just before my father was transferred from the Mediterranean to the Pacific theatre, his ship dropped anchor in Damietta. On his ship was this fellow from Lithuania; he worked as the main ship's cook and was a master at pastry making, as well as being a nut for crossword puzzles. My dad, then all of 18, ran into the sailor's hall and grabbed up as many papers with crossword puzzles as he could, no matter what language, as a little reward for great food. The cook was very pleased and got to work on them. He was working on one puzzle in English and ran across a clue he did not understand, so he asked what word the clue could be referring to. One of the sailors, a fellow out of Florida, laughed at the cook and said, "Don't you know any English?" The cook then said, "My first language is Lithuanian. After that I picked up Estonia and Latvian, then Russian and Finnish. After that I learned Swedish and Danish, along with some Dutch, Norwegian, and enough French, Spanish, Turkish, and English to get by. How many languages do you know?"
After that, everyone helped him with his crossword puzzles.
A Floridian ought to have a better understanding of linguistics, but, they rarely do...
This week on May 25 1944, after 6 months of rest, reinforcements and trainings, the French fighter regiment "Normandie" joined its base in Doubrovka (70km north-west of Smolensk) and returned on the frontline for active duty.
On November 4 1943, the squadron and its pilots are in the spotlight because the group was named "Compagnon de la Liberation" by General De Gaulle and the nominations finally arrived. First Lieutenant Béguin is appointed Captain, Second Lieutenants Albert and Lefevbre First Lieutenants, Chief Warrant Officers Risso, Mathis (severely burned and repatriated to England) and Schick named SecondLieutenants.
On November 12, what remained of the squadron after its first campaign was repatriated exhausted to its winter quarters in Tula.
On December 22 1943, arrival of Lieutenants Amarger, Bertrand and Cuffault and Chief Warrant Officers André, Cazaneuve and Feldzer.
On December 29, the French Air Force finally granted to the "Normandie" squadron the "official" status of a Fighter Regiment R (R for Russian) with 4 squadrons ; The Russians already called "Normandie" a regiment since July 1943 but the French side still refered to it as "GC3 (Fighter group n°3) Normandie" until now.
On December 30, arrival of Chief Warrant Officer Carbon.
On January 7 1944, the first reinforcement of 14 pilots arrived. it included:
Lieutenants de Faletans, de Seyne, Sauvage (Jean) and Verdier, the Chief Warrant Officers Déchanet, of Geoffre, Delin, Douarre, Marchi, Martin, Mertzizen, Penverne, of Saint Marceaux and Sauvage (Roger).
On January 26, Captain Brihaye and Chief Warrant Officer Pierrot arrived.
On February 6, Lieutenant Moynet, Second Lieutenant Le Martelot and Chief Warrant Officers Bagnères, Bourdieu, Iribarne and Lebras arrived. "Normandie" received 11 Yaks 9T with 37mm cannon.
On February 7 the "Normandie" regiment was organized into 3 squadrons.
On February 24, Lieutenant Charras, Second Lieutenant Castin, Chief Warrant Officers Monier and Schoendorff and Captain Didier Béguin returned to Moscow. Béguin was then repatriated to Algiers. He will participate in other fights within the "Alsace" fighter group over France.
On February 28, arrival of Captain Louis Delfino and delivery of another Yak9T.
On March 18 1944, 12 pilots arrived as reinforcements (Captain Challe (Mauritius) and Chief Warrant Officers Challe (René, his brother), Emonet, Gaston, Genès, Manceau, Menut, Miquel, Perrin, Pinon, Querné). But that same day, the regiment deplored the disappearance of Second Lieutenant Joire (just nominated) and Chief Warrant Officer Bourdieu whose planes collided in training flight.
On April 3 1944, Captain Matras, Chief Warrant Officers Bayssade, de la Salle, Lorillon, Taburet and Versini arrived.
On April 8, reinforcement of 8 Yak9T.
On April 21st, death of the Chief Warrant Officer Foucaud in flight exercise.
The very heterogeneous reinforcement, both in its origin and in its quality, had to undergo training in combat conditions in the USSR and this caused a lot of material damage.
On May 6 1944, delivery of 20 yak 9 with 20mm cannon + 1 yak9T.
Finally on May 25, after a stopover in Borovskoye, the "Normandie" regiment (with 4 squadrons and 58 pilots) joined its base in Doubrovka.
The maintenance of the flying fleet (51 Yaks 9, 2 Ya7 used for training, a Yak 6 and a U2) was entrusted to Russian mechanics under the direction of Captain Engineer Sergueï Agavélian.
The first missions did not see any fightings but... on May 28, following an engine failure, First Lieutenant Lefèvre crashed and was seriously burned. Marcel Lefèvre was among the first pilots who volunteered to join the "Normandie" squadron back in 1942 and fight in Russia. By this point he was a flying ace with 14 aerial victories, 11 of which have been confirmed. He died from his wounds in hospital, at the age of 26, a week later on 5 June 1944, at the very moment when the Allies launched their assault on the beaches of his native Normandy...
He was buried in Moscow, near Napoleon's Old Guard soldiers, surrounded by honors in the presence of his combat comrades and the highest Russian and French authorities. Posthumously and by order of Stalin, he was made a Hero of the Soviet Union with the Order of Lenin.
Many thanks @oOkenzoOo for the detailed debrief, that's telling a lot.
I’m surprised the Normandie regiment wasn’t sent to participate in Normandie.
@@JohnJohn-pe5kr How they got to the USSR, and in some numbers, was quite a feat in wartime conditions.
Members of the unit tended to wear a mixture of French and Soviet uniform items. I have seen a photo of one pilot who is wearing a French Air Force peaked cap and tunic, but Soviet trousers and boots. Free French troops in North Africa had often mixed French and British uniforms, and in 1944 the tendency was to mix and match French and US uniforms.
Even today the Normandie regiment is still remembered in Russia, funny how the USSR and post USSR Russia was more kind to Free French Forces than the allies themselves, especially after the US entered the war.
it’s just that the Normandy regiment did not fit into the templates of the allies: the heroes of France could not successfully fight against the German aces on "shitty" Soviet aircrafts and under general command of "brainless" Stalinist generals
8:58 ah, one of the Lend-Lease Shermans.
I remember reading translated accounts from a soviet tanker, they mentioned the upholstery on the crew seats being a target for theft. Also that they did a supply raid later on in the war and a german vehicle managed to tag along on the end of the convoy as they withdrew back to soviet lines
It is crazy to think that on this day, all those years ago, so much has happened on the same day I have finally graduated college, today in 2023. I have learned much in other areas thanks to Indy and the many teams. The Great War, in-between two wars, and World War Two have taught me so much. You have been a sort of an attached education to me over these years of schooling, and you will continue doing so until the end. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for making this knowledge free, open, unbias (besides shining humanism on the topics), and making this series so well done. I am forever grateful to the teams work. From the bottom of my heart, thank you.
Congratulations on your Graduation! Wishing the best for you.
Just found this channel today, good stuff. Thank you for mentioning the Canadian effort in Italy. I recently discovered that my grandmother had a cousin who died at Pontecorvo on the 21st of May 1944. He was a trooper with the 4th Princess Louise Dragoon Guards.
Thank you.
Hi Indy
Another wonderful episode.
This war getting interesting after each week.
Thanks for covering.
At 9:04 a rare Soviet photograph of a lend-lease Sherman tank
They aren't that rare, though Soviet captions often did not mention their foreign origin. American and British tanks usually entered the USSR via Iran and tended to be sent to southern parts of the front.
SPOILER
A number of Shermans with Red Army crews will be photographed entering Bucharest, Romania, later in the year.
@@stevekaczynski3793
I read that book and definitely recommend it.
@@stevekaczynski3793 Thank you for explaining.
Clarke should have been court-martialled.
Instead he was promoted by his superiors in US to command entire 15th Army Group when Alexander became Mediterranean Theater commander.
@@merdiolu Almost same level idiocy like Douglas Haig in WW1
And here is my last (for now, it'll come back in roughly a year's time) post on the story of USS England. Last week saw her score four more submarine kills, bringing her total up to five. This week sees her sink the sixth and final submarine of her legendary spree.
Where we left off on the 28th, our destroyer escorts (England, George, Raby, and now Spangler) had just departed from their replenishment stop at Manus and were resuming their search for the remaining Japanese submarines on Scouting Line NA. Two days later in the early hours of May 30, two of Hoggatt Bay's tin cans, USS Hazelwood (DD-531) and USS Heermann (DD-532), gained radar contacts and moved to investigate. Heermann lost hers and began conducting a search for it, but Hazelwood began making depth charge attacks on hers. Just prior to making her attack, Hazelwood contacted Raby to inquire about the DEs' positions, and replied with an affirmative when Commander Hains asked if she desired their assistance. Since George and Raby were the two closest ships they would respond to the destroyers' contacts while England and Spangler would continue patrolling the line, much to England's chagrin.
George and Raby would take over for Hazelwood and Heermann, but for much of the day would have no luck with this apparent submarine. Numerous attacks were made and several dubious hits were claimed by both ships, but neither of them achieved anything concrete and the entire time neither were entirely confident they were actually attacking a submarine and not just a reef, since the target was moving very infrequently and only over a relatively small area. Additionally the two's efforts would be marred by mechanical failures, with both ships suffering steering casualties and Raby suffering a malfunction in her recorder that would necessitate the use of a stopwatch to time at least one of her attacks. George would also periodically leave Raby alone with the contact to go and examine another oil slick which had formed nearby and created more confusion over if there was more than one submarine in the area.
But finally at 1945, all doubts were removed when their submarine made a sudden and explosive entrance. George was off investigating the aforementioned oil slick, having ordered Raby to hold the contact for the rest of the night, when Raby reported that it had begun moving again. George immediately began heading back to Raby, but before she got there, their target would strike. This was none other than Ro-105, the flagship of Submarine Division 51. Apparently having taken advantage of the growing darkness and the two destroyer escorts operating separately from one another, Ro-105 surfaced to fire a spread of torpedoes at Raby. The destroyer escort was suddenly rocked by seven to eight violent explosions in groups of two or three in her vicinity, Ro-105 having likely fired two to four torpedoes, though fortunately none had managed to hit her. These explosions were felt clearly on both ships, with Raby likening them to the explosions felt after England's kills and George to depth charges exploding in close proximity to her.
George arrived on-scene shortly after to find Raby had been given a bit of a scare but was otherwise unharmed, and gained contact on Ro-105 shortly after. As she circled the submarine she noted a definite smell of diesel oil, possibly indicating that she had managed to score a non-fatal hit on Ro-105 earlier in the day. But along with potentially leaking fuel, Ro-105 had another urgent problem: her batteries. WWII-era submarines had two methods of propulsion; while on the surface, they would use their standard diesel engines. But while underwater, they had to rely on electric batteries due to submarines having a limited oxygen supply that couldn't be spent burning diesel. The only way these batteries could be recharged at sea was to surface and charge them with the diesel engines. The time was now shortly after 0300 on the 31st, Ro-105 had been underwater for potentially over 24 hours straight, and George had impressively maintained sonar contact with her for over six hours. Even though she had limited her movements as much as possible to conserve her batteries for as long as she could, they were undoubtedly running low at this point. She would have to find some way to recharge them.
At 0302, George and Raby were sailing around 4000 yards apart from one another when simultaneously George began to lose sonar contact and Raby reported that she thought there was something in-between them. Two minutes later, George would also pick up a surface contact between her and Raby. The two ships threw on their searchlights, and were shocked to see Ro-105 on the surface, sailing directly in-between them. Ro-105 had gambled that if she stayed within the two ships' lines of fire, they wouldn't dare to shoot for fear of damaging one another. She had guessed correctly. George and Raby had their searchlights and 3" guns trained on Ro-105, and for several tense minutes tried to maneuver out of one another's way while Ro-105 tried to stay in-between them. After several minutes at around 0305, realizing she had overstayed her welcome, Ro-105 slipped back beneath the surface around 1800 yards in front of the pair. George fired off one desperate shot from her forward 3" gun as Ro-105 submerged, but missed. Ro-105's batteries were likely only barely recharged, but nonetheless, she had bought herself a little more time.
During all this, England and Spangler's search had been much less eventful. The two had reached the southern end of Halsey's portion of the NA Line with only a few false contacts reported by Spangler, and were working their way back North when they began picking up radio transmissions from George and Raby just before Ro-105 surfaced. They put together that George and Raby had been hunting this submarine for some time but hadn't been having any success, and naturally, England got in touch to ask where they were and if they wanted her and Spangler to come help. This was rebuked by a presumably very tired and frustrated radio operator on George, who responded to England's offer with "We're not telling you where we are! We have a damaged sub, and we're going to sink him! Do not come near us!" Since it seemed like George wasn't exactly in the talking mood at the moment, the pair were going to just continue patrolling up the line. But when Ro-105 surfaced and Raby's searchlight operator went to train his light on her, his hand slipped, briefly sending the beam of light up into the sky and inadvertently telling England and Spangler exactly where they were. Electing to ignore the rather rude and probably unauthorized transmission from George, England and Spangler began steaming towards the beam at full speed. Once within range at around 0500, Commander Hains got in contact and gave them a much more reasonable order to standby at 5000 yards and wait for orders.
Both George and Raby had regained contact with Ro-105 after she submerged, and with the entire hunter-killer group now on-station, Hains brought England and Spangler up to speed on the situation and the four ships laid out a plan for sequential attacks on Ro-105 until she was destroyed once the sun rose. At first light at around 0649 George kicked things off, making an attack but scoring no hits. Raby was brought in next, and likewise she failed to connect with her attack at 0659. Perhaps trying to stave off what felt like the inevitable for as long as possible, Hains had decided to save England for last and had Spangler make the next attack at 0713. Much to everyone except England's displeasure, she too missed. Finally, Hains' resigned voice rang in over England's radio, "Oh, hell. Go ahead, England. It's your turn."
Before Hains had even finished his sentence, England had gotten to within 2,000 yards and registered a solid contact on Ro-105 at 0729, pinging through the sub’s wake. As she closed to 1350 yards she began getting back a low doppler, indicating that Ro-105 was setting up for a stern chase, which was confirmed when they closed to 900 yards at 0734. And finally, at 0736:05, England let her hedgehogs fly on a center bearing from 235 yards. England’s bridge was silent as seventeen seconds ticked by, and then - “V-R-R-R-OOM!” Six to ten detonations were heard loud and clear, as the audacious and elusive Ro-105 finally met her match. The submarine that George and Raby had potentially spent over a day chasing, was sunk by England in a matter of minutes. “God damn it! How do you do it?” Hains’ frustrated and astonished voice barked over the radio; to which Captain Pendleton, still seated in his chair off to the side on the bridge, chuckled and said, “Tell him we take out our pins.” Pulling the pins was what allowed the hedgehog mortar’s propeller to turn, which armed the projectile. For obvious reasons, this rather insulting reply was not transmitted to George. Five minutes later at 0741, Ro-105’s demise was confirmed with a resounding deep water explosion. England had just sunk six submarines in less than two weeks, an achievement which remains unmatched in the history of naval warfare. As one of England's sailors wrote in his diary, "They must really be seeing red on the George right now."
Later on George and England would depart to patrol and leave Raby and Spangler with the wreck, and the group would reform on the 1st. They would remain on Scouting Line NA, working with Hoggatt Bay and her rotating squadrons of escorting destroyers. On the 4th Commander Hains moved his flag over to Spangler during a return to Seeadler Harbor to refuel and restock, and on the 10th one of the tin cans, USS Taylor (DD-468), claimed to have sunk another submarine, but otherwise, their days were uneventful in comparison to the previous weeks. England departed the next day on the 11th for Blanche Harbor in the Treasury Islands, before returning to Purvis Bay for more boiler cleaning and repairs to her sonar. George, Raby, and Spangler remained with Hoggatt Bay until George detached on the 18th and was replaced by another DesDiv39 member in Osmus, a newcomer to the Pacific, and Raby, Spangler, and Osmus left on the 20th. No more submarines were sunk.
But at the conclusion of the operation, it was a great success and had dire consequences for the Imperial Japanese Navy. The destruction of Scouting Line NA convinced Admiral Toyoda that an American attack on The Philippines was imminent, and therefore allowed the US Navy’s 5th Fleet to advance effectively unimpeded towards the Marianas. When Vice Admiral Takagi appealed to Admiral Owada for his submarines to attack and destroy the American transports at any cost, Owada allegedly could only respond with, "This squadron has no submarines to station east of Saipan." And from there, America’s own submarines and carriers dealt a crippling blow to the Imperial Japanese Navy’s carrier forces in the Battle of the Philippine Sea. American subs brought down two of Japan’s finest fleet carriers in Shōkaku and Taihō, and the carrier aviation forces Japan had spent years rebuilding in the wake of the precipitous losses faced during the Battle of Midway and Guadalcanal Campaign were torn apart by American carrier aircraft and air defenses to such an extent that the battle would come to be known as “The Great Marianas Turkey Shoot.” It was a blow from which the IJN would never recover, and it was all possible thanks in no small part to the actions of USS England; who would add more titles to her name as the “Ace of the DE Fleet” and “Ace of the Pacific.”
Once word got out of the hunter-killer group’s, and specifically England’s, achievement, congratulations came pouring in from across the US Navy. Even England’s crew, headstrong and immodest as they were, began to feel embarrassed from all the attention. Admiral Halsey sent radiograms reading, “Submarine operation results gratifying x the game is won by this kind of teamwork x for a job well done all hands are heartily congratulated.” and, “The magnificent performance x Com Third Fleet sends action ComCortDiv Three Nine and Forty [...] England George Raby Spangler [...] Is a matter of great pride to the whole South Pacific team x May there always be an England x well done and congratulations to all hands.” Admiral Chester Nimitz’s read, “for their splendid accomplishments against the Japanese submarines, Admiral Nimitz sends warm congratulations to all concerned.” Admiral Ernest King’s, “There will always be an England in the United States Navy.” She garnered praise from Secretary of the Navy James Forrestal and even Prime Minister Winston Churchill himself, after President Franklin Roosevelt mentioned England in a letter to him. Even Commander Thorwall, for all his apparent grudges against Williamson, temporarily shelved them in light of the accomplishments of England and her crew; and his reports on the operations always commended their conduct and aptitude. Later that year, Williamson even managed to leverage England’s reputation to get his ship (and USS Foreman (DE-633), Thorwall’s flagship at the time, much to his dismay) a well-deserved 10-day leave in one of the primo liberty destinations, Sydney, Australia. The request was initially denied by Admiral Arliegh Burke, but Burke’s superior, probably Admiral Marc Mitscher, overruled him, strongly recommending he approve “Sub-Killer England’s” request.
England would return to performing her standard escort duties in the South Pacific for the rest of 1944, screening convoys throughout the Solomon Islands, Papua New Guinea, the Caroline Islands, and later The Philippines. Operations in the Ryukyu Islands in 1945 would result in England seeing much more action and having a number of close calls with Japanese bombers and kamikazes, giving her the opportunity to add a handful of aircraft kills to her resume. Back to 1944, due to having to rely on a Dutch map of Seeadler Harbor from the 1790s England ran aground on approach to the harbor that July, resulting in her starboard propeller shaft having to be replaced and her port shaft being stuck at 90/1000, later corrected to 13/1000, out of line. That August, Captain Pendleton was promoted to Commander and given command of a destroyer escort division, and Williamson took his place as England’s commanding officer. Pendleton, despite his many quirks, had grown on England’s crew, and they were sad to see him leave. Likewise, England had enraptured him as well. The captain of one of the destroyer escorts from Pendleton’s division would later complain to Williamson that England was all he would ever talk about.
And that's where I'll leave things off for now. Like I said at the beginning, tune in in May 1945 for the conclusion to England's story.
@Retired Bore Correct! Very effective and efficient anti-submarine weapon in skilled hands, as was the case with England's crew.
I can't hear the word Anzio and not immediately play that whistle from "To hell anf back" in my head.
Just love the content. And seeing how the matter where the battles are the infighting between allies and the jealousies
re Operation Bagration, I was always impressed by the parade of German prisoners, some 50,000 of them, through the streets of Moscow, after the defeat of Army Group Centre in Bielorussia. What I read somewhere was that there were doubts as to the veracity of Soviet reports on the number of prisoners taken, so the Soviet authorities decided to show the world. A number of the generals mentioned in different episodes led the "parade".
Didn't the Stalingrad generals lead that parade? Or am I thinking of a different previous one?
@@stevekaczynski3793 I only know if the one after Bagration
@@elausraliano Smaller ones were conducted, sometimes the POWs' heads were shaved before being made to march. I have seen a photo of one such parade, which looks like it was carried out in a fairly small town.
The mountainous terrain of Italy was the reason why General Mark Clark was able to get away with disobeying orders. The Cassino pass is only 4 kilometers wide with much of the open ground turned into cratered water filled shell holes and ruins from months of stalemated fighting intermixed with extensive minefields. The Liri valley is only 8 to 14 kilometers wide. General Leese made the mistake of trying to shove the entirety of the Canadian 1st Corps, British 13th Corps, and the 1st Polish Corps into the Liri valley. The result was a massive 14,000 vehicle traffic jam around the ruins of Cassino extending into the roads in the Liri valley. Most of the tanks, tank destroyers, infantry tanks, self--propelled artillery, field artillery, and anti-tank guns were stuck in the traffic jam around the ruins of Cassino. As a result, the frontline units of British 8th Army were only advancing an average of 1500 meters per day. The Germans added further to the slow advance through the use of extensive demolitions and the laying of minefields and deployment of anti-tank guns to impede the advance. The slow advance of the British 8th Army is one of the main factors that some military historians highlight about the low possibility of the German army being encircled if General Clark had obeyed orders and sent the majority of the US 5th Army into the Liri valley.
The Germans were partial to booby traps - this is touched on in the film "The English Patient", though that is set in the autumn 1944 fighting in Italy.
Thank you for actually providing some nuance to the comments section and not just blindly following the usual British historiography that tries to pin everything on Clark.
Clark did not have sattalite image from above to see traffic jam of Eighth Army and nor concluded "brilliantly" that he should capture Rome before British who had to overcome both traffic jam, mountains and 10th German Army deployed on Hitler Line. Clark was actually planning this insubordination way before Diadem and Buffolo offensives (Buffolo is Anzio breakout) since he was determined to take army group command from Alexander
@@merdiolu You don't need to see British advance at a glacier pace to know that trying to fling your army through a tiny pass is not conducive to rapid operations.
@@enterprise9001 Clark did not object before the start of operation about it , nor put any complaints about narrowness of pass (which he could not overcome for months) instead switched the axis of advance uniliterally on his leisure without informing his superiors in the middle of offensive on 25th May. Trusscott , VI Corps commander in Anzio later complained on this
I wish this episode had been posted early on the Patron so I could get my reply in early as I have been saying something similar to the below over the last few weeks leading up to this weeks fall of Rome.
My main issue when people are talking about Mark Clark and taking Rome instead of going for the possible encirclement is they never mention that George Marshall the highest ranking US Army officer DIRECTLY ORDERS Clark to take Rome and Clark's direct superior British General Harold Alexander tells Clark "to take Rome if possible" as well. People now like to make it out that Clark could have encircled multiple German divisions if he didn't go for Rome which isn't correct. Maybe the US 5th army surrounds 5-15k German troops (the most likely result) or maybe they get more lucky and get 50k tops if they went for the encirclement, but doing so would have risked the Germans again creating a new defensive line in front of Rome or just behind Rome resulting in the historic city becoming a battle ground.
Additionally taking Rome was a bigger goal and moral effect towards the end of the war then surrounding a small number German troops (small number for WW2s scale) would be. Rome was the first capital to fall of the Axis powers and one of the big 3 Axis powers at that. Additionally people forget that the goal of the Italian campaign was NEVER to push all the way up through Italy and the Alps into Germany. Fighting in the Alps would have resulted in far to high casualties. The goal in fighting in Italy was to occupy German divisions so that then could not be used on the Eastern or Western fronts. Whenever the Germans would try to take divisions away from the Italian front to use elsewhere is when Alexander and then later Clark would order further offensives against the German line in Italy.
Lastly, saying Clark wanted Rome for "glory" is the most silly argument ever. Not only is there everything I just mentioned above but further Clark is one of the few US or British officers of a high enough rank to know that D-Day is about to come. So he literally knows D-Day is coming the next day after he takes Rome. If he wanted max glory he would have gone for the encirclement of German troops and then pushed for Rome. But that is not what he did because the fall of Rome was a much bigger deal to ending WW2 then capturing some more German troops along a path that could never end the war ever would have been.
From what I've read I agree with you as well. The Italy campaign never had a chance to end the war. The goal of the front was just to pull Axis troops away from the main Eastern and Western fronts which it did. Whenever the Germans would try to move troops away from the Italian front is when Alexander and later Clark would launch attacks up Italy.
Taking Rome had a far greater result in ending WW2 then capturing a small number (like you said, small for WW2) of German troops.
I wonder how many allied troops died because of Clarke's thirst for glory?
There is something of a tradition that no matter what your rank, you salute first whenever you meet a medal of honor recipient.
After the war, Audie Murphy became an actor. And one day Clark was visiting a studio. Audie hunted for him and found Clark in the commissary.
Audie stood in front of Clark. And stood.
Until Clark saluted. Then Audie returned the salute and walked away without a word to Clark.
Asked why he did it that way, Audie replied something along the lines of, "that bastard got a lot of good men needlessly killed."
Audie legit hated him.
LIBERATION OF ROME: LANDINGS IN FRANCE
HC Deb 06 June 1944 vol 400 cc1207-111207
§The Prime Minister (Mr. Churchill) I must apologise to the House for having delayed them, but Questions were gone through rather more rapidly than usual. The House should, I think, take formal cognisance of the liberation of Rome by the Allied Armies under the Command of General Alexander, with General Clark of the United States Service and General Oliver Leese in command of the Fifth and Eighth Armies respectively. [HON. MEMBERS: "Hear, hear."] This is a memorable and glorious event, which rewards the intense fighting of the last five months in Italy. The original landing, made on 22nd January at Anzio, has, in the end, borne good fruit. In the first place, Hitler was induced to send to the south of Rome eight or nine divisions which he may well have need of elsewhere. Secondly, these divisions were repulsed, and their teeth broken, by the successful resistance of the Anzio bridgehead forces in the important battle which took place in the middle of February. The losses on both sides were heavy-the Allies losing about 20,000 men, and the Germans about 25,000 men. Thereafter, the Anzio bridgehead was considered by the enemy to be impregnable.
@@AceMoonshot The Germans had a similar tradition with Knight's Cross winners. On the day they got the award, they saluted nobody, but even superior officers saluted them.
None. Clark wasn’t necessarily wrong in going for Rome, and he was almost certainly right not to go for Valmontone, for the very simple reason that the Germans weren’t there.
@@qjnmh'm sure you know better than almost everybody who's ever looked at his actions since 1944
After two years, I’m finally caught up on everything. Thank you guys for everything you do.
We’re so glad you got up to speed!
Thanks for your dedication!! 🫡
No premiere? Well okay, was waiting for this all day :D
How Mark Clark became Commander in the Korean War puzzles me...He can't even play nice with his own allies!
Korea was a frustrating stalemate. Being handed off the duty was no favour to him. Signing the armistice at Panmunjom in 1953, Clark is notably sullen-looking in every photo of the occasion I have seen.
I reckon the Rome controversy happened only later, when historians started to do their jobs. And in his favor, as commander of 5th Army and later 15th Army Group he commanded the most multinational Allied force in WW2. 5th Army he commanded in addition to American forces British, French, New Zealand, Indian and South African units. As 15th Army Group commander in addition to those also the Poles, Canadians and Brazilians. His beef was with the British commanders, like Alexander. When he took over Alexander's job that beef was basically over and 15th Army Group performed very well in it's 1945 spring offensive. with the US 5th Army not being favored over the British 8th Army. So I guess that made him a candidate to command 8th Army in Korea.
@@stevekaczynski3793 By the end. But before that the armies had chased each other the full length of the pen-in-su-la.
@@himoffthequakeroatbox4320 By the time Clark became involved it was a stalemate, and he was not delighted to be the US commander by then. Hence his behaviour at Panmunjom. In both US and Chinese photos (the Chinese cameramen were on the other side of the signing table) he clearly isn't happy about what he is doing.
Just a thought, but maybe after an episode has been up for 6 weeks, you could add time codes for each front. That would really help with binge watching. I'm currently rewatching the Guadalcanal segments and really enjoying it!
In Clarke's defense Alexander was not a military genius either. Clarke had reason to belive that the Germans would not be trapped. Kesselring was the best commander of the three. Italy was made for defense especially if the attack started from the toe of the boot. The capture of Rome was a great victory. It was overshadowed the next day by the Normandy invasion, but Clarke could not know that
I think this is interesting. My paternal grandfather grew up close to back then Insterburg, today Chernyakhovsk in the East of Russian East Prussia. He and his mother fled during the summer of 1944 to family in a village on the Neisse river, because his father warned them that the front would soon reach them.
From what I know, my great aunt (passed away last summer in her late 90s) loved the strawberries they were eating and wanted to plant some for next year. My great grandfather then told them that the Russians would be there next summer and that they should leave, but they had to cover it up by styling it as visiting family (because fleeing was forbidden for a long time, leading to the trains of refugees in the winter of 44/45). And reportedly my great aunt was shocked when my great grandfather asked them what they would do if the Russians reached them at the Neisse, claiming it was "South of Berlin".
And while my grandfather was still a child (born 1935), his sister was a bit older (born 1925, they also had a younger sister born 1945, but she didn't survive the time after the defeat) and she worked for the harbour authority in Königsberg, which meant she left with the last German ship leaving the harbour.
And to loop back why it's interesting: We are close to reaching that point on this channel
The production, maps and information is amazing on this show. Like History channel level. Cheers, Indy.
Missing a bit in the Pacific, granted the look is at D-Day, Rome/ Italy and Bagation and historic victories
Destruction of Take No.1 convoy in late April - early May which was bigger than Bismarck Sea or Naval Battle of Guadalcanal with nearly 5000 IJA killed by US wolf packs, stopped all further major reinforcement of New Guinea. No small feat.
USS England eliminating the Japanese picket ine sent out to discover the next big offensive in Pacific which both Japan and US knew was coming. Japanese by now had a good read on US codes and radio traffic and direction findings. Hence, they could send out snoopers who inevitability find the US Fleet when it was leaving base or at sea.
Biak was start of KON operations which was MacArthur plan to speed up his offensives because he knew Marianas was happening next month, and he had to be in a favourable position to return to the Philippines when the JCS started askimg for next offensive in the Pacific. MacArthur used Ultra to attack as he had done in Admiralties invasion, and ran into the same problem, that Ultra didn't pick up all the Japanese army units on the island. Nor did he realise, it triggered mini A-Go as he stumbled in the Japanese of inner defensive Empire which was defended at any cost (ie naval and air Fleets counterattacks). Some of the 1st Air Fleet was relocated to Palau and Davao to launch counter-attacks but unfortunately for the Japanese, most of them came down with Malaria. So there was very limited attacks.
Operation Kon was activated on the 27th with Australian and US cruiser screening force scaring off Kon No 1 destroyer reinforcement run for loss of 1 DD via air attacks. Kon No.2 (another reinforcement run) and Kon No.3 (reinforcement run escorted by BatDiv 1 - the Yamatos and CruDiv 5, Myokos) will be launched over the next fortnight.
With Marianas invasion and subsequent destruction of naval (1st Mobile Fleet) and land based (1st Air Fleet) air forces, this saved MacArthur bacon and he could defeat the Japanese in his own time, and launch further landings up the Vogelkop to make sure he was in a favourable position for a return to the Philippines
7:20 how on earth, if he advances deep inland to "Valmontone' (sp?) do the British somehow come up from way back south, loop around him and whatever Germans are there and move on Rome?
You are right. It can’t. Which is one of the many, many reasons that his decision NOT to go to Valmontone had nothing to do with keeping the Brits out of Rome. His logic was (broadly) that the Germans weren’t at Valmontone, that he had an open flank, that destroying the 10th Army (which he did) had as much value as trapping the 14th (which he didn’t think he could do), and that as war is politics capturing the enemy capital has value of its own.
If ego was involved in going for Rome, it was only a (probably small) part of the story.
It's the third of June 1944, 20:00 CEST and a new episode still isn't out. Either the World War Two studio in Berlin had been bombed by another Harris' raid or the war is over and we just haven't been informed yet. ;-)
Terribly sorry for the delay!
We promise we’ll deliver you the next chapter very soon!
-Will
@@WorldWarTwo No need to apologise. I was just making a joke.
I hope that all is fine with your team and the delay isn't caused by some serious issues.
Thank you! We’ll explain a bit more in detail once the episode comes out…everyone is good on our end, just some unfortunate technical difficulties
Impressive depth and detail in historical military / political analysis.
Thank you! ❤️ We try our very best!
Have you any information, on the Ox and Buck Light Infantry in India and Burma? My father was with these, and was involved around Imphal and Kohima.
You might like to read (Flashman author) George MacDonald Fraser’s book “Quartered Safe Out Here”. He was with the Borderers of 17th Indian Div (Punch Cowan). He wasn’t at Kohima/Imphal, but served in the final six months of the war. It’s an excellent memoir.
Reading Rick Atkisons “ the day of battle “ now after finishing “ an army at dawn” I’m trying to have my reading coincide with the videos. Will catch up soon. So amazing. Just finished Ian Tolls pacific trilogy, I beg all of you reading this to get those books to supplement this great …. nay, Amazing production, so worth it.
Even if it was just a slight note at 10:24 about "other nations disagreeing" - thank you for mentioning it!
My grandpa flew supplies over the hump! I wondered when that'd come up
Thank you for sharing that, and thank you for his service!
"There's a Storm a Comin !"..Cheers Indy and team
9:08 a tripling in tank strength would be a 200% increase and not 300%. 300% actually mean a 4x in strength.
With the Allies advancing and stemming the tide against the Axis; Axis Powers are struggling to maintain their defenses. They only have a vague idea of where the Allies plan to strike. But they will severely underestimate their opponent’s abilities. For when the attacks come, it will be a testament to how the Allies have grown in their offensive capabilities since the beginning of the war. All the while, as the major Axis leaders realize how the war is going, they will now make sure that what the Allies liberate is a destroyed landscape. Godspeed to those who perished.
Another awesome play-by-play... well done everyone! 👍
So what does happen when the war is over? Does this channel just end? I hope you guys can still find more history on WWII in the future and keep things going. As the son of a WWII veteran, I look forward to every video you guys do. Good luck, Mike
They have TimeGhost at least, they might do Korea or something. Indy's been doing this for a long time.
Thanks for your support, Mike!
We’ve got some ideas in the books, we promise!
I have been to the area of the Anzio bridgehead just last week. Hard to believe, this was the place of a fierce battle in the war. And so close to Rome, the Alban Hills (or Mountains) would not seem to be a threat in my view, they can be passed by on the way to Rome along the coast.
And it really looks like Germany will face three major fronts soon - the one in Italy, the Eastern front and in France. Plus minor fronts on the Balkans. By now every german general must have realized, the war is lost. Maybe they should try to get rid of Hitler, to prevent the total destruction of Germany.
2:57 So Prigozhin is just the reincarnation of Satō?
Congratulations for the allies beating axis forces in anzio
We have less than a year left in Europe 😢❤
I appreciate this channel so much and will be sad when its over
HE SAW CROSSES GROW ON ANZIOOOOOOOO
WHERE NO SOLSIERS SLEEP AND WHERE HELL'S SIX FEET DEEP
@@nilswedman9818 That death does wait there's no debate
So charge and attack
Going to Hell and Back
I do hope that your team can do a detailed video for the July 20 plot.
General Clark might have had the right friends in life, and gotten all those shiny promotions, but I don't know if it would be worth it given the reputation that has come with it.
Even the most formidable line of defense will collapse sooner or later if it's attacked by a determined and superior enemy.
Tell that to Luigi Cadorna. ;-)
Italians were not superior to Germans.
@@maciejkamil austro-hungarians*
The brutal logic of war:
The Death Trains were intentionally not attacked by the Allies as those Death Trains were consuming limited logistical capacity of the railroad system under German control.
The Death Trains also were often given priority of draw upon equipment and priority of movement above all other traffic save the private trains of the Party officials of Germany.
Remember them.
My uncle was in a unit which was the first to encounter such a camp. Until his death he refused to speak of that experience other than to acknowledge he had been there.
This is correct, but the Allies still should have put more effort into damaging targets like the German rail network instead of wasting so many lives and resources in pointless city raids and re-attacking areas which had been rebuilt and hardened against air attack.
Anzio is supposed to be flanking move to break the stalemate. It ended up, cassino fell first. 😊
6:35 - Clarkus finally defeats the British!
Anzio let’s go!
The British-American alliance in the field was feckless and characterized by Generalship so incompetent (by British and American) that to this day more effort has been spent trying to shift blame than was spent trying to fight the Germans. This was especially true in the Mediterranean theater where bad commanders were left to make Kesselring look like a genius (and smile, of course). Kesselring's best defense was Allied offense.
Not really. Kesselring’s best defence was the utterly terrible Italian terrain, and the fact that the Allies fundamentally did not commit enough force to Italy to achieve what they wanted.
Allied generalship was not nearly as bad as is made out - I would argue it was good (Alamein), quite good (Tunisia), very good (Sicily), and a curate’s egg in Italy.
On top of that, during the parade of the Allied troops in the center of Rome, when the Jeep of an american general arrived in front of the Colosseo, he looked at the monument and seeing it partly damaged (by 2000 years of history, but he had no idea it was built by a Roman Emperor), he said with satisfaction to his attendant: "Good job have done our bombers!!"
The missing parts of the Colosseo have been intentionally dismantled during the centuries to use the marble as building material for other buildings. This went on until XIX century, when it was restored in its current state. Not a single bomb hit the monument (the Germans left the city without a fight), but pretending that american general to know the History (with capital H), was too much!
Thanks Indie
Thank you for the amazing documentary! Can't wait for Steiner's attack for real please cover that LIVE
Das war ein Befehl! Der Angriff steiner war Befehl!
Hitler enters the room irritated 🙄 😒 😤
They will if it ever happens.
@@caryblack5985 The dialogue was real though
@@alih6953 But the atttack was not.
Thank you Indy❤ teach us!
I am missing Sparty and the WAH series; I know he is probably busy with the D-Day preparations. Keep telling the stories of who we lost and how, it's very important! Also not sure if you have any plans for Memorial day special.
We know! We miss him too, he’s just very busy with prep for DDAY!
We promise to return to our regularly scheduled programming soon! We know how important remembering those stories is!
Never Forget!
Thanks guys
G'dam Indy's wardrobe is great. 👍
Solid content. Killer tie, beautiful vest.
you reminded me I haven't seen Gianni in the comments in a long time
This week in French news.
The 21st, the Resistance activates the FFI and orders attacks on several points.
The 22nd, the BBC asks to help the allied forces after the landing. The same day, Pétain meets in Voisins Carl -Henrich von Stülpnagel, commander of Germans troops in France, and Rundstedt. This is only about the military situation and Rundstedt invites Pétain to visit the Atlantic Wall, but he refuses. He continues to meet politicians, administrative personnel, delegates of organization and meets the ex-Queen of Portugal, Amélie d’Orléans. He visits towns affected by Allied bombardments.
The 24th, the COMIDAC becomes the COMAC (Comité d'action militaire) to direct all resistance forces under the CNR. But like the leadership of the FFI in London (Koenig) it has little power over resistance cells. L'Humanité asks to form Patriotic Militias.
The 26th, Pétain visits Nancy and proclaims that “two armies” are going to ledge war in France and that the French should “take neither party”. He then goes to Épinal, Dijon and then to Lonzat near Vichy.
L'Humanité and the Communists tries to have for the CNR more power in the GPRF. It creates the Central Council of the Patriotic Militias to supersede the CNR. The 11th of August, it will be dismantled by the CNR.
@@loveroffunnyy depends of where and who.
I dont talkcabout it about war against Humanity is going to continue and catch up by talking about the resistance.
Vut as of right now there is a guerrilla warfare inchte Vercor
Regarding Overlord, I am concerned as to when, in Eastern Daylight Savings Time, the coverage starts. The first troops...American and British Airborne troops are supposed to arrive at 12 midnight, local time. That would be 7pm, on the East Coast of North America (I am in New York City)
Everything will be viewable on the channel after it airs live, if you're worried about missing something. I had to watch the whole Pearl Harbor series that way because of bandwidth issues, my local network just couldn't keep up and the premiere episodes kept stalling and glitching out.
@@Raskolnikov70 I understand this, but as a 'fan', I would like to catch things when they start.
I was also wondering if they were going to mention the Verlaine poem...the signal to the Resistance that the invasion was imminent ["Les sanglots longues de les violins d'auttome...blessant mon coeur avec un langour monototone"...and I know I misspelled some of that]?
What’s everyone reading ??
I’m on Shattered Sword right now. Tryin to get Lundstroms work but it ain’t cheap. Did get to order another Citino book on the way
I wish more of Citino’s books were on kindle…
props on the subtitles
Thank you!
Does this mean that the Anzio landings were still a good idea, even if they were less useful than originally imagined?
Even as isolated between January May 1944 , Anzio beachead tied down eight German divisions to besiege it (eight less German divisions to fight in France after D-day)
That's an impossible question. What was more valuable, the German divisions tied at Anzio, or the Allied divisions tied in the beachhead and the air and naval resources tied supporting them? At the very least is evident the original plan was incredibly bad, the landing force was far too small... how were just two divisions expected to a) consolidate the beachhead b) advance to the Alban Hills and c) from there threaten to envelop the German rear? Such an operation would have demanded at the very least 4 divisions, and probably more, including at least an armoured division!
In other words, as an arrow on the map the Anzio landing idea was good, but the resources needed to make it a reality didn't exist.
@@isidroramos1073 Tying down only two Allied divisions in a narrow beachead and eight German divisions (later increased to nine for counter attack that failed in February) was a much better investment for Allies when only one of German divisios deployed in Anzio perimeter was sent to Normandy in 1944 spring ,D-Day might have been a defeat for Allies.
I agree initial landing plan of Shingle was bad when the assets in hand would only land VI Corps in three waves therefore forfeiting suprise advantage but still the net result was Allies used this narrow beachead eventually to breakout and reach Highway 6 from flank in May , only four months late though when rest of 5th and 8th Army battling to breakthrough Senger Line further south
@@merdiolu Two divisions was only the initial force. The Allies had to send more and more units until by May 1944 there were 7 divisions at Anzio and another one (British 56th ID) had been withdrawn due to heavy losses, so Anzio ended up tying 8 Allied divisions and forcing the Allied navies to send supplies for five months to a force that in the last stage of the battle reached at least 150,00 men. That kept occupied a very large number of unvaluable landing craft.
And by then the German force surrounding the beachhead had been reduced to just five divisions.
@@isidroramos1073 True , VI Corps was swelled seven division in order to initiate Buffolo breakout but that was thanks to Operation Diadem planning (thanks to General John Harding , Chief of Staff of Alexander in 15th Army Group command) of stripping Eight Army corps north of Cassino , shifting and concentrating them on Fifth Army front on left flank of Allied front in secret and diverting German reserves to coast with deception plan previously in order to achieve local superiorty so Fifth Army could overwhelm Gustav Line between Cassino , Highway 6 and coast (which they did). No extra divisions were diverted from Overlord build up in UK , on the contrary several divisions wre lost from 15th Army Group in Italy , transferred to UK for Cross Channel attack in November 1943 and for Operation Dragoon in June 1944 and Allied armies broke though under dimishing resources , priorties , under a difficult mountain terrain AND increasding number of German divisions ( German Army Group C swelled from 18 divisions 22 German divisions between January and May 1944 and incoming Italian Salo republic units collaborating Germans).
The naval support of supplying reinforcing Anzio beachead might have seem big but considering the main build up for Operation Overlord or Pacific Campaign (considering that Germany First policy of Allies , shifting landing craft there was controversial when there were more Germans in Italy than Pacific islands) , the Allied naval assets and landing craft were meager (landing craft in Mediterranean were mostly shifted to UK for Cross Channel invasion in February 1944 after Shingle and Anvil/Dragoon landings would not be initiated before mid or end of August anyway)
And the number of German divisions reduced to six divisions before Buffolo breakout on 23 May again thanks to Diadem previous breakthrough at Aurinci mountains and fall of Cassino , since Kesselring and Von Vienthigoff had to shift several divisions and reserves from Von Mackensen's 14th Army at Anzio to Senger line to contain Allied advance. It was always two way stage attack for Allied attack on Gustav Line on May 1944 (Diadem and Buffolo) one leveraging another.
D-day and Bagration. June is going to hit Germans hard...
thank you for all the hard work indy!
You are very welcome!
Can you cover project X-Ray and other wacky projects going on during the war. Most people don't realize that in a very similar timeline to our WW2 would have involved the use of swarms of bats armed with napalm bombs, turning into devastating weapons of mass destruction.
The Allies didn't bother with bats since napalm did a much better job.
@@Raskolnikov70 actually the army air corp found that while conventional bombs caused 150-500 fires, the same payload of bats (which were armed with napalm) would cause around 3600-4700 fires. They only stopped due to rising cost and shifting focus to the Manhattan project
@T WE that actually could be really interesting! We’ll have time for more side specials like that once our special June 6 event passes ;)
Maybe it could be something like I cover over on our Twitter!! Sure sounds fascinating either way 😄
-Will
@@WorldWarTwo I'd definitely watch that. Other animal themed projects in development during WW2 include using trained pigeons to guide bombs onto specific targets (as crazy as it sounds it actually worked, the only problem was the lack of light while going through the clouds disoriented the pigeons), and the dogs who were armed with bombs and trained by the soviets to go under tanks.
Feel free to credit me for the idea lmao, I'm Tyler Weaver-Escobar
So, no Premiere this week. Understandable with D-Day next week! I can't wait... and yet I dread it being over.
D-Day is two weeks, next Tuesday is May 30th.
Tuesday, June 6th, 2023: 9 days from now, I was confused too at first.
@@JohnJohn-pe5kr I mean, counting workweeks it fits.
@@guillaumedeschamps1087 Ok 👍
Why wasn't Clarke Court Martialed?
Court marshalling especially a publicly known press favorite US general would be almost impossible (especially in press and home front) in an alliance during 1944 when US was major partner along with USSR and UK became junior partner. Besides his was not really a court marshall offense. Relief from duty maybe yes (was not done but instead they promoted Clark to army group command replacing Alexander) burt court marshall could be done in face of treason for which Clark was not guilty of.
Because he wasn’t necessarily wrong and Alexander (his superior) actually broadly came to agree with Clark’s POV after initially being furious.
@@qjnmh I see. Plus there's the problem the americans were not about to put one of their generals on trial for giving a Brit the finger. Still, if a complete encirclement wasn't possible due to alternative routes of widrawal by the germans, it sounds like he could've still inflicted a lot more damaged had not been more interested in glory than results.
Formations from Army Group Center will be marching in Moscow before we know it!
Steiner will take care of everything.
I just followed the other chanel for the 24 stream, Canada 🇨🇦,sends it's love
Another Great episode..... cheers to our host INDY.
Great work Indy & team! Looking forward to 24 hours of D-Day.
What’s going on with Sparty & War Against Humanity?
Thank you so much! We are too!
He’s busy with all the preparations for that DDAY project, but we promise he’ll be back to WAH soon!
Marcus Aurelius Clarkus..... The one I would vote for as the single most incompetent allied general of WWII.... This self serving narcissistic insubordination by Clark actually changed the political map of Europe for the next 75 years.... By not destroying the German 10th Army, and letting Kesserrling escape, it would cost tens of thousands of more needless military and civilian deaths, from another entire year of the war, which had to be fought all over again, in the northern Appenine mountains, and not on the border of Austria, closing the Lubjana gap and the Iron Gate....
I agree that he's a worthless gloryhound, but as Indy correctly said, there is no guarantee that the Germans would have been cut off, there were other roads out there. Kesselring was still a crafty bugger and a blitz through Italy was just impossible. Also, at this point of the war Italy was a sideshow, and there was just NO WAY IN HELL that Roosevelt would funnel more troops and resources to send Allied forces into the Balkans. If anything he was going to order US troops out of theater. Juin's Expeditionary Corps and Truscott's VI Corps were slated to be withdrawn for Operation Dragoon. So any success in Italy would not be exploited by the US. And the British had no additional forces available to reinforce 8th Army, unless they would take away troops slated for Overlord. Which the Americans would not allow to happen. Sorry, but what you are suggesting is an illusion.
There are Lloyd Fredendall, Gamelin, Weygand, Arthur Percival, Semyon Buddiony, Kliment Voroshilov, Grigory Kulik, Lev Mekhlis, and then there's the asshole that stayed in the theater in Kiev during Barbarossa.
My grandparents live in September the 13th road here in Rovereto (northern Italy) the road is called like that because on that day in 1944 the allies launched a bombardment mission against the railroads near there. One of the pilots had problems dropping his bombs on target and had to drop them after having flown over the objective, because if he didn’t he would not have made it back to base. Those bombs hit the countryside and killed many civilians (my grandfather witnessed everything) and destroyed many homes. Maybe if Clark had made the right choice Rovereto would have been liberated by that time or the allies would not have ordered that bombing run. Who knows.
@@SteelLegionnaire I live in Nijmegen, the Netherlands and we got bombed by the USAAF too, 800+ people died and the historic city center forever ruined. Don't wreck your brain thinking about what might have happened, or who was to blame. Mark Clark, some USAAF bomb group not hitting their target right that day, or mistaking one city for another. Mistakes happen in war and the Allies were conducting a concerted campaign throughout occupied Europe to hit any rail junction. It might still have happened, or not. We will never know.
@@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623 you’re definetly right
Thank you for the lesson.
Thanks for watching!
Excellent Episode, as always :)
We do our best, thank you!
You’re excellent!
Another informative and well presented episode.
15:22: I'm curious - who was the US officer who blabbed about D-day?
Patton was relieved of his command for slapping soldiers. Clark, on the other hand.... .?
oh shi, 9 more days until Overlord, let's go, I'm so hyped :D
18:42 I am no military expert but hearing the news makes me think that maybe, maybe the Germans will loose the battle if not the war. Whenever that happens.
It is inconsoluable that we are at the business end. what are we going to do from next sept :( keep up the good work