Why Did Boeing Build The 767?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 เม.ย. 2020
- Boeing’s mid-capacity widebody 767 has proven to be a staple of long haul flying. With a healthy range and better economics than the 747, it was the pioneer of twinjet ETOPS and enabled more airlines to operate on a point to point model. Here’s how the 767 came about and why Boeing built it.
Article Link: simpleflying.com/boeing-767-why/
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Austrian -300 • Video
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The reason the 767 was developed was to compete with the DC-10 and L10-11.
The 767 killed them both as soon as the ETOPS regulations were relaxed on twin engine jets.
Also, the 767 probably competed with the Airbus A300 to a lesser degree.
@phillyslasher, I forgot about the A310. The A310 more closely matches the B767 in range but not quite as much, while the A300 can carry more cargo than the B767 and the A310 can carry more cargo too I think.
@phillyslasher True, Boeing came out with the extended range B767ER and Airbus had no answer in the A310.
@@brikkstonewall3958 You are right, but not "to a lesser degree". You are 100% correct that the 767-300ER directly competed with the A300-600R, not _directly_ with the DC-10 and L-1011 which are larger aircraft.
Heck, Airbus even gave away some A300s for almost nothing just to get American Airlines to acquire them instead of the 767.
And the A330 killed the 767
I was able to fly on the 757 and 767 years back, but never got to fly the "Queen of the Skies", the 747. Hopefully I'm able to catch a flight on one before they're all gone.
Jason Barnes they are going to be around for a while before there gone BUT the 747-8 will take over so I suppose if you can’t get a 747-400 flight you’ll still be able to get a 747
-8
I've flown on 747 about a dozen times across the Atlantic. That was in the 80s and 90s, so I may never get the chance again.
The 747 is the KING of the skies not QUEEN well it was, stuff the A380 its just the Duke.
I remember watching the 747-400 taking off and the entire Airport would shake, the windows would vibrate and the energy the Aircraft generated would go straight through you, it was amazing. Flying in them towards the end you could see that they were outdated and becoming uncomfortable you can enjoy the 747-8 now with new tech specs but I have to admit its not the same. Lot quieter.
I’ve flown on every variant of the 747 including the SP and the Combi but have never been on a 757.
All this talk about royalty of the skies and who's king or queen....reminds me of these objects are just aircrafts manufactured by international companies to make money for the fat cats who in turn, may not be Kings or Queens but, they certainly can afford to live like one....
I remember reading another reason why airlines like this plane---it more or less has the same flight deck as the 757, so crews trained on one could fly the other plane when needed.....
The 767-300er has been a fantastic airplane.
I spent 9 happy years flying the 757-232, 767-232, 767-332 & 767-332ER. Great airplanes!
My favourite plane, not too big and not too small, nice simple design.
The Airbus A300 had been flying a more restricted version of ETOPS since 1976, and was the first officially ETOPS certified aircraft (1977). So it's a bit of a stretch to say the 767 is the pioneer of ETOPS. The 767-200ER can be credited with being the first aircraft certified for ETOPS 120.
100% agree. Love Boeing, but Airbus was the pioneer on the twin-jet.
Even the 777 was involved in ETOPS
2-3-2. Best way to fly, certainly across an ocean.
Not sure about that. A Gulfstream would be better, and any BBJ would be even better than that, as long as it has the range.
That's why we need 767X.
I prefer 2-4-2
Hell, not even that far.
1-2-1 is better
I've flown with a 767. It's quite the spectacular plane if You ask me. The doors open upwards and hide in the ceiling, much like some Star Wars-ship and the center overhead bins are magically flush with the ceiling making for a very spacious interior. The 767 is a big spectacular thing on wings.
The reason for the doors going up into the ceiling was this. Boeing engineers were on strike at the time of design, so Boeing had MD engineers design the door system which is just like the DC 10 design,
I loved it, I’ve flown it both short and long haul (ATL-TPA, and JFK-AMS). I loved the 2-3-2 seating mainly, so I didn’t have to climb over 2 people.
757/67 has to be my favorite Boeing series.
same here for me including the triple 7
The video mentioned that 707, 747, 757, 767 and 787, but had not even a passing mention of the 777 (unless I missed it). I find that surprising.
The 777 was made much after the 767, it wasn't relevant to the reasons why the 767 was ultimately built. For this same reason they don't mention the 727, the 717 nor the 737.
Nice to see my old bird included here, N767A. Best job I ever had...
My first and only flights were on 767's from Delta December 2019. Went from AMS to PDX
The 767 - my most favourite aircraft ever! An interesting side note was the Ansett Airlines here in Australia operated their original 5 aircraft (767-277) with a flight engineer due to union demands. These were the only 767s in the wold to have a three-person crew.
They also all had different color wings. I remember when they went through the factory. It’s the only time I ever saw different colored wings.
My dad worked for a company that supplied electrical relays to Boeing. That let him take his 16-year-old aviation-crazy so to Washington for the rollout of the 767 and 757 in 1981.
Thanks for the video, really enjoyed it 👍🏻
I'm lucky that I have flown both the 767 and 757. The 767-200 with Britannia, the 757-200 also with Britannia and Monarch absolutely two of the best aircraft I have had the privilege to fly on.
It’s very sad for me that I couldn’t fly on three of Boeing’s legendary aircrafts B747, B757 & B767. 😩😭
Tawsif Amin 747 are retiring their fleets. Do it fast
I am very lucky and fortunate to have flown on all 3, and if you have the chance to fly on any of them, do! Many airlines are phasing these 3 out of service.
I've seen a 747 in person but have never been on it. But I have been on a 757.
The only airline I know that uses a 747 constantly is British Airways, 757, Delta, and 767, LAN and United (western and mid US)
@@awesomecoolcamiloacc6584 and virgin Atlantic
0:15 Aeromexico 767, i love those colors, greetings from Mexico City.
B767, with the sexiest forward tilting landing gear in aviation!
I thought the 767 was ideal for domestic flights for larger areas such as the US and Australia
The 767 just seems a better option for a domestic flight larger than the 737 and A320 but smaller and cheaper than the A330 shame the 767 is out of favour with the Airlines their is still a use for it in passenger travel.
I agree, I just don't like the smaller narrowbodies for long distance transcontinental flights. I thought the 767 and 757 were much more comfortable for those longer flights.
My favorite type of all time! Such a beautiful bird!
Was a pleasure flying on all 4 Boeing 767 aircraft. 767-200ER,767-300,767-300ER, and Boeing 767-400ER awsome airliner.
I know this .. Boeing has been approached by United to redesign the 767 by offering the 200 fuselage with the 787 wing and the new ge90 but de-rated engines. This would allow them the flexibility with both crew and destination.
ge90 wasn't used on 787, it's just genx or rr 1000, and also the -8 fuselage is as long as the -300ER model of the 767
Another good video. Thank you.
Many fond childhood memories flying on 🇿🇼 Air Zimbabwe's B767-200ERs in the 1990s. Visited the flight deck many times and learnt so much in the hope of becoming a pilot. Got my PPL at least 😊. Last flight on a 767 was on a Kenya Airways one and filmed the landing which is on my channel.
767-300er is my second most favorite plane model after the 747 400 or 8 model. Beautiful ride and spacious inside. Beautiful and stable plane overall in my view
Twice in the past couple of months, I've ended up on a 767-400 ER on a domestic flight although I thought these planes are primarily for overseas routes. It was an extremely comfortable and roomy cabin in Comfort class - comparable to First Class seating on most domestic flights. I was curious about this aircraft so found this video while searching for info about it.
Great plane and easy to work on. I maintain Kalitta’s 767’s.
A decent and economical aircraft for the time, and a pioneer for the point to point market. Was privileged to fly on a Delta 767 from LA to Atlanta a few years ago. Very comfortable, especially for transcontinental flights.
I used to get confused between the 767-400 and the a330
Flew on a Delta 767 from Atlanta to Brussels, nice ride.
To compete with the Airbus A300, a mid-long range wide body twin.
Great video
One of the reason why 767s were needed because Wellington Airport in New Zealand used to have Boeing 747SPs. However 747SPs required to dump enough fuel to lighten the aircraft in order to land. In short is was a lot more feasible to have Boeing 767s back then they can carry more passengers than 737s but with twin engine efficiency. 767s were lighter and more fuel efficient... well back then they were efficient when seating capacities of any 747s were not needed.
"It was the pioneer of twin-jet ETOPS."
A300: do you think this is a motherfucking game?
I think the A300 was still restricted by ETOPS
A 767X based off the 767-200 would be perfect for filling the gap in the middle-of-the-market gap.
I managed to get on a 747 last year from San Francisco to Sydney by Qantas before they retired it. :(
I was fortunate enough to fly from San Francisco to Honolulu on a 757, and from Honolulu to San Francisco on a 767. Other than that, I've flown on a 727 and 737.
3:25 that American 767 kinda looks like a bigger 737 with those winglets haha
The Boeing 767 is my favourite aircraft!
IMO the Airbus A330 is a bit more classy. And I really liked the Lockheed Tristar, too.
Harley Robertson its boring
Same
jerry2357 I have my own opinion
William Fostad I have my own opinion
Whenever I complain about business flying, I remind myself that I flew during the heyday of flight. 707, 717, 727, 737, 747, 757, 767, 777, and 787 are all on my completed list. Add DC-7, DC-8, DC-9, DC-10, MD-11 and I'm pretty thankful for all of those business flights (with a not-insubstantial number of leisure flights). (I won't mention the A-list of planes.) Add in all of the passenger rail services of the US, Europe, Asia, and Australia. What's left? Bus service. Ugh.
From the Boeing family I have flown on 737s Domestic and to Honduras), 757s (also domestic and to Honduras and once on Delta Paris to EWR) 767 (BA London, UAL Barcelona, Zurich, DL Rome), 777 (EWR-IAH), 787 (LAN Lima) 747-i8 (2X Lufthansa EWR-Frankfurt). From airbus, I have flown the 318, 319, 320, 321 (in the US and within Europe-mainly Europe), A330-300 (several times on Swiss), A330 neo (Tap), A340-300 (my first ever flight to Europe, Air France (Ewr-Paris, Air France has discontinued EWR) I have yet to fly the A350 abs A380. I have also flown on some regional planes like E175 (Aeromexico) and MD88 (Delta). I love flying! Going to Barcelona on a 767 again in about 5 weeks!!
Might wish to add that the 767 became the basis for the KC-46 'Pegasus' refueler.
the most important metric for me in planes is the number of seats per aisle in economy (where I usually fly). Apart from regional jets or turbo-props, the 767 is really a winner here - 7 seats for 2 aisles, make it almost 2X "roomier" than the narrow body types like 737, 757 and Airbus 320 series (6:1). Compare this to A380 lower deck, where some airlines put 11 seats across, and it''s a clear win with a 3.5 ratio for the 767, against a 5.5 for the A380. Last I flew this on long-haul was on direct flights between Israel and South Africa (in 2014), and even though the airline (El Al) is notorious for its dismal legroom, the experience was actually quite tolerable.
I need to keep my volume full up to listen properly 😌🙌
In the good old days, Boeing had a good range of versatile aircraft products being the B737, B757, B767 and B747. It is shame they did not maintain this versatile product.
And the 717
Umm and the venerable B727
I flew with my mom from amsterdam to newyork. The 2-3-2 config was perfect. We could sit together!
I love B767 it was my favorite until the arrival of B777. So pretty and reliable, one of the best airplane ever made!
Tbh the 777 is pretty much a sequel to the 767 coz the models and the names of them are identical, so i guess if you dont want to forget about ur second fav aircraft, i guess you can play SFS flight simulator on roblox
@@gokulsavi Hi Savita i play FSX because i have B767 and B777, i would buy Prepar3D with PMDG B777, but now i'm just waiting for FS2020 and crossing my finger for PMDG or Level-D release fast, any of B767, B777, B787 for it! I have Xplane11 too, but still don't have a good add on for Boeing planes, only the Zibo B737.
The 777 Section 41 is from the 767
@@ag6371This is not true in any way. The 757 and 767 have similar 41 sections. We used Master Models back then, and there was only one for both models. The 777 cockpit and 41 structure are unique to that model. pilots were invited in to give input to the cockpit design.
Does anyone know whether DHL 767 freighters fly to Singapore?
767s are still produced as freighters but 767s are still popular Among mainline airlines in the US, and charter and leisure airlines.
Maybe Ryanair will use the old 767s. Imagine the alcohol sales they will rack up!
You only briefly mentioned the military variant, I work on the KC-46 tanker, and the intent is to eventually replace the fleet of 179 KC-135s with it. There are foreign customers for it as well. This most of all will keep the 767 in production for at least a few years to come.
The USAF currently has a fleet of 396 KC-135s. The 179 KC-46s will replace only active-duty and some of the Air Force Reserve KC-135Rs. KC-Z will replace the rest.
Which was the year twin jets were allowed transatlantic flights? I distinctly remember my first such flight in the summer of 1981. I flew from Athens Greece to Toronto Canada on a DC9. The airline was Canadian Pacific (CPAir) and we had to stop somewhere for refueling without disembarking. I remember that flight well because it was my first to the other side of the Atlantic and how boring it was without even a movie to pass the time.
My all time favorite plane. So sad to see it go
3:39 D-ABUF! I flew on that plane twice!!
The A310 is an underrated 767 and airbus should make a new a310 as it would be perfect MMA
Also there is the A320 or is it A321 neo.
Rafiah Aspagi yeah but they are not wide body’s
@@JSG003 Well it depends on the route.
@@rafiahaspagi1165 no
321neo = 752
A310 neo
I Hope One Day Like The DC-3 and Other Planes We'll be able to Fly In a Restored Concorde just for recreational purposes
I like how it sits up on its landing gear. I wish they could raise it a bit more and jam some bigger fan engines under it.
They did talk about doing that if they build the 767X.
We did actually raise it for the -400. It required moving the main gear fitting outboard on the spar and a modified landing gear beam. It was a royal pain to do this to an existing airframe.
Most versatile, reliable, clever aircraft ever. I will miss it
@simpleflying Are you based in PDX? I’ve noticed a large amount of shots from here in your videos...
Our team is based all over the world :) - TB
I dont fly often. No more than one round trip a year. Last year I went transatlantic on a Condor 767 from Pit-FRA.
UNSTOPPABLE
The seat configuration was 2-3-2 so we can without disturbing anybody to walk and WC.I had once upon from Ankara to Munich by Thomas Cook 2003
Second trans Atlantic flight was on a 767 beast, first was on a 747 - 400 Virgin Atlantic!
Favorite of mine, it's 2=3=2 seating means you're never more than 1 seat from the isle unlike the 3=4=3 in the '47s, generally I'm in one of the 2 seats with my wife and she's small. I like the '57s as well, done them repeatedly on Icelandic, best way to Europe. Well, bus. class on brit air ain't too bad except you go to Heathrow. Terminal 5.
I believe that original Boeing 767-200 actually met American Airlines' original middle-1960's specification for a twin-jet widebody plane that could fly on most domestic US routes. Indeed, one thing that helped 767 sales was the fact it burned way less fuel than the L-1011 or DC-10, which made it very attractive during the days of the 1970's oil crisis.
Interesting
As a mechanic, I liked the B767. Easy to handle Most things were easy to get to. Yea, a good plane.
Over 1200 orders now with the 767. You also didn't mention that KC-46's are being built along with the 767F.
My favorite aircraft
Boeing built this because they needed something to compete with the DC-10 and L1011. The fuselage width is exactly between the 747 and the 707 designs. They reasoned that this allowed twin aisles, yet was narrower [186 inches vs DC-10's 218 inches] and as such produced less frontal area and drag. The plan was to match the capacity of the tri-jets by lengthening the fuselage. They dropped plans for a three engine version when engines in the 100,000 pound thrust class became available and widened the fuselage to 230 inches thus creating the twin engine 777.
I've only been on a 767 twice. Detroit to Frankfurt and back. I thought it was a very nice aircraft.
I wish that I flew on a super connie or a DC7. I believe the 7 was offered to the airlines with turboprops but they turned it down, had they taken it probably would still be flying tadey. I did fly on the DC3 and Martin Metro, fly the 3 from Guatemala City to Tical where we landed on the highway and taxied up to the hotel, this was in the '70s, the plane was an old united from the 30s so it was over 40 years and been used hard. probably best airliner ever built.
Why does this channel "only" has 39000 subscribers?
Noah Schmidt-Taube because the TH-cam algorithm is sh*t
Maybe if we shared more often?
why not
Because it’s obnoxious
I'm subscribed to this channel I watch alot of Simple Flyings content because Youtubr puts it on my home screen
Don’t quite get the economics of the 2-3-2 configuration having only 7 seats across in a wide body. Could someone explain? Thanks!
Wide is not a norm, 2 aisles are needed for easy access, some widebodies are wider than others, in some you can cram in 2-4-2 in others you can’t.
The 767 is not as wide as other aircraft like the 787 or A330s. As a result, airlines can only fit a 2-3-2 configuration in coach. -JS
Fun Fact: One of the models of Boeing 767 were used in the 9/11 attacks. (United Airlines flight 175 and American Airlines flight 11were the flights that were hijacked and flown in the One and Two World Trade Center.)
No mention to the fact that what spurred on Boeing to make the 767, was the fact Airbus was starting to win over Eastern &. American Airlines . Up to that point, Boeing never took Airbus as a serious competitor and killed the notion that the Legacy Carriers would only purchase American-built planes.
I would love to fly one one day
Cantaride you’ll have to hurry then, not many left
Both the 2 big Japanese airlines also use it as Boeing offered 767-300ER while they were affected by 787-8 delays. They will stay a while as all have been retrofitted with winglets.
with the issues facing 737MAX you can still fly on one of these with Icelandair. I flew with them on a 757 from Toronto to Keflavík and 767 from Keflavík to Gatwick. They'll keep these flying until their 737MAXs are delivered.
I've never flown on a 767 but 2-3-2 must have been an awesome idea because there's an absolutely wild number of comments about it.
If you travel alone it does not really matter where you sit, couples take a 2, with a child take a 3, when you are 4 choose 2x2 behind each other and so on, best arrangement imho. 4 in the middle is awkward.
The 2-3-2 means fewer middle seats which makes it an awesome aircraft on long-haul flights! Especially in comparison to the growing number of 3-3-3 configurations out there. -JS
I flew home from Los Angeles to Atlanta in late 2001 when my dad died suddenly, I flew coach. The coach seating on this aircraft is magnificent when compared to anything else that is now flown. Sadly, this model is getting very old, and the fuel efficiency is not very good when compared to the current cattle cars that are mostly plastic. I will so sadly miss this Queen.
I still need to ride on so many planes
Greatest commercial jet ever built in my opinion. So sad to see it go.
There's also the KC-46 tanker for the USAF that is a 767 frame.
It was mentioned and pictured. (4:26)
and its a failure
@@dknowles60 It's just having early problems. Not the first plane to have problems.
@@daveriley6310 not a KC-46 it's a KC-767
@@yoyoyoyoshua ThePanda says "not a KC-46 it's a KC-767" - He should not attempt to correct people who are already correct. Walterwlim correctly referred to The USAF tanker as the KC-46. "The KC-46 Pegasus is a military aerial refueling and strategic military transport aircraft developed by Boeing from its 767 airliner."
Ansett Australia flew the 3 crew 767s right up to the late 90s.
I think the only airline to operate them with a Flight Engineer
2:01 767-100 sounds interesting just like the 747 SP
Simple was to say it for money or the demand.
It’s a tough plane. Have flown on it from Addis Ababa to Enugu a couple of times via Ethiopian airlines. I guess it’s retired now. 767 💪🏾.
Built like a truck, but a little rough around the edges
The military version is called the KC-46
The 767 has aged very well. The same as the 757. A pioneer the same as the A300 to define todays and future aviation trends.
757 and 767..Best Airplane that Boeing have ever Made..Its Just really Sad why Boeing did not continue producing it or ever Upgrading them...🤔👊👊👊
Somehow, I never got to fly on a 767, that I can remember. Its heyday was at a time when I wasn’t flying much.
@christopher hennessey the most common plane in australia is the A330-300 which is the plane i fly every year
Still plenty flying. Don’t miss your chance 😁👍🏼
My favourite plane.I wish Boeing could have upgraded the cockpit with time and have more glass cockpit like the B737NG.B767 proved itself to be a workforce.
1:53 How in the world do you order a boeing 767?? How does the shipping and handling work for that lol
I am not sure of Simple Flying`s qualifications, but I worked at Boeing from the mid-80s to 2013 supporting BCA engineers and having them teach me how to fly at the Boeing flying club.
Here's your why?
FAA regulations required 3 or more engines and a flight engineer. It wasn't until Boeing and others used data from the Navy flying 2 engine DC 9 transports from California to Hawaii did they have proof that 2 engines over the ocean was safe and reliable. Boeing improved the technology to where a flight engineer was not needed and engine thrust increased allowing only two engines rather than three or four. Back in the day the FAA had more direct reports involved with certification and it was a lengthy and thorough process to certify both the 757 at 767 ETOPS. History has shown both Boeing and the FAA did wonderfully as the airplanes safety records speak for themselves.
Lastly, both the 757 and 767 we're designed almost entirely using computer aided design (CATIA) and this made for more precise engineering in comparison to the traditional drafting table.
I want to fly the 767 from florida to vancouver.
my first ever flight was in one of these
Well it's looking like the 767 NG/MAX may now be on the cards, because hoo boy the 777X is probably toast and even the 787 might be too big for a lot of TATL routes moving forward.
In hind sight, maybe an updated 767 would have been a better option then a maxed out 737 max?? The 767 does a single stage to altitude climb, is tall enough for any new high efficiency engine you might want to sling under the wings, and the inside is roomy enough for a more pandemic friendly interior layout.....?? Could a modern version 767 with current technology be made efficient enough to make as much financial sense as the over maxed 737 max??
3:59 Eastern Airlines