John Petrucci Mark Five vs Mark IIC+ Comparison
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ส.ค. 2014
- Dream Theater Guitarist John Petrucci took a day off from a busy touring schedule while en route to their San Francisco gig to stop by the Mesa factory for some hanging out and general tone summit. One of the subjects that came up was how one of his favorite Mark IIC+ heads stacks up to the C+ Mode on the Mark V.
When it comes to the Mark IIC+, John is truly one of the worldwide experts on the Mark IIC+, next to Founder Randall Smith, Tone Boy Doug West and Mesa Chief Technician Mike Bendinelli. In this video, John explains how the Mark Five’s C+ Mode was designed around the best and most prized of the Mark IIC+ amp configurations available (since there are many different configurations of Mark IIC+ out there) while playing a few riff examples from the song “Enigma Machine” off the latest 2014 album titled after the bands name.
The playing examples were recorded via John’s personal SM57 and Shure KSM 313 Ribbon Mic from his live shows into a Rectifier 2x12 switched back and forth with a cab switcher. Played through John’s signature Ernie Ball Music Man Majesty 7 string guitar through a Mark IIC+ 100 Watt, Graphic EQ and Reverb hardwood head in Lead Mode and a Mark V head in Channel 3 on the Mark IIC+ Mode.
Our thanks to John Petrucci, Tech Maddi Schieferstein and the Dream Theater crew for their efforts to make this video possible. - เพลง
After watching John an his 5.000 $ rig ,(for a demo )
I'm all hype and I'm gonna rock the hell out of my Cube 15w roland amp hahahahahahh
Me 10W Ibanez cube :3
VetoSchwarz I got my 20w peavey ready to go, bro, just send me a text
thats a great practice amp. one of the best clean channels in 15w amps.
But why people still buy Cube’s peavey or ibanez Haha for arround 150 dollars you can get an amazing sound with software and good headphones
I have Randall RH300G3+ with cab, it was quite cheap, only about 400$
Mark IIc+ Rhythm 2:48
Mark V Rhythm 3:21
Mark IIc+ Lead 4:07
Mark V Lead 4:47
Came back to this after some time and I really here a big difference now. The Mark V sounds much tighter in it's attack, great for modern metal, the iic+ is a little softer in it's attack. So if you wanted a more vintage sound you might be better off trying an option on channel 2 instead.
@@black.iczelion Agree, Mark V is a bit tighter. But I can hear the same core sound in both. Not something that would make too much difference
god bless you
The Mark V is clearer, tighter, and brighter, especially for the low strings portion. Really wish this video was longer to hear him play the rest of the song, which is also one of my favorites of DT.
Bought my IIc+ in 1984. Simul-class, all the options. It's the amp I'll never sell.
I'll give you my kidney for it
Hilarious!
collumww I'll raise the offer to my left ball for it.
You need to upload some videos of it
@@axlej11 It'll be both your balls Alex.
I would like to see a video of Hetfield comparing Mark IIC+ and Mark V using his And Justice For All and Master of Puppets tone. That would be amazing.
We'd like to see this too, +Enrique M. :)
@@mesaboogie Please keep trying to ask James Hetfield to do this.
THIS MUST HAPPEN!! That ...And Justice For All tone is just insane!
James is not a tone nerd like John. It wouldo not surprise me if he said he doesn't know how to dial in a decent tone (including micing and eq, of course).
Clearly you've already been given the answer because he only endorses the pickups. Trade secrets are trade secrets. We want trade secrets to exist. Or else to you want 500 non USA bands and another 5000 non USA bands playing with Metallica sounds? That's probably musical hell.
The V sounds clearer and tighter where the IIC+ sounds more "vintagey", fuzzier, and a bit fatter. I wouldn't use the IIC+ for modern heavy rhythm tone. I would use to the IIC+ for more vintage sounding stuff (80s metal) and leads and use the Mark V for the heavier and more modern stuff.
agree if you wanna play old Metallica the IIC+ is the amp to get.
I think with a boost, it could get there. I guess we don't know whats going on in front of the amp in this video, but to me, it sounds straight into the amp.
I’m not a fan of Mesa Boogie amps unless I was playing death metal back in the day I’d use my friends triple rectifier and a Maxon pedal. For 80’s metal/shred tone nothing beats an ADA MP1 with a poweramp or a Marshall Mark II with a DOD 250 overdrive pedal both using an Ibanez SDR 1000 reverb rack to get that massive huge 80’s sound! It’s the same reverb. Eddie used on Van Halen’s 1979 debut album, Paul used one in his Racer X days as well as Tony Macalpine and countless others in the 80’s .
2years ago, I made a comment.....since that time, I have had 3 different Boogies. I will never go to another amp brand. MESA BOOGIE..... thank you for everything. I really hope you see this. I am writing this with all the emotion.....from the bottom of my heart.......thank you so mu Mesa. Thank you for everything. You have become a part of my life that I will forever cherish. I genuinely hope you know what that means. Thank you again. A million times, thank you.
This just goes to show how versatile the Mark V really is. I use mine on the IIC+ mode as well because I think it sounds the most vintage. But I have the mids cranked instead of scooped and with my Luke it sound nothing even remotely like John's tone. It's just such a phenomenal amp.
I always wanted a Mark IIC+ but could never find one with what I wanted for an affordable price. This video makes me even more excited that I am going to be getting a Mesa Mark V :) !
Thanks Mesa/Boogie!
Thank YOUJunnage - You have picked up on essentially the point of this video - the Mark IIC+ is alive and well in the Mark V. PLUS - there's TONS of other sounds to be had beyond that renowned tone. Thanks for the outstanding comment and thanks for watching! :D
Hi Jason Burkey - That's what we did. Check the description. This comparison is running through JUST one 2x12 Rectifier cab. Each amp is switched into the same cab with a Radial Cabinet Switcher. That's why there's only mics on the one cab in the video. The two 1x12 Mini Rectfiier Cabs are in the shot because that's what John uses as his 'monitor' cabs at the front of the stage, and... because they look ridiculously cool and are great Mark IIC+ 'stands' in this video. :D Hope this helps!
Sorry I just assumed. Apologies for my comment. Still an amazing video.
Jason Burkey No worries... just wanted to clarify! Thanks for the kind words. ;)
Jason Burkey Jason I think the IIC+ mode in Mark V sounds a little bit more modern than the original one, but the gain is the same. I hear a little bit more of bite, but not so much to say they're totally different tones. Anyway..I've have experience with other companies that for a little problem answer after 2 months. Mesa loves us and we love them .-)
Very kind, Hagstrom4ever :D. We DO love you! And we agree on your assessment of the IIC+ here. You have good ears! :)
MESA/Boogie I hope :-) I spend a lot of hours (when I don't work) near my cab tweaking the amp to find the minimal difference that could be the best for what I need.
Great comparison! I thought the Mark V held it's own nicely. I doubt listeners would notice if he switched between the IIc+ and the V from one song to another on consecutive album tracks.
I agree! BTW- DIG your demos and tutorials! Nice to see someone who is really good at their craft. Thanks for the contributions and sharing.
Andrew Abbett - Agree - ***** is putting some very cool demo stuff together. Thanks, Daniel!
The Mark V captures the ("general") IIC+ tone just fine imo. I'd love to get one (Mk V) sometime in the future.
The IIC+ should be reissued...
That'd be very cool!!
that would be awesome!
It is.... In the Mark V.
but unfortunately is not the same sound
It is with the JP2C
Man, either way you can't go wrong!! I have a MV for a month now and I'm still in honeymoon!! Every time if think I found my dream sound I tweak a little bit more here and there and find one even better!! It's just crazy!!
Mesa and Johnnie....a match made in heaven. Favorite guitarist by far.......best amps......BY FAR. Keep up the absolutely ridiculous work guys. Petaluma love
Mark V is more focused. Especially I like that focused "clank" when every string was pull. It's really new generation :)
This video brought me out of a haze of trying to figure out how to make the Mesa mark five channel 3 sound brutal. I can now raise the dead thanks to John.
So the Mark V is Mesa's greatest hits of the Mark series.
Sad to say I sold my Mark V and have been regretting it ever since.
It was extremely versatile.
Love it , he had the eq set like Hetfield for AJFA.
Thank you MESA for doing a great job once again! Cool video! Both amps are "killing sound machines", but I like Mark V a little bit more in that video! Just my opinion :-) It'll be great, if you'll be doing more videos like this in future! Especially, with John!
That is real fucking close, great job!
Hi +Gabriel Martins - There are a number of options for using the external switch jacks on the back of the Mark V with a MIDI inteface device. The RJM Amp Gizmo is one such device that will convert the 1/4" switch jacks to respond to your MIDI messages. We love MIDI too but LOTS (Most) of folks don't use it and it does increase the cost. That said, lots of great stuff in the works all the time so stay tuned and thanks for the comment!
John could probably secretly switch between a Mark II, IV, and V in a live setting with very few or even no ears in the audience noticing. I'm using my Mark V with greenbacks in my cab now. Totally digging it, and its really starting to sing like some of the older Marks.
Mark IIC+ mode gives spooky awesome tones. With the power tubes pushed all the way, it gets into Black Keys/White Stripes territory. I nearly bought a fuzz pedal before discovering this. I keep buying pedals and selling them because I prefer the straight Boogie tone. I have had the amp for 3 years, play it almost every day and keep finding new sounds I like. Way to go Mesa!
I bought a dead mint (unused) Mk IIC+ head in 1990 when I was in high school for $400. The man selling it bought it in the early 80s direct from Mesa. Soon after receiving it, his house was broken into and all of his gear was stolen (except the amp, which was in a closet with a slip cover in it). He kept the amp thinking he would rebuild his rig but never did. Fast forward to 1990 where he sold it to me for quick cash, as he had a baby on the way. When I went to test it at his house with a loaner cab, it was the first time he'd heard it since the break in. The poor guy almost cried. He still had all the brochures and literature that came with the amp including a thank you card from Randall Smith. I loved that amp, but eventually parted with it a few years later when I needed money while changing careers. I sold it for $800 with a cab. This was still before they became extremely collectible. That amp would go for thousands now LOL. Oh well, I paid a good deal forward to another excited young kid and have since gone in to own several more Mesa amps.
The closed captions just killed me!So hilarious
EXCELLENT demo video!!! JUST received my Mark V in for review over at musicplayers.com. I specifically chose this amp for review in hopes it faithfully recreated the IIC+ tone. Just viewing this video, its basically the same! The Mark V sounded like it had a little more bite to it, but honestly a few dB on the high end or moving the mic an inch would have probably yielded the same result. IF you can find a IIC+, you're spending at least Mark V money. With so much more the new amp gives you, I couldn't see NOT buying the Mark V vs. the IIC+ (unless you already have a Mark V and a yacht, Benz etc etc etc).
very nice great Happy New Year
So do the individual EQ knobs react similarly across all Mark amps? I know the voicing is different in each series of the Mark amps but should Treble at 6 on a IIC+ react similarly to the same setting on a V IIC+ mode and a Mark III black stripe?
Hi +Michael Lozano - Good question! Short answer... Not completely, although... There are far more similarities than there are differences. That said, it's not exact. Between all the Mark V products (Mark V: 25, Mark V: 35 and Mark V) it WILL be the same. Thanks for watching!
They both sound great!
Where do I find out about the cab switcher. I would like to toggle back and forth between my Mark IV Combo amp and another smaller combo amp with an Alnico speaker that I own. Or perhaps run both amps together at times (if possible). Thanks.
Three questions for the staff at Mesa:Mark V in this comparison is set to pentode or triode?Loop is active or hard bypassed?Valves are original stock?Thank you!
HiCarlo Emanuele Manca - Loop was Active but not in use, Pentode operation and the Mark IIC+ had Sylvania STR 415 6L6s while the Mark V had its stock STR 440 6L6s. Hope this helps!
I prefer the IIC+ to the Mark V amp sound but both sound amazing! Now to save for one.
Great tone... One question. Why isn't there a mic infront of the cab that's actually under the MK IIC+?
Hi Marc Taylor - We used the same cab for both amps and switched them via a cab switcher. This maintained both the cab and speakers in use as well as the mic placement so the comparison was as consistent as possible with each amp. Same cab= one less variable in the comparison! Thanks.
Damn, I really can hear a difference between the two. I'd love to have a Mark V combo, but the Holy Grail for me would still be the IIC+
Please, anyone help me to remind what is the riff song that sounds at the beginning of the video? Really appreciated!
Obrigado João Patrício! Já percebemos tudo :)
i can hear the really slight difference between them. i prefer the mark V but that tone is spectacular
I’m curious if anyone knows what the small knob is where the foot switch input normally plugs into on his Mark IIC+? You can screen capture and widen the pic and see it....
Mark V is tighter and more focused.
Mark II C+ is loose on the bottom end and sounds "flubby"
Get a Mark V and turn the bass up to match! Lol
Interesting. I thought the opposite. To me the II C+ had better note separation and sounded less "fizzy" and thought the V was less chunky. They both sound of the same tone stack though.
killereverb Mark IV to me is like the perfect middle ground.
Instead of that get a mark IV with an el34 set so it doesn't sound like dog shit. On that note, does anyone want a mark V for a bunch of money? If not, then the Mark V is awesome as hell. Did I ruin my sales pitch?
I thought the opposite and to me the IIC+ had more presence. Cut through a heavy mix more easily. I think that if Petrucci had these amps dialed in the same you could probably make either sound like the other with a little tweaking.
Please Correct me if im wrong, the mark iic+ is always on triode right? So is this mark v on triode or pentode? I dont understand what the difference between that option.
In my opinion sound from Mark V is more tight and sounds better on single notes. On the other hand IIC+ sounds bigger on the power chords. It might be eq thing though. But to be honest - difference is small so my choice would be Mark V because of more variety. Thanks John for this presentation! I watched many videos with Mesa and Petrucci's signature guitar and it didn't sound like Petrucci at all. Hand is hand!
I love the sound of both amps...
Will a Mesa Boogie DC-5 get me near this tones? or it doesnt have nothing to do with a IIC+ o Mark V tone? Im looking for a Heavy Rhythm tight yet articulate tone, not grainy distortion, just agressive tone kinda recto but with more mids, probably boosting with an od in the front for Groove Thrash metal. Great videos!! greeting from Argentina!
Hi Facu - A DC5 has great heavy rhythm tones but they are a little different from a Mark IIC+ or a Rectifier. It does have more mids than a Rectifier but still not quite a Mark IIC+ However, the Graphic EQ will help you dial in great metal tones so it should work well. We would always recommend you try and play the amp first if you can. Hope this helps and good luck in your search!
Sound amazing
Just bought the Mark V and I never want to go back to something else...it’s sounds so amazingly tight!
Congrats on the new rig, Hilbert! Hope it exceeds your expectations. :)
MESA/Boogie It does! Man, that tone....I've set it up in true stereo using two heads and TC Electronic Gmajor2. By directing one of the TC outputs to the return of the second amp I'm bypassing the preamp of that second amp. Together with my Musicman Luke BFR I'm finally able to create that mid 80's Lukather tone...and beyond! Would you guys appreciate if I make vid about my setup with Mark V as subject? :)
As promised! The Mark V in action during a concert in a small venue. The proof that the MESA sound is the absolute #1! th-cam.com/video/1B18olp3mgE/w-d-xo.html
I would love to see a comparison of John's Signature JP-2C amp with the Mark V!
Please!
It will be very very very interesting!!!!
I just bought a Mark V 35 like a week ago and I'm loving it. Hopefully I can get some cabs soon as they are currently backorderd everywhere. I'm running through 2 Orange ppc2x12s and it sounds okay i guess but not as good as it could
Did John have any effects or was this simply through the amp? Thanks
Hi DAVID HRBEK - Just the amps! Thank for watching.
+MESA/Boogie How does the size of his original Mark IIC+ heads compare with the Mark V 35 head? I'm just curious because I have a mini rectifier cabinet and I'm wondering if it will sit on top of it ok, or if it's too big. Thanks!
Hi +Snydermans Music - Great question! The Mark Five: 35 is the same width as the Mark IIC+ head in this video. The Mark Five: 35 is one inch wider than the Mini Rectifier 1x12 Cab. It will hang over each side by 1/2". The width difference is fairly hard to notice aesthetically, but if you have a Mini Rec SLANT cab, only the MINI amps will sit properly on the slant. The Mini Rec STRAIGHT cab would work fine. The Mark Five: 35 head dims are: H 9 1/8 x w 18 7/8 x 10 7/8. Hope this helps and let us know if you have any further questions! :)
Thanks! That's great, I have a STRAIGHT cab so that's good. My custom mahogany Mark V 35 head should be sitting on it any day now!!
Amazing amp,Snydermans Music! Congrats on having such excellent taste! :) Hope it exceeds your expectations once it finally meets it's new cab friend! :)
Mark V has more clarity and tightness, both amazing but the V is more reliable and has way more options and pretty much nails the IIC+
How were they tubed? Did the Mark IIC+ have NOS glass? Could that account for why it was warmer?
Hi +HollaJo3 - This is a very important and good point that you bring up! There are SO many variables in ANY A/B comparison that its quite difficult to establish a PERFECT comparison. In this case, your observation about the original C+ having Sylvania 6L6s while the Mark V had it's stock Mesa STR 440 6L6 is one example of a variable to consider. The preamp tubes in John's original C+ are also unknown to us (although it is assumed they are current Mesa 12AX7s like the ones used in current production and in the Mark V in this video). Pots being set via visual cues versus being metered to be exactly the same is another variable that we did not engage in here. These things and many more make any comparison like this only so close...
THAT SAID... The real point of this video was to show how SIMILAR the two amps sound, rather than how different they are from one another. The irony of how tough it is to create a scientificically accurate A/B comparison is that the same variables that can make the comparison different can be used in a different way... say to intentionally try and make both amps sound the same through different settings, etc. Anyway - your question is a good one and your observation about the C+ sounding warmer is one we agree with, except to say that between the two, they appeare to us to sound much more similar than they are different. Thanks for watching and thanks for taking the time to comment! :)
Wow, guys! I honestly wasn't sure I'd get a reply, and I definitely wasn't expecting to receive one so quickly. A+ customer service. Also, btw, I agree that the amps sounded very similar (particularly when you consider the age, and amount of use, of the Mark IIC+).
was the V in triode or pentode mode? full power or variac? 10/45/90 watt mode? tube or ss rectifier?
zillathegorilla - Great question! Pentode, 90 watts and Solid State Rectifier - so as to create the fairest comparison to John's C+ which is a 100 watt (Non-Simul).
I'm looking forward to getting my Mark V because of the versatility and tight response. However, I look forward to using the IIC+ mode at high gain in recording some killer metal riffs. I hear some people saying that the IIC+ sound is dated. "Master of Puppets" sounds awesome to me. The Mark IV was used on two of "Nevermore's" best sounding albums. Anyway, it's a win/win situation as far as I am concerned!
Valagnar I think Lamb of God uses (or used to use) Mark VIs, too. They pretty damn modern.
MESA/Boogie How is John switching the guitar between the 2 inputs and the cabinet between the two heads? It sounds like a single click on the pedal. I've been looking for something that does that.
Himykllynyrd - John is using a Radial Tonebone Cabbone switcher which provides the exact function you describe that you're looking for. Hope this helps!
Oh, okay, thanks. I was looking at the Cabbone too, but I thought that he was switching the input at the same time, I guess he already had the inputs split and both heads are hot at the same time.
i recently scored a MINT 85 S.O.B. 1x12 with no effects loop or reverb... even has the FETRON tube in the first slot!! HOW CAN I ADD AN EFFECTS LOOP? or reverb? !!!! MESA !!!! what can we do bout this? not even a footswitch jack.... i love the tones, but please what can u guys suggest?
Hi Minus 9us. Both of the modifications you are asking for require SIGNIFICANT modification to the amp to be possible, although the FX Loop is particularly difficult as the FX loop wasn't even invented when this amp was built. Integrating a loop that is worth integrating into an amp that has little to no layout to support it will be difficult or at least expensive - likely $300-400+. Becuase the amp was designed and built before FX loops were even a thing, it may not be possible. Reverb can likely be added but will also be expensive as it will require the addition of the reverb tube which drives the reverb circuit and the other related circuitry, plus the tanmk. Again, I would imaging this modification to likely be somewhere in the $300+ range as there are a fair amount of parts invcolved and a good amount of work, although it's much more possible to dso since people ordered Mesa amps in the '70s & 80's with a list of custom opiotns and reverb was one of the options for the amp you have. The person who ordered that amp obviously didin't order it with the reverb option, but the potential likely exists to have it added. Please contact the Mesa factory to discuss the possibilities of sending your amp in for updates. www.mesaboogie.com/support/contact-us.html Hope this helps and hope the amp is working well!
Ive never had a chance to play a IIC+. That said, I HAVE played a Mark III red stripe, and it might be my all time favorite amp.
A bit off topic but what model of microphone the red one is ?
Dorian CIET - Shure KSM 313 Ribbon. Great mic!
I have owned both amps. While I did love the C+, I found it to be too "noisy" and not versatile enough to give me the variation in sounds that I needed. It could have been due to old tubes (it wasn't microphonic, just a general hiss). The Mk V is an outstanding amp, in my opinion. Not only for channel 3 but also the clean sounds that are available on channel 1 and the Mk I setting on channel 2 are killer.
The Mark V on the iic+ mode sounds like you stuck a tube screamer in front of the old iic+. I like it!
God i love the Mesa tone, just wish i could afford one. some day i will have one
Hey Mesa! I can't help but look at the master on the Mark V and wonder, at this level, does John wear ear protection sitting just beside the cab?? Solve that mystery for me, please guys =p
Fuck I am just impressed that JP can play that stuff over and over with no mistakes!
What are the speakers in these Boogie cabs , are the Evs or Black Shadow Celestions ? Boogies are Hi- gain amos and it seems hard to tell what they are , at least for me , have heard more with EVs older Mark IIs and Mark III ( I have self contained Mark III from 1991 ) . Not truely a fan of the Evs , I guess depends on the style they have their points for a " clean sound " but for rock /Metal , not to hot
I expected to like the IIC+ more - as copies usually are not as great as the originals - but... I preferred the V by far. At least in this video. It was tighter and clearer. Perhaps they should not have been dialed the same - maybe the IIC+ should have less bass or less gain to clean up the low end - but the way things were set up I liked the V more.
Jp dialed it himself, there's no bigger authority in doing that than him.
vicsnake Well, he said they are dialed the same. So if the goal was to showcase the V, he would dial the V the way it sounded best and then dial the IIC+ the same way, which may not have been the best setting for that particular IIC+. This is always the problem with a comparison at the same settings - it always benefits one piece of gear better than the other. To me the best comparison is not at the same settings but at the optimal settings for each individual piece of gear. Anyway, from this vid I would have picked the V.
Shmalentine Yes, I liked the V more as well but not because I have one. I think the IIC+ lacked clarity and definition on the low B but the little solos that he played sounded better.
vicsnake I never said I had one. In fact I've never even played through either IIC+ or V (I did own a couple of Rectos a while back before I switched to Bogner Uber). My opinion is based solely on this video. And I agree, the V sounded much clearer and tighter - especially in the low chords - but also (to me) in the individual note runs. Anyway, I certainly wouldn't mind adding a V to my stable.
Shmalentine I meant me, I have a V and I try not to be biased.
Check out our latest video with Dream Theater's John Petrucci, as he describes how one of his favorite Mark IIC+ heads stacks up to the C+ Mode on the Mark V.
Mark Five vs Mark IIC+ - John Petrucci Mark IIC+ Comparison
The V sounds tighter and clearer
You guys should come out with a mini Mark head aka "Little Mark" thats affordable like the mini recto.
So, I can buy one in mini version. Lol
***** I know, I have been trying to save for years for a Mark V!
i have a mkV and love the llC+ mode..i would definately buy a mini version...
The Mark IIC + head is what John Sykes used with whitesnakes 1987 right?
+1 for Mark IIC+ !
will you release c+'s again please mesa!! Im in need of a new amp and this is one I want to buy
+Christian Dinero Just buy one used.
+wxp24 I can't find them anywhere and where I can they are all asking for like 3k
I just bought a Used Mark V Combo in Mint condition. Totally Psyched , and cannot wait for it to arrive. I heard they will retrofit into a head shell from MESA. Just wondering where I can get one? I already have a few Recto 4 x 12 cabs, and cannot wait to spend hours, and hours of tone tweaking. I play everything from Outlaws, Skynryd, Allman brothers all the way up to Metallica,OZZY, and Scorpion. Love Boogie/ John is amazing too. He has some great phrasing, and picking techniques.
Hiphallystorm - If you are looking for a Mark V head cabinet and you are in the USA, contact Mesa directly or your local dealer and you can order one up! Enjoy the amp!
Mesa Boogie makes great amps. I am the original owner of a recto that is of legal drinking age now and has brought me endless hours of joy, (Orange Channel in Raw Mode with Spongy and Tube Selected on the back and all knobs at noon except the gain around 1 or 2 O’Clock = a mellow crunch tone I’ve spent decades enjoying… This amp continues to educate me on audio, electronics, and tone, to this day.
I’ve just started to appreciate the Mark tones and in this demo, I’d go with the old school IIC+. The MKV sounds like a MKV. Petrucci was being nice by saying it’s the, “same spirit” and sure it is, but it’s not exactly the same and that’s why Petrucci still owns his 2C+’s: Because a mid-1980’s Boogie Mark IIC+ is the greatest heavy metal tone of all time.
What cab is under the 2c+
The heavy low chords sound crisper and cleaner through the Mark Five, but the Mark IIC+ sounded alot better in the mids in single note progression, more smooth. The Mark Five had a little more...almost twangy-ness in the mids. Would love to own a IIC+ but the Mark Five doesn't suck either :P
Just out of curiosity... even though you can get them relatively inexpensively, why is there never any mention of the Mark III in this series?
Hi Nicholas Totoro - The Mark III is a great amp but it was the Mark IIC+ that got so much acclaim in it's day via bands like Metallica and other major players in the middle 80s using and swearing by them. Also, likely because there are so many fewer Mark IIC+s compared to the Mark III could be another significant reason, but most people reference the tone as being better. That said, find a Mark III you like, and well... you're set. Great amp! :)
MESA/Boogie Thanks!!! I don't mean to get too far off topic, but is there a source that details the differences from the IIC or the IIC+ to the III? Not necessarily all the different variations of the III, but something generic.
Hi +Nicholas Totoro - Sorry to say, there isn't. It would be a good blog post topic, though. Will have to put that on the list. :)
is there any way of using midi with the iic+?
HiJoseph Madden - YES! You need a device that will convert the 1/4" switching jacks to MIDI functionality. Something like the RJM Switch Gizmo does the trick nicely: www.rjmmusic.com/switchgizmo.php
thank you very much
Wonder if part availability keeps a 2C+ reissue from happening. The Mark 5 has a close facsimile but not good enough, it doesn't feel the same and that's where the 2C+ shines. Sure most haven't had the chance to to use a 2c+ so how could they even compare the two. Reissue the 2C+
The settings of both amps?
The Mark V is absolutely incredible. Not saying the IIC+ isn't, but the fact that it sounds sooooo close.....absolutely incredible. Thank you Mesa Boogie for everything. You make the world a better place.
I have the Mark5, If you put the amp in Triode mode, drop the 240 slider right under the middle line and then raise the Presence up to about 1:30, its gives you more of that "Vintage", less tighter tone. Petrucci likes to raise that 240 slider up a lot, that's what gives him that tighter tone he likes.
Will you guys be sharing the settings by any chance?
Hi Leonel Hernandez - Take a look at 0:41 and 1:09 and you can see the settings pretty clearly. They did not change from what you see there. Hope this helps!
I also notice that John's settings have changed since the videos that he posted on TH-cam a little while back showing all the channels and his settings for each channel. Does anybody know where I can find the new settings that John is using. I love his sound so much that I would like to hear it here for myself on my MarkV :) thanks in advance
alamakluke John is currently using a Triaxis live
vicsnake Hi there thanks for the reply... my question was if it's possible to get the MarkV settings that John is using in this video....
the settings are visible on the video, don't know if pentode or triode though
starting to love mesa IIC+ - one of the best death metal tones on my new Bias Head ;-) freaking awesome tone! also Ola's sims of IIC+ are just on the money. jokes aside - its expensive but one day ill get Mark V since its IIC+ based and IIC+ are just so darn expensive.
the single note stuff reminds me of the inspector gadget theme
haha yeah man, the song he is playing is a dream theater song called 'enigma machine'. it's an instrumental, and john said that he wanted it to have a spy movie vibe :P
Jeff Corcoran that explains it then
Absolutely 😆
Is the Mark V in Pentode or Triode?
John Robinson - Great question! Pentode, 90 watts and Solid State Rectifier - so as to
create the fairest comparison to John's C+ which is a 100 watt
(Non-Simul).
Good comparison! But I think for this one I would of ran both heads through either the a 2-12 cab or just a single cab not a single and a 2-12. Kinda has a different sound from the 212 over the 112. But still amazing.
nice reference with the video length
Both sound great, Mark V sounds a little more compressed, i personally prefer IIC+.
Please tell me when your gonna release the mini Cabs with Diamond plate on them!!!!! Take my money now!
Why was the Mark III sound not included in the Mark V?
The IIC+ sounds bigger than the Mark V in this video.
I'd say its because its not as famous as the IIC+ and the IV
hmm, but at the same time, the MK III heads made a lot of buzz in the guitar community when it came out. Maybe the MK III is relatively the same as MK IV ?
Too many different variations I'd imagine. The 5 different stripes sound different enough that you could make a whole Mark VI just off the different stripes.
Rusty Shackleford ahh, that's very good insight. I didn't think about the stripes. Didn't know the different stripes would make such a difference. I have the red stripe MK III, have been using it since the late 80s, and it still sounds pretty good. Maybe I should try the Mark V.. looks very complicated.
GuitarToneFreaks Its really simple actually. All three channels are set up almost exactly the same way so once you're comfortably with one you're pretty much set with the others!
Does anyone know if the Mark V is set in Triode or Pentode? I believe (most of) the original C+'s were hardwired in Triode so it would make sense to use this power configuration to compare.
It is switchable in Ch. 3 between either, but the other two channels are Pentode for max output. :)
I see now that my question was misleading. I was inquiring as to which setting (pentode/triode) was selected on the Mark V in this video.
Ahhhh, Brandon Bauerly - This makes more sense now. Thanks for the clarification. The C+ John is playing is a 60/100 watt and thus is set for Pentode, which suits John's use of and playing with the amp. In this demo, the Mark V was set to Pentode to match John's C+ so the comparison was the most accurate, and that people could see how close the C+ mode in the Mark V is to an original C+. thanks again for the great question and the calrification so we could get you the right answer. :)
Thank you so much for replying! Mesa truly is the greatest amp company in the world! =) JP's videos have really helped me get the most out of my Mark V. It's not going anywhere soon.
Haha, one last question. Do you know if the Mark V's master volume was engaged in this video?
Mark V sounds so much tighter and less "flubby" than the original Mark IIC+. That's why I love my Mark V so much!!! Best amp ever for every tone I've ever needed.
Also, I love how people are screaming for the Mark IIC+ to be "reissued." They ALREADY DID!! It's in the Mark V. That's the closest Mesa themselves could get to making a Mark IIC+ reissue, so if you want it, buy a Mark V. It's the perfect amp.
uglyguitarguy Can't agree more.
You assume I've never played a Mark IIC+, which is unfortunate, because I have and I'd still pick my Mark V.
Sadly Kyle, I'm not as much of an expert of IIC+ specs as you are, so I can't say I took notes about every detail of the IIC+ that I played to regurgitate to you right now. If that's your forte then more power to you. However, I'm an expert in what sounds good to me, and the Mark V is the last amp I'll ever own because it nails the sound that my ears want to hear. Don't forget, everyone's taste is different, so there's no need to be so aggressive just because you're hiding behind a computer screen. JP and Mesa did a great demo, and you should just be grateful they even took the time to try to educate their customers.
Exactly, the amp is really versatile, and dynamic
Quick comparison timestamps
2:48 vs 3:21 (IIC+ - V)
4:07 vs 4:47 (IIC+ - V)
Two incredible tone machines right here! Mark V takes the win in a photo finish for the MK IIC+ battle. Comparing both amps as a whole......well no amp in the world beats a Mark V!!!!!
Actually preferred the V, well done. Not sure if they would be able to get the IV mode to sound identical to the original though :P
Is that a V30 loaded 2x12?
John ! You just Say it's good ,and I just BUY BUY BUY
Now, the same thing with the Mark I and IV :D
I have a Mark V and I love it. I think John is a rad player, but he turns the mids all the way down, the scoops them out on the EQ...I keep mids and I think it sounds so much better. Nice and thick, but still clear and sharp (It always sounds clear...even if you have it gained out and boosted). I guess it just goes to show how many cool tones are in this amp.
Mark V is just a little bit (just a little) clearer and tighter, but the Mark IIC+ sounds a little heavier and has more "life" (I don't know how to call it haha). For me Mark IIC+ > Mark V > Everything else.
Owned and gigged with a IIC+ in the late 80s to early 90s. This one sounds very reminiscent of mine. That said, in this video I preferred the Mark V. Better definition. The IIC+ was just like mine. Heavy and it sounded really good if you didn't minding that hint of mushiness that you just couldn't dial out without losing the core tone. Liked the Boogie but never really bonded with it. Went back to Marshall style amps.
What's the 1st song he plays?
When are you making a Mini Mark?
I only need the Bold Tweed Clean and the bright Mark 4. Just 2 channels! Come on!
I'd like to see the Mark IV reissued with two IDENTICAL red channels a clean channel and two graphic eq's ! It would be flying off the shelf !