... Did he ... NOT... like Batman??!! Dude when you look down and see your Batman-ness, how the hell does one not love that?! Thats my Batman arm, turn my wrist and pull out a smoke bomb, come onnn man AWESOME!
@@Subfightr i totally agree with this comment. The whole point of being batman, is seeing that you are batman. I hate floating hands, in vr. All vr games should have a full body.
I love the arms because of the sheer amount of detail they have like when you move your fingers, you can see the muscles pulling in the arm or if you have your arm bent versus straight you can see your muscles growing and shrinking it also has a nice flare when you are punching, throwing, grabbing, slashing, or whatever it just makes you feel a lot more connected and each swing feels more convincing because it actually makes sense the way your arms drag behind instead of your hands feeling like there’s some tracking issue speaking of tracking issues you said the hand hovers over where your actual controller is I didn’t experience that so your controllers might have a weird tracking offset
discussing his points 1. A "problem" that over 80-90 percent of people who play vr have absolutely no problem with, though I guess it does bring up an interesting point. 2. Honestly very nitpicky in my opinion. there nothing really wrong with the way they implement it he just wishes they did it differently. 3. his controller issue might be a headset issue I'm unsure though. another point that is really up to opinion, I love the haptics and really don't have much an issue with them in any game though if it were an issue it should be a "state of vr" games issue not just something with Behemoth. 4. low resolution is a given for standalone so I find it to be a redundant point, some games are able to handle higher some lower, its simply for optimization. there might be visual bugs though that do need to be fixed. 5. the long start up is a common thing, from what I know its for optimizing shaders. overall I think its just not his type of game.
Thank you, I agree with your points. Just clarifying that yes, games have to compile shaders on first launch. This is because each GPU will run the shaders with different machine code so it needs to be rebuilt for every GPU. Many games try to get away with processing shader compilation during gameplay but this leads to horrible stuttering, less than ideal in a VR game. Hope this clears it up, have a great day!
I was getting that vibe too. It sounds like a lot of his issues are really about his preferences for how to handle the limitations of VR as a medium (arms, lack of tactile feedback from impacts) rather than the actual quality of the game itself. He makes valid points, but there’s only so much you can do to remedy these issues.
@johnforkner you're not wrong. I think I'd just as soon avoid games that attempt to make use of the limited mechanics, but this thread proves - if nothing else - that I'm the minority.
yknow its funny I think we have the complete opposite opinion on vr mechanics and how they should work and its fascinating. You seem to want vr to function more like a specialised approximation of reality where everything aligns fine and theres no like potentially immersion breaking stretch of the imagination. Im the opposite I think that vr games should push the limits as much as possible and have the player roleplay these things out. I think its like the difference between a half life alyx style game and a bonelab style game. One plays within vrs limits and one disregards them as much as possible to do things that "shouldnt" work. Most games fall somewhere in the middle ig
I'm with you. It's an imagination/roleplay of a virtual character in a virtual world. I don't ever forget I'm in a videogame with ANY VR game...I'm in a virtual world with its own physical laws, which I adopt through that mental roleplay. On that note, I played the two games you mentioned totally differently because they are totally different. Alyx, I played in a giant room scale space, moving 1 to 1 throughout literally the whole game (except stairs or other impossibilities), but with Boneworks/lab, I played with smooth locomotion. I felt equally grounded in each world.
...or reminds me of the game Windlands, where you can jump like 30 feet in the air. My buddy was struggling at one point, hanging off the edge of a cliff, trying to climb up how he would in the real world. I'm like bro....jump off of that shit like a fuckin super hero! Launch around! He eventually understood...it's about adopting and roleplaying any particular games' physics/gameplay.
I agree with this. I don’t try to walk through characters as I wouldn’t do that in real life, I don’t go in looking for flaws as I don’t do that in real life, and I don’t attempt to break the game by making certain actions I play within the confines of the game which makes it more enjoyable to me.
It's weird as I haven't got the issue with the arms being cut like that at all. They merge perfectly into my own body. Either the auto calibration worked for me or I have the exact same physique as the character! I'm actually quite enjoying the game so far but it should have had more Behemoths and less human battles. It's as close to SOTC in VR as we can get for now which is better than not having it at all.
15:22 I mean you’re making some good points when it comes to swords not being emulated great in VE, but it’s the best we got lol. The tech to do what you want doesn’t exist
you are just old and weird :) the batman body is the best upgrade in VR, it allows exactly to feel like beating the bad guys in the game. And Quest 3 does have the whole elbow, arm tracking, this is why that body finally works in VR. And all new games will have upper body tracking on Quest now. Even old ones are getting updated to support body instead of just arms. :)
@@10speed4 no. I have played Blade and Sorcery with a full body and even have videos on my channel. And I can agree only on that part that most VR games have melee combat totally wrong with weightless swords. But games like Blade and Sorcery do feel great. And even Saints and Sinners had cool mechanics stabbing zombies. I will still waiting to check the Behemoth though.
@@10speed4 They're some of the best you'll see, but they're by no means perfect. Better than this and much less off-putting, but your arms still sometimes move into odd and unnatural shapes.
Yikes - I’m trying hard to support VR devs, but Batman came out buggy and I wasn’t a fan of the legacy fighting mechanic (pass), Metro Awakening looked like another less than optimum 2D to VR transition + too focused on cinematic story telling + the ultra fast monsters that don’t play well in VR(pass). Wanderer, well I bought the original and didn't get on with that (pass) and that kinda left Behemoth! I bought the hype train for BoneLab and damn I hated dragging that dead elastic body around with me! So I'll watch other reviews of Behemoth but it ain't looking good 😢.... back to iRacing, DCS, HLA and Red Matter...its not all bad
I gotta say I disagree with the body thing. I ALWAYS prefer having a body in VR. It's much more immersive that way, and the fact that HLA had floating hands is actually my biggest gripe with that game. I don't really mind if my elbows don't match exactly, but that's just me. I would much rather have elbows that don't quite match up if it means I have an entire body in VR, because the immersion ramps up for me regardless. I know it's divisive though, so it's nice if games give an option. All that said, I still prefer VR games that I just sit down to play vs. roomscale type games.
The arms thing is a debate that will go on forever. Personally i just like the hands, i dont find it any less immersive. I am interested in playing this but i sort of hold the same opinion as you on sword fighting. It always just looks and feels like fighting with cardboard swords and the collision detection is hit and miss. And that isn't just this game. 12:28 like tell me that isn't a cardboard knife haha.
@@86themadhatter27 I'm probably just in a bubble, but from my perspective I'm the weirdo and nobody even mentions the hands. I want to enjoy the game, but it begins with "are the hand interactions well done? Because that's entirely how we're gonna interact with the game. Are the mechanics polished? What's it doing different from others in it's category? And after that I just wanna have fun. But everything else grows out of those small necessities. But I'll be damned if that's not one more controversy in this year of our Lord.
Big patch dropped yesterday. All my main issues with the feel of combat have been resolved. OP probably wont like it still but for those in the fence, it feels much better than the day 1 release.
@@bringhurstvrhaha remembered this comment thread cause of Clone Drone in the Hyperdome blowing me and (behemoths combat) with it’s beautiful swordplay. i can’t recommend it enough it feels like skill at play. they mo capped people in vr for the animation so it feels so real if that makes sense. Highly recommend
The one armed jump climbing, I used to be able to do that before I became disabled. You gotta remember , you're not average Joe in this game. You're strong enough to punch heads off, you're strong enough to climb with 1 arm. 🤯 Oh no... 😭 Dude...I've been so hyped over this game, I never even thought about the fact that I probably can't play this! 😭 I can't bring my hand above my head! I gotta do weird stuff to climb like lean way back and "climb" like I'm crawling upside down.
Long initial load time was probably the game loading shaders on first launch. Didn't red matter 2 do that also? I think they had a notification saying that was what's going on maybe? Still took longer to load up that first time launching it though.
Thanks for a honest and detailed impressions video of Quest version. If I recall correctly Saints and Sinners Chapter 2 made by the same developer also had tons of jank for Quest/PC. I got it on sale for SteamVR only after they fixed most of my concerns via patches.
You are correct, but let me add to that the fact that on Quest SAS Retribution(?) is still a mess, mainly unfixed, hence it's much lower rating on the Meta games store.
@@denemessina8601This. My faith in Skydance is next to zero sadly. I'll wait for cd-key pcvr cheap version a year from now. Can't say I'm surprised, given the constant delays, late review release and desperately trying to hit the Xmas market. Basically a replay of the Retribution debacle
How? You also hated Batman Arkham Shadow? That game was flawless for me, similar to this one. I think people are really really spoiled these days, and cant be pleased with anything anymore...
I got the same hand hat thing you are talking about. It's like my controller is where the wrist is at. It's so stupid. Feels like the character is only 5ft tall too.
I also prefer floating hands! We're definitely in a minority.. I just dont get this bothered about it cause I never forget that Im in VR.. so i don't mind "immersion breaking" things here and there. Very thankful for this review because in the midst of hype.. i need some critical takes about the small stuff since that's how i go through games.. ill still enjoy something.. but Im going to point out the bad. Im going through zero dawn remaster right now and one small thing I'll bring up is how the lip movements while speaking are muppet-like and worse than the original.... but, Im still loving it😅
I played around 14 hours (I am still around 90% of story), can't agree with your opinion on gameplay experience, combat is very good, gameplay loop is cool, between combat there are some puzzle and story elements to make it more diverse. Rope mechanics are best I saw in any game, rope keep actual lenght when cut and with whole its physics when pulling up object it is mindblowing they did it in game. Arms are working well. I found workaround to match my hands position (around 0,8 cm offset) by editing controllers offset values in my driver file. They did not have official support for all headsets, which will be coming in next updates I hope.
We NEED critical reviews, in order to push VR forward. There is far too much settling for a hyped-up game for a medium that we love and want to see more from. This is not present in any other established medium, like movies or ANY other medium of gaming. If GTA5 or God of War had these kind of issues, it would be DISASTROUS for them. Yet, so many people in the space give these passes despite glaring issues. I appreciate you being one of those people who aren't afraid to focus on the negatives (a necessity for improving) and not just give these games a blanket pass. Watching these more critical reviews, I feel like I could have been much more critical in my first playthrough vid. I did, in fact, comment on these issues, but I don't think I put across the proper DEGREE of impact these issues are going to have on me in regards to choosing or not choosing to play this again after I finish. In part 2, I will definitely be more focused on these issues. Skydance, after all, hyped the game up themselves as being a AAA title, even putting their name IN the title "Skydance's Behemoth" as if it were a quality qualifier. So, that's on them. It's their fault for not underpromising and over-delivering, and choosing instead to overpromise and underdeliver. I appreciate the critical review, and totally agree! I think you've even swayed me on body presence. It just makes sense to only represent what can be represented by presence/motion controls.
You sir, are a brave man. I, speaking from one day in the future, can say that most/all of your glitch related gripes have been solved. And I think I heard they added an option for just hands. I should check that myself before posting this but that would require more effort than I'm willing to expend. All in all, I think you should give it another shot, if you can get over the swordfighting and jump climb. To appreciate the jump climb, you gotta have an affinity for shadow of the colossus, and keep it in mind. You also have to think of the practicality. You said yourself there's a lot of climbing in this game and throwing yourself in The Climb is like the most exhausting part. I don't know about you but The Climb is a workout for my fat ass, now put a guy on top of that mountain trying to kill me so I have to keep swinging my flabby, burning arms to stay alive. Naw, give me a button and make me feel like I'm actually strong and capable of climbing and fighting. As for your feelings about sword fighting in VR, I get it and I even felt the same way for a while, but there's really not much you can do without some kind of force feedback system. By the time something like that could be readily available, full dive technology could it be on the horizon. As shity as it is you just kind of have to accept the limitations of the technology at hand. Games like Blade & sorcery try to give you a one-to-one control of your hands, weight be damned. This game and Saints and Sinners opted for a more weighted approach. Your real hands are up here and your sword is down there because when a sword gets hit it moves regardless if you want it to stay still. You have to think of it like your in-game hands are your real hands, and your real hands are where you're willing your hands to go. If you push it too hard it's going to Jank, so you just have to play the controls you're given. Likewise in real life if your hand hits a wall you don't keep trying to push through it you find a way around. Sorry for the essay, but this is the first video of yours I've seen and even though I don't share a lot of your opinions I can appreciate your view. Your worth a watch.
I reinstalled and used steam to confirm the files weren't corrupt. They gave the press early access, releasing a game that wasn't working on launch, and this video is what resulted.
I gave up at the 3rd miniboss, the guy with the shield. There is something seriously wrong with the combat. Im not too proud to recognize that some of it is user error on my part but its largely the game. It just simply doesn't work more often than not, and it completely soured the experience. Now that everyone has access to it, youre seeing the same sentiment from other people. The combat is completely borked. I really hope the patch on the 12th cleans things up.
It's baked into something like RoboCop with the UEVR. And that's something that's difficult to overcome on it's face without experience in using the app. It's not my hardware.
@@bringhurstvr No but you actually have a hardware problem, I've just now watched all the video and you got a ton of non-software issues like: tracking issues, controller displacement, bad hmd tracking and much more
I will be honest the one thing I did agree with you on is the bow but that's just because it was uncomfortable and strange to use most of the time I would have preferred a shield to be one of the three weapons instead with a similar effect that you can get in blade & sorcery where you throw the shield and then it bounces back to you
i dont get Skydances hands either they had this with Walking dead where they looked slightly cartoonish and large but theyve done the same thing in this game. i feel like im wear Micky Mouse gloves on at all times and my god the physics for the hands are just as awful as the ones in Walking Dead. theres too much weight simulation for the hands so they never track your actual hand movements 1-1. and in a game where parrying is crucial to combat i want to know my quick reactions and movement is being rewarded not punished just because my characters hands couldnt adjust to the same angle and position my actual hands were in
Absolutely disagree. There’s nothing more that ruins the immersion for me than something that is supposed to represent my body, and feels completely disconnected. Until VR gets body representation movement one to one, bodies, and VR will always feel like I’m controlling. A puppet
Had none of the technical problems you talk about. None. But wasn't enjoying the game much until I watched a few 'pro combat tips' for it (Substatica etc). Then it was *much* better experience, excellent in fact. Really enjoying the combat now. But for fans of SOTC, I've found the first 2 Behemoths very underwhelming and overly scripted sadly. Hoping the last 2 are much better.
First off, I'm team arms, sorry 😂 Fullbody can be distracting at times if not implemented correctly, that i fully get. Stresslevel Zero did some magic in Bonelab in the guessing of the arm/elbowplacement. So its achievable. But, its clear that Skydance has brought over ALOT from S&S. So this game, felt like saints and sinners only with more swords. You're this "buff" warrior supposedly with the worst stamina ever :P I kinda got thrown off by the "tiring"-vignetting around my vision and my arms turned into jello after swinging 3-4 times at an enemy. I bought this game without looking at any reviews. Because I thought it would be amazing. Turns out its ok-ish, but it feels too sluggish to fight. Alot has to do with the mismatch of arms and IRL arms. But also feel like I cant go HAM on the enemies as I'm restricted into this stamina-based system that I feel belongs in Saints and sinners and not this game. I'd much rather have more enemies on screen and be stronger, than fewer and beeing forced to parry and stuff. I refunded this game,🤞hoping that will go through :P Maybe I'll come back to it. But very dissapointing after playing a masterpiece like Metro. Still to this day, the only swordfighting, physics based game i thoroughly enjoy is Dungeons of Eternity. They've really nailed that. Thats my unpopular opinion.
I dont enjoy swordplay in vr also, main reason I didn't pick this one up. It does work so much better with ranged weapons. I loved Asgards wrath 2 harp weapon
Skydance is nOt a "triple A company" and this most definitely is nOt a "triple A game". This is objectively false. Even the Skydance devs would tell you they're not and this game is not nor was it ever going to be. Since its Unreal Engine, the black intro screen is likely shader compilation but agree it would be super nice if the devs put a progress/loading bar there to show the player that aNYTHing is actually happening.
There's also nothing physical to convey that you need to use two hands to lift up a log in saints and sinners, your in-game arm becomes floppy and slow, it's clearly too heavy and requires two hands, I FEEL as if I'm struggling to hold it with 1 arm. I love the fact that this game has impact recoil, I hated that about assassin's creed, without that heft and reactions, it just becomes a waggle feat. I WANT to feel like I am struggling to rip my knife out of someone's skull, I find myself unconsciously making grunting as I struggle to pull the stuck weapon.
Great Video. I agree entirely with your comments about the insanity of attempting to render untracked avatar body parts. Yeah I'd love to have a full body in every game over just hands, but unfortunately, atm only the hands head and controllers are tracked, so they are the only true interface with your virtual world. Asgards Wrath 2 is just about the best attempt i've seen on Quest, but it's still nowhere near perfect. Compare these games to the Arizona Sunshine remake and there's no denying that at the moment, the disembodied hands are the best way to go.
I think people are too forgiving with vr games. The truth is every inconsistency whether it be graphical or physical will pull you out of the experience. They all add up to the point where you'd rather be playing a flat game.
I think you're right about this game bro I just refunded it. I do like arms in the games that have them they seem to be implemented well and they're probably shooter games so it's predictable where your arms will be. Keep giving us your opinion bro
Wow, I can't wait for the Thrill of the Fight 2 review where we bitch for 20 minutes on how boxing in VR can't work because your not actually punching someone. :eyeroll 🙄
Thanks again for your honesty. Most trusted man in VR. Question: Did you like the sword play in Asgard's Wrath 2 more or less than Behemoth? That was the first game I thought it was done alright, partially because they gave you more options, so I was never using the sword for too long.
@@IanDeMartino I'm hearing that from a lot of people. But I honestly never made a review of that game. I skipped it at the time cause I was busy elsewhere.
A contrarian view point. Good to have opinions. The arm movement you dislike is down to Skydances' inverse kinematics implementation. The walking dead games suffered from the same.
Seems we think very differently of how VR should be. For me one of the great things about VR is that you don''t see your real hands so if you touch a wall and your in-game hand stops at the wall it really feels like you are touching it even if you can technically just put your real hand in the wall. For that same reason I don't mind if my arms don't fit my real arms exactly. It's like I don't expect the game to have my arms and hands exactly as I have them in real life, it's more like I control the VR body with my body and I have to adjust for when things in the game block my arms and stuff. That said I don't think the combat is really good in this and I agree melee combat in VR is pretty jank. I used to really not like it until I played more sword and sorcery but this game has something weird going on, It feels like everything is a bit too wobbly when using 1 hand and with 2 hands the weapon moves in a strange way. Fought the first behemoth and wasn't really impressed with the combat. The thing looked really cool but the fight was underwhelming, hopefully the others are better.
So basically you have in game hand offset which does not match to your controller position? If so, this is the most annoying thing in VR games recently, they can't do proper match for some reason but won't give you option to fix it manually.
No, that is not it. The ARMS don't match your actual arms because the only thing being tracked is your hands. They guess the arms purely by hand position + IK.
@@amadeusk525 Ok thanks for explaining, I was afraid hands are off since that I understood this frase like you have hats on them. Arms are usually buggy, can be only predicted where should be without tracking but some game are doing it right way.
@@amadeusk525 Actually I tried it finally and he was right, hands are way off to players controller position so playing it you feel like you steering some other hands on stick.
I agree with almost everything you said. I was having my hopes up for another cool rpg the size of asgard`s wrath. But man games only seem to get worse and short. I really hoped this would have a main story of at least 30 hours. I will keep watching how this unfolds with patches but for now this is a big nono.
That roomscale boundary grid was killing me. Fix yo boundary, man! Unless you legit don't have room and then I guess we do what we gotta do. Interesting to hear your opinions on this. Seems to be that the community is pretty well divided between 'this game is a buggy pile of ass' to 'this game is GotY easily.' Kinda bummed to see it get such a polarized reception. I think I'm going to give it a month or two and check it out then. Maybe buy it physically on PSVR2 though that version seems to be in worse shape at the moment. Gonna go check out your Batman vid now.
Dude, why are you complaining about the arms of all things for 6 minutes when it really is not that big of an issue? Also, you claim that swords "just don't work". Clearly you have never played a VR game with actual physics based melee combat, like blade & sorcery, dungeons of eternity, legendary tales, etc. They do work, its just that they are hard to get right. Don't like it? Stick with other methods of combat. So yeah, half your review is complete bullshit, but the rest seems valid enough.
I never thought about it, but you're not wrong at all about the "VR body problem". I don't mind it myself, but as a smaller guy, my character has to bend his arms when mine are completely outstretched. I'm like a gorilla man or something. I think if we actually want arms, someone needs to research actual natural arm movements and train the game engine to actually put the arms where most people would actually have them, then show the world what it actually looks like to have arms done right. Right now it seems like they just let the physics figure it out, which it never does.
I really enjoyed VR for a while, but over the past few years it has become really disappointing. 2024 was a breaking point for me. Batman didn't look worth playing for free much less to buy yet another HMD to play. I was never really "excited" about Behemoth but now that I've been off VR for a couple of months I really feel like something amazing is going to have to happen for me to want to get back in. There doesn't have to be a debate about arms. It could totally be optional. That they don't take the time to make it optional shows they don't care about the poor clunky experience that arms and bodies become. I feel like all those people who attack anyone who has an opinion are just in that place that I was for years, struggling to enjoy it so much as to be in denial of any honest criticism. Things will never get better until the developers start LISTENING to the criticism. They can't keep creating content in a vacuum, or an echo chamber of sycophants telling them how wonderful everything is. VR is on its way to novelty/niche status, like the Rubik's Cube.
@@jackdiddley do you have access to PCVR? The cost of entry is high, but there are no less than 20 games I can play all day, that never get old, and that are visually stunning.
I don't like jank, I don't like bad mechanics, I don't like the body in Batman, I don't like the belt in Sniper Elite. Ha Ha! I am still curious about Behemoth, but since it's announcement, I have wondered how much game there would actually be beyond climbing up the big guys. Is just boss fight battles on steroids?
This is kind of disappointing also that some people are taking this one opinion without consulting other because even if in the end they believe it its never great to trust only the first source! If the game gets dragged down simply because some people were initially told it was bad and started hyper focusing on those detail then its less updates and fixes for everyone :(.
@@liambongioanni5781 I watched great games like Solaris and Death Lap get glowing reviews, just to tank a year later. These games have a half life of six months, and if developers insist on launching games with jank, broken mechanics, and half functional mechanics - expecting the audience to buy it before it's complete, then that's a hiccup on their end. Creators get paid a commission when you buy a game. You can argue I'm wrong regarding the mechanics, but the smaller issues I discussed shouldn't have been there, and this video would have had better reception, a better commission rate, and I'd be typing less if I'd lied and not spoken my mind. That's the thing. You guys are commenting constantly on the arms, which I said you would, and it culminates in "you're so negative", but the other things happened. You shouldn't be able to climb with one hand. Those are bad gameplay mechanics, and I'm done with this thing where I should have pulled a BMF saying exactly what you wanted to hear. I don't believe anyone subscribes to my channel because they disagree vehemently. I'm not alone here.
I hated how Horizon Call of the mountain felt like this dumbed down version of a game. Pretty sure that they are making these AAA games like this so theyre playable for a very large audience and casual gamers just getting into VR...at least making it playable for them. It sucks because we are being held back by the weakest link. Vould also just be allotted budget. Regardless, its hard to go back from a 15x15 ft true 1 to 1 roomscale experience with Alyx, where even your CLOTHES have sound when you make movements through the space, to these games with simplified gameplay and cut corners. Youre honestly kinda bumming me out about the game though, lol. I was looking to buy it today but some of the things that you mention are things that I dont like either. The arm thing doesnt bother me though--its a matter of mentally and physically assuming the role of a virtual character in a virtual world, and not trying to cram actual reality onto the game....its like, reverse.
@@parallelsmoke7800 I mostly hate the retort that Alyx had more money and more developers, so we ask too much of the people making these new games. Alyx is beautiful. It's nearly perfect. But it's not just because of the wild textures. Vertigo 2 was made by a handful of guys and it's brilliant. Lies Beneath did a lot with very little. It's the small mechanics, the voiceovers and the story that makes a game great. And most of the time when someone replies like that it's because that can't bring themselves to say someone or something was lazy.
@@bringhurstvr Maybe I'll just get Vertigo 2 instead. Lol. Been eyeing that for a couple years at this point (played the first game and thought it was awesome).
This is why you’re my favorite VR guy, you tell it like it is and you saved me some money that I can use to purchase 2024 flight simulator 😎. I’ll wait and see if they fix Behemoth issues in future updates.
watchi g your game vs others gameplay... i think your just bad at the game, dude. I just watched Wolf in vrs full video, and it didn't have any of that. the combat looked fluid and weighted.
That video is gameplay without seeing his arms relative to the footage. I'm sure I suck at the game, but the issues I'm talking about can't be represented in just gameplay footage. And the sword play amounted to like 6 minutes of this episode. I doubt if climbing with one hand, controller drift, low resolution and janky arms are the result of me being an imbecile. More likely, I just have higher standards, even if they're pie in the sky, and he's just made $500 in 8 hours through game sales.
At 70% completed what I'm seeing is a childish game ... maybe good for children and younger teenagers. The rubbery wet noodle wrists, the cartoonish swordplay and the weak story all add up to a AA game at best. The combat, the puzzles and the platforming are shallow and repetitive. VR deserves better than this.
I am glad to hear other opinions on things even if I absolutely completely disagree with you on almost all fronts. The review does feel very negative of things that are now kind of consistent to what is the main opinion on VR games which I believe is important to help game devs diversify. But after hearing all that it seems like VR may just not be your thing because games seem to be going in this direction and people seem to be enjoying it! No shade to you glad to hear other opinions!
I can list 50 games off the top of my head that are absolute masterpieces, PCVR and Standalone alike. I don't like the direction it's going, but I've got a higher standard than most, it seems.
Or maybe just different taste! But like I said it seems VR is going in a direction you may not like. Anyways keep making videos even if I don't agree with them diversity is essential to create good things
I was extremely excited to buy this title, but much less enthusiastic after seeing this review and may save my cash and disappointment for something else. Thank you for the honest review.
You thrive on negative feedback on batman VR? Why do you make content for the public if you pride in ignoring any feedback/info/thoughts the people watch you say? Why not just make your content private and only for yourself then
@@bearofthewest389 what else would I do but thrive? I'm not gonna change my mind and anyone bent on doing so begins with vitriol. That's not any place to begin. I'm here to talk, not bend the knee to kids who are ticked off because they just bought a Quest 3S and I'm saying I don't like a game they were looking forward to.
After that batman review, i dont consider your opinion
Well, I'll take ya anyhow. Even if you're only here to suffer.
@@bringhurstvr Just subscribed for that reply alone. Now I'll watch your vid :)
... Did he ... NOT... like Batman??!! Dude when you look down and see your Batman-ness, how the hell does one not love that?! Thats my Batman arm, turn my wrist and pull out a smoke bomb, come onnn man AWESOME!
@@Subfightr i totally agree with this comment. The whole point of being batman, is seeing that you are batman. I hate floating hands, in vr. All vr games should have a full body.
@@TijnvanGimstHow dare you disagree with me!
I love the arms because of the sheer amount of detail they have like when you move your fingers, you can see the muscles pulling in the arm or if you have your arm bent versus straight you can see your muscles growing and shrinking it also has a nice flare when you are punching, throwing, grabbing, slashing, or whatever it just makes you feel a lot more connected and each swing feels more convincing because it actually makes sense the way your arms drag behind instead of your hands feeling like there’s some tracking issue speaking of tracking issues you said the hand hovers over where your actual controller is I didn’t experience that so your controllers might have a weird tracking offset
I prefer hearing someone with an alternative viewpoint and are not scared to voice negative opinions of a title.
discussing his points
1. A "problem" that over 80-90 percent of people who play vr have absolutely no problem with, though I guess it does bring up an interesting point.
2. Honestly very nitpicky in my opinion. there nothing really wrong with the way they implement it he just wishes they did it differently.
3. his controller issue might be a headset issue I'm unsure though. another point that is really up to opinion, I love the haptics and really don't have much an issue with them in any game though if it were an issue it should be a "state of vr" games issue not just something with Behemoth.
4. low resolution is a given for standalone so I find it to be a redundant point, some games are able to handle higher some lower, its simply for optimization. there might be visual bugs though that do need to be fixed.
5. the long start up is a common thing, from what I know its for optimizing shaders.
overall I think its just not his type of game.
Thank you, I agree with your points. Just clarifying that yes, games have to compile shaders on first launch. This is because each GPU will run the shaders with different machine code so it needs to be rebuilt for every GPU. Many games try to get away with processing shader compilation during gameplay but this leads to horrible stuttering, less than ideal in a VR game.
Hope this clears it up, have a great day!
@@skellybob5620 thank you
I was getting that vibe too. It sounds like a lot of his issues are really about his preferences for how to handle the limitations of VR as a medium (arms, lack of tactile feedback from impacts) rather than the actual quality of the game itself. He makes valid points, but there’s only so much you can do to remedy these issues.
@johnforkner you're not wrong. I think I'd just as soon avoid games that attempt to make use of the limited mechanics, but this thread proves - if nothing else - that I'm the minority.
yknow its funny I think we have the complete opposite opinion on vr mechanics and how they should work and its fascinating. You seem to want vr to function more like a specialised approximation of reality where everything aligns fine and theres no like potentially immersion breaking stretch of the imagination. Im the opposite I think that vr games should push the limits as much as possible and have the player roleplay these things out. I think its like the difference between a half life alyx style game and a bonelab style game. One plays within vrs limits and one disregards them as much as possible to do things that "shouldnt" work. Most games fall somewhere in the middle ig
I agree
I'm with you. It's an imagination/roleplay of a virtual character in a virtual world. I don't ever forget I'm in a videogame with ANY VR game...I'm in a virtual world with its own physical laws, which I adopt through that mental roleplay. On that note, I played the two games you mentioned totally differently because they are totally different. Alyx, I played in a giant room scale space, moving 1 to 1 throughout literally the whole game (except stairs or other impossibilities), but with Boneworks/lab, I played with smooth locomotion. I felt equally grounded in each world.
...or reminds me of the game Windlands, where you can jump like 30 feet in the air. My buddy was struggling at one point, hanging off the edge of a cliff, trying to climb up how he would in the real world. I'm like bro....jump off of that shit like a fuckin super hero! Launch around! He eventually understood...it's about adopting and roleplaying any particular games' physics/gameplay.
I agree with this. I don’t try to walk through characters as I wouldn’t do that in real life, I don’t go in looking for flaws as I don’t do that in real life, and I don’t attempt to break the game by making certain actions I play within the confines of the game which makes it more enjoyable to me.
It's weird as I haven't got the issue with the arms being cut like that at all. They merge perfectly into my own body. Either the auto calibration worked for me or I have the exact same physique as the character! I'm actually quite enjoying the game so far but it should have had more Behemoths and less human battles. It's as close to SOTC in VR as we can get for now which is better than not having it at all.
6:06 yea that’s to prevent jank. VR still had jank, but it works good enough. I stopped noticing anything after a hour or two into the game.
15:22 I mean you’re making some good points when it comes to swords not being emulated great in VE, but it’s the best we got lol. The tech to do what you want doesn’t exist
Yeah. That's what I said.
You really should check out my review on Behemoth, also you have to have arms fue to the grapple hook mechanic..wo arms it wouldnt work
you are just old and weird :) the batman body is the best upgrade in VR, it allows exactly to feel like beating the bad guys in the game. And Quest 3 does have the whole elbow, arm tracking, this is why that body finally works in VR. And all new games will have upper body tracking on Quest now. Even old ones are getting updated to support body instead of just arms. :)
Have you played AGW2? The mechanics are on target 🎯
@@10speed4 no. I have played Blade and Sorcery with a full body and even have videos on my channel. And I can agree only on that part that most VR games have melee combat totally wrong with weightless swords. But games like Blade and Sorcery do feel great. And even Saints and Sinners had cool mechanics stabbing zombies. I will still waiting to check the Behemoth though.
@@PandaTrackers absolutely, let us know your findings with Behemoth. Different takes are good to hear.
@@10speed4 They're some of the best you'll see, but they're by no means perfect. Better than this and much less off-putting, but your arms still sometimes move into odd and unnatural shapes.
Yikes - I’m trying hard to support VR devs, but Batman came out buggy and I wasn’t a fan of the legacy fighting mechanic (pass), Metro Awakening looked like another less than optimum 2D to VR transition + too focused on cinematic story telling + the ultra fast monsters that don’t play well in VR(pass). Wanderer, well I bought the original and didn't get on with that (pass) and that kinda left Behemoth! I bought the hype train for BoneLab and damn I hated dragging that dead elastic body around with me! So I'll watch other reviews of Behemoth but it ain't looking good 😢.... back to iRacing, DCS, HLA and Red Matter...its not all bad
I gotta say I disagree with the body thing. I ALWAYS prefer having a body in VR. It's much more immersive that way, and the fact that HLA had floating hands is actually my biggest gripe with that game. I don't really mind if my elbows don't match exactly, but that's just me. I would much rather have elbows that don't quite match up if it means I have an entire body in VR, because the immersion ramps up for me regardless.
I know it's divisive though, so it's nice if games give an option.
All that said, I still prefer VR games that I just sit down to play vs. roomscale type games.
That's a very fair take on the issue.
@@bringhurstvr You totally make a good point though
The arms thing is a debate that will go on forever. Personally i just like the hands, i dont find it any less immersive. I am interested in playing this but i sort of hold the same opinion as you on sword fighting. It always just looks and feels like fighting with cardboard swords and the collision detection is hit and miss. And that isn't just this game. 12:28 like tell me that isn't a cardboard knife haha.
@@86themadhatter27 I'm probably just in a bubble, but from my perspective I'm the weirdo and nobody even mentions the hands.
I want to enjoy the game, but it begins with "are the hand interactions well done? Because that's entirely how we're gonna interact with the game.
Are the mechanics polished?
What's it doing different from others in it's category?
And after that I just wanna have fun. But everything else grows out of those small necessities. But I'll be damned if that's not one more controversy in this year of our Lord.
Big patch dropped yesterday. All my main issues with the feel of combat have been resolved. OP probably wont like it still but for those in the fence, it feels much better than the day 1 release.
until you fall was so ahead in its swordplay. still play it occasionally
Never played it. Color me intrigued.
THIS, instead of Blade & Sorcery, VR games should emulate Until You Fall, it does physics right without being janky
I agree. Until you fall has much better swordplay than Behemoth. So does iron strike. Behemoth is a disappointment for me so far
@@bringhurstvrhaha remembered this comment thread cause of Clone Drone in the Hyperdome blowing me and (behemoths combat) with it’s beautiful swordplay. i can’t recommend it enough it feels like skill at play. they mo capped people in vr for the animation so it feels so real if that makes sense. Highly recommend
@truth7down nice, I'll check it out.
The one armed jump climbing, I used to be able to do that before I became disabled. You gotta remember , you're not average Joe in this game. You're strong enough to punch heads off, you're strong enough to climb with 1 arm. 🤯 Oh no... 😭 Dude...I've been so hyped over this game, I never even thought about the fact that I probably can't play this! 😭 I can't bring my hand above my head! I gotta do weird stuff to climb like lean way back and "climb" like I'm crawling upside down.
@@Subfightr willing to bet we'll find some accessibility tips to figure it out.
you're not an average joe but you can't hold a sword properly to the point that you have noodle arms, makes no sense.
Long initial load time was probably the game loading shaders on first launch. Didn't red matter 2 do that also? I think they had a notification saying that was what's going on maybe? Still took longer to load up that first time launching it though.
Thanks for a honest and detailed impressions video of Quest version. If I recall correctly Saints and Sinners Chapter 2 made by the same developer also had tons of jank for Quest/PC. I got it on sale for SteamVR only after they fixed most of my concerns via patches.
You are correct, but let me add to that the fact that on Quest SAS Retribution(?) is still a mess, mainly unfixed, hence it's much lower rating on the Meta games store.
@@denemessina8601This. My faith in Skydance is next to zero sadly.
I'll wait for cd-key pcvr cheap version a year from now.
Can't say I'm surprised, given the constant delays, late review release and desperately trying to hit the Xmas market.
Basically a replay of the Retribution debacle
How? You also hated Batman Arkham Shadow? That game was flawless for me, similar to this one. I think people are really really spoiled these days, and cant be pleased with anything anymore...
Eh, spoiled is the right word. Past games have had that effect.
I got the same hand hat thing you are talking about. It's like my controller is where the wrist is at. It's so stupid. Feels like the character is only 5ft tall too.
I also prefer floating hands! We're definitely in a minority.. I just dont get this bothered about it cause I never forget that Im in VR.. so i don't mind "immersion breaking" things here and there.
Very thankful for this review because in the midst of hype.. i need some critical takes about the small stuff since that's how i go through games.. ill still enjoy something.. but Im going to point out the bad.
Im going through zero dawn remaster right now and one small thing I'll bring up is how the lip movements while speaking are muppet-like and worse than the original.... but, Im still loving it😅
I played around 14 hours (I am still around 90% of story), can't agree with your opinion on gameplay experience, combat is very good, gameplay loop is cool, between combat there are some puzzle and story elements to make it more diverse. Rope mechanics are best I saw in any game, rope keep actual lenght when cut and with whole its physics when pulling up object it is mindblowing they did it in game. Arms are working well. I found workaround to match my hands position (around 0,8 cm offset) by editing controllers offset values in my driver file. They did not have official support for all headsets, which will be coming in next updates I hope.
We NEED critical reviews, in order to push VR forward. There is far too much settling for a hyped-up game for a medium that we love and want to see more from. This is not present in any other established medium, like movies or ANY other medium of gaming. If GTA5 or God of War had these kind of issues, it would be DISASTROUS for them. Yet, so many people in the space give these passes despite glaring issues. I appreciate you being one of those people who aren't afraid to focus on the negatives (a necessity for improving) and not just give these games a blanket pass.
Watching these more critical reviews, I feel like I could have been much more critical in my first playthrough vid. I did, in fact, comment on these issues, but I don't think I put across the proper DEGREE of impact these issues are going to have on me in regards to choosing or not choosing to play this again after I finish. In part 2, I will definitely be more focused on these issues. Skydance, after all, hyped the game up themselves as being a AAA title, even putting their name IN the title "Skydance's Behemoth" as if it were a quality qualifier. So, that's on them. It's their fault for not underpromising and over-delivering, and choosing instead to overpromise and underdeliver.
I appreciate the critical review, and totally agree! I think you've even swayed me on body presence. It just makes sense to only represent what can be represented by presence/motion controls.
@@mattvsmetaverse wow, thanks man. Very much.
@ No problemo! ✊🏻
You sir, are a brave man. I, speaking from one day in the future, can say that most/all of your glitch related gripes have been solved. And I think I heard they added an option for just hands. I should check that myself before posting this but that would require more effort than I'm willing to expend. All in all, I think you should give it another shot, if you can get over the swordfighting and jump climb. To appreciate the jump climb, you gotta have an affinity for shadow of the colossus, and keep it in mind. You also have to think of the practicality. You said yourself there's a lot of climbing in this game and throwing yourself in The Climb is like the most exhausting part. I don't know about you but The Climb is a workout for my fat ass, now put a guy on top of that mountain trying to kill me so I have to keep swinging my flabby, burning arms to stay alive. Naw, give me a button and make me feel like I'm actually strong and capable of climbing and fighting. As for your feelings about sword fighting in VR, I get it and I even felt the same way for a while, but there's really not much you can do without some kind of force feedback system. By the time something like that could be readily available, full dive technology could it be on the horizon. As shity as it is you just kind of have to accept the limitations of the technology at hand. Games like Blade & sorcery try to give you a one-to-one control of your hands, weight be damned. This game and Saints and Sinners opted for a more weighted approach. Your real hands are up here and your sword is down there because when a sword gets hit it moves regardless if you want it to stay still. You have to think of it like your in-game hands are your real hands, and your real hands are where you're willing your hands to go. If you push it too hard it's going to Jank, so you just have to play the controls you're given. Likewise in real life if your hand hits a wall you don't keep trying to push through it you find a way around.
Sorry for the essay, but this is the first video of yours I've seen and even though I don't share a lot of your opinions I can appreciate your view. Your worth a watch.
14:31 dawg your game clearly had issues installing. none of this stuff has happened to me. Only major glitch I’ve had are a miniboss dying instantly
I reinstalled and used steam to confirm the files weren't corrupt. They gave the press early access, releasing a game that wasn't working on launch, and this video is what resulted.
The quest 3 does have arm tracking, but basically no game is using it, not sure if it has some drastic drawbacks or what’s going on with this.
@@foeroon nobody uses it. They all rely on hands and an IK skeleton to guess the rest.
I gave up at the 3rd miniboss, the guy with the shield. There is something seriously wrong with the combat. Im not too proud to recognize that some of it is user error on my part but its largely the game. It just simply doesn't work more often than not, and it completely soured the experience. Now that everyone has access to it, youre seeing the same sentiment from other people. The combat is completely borked. I really hope the patch on the 12th cleans things up.
5:18 its harder to develop what you said than just not doing anything, I think its a hardware problem
It's baked into something like RoboCop with the UEVR. And that's something that's difficult to overcome on it's face without experience in using the app. It's not my hardware.
@@bringhurstvr I've played Behemoth and got zero of the issues you've got. Also the body ik can't be 100% accurate so stop being sissy pissy about it
@@bringhurstvr I played Behemoth and it never happend
@financialguru28 awesome
@@bringhurstvr No but you actually have a hardware problem, I've just now watched all the video and you got a ton of non-software issues like: tracking issues, controller displacement, bad hmd tracking and much more
I will be honest the one thing I did agree with you on is the bow but that's just because it was uncomfortable and strange to use most of the time I would have preferred a shield to be one of the three weapons instead with a similar effect that you can get in blade & sorcery where you throw the shield and then it bounces back to you
@@ceryndins7348 I'll take it.
We need honest opinions and reviews like this. Did you mention what platform you reviewed this on?
@@neonpop80 I'm not sure. But it's Quest. I'll be covering PCVR this weekend.
@@bringhurstvr quest what?
@@SUBZER0GREEN Quest 3..
i dont get Skydances hands either
they had this with Walking dead where they looked slightly cartoonish and large but theyve done the same thing in this game. i feel like im wear Micky Mouse gloves on at all times
and my god the physics for the hands are just as awful as the ones in Walking Dead. theres too much weight simulation for the hands so they never track your actual hand movements 1-1. and in a game where parrying is crucial to combat i want to know my quick reactions and movement is being rewarded not punished just because my characters hands couldnt adjust to the same angle and position my actual hands were in
we will continue to disagree with you about arms and bodies in VR. hands only is just dumb at this point
@@alsims2007 I'd expect nothing less.
Options, options, options.
I love seeing arms in VR, Saints and Sinners absolutely sold me.
Agreed I also hate hands only totally breaks my immersion
Absolutely disagree. There’s nothing more that ruins the immersion for me than something that is supposed to represent my body, and feels completely disconnected. Until VR gets body representation movement one to one, bodies, and VR will always feel like I’m controlling. A puppet
Had none of the technical problems you talk about. None.
But wasn't enjoying the game much until I watched a few 'pro combat tips'
for it (Substatica etc). Then it was *much* better experience, excellent in fact. Really enjoying the combat now.
But for fans of SOTC, I've found the first 2 Behemoths very underwhelming and overly scripted sadly. Hoping the last 2 are much better.
First off, I'm team arms, sorry 😂 Fullbody can be distracting at times if not implemented correctly, that i fully get. Stresslevel Zero did some magic in Bonelab in the guessing of the arm/elbowplacement. So its achievable. But, its clear that Skydance has brought over ALOT from S&S.
So this game, felt like saints and sinners only with more swords. You're this "buff" warrior supposedly with the worst stamina ever :P I kinda got thrown off by the "tiring"-vignetting around my vision and my arms turned into jello after swinging 3-4 times at an enemy. I bought this game without looking at any reviews. Because I thought it would be amazing. Turns out its ok-ish, but it feels too sluggish to fight. Alot has to do with the mismatch of arms and IRL arms. But also feel like I cant go HAM on the enemies as I'm restricted into this stamina-based system that I feel belongs in Saints and sinners and not this game. I'd much rather have more enemies on screen and be stronger, than fewer and beeing forced to parry and stuff.
I refunded this game,🤞hoping that will go through :P Maybe I'll come back to it. But very dissapointing after playing a masterpiece like Metro.
Still to this day, the only swordfighting, physics based game i thoroughly enjoy is Dungeons of Eternity. They've really nailed that.
Thats my unpopular opinion.
Now I remember never to watch your videos for vr reviews, thanks!
@@Sneaky_Tempest glad I could help.
I dont enjoy swordplay in vr also, main reason I didn't pick this one up. It does work so much better with ranged weapons. I loved Asgards wrath 2 harp weapon
Skydance is nOt a "triple A company" and this most definitely is nOt a "triple A game". This is objectively false. Even the Skydance devs would tell you they're not and this game is not nor was it ever going to be.
Since its Unreal Engine, the black intro screen is likely shader compilation but agree it would be super nice if the devs put a progress/loading bar there to show the player that aNYTHing is actually happening.
@@Cinnabuns2009 maybe I should have called it AAA advertising.
There's also nothing physical to convey that you need to use two hands to lift up a log in saints and sinners, your in-game arm becomes floppy and slow, it's clearly too heavy and requires two hands, I FEEL as if I'm struggling to hold it with 1 arm. I love the fact that this game has impact recoil, I hated that about assassin's creed, without that heft and reactions, it just becomes a waggle feat. I WANT to feel like I am struggling to rip my knife out of someone's skull, I find myself unconsciously making grunting as I struggle to pull the stuck weapon.
Great Video. I agree entirely with your comments about the insanity of attempting to render untracked avatar body parts. Yeah I'd love to have a full body in every game over just hands, but unfortunately, atm only the hands head and controllers are tracked, so they are the only true interface with your virtual world. Asgards Wrath 2 is just about the best attempt i've seen on Quest, but it's still nowhere near perfect. Compare these games to the Arizona Sunshine remake and there's no denying that at the moment, the disembodied hands are the best way to go.
I love this game but take me some hour to appreciate this mechanic and learn some tricks
I dont trust anyones opinion who plays games with vignette turned on.
Fair
I think people are too forgiving with vr games. The truth is every inconsistency whether it be graphical or physical will pull you out of the experience. They all add up to the point where you'd rather be playing a flat game.
I think you're right about this game bro I just refunded it. I do like arms in the games that have them they seem to be implemented well and they're probably shooter games so it's predictable where your arms will be.
Keep giving us your opinion bro
I at least agree with you on the arms thing. It's weird. Either go full body or just hands
Wow, I can't wait for the Thrill of the Fight 2 review where we bitch for 20 minutes on how boxing in VR can't work because your not actually punching someone.
:eyeroll 🙄
Uh oh.
6:35 I mean we do lol. But their expensive
I also don’t like having a body in vr , how can you do I’m the character yet giving the in game character a body that isn’t even tracked
Thanks again for your honesty. Most trusted man in VR.
Question: Did you like the sword play in Asgard's Wrath 2 more or less than Behemoth? That was the first game I thought it was done alright, partially because they gave you more options, so I was never using the sword for too long.
@@IanDeMartino I'm hearing that from a lot of people. But I honestly never made a review of that game. I skipped it at the time cause I was busy elsewhere.
I think its great!
A contrarian view point. Good to have opinions. The arm movement you dislike is down to Skydances' inverse kinematics implementation. The walking dead games suffered from the same.
Seems we think very differently of how VR should be. For me one of the great things about VR is that you don''t see your real hands so if you touch a wall and your in-game hand stops at the wall it really feels like you are touching it even if you can technically just put your real hand in the wall. For that same reason I don't mind if my arms don't fit my real arms exactly. It's like I don't expect the game to have my arms and hands exactly as I have them in real life, it's more like I control the VR body with my body and I have to adjust for when things in the game block my arms and stuff.
That said I don't think the combat is really good in this and I agree melee combat in VR is pretty jank. I used to really not like it until I played more sword and sorcery but this game has something weird going on, It feels like everything is a bit too wobbly when using 1 hand and with 2 hands the weapon moves in a strange way. Fought the first behemoth and wasn't really impressed with the combat. The thing looked really cool but the fight was underwhelming, hopefully the others are better.
Bringhurst bringing the hurt.
i like Blade and sorcery, that has a body and swords
I dislike floating hands
This game sounds like Call of the Mountain without the enormous amount of Sony polish. Hopefully they can improve it otherwise I'll wait for a sale.
Having played both cotm and I’ve played Behemoth on my pc tonight. Behemoth looks much better and is a much better game.
@Quest4Horror well that's good to know. I guess everyone has a different experience
So basically you have in game hand offset which does not match to your controller position? If so, this is the most annoying thing in VR games recently, they can't do proper match for some reason but won't give you option to fix it manually.
No, that is not it. The ARMS don't match your actual arms because the only thing being tracked is your hands. They guess the arms purely by hand position + IK.
@@amadeusk525 Ok thanks for explaining, I was afraid hands are off since that I understood this frase like you have hats on them. Arms are usually buggy, can be only predicted where should be without tracking but some game are doing it right way.
@@amadeusk525 Actually I tried it finally and he was right, hands are way off to players controller position so playing it you feel like you steering some other hands on stick.
I agree with almost everything you said. I was having my hopes up for another cool rpg the size of asgard`s wrath. But man games only seem to get worse and short. I really hoped this would have a main story of at least 30 hours. I will keep watching how this unfolds with patches but for now this is a big nono.
That roomscale boundary grid was killing me. Fix yo boundary, man! Unless you legit don't have room and then I guess we do what we gotta do. Interesting to hear your opinions on this. Seems to be that the community is pretty well divided between 'this game is a buggy pile of ass' to 'this game is GotY easily.' Kinda bummed to see it get such a polarized reception. I think I'm going to give it a month or two and check it out then. Maybe buy it physically on PSVR2 though that version seems to be in worse shape at the moment. Gonna go check out your Batman vid now.
@@frozenninja4030 oof. Good luck. Lol. I'm stuck in a small space because of temporary renovations.
Dude, why are you complaining about the arms of all things for 6 minutes when it really is not that big of an issue? Also, you claim that swords "just don't work". Clearly you have never played a VR game with actual physics based melee combat, like blade & sorcery, dungeons of eternity, legendary tales, etc. They do work, its just that they are hard to get right. Don't like it? Stick with other methods of combat. So yeah, half your review is complete bullshit, but the rest seems valid enough.
I never thought about it, but you're not wrong at all about the "VR body problem". I don't mind it myself, but as a smaller guy, my character has to bend his arms when mine are completely outstretched. I'm like a gorilla man or something.
I think if we actually want arms, someone needs to research actual natural arm movements and train the game engine to actually put the arms where most people would actually have them, then show the world what it actually looks like to have arms done right. Right now it seems like they just let the physics figure it out, which it never does.
I really enjoyed VR for a while, but over the past few years it has become really disappointing. 2024 was a breaking point for me. Batman didn't look worth playing for free much less to buy yet another HMD to play. I was never really "excited" about Behemoth but now that I've been off VR for a couple of months I really feel like something amazing is going to have to happen for me to want to get back in.
There doesn't have to be a debate about arms. It could totally be optional. That they don't take the time to make it optional shows they don't care about the poor clunky experience that arms and bodies become.
I feel like all those people who attack anyone who has an opinion are just in that place that I was for years, struggling to enjoy it so much as to be in denial of any honest criticism. Things will never get better until the developers start LISTENING to the criticism.
They can't keep creating content in a vacuum, or an echo chamber of sycophants telling them how wonderful everything is. VR is on its way to novelty/niche status, like the Rubik's Cube.
@@jackdiddley do you have access to PCVR? The cost of entry is high, but there are no less than 20 games I can play all day, that never get old, and that are visually stunning.
I don't like jank, I don't like bad mechanics, I don't like the body in Batman, I don't like the belt in Sniper Elite. Ha Ha! I am still curious about Behemoth, but since it's announcement, I have wondered how much game there would actually be beyond climbing up the big guys. Is just boss fight battles on steroids?
This is kind of disappointing also that some people are taking this one opinion without consulting other because even if in the end they believe it its never great to trust only the first source! If the game gets dragged down simply because some people were initially told it was bad and started hyper focusing on those detail then its less updates and fixes for everyone :(.
@@liambongioanni5781 I watched great games like Solaris and Death Lap get glowing reviews, just to tank a year later. These games have a half life of six months, and if developers insist on launching games with jank, broken mechanics, and half functional mechanics - expecting the audience to buy it before it's complete, then that's a hiccup on their end.
Creators get paid a commission when you buy a game. You can argue I'm wrong regarding the mechanics, but the smaller issues I discussed shouldn't have been there, and this video would have had better reception, a better commission rate, and I'd be typing less if I'd lied and not spoken my mind.
That's the thing. You guys are commenting constantly on the arms, which I said you would, and it culminates in "you're so negative", but the other things happened. You shouldn't be able to climb with one hand. Those are bad gameplay mechanics, and I'm done with this thing where I should have pulled a BMF saying exactly what you wanted to hear.
I don't believe anyone subscribes to my channel because they disagree vehemently. I'm not alone here.
@@bringhurstvryou spent almost half the video talking about arms
@Chrizton you spent the whole time listening to it.
I don't remember disliking any game as intensely as this. It's an undercooked, janky mess with truly bad mechanics.
Curious how the new update changed things up. I'll be jumping in again to check it out, but I'm doubtful.
I hated how Horizon Call of the mountain felt like this dumbed down version of a game. Pretty sure that they are making these AAA games like this so theyre playable for a very large audience and casual gamers just getting into VR...at least making it playable for them. It sucks because we are being held back by the weakest link. Vould also just be allotted budget. Regardless, its hard to go back from a 15x15 ft true 1 to 1 roomscale experience with Alyx, where even your CLOTHES have sound when you make movements through the space, to these games with simplified gameplay and cut corners. Youre honestly kinda bumming me out about the game though, lol. I was looking to buy it today but some of the things that you mention are things that I dont like either. The arm thing doesnt bother me though--its a matter of mentally and physically assuming the role of a virtual character in a virtual world, and not trying to cram actual reality onto the game....its like, reverse.
@@parallelsmoke7800 I mostly hate the retort that Alyx had more money and more developers, so we ask too much of the people making these new games.
Alyx is beautiful. It's nearly perfect. But it's not just because of the wild textures. Vertigo 2 was made by a handful of guys and it's brilliant. Lies Beneath did a lot with very little.
It's the small mechanics, the voiceovers and the story that makes a game great. And most of the time when someone replies like that it's because that can't bring themselves to say someone or something was lazy.
@@bringhurstvr Maybe I'll just get Vertigo 2 instead. Lol. Been eyeing that for a couple years at this point (played the first game and thought it was awesome).
@parallelsmoke7800 Vertigo 2 is one of the four best VR games ever made.
This is why you’re my favorite VR guy, you tell it like it is and you saved me some money that I can use to purchase 2024 flight simulator 😎. I’ll wait and see if they fix Behemoth issues in future updates.
watchi g your game vs others gameplay... i think your just bad at the game, dude. I just watched Wolf in vrs full video, and it didn't have any of that. the combat looked fluid and weighted.
Gamertag VR had similar issues. This dude and gamertag are the most honest reviewers I know of
That video is gameplay without seeing his arms relative to the footage. I'm sure I suck at the game, but the issues I'm talking about can't be represented in just gameplay footage.
And the sword play amounted to like 6 minutes of this episode. I doubt if climbing with one hand, controller drift, low resolution and janky arms are the result of me being an imbecile.
More likely, I just have higher standards, even if they're pie in the sky, and he's just made $500 in 8 hours through game sales.
Not watching this crap the game is fun I have it and just killed the giant bat from the clouds the combat is extremely good
At 70% completed what I'm seeing is a childish game ... maybe good for children and younger teenagers. The rubbery wet noodle wrists, the cartoonish swordplay and the weak story all add up to a AA game at best. The combat, the puzzles and the platforming are shallow and repetitive. VR deserves better than this.
Wow, that thumbnail is clickbait AF
@@TrevorJones1 you think so?
I think he forgot he was playing a game and thought he was supposed to be teleported into the game
Right, because this is flat screen and VR doesn't require anything more.
I am glad to hear other opinions on things even if I absolutely completely disagree with you on almost all fronts. The review does feel very negative of things that are now kind of consistent to what is the main opinion on VR games which I believe is important to help game devs diversify. But after hearing all that it seems like VR may just not be your thing because games seem to be going in this direction and people seem to be enjoying it! No shade to you glad to hear other opinions!
I can list 50 games off the top of my head that are absolute masterpieces, PCVR and Standalone alike. I don't like the direction it's going, but I've got a higher standard than most, it seems.
Or maybe just different taste! But like I said it seems VR is going in a direction you may not like. Anyways keep making videos even if I don't agree with them diversity is essential to create good things
I was extremely excited to buy this title, but much less enthusiastic after seeing this review and may save my cash and disappointment for something else. Thank you for the honest review.
Who cares wot you think
wot?
Earned my subscription
You thrive on negative feedback on batman VR? Why do you make content for the public if you pride in ignoring any feedback/info/thoughts the people watch you say? Why not just make your content private and only for yourself then
@@bearofthewest389 what else would I do but thrive? I'm not gonna change my mind and anyone bent on doing so begins with vitriol. That's not any place to begin.
I'm here to talk, not bend the knee to kids who are ticked off because they just bought a Quest 3S and I'm saying I don't like a game they were looking forward to.