How Apothecary Diaries Flips Genre Convention
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ค. 2024
- #apothecarydiaries has wrapped on Season 1 - Season 2 has been announced - and while I still feel very strongly that my previous video ( • The Secret Sauce That ... ) still captures what makes it so great, I wanted to correct the record on one aspect, and show that even though Apothecary Diaries isn't the kind of mystery series I was expecting - it's still a pretty damn good one, even while it highlights aspects that wouldn't be considered as such.
#kusuriyanohitorigoto
Follow on Twitter: / value_replay
Support on Patreon: / replayvalue
Join the Discord: / discord
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Music:
Toto'haha - Octopath Traveler 2 OST
Lady in Waiting - Apothecary Diaries OST
Understanding the Situation - Apothecary Diaries OST
Reminiscing by the River - Gamer of the Winds (ocremix.org/remix/OCR04159)
Chapters:
Intro - 0:00
Atypical Standalones - 1:19
Arc Mysteries - 5:02
Conclusion - 9:18
Logo: Drawplex - ภาพยนตร์และแอนิเมชัน
My favourite arc in the series has to be the slow reveal of Lakan and just what his deal is. The story repeatedly tells you not to draw conclusions based on conjecture and then presents you with someone who, on the surface and with the choice fragments of information provided, appears to be a despicable man that treats others as lesser than himself. Maomao’s reaction to him only cements this conception, and then they pull the rug out from under the people who were too quick to judge him by revealing he has a severe mental disability that fundamentally changes how he is able to see the world around him. He didn’t abuse Maomao’s mother, she manipulated him and he didn’t realize what was happening until circumstances outside of his control had already robbed him of the chance to take responsibility for his mistakes. What happened to Fengxian wasn’t his fault.
Basically, if you don’t internalize Loumen’s core tenant on conjecture, this story is going to teach it to you the hard way. Hating Lakan for actions he never took and for things he had no control over is wrong, and judging his behaviour which is shaped by a mental disability is shallow.
Love this comment, you summarized this perfectly
Also, the reveal at the end that Maomao's disdain wasn't based on hatred, but jealousy. She just disliked the man because her father would go on and on about how brilliant he was.
@@Paratet Maomao’s disdain is sourced from the fact that a strange man she’d never seen before got uncomfortably close to her and insisted she call him “dad” when the man she already considers her father was right there, which was a traumatic experience due to her being three-years-old at the time paired with Lakan’s excessive intensity. He tried to straight-up take her home a few times when she was still a small child unable to resist and had to have it beaten into him that he’s gotta pay for her despite the fact that it would still take years for him to be on speaking terms with the madam.
Loumen pitied him and tried to illustrate that he’s not a bad person, and even worthy of admiration, but by then the damage had already been done.
The slow reveal was good. I thought he was some old pervert who wanted maomao to be his wife.
Don't know if you're aware, but there was already a subtle follow up with the stick mystery. The level-headed soldier who convinced his hot-headed colleague not to kill the villagers is the guy who was allowed to marry the concubine who faked sleep-walking, the one who was his childhood sweetheart. I don't know how much you know of the source material, but this first season covered the plot of the first two light novels. The 15th light novel has just been release in Japan.
approximately 7-8 seasons just to catch up with the light novel, jesus christ thats a lot of source material
@@Kettvnen to catch up with the light novels as they are right now.
imagine if it reaches 25 or even 30 30 volumes
Oh if they keep at this pace and general level of care in adaptation, we will be in for good viewing for a while.
The amount of times Maomao focuses on her pinky finger for just a second or two at random moments throughout the series before you know the significance or even realize to look for it was STAGERING to me as someone who’s read the manga tbh. Every time it happened I’d nearly jump out of my seat like “YOOOO SHE DID THE THING AGAIN!!!”
I have one word, and if you know, you know.
FROG
Yep. Just a frog. Definitely not anything else.
frog.
Moderate frog
Average sized frog😊
As someone who either doesn’t know (or has forgotten.) this is very confusing. I hope you enjoyed making me want more mao mao then what we anime watchers already have you monster.
My only regret about Apothecary Diaries has nothing to do with the show, but instead that it had to come out at the same time as Frieren, which has sort of taken over everybody's brains. Which is not a knock against that show, I adore it too, but I feel like the timing means Apothecary Diaries may not get the props it deserves and that makes me sad.
Yeah, TAD is my personal favorite of the two, but looking at manga sales and TV ratings in Japan, or scores on websites like MAL, it’s hard to deny that it ended up playing second fiddle to Frieren.
Looks like it’ll get a second season before Frieren does, though - and I am SUPER psyched to see LN3-4 adapted.
I don’t see how Frieren diminished the reception to Apothecary Diaries, in fact it probably helped (“rising tide lifts all boats” sort of deal). Imperial court intrigue with slow-burn romance isn’t the most popular genre for anime watchers in the first place, so I’d say it actually overperformed.
For real. I can admit that Frieren is the better show overall. But Apothecary Diaries turned out to be my personal #1, and it really all comes down to Maomao. No one in Frieren's cast was as compelling for me to watch, or written or acted as well.
@@yubaa I think you're right. Many of my friends starting following Anime releases weekly again when Frieren came out due to the hype surrounding it, and when they finish the one weekly Frieren episode they looked through the other anime running at the time and found TAD (Myself included).
Ahh fantasy vs historical
I just finished volume 10 and let me tell you two things. 1. It only keeps getting better, and 2. yes, the foreshadowing in this show is unmatched, literally stuff that just appeared in the anime is still relevant in volume 11 of the LN
As someone who is currently on the latest English released chapter of volume 11, I can confirm.
@@Trisha_Yuu Oooooh I love call backs being relevant to the story.
@@Trisha_Yuuhey where do you read the LN?
@@miyaatherton8326 you can read on j novel club
@@Trisha_Yuu Same, did you read Volume 12 English!?
Apothecary Diaries is now my favorite piece of fiction. I truly am engrossed in MaoMao's world.
What I think is so interesting about the mysteries in apothecary diaries is how it tricks you into thinking certain things without outright lying to you. It makes you assume things that would be the most obvious conclusion only to drop hints as to what is actually happening. And that pays off in spades by the end. Great video!
I love how Mao Mao is a flawed and not a perfectly reliable narrator as well. The thoughts she has don’t always lead to the right direction and it takes a while to even get a full understanding of her as a character as there may be things that haven’t been expressed yet
While the story also warns you about conjecture early on - it's wonderful.
If you want to make a full Apothecary Diaries series, I am all here for it!
While we patiently wait for more Hyouka, of course. Surely more Hyouka will happen😭
In Summer there is an anime coming out, How to Be Ordinary that is also a Slice of Life Mystery series by the same author as Hyouka. You can check that out.
i mean, the problem of Hyouka, is there is not enough source material at all. The anime already adapt to vol 4 of the Light Novel, and there are only 6 vol until now. That much only fit for another cour, or even some short run OVA.
@@huuthien2911 I understand there’s not much more.
But that means there IS more, and it COULD exist as anime.
We can bring up the matter again in 2036 when the author is up to volume 8. 😛
@@cthellisI think the director died in the fire soooo it might not have the same feel. But Kyo Ani has many talented people so maybe the lady who did violet evergarden could in theory step up in 10 years time by which point hopefully we will have volume 8.
I will confirm that as someone who read the first 2 novels (and currently on the 3rd) that cover season 1 of this show, the structure is very similar. The adaptation is quite accurate really. So the interconected mysteries and hpw they're ordered and executed is quite one to one with the writing style.
This has been my favorite mystery series for the past 5 or so years. It’s different than my usual Agatha Christie stuff but the overarching mysteries and character depth is amazing. MaoMao isn’t OP and is aware of her status and limitations. She’s sharp but she still gets stuff wrong. And of course I love the dynamic between her and Jinshi🤣
I've read up to the 5th volume of the light novel and it's kind of insane how the story keeps building on itself and throwing older scenes into a new light tbh. Even the start of the story itself takes on a new layer of meaning as you get to a future plot point we'll probably explore in s2. The continuity in this show is glorious
And here I thought One Piece did that well.
It's amazing that they managed to stretch 2 light novels into 24 episodes without feeling boring when usually 24 episodes is around 6 volumes
my fav part was when i realized suirei being mentioned looking quite tall with a sharp jaw for a woman was to confirm the blue eyed man salting the general's sake was her all along.
Also the fact that consort rouran is known to dress very different on random days that jinshi "couldnt recognise her" also supports how suiren's disguise worked so far. She's defo rouran's spy
I had never put two and two together that it was her... and after re-watching I noticed that the shot of her at the end of the Ep. 9 opening and the shot of her leaving the mortuary in Ep. 20 is the exact same shot.
After you first video on the anime, I got hooked on the manga, rushed through it and ended up reading all of the translated light novels in a weeks time
you fucked my sleep schedule man
I think your excitement mirrored mine. I picked up the LN shortly after the midway point of the season, and finished the second LN (where season 1 ends) around the second cours mid point. My friend did the same with the Manga, and we have spoken at length on how the structure of how the mysteries are written with subtle reviews and red herrings are directly mirrored in the broader Book long or cour long arcs and how they handle interpersonal mysteries of the characters. Things like Jinshi's identity and Maomao's family dynamics were all handled with the same care that individual mysteries recieved.
The way Apothecary Diaries sets things up so that they can domino into future revelations later on is master-class, and this video does a great job showcasing that
I love how "the ceremony" is a culmination of a lot of previous misteries and events while still pushing forward 2 other plots (Jinshi and the tactician).
The story also put back in the context previous events, even the first chapter can be recontextualized (and not as a retcon like other shows did)
Having read the first 10 volumes of the light novel. All I have to say is, it just gets better and better, and the plots span long, as rightly guessed!
As I'm starting more on the light novel side recently, I can at least give you some insight into that if you want it.
In the books, the episodes are brief chapters. Just one or two chapters told in 3rd person limited, usually MaoMao's head. And there's not much dialogue at all. Being part of a novel is probably why you get the interconnedtedness and stories that are not mysteries. Those stories are still part of the connective tissue of the novel, and need to exist.
Other than that, I'd gives this light novel a high recommendation if you like it. Most light novels read like the authors have a kind of middle school idea of writing. I don't know if its the genre conventions, an actual lack of skill in most writers in the genre, an issue with translation or what, but most light novels suck in the actual literary merit category of writing. Apothecary Diaries is genuinely WELL WRITTEN. I don't know if it's just a great translator, or a great author combined with a great translator, but if you were going to read any light novel series, this is the one to read. Amazon does have kindle and paperback copies available.
It is , however, less "cutesy." The anime uses anime conventions to make MaoMao a more typical anime protagonist, and it actually doesn't suit the character that well if you read the novel. Little things like giving her cat ears and making her dance for joy are out of character for her.
Maomao does get maniacal when she finds rare herbs in the novel too though. It's why Yinghua and the others mistook Maomao for another otaku character in vol. 3 right? I think the tone overall isn't relatively less cutesy than the anime unless you find the light novel illustrations out of place as well. In fact some characters are portrayed a bit more goofy in the novel than in the anime. Best one I can think of is the emperor. In the novel he'smuch more approachable and casual. I really don't know why they made him super serious in the anime as if they're making him out as the villain or something. Lakan is also goofier in the novel.
I think they were made more serious in the anime to play off the don't make conclusions off conjectures theme. The emperor and Lakan off their positions alone are supposed to be menacing characters, but at the end of the day, they're human just like the rest of the cast. They're caged by their positions, and that's everything in this world.
@@AlvissaCo tbf the anime direction takes a much more "historical drama" angle and it shows a lot when compared to the manga (and to a lesser extent, the novel), which makes it give off a more serious/realistic vibe than you usually get from anime. So the emperor being Like That checks out considering all the characters are generally portrayed in a more serious way/they aren't as expressive
Hell ya glad you uploaded I can't wait to see what you upload next maybe another Apothecary video or just maybe your final thoughts on Frieren
This anime is just. Gold i have always been intersted in the chinese dinasty era and other animes simply wasnt realistic,while This anime was just. EVERYTHING i wanted,i waited the anime to end so i wouldnt be waiting for season 2 and im glad i finished it today.
This anime just explains everything flawlessly and making US feel like maomao ❤
BTW if you want more Hyouka type shows this summer There is a Show called "How to Become Ordinary" which is adapted from Novels also written by Honobu Yonezawa the author of the Classic Club series (Ergo Hyouka's Source Material) being adapted by the studio Lapin Track who did last year's Undead Girl Murder Farce (Which if you like Mysteries and missed that hidden gem last year I recommend you watch.)
I'm currently reading the How to be Ordinary novel series. The anime trailer looks very promising! Is a community/fandom discussing it?
@@Amy-G-Dala- not that I know.
It's the looking at her pinky while thinking what got me. I saw the manga and when I recognised what was she doing in the anime, I realised that it's a beautifully subtle foreshadowing and extra, hidden layer of her character.
Thank you for this review
Just Wanted to thank you for this video, because it was the reason I started watching Hyoka, which I absolutely loved (And ofc because of the detailed analysis of the Apothecary Diaries)
Glad you loved Hyouka, such an incredibly special series.
@@ReplayValue It sure was, and your playlist is making me love it even more with each video!
Can’t wait for season 2
FROG
I picked up this show 'late' (a month ago) and just by chance. I fell in love with it so much that I immediately bought all the light novels that were available and read them all non-stop. I found the writing and forethought really satisfying and I could say with conviction that the source (LN) lends its strength over to the anime. I'm now once again left with the regret that I stopped my studies of nihongo, and will have to wait for the English translation of the LNs which is at least a year behind the JP :(
Oh yes, you get it, you get why this show grabbed me. I'm so glad to hear someone elses verdict matches mine. It is a mystery series and a court drama and historical fiction all in one and does it marvelously. Apothecary runs a lot like a serial drama but it is masterful at weaving the standalone mundane stories into a longer narrative in a way very few serial dramas achieve. I'm glad you've been enjoying it and I look forward to whats to come.
That smack still goes hard
Been wanting a series like hyouka.
and I love this anime.
Its not what I expected. It really suprised me.
Around mid season I picked up the LN. I finished the whole 13 of them in a week. It’s amazing definitely would recommend.
A great video for a great anime! Im going to miss Kusuriya, good thing there is gonna be a 2nd season
The concept of chinese rear palace will always be interesting, so an anike about it is fierce
Great video
the more I read the manga more and more piece of the puzzle is apply.
I hope this series popularity will lead to "raven of the inner Palace" also getting a second season😢
It's crazy to me that I've been watching videos of yours about, or compared to, Hyouka for 6 years now. Still my favourite anime.
While apothecary diaries was easily my favorite anime of the season by FAR which is to say a lot. I think Frieren is the best anime ever. Period. It is the only anime I could recommend to almost literally anyone. I could not do that with any other anime.
Nice video
AND IT IS JUST GONNA GET BETTER BRUH
Oreki in the thumbnail lol
I am reading the manga. You can prepare to scream when another call back happened.
My only small problem with MaoMao is she look more like Isekai protagonist that person that grown in that culture. Some of here knowledge is close to be from 21th Century (CPR) that to around 18-19th where this show suppose to be. Same with her world view, best example is her reaction to ghost rumors, she is very fast to dismissive it and this should be very rare approach in that place and age.
But this only minor problems as do not affect overall plot much.
I binged the anime up to the available episodes when i saw your video. I really liked it and because I couldnt wait i read up to... halfway of volume 3 of the novel? Last thing i remember (very minor spoiler i guess) was maomao teaching the concubines how to pleasure the King. (End of spolier)..
..
..
I liked the series overall, i think the anime is a bit better in terms of pacing, but what bore me is the mystery. (I should continue watching the episodes though to make a better assesment)
I thought the mysteries were pretty shallow. Like you said, the focus is in the characters. And i think thats great! I just found the characters werent changing at all. Everyone seemed to be a static character. The eunuch was still trying to flirt with maomao. Maomao was still ignoring him/didnt want romance. The concuvines and the concuvine helpers seemed to treat her as before/in the beginning(like they had a behaviour reset for some reason?). For a character focused story, the narrative sure didnt affect the personality of any of the character's behaviour or thoughts.
I was actually expecting either the eunuch to stop pursuing maomao or for her to start falling for him while keeping the focus on the "Dr house/sherlock" part. I guess thats also fault of mine because i expected something different from what the series was offering (+ my personal taste in stories of course), but regardless, i still think it feels like the story advances but characters stay the same. Its an ok story, a 7/10. i just felt the anime had better pacing than the LN, that the characters werent changing much... and the teases of romance from the eunuch was boring me cause they werent leading anywhere. It left me with wanting to read an actual romance novel lol.
Maomao already teach that class once. So i don't think its a spoiler😏
I think you need to continue reading up to at least volume 4 and then make your judgement.
@@ernitm6692 i mean, fair, but now i prefer to watch the anime cause the episodes are out. I dont mind giving the LN the DNF treatment
i agree with this video, therefore it's a good video
no but really, glad you enjoyed it as much as i did
Having read the novel, some of those payoffs go up to volume 9, from volume one(First half of the season)
have you watched Master of Demonic Cultivation? Its just like this but much more complex
I think it's a more realitic takes on mysteries, the genre tend to try too hard to be a game between the writer and the audience "will you get the answer with those elements I gave you ?" which is fine but lead to too many conventions to not lose the reader and frustrate him by giving solutions too far fetched.
Here what helps is that, not all of the elements we see are always part of the solutions, there are several stories happening at the same time, some are connected and some are not, some connects to stuff that happened long ago, other to more recent stuff.
What it reminds me of is the TTRPG legend of the 5 rings, which also happen to take inspiration from asian cultures (tho in a more fantastic setting)
The plots that are provided for that game very often also do that trickery of being a mystery where all the elements don't add up only to the answer you're looking for but to several smaller stories that may or may not be related with your main problem. it helps making it feel like the whole place doesn't revolve around that one story you're living right now and it also makes deduction harder because you cannot assume that everything strange happening has to be related to your mysery, which is a bias a lot of mystery novel have.
I would really like to join your discord server but it's showing the link is invalid or has expired
the old title feels so much better, idk
Had to test a new one, people weren’t as intrigued.
MyaoMyao~
This is perhaps a more subjective take on my part, but watching apothecary reminds me of the very 'realist' and 'matter of fact' way in which stories used to be written, stuff like "the count of Monte Cristo" where the story definitely focuses on a somewhat larger than life protagonist in dramatic circumstance, but portrayed in an almost casual pastiche of daily life and circumstance. Yes, Maomao is going around playing Detective Conan and flexing her wicked medical trivia, but she's also just doing her job, everyone is, they feel grounded and like they have a 'place' they exist in rather than their occupations being a formality to give them the illusion of existing within a world.
I suppose I mean that the writing feels very "romantic" in the literary sense, which is refreshing when it seems like a lot of shows lean a lot on their genre and tropes, which is something even better shows contemporary to it are guilty of. (frieren and mushoku tensei jumping out as examples to me). It's just written with a sense of clarity unbidden by other works that's just. . . rare these days.
I think this video is the final answer I needed (but by far not the only one) to know why I like Apothecary Diaries so much. I don't hate detective shows at all, but they don't tend to be my favoirite. Same with a lot of episodic anime in general (save for maybe Horimiya). Apothecary diaries is exactly that, but also it isn't. It's a detective show, but its not episodic. Its also slice of life and with some tropes more common in romance than mystery shows. Its slow paced, but well paced. It's Jinshi getting jealous over Maomao existing near another guy. Its Maomao begging jinshi to give her whatever he promised her that she was absolutly gushing over 6 episodes ago. Its maomao being a better doctor than the doctor. It's Lakan convincing us hes a bad guy just long enough that we're sure of it before proving he isn't that bad (maybe not nice per se, but not as bad as we think he is). it's all of that and more, and thats what I think makes this anime so great. You could sit here all day telling us how great it is with all these examples, but its better than that. Its an anime thats greater than the sum of its parts, and I think thats rare now. That's, in my opinion, what defines great story telling in general. A great story isn't only those that are timeless, but those that are something more than the sum of their parts.
My favorite show this season. I liked it even more than Frieren.
Every single episode is not about the mystery but the small hints that it gives about the world and the Signiant of maomao as a person and as a main character. Season 2 will be even better as maomao background will play a big role in. If you think being the (great general) Lakan daughter does not hold any weight you better think again. The man Lakan himself is important enough, he could waltz into Jinshi office, someone who was hinted to have the closest bloodline connection to the emperor should be a dead giveaway. along with Lakan family background which was mentioned like a no biggie info right in between his sad love story, you would later need to back track that a few times when the huge reveal is done for sure.
A know all that solves every mystery almost instantly seems very conventional to me.
Yeah it's like barely below surface level detective work, and everything always wrapping up neatly is going to get annoying if they continue it in S2. I enjoyed it, but don't see it getting better after S2.
I keep wishing Apothecary Diaries was available with a Chinese Dub... there's something close to an uncanny valley watching (effectively) Chinese historical fiction in Japanese (or even English). I'm used to seeing Anime set in western settings in Japanese, so that isn't as jarring. But I can't help feeling as if AD was like a almost perfect cake missing some minor decorative element. It's glorious as it is... but I can't help but think that it's missing something.
The early mystery in episode 2 about burning poisonous wood is related to Fuyou (sleep walking consort)
They thought the villager attempted to poison the military. But Fuyou's lover stop their execution. Maomao confirmed they aren't intentionally trying to poison them. The guy got granted reward (Fuyou is bestowed upon him)
In another version of the manga it is hinted that the aphrodisiac that Jinshi ordered is also sent to that guy, to motivate him to come get Fuyou.
The sleepwalking consort story also bears a lot of parallel with Maomao's mom. She got herself rejected by the emperor (the same as Maomao's mom got herself pregnant) just for the sake of the man they loved.
And while Fuyou had her happy ending thanks to Maomao, Fengxian is bittersweet. In the manga Maomao also noted (before she dance) it reminds her with consort Fuyou back then, dancing in the wall for her lover.
Also the LN originally meant to run 4 volumes, with the anime only finish LN 2.
For the next season there is still overaching question why people tried to kill Jinshi, his status, what's the deal with the new consort, etc.
Three some odd minutes in you jumped the gun an talked about the blue roses. That should have been an ending part of the discussion because there is nowhere else they would be mentioned
SPOILERS
.
.
Ep 24, when she tricked Lakan into losing a game of chess, I was so amazed. All the pieces for how she was going to trick him were there, she spelled them out perfectly for us, but I STILL didn't see it coming until it happened, and he's passed out drunk on the bench.
And even after that, she manipulated him AND the old lady in charge of the brothel into getting her birth parents back together. I was dumbstruck!
as a novel reader I could say, episode 1 mystery is a part of overarching plot that will be somewhat revealed at the end of season 2.
i gave it a chance after watching your video. it was an amazing experience.
Frieren has better story telling though.
you guys know that a season is stacked with alot of anime that got indepth explanation from alot of utubers like frieren , dungeon meshi , apothecary diary ,.. these 3 are currently my top 3 manga/ anime rn , all i can say is these 3 all have things in common : world building , characters depth , life lesson maybe ? , and most important everything every plot in the manga/anime felt natural , yes NATURAL it feels fluent like you dont question anything about it
SPOILERS: Consort Loulan in season 2 will be super important
It is not really a mysteries show, though. It is a period piece with intrigue and conflict
Keeping Loulan in the story is likely more a product of Anime adaptation being a product to drive sales of the books. Which is why I have a whole list of 1 core anime that may never get another season.
Prepare to be screaming then bud
2:43 I think the simple answer is that it just isn't a mystery show - rather it is a palace drama with a lot of good mystery/detective elements woven in: characters and world building elements that become plot relevant in the series later on are usually introduced or established using in-story mysteries/puzzles, but the main template is still palace drama. Whodunnits and other mysteries are common staples of palace drama series in the first place. It's not uncommon for palace drama to include subplots about consorts poisoning other consorts or their children. If anything, by leaning more into the mystery aspect, the genre convensions being flipped here is tha palace drama genre: The protagonist is not actively trying to rise in, or keep their rank, is a poison nerd but uses her knowledge for healing; the ML is a prince who is actively trying NOT to be a prince, and the consorts aren't at each others throats and are actually on good terms with each other! I feel like you'd be missing a lot of subtext by framing the series as a mystery story first, just with drama aspects when it's the other way around.
First
Apothecary Diaries is one of the greatest entertainment pieces, but Frieren is a life changer and you need certain age to understand it. We need both, but Frieren greatness makes it mandatory. I believe, that one should understand and experience existential crisis from Frieren before being allowed to Diaries.
Apothecary Diaries is the best winter show airing....
More than Freiren.... (spews milk)
More than Sign of Affection. Well yeah Sign of Affection is Mid, and also why are we bringing up Sign of Affection and not Dangers In My Heart which is way superior? Are you discounting sequels?
If so Frieren and Apothecary shouldn't be considered since they are Fall shows continuing into Winter.
I think the best new Show that started in the Winter season that is NOT a sequel is probably Delicious in Dungeon.
For the record watching Hyouka trained me where I guessed the "twist" with Lakan and knew the show was trying to misdirect me with framing despite the fact Lakan hadn't been shown to actually have done anything to suggest he is as scummy as the episodes were framing him, plus we had seen in previous mysteries that often things that seem one way are actually another. (Like with the sleep walking concubine.) And Mao Mao's adopative Dad was constantly telling her....don't speculate without proper evidence.
I think that was directly towards the audience just as much if not more to Mao Mao.
Watching Hyouka, particularly the Film Arc taught me not to be suckered by Narrative Twists.
its written well for an anime, except for her not figuring out who she is working for but can figure out all the other palace intrigue BS.
That's deliberate action on her part. She more or less has already figured it out (and has actually figured out more than the person themself has), but she deliberately makes herself refuse to acknowledge it or even think about it too much because getting involved would be troublesome for her.
She does know, and even knows things Jinshi doesn't know about himself. She just is actively trying not to notice because it will cause more trouble if she "notices"
In the manga she is shown purposely avoiding Jinshi's secrets. She feels that it is too dangerous for her to know.