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@@rq7035 i agree with you. My group is rolling PvE this time round. I was there for STVietnam on Grobbulus in 2019. No one needs to know what that feels like. (I'm sure it was tons worse on the imbalanced servers, grobbulus was very lucky in early classic wow because the server was balanced +/- 5%)
SOM did not change warlocks standing. This does not make lock any more desirable vs a full warrior roster. It's like everyone forgets we did this in SOM and the overall raid comp did not change. Lock is no more on or off the menu.
@@Average1212 realistically it wont affect the meta at all, but it is nice that a lot of classes that were 1 button spam because of debuff/buff limits can now utilize more of their toolkit without fucking over other people.
@@Grumpypu That and things like t3 priest being able to be used. I just hope the pally and warlocks out there don't think this means they will be wanted more than they were in vanilla, or that feral cat is now magically viable. This was done in SOM we know the result yet i'm seeing videos that somehow can't remember.
@@sile7764 Wrong i am already in a discord for a guild we are a no meta guild we take everyone and will work the way of the old days when no one knew anything about the game :) no 1 gunna be locked out of our raids night even if u play a meme spec
Me and a friend were talking about dual spec and instant mail last night and we both woke up to these blue notes today with a big ole smile in our faces. CLASSIC FRESH HYPE!!!
I think we don't know exactly how they are gonna implement the dual spec system. It could be that it'd used anywhere or maybe you have to be in a major city or at the class trainer. I guess we will have to wait and see. Now what I am really excited about is the buff/debuff limit removal. I can finally be a real resto druid, and maybe specs like affliction warlock are playable in raids now.
now we just need the Flight Path in Rebel Camp northern STV that was originally added in 2.3 (ZA Patch) it doesnt affect the game other than balancing the leveling, since horde allready has Grom'Gol
Great changes in my opinion. Instant mail is awesome and dual talent is awesome. I'm leveling as a Druid and this change was music to my ears, especially for TBC where i'll be resto for raiding/pvp and then Feral for general play.
Dual spec is huge ! I can imagine playing warrior and finally go PVP/PvE or DPS/TANK... this is so cool and will bring new player to wow classic for sure. I'm so hype !
You are absolutely right. Just like nobody is FORCED to use World Buffs in raids. And nobody is FORCED to use a single consumable inside raids. And nobody is FORCED to play Holy if they're a Paladin, they can play Ret & Prot. And nobody is FORCED to grind out Manual Crowd Pummelers if they play a Feral Druid. However, we all know how it is.
Not trying to sound edgey but duelspec lowers my interest by a ton. Vanilla just wasn't designed with that feature in mind, it's going to increase toxicity within groups and raids. Expectations to have this and that. Being immersed in your spec, partly due to it costing a lot to change it, to me, was the whole point of that era of the game. That leaves TBC as the remaining interest, I just wish they'd do TBC and Wrath Era servers too. Plenty would live on them forever, including myself.
100% agree. Now the dps warrior also needs the tank item the prot pally was looking for. He tanks sometimes with his second spec after... Priest are no longer unique; at all. Every priest can heal and has a shadow spec. Rogues will ALWAYS be in PVP spec and walk into raid in PvE spec. This is kinda meh since the player had to pick between raid spec or pvp spec. Not a fan of this. .. We need "meta raiding". 5 of each class in a 40 man raid and get 1 extra item on last boss.
@@KT-ti9bkI'm sorry but prot tanking is not a thing in vanilla. You can do dungeons sure but not raids, a dps warrior has better threat than prot pally. They're better off getting the gear. Why do we need to be unique, what would dual spec even do to uniqueness. You can have a healing spec and a smite spec or a PI spec. I feel like yall really never got to raid in vanilla at all. Or are stuck doing 8 hour molten cores
Dual spec: "guild demanded dual spec if you want to raid so you can preset 2 specs for best dps depending on each fight" or Dual spec: as a warrior, priest, druid, (any multi trio class) will be forced to have it in case if someone leaves. Dual spec: "buy it or dont expect to come to any raids even though you helped 150 guildmates hit 60 we dont care we dont wanna waste 10 seconds of our time."
3:40 - as long as that is a personal standard you hold to. don't let it become a thing where if someone hasn't payed for dual talents they don't get to raid.... the thing about vanilla raids are that they're EASY to clear.... the difference between a bad MC and a good MC is 20 to 30 minutes clear time...
okay NOW we're talking... getting rid of some of the attrition I feel doesn't shape the core gameplay has me actually kind of excited to play 1-60 again. on 2 characters which I can instant mail between
Do we know if we're gonna be able to aoe farm dungeons? I recall them adding some sort of diminishing return to snares at some point. Might be wrong. Do you know?
debuff limit will not increase raid dps at all, a hunter pressing SS doesnt make him a fury warrior. The things it will change on allaince is judgements on bosses, which for melee cleave does make a difference. Dots are still a dps loss for a warlock for example as well
So would this make shadow priest or lock more wanted for pve? I’m debating on both of those for mainly pvping just curious and which would u pick out of the two??
Warlocks will still be wanted but Dots are a DPS loss, will still be SB spam if you want to do the best damage. Shadow priests have mana issues still, but this cld just mean you bring 1 shadow priest instead of the 1 Shadoweaving healer. Debuff limit removed is just QoL cos its not so bad if you accidently use corruption, but u will likely still have a curse assignment Buff limit however changes life for healers a lot, they can do some DPS, use judgements, use hots, use PWS
This change happened in SOM, it does not make lock or priest any more viable in PVE(dps) the damage gap remains around the same as warriors get more buffs as well.
yo, been years since i played, but do you guys think the buff/debuff limit removal will change the meta? I have no idea on what to play. My heart says warrior as that was my original character, but I also had som much fun with a mage and i found aoe farming fun, but I also love shadow priest and warlock... can't decide... also dual spec is awesome, so i could go holy/shadow priest.... so hyped for classic again
Make Dual Spec available ONLY from Class Trainers...not in open World or inside Raids/Battlegrounds. I don't think players realize how unfun classic will be, it doesn't operate the same as SoD.
Shadow priests don't have issues healing while leveling, trust me. Yeah, you will heal better if you aren't shadow, but it's not needed at all and it's overkill. On top of that, you don't level as shadow until lvl 40ish, other specs are better until then. As for paladins, leveling as two-hander ret is one of the worst ways to level a paladin in the first place, so dual spec while leveling only helps people who have no idea what they are doing. The two things dual spec will achieve in vanilla are to make the content easier than it already is and to potentially allow healers who want to grind something do it more easily. But realistically speaking, your guild will force you to have 2 different healing specs for raids (especially priests), so that's moot. The debuff limit removal will help less than people think. It won't make affliction locks viable because they can't do as much damage as when shadow bolt spamming anyway, the dots are a net dps loss. At least as far as I remember, I might be wrong on that. Even if affli locks are finally viable, that's basically the only spec that will benefit, every other non-viable specs have different problems that aren't related to the debuff limit.
Leveled a bunch of paladins in classic/hardcore. Ret is the best spec till 40. SoC dps is insane at 20-40 lvl range, because it scales with your weapon dmg and you get a verigans fist at early 20s. And it’s much more easier to find gear with lots of str on it (bs gear, deadmines q legs, etc) which helps you increase your melee and seal proc damage. But after 40… yeah, it kinda falls of and I would go holy/prot anyway I will probably use dual spec for my deep prot build for farming and tanking dungeons at 60
@@AlexM-zj8qw gearing for str is your first mistake. Int/stam is the best but it's expensive, so spirit/stam is your second best choice (you still need some int gear, though). You go with the fastest one-hander you can find or *fast* two-hander (depending on situation) and spec *holy* to get more int and aoe damage early, then continue onto prot. Ret is complete trash in vanilla, especially for leveling. There are exceptions if you want to just grind mobs and do 0 questing at all, but that's another discussion entirely.
@ yeah, I watched pallytime guide about spirit/stam gear with fast weapons and SoR. I tried it out and it’s really good for killing 2-3 mobs at once. But 1v1 fights are still taking ages compared to ret build imo. Plus, when I was doing self found hardcore run it was much more easier to obtain good str gear from quests and blacksmithing. I guess both specs are viable before 40, but after that ret kinda sucks alot
I like these changes. Obviously we don't want too much of SOD in here but...we just cannot play vanilla with vanilla systems truly anymore because of how much the skill level has gone up vs 2004. I don't expect SOD runes but some tweaks to talents so that If i wanna raid on a spec that currently is non-viable because of mana issues, I would appreciate that. Also, I would prefer summoning stones, 30 min hearth, not just dual-spec but quad-spec, instant mail between guild members, one GM per server, etc.
NO this is what happens when people ask for changes. "well what about just this small change, and this small change, and this one, and this, this, this, etc" IT NEVER ENDS and it ALWAYS ends up being hybrids asking for """small""" tweaks to their class like fkn Crusader Strike. Are you for real? seriously just go play SoD. it has everything you want and more. stop this bs
Not super excited about the dual spec. It takes away from each characters uniqueness. You should have to figure out how to optimize your character with your given build. Not just press a button and now you are a perfect pvp spec. Also going to make it way more annoying to get loot as you basically double the competition. Also takes away the excitement of respecting your talents… It’s cool to have it for a lot of reasons but these are the things that seem small that added up to make retail suck.
Make dual talent 500g and gold sink aspect of changing talents is mostly fixed... I suppose not many people change talents so much to exceed 500g for it over the course of vanilla
I swear if they ever make a classic plus with the same team that makes sod and som blizzard classic wow could end altogether. It will be that bad. It will drive more people to turtle wow than to retail. They need to focus on stuff like this. Fresh, fresh with minor changes, tbc, wrath, more era servers for all versions. Thats it
I think your thoughts on specs during leveling is pretty off by a mile to be honest. You never need talents when healing in dungeons during leveling. Swap on some int gear and you are more than fine. And for shadow priests, all you need to do is to turn off shadow form and you are good. Dual specs is more of a max level thing. And I hope that is where its implemented.
Dual Spec is great, but being able to use at any location with no CD is really bad. Should only be allowed at town and with a big cast time / cd. Otherwise people are gonna be running multiple specs for a single raid which goes againts what vanilla is
And what class will change what spec into what spec in the Middle of the raid and for what reason? There is optimal spec and u wont go for example from Shadow priest to holy (cause of gear) or from Furry Warr to Prot etc. What are u talking about? Give me 1 example where this is bad? This was made so that people dont need to grind 50 golds cause without GDKP 50 golds will be like on era 800 golds.
@@chrisandreas3142 - Healers will swap to dps specs depending on the boss/trash - DPS will swap between AOE & single target specs constantly - And what do you mean you won't from Fury to Prot ? Offtanks will be constantly swapping from DPS to tank specs - And like I said "Dual Spec is great". I just want players to only be able to change specs at the trainer and with a big CD/cast time if possible.
Do you not remember SOM, It amazes me that people have this short of a memory. Not only will the raids not be cleared in 5 min but the ideal raid comp did not change at all.
@@Average1212 didn’t play SoM but debuff limit is to OP for vanilla, i dont understand how is this good thing. Like i said, speedrunners will MORE than half their time with this.
@@chrisandreas3142 SOM was literally vanilla without debuf limit and a couple other QOL items (that is where they tested the new ranking system) You can literally go look at the logs. It really doesn't make much of a difference as the meta did not shift as the improved "other" dps still didn't do enough to replace warriors. Raids were shortened by a few %. Like I said you can go check the logs. You had best look at what was in SOM while you are at it.
Dual spec is a TERRIBLE idea.. this is becoming retail minus all over again.. Back to everyone being able to do everything again at every moment and zero character identity
Not true, duel spec was always a classic experience. The only difference is you don't have to spend 50g each time, it's not like people weren't spending the 50g. You will need to roll on whatever class you're currently playing with obviously
@ In real classic you have to see your trainer to respec, you can’t just do it anywhere you want in the world at any given moment. Hence making everyone capable of doing everything at all times. Dual spec was introduced in retail. So this is becoming retail minus. You’re talking to an og classic player in the mid 2000s and a 2019 classic player as well.
@@JFK47x outside of a handful of guilds people were not respecking mid raid for different bosses. It isn't rocket science to see how this changes the entire classic dynamic. First available raid dps per boss is massively changed as people swap. Second: Economy, respecing was a major gold sink, this gold will still exist so expect Black lotus to be a fortune. Are there benefits? Sure I can now play priest the way I want to. However it is simply disingenuous to pretend there won't also be significant downsides to DS being in the game.
its funny because there is already a dual spec in classic with no cd, you just pay 50g for it every time... and as a paladin i have to say, it sucked to change specs all the time because i wanted to have some fun as ret pvp'ing but had to heal in raids as healer. 50g all the time... and you have a dual spec.
With the changes are resto druid better with the changes because of buff limit? New to classic wow but want to level all the healers to 60 was gonna do druid first wondering if this makes resto druids better as heard priest and holy paladin to a lesser extent is better until TBC where things even out?
good change but terrible to delay, its like they want their cake and eat it too. to appease the purists for awhile then let the rest of us enjoy our time at a later date.
Fk viability, it will turn out to be EASY mode. I was Mad when they said 16 debuff slot instead of original 12. Now with this you can clear raids in LITERALLY 10 minutes.
4:58 ... wait wait wait... wait a minute... are they saying dual specc is innately unlocked for everyone? they didn't say that did they? and that's never been how dual specc works anywhere(classic)... you have to buy it ...
Make no Mistake, People can now "Enjoy" PVP With theyr Raid Char, So Fury Warr can be Arms for Alterac... !Everyone! will be Rank14 cuz its literally a joke now. Without Buff Limits the Powercreep will be even more of a Joke btw.
@@gabes.1882 not SOD, im talking about SOM season of mastery, the one released after the 2019 classic. It was an accelerated vanilla with some changes.
I like how it feels like they listen to by bug reports on the PTR xD the zeps where broken reported it they fixed it, messaged again saying all it good but maybe instant mail too? and here it is xD
Anyone on EU going to make a guild that will actually be chill in terms of leveling but still going for raids? I do wanna try get bis for the first time in my WoW life but I have work and can't grind 8 hours a day, I want to play with people who don't need to rush.
Is all good and such but now with dual spec there is 0 gold sink for players after they get their mounts. will be so much gold on the server. Also raids will be even more trivial with debuff removal :P
Druids need more than dual talent and hunter pets are not good enougt when most have not any abilites except ,cower ,bite ,claw if the wotkl ,cata ,bc pets talent are to strong - then make them half of 1/3 as strong or duration
Hell yeah, finally i can be the shitty tank i always wanted to be, and heal when needed, also i will always be using serpent sting on each boss forever and ever
No we don't need to make specs more viable. This is vanilla and shouldn't be changed. It's an easy game and you can join a casual guild that allows non-meta specs
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These are the types of changes we want to see in classic plus
yeah in classic plus, not ERA xD
@@amberleaf42069 this isnt era
This is classic plus
we got this stuff in SoD already , the real classic + beta
Something else to consider: Now when roaming the world people will more likely be in their special pvp spec.
Anyone doing a PvP server gets what they deserve at this point
@@rq7035 i agree with you. My group is rolling PvE this time round. I was there for STVietnam on Grobbulus in 2019. No one needs to know what that feels like. (I'm sure it was tons worse on the imbalanced servers, grobbulus was very lucky in early classic wow because the server was balanced +/- 5%)
@@rq7035most fun way to play classic
Looks like Warlock's back on the menu boys!
He was always on the menu with any spec
SOM did not change warlocks standing. This does not make lock any more desirable vs a full warrior roster. It's like everyone forgets we did this in SOM and the overall raid comp did not change. Lock is no more on or off the menu.
@@Average1212 realistically it wont affect the meta at all, but it is nice that a lot of classes that were 1 button spam because of debuff/buff limits can now utilize more of their toolkit without fucking over other people.
@@Grumpypu That and things like t3 priest being able to be used.
I just hope the pally and warlocks out there don't think this means they will be wanted more than they were in vanilla, or that feral cat is now magically viable.
This was done in SOM we know the result yet i'm seeing videos that somehow can't remember.
Finally i can play Holy + Shadow Priest on Classic at the same time!
Shadow can heal dungeons normal without problem and in raids just go shadow if you like it.
@@chrisandreas3142 you know it, I know it, nobody will take you to raids as shadow (mostly). Same with ele, enha
@@sile7764 Wrong i am already in a discord for a guild we are a no meta guild we take everyone and will work the way of the old days when no one knew anything about the game :) no 1 gunna be locked out of our raids night even if u play a meme spec
Me and a friend were talking about dual spec and instant mail last night and we both woke up to these blue notes today with a big ole smile in our faces. CLASSIC FRESH HYPE!!!
Cring
I think we don't know exactly how they are gonna implement the dual spec system. It could be that it'd used anywhere or maybe you have to be in a major city or at the class trainer. I guess we will have to wait and see. Now what I am really excited about is the buff/debuff limit removal. I can finally be a real resto druid, and maybe specs like affliction warlock are playable in raids now.
They removed it in sod and it didn't make much of a difference. Still nice to be able to press all your classes buttons now
Disc / Shadow priest in classic finally my dreams come true. So nice for those of us who heal everyone to level cap to be able to switch it up
I wanted to play disc/holy for PvE and raid content, and shadow for PvP so I'm really excited
now we just need the Flight Path in Rebel Camp northern STV that was originally added in 2.3 (ZA Patch) it doesnt affect the game other than balancing the leveling, since horde allready has Grom'Gol
Thats our teritory like Badlands.
The only thing I really want is nameplate distance to be increased to retail level.
-》Make Dual Spec available ONLY via the Class Trainers...not in open World or inside Raids/Battlegrounds. Will hurt the vanilla experience otherwise.
Yeah, i also think that's how they should implement it
Agree
Good idea that keeps it true classic
How will that hurt vanilla?
So when i want to go to let’s say Maraudon, i would first need to go to Org and than back?
@@chrisandreas3142we’re agreeing with you king
Great changes in my opinion. Instant mail is awesome and dual talent is awesome. I'm leveling as a Druid and this change was music to my ears, especially for TBC where i'll be resto for raiding/pvp and then Feral for general play.
Dual spec is huge ! I can imagine playing warrior and finally go PVP/PvE or DPS/TANK... this is so cool and will bring new player to wow classic for sure.
I'm so hype !
You will not find more groups than normal. All dungeons can be done as your non tank / healer spec.
Not being able to transfer to the PvP server is severely hamstringing people with jobs and lives. Terrible decision
Dual spec is making me reconsider my main to level. So excited this has been announced
Nobody will be FORCED to use dual spec. If you are in a guild that demands it, leave that guild.
lol, why
You are absolutely right.
Just like nobody is FORCED to use World Buffs in raids.
And nobody is FORCED to use a single consumable inside raids.
And nobody is FORCED to play Holy if they're a Paladin, they can play Ret & Prot.
And nobody is FORCED to grind out Manual Crowd Pummelers if they play a Feral Druid.
However, we all know how it is.
pug or play with similar minded players uf u're going with a min/max guild it will be mandatory
Trying to hyper-narrow the way that term is used is the worst counterpoint there is honestly
As a Tank I never had to use world buff in Raid cause the World buff is inside us all
Not trying to sound edgey but duelspec lowers my interest by a ton. Vanilla just wasn't designed with that feature in mind, it's going to increase toxicity within groups and raids. Expectations to have this and that. Being immersed in your spec, partly due to it costing a lot to change it, to me, was the whole point of that era of the game.
That leaves TBC as the remaining interest, I just wish they'd do TBC and Wrath Era servers too. Plenty would live on them forever, including myself.
Shush
100% agree. Now the dps warrior also needs the tank item the prot pally was looking for. He tanks sometimes with his second spec after...
Priest are no longer unique; at all. Every priest can heal and has a shadow spec.
Rogues will ALWAYS be in PVP spec and walk into raid in PvE spec. This is kinda meh since the player had to pick between raid spec or pvp spec.
Not a fan of this. ..
We need "meta raiding". 5 of each class in a 40 man raid and get 1 extra item on last boss.
@@KT-ti9bkI'm sorry but prot tanking is not a thing in vanilla. You can do dungeons sure but not raids, a dps warrior has better threat than prot pally. They're better off getting the gear.
Why do we need to be unique, what would dual spec even do to uniqueness. You can have a healing spec and a smite spec or a PI spec.
I feel like yall really never got to raid in vanilla at all. Or are stuck doing 8 hour molten cores
@ you must be new or retarded to miss the point so hard. Either way I hope your not on my faction coming up because people like you make me sick.
Dual spec: "guild demanded dual spec if you want to raid so you can preset 2 specs for best dps depending on each fight" or
Dual spec: as a warrior, priest, druid, (any multi trio class) will be forced to have it in case if someone leaves.
Dual spec: "buy it or dont expect to come to any raids even though you helped 150 guildmates hit 60 we dont care we dont wanna waste 10 seconds of our time."
thats easy, find a new guild
The whole consumable/world buff situation still leaves the game unplayable.
Do you thibk with debuff removal, meme spec like enhancement sham will be ok in raid ?
Or doting warlock ?
These are the types of changes that classic+ should focus on! Also, remove cockroach agro while we are at it...
3:40 - as long as that is a personal standard you hold to. don't let it become a thing where if someone hasn't payed for dual talents they don't get to raid....
the thing about vanilla raids are that they're EASY to clear.... the difference between a bad MC and a good MC is 20 to 30 minutes clear time...
Instant Mail and dual talents are a huge W.
But changing specs outside of cities is a big no no. Shouldnt be raid meta.
okay NOW we're talking... getting rid of some of the attrition I feel doesn't shape the core gameplay has me actually kind of excited to play 1-60 again. on 2 characters which I can instant mail between
Do we know if we're gonna be able to aoe farm dungeons? I recall them adding some sort of diminishing return to snares at some point. Might be wrong. Do you know?
Do you think they will have to increase boss HP as a result of allowing limitless debuffs?
Have to? No. Will they? Potentially.
oh no, no buff limit, everyones dps is increased by 0.5%, gotta increase the bosses health by 50%
debuff limit will not increase raid dps at all, a hunter pressing SS doesnt make him a fury warrior. The things it will change on allaince is judgements on bosses, which for melee cleave does make a difference. Dots are still a dps loss for a warlock for example as well
debuff limit on boss is ok, but buff cap should be in the game. i cba popping 30 consumes every raid
@@MrCallumDennisthere’s no way to know if dotting as lock is a dps loss until the game and raids are cleared that way
They better make this dual spec very restrictive. They are already going against their wors with these changes
So would this make shadow priest or lock more wanted for pve? I’m debating on both of those for mainly pvping just curious and which would u pick out of the two??
Following this comment
Warlocks will still be wanted but Dots are a DPS loss, will still be SB spam if you want to do the best damage. Shadow priests have mana issues still, but this cld just mean you bring 1 shadow priest instead of the 1 Shadoweaving healer.
Debuff limit removed is just QoL cos its not so bad if you accidently use corruption, but u will likely still have a curse assignment
Buff limit however changes life for healers a lot, they can do some DPS, use judgements, use hots, use PWS
This change happened in SOM, it does not make lock or priest any more viable in PVE(dps) the damage gap remains around the same as warriors get more buffs as well.
Quality of life changes, this is actually huge.
I’m happy! I’m even more excited to play now. This just makes the game better!
yo, been years since i played, but do you guys think the buff/debuff limit removal will change the meta? I have no idea on what to play. My heart says warrior as that was my original character, but I also had som much fun with a mage and i found aoe farming fun, but I also love shadow priest and warlock... can't decide... also dual spec is awesome, so i could go holy/shadow priest.... so hyped for classic again
Make Dual Spec available ONLY from Class Trainers...not in open World or inside Raids/Battlegrounds.
I don't think players realize how unfun classic will be, it doesn't operate the same as SoD.
Shadow priests don't have issues healing while leveling, trust me. Yeah, you will heal better if you aren't shadow, but it's not needed at all and it's overkill. On top of that, you don't level as shadow until lvl 40ish, other specs are better until then. As for paladins, leveling as two-hander ret is one of the worst ways to level a paladin in the first place, so dual spec while leveling only helps people who have no idea what they are doing. The two things dual spec will achieve in vanilla are to make the content easier than it already is and to potentially allow healers who want to grind something do it more easily. But realistically speaking, your guild will force you to have 2 different healing specs for raids (especially priests), so that's moot.
The debuff limit removal will help less than people think. It won't make affliction locks viable because they can't do as much damage as when shadow bolt spamming anyway, the dots are a net dps loss. At least as far as I remember, I might be wrong on that. Even if affli locks are finally viable, that's basically the only spec that will benefit, every other non-viable specs have different problems that aren't related to the debuff limit.
Leveled a bunch of paladins in classic/hardcore. Ret is the best spec till 40. SoC dps is insane at 20-40 lvl range, because it scales with your weapon dmg and you get a verigans fist at early 20s.
And it’s much more easier to find gear with lots of str on it (bs gear, deadmines q legs, etc) which helps you increase your melee and seal proc damage. But after 40… yeah, it kinda falls of and I would go holy/prot anyway
I will probably use dual spec for my deep prot build for farming and tanking dungeons at 60
@@AlexM-zj8qw gearing for str is your first mistake. Int/stam is the best but it's expensive, so spirit/stam is your second best choice (you still need some int gear, though). You go with the fastest one-hander you can find or *fast* two-hander (depending on situation) and spec *holy* to get more int and aoe damage early, then continue onto prot. Ret is complete trash in vanilla, especially for leveling. There are exceptions if you want to just grind mobs and do 0 questing at all, but that's another discussion entirely.
@ yeah, I watched pallytime guide about spirit/stam gear with fast weapons and SoR. I tried it out and it’s really good for killing 2-3 mobs at once. But 1v1 fights are still taking ages compared to ret build imo. Plus, when I was doing self found hardcore run it was much more easier to obtain good str gear from quests and blacksmithing. I guess both specs are viable before 40, but after that ret kinda sucks alot
I like these changes. Obviously we don't want too much of SOD in here but...we just cannot play vanilla with vanilla systems truly anymore because of how much the skill level has gone up vs 2004. I don't expect SOD runes but some tweaks to talents so that If i wanna raid on a spec that currently is non-viable because of mana issues, I would appreciate that. Also, I would prefer summoning stones, 30 min hearth, not just dual-spec but quad-spec, instant mail between guild members, one GM per server, etc.
So what exactly is dual spec? 2 specs of the same class? Or 2 specs from different classes?
Joker😂
Great changes
Dual talent is a must
Good news
If only they Slight make Elem shaman, enh shaman, ret paladin, balance druid just slightly more valuable
NO
this is what happens when people ask for changes. "well what about just this small change, and this small change, and this one, and this, this, this, etc" IT NEVER ENDS
and it ALWAYS ends up being hybrids asking for """small""" tweaks to their class like fkn Crusader Strike. Are you for real?
seriously just go play SoD. it has everything you want and more. stop this bs
Sit down @@sproosemoose285
Not super excited about the dual spec. It takes away from each characters uniqueness. You should have to figure out how to optimize your character with your given build. Not just press a button and now you are a perfect pvp spec. Also going to make it way more annoying to get loot as you basically double the competition.
Also takes away the excitement of respecting your talents…
It’s cool to have it for a lot of reasons but these are the things that seem small that added up to make retail suck.
Respeccing talents for 100g every week is not an exciting thing. Join groups that roll loot MS>OS this isn't a new thiglng
Stop crying dualspec is insanely good and allows for more gameplay.
@@TheWowzz I’ve been thinking about it more and I’m cool with it. Makes me want to roll priest.
Make dual talent 500g and gold sink aspect of changing talents is mostly fixed... I suppose not many people change talents so much to exceed 500g for it over the course of vanilla
I think Dual Spec will be like in TBC and therefore you won't be able to change specs anywhere
And this is how little by little vanilla wow will be turned into retail
I swear if they ever make a classic plus with the same team that makes sod and som blizzard classic wow could end altogether. It will be that bad. It will drive more people to turtle wow than to retail. They need to focus on stuff like this. Fresh, fresh with minor changes, tbc, wrath, more era servers for all versions. Thats it
I think your thoughts on specs during leveling is pretty off by a mile to be honest. You never need talents when healing in dungeons during leveling. Swap on some int gear and you are more than fine. And for shadow priests, all you need to do is to turn off shadow form and you are good.
Dual specs is more of a max level thing. And I hope that is where its implemented.
Don't do this to me Blizzard, I have kids and family!
(actually not, bring me that Classic!)
These are great changes and made me even more excited to play!!!
Pumped, dual spec is a game changer. Planning ele/resto
It's a very bad thing if they don't do it right. it could ruin raiding
I was ready to level up alts of the same class for additional specs. I guess I was the only one.
Where does it said you can change spec in the middle of the raid ?
Dual Spec is great, but being able to use at any location with no CD is really bad. Should only be allowed at town and with a big cast time / cd. Otherwise people are gonna be running multiple specs for a single raid which goes againts what vanilla is
How is that against vanilla
I 100000 percent agree. Shoukd be at trainers only
And what class will change what spec into what spec in the Middle of the raid and for what reason?
There is optimal spec and u wont go for example from Shadow priest to holy (cause of gear) or from Furry Warr to Prot etc.
What are u talking about?
Give me 1 example where this is bad?
This was made so that people dont need to grind 50 golds cause without GDKP 50 golds will be like on era 800 golds.
no its not stfu
@@chrisandreas3142
- Healers will swap to dps specs depending on the boss/trash
- DPS will swap between AOE & single target specs constantly
- And what do you mean you won't from Fury to Prot ? Offtanks will be constantly swapping from DPS to tank specs
- And like I said "Dual Spec is great". I just want players to only be able to change specs at the trainer and with a big CD/cast time if possible.
are they gonna keep the boosting restictions and aoe farming in dungeons ??#
Changes I'd like, no world buffs in raids...
Bro, with limit debuf game will turn out to be retail. Wtf?
We can go LITERALLY 2 healers, 2 tanks and 36 warlocks and finish raid in 5 minutes.
Do you not remember SOM, It amazes me that people have this short of a memory. Not only will the raids not be cleared in 5 min but the ideal raid comp did not change at all.
@@Average1212 didn’t play SoM but debuff limit is to OP for vanilla, i dont understand how is this good thing.
Like i said, speedrunners will MORE than half their time with this.
@@chrisandreas3142 SOM was literally vanilla without debuf limit and a couple other QOL items (that is where they tested the new ranking system)
You can literally go look at the logs. It really doesn't make much of a difference as the meta did not shift as the improved "other" dps still didn't do enough to replace warriors.
Raids were shortened by a few %. Like I said you can go check the logs. You had best look at what was in SOM while you are at it.
Dual spec is a TERRIBLE idea.. this is becoming retail minus all over again.. Back to everyone being able to do everything again at every moment and zero character identity
Not true, duel spec was always a classic experience. The only difference is you don't have to spend 50g each time, it's not like people weren't spending the 50g. You will need to roll on whatever class you're currently playing with obviously
@ In real classic you have to see your trainer to respec, you can’t just do it anywhere you want in the world at any given moment. Hence making everyone capable of doing everything at all times. Dual spec was introduced in retail. So this is becoming retail minus. You’re talking to an og classic player in the mid 2000s and a 2019 classic player as well.
@@JFK47x outside of a handful of guilds people were not respecking mid raid for different bosses. It isn't rocket science to see how this changes the entire classic dynamic.
First available raid dps per boss is massively changed as people swap.
Second: Economy, respecing was a major gold sink, this gold will still exist so expect Black lotus to be a fortune.
Are there benefits? Sure I can now play priest the way I want to.
However it is simply disingenuous to pretend there won't also be significant downsides to DS being in the game.
I hope they add mounts account Wide in classic era and classic fresh if u get a mount drop on main char you can also use it on the alt
Can we choose not to go to tbc?
Negative
Yes. Just stop playing at 60
Blizzard has not said anything about this so the answer is not negative. It’s we don’t know.
@@gamingod2137 you will go to outland and you will like it.
@@SI-hf4di you will go to Outland and you will like it.
its funny because there is already a dual spec in classic with no cd, you just pay 50g for it every time... and as a paladin i have to say, it sucked to change specs all the time because i wanted to have some fun as ret pvp'ing but had to heal in raids as healer. 50g all the time... and you have a dual spec.
With the changes are resto druid better with the changes because of buff limit? New to classic wow but want to level all the healers to 60 was gonna do druid first wondering if this makes resto druids better as heard priest and holy paladin to a lesser extent is better until TBC where things even out?
aw just saw question already asked and answered :)
My number one desire is new race models.
well i can understand dualspec makes sence since as a holypaladin you cant do shit outside of raid/dungeon
good change but terrible to delay, its like they want their cake and eat it too. to appease the purists for awhile then let the rest of us enjoy our time at a later date.
Will we get perma-tbc though? Thats what will get me to come back.
removing the debuff limit will definitely help increase the viability of certain classes. Affliction locks especially
Fk viability, it will turn out to be EASY mode.
I was Mad when they said 16 debuff slot instead of original 12.
Now with this you can clear raids in LITERALLY 10 minutes.
@@chrisandreas3142 vs's clearing it in 20mins? game is super ez regardless people just playing for simplicity... cry more.
@@dandoge8999 go play retail and Fortnite little one.
They just have to touch Era. How is it that hard?
Love the QoL updates. Now, if only we could get Classic achievements.
4:58 ... wait wait wait... wait a minute... are they saying dual specc is innately unlocked for everyone? they didn't say that did they? and that's never been how dual specc works anywhere(classic)... you have to buy it ...
Yes, no need to buy it.
Will tier 0.5 an earnest proposition quest be available in phase 1? Does anyone know please
Dire maul not out on launch. .5 will be gatekept
Why are you so confident that dual spec will work inside raid?
Wonder if we Might get an updated Tier gear for all talents specs
Not all warriors are good tanks...
Dual spec will be released later on. So will propability Not be available in leveling phase..
Make no Mistake, People can now "Enjoy" PVP With theyr Raid Char, So Fury Warr can be Arms for Alterac...
!Everyone! will be Rank14 cuz its literally a joke now. Without Buff Limits the Powercreep will be even more of a Joke btw.
Great changes. We need the removal of boosting as well.
This is a massive W. Fresh Hype!
Dual spec? That shouldn't be in, that's going to be very toxic. Not good.
So will druid heals be more competitive or will it stay rank 4 healing touch spam lol
As someone who never played a Resto Druid, I can say: Yes.
they will be as effective as they were in SOM.........
@@Average1212 I didn't play SoD past phase 1 so I really don't know
@@gabes.1882 not SOD, im talking about SOM season of mastery, the one released after the 2019 classic.
It was an accelerated vanilla with some changes.
@@Average1212 ohhh
Hell yeah there is no positive to debuff limit glad theyre removing it
I like how it feels like they listen to by bug reports on the PTR xD the zeps where broken reported it they fixed it, messaged again saying all it good but maybe instant mail too? and here it is xD
Is it known when we get dual spec and at what cost ?
when: at a later date
Cost: undisclosed
U should onky be able to swap specs if ylur in a major city though. That would be more in vibe of classic
Nice to see dual spec
Lets go boys
Anyone on EU going to make a guild that will actually be chill in terms of leveling but still going for raids?
I do wanna try get bis for the first time in my WoW life but I have work and can't grind 8 hours a day, I want to play with people who don't need to rush.
Is all good and such but now with dual spec there is 0 gold sink for players after they get their mounts. will be so much gold on the server. Also raids will be even more trivial with debuff removal :P
Good changes! Can't wait!
BLACK LOTUS BEING MORE THEN YOUR LVL 60 MOUNT!!!! THE BLACK LOTUS BOTS!!!!
Classic is just TBC waiting room for me.
Now resto druids will be god tier healers in raids
were trey god tier in SOM.......... the same change happened there. Short answer: no it did not effect the healing ranks
it all seems nice in theory but in practice lots of the changes take away from what vanilla makes so great.
Druids need more than dual talent and hunter pets are not good enougt when most have not any abilites except ,cower ,bite ,claw if the wotkl ,cata ,bc pets talent are to strong - then make them half of 1/3 as strong or duration
I didn't want to play but these changes made me think
What us debuff buff limit
Hell yeah, finally i can be the shitty tank i always wanted to be, and heal when needed, also i will always be using serpent sting on each boss forever and ever
They don’t need to add new abilities as much as they just need to tweak the numbers to make more specs viable
Agreed. Everyone has min maxed the game to exhaustion. Nobody will even sway away from the meta talent specs much less entire trees and build
No we don't need to make specs more viable. This is vanilla and shouldn't be changed. It's an easy game and you can join a casual guild that allows non-meta specs
I would have preferred no changes, but this is fine. Let’s hope it’s not just another changes->wow token deal.
not having the wow token is the only no changes Im 150% in favor of.
wow...impressive new technological advancements.
Serpent sting ftw!!!
i kind of hope that this turns into classic plus lol at least with tbc classic.
Don't almost all priests level as shadow priests?
They should be as you can heal up to LBRS as shadow with out an issue.
Dual Wield at a later date? Stupid... Just add it ffs.
These are perfect changes
Warriors will just have 2 dps specs lol