Hot damn, that was one hell of an episode!! My friend, I do believe you are not charging enough for your services! Clearly your client isn't concerned with cost, and this has been my experience with GOOD clients as well. That repair/restoration work would cost $1,000 anywhere else! Congrats on your success, I actually cheered "WOO HOO!!" when I heard the protection relay click on!
You have no idea of how much time was spent on this. I lost track of how many hours I know the first day I was on it I spent most of the day working on it. The first part of this one when I went into the Dolby board in the metal shield that was actually part of the first days service that didn't make it into the video and that was about an hour just to take that thing out and take it apart and go through it and put it back together. Then I put it back in the box as I had stuff to do so I set it aside and got back on it for the second part which I spent another several hours checking the boards checking voltages double checking all the connections. That was on Sunday I think I set it aside didn't release a video on Sunday instead went and dug up that tape of the old house being demolished and put that one up because I didn't have anything on the bench that I could edit and then I came back to it yesterday and started with the taking the front panel off to look for any broken salter connections under there which I found about five while I had the front panel apart I fixed the B speaker button which was broken. Then back into the main circuit I kept going back to that slight imbalance on the main channel that affected both the left and right. I think if we go back to part one I was actually working in that exact area where that resistor was burned a bit but not open and where the bad cap ultimately ended up being I was in that area I was checking voltages in there and everything looked to be on the up and up but then again with such a shitty schematic that has no expected voltages printed on it it's a shot in the dark. It would have been so much simpler if the manufacturer had put various voltages on various test points so that as you're testing you can look and see is that supposed to be 5.1 or 4.9 volts right? Just an overall bad design and a service manual that was clearly never meant to be used. if you've looked at a properly documented service manual you'll know what I mean the good ones have all your voltages right there so you know what to expect and if the voltage is not where is it supposed to be at least it helps to isolate the area that's causing the problem. On a receiver this complex when it's in shutdown mode you just never know why it's in shutdown mode. All the over voltage and over current loops from the five amplifiers are all tied down to two lines so any of them can cause the speaker protection shut down. There's also a delay start and a quick exit so when you turn on the power it takes a specified amount of time for a capacitor to charge and that is to give the outputs a chance to stabilize before it energizes to relay and also when you shut the power off that same capacitor needs to discharge quickly to de-energize the relays before the output start throwing DC as the power supply discharges. I think today I will look at the circuit board layout so I can get the location number of that cap and look it up on the schematic and see what circuit it actually was in because I couldn't read it off the board that area of the board has been discolored by excessive heat caused by those small resistors and couple of zener diodes that are right in that circuit. As you saw when I replace the parts I actually had to bridge over the traces that it started to lift that was because just over the years of operation that area of the circuit got really hot. But if one good thing comes out of this if someone's trying to service their own pioneer that has the same problem now you know where to look. Although I don't really want to ever see another one of these if I ever do that's the first place I'm looking when I have low preamp output and speaker in protection. It caused two faults not one.
you are like me, don't let it beat you, you are not in it for money, well money is always welcome, but the challege means so much more, it is a hobby for me now.......and i love it, respect
Really the only thing that was challenging about this was getting to the problem parts due to a very poor build design. Clearly this one was designed not to be repaired. I have a receiver personally that I've had for a long time it's a Harman kardon and like this it's I think stuck in protection but it's another pig as far as working on it I have never gotten down to fixing it just because of the way it's built like this. I started on it a couple times and then just threw my hands in the air put it back together and put it back in storage. One day if I ever have the time I might even get around to fixing it but because of the build of it I keep putting it off it's exactly the same as this to remove the board to get to anything on the bottom of the board because there's no hatch on the bottom you have to remove everything and that requires a lot of real estate on the bench and a lot of screws have to come out and then once it's apart because there are other boards and stuff that have to be unplugged you can't test it you can only put it back together and test it and find that it still has a problem and has to come apart again. I think I paid around $2,000 for my HK. It was the most expensive amplifier I ever bought and it had the shortest life of any that I had bought. Between that Harman kardon and the Onkyo that followed. But mine's a fancy AV receiver with HDMI and the gazillion inputs. It was a really nice sounding receiver one of the better sounding I think that I've owned but unfortunately it only lasted about 5 years. At the time it broke I wasn't even bothering to work on equipment it was during the period where I had washed my hands of repairs. I think I bought it in about 2007 and it broke down around 2011. I remember when I walked into visions looking for a new receiver that had HDMI because my Sony had packed it in and the parts were no longer available the salesman walked me over to this one and said hey I can give you a hell of a deal on this it had a $3,000 price tag on it and he offered it to me for two because it was the last one they had and it was the display model. Well that's warning sign number one the display model one that they've cracked the crap out of while testing it. One that's been sitting in a shelf cooking for God knows how long with all the other receivers. He even threw in an extended warranty for free had all the paperwork for it. It broke down, and since this was in my hiatus I wasn't fixing nothing I was out of the repair business at that time and wanted nothing to do with electronics. So I card at the unit back to the service Depot and the guy the service people calls me up and tells me that it's past the warranty. And I was like pardon I've got the extended warranty the guy tells me things that are warranty wasn't worth the paper that it was written on because the unit was 10 years old. I like pardon I've had this thing for 4 years. Guy on the phone well this bottle is 10 years old it must have been sitting in the store for 6 years but there are no parts available for it now sorry we can't help you. When I went to pick it up they actually expected me to pay for an estimate fee. I told them to send the bill to visions. Yes I was that guy I was pissed.
*You deserve a hug for staying with that dog 'till it was fixed and done!* Thanks for the _reminder_ that whenever you have to start pasting together copies of the schematic pages to see a complete circuit to then troubleshoot, *it's a warning sign,* and time to abandon the whole unnecessary debacle; been right there doing it, many times myself. Quite satisfying to fix it... eventually. Sometimes, you wish you'd never started on the time waster. I'd have my tin snips out to solve that unserviceable cabling / access problem because of the OEM's unforgiveable construction. I'm learning to "fib" and say, "No thanks; it looks too hard for me, I give up!" when I just don't feel like battling those piggish obstacles any more when it should just be another repair. I'm retired and do not need to deal with ANY of that crap any more! *Thanks for showing your beast-mode technical skills here, it's a treat, a reminder and true inspiration.* RESPECT
I'm tearing into one of these Pioneer receivers right now to replace the caps, and without a schematic. Classic hum sourced from the power supply. Looking for a bunch of 47uf caps to replace that I read about online. These videos have been stellar, wish I had your skills and patience.
Vow! barking dogs dont bite. i cant thank you enough for taking the time and the challenge. in the end rewards are the benefits of hard work. youtubbers! take lessons from this man. as difficult and frustrated he got. his priority was the client. take notes
Recently was trying to get an Onkyo A-RV401 100watt integrated amplifier back to working but gave up because there were ultra short ribbon cables (directly soldered to boards) everywhere. It was like playing twister trying to remove individual boards to inspect. So I know the feeling too!
You may add Pioneer VSA 910 to the list of badly designed Amplifiers, (from the Service/Repair point of view). This video might help me fix my VSA910 (bought in 1989). Thanks for uploading this video. I appreciate your patience sir.
Ive repaired quite a few of the 9900s / 95 elites models. You can power up these units with the surround sound amplifier board ribbon cables disconnected entirely. The biggest issue I have had with these units is the dsp board goes out. I believe it to be the analog to digital converter Sanyo lc7886. You cant find through hole ics anymore but you can find the sop package. I am going to try to use a convertor kit and replace the Sanyo lc7886 from through hole to sop.
I have 2 VSX 9900s one working one I am fixing now The real issue is they are worth it they sound great. I actually agree the schmatics I have found are really bad on the 9900s also BUT like I said they are great sounding powerful amps, and they are now 30 year old and a lot are still out there working.
Well Done! Maybe the biggest problem was the broken trace you found later on. When the schematics are wrong It sure makes it harder to find and fix the problem. The circuit board in this unit is marginal standard in my opinion. Normal heat over time can cause the copper to break or pad to lift. They sure made it hard and a lot of work to get to the problem area.
When they work - they are an awesome sounding receiver! I guess I should value my repair shop. They charged me 500.00 to repair mine. After owning it for 20 years some caps went bad and it was getting bad electrical humming/buzzing through the speakers - I don't know how far he had to take it apart to fix those issues, but he did mention the lower hatch.
Well that's about what i charged to repair this one. 3 days on the bench and I went through it thoroughly. 5 caps and a resistor and board trace repair plus about 100 bad solder connections. I had about 20 hours of time into this one.
just got one off ebay this week it plays like new ,,but you are right having a 5700 with no sound the gray wires are junk ..no full bottom cover,,,but i have two working 5700s on i bought new,,an it still works great...never had to touch it...like you say...made to junk...
It does look like C1305 on the Power Supply and uComm ass'y is a sharp cut-off for the protection circuit at power-down. If it's bad, usually open, the unit will never come out of protect. It's at the bottom left side of the schematic page 78 of the paper one, page 37 of my PDF. The resistor is 3.9K.
Yes it does look like that one. Takes AC directly from transformer rectifies with d1315 and d1316, fuse resistor R118 4.7 ohm. R1317 was the burned resistor, C1305 is a negative filter regulated by 4.7v zener diode. This keeps D1313 off as long as the supply is negative. When power is shut off, the voltage drops instantly allowing D1313 to conduct and kill the relays. Its there to protect the speakers from power bumps, so if the power drops for a split second and comes back there is no pop to the speakers, allows the amp time to stabilize.
I will call this an work of "molecular electronics"! If this receiver was mine and i have all money that your customer have i will pay for the service and give it to you lol Congratulations!!
I was waiting for the "Shut the F*#% Up" when the dog was barking 🤣 Excellent as usual and informative 💯 I found the shut off problem in 3 Yamahas to be bad regulators. +/- 12, 5, 15v
I was expecting it to be regulators but nope. 2 seperate problems. One was the loss of the +65 and the other a bad cap in the - supply for the speaker protection. The biggest challenge on this is the way it is built with all those stupid interconnect wires. Impossible to test I am pretty sure this will help others out. I will likely out up another shorter version of this down the road where I will combine the 2 into a shorter version. Won't do that for awhile though. I'll let these 2 percolate for a year or so. Next time i see one of theses you know where i am going.
Sony and the other Japanese firms usually seem to be a lot more considerate in their designs. The nice thing about being a hobbyist is that you can just toss away anything you don't feel like messing with. I would have tossed that long ago.
Oh I was ready to toss it on part one. Had this come into the shop that I had worked at it would have been tossed after about 15 minutes on the bench. customer would have been called and told it wasn't worth fixing and to come and collect their junk. Wouldn't it mattered how much they stopped their feet and insisted that they wanted to pay whatever it cost to fix they would have been told to take it somewhere else. The only reason why I spent the kind of time that I spent on this one was because the guy that owned it was quite insistent that he wanted it repaired and it became a challenge. even when he does finally pay me for this so I still have lost money no matter what I charge because I spent four days of this unit and that's 4 days that I had other paying jobs that have come in that other customers have been waiting for me to get on their stuff so I've been getting phone calls from people is my equipment ready yet. I have right now about a dozen pieces that have come in waiting their turn because when you get bogged down with a dog it can really create a bottleneck for everything else that's walking in the door behind it
Hello sir I admire your work very much. But can you help me out I have a power amp that I used for my subwoofers and one channel was burned I have changed everything that’s required but there is one part I can’t figure out on the schematic it’s listed as CR 100 P can you help me out to figure out what it is it looks like a resistor with colors brown black brown.
Even with the terrible board interconnects, cheap PCBs, internal design that makes a 4-cyl economy car engine bay look roomy... I would still rather have this than the garbage you can buy today -- 1" tall, 3-chips and a switching PSU inside an aluminum can, a WiFi antenna, and a gazillion royalties to Dolby and DTS. Bugger all of that.
Dave, seeing the density of circuits on this receiver , I'm surprised that it doesn't have cooling fans. I suppose this unit will get hot quickly. Its true when you say this was a bad design.
You can trust me,I have restored two DS1s in the last two years,it Your going to need to get the bottom board turned over to recap and check all the five + relays contacts are weak in these units..Open ended on both units I repaired.
I had the board out in part one it's a pain in the ass. I also did resold her the relay contacts on a couple that looked questionable that were not accessible from the hatch the ones over in the corner. As I say never again I'll never accept one of these units if someone comes to me with one sorry not working on it.
I know you hate the design of this thing and want to forget it but a buddy of mine just bought one and the left channel on speaker B sometimes does not play if powered on at low volume. If he turns it up a little or even changes the station it starts playing. He has the issue only after sitting for 4 - 5 days and only on system B. Is the speaker relay hard to get to if he wants to replace/clean it?
@@12voltvids what I figured, faulty relay. Is it on that lower board that is hard to get to? I asked the tech that repaired mine and he said that he doesn't remember.
Well I haven't made anything yet. He could turn around at this point and just tell me to throw it out and then I've lost everything because I haven't got a penny for it yet. I mean the shipping charges to send it back it'll give me probably about $180 just due to the weight I think that's how much it cost him to ship it to me and going back it's going to be about the same.
I don't like messing with stupidly over complex devices, too many traps and horrible design. And you often cant power up parts of the circuits to test them. Power amplifiers i go mad on the final p.a to make sure every part is spot on, i dont tend to like finals producing smoke lol.
I won't be seeing this again believe me. For what it cost to ship it to me. This is the one that the sender incorrectly filled out the paperwork and got nailed like $240 in import taxes. So just to get it to me he's already into it for close to $400 he still has to get it home which will be another $150 to 180 somewhere in there plus the cost to repair it. Hopefully it won't break down a game for a long time but you're absolutely correct those ICS are obsolete as are the five need dual transistors that buffer the audio going into the IC
@@12voltvids if ever you have units that are just good for parts I am interested and willing to make a deal with you. So may we talk later in the future?
@@singlesteve2011 I have lots of units that are good just for parts. I had a storage locker full of junk the only reason I hang on to them is for the parts.
This range of receivers learns you how to swear, cramming multiple PCB's into a tight enclosure is never any good for servicing or for long term reliability. Pioneer did the same with their higher range cassette decks, hiding the pcb's under screening plates, a tech's nighmare! The labour costs are way outway what any customers are happy to pay. You did well to persevere with this one Dave, a lot of tech's would not have spent all that time on it. Thankfully i am now semi-retired and can pick which jobs i take on, at least i now know to avoid this dog!
Yeah I know I pick and choose what I want to work on too. Having not worked on one of these before I didn't know what I was in for. When the owner contacted me the first thing I asked him was is this one of these fancy HDMI receivers and he said no it's an old one no HDMI. Unfortunately looks like pioneer started the curve of making things unrepairable before everybody else. I gamma her for example I know not to go into them because they're also a real pain in the ass to work on. It's like they Yamaha that's a vx1000 I think I had a couple weeks ago that my neighbor walked over to me and didn't want to spend really anything on. That's the one I ended up cutting the hole in the bottom to solder one of the transistors that had broken free. The only reason why I got that walk in the door was because it was my neighbor and I used to do a lot of work for his dad when his dad ran the local Photoshop I did all of his film transfers for him. anybody else walking in one of those I would tell them to throw it out and buy a new one tell you the truth nine out of 10 people wouldn't be fixing something like that because it's not compatible with their new AV system. That's the one benefit these days is that 9 out of 10 people don't want to fix their old receiver because it's not compatible with their new equipment they won't pass 4K signals for example or they don't do Arc. 9 out of 10 people when the receiver packs it in after it's a couple years old they just go out and buy another one because the new one has the bells and whistles that they want for their AV system. In the case of the Yamaha for my neighbor he just used it out on his patio to listen to music when he was barbecuing. Because it's outside sure sh1t another bug will crawl into the thing because it's a little bit warmer inside with the standby transformer and stuff and then when he hits the power button it's going to go boom it's going to be bugs burning there's going to be smoke probably flame shooting out of it and the next time it blows up he'll be taking it to recycling as he's told me so I don't have to look at it again.
@@12voltvids Yamaha should be shot for leading the way with no access plate, sadly the rest followed just to make our lives difficult. As you say, the new buyers want a receiver that can handle the latest new tech. At least we can now pick the models that are not worth the hassle of trying to get to the parts that fail in the least accessible places. Our trade was mostly fun while it lasted, who will fix them after we have gone?
@@Barbarapape no one will fix them and that's the grand scheme. Manufacturers don't want their products fixed and I think a lot of times they build them the way they do because they are being put together by robots and they are assembled in such a ways to make it easy for mechanized assembly. That is basically what it boils down to how can we assemble these units for the least effort so they assemble all the boards and then they drop them in the chassis and put in a couple screws. They don't consider that someone servicing it needs to be able to access all the parts to find the one that is failed and they don't consider that the unit needs to be powered up while it's apart in order to be tested. This is not a consideration the only consideration the manufacturer has is how can we assemble this quickly for the least cost on our side and if that means not leaving an extra two or three inches of wire for a service person because that extra couple of inches of wire might cost them a penny per unit. But realistically not come on there is no service industry nobody's making a living fixing this stuff. The guys that are still doing it like myself it's a side hustle. The days of full-time consumer electronic text they've been gone for at least 20 years. For me it'll be 19 years next month when I walked away from working on this stuff for a living. I would have left earlier much earlier but there really wasn't anybody hiring people with my skill set. It was basically a dead end job when I got in in 19 83 and there wasn't much room for growth. As I think I have mentioned before it wasn't my first choice of career my first choice of career was video and television production and that is actually what I went to college for. the broadcast career didn't really pan out because as I learned after going to school I would be moving around from small town to small town because they just don't hire people in the big city right out of school you have to do your time. I started out in a small community station but it didn't take long to realize that I was going to have to be doing that for a few years. another friend of mine went into the radio side of broadcast and that's exactly what he had to do he was in all these little small towns all over the place for the first several years of his career and I wasn't willing to relocate. I got the opportunity to work for Sony and I thought wow I've made it big. Sony put me on there Dpecial High Intensity Training course. Learned everything about VCRs that I didn't want to know. Work for them for a year and then they too wanted me to move back east which I said thanks but no thanks left Sony went to Independent shop where I remain for 20 years. I can't say that I really ever loved the job, but it paid the bills and allowed me to start my own video production company. Started out doing weddings. Pretty good at it branched out to corporate videos and that's where the money was. I actually made more doing video production than I did working full-time at the TV repair shop the problem however was I was always striving to produce better looking content then my competition and that meant better cameras better microphones better lighting better recording equipment. I invested a lot of my profits back into new equipment. At one stage of the game I had over $100,000 in cameras. Had a couple guys working for me at a business partner and we were doing pretty good. Myself and the business partner did the majority of the work he handles sales and I handled the production side of things and we made lots of money. Unfortunately Gordie went and got himself cancer, very aggressive cancer he was dead in 3 months after diagnosis. But back to the electronic repair business it's been a dying industry for a long time it was a dying industry when I was still in it and I got out 19 years ago. What I hear people comment about how much people pay to have vintage equipment serviced I laugh because I've yet to meet those people pretty much every client that I have almost wants me to pay them to fix their equipment at least that's how it seems a lot of times.
@@12voltvids interesting, i guess youtube doesn't like it when people put links to other sites in the comments, as I had linked the exact hifi engine page in a comment for Victor and it is gone. Good to know.
Hot damn, that was one hell of an episode!! My friend, I do believe you are not charging enough for your services! Clearly your client isn't concerned with cost, and this has been my experience with GOOD clients as well. That repair/restoration work would cost $1,000 anywhere else! Congrats on your success, I actually cheered "WOO HOO!!" when I heard the protection relay click on!
I admire your professional commitment to get this one done - at the same time showing the community what this means in labor and patience
You have no idea of how much time was spent on this. I lost track of how many hours I know the first day I was on it I spent most of the day working on it. The first part of this one when I went into the Dolby board in the metal shield that was actually part of the first days service that didn't make it into the video and that was about an hour just to take that thing out and take it apart and go through it and put it back together. Then I put it back in the box as I had stuff to do so I set it aside and got back on it for the second part which I spent another several hours checking the boards checking voltages double checking all the connections. That was on Sunday I think I set it aside didn't release a video on Sunday instead went and dug up that tape of the old house being demolished and put that one up because I didn't have anything on the bench that I could edit and then I came back to it yesterday and started with the taking the front panel off to look for any broken salter connections under there which I found about five while I had the front panel apart I fixed the B speaker button which was broken. Then back into the main circuit I kept going back to that slight imbalance on the main channel that affected both the left and right. I think if we go back to part one I was actually working in that exact area where that resistor was burned a bit but not open and where the bad cap ultimately ended up being I was in that area I was checking voltages in there and everything looked to be on the up and up but then again with such a shitty schematic that has no expected voltages printed on it it's a shot in the dark. It would have been so much simpler if the manufacturer had put various voltages on various test points so that as you're testing you can look and see is that supposed to be 5.1 or 4.9 volts right? Just an overall bad design and a service manual that was clearly never meant to be used. if you've looked at a properly documented service manual you'll know what I mean the good ones have all your voltages right there so you know what to expect and if the voltage is not where is it supposed to be at least it helps to isolate the area that's causing the problem. On a receiver this complex when it's in shutdown mode you just never know why it's in shutdown mode. All the over voltage and over current loops from the five amplifiers are all tied down to two lines so any of them can cause the speaker protection shut down. There's also a delay start and a quick exit so when you turn on the power it takes a specified amount of time for a capacitor to charge and that is to give the outputs a chance to stabilize before it energizes to relay and also when you shut the power off that same capacitor needs to discharge quickly to de-energize the relays before the output start throwing DC as the power supply discharges. I think today I will look at the circuit board layout so I can get the location number of that cap and look it up on the schematic and see what circuit it actually was in because I couldn't read it off the board that area of the board has been discolored by excessive heat caused by those small resistors and couple of zener diodes that are right in that circuit. As you saw when I replace the parts I actually had to bridge over the traces that it started to lift that was because just over the years of operation that area of the circuit got really hot. But if one good thing comes out of this if someone's trying to service their own pioneer that has the same problem now you know where to look. Although I don't really want to ever see another one of these if I ever do that's the first place I'm looking when I have low preamp output and speaker in protection. It caused two faults not one.
@@12voltvids I feel all the pain. *I celebrate your success!*
you are like me, don't let it beat you, you are not in it for money, well money is always welcome, but the challege means so much more, it is a hobby for me now.......and i love it, respect
One of the most challenging repairs in the channel, but you managed to fix it. You’re my personal hero
Really the only thing that was challenging about this was getting to the problem parts due to a very poor build design. Clearly this one was designed not to be repaired. I have a receiver personally that I've had for a long time it's a Harman kardon and like this it's I think stuck in protection but it's another pig as far as working on it I have never gotten down to fixing it just because of the way it's built like this. I started on it a couple times and then just threw my hands in the air put it back together and put it back in storage. One day if I ever have the time I might even get around to fixing it but because of the build of it I keep putting it off it's exactly the same as this to remove the board to get to anything on the bottom of the board because there's no hatch on the bottom you have to remove everything and that requires a lot of real estate on the bench and a lot of screws have to come out and then once it's apart because there are other boards and stuff that have to be unplugged you can't test it you can only put it back together and test it and find that it still has a problem and has to come apart again. I think I paid around $2,000 for my HK. It was the most expensive amplifier I ever bought and it had the shortest life of any that I had bought. Between that Harman kardon and the Onkyo that followed. But mine's a fancy AV receiver with HDMI and the gazillion inputs. It was a really nice sounding receiver one of the better sounding I think that I've owned but unfortunately it only lasted about 5 years. At the time it broke I wasn't even bothering to work on equipment it was during the period where I had washed my hands of repairs. I think I bought it in about 2007 and it broke down around 2011. I remember when I walked into visions looking for a new receiver that had HDMI because my Sony had packed it in and the parts were no longer available the salesman walked me over to this one and said hey I can give you a hell of a deal on this it had a $3,000 price tag on it and he offered it to me for two because it was the last one they had and it was the display model. Well that's warning sign number one the display model one that they've cracked the crap out of while testing it. One that's been sitting in a shelf cooking for God knows how long with all the other receivers. He even threw in an extended warranty for free had all the paperwork for it. It broke down, and since this was in my hiatus I wasn't fixing nothing I was out of the repair business at that time and wanted nothing to do with electronics. So I card at the unit back to the service Depot and the guy the service people calls me up and tells me that it's past the warranty. And I was like pardon I've got the extended warranty the guy tells me things that are warranty wasn't worth the paper that it was written on because the unit was 10 years old. I like pardon I've had this thing for 4 years. Guy on the phone well this bottle is 10 years old it must have been sitting in the store for 6 years but there are no parts available for it now sorry we can't help you. When I went to pick it up they actually expected me to pay for an estimate fee. I told them to send the bill to visions. Yes I was that guy I was pissed.
*You deserve a hug for staying with that dog 'till it was fixed and done!* Thanks for the _reminder_ that whenever you have to start pasting together copies of the schematic pages to see a complete circuit to then troubleshoot, *it's a warning sign,* and time to abandon the whole unnecessary debacle; been right there doing it, many times myself. Quite satisfying to fix it... eventually. Sometimes, you wish you'd never started on the time waster.
I'd have my tin snips out to solve that unserviceable cabling / access problem because of the OEM's unforgiveable construction. I'm learning to "fib" and say, "No thanks; it looks too hard for me, I give up!" when I just don't feel like battling those piggish obstacles any more when it should just be another repair. I'm retired and do not need to deal with ANY of that crap any more!
*Thanks for showing your beast-mode technical skills here, it's a treat, a reminder and true inspiration.*
RESPECT
I think the engineers were having a bad day when they designed this one. 🖕
Wow! He is back! I will watch for sure!!
Well done there ,you stuck with it and can imagine the frustrating time spent on it , Love the Dog Barking .
My cats were freaking out when i was editing
I've got 2 of them. Best receiver I've owned or heard.
Epic repair job. What a nightmare to access. Very interesting to watch.
Well done for sticking with it nice video
I'm tearing into one of these Pioneer receivers right now to replace the caps, and without a schematic. Classic hum sourced from the power supply. Looking for a bunch of 47uf caps to replace that I read about online. These videos have been stellar, wish I had your skills and patience.
Technician Master, and also Zen Master so much patience.
Vow! barking dogs dont bite. i cant thank you enough for taking the time and the challenge. in the end rewards are the benefits of hard work. youtubbers! take lessons from this man. as difficult and frustrated he got. his priority was the client. take notes
It was a little bit of a challenge. The most difficult part was all the disassembly required. I went through it all should be good for awhile.
Great detective work….!!! 👍
Recently was trying to get an Onkyo A-RV401 100watt integrated amplifier back to working but gave up because there were ultra short ribbon cables (directly soldered to boards) everywhere.
It was like playing twister trying to remove individual boards to inspect. So I know the feeling too!
nice fix glad it plays again
Awesome Job !!!
You may add Pioneer VSA 910 to the list of badly designed Amplifiers, (from the Service/Repair point of view).
This video might help me fix my VSA910 (bought in 1989). Thanks for uploading this video. I appreciate your patience sir.
Ive repaired quite a few of the 9900s / 95 elites models. You can power up these units with the surround sound amplifier board ribbon cables disconnected entirely. The biggest issue I have had with these units is the dsp board goes out. I believe it to be the analog to digital converter Sanyo lc7886. You cant find through hole ics anymore but you can find the sop package. I am going to try to use a convertor kit and replace the Sanyo lc7886 from through hole to sop.
nice fix well done!
Holy smokes batman! more the challenge than anything else at that point! A good win but at a high sanity cost haha
Good payoff on this one. I'm happy.
I have 2 VSX 9900s one working one I am fixing now The real issue is they are worth it they sound great.
I actually agree the schmatics I have found are really bad on the 9900s also BUT like I said they are great sounding powerful amps, and they are now 30 year old and a lot are still out there working.
Well Done! Maybe the biggest problem was the broken trace you found later on. When the schematics are wrong It sure makes it harder to find and fix the problem. The circuit board in this unit is marginal standard in my opinion. Normal heat over time can cause the copper to break or pad to lift. They sure made it hard and a lot of work to get to the problem area.
Good Job!!!
When they work - they are an awesome sounding receiver! I guess I should value my repair shop. They charged me 500.00 to repair mine. After owning it for 20 years some caps went bad and it was getting bad electrical humming/buzzing through the speakers - I don't know how far he had to take it apart to fix those issues, but he did mention the lower hatch.
Well that's about what i charged to repair this one. 3 days on the bench and I went through it thoroughly. 5 caps and a resistor and board trace repair plus about 100 bad solder connections. I had about 20 hours of time into this one.
just got one off ebay this week it plays like new ,,but you are right having a 5700 with no sound the gray wires are junk ..no full bottom cover,,,but i have two working 5700s on i bought new,,an it still works great...never had to touch it...like you say...made to junk...
Nice !!!very good joob
I have one, a 30 plus year workhorse to this day.., only in the shop once for a power supply issue...precursor to the early Elite ??
It does look like C1305 on the Power Supply and uComm ass'y is a sharp cut-off for the protection circuit at power-down.
If it's bad, usually open, the unit will never come out of protect. It's at the bottom left side of the schematic page 78 of the paper one, page 37 of my PDF. The resistor is 3.9K.
Yes it does look like that one. Takes AC directly from transformer rectifies with d1315 and d1316, fuse resistor R118 4.7 ohm. R1317 was the burned resistor, C1305 is a negative filter regulated by 4.7v zener diode. This keeps D1313 off as long as the supply is negative. When power is shut off, the voltage drops instantly allowing D1313 to conduct and kill the relays.
Its there to protect the speakers from power bumps, so if the power drops for a split second and comes back there is no pop to the speakers, allows the amp time to stabilize.
I will call this an work of "molecular electronics"! If this receiver was mine and i have all money that your customer have i will pay for the service and give it to you lol
Congratulations!!
I was waiting for the "Shut the F*#% Up" when the dog was barking 🤣
Excellent as usual and informative 💯
I found the shut off problem in 3 Yamahas to be bad regulators.
+/- 12, 5, 15v
The dog was added in post.
I was expecting it to be regulators but nope. 2 seperate problems. One was the loss of the +65 and the other a bad cap in the - supply for the speaker protection. The biggest challenge on this is the way it is built with all those stupid interconnect wires. Impossible to test I am pretty sure this will help others out. I will likely out up another shorter version of this down the road where I will combine the 2 into a shorter version. Won't do that for awhile though. I'll let these 2 percolate for a year or so. Next time i see one of theses you know where i am going.
@@12voltvids I could feel your frustion and I know that feeling. I usually walk away for a bit and come back.
Excellent resurrection regardless 💯🤙
Man, the dog chased me away.
Sony and the other Japanese firms usually seem to be a lot more considerate in their designs. The nice thing about being a hobbyist is that you can just toss away anything you don't feel like messing with. I would have tossed that long ago.
Oh I was ready to toss it on part one. Had this come into the shop that I had worked at it would have been tossed after about 15 minutes on the bench. customer would have been called and told it wasn't worth fixing and to come and collect their junk. Wouldn't it mattered how much they stopped their feet and insisted that they wanted to pay whatever it cost to fix they would have been told to take it somewhere else. The only reason why I spent the kind of time that I spent on this one was because the guy that owned it was quite insistent that he wanted it repaired and it became a challenge. even when he does finally pay me for this so I still have lost money no matter what I charge because I spent four days of this unit and that's 4 days that I had other paying jobs that have come in that other customers have been waiting for me to get on their stuff so I've been getting phone calls from people is my equipment ready yet. I have right now about a dozen pieces that have come in waiting their turn because when you get bogged down with a dog it can really create a bottleneck for everything else that's walking in the door behind it
Hello sir I admire your work very much. But can you help me out I have a power amp that I used for my subwoofers and one channel was burned I have changed everything that’s required but there is one part I can’t figure out on the schematic it’s listed as CR 100 P can you help me out to figure out what it is it looks like a resistor with colors brown black brown.
they gave you long form schematics 😂 like plotter size
Even with the terrible board interconnects, cheap PCBs, internal design that makes a 4-cyl economy car engine bay look roomy... I would still rather have this than the garbage you can buy today -- 1" tall, 3-chips and a switching PSU inside an aluminum can, a WiFi antenna, and a gazillion royalties to Dolby and DTS. Bugger all of that.
Dave, seeing the density of circuits on this receiver , I'm surprised that it doesn't have cooling fans. I suppose this unit will get hot quickly. Its true when you say this was a bad design.
totally looks like a heat trap.
They do get hot. I put a laptop cooling fan pad on top of mine to keep Temps down
You can trust me,I have restored two DS1s in the last two years,it Your going to need to get the bottom board turned over to recap and check all the five + relays contacts are weak in these units..Open ended on both units I repaired.
I had the board out in part one it's a pain in the ass. I also did resold her the relay contacts on a couple that looked questionable that were not accessible from the hatch the ones over in the corner. As I say never again I'll never accept one of these units if someone comes to me with one sorry not working on it.
are all the speaker relays on the bottom board and very difficult to get to?
So what is the consensus? Is the Pioneer more of a dog to service than the Yamahahahaha's?
They are both hard to work on. Yamaha is worse as at least this one has a hatch on the bottom.
That Yamaha is looking pretty good right about now, yes?
Nope its not. Both a piece of crap
@@12voltvids I was really just joking...
@@mdzacharias I wasn't they're both a piece of crap
Where do you find the schematics for the amps you fix?
Hifiengine dot com.
I know you hate the design of this thing and want to forget it but a buddy of mine just bought one and the left channel on speaker B sometimes does not play if powered on at low volume. If he turns it up a little or even changes the station it starts playing. He has the issue only after sitting for 4 - 5 days and only on system B. Is the speaker relay hard to get to if he wants to replace/clean it?
Relay bad
@@12voltvids what I figured, faulty relay. Is it on that lower board that is hard to get to? I asked the tech that repaired mine and he said that he doesn't remember.
@@jewllake yes nightmare.
@@12voltvids thanks! I guess I'll tell him to live with it. Great unit when working nightmare to work on :(
@@jewllake you got that right. I did make money on this one though.
What song is that at 53:00? sounds like Larry Carlton.
Jack waldenmaier (musicbakery.com)
Sir I have denon avr 1804 volume control is reading but not sound increase
This VSX does look like a disaster AKA Dog. Glad I missed part 1& 2. AH, I just looked back, now I remember. did see the beginning vid 2 weeks ago.
There is no part 2 I just called It part 3 to confuse people so I can have people asking where part two is.
@@jimbergen5232 yes I saw it.
This just happened to my old girl :( what do i do???
I am curious to know how much you charged for this mega repair in this episode featuring, patience?
Well I haven't made anything yet. He could turn around at this point and just tell me to throw it out and then I've lost everything because I haven't got a penny for it yet. I mean the shipping charges to send it back it'll give me probably about $180 just due to the weight I think that's how much it cost him to ship it to me and going back it's going to be about the same.
I don't like messing with stupidly over complex devices, too many traps and horrible design.
And you often cant power up parts of the circuits to test them.
Power amplifiers i go mad on the final p.a to make sure every part is spot on, i dont tend to like finals producing smoke lol.
I think that it is the IC's that are no longer working right
LOL yeah it is fixed but why do I have the feeling that you'll be seeing it again but with a IC problem.
I won't be seeing this again believe me. For what it cost to ship it to me. This is the one that the sender incorrectly filled out the paperwork and got nailed like $240 in import taxes. So just to get it to me he's already into it for close to $400 he still has to get it home which will be another $150 to 180 somewhere in there plus the cost to repair it. Hopefully it won't break down a game for a long time but you're absolutely correct those ICS are obsolete as are the five need dual transistors that buffer the audio going into the IC
@@12voltvids if ever you have units that are just good for parts I am interested and willing to make a deal with you. So may we talk later in the future?
@@singlesteve2011
I have lots of units that are good just for parts. I had a storage locker full of junk the only reason I hang on to them is for the parts.
Denon AVR 1804 volume control clicking sound all control panel is clicking sound
radio has sub terrier :D
This range of receivers learns you how to swear, cramming multiple PCB's into a tight enclosure is never any good for servicing or
for long term reliability.
Pioneer did the same with their higher range cassette decks, hiding the pcb's under screening plates, a tech's nighmare!
The labour costs are way outway what any customers are happy to pay.
You did well to persevere with this one Dave, a lot of tech's would not have spent all that time on it.
Thankfully i am now semi-retired and can pick which jobs i take on, at least i now know to avoid this dog!
Yeah I know I pick and choose what I want to work on too. Having not worked on one of these before I didn't know what I was in for. When the owner contacted me the first thing I asked him was is this one of these fancy HDMI receivers and he said no it's an old one no HDMI. Unfortunately looks like pioneer started the curve of making things unrepairable before everybody else. I gamma her for example I know not to go into them because they're also a real pain in the ass to work on. It's like they Yamaha that's a vx1000 I think I had a couple weeks ago that my neighbor walked over to me and didn't want to spend really anything on. That's the one I ended up cutting the hole in the bottom to solder one of the transistors that had broken free. The only reason why I got that walk in the door was because it was my neighbor and I used to do a lot of work for his dad when his dad ran the local Photoshop I did all of his film transfers for him. anybody else walking in one of those I would tell them to throw it out and buy a new one tell you the truth nine out of 10 people wouldn't be fixing something like that because it's not compatible with their new AV system. That's the one benefit these days is that 9 out of 10 people don't want to fix their old receiver because it's not compatible with their new equipment they won't pass 4K signals for example or they don't do Arc. 9 out of 10 people when the receiver packs it in after it's a couple years old they just go out and buy another one because the new one has the bells and whistles that they want for their AV system. In the case of the Yamaha for my neighbor he just used it out on his patio to listen to music when he was barbecuing. Because it's outside sure sh1t another bug will crawl into the thing because it's a little bit warmer inside with the standby transformer and stuff and then when he hits the power button it's going to go boom it's going to be bugs burning there's going to be smoke probably flame shooting out of it and the next time it blows up he'll be taking it to recycling as he's told me so I don't have to look at it again.
@@12voltvids Yamaha should be shot for leading the way with no access plate, sadly the rest followed just to make our lives difficult.
As you say, the new buyers want a receiver that can handle the latest new tech.
At least we can now pick the models that are not worth the hassle of trying to get to the parts that fail in the least accessible places.
Our trade was mostly fun while it lasted, who will fix them after we have gone?
@@Barbarapape no one will fix them and that's the grand scheme. Manufacturers don't want their products fixed and I think a lot of times they build them the way they do because they are being put together by robots and they are assembled in such a ways to make it easy for mechanized assembly. That is basically what it boils down to how can we assemble these units for the least effort so they assemble all the boards and then they drop them in the chassis and put in a couple screws. They don't consider that someone servicing it needs to be able to access all the parts to find the one that is failed and they don't consider that the unit needs to be powered up while it's apart in order to be tested. This is not a consideration the only consideration the manufacturer has is how can we assemble this quickly for the least cost on our side and if that means not leaving an extra two or three inches of wire for a service person because that extra couple of inches of wire might cost them a penny per unit. But realistically not come on there is no service industry nobody's making a living fixing this stuff. The guys that are still doing it like myself it's a side hustle. The days of full-time consumer electronic text they've been gone for at least 20 years. For me it'll be 19 years next month when I walked away from working on this stuff for a living. I would have left earlier much earlier but there really wasn't anybody hiring people with my skill set. It was basically a dead end job when I got in in 19 83 and there wasn't much room for growth. As I think I have mentioned before it wasn't my first choice of career my first choice of career was video and television production and that is actually what I went to college for. the broadcast career didn't really pan out because as I learned after going to school I would be moving around from small town to small town because they just don't hire people in the big city right out of school you have to do your time. I started out in a small community station but it didn't take long to realize that I was going to have to be doing that for a few years. another friend of mine went into the radio side of broadcast and that's exactly what he had to do he was in all these little small towns all over the place for the first several years of his career and I wasn't willing to relocate. I got the opportunity to work for Sony and I thought wow I've made it big. Sony put me on there Dpecial High Intensity Training course. Learned everything about VCRs that I didn't want to know. Work for them for a year and then they too wanted me to move back east which I said thanks but no thanks left Sony went to Independent shop where I remain for 20 years. I can't say that I really ever loved the job, but it paid the bills and allowed me to start my own video production company. Started out doing weddings. Pretty good at it branched out to corporate videos and that's where the money was. I actually made more doing video production than I did working full-time at the TV repair shop the problem however was I was always striving to produce better looking content then my competition and that meant better cameras better microphones better lighting better recording equipment. I invested a lot of my profits back into new equipment. At one stage of the game I had over $100,000 in cameras. Had a couple guys working for me at a business partner and we were doing pretty good. Myself and the business partner did the majority of the work he handles sales and I handled the production side of things and we made lots of money. Unfortunately Gordie went and got himself cancer, very aggressive cancer he was dead in 3 months after diagnosis. But back to the electronic repair business it's been a dying industry for a long time it was a dying industry when I was still in it and I got out 19 years ago. What I hear people comment about how much people pay to have vintage equipment serviced I laugh because I've yet to meet those people pretty much every client that I have almost wants me to pay them to fix their equipment at least that's how it seems a lot of times.
Will you work on my pioneer
No
Come on, tell us how you really feel. I sense you are holding back. 😂
Give me 70's gear any day of the week.
I hope this was a job you were being paid for !!! 💩 sorry ... not sorry ! Tell them to stuff it haha
Yes absolutely. I will do ok on this one.
Imagine being that attached to some 90s AVR multichannel junk.
Hi get me url for shema diagram
Hi-Fi engine
@@12voltvids interesting, i guess youtube doesn't like it when people put links to other sites in the comments, as I had linked the exact hifi engine page in a comment for Victor and it is gone. Good to know.
@@razpones no they won't allow links other than TH-cam videos. The reason is spammers put up malicious site links hoping to Phish someone.
@@12voltvids makes sense
Bad dive circuit