A Ricky Tinez video always does 2 things for me. Fills me with understanding and knowledge while simultaneously bringing me the calm! Thanks Ricky l! You’re the bees knees. Cheers.
@@Leviathan-mj8gi Totally agree...when I was analogue synth hunting...I bought and returned so many of them at a similar price point...and the Peak was without a doubt...the best of the bunch. Easy to use, intuitive, fun, creative...LOVE THAT THING!
Thank you for sharing your knowledge Rick 🙏 I totally agree with your viewpoint on sustain in the amplitude envelop context. What’s interesting is that when I started it was the opposite way around, I couldn’t understand the use of decay. And as to answer your question, there’s few things that have sustain: the sound of the wind in some places where it never rests, waterfalls, rivers, etc. As for insects, if you spend time in the countryside of any warm region, the cicadas are your best answer.
Yesssssssss! I'd call it a logically inspired dive into envelopes. One of the most useful explanations about one of the trickiest yet super necessary adjustment on any sound. Actually preferred AD envelopes for a long time until I really knew how to use ADSR, this is the video I needed a loooong time ago
In my experience .envelopes are a rabbit hole you don't want to leave. They are just so powerful and can be used to do so many things. Lately I have been running my envelopes through my S&H modules which has made the rabbit hole even deeper lol
Ong that last little section might have convinced me to buy a Peak. That bass is RAW. Thx for doing that all the other demos of this thing are all gussied up in reverb, which also sounds great, but good to know it’s got that beef
bowed instruments have sustain, but the biggest thing that people forget about bowed or stringed instruments is that while they have sustain, they also have INCREDIBLY diverse dynamic control based on how hard or soft you pull or push the bow, how much rosin you use for your bow, whether you're pushing or pulling in the first place - dry sustain by itself with no dynamics is incredibly boring
yeah, as someone who has spent my entire life moving around the string family and later refinding my love for music through synths, sustain on a physical instrument and sustain on a synth are so fundamentally different that calling the same thing is more cause of confussion than anything else.
for me it's always been that quest to turn any synth or keyboard into the most expressive instrument I can make it, a constant effort to make the synth better convey me, my heart and expression lives in the envelope and filter, velocity/attack and aftertouch
I love hearing/seeing someone talk about the finer points of sound design, even if it's just rambling. :D I do think a lot of newer sound designers/synthesists forget the importance of tremolo, vibrato, and filter lfo modulation.
Wind and string instruments have sustain. String players can sustain as long as they want by bowing back and forth. Wind players have a technique called circular breathing to hold a note for an insane amount of time! And a great vocal example using the same technique is A Lovely Day by Bill Withers!
@@Leviathan-mj8gi and sustaining a note forever vocally as a choir was how harmony started in european music in the middle ages. bagpipes also are of the oldest family of instruments tracing back to neolithic and they are full sustain
This is one of my favorite videos you've ever made. Such a simple topic, envelopes, and the versatility they have. And then in comes this just massive, filthy FM jam at the end. You're the man Ricky.
I already fell in love with the Peak since Mylar Melodies video.. but this.... THIS.... is... EPIC! Have been searching for similar good video's and none matched Mylars, until now.. Thnx Ricky!
Thanks for this video. I would LOVE to see more sound design specific videos from you. Perhaps even a course on sound design. I think this is the biggest area that people can benefit from and without accessibility to teachers, it becomes a very difficult entry point for most. There are plenty of videos out there about "how to make this sound" and while it shows you how to make said sound, the focus is on the result and not what it took to achieve the result. Where as this video was more open ended and the content is the process, not the result.
Watched this video when it came out rewatched it today. Have done a bunch of synth DIY in the meantime. The simplest envelope generator circuit you can build is a basic slew limiter with one knob to control both attack and release. This basic envelope is elegant and still has plenty of uses.
Organic sustain is great in specific locations, effectively working as reverb trails, like noise in a tunnel, wind in the trees, noise in churches, empty rooms vs busy rooms. Also stuff like vehicles having a slow attack, decay and sustain (as well as a weird pitch modulation) when they arrive and then pass you. Ocean waves have incredible variations in sustain and don't rely on echo of course.
Wow thanks, so much good information about how to use the envelope for the filter and other oscillator. If you have a chance to post more of these sound design ideas!
It's a good discussion this Ricky. I've been using low pass gates in modular recently and it reminded me of what you're talking about on the filter envelope section of the video. You get so much more organic movement with envelope mods and using the decay in the right way.
I'm on board with the main point about sustain, but what I really liked in the video was the FM-type stuff you started doing around 11:00 into the video and the jamming toward the end. Cool stuff. 👍
Aww man, you're just the best. Thanks for all your soothing, informative and inspiring content. Mr Tinez, I love your channel; pure silky smooth GOLD (just like I like my coffee).
Only a few can make you care to listen while watching without a bunch of flashy technics and title cards, feels like I'm at a friend's house when watching Ricky Tinez jamming along
Man, I am so glad that I chose to put the headphones on before I watched. Anyways, I love watching your videos, not because I directly emulate your sounds, but because you always put ideas in my head of different things I haven't tried, or tried once and forgot about. So good. Thanks again ~ edit: oh yeah, sustain. Crickets and cicadas. Insect life. They get a good vibratory rub going and just sit there and buzz. It might always be the same note, but they play a lot with dynamics and intensity.
I like making pads with multiple voices with different envelopes plus modulation envelopes and velocity sensitivity differently set differently for each of the voices. So you can play the pad and there's a wide variety of sounds of the voice, both on attack and as you hold the notes at different lengths of time.
Most wind instruments like saxophone or brass will have sustain to them. Strings like violin also have sustain. Singing also have sustain. Some of my favorite synth patches are slowly evolving string pads. But I do think you're correct in saying that sustain is an overused sound design tool.
That's what i was thinking as well, although the sustain phase of those examples is usually still modulated by variable motion or breath. I enjoy (polyphonic) aftertouch for controlling this, but internal modulation or mod-wheel playing helps a lot as well.
That was pretty fuckin' awesome Mr. Tinez. I gotta tell ya, you've really honed in on your voice, what it is that makes your approach to music production unique and interesting, and your videos are really polished. I've been a "hit and run" consumer of your videos for at least two or three years. I couldn't even tell you exactly what it was, but something about your older content rubbed me a little wrong, for lack of a better term. I'm not throwing shade dude, I'm just being real. You've earned yourself another sub Mr. Tinez. Thank you for all the work you put into your content and sharing your wealth of knowledge of production and sound design. Godspeed, Diem
@@dragonstuff1983 Well, I mean, yeah, we're all gonna die someday so I can't blow a flute or bow a string forever. Thanks for that stunning revelation. Maybe something like a cave could exist whose entry has wind that causes the cavern to resonate... like Marsoulas Cave in the Pyrenees or the sheer force of tectonics causing resonances in magma. But even then, I guess the earth will eventually be sucked into a black hole sooo... no sustain exists
@@baronvonbeandip I was more thinking along the lines of a seagull which chirps gets carried a long way with strong winds. But since you brought up black holes, pritty much the definition of a natural phenomenon with indefinite sustain. Sure its a big negative hole that swallowing all vibrations. That other big sustainer in nature is cosmic noise.
To name a few instruments with sustain: choirs, orchestral ensembles, bellow/pipe/tone wheel organs, bowed instruments, hurdy-gurdy, harmonium, bagpipes, didgeridoos (in a way), wine glasses, glass armonica
Something that comes to mind watching this is that the specific thing sustain produces is the sound of an organ. Organ sounds are useful, but organ sustain usually isn't a centerpiece of a mix(unless you go the reverberant church organ route). When the desired goal is more like "I want this synth voice to remain constant volume", that's something that can be accomplished by putting compression in the signal chain. Compression is a nuanced sound design tool in its own right because it shapes volume but also shapes transients at the same time, so it's something that can be made to collaborate with every previous stage in the signal path by driving the input gain harder or softer - and you can go even further than compression by bouncing out a sample, then applying another volume envelope and filter stage on the sample to get a specific mix of "big, lush, analog" and "processed, polite, digital" sound.
Love your improvisational insights man, but even more than that, your ethos. Your work makes TH-cam music channels a better place to hang out. Simple 🙏👍
Waterfall, infinite sustain. Rain, wind, fire, animals voices. Plenty of natural sounds have a semi-constant state that would require sustain to synthesize. Great video as always though!
I think the best example of where a completely constant and unmodulated sustain phase is desirable among non-electronic instruments is a pipe organ. Think of the massive pipe organs that have been used on certain rock songs - that floor-shaking blast of a chord that continues over multiple bars... some music needs it. In the synth world, of course, there are also pads, which often persist without decaying, and for good reason. All of that said, I understand where you're coming from. I like music to have a lot of dynamics in it, and neglecting to put design effort into envelopes can kill that. Love the FM you were getting from that Peak! And no, I don't have a sub :( Oh well.
After replicating every vintage synth I have I started getting into the peaks own raw sound. It’s really amazing. Maybe the best poly purchase one could make right now. Unless you want binaural or oberheim stuff 😂 well than go for the summit. Joking aside: As much as I love my vintage stuff, the peak really stands up and goes a lot further. From diverging and flexing the oscillators behavior to match an old synth to 1.000 elefants screaming at once - crazy synth
I’ve been using the NordDrum for basses and melodic stuff and it’s taught me too that sustains are not always necessary. I even made a converter that maps note-off messages from one channel to note-on messages for another channel that is A:muted and B:in the same mute group. Now this uses two channels to make a simple zero-release instrument. Really good for rhythmic basslines!
Great video! I've been tryna pick apart the Alpha Juno's "What The" patch today, and diving into these envelope meditations does a lot to elucidate what exactly is going on.
Common thing, turn the sustain down to 75 or 50, and attack down to 0, then add a little decay to add punch to the beginning of bass. Amplify it afterwards to get back to original levels if you need to, but now you have a BANG in front of your sound.
Loved the knowledge and experience on this one. The sounds created brought me back to the days of gaming on my Commodore C-64 home computer back in the day, but really loving the deep dive in ADSR, Once again, thank you for this and being you!
9:00 Slight correction, and I know Ricky knows this its just a little slip up in the language. Oscillator 3's *signal* is changing the frequency of oscillator 1, meaning the waveform osc 3 is emitting is changing the pitch value (frequency) of osc 1 by a chosen amount relative to the +-db position of the wave. The pitch of oscillator 3 does not change unless you change the knob. I hate nitpicking stuff like this but I hope this will help anyone still learning FM synthesis be a little less confused.
DUDE. I didn’t realise I did this as much as I do - envelopes seem so much more powerful now that I’m not using them for filter and 808s… knowledge is power man
This has literally made all of my music sound so much better, always thought that a lot of my tunes sound very clouded with sounds, was because on the JDXI basically every tone seems to have sustain on max! Cheers dude, learn something new every day.
wow, I'm not the only one, I very often will not use any sustain in a lot of patches, it's very common for me to turn it off in the natural world there are some sounds that have a "sustain" certain winds, maybe something "fizzing" out of mud, or a stone being dragged across another stone but the consistent thing is they all have motion and texture as well in general I prefer a looped envelope, or multistage but this is a very good point
Very interesting thoughts. I often get caught in the sustain trap as well. I’ll definitely consider it more carefully from now on (if I remember to). Love the tones you dialed at the end too. Great stuff all around
Zach! thanks for the comment and for watching it the whole way through! Don't worry if you don't remember. i can easily say i've already fell into the trap a few times since haha!
definitely agree with this sentiment - most sounds don't need sustain. the default settings on many soft synths (and fat parameter knobs/ sliders on hardware) trick you in to thinking that you need to do something with the sustain parameter. use it sparingly!
I've always used real world instrumental sounds as modelling ideas for my synth sounds. Doing that almost guarantees something akin to what i term "organic' results. For instance, even if you use a sustain that is not necessarily maximum, use your filter emvelops for much more dynamic and interesting results. If you use any sustain on that envelope, make it lower than the amp envelope. Or for results that are always changing, use an LFO with a delay for its introduction to sweep the amplifier or filter. Even better, use something like velocity to control either or both envelope depths. Or if you have it, use a small amount of random for control of any number of parameters. It doesn't take a lot of effort to get away from all the boring static things we're hearing in so much music these days.
True that Ricky, personally I dont use sustain much and just sculpt my reverb so it has an adjustable fade on whichever note I use, which makes sustain obsolete in most circumstances. Quite easy really and especially on ableton where you have the chance to manipulate every aspect of any sound.
This is why i soooo much prefer the DX7 envelopes to traditional analog envelopes. You aren't just stuck in this battle between flat sustain and a decay curve that might always be too short or two long.
I always like putting sustain to about 70% or so, with a little short dip of decay at the beginning. Gives the sound a little bit of a transient.... especially good for fast arpeggios. Just gives you a slight bit of dynamics while keeping that thick sustain sound. If possible you can mod matrix a decay to itself in order to change decay shape to logarithmic or exponential if you don't have that envelope option. OFC if you want the most natural, varied synth sound properly programming your modulations, and tying parameters to velocity, keyboard tracking, after touch will go a long way to creating a less monotonous patch. I'm also a big fan of on note hit random LFO trigger.
I love listening to Ricky’s voice. Especially when he’s in such a thoughtful mode. Envelopes are a really powerful element of synthesis and well worth the exploration in this vid.
"Sustain introduces proble....no I'm talking out my ass now" 🤣🤣🤣 Have to say I always look forward to your videos Ricky they always have knowledge, humor, and humility in them which keeps me coming back. Keep'em coming 🤟
Simple patch, but something that comes up is: Damn. Peak just sounds so pretty. What’s up with that? Summit & Peak are definitely dream synthesizers of mine.
I own the Prophet 6, OB-6, and Peak. Without a doubt, the P6 and OB-6 are the more beautiful sounding synths. But if I had to take one synth to a desert island, it would be Peak, no question.
@@eddievanheinous666 Great to hear. Now Why would it be your desert island synth? is it the wider sonic scope that Peak can cover? or is it the UI? or?
I think you are talking about making space with dynamics. What other things can you make space with: - note voicing - eq - structure like call and response Yes, I have a massive pad / all sound to start with problem too. I've gotten sick of it and recognize when I'm going down that path. I'm sure other things will be like this in the future.
Had to stop the video 1:22 in to say this, Ricky : every animal call or voice has sustain. Your voice has sustain. When you read this and go “ahhhhhh…” , you can hold that high pitch for as long as you want before you come down again. Hopefully that illustrates the envelope for you. Then generally speaking, every naturally occurring sinusoids envelope ( think crashing waves or squeaking door) will have a sustain, however brief.
And why does it matter EVEN if there's no such sound on the organic world? Isn't the point of synthesizers that you can go beyond that and create your own world?
Pianos...i believe the ADSR envelope was originally design to emulate a piano. "D" - would be when the hammer hits the strings in the piano. "S" - would be the following sound while you hold a key down.
@@jarls5890 a piano is only a/d, it is a percussive string instrument, and the sound begins decaying the moment the string is struck. Holding the sustinudo pedal doesn't prolong that, it just prevents the dampers from shortening the decay phase artificially.
Brass instruments. Woodwind, basically any wind. Bowed instruments. Anything that's not percussive, basically (a piano IS percussive). But an ADR envelope with adjustable curve for the D/R would be more useful.
![PASULOL รามเกียรติ์ ตอนที่ 4 นนทกพบรัก [Ramakien Ep.4: Nonthok in love]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tMUQgmZzf_A/mqdefault.jpg)
A Ricky Tinez video always does 2 things for me. Fills me with understanding and knowledge while simultaneously bringing me the calm! Thanks Ricky l! You’re the bees knees. Cheers.
Man I always forget how crazy good the Peak sounds, then you bring it out every few weeks and I'm blown away again.
@@Leviathan-mj8gi Totally agree...when I was analogue synth hunting...I bought and returned so many of them at a similar price point...and the Peak was without a doubt...the best of the bunch. Easy to use, intuitive, fun, creative...LOVE THAT THING!
Thank you for sharing your knowledge Rick 🙏 I totally agree with your viewpoint on sustain in the amplitude envelop context. What’s interesting is that when I started it was the opposite way around, I couldn’t understand the use of decay.
And as to answer your question, there’s few things that have sustain: the sound of the wind in some places where it never rests, waterfalls, rivers, etc. As for insects, if you spend time in the countryside of any warm region, the cicadas are your best answer.
"it's just this giant wall of sound"
you say that like it's a bad thing!
_cries in shoegaze/philspector/ambient_
hahaha, its all relative. but for the "lofi" house songs that came on it felt like they all became the same song. could have been chord choice to
The sun never stops shining, the wind never stops blowing, and the ocean don't stop churning.
to be fair, they will stop.
they just have absolutely massive sustain.
Yesssssssss! I'd call it a logically inspired dive into envelopes. One of the most useful explanations about one of the trickiest yet super necessary adjustment on any sound. Actually preferred AD envelopes for a long time until I really knew how to use ADSR, this is the video I needed a loooong time ago
Hoo boy that pulsing around minute 14 had me mesmerised. Totally zoned out!
In my experience .envelopes are a rabbit hole you don't want to leave. They are just so powerful and can be used to do so many things. Lately I have been running my envelopes through my S&H modules which has made the rabbit hole even deeper lol
Ong that last little section might have convinced me to buy a Peak. That bass is RAW. Thx for doing that all the other demos of this thing are all gussied up in reverb, which also sounds great, but good to know it’s got that beef
bowed instruments have sustain, but the biggest thing that people forget about bowed or stringed instruments is that while they have sustain, they also have INCREDIBLY diverse dynamic control based on how hard or soft you pull or push the bow, how much rosin you use for your bow, whether you're pushing or pulling in the first place - dry sustain by itself with no dynamics is incredibly boring
Same for wind instruments
Ditto for vocals
yeah, as someone who has spent my entire life moving around the string family and later refinding my love for music through synths, sustain on a physical instrument and sustain on a synth are so fundamentally different that calling the same thing is more cause of confussion than anything else.
for me it's always been that quest to turn any synth or keyboard into the most expressive instrument I can make it, a constant effort to make the synth better convey me, my heart
and expression lives in the envelope and filter, velocity/attack and aftertouch
@Therm0ptic no, way more complex. With a VERY heavily programmed MPE patch you might get close, but just aftertouch is way too primitive.
I love hearing/seeing someone talk about the finer points of sound design, even if it's just rambling. :D I do think a lot of newer sound designers/synthesists forget the importance of tremolo, vibrato, and filter lfo modulation.
its ALL the small details that add up to a mega sound
Really looking forward to that new Bizkit record tho
I hear that they're focused on their side project: turgid muffin
ROLLIN ROLLIN ROLLIN ROLLIN
@@TayTayMakesBeats Attack, Decay, Sustain, ROLL!
Yeah I’m on the fence. Really looking forward to that or jamming an ice pick into my forehead. Tough call.
@@TotallyNuss Trotsky time
Wind and string instruments have sustain. String players can sustain as long as they want by bowing back and forth. Wind players have a technique called circular breathing to hold a note for an insane amount of time! And a great vocal example using the same technique is A Lovely Day by Bill Withers!
@@Leviathan-mj8gi and sustaining a note forever vocally as a choir was how harmony started in european music in the middle ages.
bagpipes also are of the oldest family of instruments tracing back to neolithic and they are full sustain
Daaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyy....
@@Leviathan-mj8gi th-cam.com/video/bEeaS6fuUoA/w-d-xo.html the BillWithers sustained note, referenced above 👍🏻
This is one of my favorite videos you've ever made. Such a simple topic, envelopes, and the versatility they have. And then in comes this just massive, filthy FM jam at the end. You're the man Ricky.
haha, thanks! I'm surprised how many people care about envelopes.. i thought it might have just been me
I already fell in love with the Peak since Mylar Melodies video.. but this.... THIS.... is... EPIC!
Have been searching for similar good video's and none matched Mylars, until now.. Thnx Ricky!
Thanks for this video. I would LOVE to see more sound design specific videos from you. Perhaps even a course on sound design. I think this is the biggest area that people can benefit from and without accessibility to teachers, it becomes a very difficult entry point for most. There are plenty of videos out there about "how to make this sound" and while it shows you how to make said sound, the focus is on the result and not what it took to achieve the result. Where as this video was more open ended and the content is the process, not the result.
Agreed. Would happily pay for a Ricky tinez sound design course
You are the first TH-camr that talks this casually, and it's so nice. It feels better. Keep it up!
Ricky, you whispered "DO IT..." in my ear when I was lusting over the Peak @ Knobcon last month. Yesterday, I did it. Thanks for the inspo.
hahahah! i remember this hahahaah
Watched this video when it came out rewatched it today. Have done a bunch of synth DIY in the meantime. The simplest envelope generator circuit you can build is a basic slew limiter with one knob to control both attack and release. This basic envelope is elegant and still has plenty of uses.
Organic sustain is great in specific locations, effectively working as reverb trails, like noise in a tunnel, wind in the trees, noise in churches, empty rooms vs busy rooms. Also stuff like vehicles having a slow attack, decay and sustain (as well as a weird pitch modulation) when they arrive and then pass you. Ocean waves have incredible variations in sustain and don't rely on echo of course.
Very happy that the new MPC update lets me play with everything you talk about in this video
I still come back to this some years later. This is a really solid device espcially in portability, and convenince
Ricky is the GOAT of coming up with a hot take then bailing on it in the same sentence 😂
i present to you, My Brain..
The Bill Burr of synthesis XD
this is why i’ve always believed that the true character of a synth is NOT its oscillators, but its envelopes
So true but I would also add that filters are a very close second. I have more envelopes and modulation modules in my eurorack than any other module.
Wow thanks, so much good information about how to use the envelope for the filter and other oscillator. If you have a chance to post more of these sound design ideas!
It's a good discussion this Ricky. I've been using low pass gates in modular recently and it reminded me of what you're talking about on the filter envelope section of the video. You get so much more organic movement with envelope mods and using the decay in the right way.
Man, the sounds in the first half of the "getting laust in the sauce" section were AMAZING! Please turn this into a whole album! =)
I'm on board with the main point about sustain, but what I really liked in the video was the FM-type stuff you started doing around 11:00 into the video and the jamming toward the end. Cool stuff. 👍
I don’t usually sub to anything that isn’t politics or philosophy, but your mix of hip hop sensibilities and well thought out takes have won me over.
WHEWWWWWWW. That bass lifter is MEANNNNN. This was super helpful man! Thanks!
Aww man, you're just the best. Thanks for all your soothing, informative and inspiring content. Mr Tinez, I love your channel; pure silky smooth GOLD (just like I like my coffee).
Less than 2 months ago you & Jakob Haq got me into the PO33; now I'm on an Akai MPC and loving it all, thanks to you. Love making music. Peace bro'.
On point Ricky, good catch! Just this morning I was playing Roland MV-1 and was puzzled why Sustain was missing just ADR. That's why.
Only a few can make you care to listen while watching without a bunch of flashy technics and title cards, feels like I'm at a friend's house when watching Ricky Tinez jamming along
Thanks! A really nice reminder about the power of envelopes. 😃 A nice follow-up might be using pitch envelopes to make 808s from scratch.
The entirety of the universe is a big sustained vibration. All possible frequencies vibrating at once throughout space-time.
Cool video and love those FM timbres- PHAT!
Man, I am so glad that I chose to put the headphones on before I watched. Anyways, I love watching your videos, not because I directly emulate your sounds, but because you always put ideas in my head of different things I haven't tried, or tried once and forgot about. So good. Thanks again ~
edit: oh yeah, sustain. Crickets and cicadas. Insect life. They get a good vibratory rub going and just sit there and buzz. It might always be the same note, but they play a lot with dynamics and intensity.
Hi everyone, are you with me when I say that I like the way Mr Tinez speaks to us? With words but with sounds also. Love the melody.
I like making pads with multiple voices with different envelopes plus modulation envelopes and velocity sensitivity differently set differently for each of the voices. So you can play the pad and there's a wide variety of sounds of the voice, both on attack and as you hold the notes at different lengths of time.
My brain has definitely done the whole "ADR>ADSR" thing
Thank god my headphones can catch those low frequencies.
Also the jam sounded like a synth motorcycle revving off into the night. Very neat sound.
Most wind instruments like saxophone or brass will have sustain to them. Strings like violin also have sustain. Singing also have sustain.
Some of my favorite synth patches are slowly evolving string pads.
But I do think you're correct in saying that sustain is an overused sound design tool.
That's what i was thinking as well, although the sustain phase of those examples is usually still modulated by variable motion or breath.
I enjoy (polyphonic) aftertouch for controlling this, but internal modulation or mod-wheel playing helps a lot as well.
That FM at the end though... yow. Every time I see the Peak doing FM, I regret not buying one. It just makes such delicious sounds!
That second to last patch was wicked!!! So many cool harmonics going on in there. Boh boh!
Thanks for explaining so simple & easy, everything got into my head the right way.
My Subwoofer:"I got this" Interesting video man, liked and subbed.
Such good advice! Thank you! Have been using this synth for a couple of years now. Always something to learn. Great dicussion on movement of sound.
That was pretty fuckin' awesome Mr. Tinez. I gotta tell ya, you've really honed in on your voice, what it is that makes your approach to music production unique and interesting, and your videos are really polished. I've been a "hit and run" consumer of your videos for at least two or three years. I couldn't even tell you exactly what it was, but something about your older content rubbed me a little wrong, for lack of a better term. I'm not throwing shade dude, I'm just being real. You've earned yourself another sub Mr. Tinez. Thank you for all the work you put into your content and sharing your wealth of knowledge of production and sound design.
Godspeed,
Diem
See you say it’s not a sales pitch but MAN your videos make me want a peak.
If voice and wind instruments are "natural" then they have sustain.
Not full sustain.
@@dragonstuff1983 still, it's sustain. I'm not even speaking about breath technique, bowed string and organ..
@@dragonstuff1983 Well, I mean, yeah, we're all gonna die someday so I can't blow a flute or bow a string forever. Thanks for that stunning revelation.
Maybe something like a cave could exist whose entry has wind that causes the cavern to resonate... like Marsoulas Cave in the Pyrenees or the sheer force of tectonics causing resonances in magma. But even then, I guess the earth will eventually be sucked into a black hole sooo... no sustain exists
Hes not saying get rid of sustain
@@baronvonbeandip I was more thinking along the lines of a seagull which chirps gets carried a long way with strong winds. But since you brought up black holes, pritty much the definition of a natural phenomenon with indefinite sustain. Sure its a big negative hole that swallowing all vibrations. That other big sustainer in nature is cosmic noise.
organic with sustain=anything with vocal chords ;)
ps this is your best vid so far, totally with you on the nerd out, omg
Why have I only just watched this? Magnificent as per.
To name a few instruments with sustain: choirs, orchestral ensembles, bellow/pipe/tone wheel organs, bowed instruments, hurdy-gurdy, harmonium, bagpipes, didgeridoos (in a way), wine glasses, glass armonica
Something that comes to mind watching this is that the specific thing sustain produces is the sound of an organ. Organ sounds are useful, but organ sustain usually isn't a centerpiece of a mix(unless you go the reverberant church organ route). When the desired goal is more like "I want this synth voice to remain constant volume", that's something that can be accomplished by putting compression in the signal chain. Compression is a nuanced sound design tool in its own right because it shapes volume but also shapes transients at the same time, so it's something that can be made to collaborate with every previous stage in the signal path by driving the input gain harder or softer - and you can go even further than compression by bouncing out a sample, then applying another volume envelope and filter stage on the sample to get a specific mix of "big, lush, analog" and "processed, polite, digital" sound.
Yes, another peak vid! Awsome growl. 😎👍
Love your improvisational insights man, but even more than that, your ethos. Your work makes TH-cam music channels a better place to hang out. Simple 🙏👍
The soundstage at the end could be something out of an Alien Movie, whats going on 😂
hahaha! i love getting "out of this world" with this thing. the distortion sounds so good to me
@@RickyTinez Definitely feel free do do more noise demos.
I really enjoyed this video. Nice to have a different perspective on sustain. I have a peak and will play with this more in my sound design.
Waterfall, infinite sustain. Rain, wind, fire, animals voices. Plenty of natural sounds have a semi-constant state that would require sustain to synthesize. Great video as always though!
Actually, does a waterfall even have an attack, decay or release? It’s only sustain!
I think the best example of where a completely constant and unmodulated sustain phase is desirable among non-electronic instruments is a pipe organ. Think of the massive pipe organs that have been used on certain rock songs - that floor-shaking blast of a chord that continues over multiple bars... some music needs it. In the synth world, of course, there are also pads, which often persist without decaying, and for good reason.
All of that said, I understand where you're coming from. I like music to have a lot of dynamics in it, and neglecting to put design effort into envelopes can kill that.
Love the FM you were getting from that Peak! And no, I don't have a sub :( Oh well.
Good video. These sort of ponderings are far more interesting than the average gear review or 'how to'.
After replicating every vintage synth I have I started getting into the peaks own raw sound. It’s really amazing. Maybe the best poly purchase one could make right now. Unless you want binaural or oberheim stuff 😂 well than go for the summit. Joking aside: As much as I love my vintage stuff, the peak really stands up and goes a lot further. From diverging and flexing the oscillators behavior to match an old synth to 1.000 elefants screaming at once - crazy synth
I’ve been using the NordDrum for basses and melodic stuff and it’s taught me too that sustains are not always necessary. I even made a converter that maps note-off messages from one channel to note-on messages for another channel that is A:muted and B:in the same mute group. Now this uses two channels to make a simple zero-release instrument. Really good for rhythmic basslines!
I guess I've been a good sound designer all along without realizing it! Thanks for this. I was having a bit of depression earlier.
Great video! I've been tryna pick apart the Alpha Juno's "What The" patch today, and diving into these envelope meditations does a lot to elucidate what exactly is going on.
Common thing, turn the sustain down to 75 or 50, and attack down to 0, then add a little decay to add punch to the beginning of bass. Amplify it afterwards to get back to original levels if you need to, but now you have a BANG in front of your sound.
Loved the knowledge and experience on this one. The sounds created brought me back to the days of gaming on my Commodore C-64 home computer back in the day, but really loving the deep dive in ADSR,
Once again, thank you for this and being you!
9:00 Slight correction, and I know Ricky knows this its just a little slip up in the language. Oscillator 3's *signal* is changing the frequency of oscillator 1, meaning the waveform osc 3 is emitting is changing the pitch value (frequency) of osc 1 by a chosen amount relative to the +-db position of the wave. The pitch of oscillator 3 does not change unless you change the knob. I hate nitpicking stuff like this but I hope this will help anyone still learning FM synthesis be a little less confused.
yea i heard this later and said whoops to myself haha. Thanks for clarifying M4RS!
DUDE. I didn’t realise I did this as much as I do - envelopes seem so much more powerful now that I’m not using them for filter and 808s… knowledge is power man
that mod envelope/sine wave FM outro was spectacular
This has literally made all of my music sound so much better, always thought that a lot of my tunes sound very clouded with sounds, was because on the JDXI basically every tone seems to have sustain on max! Cheers dude, learn something new every day.
wow, I'm not the only one, I very often will not use any sustain in a lot of patches, it's very common for me to turn it off
in the natural world there are some sounds that have a "sustain"
certain winds, maybe something "fizzing" out of mud, or a stone being dragged across another stone
but the consistent thing is they all have motion and texture as well
in general I prefer a looped envelope, or multistage
but this is a very good point
Got that Peak humming like an engine. Nice! 😄
Awesome work Ricky Tinez, thank You
Very interesting thoughts. I often get caught in the sustain trap as well. I’ll definitely consider it more carefully from now on (if I remember to). Love the tones you dialed at the end too. Great stuff all around
Zach! thanks for the comment and for watching it the whole way through! Don't worry if you don't remember. i can easily say i've already fell into the trap a few times since haha!
definitely agree with this sentiment - most sounds don't need sustain. the default settings on many soft synths (and fat parameter knobs/ sliders on hardware) trick you in to thinking that you need to do something with the sustain parameter. use it sparingly!
There is also fun to be had with looping envelopes
Holy sub bass Batman, watched this on the home stereo and the end had all of my windows vibrating, well done sir!
Always entertaining and educational…thx Ricky. Hope you’re well.
Thank you Ricardo. I really enjoy your videos, you are a great educator.
I've always used real world instrumental sounds as modelling ideas for my synth sounds. Doing that almost guarantees something akin to what i term "organic' results. For instance, even if you use a sustain that is not necessarily maximum, use your filter emvelops for much more dynamic and interesting results. If you use any sustain on that envelope, make it lower than the amp envelope. Or for results that are always changing, use an LFO with a delay for its introduction to sweep the amplifier or filter. Even better, use something like velocity to control either or both envelope depths. Or if you have it, use a small amount of random for control of any number of parameters. It doesn't take a lot of effort to get away from all the boring static things we're hearing in so much music these days.
True that Ricky, personally I dont use sustain much and just sculpt my reverb so it has an adjustable fade on whichever note I use, which makes sustain obsolete in most circumstances. Quite easy really and especially on ableton where you have the chance to manipulate every aspect of any sound.
This is why i soooo much prefer the DX7 envelopes to traditional analog envelopes. You aren't just stuck in this battle between flat sustain and a decay curve that might always be too short or two long.
11:48 reminded me of todd rundgren international feel! great video! :D
I always like putting sustain to about 70% or so, with a little short dip of decay at the beginning. Gives the sound a little bit of a transient.... especially good for fast arpeggios. Just gives you a slight bit of dynamics while keeping that thick sustain sound. If possible you can mod matrix a decay to itself in order to change decay shape to logarithmic or exponential if you don't have that envelope option. OFC if you want the most natural, varied synth sound properly programming your modulations, and tying parameters to velocity, keyboard tracking, after touch will go a long way to creating a less monotonous patch. I'm also a big fan of on note hit random LFO trigger.
thanks for more FM inspo! great vid s always
I love listening to Ricky’s voice. Especially when he’s in such a thoughtful mode. Envelopes are a really powerful element of synthesis and well worth the exploration in this vid.
"Sustain introduces proble....no I'm talking out my ass now" 🤣🤣🤣 Have to say I always look forward to your videos Ricky they always have knowledge, humor, and humility in them which keeps me coming back. Keep'em coming 🤟
This was awesome! I didn’t understand a single thing, but one day…
Simple patch, but something that comes up is: Damn. Peak just sounds so pretty. What’s up with that?
Summit & Peak are definitely dream synthesizers of mine.
I own the Prophet 6, OB-6, and Peak. Without a doubt, the P6 and OB-6 are the more beautiful sounding synths. But if I had to take one synth to a desert island, it would be Peak, no question.
@@eddievanheinous666 Great to hear. Now Why would it be your desert island synth? is it the wider sonic scope that Peak can cover? or is it the UI? or?
I think you are talking about making space with dynamics. What other things can you make space with:
- note voicing
- eq
- structure like call and response
Yes, I have a massive pad / all sound to start with problem too. I've gotten sick of it and recognize when I'm going down that path. I'm sure other things will be like this in the future.
Wow, that last patch was nasty. Damn, the Peak can really sound dark and dirty. I love it.
Man, I love the Peak! Endless possibilities.
Using the dynamics controls to your advantage is no small task, especially figuring out how multiple envelopes interact with each other.
Ricky!!! Damn this video is so good lol. Never realized how overplayed sustain on 100 was til now lol
Had to stop the video 1:22 in to say this, Ricky : every animal call or voice has sustain. Your voice has sustain. When you read this and go “ahhhhhh…” , you can hold that high pitch for as long as you want before you come down again. Hopefully that illustrates the envelope for you. Then generally speaking, every naturally occurring sinusoids envelope ( think crashing waves or squeaking door) will have a sustain, however brief.
Singing. But we use sustain too much and we don’t even think about it. I think just be conscious of it is a good thing I learned here.
Any string instrument played with a bow. Crickets in a forest. The wind in a stormy day. The rain.
And why does it matter EVEN if there's no such sound on the organic world? Isn't the point of synthesizers that you can go beyond that and create your own world?
what has sustain? string ensembles? the human voice?
Pianos...i believe the ADSR envelope was originally design to emulate a piano. "D" - would be when the hammer hits the strings in the piano. "S" - would be the following sound while you hold a key down.
Woodwinds, bowed strings and the human voice mostly.
A perfect bong hit
_ur mom, whilst hot & bothered..._ ; )
[yeh, somebody was gonna]
@@jarls5890 a piano is only a/d, it is a percussive string instrument, and the sound begins decaying the moment the string is struck. Holding the sustinudo pedal doesn't prolong that, it just prevents the dampers from shortening the decay phase artificially.
Brass instruments. Woodwind, basically any wind. Bowed instruments. Anything that's not percussive, basically (a piano IS percussive). But an ADR envelope with adjustable curve for the D/R would be more useful.