HI Steve! That is extremely interesting to me! I have been trying to get testing performed on honey here in the United States prior to and after oav exposure. Not one lab has a protocol for that test and many simply state that pre and post-treatment OA residue differences are almost "not measurable". Would you be willing to send me a link to an English explanation regarding OAV being permitted when honey supers are on? I am running into walls here in the U.S. when I try to get detailed information as to why we must isolate our honey supers. I look forward to learning more from you on the subject! Thank YOU.
Frederick Dunn I’m in the US too. I got that data from a local beer chap who lived in Europe and maintains a cadre of beekeeping friends there though I didn’t ask him which country but he alluded to it being Europe wide.
@@romoshka1 I really need a solid reference so I can speak about it to my viewers :) Thanks for the follow-up Steve! I did receive some information from Michigan State U. regarding why it's not approved by our FDA.... boils down to no one wanting to fund the testing required.
@@FrederickDunn Hey Fred. I'm not sure if it's part of the law up here, but we get the same instructions as the US: pull off honey supers when treating with Oxalic vapour.
Thank you for that very flattering comment. It's also funny because Bob Ross and I have a lot in common. We both had military careers, we both learned the wet-on-wet painting technique from Bill Alexander, we both decided to make up for our military exploits by later becoming nice to everyone in every possible situation. I don't obviously have his awesome head of hair (which he hated and only got because a perm saved him money on haircuts) which became his visual brand. So, thank YOU! Did you know that Bob was never paid a single dime for any of his Public Television Oil Painting programs? It's true... he did it for free. He also never sold a single painting... me, being a capitalist, sold hundreds of paintings during my life and will do more when I really retire. :)
@@FrederickDunn The four core pillars of good people in our society. Mister Rodgers, Bob Ross, Keanu Reeves, and Fred Dunn. With half that group being not alive anymore the pressure is on Keanu and Fred. I have said it before Fred needs a show. The joy of beekeeping. On PBS this fall.
@@FrederickDunn Mr. Dunn, Bob Ross was a standard in our home we never missed any of his programs. we all began taking art lessons because of him. He may be gone but never forgotten. His name was brought up in a conversation just yesterday and that hair was part of the convo. Now I understand why your work through the lens is nothing but pure art!!! 👍 📖🛐✈️🐆🐆🐆🐆🐆🐝🐝🐝🐝🐝🐝🐝🐝
Yes, that was totally a treat to see. I was drawn to that channel mainly because he films stuff from there sometimes with his swarming footage from inside being really amazing to see. i did not know bees could run that fast!
@@evilgibson Bees change flight speed also. They can carry enough sugar in their flight muscles to power an hour of flight but normally they carry enough sugar for 15 minutes of flight or about 5.5 km of distance. When bees feed on rich sugar solutions they can fly as fast as 29 km/h while a dilute solution results in slower flight speeds of 4 to 7 km/h When the blood sugar concentrations fall to 1 percent in the flight muscles, the forager can no longer fly and you will find the bee laying there tired wanting a drink.
@@weasleoop i was talking about the knees bent running around inside the hive. instead of the general wandering chill mood they are absolutely tearing up comb running out.
@@weasleoop That's nice to know Carlos. I do the same thing when I get a sugar rush, except I can't fly, lol. But sometimes I do in my dreams, it's been a while though.
This is EXCELLENT info as always Fred! I am so relieved to see their reaction and LACK of panic to OAV. A friend and I were talking about OAV on my live-stream last week. We both had a lot of questions about it. You have answered everything I think! I will be sharing this with him and on my live-stream next week. Another excellent FFB production!
The Farmacy Seeds Network using my provap clone and forgot to rag the entrance. Ran around front to put the rag in place and saw bees boiling out. Quickly put the rag in place but it was too late...too many were out and I was sans veil and they did a number on me.
@@romoshka1 Ouch! That's why I ALWAYS wear the suit.. I am very comfortable around my bees now.. but my friend Matt mentioned to me "If things go south, you'll be glad you are covered"... and it made me think of it every time I go out. I'm sorry to hear about your mishap! I hope you are getting over the stings and get a "clean vape" on them.. :)
Fred. I don't think people realize what your doing. This is awesome. Fred you are so awesome. Thank you and people doing this. No bees no life on this planet.
This was an excellent OAV demonstration! It's nice to see you turn to a light treatment Mr Dunn and I look forward to your wintering results with the Saskatraz line! We're watching!!!
I'll chime in with another round of thanks for the video. It WAS great to see the reaction of the bees in th observation hive: NO STRESS. Definitely the way to go for treatment. Hope you get those little beasties contained.
What a fantastic video as always and what a technician in the making of such helpful videos which are packed full of educational data. Thank you so much for your second to none help. You are indeed one in millions.
Thanks for sharing. I always wondered what the bees did when such treatments were administered. Last month I placed formic acid pads and the stress they endured was terrible ... within a two week period only 10% of the bees remained, and quickly after the colony collapsed. I think they died because particularities to my horizontal hive made it impossible for the bees to naturally and properly vent the hive. I wouldn’t recommend filming the use of formic acid. Anyway, the filming of the bees as you applied a gas treatment was incredibly fascinating. Thanks!
Thanks for mentioning that you have heard similar stories ... the worst part is watching them suffer ... I could hold my breath and immediately leave the area ... the bees could not
By the way Frederick = love all your videos and doing a lot following you in your ways. Near Spring must ask you the subject of how to coax bees to use the Flow Hive =if needed that is? That is if there are any bees left ---if and when the dastardly Varroa mites leave any healthy hygienic bees alive after the winter? Did I buy a second 'Flow' bee hive much too soon ? Time and nature will tell ! PS great deal of bee action yesterday due to a balmy 15 c in the sun yesterday. They are definitely making avery sunny day count! not a sign of a bee some miserable days!. They are just incredible.
This was great I have screen bottoms some how I have to close them up right. I got the other wans that u showed us last time and the jumper box all that but this is really a cool way to do it. I have some hives that the opening is not big enough for the wan but this will work great the way u just did here. Oh man u just don"t know how wonderful your videos are I have not even finished watching it yet. But wanted to tell u.
Dear Frederick Thank you for the reply. It's strange though it ages since I messaged you??????? We've been so disappointed this season compared with last year. No honey in the now. 3 Flow frames. The bees are hard at it and are working in the flow frames for over two months now but it's been a poor Summer and Spring was not musch better. I put one extra shallow super on two hives but it's not that as they are full of honey. The one that is the original hive we got 50lbs of honey from last year (40 out of the Flow frame and 10lbs in the Autumn) but this hive does not have 2 shallows on under the Flow frame but one. So they must be eating the honey due to the poor weather. = Wettest July for yonks! I hope your situation is much better than ours..... April swarms from the biggest colony even though they had space. The hose pipe had little effect on them and was only temporary...... My wife & I got plenty of stings many through our suits as well...... The new Queen seems to have settled them. Interesting that this is the hive that had a massive infestation of varroa when I bought them (1300 killed within a couple of months) (300 on the first drop) you said that's awful! The 'strips' have worked wonders. I know I know it's bending the rules but hey, it works! Perhapse I should not mention this success? best wishes & hope you have loads of lovely honey.
I used the Pro Vap 110 as well and it is very effective. I credit the multiple treatments I did last fall is what saved my colonies throughout winter. The only difference I do from what you did Fred is a initiate the treatment through the front at the entrance hole. I do that mainly so that the pro-vac 110 device will rest easily on the landing board. This ensures that I do not break the delivery spout that you’re sticking the quarter inch hole at the back. I find the weight of the gun will damage the spout overtime if you do not hold onto it or support it somehow.
Through the front, the initial "blast" directly impacts open brood during the warm season. Introducing it via the back, or upper part of the box greatly reduces that heat and the intense puff of oa. True, it's much better to support the unit, though it hasn't failed to date, it's a great idea to not let the copper tube support the entire unit. Thanks for sharing your ideas and use.
Thanks for this timely video! I’m removing supers next weekend and will be starting this same treatment right after that. I just got the $150 ‘Easy Vap’ and will be giving it a full test. That shot into your observation hive was fantastic. I’ve never treated with oxalic but seeing that footage put me much more at ease. I always wondered what actually happened in the hive. Great job!
I really enjoy how timely and relevant your video topics are. I am a first year beekeeper. I was told that in the first year I don’t need to worry about Verona mites and treatment this year would be unnecessary. I know everyone has different opinions regarding routine and technique but this sounds way too serious to hope I’m ok first year. I’ve only ever had dead bees on the landing board right after removing supers. Do you agree with the advice I was given?
HI Rick, thank you for this valuable question. There is some validation in the approach that the first year bees are installed IF they are a varroa resistant line, that they may not require any varroa or other potential infection interventions. You will hear other experienced beekeepers flatly state that "if you don't treat, ALL of your bees will be dead in less than three years". So many voices and words of beekeeping wisdom, each with their own experiences and approaches. Here is my personal philosophy on any pest management approach - learn about the pest and its life cycle - determine if the pest is present in damaging numbers - intervene if and when the bees are not coping on their own. My approach has always been, colonies that survive are good, colonies that don't make it just didn't have the level of resistance needed. I'm moderately altering course this year in order to see if my winter die-offs are due to the "cold" or the ever-present challenge of parasites inside the hive. Let's talk about the "first year don't need to worry" philosophy/advice - If you receive package bees, for example, I say treat them upon arrival as all of the bees are exposed as are the mites. Many beekeepers report receiving package bees with mite loads already on their bodies. If I capture a swarm, after the first week in the hive, I would "now" treat them with OAV before any of the brood is capped - again, that's because 100% of the bees and larvae are exposed to the treatment. I personally would not wait until losses are higher, or varroa numbers are at destructive density as they will then have much more to overcome. Remember that it's not just the varroa, but the diseases they are bringing with them. I think I will have to discuss this in greater detail in future FAQ videos as it's very important. If the varroa are present and growing in numbers, and your bees are not keeping those numbers at manageable levels, then I would not hesitate to assist those bees with an approved intervention method, no matter how long you've had the bees. I wish you well in your beekeeping journey, and thank you so much for watching! :)
I was told the samething my first year. The supplier said: "We've discussed it and we feel that the bees are relatively mite free." I didn't know any better, I didn't know about TH-cam beeks, I didn't have a mentor. Like Fred said, you have to test and go from there. You don't know whether or not your bees are robbing out someone else's failed colony, which has become a mite bomb.
Left work early for this! Thanks for another great video. Love my 2 sask hives. I received them(6/28) maybe 2 weeks before the other 3 nucs I have, and as a beginner they seem to be far ahead in population and stores. Both hives took another box(10 frame full) by 8/5. Only one of the other 3 have grown enough to add a box. Maybe it’s timing,pure luck, breeders, or the 10 extra days I’ve had them. Thoughts,anyone???
Don't know where you are, but here it has been a STELLAR bee/honey / resource season.. maybe that's a factor where you are too. But congrats! I am planning splits in the spring!
Dear Frederick I have always though that parasites are reprehensible. Urrrrh ......... I can bare with the bees that something is sucking the life out of them. I was bitten by a tick in October and three weeks of Doxycycline later to counteract the lime disease I recovered OK. Seeing 6 dead removed bees with the wing virus galvanised me into action so I vaped them. Did the vapour penetrate all the bees though? I worry about them. Mick Hall
Awesome to see the observation hive. Thank You. I've been wanting to ask your opinion on the slatted rack?We only have 3 hives, one with a slatted rack it looks like if, for no other reason the racks work great for treating OA. We're using (been using) OA in a fogger and hope it's doing the job (my daughter don't want me to do a "wash")(:. Thanks again
I'm a first year beekeeper and just finished an OA vaporization treatment (middle August). Before the treatment my three hives were doing great. At the beginning of August I mite washed them and the mite count was at 3%. I smoked the entrances before vaporization and used 2 grams of OA in each hive because I have single deeps with one medium for my brood chambers and then a queen excluder isolating the supers above from the queen. I used a piece of cardboard as a barrier to isolate my supers from the OA. After the treatment I inspected my hives and had one missing queen with no eggs or larvae and all capped brood in the hive and one queen that was not laying. The other hive was doing great like nothing ever happened. I thought OA was supposed to be one of the least aggressive treatments for mites but two out my three hives took a drastic downturn after/during the treatment. I wondering if it was the OA or if it was just something that happened with the hive that I wasn't aware since I didn't inspect them during the treatment period.
I know years ago when Apistan was used to kill the mites there were 2 unintended consequences. 1. The mites developed resistance to the pesticide. 2. Because the wax was reused over and over again to make foundation the wax foundation became more and contaminated eventually making the bees sick and dead. Will this not be the case with the use of OVA?
Good Morning Mr. Dunn! I’m a day late on this video, but what great information. Loved the Observation Hive treatment. Very cool to see how they react to the OAV. Question: The Beekeeper Association over here is telling everyone to use formic acid paddies first and then follow up with OAV a few weeks later... Formic seems to affect the bees where OAV does not... Can you think of a reason why both would be needed? Again, thanks for the incredible FAQ’s, I get so much out of them.
Dear Larry... because we've become friends and are brothers at arms... formic acid patties have killed many beekeeper's bees... the results are wide and varied with lots of horror stories about lost colonies. You will be fine if you use three OAV treatments 7 days apart... it's the only thing I currently endorse or would personally use on my own bees. I'm probably already getting kicked out of the treatment-free "club"... and that's also ok.
Frederick Dunn - Thank you Sir! Great to know! Also, sorry that folks would rather put their bees at risk rather than treat. But OA is a natural occurring acid in foods... So then are you really guilty of treating? I’ll speak up for you at the Treatment Free Court Marshal. 🤣
Come on Fred. Lets have a video of when drone kick out day is going to happen. My hives are still producing drones currently but I can feel the chill in the air. Enough to move my bananna trees in soon.
The temperature of the steam suddenly rushing into the colony probably annoys them more than the vapor. Kind of like getting splashed by cold water when you don’t expect it. Meant to mention that I was elated to see you put the observation hive back up again and I enjoy seeing it in action. Great video Fred, you do such a fantastic job describing the intricacies of beekeeping making it simple and understandable. Gotta prep for winter as it will be here before you know it as I’m sure you know 👍🏻😃
Let’s assume their is no brood in the super. Before 1st treatment you remove any super (with or without honey) then treat. Assuming you will harvest honey later. How long do wait to reintroduce the super back to the hive. Do you keep it isolated for the 3 treatment sequence?
HI Judd, you can replace the honey super right away - and that's only if you want to extract the honey for human consumption, if you are allowing the bees to store up for winter, then those supers may remain even during treatment.
Frederick Dunn< I may be over thinking this but isn’t the purpose of treating (in this manner) is to deposit micro ox acid throughout the hive on virtually every surface, including the bee’s, wood frames and comb and if you isolate the super during treatment then when it is reintroduced the previously treated bee’s will contaminate the once isolated super. I’ve read that you only want to use a ox acid that is blessed by the “FDA” and I assume that is because of the residual contamination. Apparently the oxacid sold at a big box store used to clean fencing is inappropriate for this application.
@@judd_s5643 It is true that it settles on every surface it contacts and results in micro crystal dusting. You definitely want the properly labeled and classified OAC for bee hive use. As for contamination of the restored honey supers that would have a potential health impact on the honey consumed - please link that study as that's very interesting and new, to me. Much appreciated. Definitely do NOT use the wood-bleach grade that is sold in construction centers - I guess I should have mentioned more than to say "properly labeled". Thanks for that.
@@FrederickDunn What happens if the bees do not use all the honey up over winter and then move honey around and move it up into harvest-able honey supers next year?
@@weasleoop My personal practice has always been to remove winter honey frames when the spring nectar flow begins. As part of my "new" observations, I will have to sample that honey and get it tested for OA residue so see if it matches untreated colony levels. I need greater understanding regarding what the "real" health threats are if someone ingests oxalic acid in honey. One science-based researcher argued that a pound of carrots already contains more oxalic acid than is used to treat a hive of bees. So I think that in order to really consume a damaging dose of oxalic acid, an individual would be consuming gallons of honey even if the beekeeper were negligent and left capped honey supers on. I have lots of questions myself and hope to get some biochemical responses from experts in the area. I think since this is an approved method, that they are setting the safety standards very high as a fail-safe measure. This is a highly polarizing area and I need to defer to expert sources.
Are these Olivarez Sask or imported Sask. Just an FYI they cut the line in California if they are. and are NOTHING compared to the Candian ones that are directly raised up there.
The only autorized breeder in the U.S. was the OHB family in California. They have their own breeding/mating yards for their breeder queens, so there is some varience in genetics. They sell through Mann Lake. If you want pure Saskatraz, you have to go to Canada. Unless something has changed.
Questions about propolis: How do bees transport it? Does a forager go off just for propolis, or do they carry it back with their pollen and nectar? Thanks again for the great info.
Frederick this is so very helpful to me. I’m so grateful for you. I hope you know that. I’m just now using OAV with my FlowHive and am placing the OA pipe in under the back pest tray area (pest tray removed) and angling it upwards a tad. Question. Will the OAV be hindered by that FlowHive metal grid or is this a good method? My front entrances are blocked because of Hivegates. And does it matter if the treatment is applied from the bottom up or the top down? I like the idea of carving a hole. Super grateful.
HI Brad, I'm not sure how you contained the vapor inside the hive with the tray removed? You really need an enclosed box so the vapor remains controlled for 10 minutes. If they just blow it out through the bottom, then it's not going to be very effective in my opinion.
Fred great video. I was wondering if the OAV will still work with the capped brood? And what time of year should we do this? Again, thanks for all the great informative videos you create. You are the best.....
Me again. ;) Have you considered trying to cross Beweaver and Saskatraz? (I don't know if you produce queens or not). I'm thinking it might make a great combo (or a FrankenBee)!
I let the m do what they want and since I have both lines in my apiary, I can only assume that they are already doing that. :) My only Queen Production is to pull frames of brood with queen cells and start new colonies. I don't do any grafting or OTS Queen Rearing...
A few quick questions: How soon after adding a new 3# box of bees to my hive would you recommend giving them a treatment? Also, is after doing the 3 tandem treatments, would you recommend the 3 week interval for the remainder of the season? Lastly, where did you get that solar owl head?!?! LOL. That must work great for the skunks / racoons / possums. Thanks Fred
Hi Rich, if you suspect your package may have varroa mites, you can knock them out with a single oav treatment after they have been hived for up to 9 days from install. I wouldn't do it before that as it may impact queen acceptance.
First year bee keeper and I was wondering if you can feed syrup right after an oxalic acid vaporization treatment? I waited too long to treat I think and it seems to be coinciding with when I should be feeding. We started with two hives and we are down to one hive in a two deep box hive. I wanted to get a little more syrup on before the weather gets too cold. I am in Connecticut. We had a pretty bad drought this year. I love your videos. Thanks!
Just FYI - I have read many places that the OA crystals stay in the hive for about 4 days. So any mites that emerge with hatching bees will die during that period. After that, the efficacy declines and mites that exit could possibly make their way into another cell right before it is capped. That means you should treat about every 4-5 days over a 24 day period when drones are still in production. If it is very late in the season and you are pretty sure the queen is no longer laying, then a 21 day treatment period would suffice. This will be more effective than only treating 3 times over 21 days, and as you said, the bees will be fine. So will the honey be if it is only for personal consumption.
@@FrederickDunn I found one that is referenced in different sites and was put out by Dadant. It comes up as a pdf, so I'm not able to attach that, but a general search for Dadant Oxylic Acid will yield the pdf. Having said that, another article from Scientific Beekeeping suggested one treatment per week. Perhaps no one really knows? I guess I figure if it isn't known to be harmful to the bees, I'd rather treat a little more frequently to kill any that might have emerged. Cheers!
Hello Fred. I try to watch all your videos and just watched this one as per your reply to my message re another of your videos = 2021 latest I believe. I suppose they instinctively move away from any 'perceived' threat. Do we know how they 'feel' though. The saying, being cruel to be kind applies in this instance where we apply a noxious substance to treat the threat of the nasty Varroa mite. Eventually it is hoped that natural immunity will happen for bees. Those bees who realise if they are clean and vigilant and spot anything red on themselves or their relations =knock em off and munch em. pass the word --get em outa here! God forbid - a red under the bed?
Genetics are definitely the long term goal. All we have regarding determining how the bees are impacted, is their behavior immediately after treatment. Since they return to business as usual right away, and the queen continues to lay eggs etc... an "assumption" is made that the impact is minimal regarding the bees and brood. Some other treatments result in instant responses that include dying bees, and often queen loss.
Have you seen a big enough difference between the beeweaver and saskatraz bee in production and temperment to justify keeping them since they need treatments
That is a great question Greg - I am willing to keep the Saskatraz bees, even if they require a couple of treatments per year as they just may be top performers coming through winter. My evaluation of that line continues. They are still improving the varroa resistance in the line and I'm happy to support that by buying their Queens. Years ago when I started buying in BeeWeaver Queens, they were not as good as they are today and we need these breeders to be able to continue their improvements with survivor genetics. Another aspect of treating them is that I will personally know more about how they respond to OAV and I'll need those records and observations through many seasons.
My Saskatraz are bigger producers of both brood and honey than my beeweavers. Also they have no pests. They were beeweavers at first and then were headed up by a Saskatraz Queen at first so maybe that is why. They are SUPER docile. I work the hives with no suit, no smoke and they send zero guard bees at me. They are calm on the combs, and ignore that I am even there. If they produce more honey and are this docile I love them. My only thing is testing to see how hygienic they are and how well they overwinter.
@@weasleoop If your bees are that docile then they won't make it in the long run. Defensiveness is a critical survivor trait. Your bees are acting like sheep. There are too many wolves.
Excellent in every way! Thank you. I am curious to know if you wash the gloves and clothing you were wearing after treatments? Did you treat every single hive? Thanks again Fred, your videos are so full of information and details.
Thanks Mary, the oxalic crystals are not harmful to the touch and they wash off in regular water. It's the vapor that's potentially harmful if inhaled. Also the ProVap unit gets wiped off with a water-dampened cloth. Very low key and does not irritate the skin.
Oh, to answer the other part of your question, yes, I'm treating across the board as there may be cross-transmission of varroa with the several swarms I've added. Until I know their resistance levels, they will all get this series. I did it in spring and attribute their profound success this year, to that initial treatment which freed them from wasting time and energy fighting varroa. In October, I wlll be doing mite counts to verify the effectiveness and will post a follow-up.
@@FrederickDunn I see. I've watched videos of this using both instruments. Some beekeepers are pretty relaxed about it and others were a disaster. (At least the way I saw it) I guess common sense and being prepared goes a long way! I'm looking forward to the follow up. By the way....your field of sunflowers is breathtaking!
Beekeeping questions: How are drone eggs laid? Do the workers lay them, since the queen's eggs are fertilized and turn into workers? Do the workers create a drone cell before the cell is filled or do they add on a room addition? Thanks for the great info as always.
HI Keith, the Queen generally is the layer and producer of all eggs in the hive. The workers decide how they develop and what they develop into with their highly specialized diet they assign. There are situations where a female worker begins to produce drone as they can only lay infertile eggs and all of those would be drones. It's a twisted diet-related world of wonder and the topic of much current research. It's the size of the cell and proteins fed during growth and development.
Now days we take advantage of brood breaks and do fewer treatments. Whenever there is a swarm, split, or low brood, that's a great treatment window. If the colony is building rapidly, I have a queen holding method that creates the treatment opportunity - www.fredsfinefowl.com/queencagemethod.html
🛫📖🛬 Mr. Dunn, After you did your three treatments with the vaporizer will you still do a dribble or drip method as your last treatment for the year before winter sets in?? Here in 7A, it is Wednesday the 10th of August and my landing board is full of drones being bitten and stung and decapitated right behind their crop. If I continue doing the sugar treatments and have a low might count (which I know is not going to be a favorite treatment by most people) could I get by with using just the dribble method and say late October or early November?? GOD Bless 📖🛐✈️🐆🐆🐆🐆🐆
Do you also block off every vent in your hives when applying it? If so is there a high outdoor temperature limit when you wouldn’t want to be blocking off all the air ventilation to prevent overheating the bees? It seldom gets below 80 here during summer even early mornings. Also do you use a Queen excluder in your horizontal hives to be able to separate the honey frames?
I don't use queen excluders, yes I close it up for 10 minutes. We don't do this mid-day, but apply generally within an hour of sunset so most of the population are inside.
Even More! If you go to the Blythewood Bee Company, I think he's actually cheaper than Amazon on this one. With my small apiary, I think it's basically going to last forever.
Hi Fred, another great vid, thanks. David over at Barnyard bees uses an insect fogger to apply oxalic acid. Could you recommend or comment on this method? It would be a lot cheaper than the $400 fogger you use ;-)
You will rarely have me say I dislike something... but I do dislike the fogger method and it's less effective. I think you'le find that Dave no longer uses that method and has gone to the ProVap also.
@@FrederickDunn Check this latest vaporizer in the USA out.Made out of stainless steel, no cheap copper parts. No cord, no battery, no generator needed. Laser cut. Professionally built. 1/2 price of generator operated one. Faster, vaps in 10-15 secs. What you need to buy is just a 1lb propane tank ($5). Shipped from Massachusetts. th-cam.com/video/5oYZMY0Cse8/w-d-xo.html
wouldn't it be better to start the vapor from the top? as the vapor cools, but not enough to have the acid drop out, it will go flow down and then drop out.
That's a great question, but the bees don't allow for temperature stratification as they move the air very fast throughout the hive. If the hive were unoccupied, what you're mentioning would make sense, but it's the bees that circulate it into every single nook and cranny. Thanks for sharing your idea.
@@FrederickDunn hey man. thanks for the reply! i saw the bottom near the observation hive was coated in white and thought it was just hitting the comb, cooling, and immediately falling out of the vapor.
Fred, I understand not to use OAV when supers are on with honey intended for human consumption. I have a box (not frames) that was exposed to OAV does that mean I should never use it as a super in the future ?
Hi John, I think you'll find that box to be just fine. Oxalic Levels that remain in future honey/wax/propolis, would be almost not discernable between treated and untreated hives. Oxalic acid is already present and introduced by the bees as they work the plants. I'm hitting dead ends regarding what the post-treatment levels are with exposed equipment and honey. The responses I've received suggest that the levels don't exist at high enough levels to make it "worth testing for". It's considered a soft organic acid that is derived from some of the healthiest greens we eat. Aside from not exposing honey for consumption, I'd feel comfortable sharing that your other hive components should be considered safe. Even with honey supers left on, it's difficult to find a variance in OA levels. The quest for knowledge in this area continues. Testing labs have no protocol for oxalis as it's not making the top 10 priority where honey is concerned.
I long for the day when Varroa is no longer a major problem. Probably will not see it in my life time but I have faith. It must have been a lot more fun in beekeeping before Varroa and hive beetles!
You know Stan, it may not be as far off as you think. There are Martha Carpenter Mite Maulers, Purdue Ankle Biters, VSH strains. There are people propogating hybrids of these bees successfully. I see the OA as a tool to hold off the varroa destructor's advance until we can incorporate these genetics into everyone's local stock and have a truly resistant honey bee with diversity. They will be named Apis mellifera adversus.
@@danskisbees7348Man, I sure hope we can get this varroa thing under control. It sure would make beekeeping MUCH more enjoyable. I hate seeing my girls have to suffer and put up with those peaky varroa bastards. When I first got started in bees I was so worried and fixated on things like ants, hornets, wax moths and then I relized that these are tiny tiny problems compared to varroa. Best of luck to you and your bees. We will be getting ours ready for the upcoming Michigan winter very soon. I hope my bees survive this winter. It would be nice to start saving money on not having to buy new packages every spring!
That's too broad of a question... as it depends on the zone you're in and what your seasons are like, as well as the quality of the land we're talking about.. I would suggest going to Eden Bros. Website and checking into pollinator friendly plants and going from there :)
It can work to some degree, but you have to open the hive frequently and directly powder the brood frame bees. This is far too distruptive in my opinion and may encourage your bees to abscond or at the least be very stressed by the frequent intrusion.
Hi Kay, unfortunately, SHBs are not zapped by OAV, how I wish they were as so many southern beekeepers are being inundated by those honey-slimers... May I never have to deal with them!
Not exactly, they feed on their stored fats and other nutritional resources while transmitting a number of viruses to the pupae. They use the capped pupa cells for egg-laying and protected reproduction.
They feed on them like a leech or a tick. It is a symbiotic type relationship and when the bee hatches the Varroa leaves the cell. That is why it is best to treat in fall if not an emergency. Less brood means you get more of the total mite population as they need brood to expand thier numbers. Usually there will be a few females and one or more males in a cell and the Varroa come out of the cell already mated and ready to spread eggs elsewhere.
My Saskatraz have pulled out a few pupae. But over all they are super strong. No varroa or pests. They almost have too much population and I am worried they may have too large of a colony and may starve to death. They built up FULL of honey but the queen will not slow down. All my Saskatraz colonies are my largest colonies. It is insane.
They definitely are booming in numbers - remember that often new colonies do well into the first winter and hold their own only to be overrun by varroa later in the year. Let me know how you're doing counts Carlos, I'd be very interested in the numbers. Also, the breeders for Saskatraz bees here in the U.S. are not controlling the mating stock, so we will probably see some variance in resistance. The breeders mentioned that they don't expect them to do well without some level of mite treatment which causes me to pay more attention to them. Thanks for sharing what yours are doing as always! :)
@@FrederickDunn I sent samples to the Bee Research Laboratory in Beltsville Maryland. Its a free service. Samples received of adult bees and beeswax comb (with and without bee brood) are examined for bacterial, fungal and microsporidian diseases as well as for two species of parasitic mites and other pests associated with honey bees (i.e., small hive beetle, Aethina tumida).
Also very interesting Maryland has a rare one called the gray petaltail. Only found in Maryland and is one of only 11 species in the world. Family goes back 150 million years. Very rare. We have them all over here which further proves I am in a very healthy wetland. I love bees. I had to learn about trees, flowers, weeds, plants, and other beneficial insects. It has gained me a wealth of knowledge about entomology and horticulture native trees, flowers, and just an awarness of biology.
Respectfully may I suggest you update-edit this video. We now know that 3 treatments 7 days apart will not kill off most of the mites. 7 days apart allows the mites to get into brood being capped. Eggs to capping. What is now being suggested is 3 to 5 days on the outside for 6 to seven treatments. 2 grams per super and oddly enough we still don't know what it is about OA that kills the mites. Thank you Mr. Dunn.
Hi Michael, 5-7 day intervals is what was approved. We track effectiveness with follow-up mite counts. When it comes to more treatment cycles or variable dosing beyond the approved treatment, I leave that to others. For example, a single treatment of OAV at the end of November, beginning of December can take out more than 90% of the phoretic mites when brood is at its lowest. Low brood periods can appear during periods of dearth which enhances the effectiveness of OAV. If the mite numbers don't come down when using the only approved OA which is Api-Bioxal, then it's time to use another approved treatment such as Formic Pro rather than simply modifying periodicity or dose. It really comes down to how far the mites have progressed before treatments are applied. I can't comply with your request to recommend going off-label. Others are certainly free to do so. I have to personally provide what's legal to do.
Based on what I observed on the landing boards, I did not stop to perform a sugar shake, I went straight to treatment. Those results would not alter my decision to do the three treatment regimen.
i think mite washes and sugar dusting is overrated and doesn't tell the real story and a friend killed his queen doing the alcohol wash didnt see her till it was to late
What you're suggesting is exactly what I'm doing here... allowing them to swarm and genetically blend with my weaver stock "seems" like a good idea, but after visiting with a genetics expert, she mentioned that when these traits are cross mated, the lower resistance is carried on, not the higher resistance to varroa. So... based on that, varroa resistant lines must be bred with other varroa resistant genetics or it fades.
It would not be too beneficial I would not think. The Beeweaver queen would quickly replace the Saskatraz stock and they would be all Beeweaver in there within two months. (in summer)
Great ..thank you so much for your answers.. However I wasn't thinking about waiting they swarm out as and just introduce a beaweaver mated queen su she can lay and replace with her resistant gens. Now would the saskatraz bees accept a beeweaver queen easily or not???
@@saleh67 The Saskatraz and BeeWeaver bees are cross-breeding easily and when making splits for example, they each accept fertile Queens from the other line.
Oh well 485.00 that is why it is so nice and works so great. Guess I have to stick to the other way it sweet, may be the price will go down in a couple of years
The OAV Irons work well also... the wands are very convenient and can run off of a battery, this unit requires an extension cord and real electricity. Larger bee yards would need a generator for it.
Just in case you're thinking I received the ProVap 110 at a discount or in exchange for a "plug" I paid full price and received no discount of any kind.
Who cares about how he gets his products that he using in his videos. If you are not a beginning beekeeper then it may not interest you. I am a beginning beekeeper and I have watched all 34 of this series on beginning beekeeping and have learned at least something in every one. Keep up the good work Fred!
@@mark-wn5ek I can't remember the last time Fred didn't buy a product. If something doesn't work for Fred or he doesn't like it, he's going to tell us or he just won't bring the product up. He also designs neat accessories for the hive that he has no interest in marketing. He supplies information in a unique and professionally crafted manner. When you find something that you like, that you paid for, I'm sure you probably tell people about it.
Sometimes I say it is good to not know how to read and write then you do not have to know about the problems yes you are a good person to talk to good man
Dear Frederick I have bought some oxalic acid. I've also made a vaporizer but I'm waiting delivery of the heater band. It will stop heating at 160C. Dod you see some startling young beekeepers a few years ago putting info on the net that they were suggesting not soldering the electrical connections as the temperature from the glowplugs they were using would melt the solder! Some were mentioning temps that would definitely change the fumes from Oxalic acid to formic acid and carbon monoxide, if Iv'e got the transformation correct due to overheating the oxalic acid. The main reason for my question is that over three days I've seen 2 minute grey insects walking about on the sticky sheet that I've now changed for vasilene instead. I wonder if these two insects are varroa. I killed one and put it in alcohol with a view to putting it under a microscope-----more expense! I thought the varroa were red not grey? is there a sure fire way to confirm the accuracy of what I'm looking at? I'm sorry to keep firing questions to you. Incidentally the heat treatment of varroa appeals to me and I'm building an insulated box that will bve controlled with a Chinese STC1000 controller. They are supposed to be accurate to .3 C. I've checked the temps with a good qual laser thermometer and indeed the device seems accurate and the differential also is .3 degC accurate. I'll be blowing air into the insulated box off our heating system radiator which is 50C.(why didn't I think of that before?) In any case the rad has a thermostatic valve which is quite controllable re the primary heat source. There's a bench top over the rad as well so It will work admirably. The bench top is always usually 25C. I measured the very accurate electric oven and while 4 frames would fit in it is either 40C or 45C which is either side of the appropriate temp which is advised as 41C to kill Varroa mites at all stages and especially in the capped brood frames. I was going to heat the bottom of this new hive but I've decided to go with your oxalic acid fumigation back end and winter to kill mites on the bees but if required heat frames earlier than the bees treatment when it's cooler.
@@FrederickDunn Oh, just wondering. I was hoping you lived nearby, I live in Michigan so our weather and temps are similar. I get frustrated taking advice from beeks in southern areas or tropical areas because much of what they do will not apply in our region.
@@FrederickDunn Yep, these long depressing never-ending freezing Michigan winters are getting old! If I were a rich man (I am a public school teacher) I would move somewhere with plenty of sunshine and warm days! I am sure my bees would appreciate the warmth too.
@@FrederickDunn supposed to be in the 70s today I'm going to try to do a really good check make sure I have queens and all and see if any of them needs to be taken down to one box cuz we supposed to have some 30° weather next week
If that video doesn't prove to the doubters that OA isn't harmful to the bees I don't know what will. I wish more people understood just how deadly mites can be especially over winter waiting for spring. It makes me think a large percentage of hives that don't make it are because of mites.
I have to agree, that many colony die-offs are due to the impact that varroa and the diseases they carry have on the bees. When I observe the results after OAV treatments, I have to look back over the years and wonder why I didn't give them that boost all along. I'm late to the OA treatment game and I'll know more in spring when I see how they cope through winter with this advantage. Thank you for watching and commenting.
Thanks Ashby, I am using, and have always used the correct filter. I invite you to learn a little more about them 3M Organic Vapor/Acid Gas Cartridge/Filter 60923, P100 Respiratory Protection. I welcome all challenges :) I believe you may have been looking at the respirator listing, not the filter listing.
You have one breed of bees that have good resistance to varoa and another breed that have poor resistance to varoa. Isn't that telling you that you have poor genetics that doesn't make economic sense to not only sustain but to propagate from. There is a fair bit of research now telling us that feral bees have much better disease resistance than managed hives and it is a much cheaper way of acquiring bees. All beekeepers should keep the opening sentence in the book -Beekeeping for all by Abbe Warre in mind. Apiculture or beekeeping is the art of managing bees with the intention of getting the maximum return from this work with the minimum of expenditure.
Hi Ben, thank you for commenting. We are continuing to monitor feral colonies of honeybees to see how they are surviving with our current pest and environmental challenges. The problem is that more than 90% of the feral colonies targeted for observation/study died out last winter. As a backyard beekeeper without commercial pressures, I am free to watch, learn, experiment and then of course, share the findings. If I were a bee-breeder, I would definitely have a different approach. For me, the "maximum return" is in knowledge, not monetary gain. Feral bees tend to swarm out often which results in breaks in varroa which is one way they are surviving. When a feral colony completely abandons a tree or other cavity, wax moths and other insect residents move in and consume the old comb - when the cavity is re-occupied by another feral colony, they seal it all up with propolis (antibacterial envelope) and then construct new comb and begin again. What seems to be continuous occupancy by feral bees often isn't "continuous". We have a lot to learn from feral bees and those studies will certainly continue. If someone is going into commercial beekeeping, the financial bottom line will certainly dictate their approach from hive construction to the genetics selected for maximum production. My viewers are largely backyard hobby beekeepers - most of the commercial keepers in my State are always treating their bees and most don't monitor for mites as that's "too time-consuming". I think the Saskatraz bees have many promising traits I will continue to see how they cope with our northern winters. Non-commercial beekeepers like myself, as with free-ranging chickens, are not guided by the financial bottom line - and will probably spend more than what may be gained financially. The rewards are a lifelong pursuit of bee knowledge.
@@FrederickDunn I think you misjudge what most beginning beekeepers are prepared to spend on equipment. Its a mistake for beginning beekeepers to think they should buy flow hives, uneeded acid treatments trying to sustain colonies that are obviously failing and bees from different climates that are not adapted to their local environment. The bottom line is that for beekeeping to be popular everyone of limited financial means has to understand that beekeeping can have a good return on investment. That's why Abbe Warre called his book Beekeeping for All.
Ben K you seem to be completely out of touch here. Mr Dunn has demonstrated a thoughtful approach to intervention when it's required. How did you determine that the Saskatraz bees are failing? 90% of the commercial bees are requiring treatment. Where are you coming from?
@@MrSydjf HI Ben, I never tell people what to buy, I share information and leave it to them. In my first FlowHive video, I close it out by sharing how inexpensive Langstroth kits are. There are many ways to keep bees on a budget.
@@masterbeekeeper30years18 You obviously live in a different paradigm. The evidence is right before your eyes. Treatment free or natural beekeeping is being practiced around the world by amateurs and professionals without thinking they have to throw money at disease problems.
Please explain how these chemicals have destroyed your health and "God's Creatures"? If your family consumes a pound of carrots, you've ingested more oxalic acid than is in an entire treatment in a beehive. Please explain your position further? If the bees decline and die from varroa infestation and the diseases they have vectored, is that your preference. My mind is open and I'm very happy to have this discussion.
Let’s use your logic then. Allow the bees to collect oxalic acid on their own and consume it. I don’t force my family to eat a pound of carrots neither should you force bees
And yes it’s much better to allow the bees to die then to meddle with their health. There’s a reason why people are sicker than ever and bees the same. Chemicals, natural un natural have destroyed the health of food, life, everything. When you become dependent on treating a symptom instead of the root cause you will never have true health. The wisdom of man is foolishness to god
@@BlessedBeJESUSCHRIST I didn't see a question in there. I'll continue doing the best I can for the bees in my care and I am certain that you'll do the same.
I know years ago when Apistan was used to kill the mites there were 2 unintended consequences. 1. The mites developed resistance to the pesticide. 2. Because the wax was reused over and over again to make foundation the wax foundation became more and contaminated eventually making the bees sick and dead. Will this not be the case with the use of OVA?
HI Bill, OAV has not shown to cause resistant bees. It's a naturally occuring acid that comes from plants and is already present in all bee comb. The levels of OA in the wax from treated and untreated hives are almost not measurable. It's a very different treatment.
I’m not sure why US requires honey supers to be removed prior to OAV treatment. There is no such requirement in Europe and there is OA in honey.
HI Steve! That is extremely interesting to me! I have been trying to get testing performed on honey here in the United States prior to and after oav exposure. Not one lab has a protocol for that test and many simply state that pre and post-treatment OA residue differences are almost "not measurable". Would you be willing to send me a link to an English explanation regarding OAV being permitted when honey supers are on? I am running into walls here in the U.S. when I try to get detailed information as to why we must isolate our honey supers. I look forward to learning more from you on the subject! Thank YOU.
Frederick Dunn I’m in the US too. I got that data from a local beer chap who lived in Europe and maintains a cadre of beekeeping friends there though I didn’t ask him which country but he alluded to it being Europe wide.
@@romoshka1 I really need a solid reference so I can speak about it to my viewers :) Thanks for the follow-up Steve! I did receive some information from Michigan State U. regarding why it's not approved by our FDA.... boils down to no one wanting to fund the testing required.
@@FrederickDunn Hey Fred. I'm not sure if it's part of the law up here, but we get the same instructions as the US: pull off honey supers when treating with Oxalic vapour.
Yes we do have to remove honey suppers when using any kind of varoa treatment. Even with oxalic acid. Greetings from Slovenia / Europe
Showing the vaporization of the observation hive was brilliant! Great video!
I like this guy. He's like the Bob Ross of beekeeping. Happy bees, happy bees.....
Thank you for that very flattering comment. It's also funny because Bob Ross and I have a lot in common. We both had military careers, we both learned the wet-on-wet painting technique from Bill Alexander, we both decided to make up for our military exploits by later becoming nice to everyone in every possible situation. I don't obviously have his awesome head of hair (which he hated and only got because a perm saved him money on haircuts) which became his visual brand. So, thank YOU! Did you know that Bob was never paid a single dime for any of his Public Television Oil Painting programs? It's true... he did it for free. He also never sold a single painting... me, being a capitalist, sold hundreds of paintings during my life and will do more when I really retire. :)
@@FrederickDunn The four core pillars of good people in our society. Mister Rodgers, Bob Ross, Keanu Reeves, and Fred Dunn.
With half that group being not alive anymore the pressure is on Keanu and Fred.
I have said it before Fred needs a show. The joy of beekeeping. On PBS this fall.
@@FrederickDunn
Mr. Dunn,
Bob Ross was a standard in our home we never missed any of his programs. we all began taking art lessons because of him.
He may be gone but never forgotten.
His name was brought up in a conversation just yesterday and that hair was part of the convo.
Now I understand why your work through the lens is nothing but pure art!!! 👍
📖🛐✈️🐆🐆🐆🐆🐆🐝🐝🐝🐝🐝🐝🐝🐝
Nice to see their reaction in the observation hive.
Yes, that was totally a treat to see. I was drawn to that channel mainly because he films stuff from there sometimes with his swarming footage from inside being really amazing to see. i did not know bees could run that fast!
@@evilgibson Bees change flight speed also. They can carry enough sugar in their flight muscles to power an hour of flight but normally they carry enough sugar for 15 minutes of flight or about 5.5 km of distance.
When bees feed on rich sugar solutions they can fly as fast as 29 km/h while a dilute solution results in slower flight speeds of 4 to 7 km/h
When the blood sugar concentrations fall to 1 percent in the flight muscles, the forager can no longer fly and you will find the bee laying there tired wanting a drink.
@@weasleoop i was talking about the knees bent running around inside the hive. instead of the general wandering chill mood they are absolutely tearing up comb running out.
@@evilgibson Yeah I know. Was just tossing knowledge out there.
@@weasleoop That's nice to know Carlos. I do the same thing when I get a sugar rush, except I can't fly, lol. But sometimes I do in my dreams, it's been a while though.
This is EXCELLENT info as always Fred! I am so relieved to see their reaction and LACK of panic to OAV. A friend and I were talking about OAV on my live-stream last week. We both had a lot of questions about it. You have answered everything I think! I will be sharing this with him and on my live-stream next week. Another excellent FFB production!
So glad to help and thank you for sharing what I do :) It's always great to see your comments!
Well you make great content worth sharing.. So it's really your fault.. :) I always enjoy our interactions too!
The Farmacy Seeds Network using my provap clone and forgot to rag the entrance. Ran around front to put the rag in place and saw bees boiling out. Quickly put the rag in place but it was too late...too many were out and I was sans veil and they did a number on me.
@@romoshka1 Ouch! That's why I ALWAYS wear the suit.. I am very comfortable around my bees now.. but my friend Matt mentioned to me "If things go south, you'll be glad you are covered"... and it made me think of it every time I go out. I'm sorry to hear about your mishap! I hope you are getting over the stings and get a "clean vape" on them.. :)
Fred. I don't think people realize what your doing. This is awesome. Fred you are so awesome. Thank you and people doing this. No bees no life on this planet.
This was an excellent OAV demonstration! It's nice to see you turn to a light treatment Mr Dunn and I look forward to your wintering results with the Saskatraz line! We're watching!!!
I'll chime in with another round of thanks for the video. It WAS great to see the reaction of the bees in th observation hive: NO STRESS. Definitely the way to go for treatment. Hope you get those little beasties contained.
Within two days, no more dead bees of any stage of development on any of the landing boards, so it's looking great so far. Thanks Tony!
Fred is that your backyard with all those flowers it's beautiful. You got it going on my friend that's beautiful. Bee Paradise
Yes, it is indeed :) thanks
What a fantastic video as always and what a technician in the making of such helpful videos which are packed full of educational data. Thank you so much for your second to none help. You are indeed one in millions.
Glad you enjoyed it! Thank you so much!
Awesome Fred! It's nice to see what goes on in the hive during treatment. I like the corkscrew.
I love the education you are providing.
Thanks for sharing. I always wondered what the bees did when such treatments were administered. Last month I placed formic acid pads and the stress they endured was terrible ... within a two week period only 10% of the bees remained, and quickly after the colony collapsed. I think they died because particularities to my horizontal hive made it impossible for the bees to naturally and properly vent the hive. I wouldn’t recommend filming the use of formic acid. Anyway, the filming of the bees as you applied a gas treatment was incredibly fascinating. Thanks!
Your story of the bees being killed off is all too familiar. I have no intention of using formic. Thank you for sharing that valuable information.
Sorry to hear that George. I hear a lot of stories like that too. You could accidentally over dose the OA and the bees would be okay.
Thanks for mentioning that you have heard similar stories ... the worst part is watching them suffer ... I could hold my breath and immediately leave the area ... the bees could not
Deluxe delivery of precious information, thank you!
By the way Frederick = love all your videos and doing a lot following you in your ways. Near Spring must ask you the subject of how to coax bees to use the Flow Hive =if needed that is? That is if there are any bees left ---if and when the dastardly Varroa mites leave any healthy hygienic bees alive after the winter? Did I buy a second 'Flow' bee hive much too soon ? Time and nature will tell ! PS great deal of bee action yesterday due to a balmy 15 c in the sun yesterday. They are definitely making avery sunny day count! not a sign of a bee some miserable days!. They are just incredible.
This was great I have screen bottoms some how I have to close them up right. I got the other wans that u showed us last time and the jumper box all that but this is really a cool way to do it. I have some hives that the opening is not big enough for the wan but this will work great the way u just did here. Oh man u just don"t know how wonderful your videos are I have not even finished watching it yet. But wanted to tell u.
Thank you Frances! :)
Thx Fred, did my first oav treatment yesterday with my homemade “vap110”. You do an outstanding job of explaining everything. 👍
Your flowers are BEAUTIFUL!!
Thank you so much!
Great info !
Dear Frederick Thank you for the reply. It's strange though it ages since I messaged you??????? We've been so disappointed this season
compared with last year. No honey in the now. 3 Flow frames. The bees are hard at it and are working in the flow frames for over two months now but it's been a poor Summer and Spring was not musch better.
I put one extra shallow super on two hives but it's not that as they are full of honey. The one that is the original hive we got 50lbs of honey from last year (40 out of the Flow frame and 10lbs in the Autumn) but this hive does not have 2 shallows on under the Flow frame but one.
So they must be eating the honey due to the poor weather. = Wettest July for yonks!
I hope your situation is much better than ours..... April swarms from the biggest colony even though they had space. The hose pipe had little effect on them and was only temporary......
My wife & I got plenty of stings many through our suits as well...... The new Queen seems to have settled them.
Interesting that this is the hive that had a massive infestation of varroa when I bought them (1300 killed within a couple of months) (300 on the first drop) you said that's awful! The 'strips' have worked wonders. I know I know it's bending the rules but hey, it works!
Perhapse I should not mention this success?
best wishes & hope you have loads of lovely honey.
I used the Pro Vap 110 as well and it is very effective. I credit the multiple treatments I did last fall is what saved my colonies throughout winter. The only difference I do from what you did Fred is a initiate the treatment through the front at the entrance hole. I do that mainly so that the pro-vac 110 device will rest easily on the landing board. This ensures that I do not break the delivery spout that you’re sticking the quarter inch hole at the back. I find the weight of the gun will damage the spout overtime if you do not hold onto it or support it somehow.
Through the front, the initial "blast" directly impacts open brood during the warm season. Introducing it via the back, or upper part of the box greatly reduces that heat and the intense puff of oa. True, it's much better to support the unit, though it hasn't failed to date, it's a great idea to not let the copper tube support the entire unit. Thanks for sharing your ideas and use.
Thanks for this timely video! I’m removing supers next weekend and will be starting this same treatment right after that. I just got the $150 ‘Easy Vap’ and will be giving it a full test. That shot into your observation hive was fantastic. I’ve never treated with oxalic but seeing that footage put me much more at ease. I always wondered what actually happened in the hive. Great job!
I agree with you Vino Farm watching it inside the hive cinches it for me i was of the thinking they are distressed i love your channel by the way!!
You are very welcome as always, and it's always a nice treat to see your comments! I have to catch up on some of your videos one of these days!
I really enjoy how timely and relevant your video topics are. I am a first year beekeeper. I was told that in the first year I don’t need to worry about Verona mites and treatment this year would be unnecessary. I know everyone has different opinions regarding routine and technique but this sounds way too serious to hope I’m ok first year. I’ve only ever had dead bees on the landing board right after removing supers. Do you agree with the advice I was given?
HI Rick, thank you for this valuable question. There is some validation in the approach that the first year bees are installed IF they are a varroa resistant line, that they may not require any varroa or other potential infection interventions. You will hear other experienced beekeepers flatly state that "if you don't treat, ALL of your bees will be dead in less than three years". So many voices and words of beekeeping wisdom, each with their own experiences and approaches. Here is my personal philosophy on any pest management approach - learn about the pest and its life cycle - determine if the pest is present in damaging numbers - intervene if and when the bees are not coping on their own. My approach has always been, colonies that survive are good, colonies that don't make it just didn't have the level of resistance needed. I'm moderately altering course this year in order to see if my winter die-offs are due to the "cold" or the ever-present challenge of parasites inside the hive. Let's talk about the "first year don't need to worry" philosophy/advice - If you receive package bees, for example, I say treat them upon arrival as all of the bees are exposed as are the mites. Many beekeepers report receiving package bees with mite loads already on their bodies. If I capture a swarm, after the first week in the hive, I would "now" treat them with OAV before any of the brood is capped - again, that's because 100% of the bees and larvae are exposed to the treatment. I personally would not wait until losses are higher, or varroa numbers are at destructive density as they will then have much more to overcome. Remember that it's not just the varroa, but the diseases they are bringing with them. I think I will have to discuss this in greater detail in future FAQ videos as it's very important. If the varroa are present and growing in numbers, and your bees are not keeping those numbers at manageable levels, then I would not hesitate to assist those bees with an approved intervention method, no matter how long you've had the bees. I wish you well in your beekeeping journey, and thank you so much for watching! :)
I was told the samething my first year. The supplier said: "We've discussed it and we feel that the bees are relatively mite free." I didn't know any better, I didn't know about TH-cam beeks, I didn't have a mentor. Like Fred said, you have to test and go from there. You don't know whether or not your bees are robbing out someone else's failed colony, which has become a mite bomb.
congratulations for your victory in the first battle against Varoa
Left work early for this! Thanks for another great video. Love my 2 sask hives. I received them(6/28) maybe 2 weeks before the other 3 nucs I have, and as a beginner they seem to be far ahead in population and stores. Both hives took another box(10 frame full) by 8/5. Only one of the other 3 have grown enough to add a box. Maybe it’s timing,pure luck, breeders, or the 10 extra days I’ve had them. Thoughts,anyone???
Don't know where you are, but here it has been a STELLAR bee/honey / resource season.. maybe that's a factor where you are too. But congrats! I am planning splits in the spring!
I started my Saskatraz colonies in June as well.
@@weasleoop Yours and Fred's have exploded. That was good hygienic behavior they were displaying.
Dear Frederick I have always though that parasites are reprehensible. Urrrrh ......... I can bare with the bees that something is sucking the life out of them. I was bitten by a tick in October and three weeks of Doxycycline later to counteract the lime disease I recovered OK.
Seeing 6 dead removed bees with the wing virus galvanised me into action so I vaped them. Did the vapour penetrate all the bees though? I worry about them. Mick Hall
Awesome to see the observation hive. Thank You. I've been wanting to ask your opinion on the slatted rack?We only have 3 hives, one with a slatted rack it looks like if, for no other reason the racks work great for treating OA. We're using (been using) OA in a fogger and hope it's doing the job (my daughter don't want me to do a "wash")(:. Thanks again
I use slatted racks. They are great for winter. I use slatted racks and know about slatted racks because of Fred. The master beekeeper.
I'm a first year beekeeper and just finished an OA vaporization treatment (middle August). Before the treatment my three hives were doing great. At the beginning of August I mite washed them and the mite count was at 3%. I smoked the entrances before vaporization and used 2 grams of OA in each hive because I have single deeps with one medium for my brood chambers and then a queen excluder isolating the supers above from the queen. I used a piece of cardboard as a barrier to isolate my supers from the OA. After the treatment I inspected my hives and had one missing queen with no eggs or larvae and all capped brood in the hive and one queen that was not laying. The other hive was doing great like nothing ever happened. I thought OA was supposed to be one of the least aggressive treatments for mites but two out my three hives took a drastic downturn after/during the treatment. I wondering if it was the OA or if it was just something that happened with the hive that I wasn't aware since I didn't inspect them during the treatment period.
All I can say is that I've not had that negative impact on my colonies. I'd continue investigating for other possible causes.
Interested to see the boards from your follow on treatments!
I know years ago when Apistan was used to kill the mites there were 2 unintended consequences. 1. The mites developed resistance to the pesticide. 2. Because the wax was reused over and over again to make foundation the wax foundation became more and contaminated eventually making the bees sick and dead. Will this not be the case with the use of OVA?
Both of those concerns are not a side effect of OAV. Thank goodness.
Good Morning Mr. Dunn! I’m a day late on this video, but what great information. Loved the Observation Hive treatment. Very cool to see how they react to the OAV.
Question: The Beekeeper Association over here is telling everyone to use formic acid paddies first and then follow up with OAV a few weeks later... Formic seems to affect the bees where OAV does not... Can you think of a reason why both would be needed?
Again, thanks for the incredible FAQ’s, I get so much out of them.
Dear Larry... because we've become friends and are brothers at arms... formic acid patties have killed many beekeeper's bees... the results are wide and varied with lots of horror stories about lost colonies. You will be fine if you use three OAV treatments 7 days apart... it's the only thing I currently endorse or would personally use on my own bees. I'm probably already getting kicked out of the treatment-free "club"... and that's also ok.
Frederick Dunn - Thank you Sir! Great to know!
Also, sorry that folks would rather put their bees at risk rather than treat. But OA is a natural occurring acid in foods... So then are you really guilty of treating? I’ll speak up for you at the Treatment Free Court Marshal. 🤣
@@LarryLeesBees Thanks Larry.. and there is already oxalic acid present in every single honeycomb sample according those who know :)
Come on Fred. Lets have a video of when drone kick out day is going to happen. My hives are still producing drones currently but I can feel the chill in the air. Enough to move my bananna trees in soon.
Porvap 110 is $485 Think I'll stick with my black flag fogger. Thanks for the video. Great job.
The new InstantVap is my current favorite OAV system. I get it, they are expensive. No problem.
I am also a master bee keeper you are doing a great job.
Thanks, Greg :)
The temperature of the steam suddenly rushing into the colony probably annoys them more than the vapor. Kind of like getting splashed by cold water when you don’t expect it.
Meant to mention that I was elated to see you put the observation hive back up again and I enjoy seeing it in action. Great video Fred, you do such a fantastic job describing the intricacies of beekeeping making it simple and understandable. Gotta prep for winter as it will be here before you know it as I’m sure you know 👍🏻😃
Thanks and yes, the weather could turn for the worst at any moment!
Congratulations from Roumania!
Well Fred where do you buy your ax acid mech. as your mech. is diffrant to others I have seen. Rob.
www.betterbee.com/medicine-and-pest-management/oxalic-acid-35grams.asp
Let’s assume their is no brood in the super. Before 1st treatment you remove any super (with or without honey) then treat. Assuming you will harvest honey later.
How long do wait to reintroduce the super back to the hive. Do you keep it isolated for the 3 treatment sequence?
HI Judd, you can replace the honey super right away - and that's only if you want to extract the honey for human consumption, if you are allowing the bees to store up for winter, then those supers may remain even during treatment.
Frederick Dunn< I may be over thinking this but isn’t the purpose of treating (in this manner) is to deposit micro ox acid throughout the hive on virtually every surface, including the bee’s, wood frames and comb and if you isolate the super during treatment then when it is reintroduced the previously treated bee’s will contaminate the once isolated super.
I’ve read that you only want to use a ox acid that is blessed by the “FDA” and I assume that is because of the residual contamination. Apparently the oxacid sold at a big box store used to clean fencing is inappropriate for this application.
@@judd_s5643 It is true that it settles on every surface it contacts and results in micro crystal dusting. You definitely want the properly labeled and classified OAC for bee hive use. As for contamination of the restored honey supers that would have a potential health impact on the honey consumed - please link that study as that's very interesting and new, to me. Much appreciated. Definitely do NOT use the wood-bleach grade that is sold in construction centers - I guess I should have mentioned more than to say "properly labeled". Thanks for that.
@@FrederickDunn What happens if the bees do not use all the honey up over winter and then move honey around and move it up into harvest-able honey supers next year?
@@weasleoop My personal practice has always been to remove winter honey frames when the spring nectar flow begins. As part of my "new" observations, I will have to sample that honey and get it tested for OA residue so see if it matches untreated colony levels. I need greater understanding regarding what the "real" health threats are if someone ingests oxalic acid in honey. One science-based researcher argued that a pound of carrots already contains more oxalic acid than is used to treat a hive of bees. So I think that in order to really consume a damaging dose of oxalic acid, an individual would be consuming gallons of honey even if the beekeeper were negligent and left capped honey supers on. I have lots of questions myself and hope to get some biochemical responses from experts in the area. I think since this is an approved method, that they are setting the safety standards very high as a fail-safe measure. This is a highly polarizing area and I need to defer to expert sources.
Are these Olivarez Sask or imported Sask. Just an FYI they cut the line in California if they are. and are NOTHING compared to the Candian ones that are directly raised up there.
The only autorized breeder in the U.S. was the OHB family in California. They have their own breeding/mating yards for their breeder queens, so there is some varience in genetics. They sell through Mann Lake. If you want pure Saskatraz, you have to go to Canada. Unless something has changed.
Questions about propolis: How do bees transport it? Does a forager go off just for propolis, or do they carry it back with their pollen and nectar?
Thanks again for the great info.
Great question Keith! Propolis foragers just being in those resins and no pollen on the same trip. They are foraging specialists.
Frederick this is so very helpful to me. I’m so grateful for you. I hope you know that.
I’m just now using OAV with my FlowHive and am placing the OA pipe in under the back pest tray area (pest tray removed) and angling it upwards a tad.
Question. Will the OAV be hindered by that FlowHive metal grid or is this a good method? My front entrances are blocked because of Hivegates. And does it matter if the treatment is applied from the bottom up or the top down?
I like the idea of carving a hole. Super grateful.
HI Brad, I'm not sure how you contained the vapor inside the hive with the tray removed? You really need an enclosed box so the vapor remains controlled for 10 minutes. If they just blow it out through the bottom, then it's not going to be very effective in my opinion.
I forgot to mention that all my flow hives are completely sealed off on the bottom with 1.5” insulation foam board and tape!
Fred great video. I was wondering if the OAV will still work with the capped brood? And what time of year should we do this? Again, thanks for all the great informative videos you create. You are the best.....
does not work through capped brood, this is why we have to perform 3 treatments at 7 days apart so that all bees are eventually exposed.
Me again. ;)
Have you considered trying to cross Beweaver and Saskatraz? (I don't know if you produce queens or not). I'm thinking it might make a great combo (or a FrankenBee)!
I let the m do what they want and since I have both lines in my apiary, I can only assume that they are already doing that. :) My only Queen Production is to pull frames of brood with queen cells and start new colonies. I don't do any grafting or OTS Queen Rearing...
A few quick questions: How soon after adding a new 3# box of bees to my hive would you recommend giving them a treatment? Also, is after doing the 3 tandem treatments, would you recommend the 3 week interval for the remainder of the season? Lastly, where did you get that solar owl head?!?! LOL. That must work great for the skunks / racoons / possums. Thanks Fred
Hi Rich, if you suspect your package may have varroa mites, you can knock them out with a single oav treatment after they have been hived for up to 9 days from install. I wouldn't do it before that as it may impact queen acceptance.
First year bee keeper and I was wondering if you can feed syrup right after an oxalic acid vaporization treatment? I waited too long to treat I think and it seems to be coinciding with when I should be feeding. We started with two hives and we are down to one hive in a two deep box hive. I wanted to get a little more syrup on before the weather gets too cold. I am in Connecticut. We had a pretty bad drought this year. I love your videos. Thanks!
Watch today's Q&A for this answer :)
Just FYI - I have read many places that the OA crystals stay in the hive for about 4 days. So any mites that emerge with hatching bees will die during that period. After that, the efficacy declines and mites that exit could possibly make their way into another cell right before it is capped. That means you should treat about every 4-5 days over a 24 day period when drones are still in production. If it is very late in the season and you are pretty sure the queen is no longer laying, then a 21 day treatment period would suffice. This will be more effective than only treating 3 times over 21 days, and as you said, the bees will be fine. So will the honey be if it is only for personal consumption.
I would be happy to read that study and invite you to share the link here. I'm always open to new learning. Thanks Doug.
@@FrederickDunn I found one that is referenced in different sites and was put out by Dadant. It comes up as a pdf, so I'm not able to attach that, but a general search for Dadant Oxylic Acid will yield the pdf. Having said that, another article from Scientific Beekeeping suggested one treatment per week. Perhaps no one really knows? I guess I figure if it isn't known to be harmful to the bees, I'd rather treat a little more frequently to kill any that might have emerged. Cheers!
Hello Fred. I try to watch all your videos and just watched this one as per your reply to my message re another of your videos = 2021 latest I believe. I suppose they instinctively move away from any 'perceived' threat. Do we know how they 'feel' though. The saying, being cruel to be kind applies in this instance where we apply a noxious substance to treat the threat of the nasty Varroa mite.
Eventually it is hoped that natural immunity will happen for bees. Those bees who realise if they are clean and vigilant and spot anything red on themselves or their relations =knock em off and munch em. pass the word --get em outa here! God forbid - a red under the bed?
Genetics are definitely the long term goal. All we have regarding determining how the bees are impacted, is their behavior immediately after treatment. Since they return to business as usual right away, and the queen continues to lay eggs etc... an "assumption" is made that the impact is minimal regarding the bees and brood. Some other treatments result in instant responses that include dying bees, and often queen loss.
Thank You Sir..👊🇯🇲👍
Have you seen a big enough difference between the beeweaver and saskatraz bee in production and temperment to justify keeping them since they need treatments
That is a great question Greg - I am willing to keep the Saskatraz bees, even if they require a couple of treatments per year as they just may be top performers coming through winter. My evaluation of that line continues. They are still improving the varroa resistance in the line and I'm happy to support that by buying their Queens. Years ago when I started buying in BeeWeaver Queens, they were not as good as they are today and we need these breeders to be able to continue their improvements with survivor genetics. Another aspect of treating them is that I will personally know more about how they respond to OAV and I'll need those records and observations through many seasons.
@@FrederickDunn have you seem a big difference in their honey production over the beeweavers
@@gregwaskom552 Yes, they are currently doing a tad better than the BeeWeaver bees in honey production.
My Saskatraz are bigger producers of both brood and honey than my beeweavers. Also they have no pests. They were beeweavers at first and then were headed up by a Saskatraz Queen at first so maybe that is why.
They are SUPER docile. I work the hives with no suit, no smoke and they send zero guard bees at me. They are calm on the combs, and ignore that I am even there.
If they produce more honey and are this docile I love them. My only thing is testing to see how hygienic they are and how well they overwinter.
@@weasleoop If your bees are that docile then they won't make it in the long run. Defensiveness is a critical survivor trait. Your bees are acting like sheep. There are too many wolves.
Excellent in every way! Thank you. I am curious to know if you wash the gloves and clothing you were wearing after treatments? Did you treat every single hive?
Thanks again Fred, your videos are so full of information and details.
Thanks Mary, the oxalic crystals are not harmful to the touch and they wash off in regular water. It's the vapor that's potentially harmful if inhaled. Also the ProVap unit gets wiped off with a water-dampened cloth. Very low key and does not irritate the skin.
Oh, to answer the other part of your question, yes, I'm treating across the board as there may be cross-transmission of varroa with the several swarms I've added. Until I know their resistance levels, they will all get this series. I did it in spring and attribute their profound success this year, to that initial treatment which freed them from wasting time and energy fighting varroa. In October, I wlll be doing mite counts to verify the effectiveness and will post a follow-up.
@@FrederickDunn I see. I've watched videos of this using both instruments. Some beekeepers are pretty relaxed about it and others were a disaster. (At least the way I saw it) I guess common sense and being prepared goes a long way! I'm looking forward to the follow up. By the way....your field of sunflowers is breathtaking!
Beekeeping questions: How are drone eggs laid? Do the workers lay them, since the queen's eggs are fertilized and turn into workers? Do the workers create a drone cell before the cell is filled or do they add on a room addition? Thanks for the great info as always.
HI Keith, the Queen generally is the layer and producer of all eggs in the hive. The workers decide how they develop and what they develop into with their highly specialized diet they assign. There are situations where a female worker begins to produce drone as they can only lay infertile eggs and all of those would be drones. It's a twisted diet-related world of wonder and the topic of much current research. It's the size of the cell and proteins fed during growth and development.
Hi Frederick! Long time no talk. Here learning from you once again!! Thank you. Are you still doing 3 treatments 7 days apart or has that changed?
Now days we take advantage of brood breaks and do fewer treatments. Whenever there is a swarm, split, or low brood, that's a great treatment window. If the colony is building rapidly, I have a queen holding method that creates the treatment opportunity - www.fredsfinefowl.com/queencagemethod.html
🛫📖🛬
Mr. Dunn,
After you did your three treatments with the vaporizer will you still do a dribble or drip method as your last treatment for the year before winter sets in??
Here in 7A, it is Wednesday the 10th of August and my landing board is full of drones being bitten and stung and decapitated right behind their crop.
If I continue doing the sugar treatments and have a low might count (which I know is not going to be a favorite treatment by most people) could I get by with using just the dribble method and say late October or early November??
GOD Bless
📖🛐✈️🐆🐆🐆🐆🐆
I personally never do the dribble method, only OAV. I can't really give personal experience information during cold weather and dribble.
Do you also block off every vent in your hives when applying it? If so is there a high outdoor temperature limit when you wouldn’t want to be blocking off all the air ventilation to prevent overheating the bees? It seldom gets below 80 here during summer even early mornings. Also do you use a Queen excluder in your horizontal hives to be able to separate the honey frames?
I don't use queen excluders, yes I close it up for 10 minutes. We don't do this mid-day, but apply generally within an hour of sunset so most of the population are inside.
@@FrederickDunn I’d probably have to do it at 1st light at the coolest time of day. It’s in the 90s here at sunset. Thanks
Mr Dunn is it ok to do O/A Vap with candy boards in place ?
Absolutely, it's just fine.
I sure do enjoy your videos keep up the good work.
Thank you so much!
Hi Fred, is that vaporizer as expensive as it looks?
Even More! If you go to the Blythewood Bee Company, I think he's actually cheaper than Amazon on this one. With my small apiary, I think it's basically going to last forever.
ahh the most interesting beekeeper alive seems to have deep pockets!!! they are expensive adn christmas is coming!!! thanks mr dunn!
Blythewood Bee Company had a ProVap giveaway a while ago, maybe they will do that again.
Hi Fred, another great vid, thanks. David over at Barnyard bees uses an insect fogger to apply oxalic acid. Could you recommend or comment on this method? It would be a lot cheaper than the $400 fogger you use ;-)
You will rarely have me say I dislike something... but I do dislike the fogger method and it's less effective. I think you'le find that Dave no longer uses that method and has gone to the ProVap also.
@@FrederickDunn Check this latest vaporizer in the USA out.Made out of stainless steel, no cheap copper parts. No cord, no battery, no generator needed. Laser cut. Professionally built. 1/2 price of generator operated one.
Faster, vaps in 10-15 secs. What you need to buy is just a 1lb propane tank ($5).
Shipped from Massachusetts.
th-cam.com/video/5oYZMY0Cse8/w-d-xo.html
wouldn't it be better to start the vapor from the top? as the vapor cools, but not enough to have the acid drop out, it will go flow down and then drop out.
That's a great question, but the bees don't allow for temperature stratification as they move the air very fast throughout the hive. If the hive were unoccupied, what you're mentioning would make sense, but it's the bees that circulate it into every single nook and cranny. Thanks for sharing your idea.
@@FrederickDunn hey man. thanks for the reply! i saw the bottom near the observation hive was coated in white and thought it was just hitting the comb, cooling, and immediately falling out of the vapor.
Fred, I understand not to use OAV when supers are on with honey intended for human consumption. I have a box (not frames) that was exposed to OAV does that mean I should never use it as a super in the future ?
Hi John, I think you'll find that box to be just fine. Oxalic Levels that remain in future honey/wax/propolis, would be almost not discernable between treated and untreated hives. Oxalic acid is already present and introduced by the bees as they work the plants. I'm hitting dead ends regarding what the post-treatment levels are with exposed equipment and honey. The responses I've received suggest that the levels don't exist at high enough levels to make it "worth testing for". It's considered a soft organic acid that is derived from some of the healthiest greens we eat. Aside from not exposing honey for consumption, I'd feel comfortable sharing that your other hive components should be considered safe. Even with honey supers left on, it's difficult to find a variance in OA levels. The quest for knowledge in this area continues. Testing labs have no protocol for oxalis as it's not making the top 10 priority where honey is concerned.
I long for the day when Varroa is no longer a major problem. Probably will not see it in my life time but I have faith. It must have been a lot more fun in beekeeping before Varroa and hive beetles!
You know Stan, it may not be as far off as you think. There are Martha Carpenter Mite Maulers, Purdue Ankle Biters, VSH strains. There are people propogating hybrids of these bees successfully. I see the OA as a tool to hold off the varroa destructor's advance until we can incorporate these genetics into everyone's local stock and have a truly resistant honey bee with diversity. They will be named Apis mellifera adversus.
@@danskisbees7348Man, I sure hope we can get this varroa thing under control. It sure would make beekeeping MUCH more enjoyable. I hate seeing my girls have to suffer and put up with those peaky varroa bastards. When I first got started in bees I was so worried and fixated on things like ants, hornets, wax moths and then I relized that these are tiny tiny problems compared to varroa. Best of luck to you and your bees. We will be getting ours ready for the upcoming Michigan winter very soon. I hope my bees survive this winter. It would be nice to start saving money on not having to buy new packages every spring!
@@stansmith4054 Thank you Stan, I hear that sir!
Where would you place the 1/4” hole on a flow hive 2 with the stand?
centered in the back, just above the stand in the brood box.
Amazing 👏
I was wanting to get into beekeeping but the more I learn about it the more I come to the realization that I can not afford to do it properly.
There are lots of wholistic or natural beekeeping groups, maybe check into those?
I have one acre what would you plant on it for bees
That's too broad of a question... as it depends on the zone you're in and what your seasons are like, as well as the quality of the land we're talking about.. I would suggest going to Eden Bros. Website and checking into pollinator friendly plants and going from there :)
Hm... I had a bit different opinion on saskatraz bees, so now I will think about purchasing some, since they are not really varroa tolerant....
in 2020, the Saskatraz line had the heaviest varroa loads in my apiary.
Could you tell me who did you purchase it from? ( just in case so I will look for alternate sources)
is there a difference between oxivap or provap? or is it the same thing?
Oxavap is the company that makes the ProVap unit, I often get confused there, it's the same unit.
what about powdered sugar treatment? gets the bees to clean one another?
It can work to some degree, but you have to open the hive frequently and directly powder the brood frame bees. This is far too distruptive in my opinion and may encourage your bees to abscond or at the least be very stressed by the frequent intrusion.
Thank you for this video demonstration. Will the oxalate vapor do in hive beetles as well?
Hi Kay, unfortunately, SHBs are not zapped by OAV, how I wish they were as so many southern beekeepers are being inundated by those honey-slimers... May I never have to deal with them!
@@FrederickDunn Thank you.
So, the mites eat the pupae ?
Not exactly, they feed on their stored fats and other nutritional resources while transmitting a number of viruses to the pupae. They use the capped pupa cells for egg-laying and protected reproduction.
@@FrederickDunn thank you for responding
@@quilliejones4314 You get around Quillie :) I just answered your comment on Jeff's channel!
They feed on them like a leech or a tick. It is a symbiotic type relationship and when the bee hatches the Varroa leaves the cell.
That is why it is best to treat in fall if not an emergency. Less brood means you get more of the total mite population as they need brood to expand thier numbers.
Usually there will be a few females and one or more males in a cell and the Varroa come out of the cell already mated and ready to spread eggs elsewhere.
My Saskatraz have pulled out a few pupae. But over all they are super strong. No varroa or pests. They almost have too much population and I am worried they may have too large of a colony and may starve to death. They built up FULL of honey but the queen will not slow down. All my Saskatraz colonies are my largest colonies.
It is insane.
They definitely are booming in numbers - remember that often new colonies do well into the first winter and hold their own only to be overrun by varroa later in the year. Let me know how you're doing counts Carlos, I'd be very interested in the numbers. Also, the breeders for Saskatraz bees here in the U.S. are not controlling the mating stock, so we will probably see some variance in resistance. The breeders mentioned that they don't expect them to do well without some level of mite treatment which causes me to pay more attention to them. Thanks for sharing what yours are doing as always! :)
@@FrederickDunn I sent samples to the Bee Research Laboratory in Beltsville Maryland. Its a free service.
Samples received of adult bees and beeswax comb (with and without bee
brood) are examined for bacterial, fungal and microsporidian diseases as
well as for two species of parasitic mites and other pests associated
with honey bees (i.e., small hive beetle, Aethina tumida).
I guess it is Dragonfly mating season in Maryland. There are like 3000 dragonflies out here flying around.
Also very interesting Maryland has a rare one called the gray petaltail. Only found in Maryland and is one of only 11 species in the world. Family goes back 150 million years. Very rare.
We have them all over here which further proves I am in a very healthy wetland.
I love bees. I had to learn about trees, flowers, weeds, plants, and other beneficial insects. It has gained me a wealth of knowledge about entomology and horticulture native trees, flowers, and just an awarness of biology.
Respectfully may I suggest you update-edit this video. We now know that 3 treatments 7 days apart will not kill off most of the mites. 7 days apart allows the mites to get into brood being capped. Eggs to capping. What is now being suggested is 3 to 5 days on the outside for 6 to seven treatments. 2 grams per super and oddly enough we still don't know what it is about OA that kills the mites. Thank you Mr. Dunn.
Hi Michael, 5-7 day intervals is what was approved. We track effectiveness with follow-up mite counts. When it comes to more treatment cycles or variable dosing beyond the approved treatment, I leave that to others. For example, a single treatment of OAV at the end of November, beginning of December can take out more than 90% of the phoretic mites when brood is at its lowest. Low brood periods can appear during periods of dearth which enhances the effectiveness of OAV. If the mite numbers don't come down when using the only approved OA which is Api-Bioxal, then it's time to use another approved treatment such as Formic Pro rather than simply modifying periodicity or dose. It really comes down to how far the mites have progressed before treatments are applied. I can't comply with your request to recommend going off-label. Others are certainly free to do so. I have to personally provide what's legal to do.
Did you do a mite wash count before/after... or sugar dusting?
Based on what I observed on the landing boards, I did not stop to perform a sugar shake, I went straight to treatment. Those results would not alter my decision to do the three treatment regimen.
i think mite washes and sugar dusting is overrated and doesn't tell the real story and a friend killed his queen doing the alcohol wash didnt see her till it was to late
@@FrederickDunn Simply asking to understand how you would measure efficacy of the treatment to know whether you still have a problem or not. Thanks
@@thehiveandthehoneybee9547 Someone killed their Queen? Wow
@@MikeChamplin I will be doing post-treatment mite counts. Thanks for commenting and all comments are welcome :)
Two 2gm for each beehive or 3gm
Always follow the Api-bioxal label and dosing instructions.
Thanks for the video my question is can I use the saskatraz bees And reQueen with the beeweaver queen bee to get the best of both?
What you're suggesting is exactly what I'm doing here... allowing them to swarm and genetically blend with my weaver stock "seems" like a good idea, but after visiting with a genetics expert, she mentioned that when these traits are cross mated, the lower resistance is carried on, not the higher resistance to varroa. So... based on that, varroa resistant lines must be bred with other varroa resistant genetics or it fades.
It would not be too beneficial I would not think. The Beeweaver queen would quickly replace the Saskatraz stock and they would be all Beeweaver in there within two months. (in summer)
Great ..thank you so much for your answers..
However I wasn't thinking about waiting they swarm out as and just introduce a beaweaver mated queen su she can lay and replace with her resistant gens.
Now would the saskatraz bees accept a beeweaver queen easily or not???
@@saleh67 The Saskatraz and BeeWeaver bees are cross-breeding easily and when making splits for example, they each accept fertile Queens from the other line.
@@FrederickDunn I really appreciate it sir
All the best to you
I wish I could get the oxalic acid you have linked above they don't ship to us
That stinks!
@@FrederickDunn it sure does this is a nice tidy container the best I can get is a 1kg tub it's like a small bucket with lid
Boa noite meu irmão muito linda paisagem Deus abençoe
Muito obrigado, estou feliz que você tenha gostado.
Oh well 485.00 that is why it is so nice and works so great. Guess I have to stick to the other way it sweet, may be the price will go down in a couple of years
The OAV Irons work well also... the wands are very convenient and can run off of a battery, this unit requires an extension cord and real electricity. Larger bee yards would need a generator for it.
Unless you have sponsors mailing this stuff to you in exchange for public plugs.. .then you can use the best for gratis.
Just in case you're thinking I received the ProVap 110 at a discount or in exchange for a "plug" I paid full price and received no discount of any kind.
Who cares about how he gets his products that he using in his videos. If you are not a beginning beekeeper then it may not interest you. I am a beginning beekeeper and I have watched all 34 of this series on beginning beekeeping and have learned at least something in every one. Keep up the good work Fred!
@@mark-wn5ek I can't remember the last time Fred didn't buy a product. If something doesn't work for Fred or he doesn't like it, he's going to tell us or he just won't bring the product up. He also designs neat accessories for the hive that he has no interest in marketing. He supplies information in a unique and professionally crafted manner. When you find something that you like, that you paid for, I'm sure you probably tell people about it.
Another professional video!
Fred where are you located?
Thanks! Don
Northeastern U.S., Pennsylvania
Sometimes I say it is good to not know how to read and write then you do not have to know about the problems yes you are a good person to talk to good man
What are you talking about?
Dear Frederick I have bought some oxalic acid. I've also made a vaporizer but I'm waiting delivery of the heater band. It will stop heating at 160C. Dod you see some startling young beekeepers a few years ago putting info on the net that they were suggesting not soldering the electrical connections as the temperature from the glowplugs they were using would melt the solder! Some were mentioning temps that would definitely change the fumes from Oxalic acid to formic acid and carbon monoxide, if Iv'e got the transformation correct due to overheating the oxalic acid.
The main reason for my question is that over three days I've seen 2 minute grey insects walking about on the sticky sheet that I've now changed for vasilene instead. I wonder if these two insects are varroa. I killed one and put it in alcohol with a view to putting it under a microscope-----more expense!
I thought the varroa were red not grey? is there a sure fire way to confirm the accuracy of what I'm looking at?
I'm sorry to keep firing questions to you.
Incidentally the heat treatment of varroa appeals to me and I'm building an insulated box that will bve controlled with a Chinese STC1000 controller. They are supposed to be accurate to .3 C. I've checked the temps with a good qual laser thermometer and indeed the device seems accurate and the differential also is .3 degC accurate.
I'll be blowing air into the insulated box off our heating system radiator which is 50C.(why didn't I think of that before?) In any case the rad has a thermostatic valve which is quite controllable re the primary heat source. There's a bench top over the rad as well so It will work admirably. The bench top is always usually 25C.
I measured the very accurate electric oven and while 4 frames would fit in it is either 40C or 45C which is either side of the appropriate temp which is advised as 41C to kill Varroa mites at all stages and especially in the capped brood frames.
I was going to heat the bottom of this new hive but I've decided to go with your oxalic acid fumigation back end and winter to kill mites on the bees but if required heat frames earlier than the bees treatment when it's cooler.
interesting!
Now we can leave supers on during OA treatment and kill more mites on the bees.
Yes, it's approved in most areas now.
Fred, what state are you in?
PA
@@FrederickDunn Oh, just wondering. I was hoping you lived nearby, I live in Michigan so our weather and temps are similar. I get frustrated taking advice from beeks in southern areas or tropical areas because much of what they do will not apply in our region.
@@stansmith4054 Living in the snowbelt Stan, long cold winters, but now as cold as upper Michigan! :)
@@FrederickDunn Yep, these long depressing never-ending freezing Michigan winters are getting old! If I were a rich man (I am a public school teacher) I would move somewhere with plenty of sunshine and warm days! I am sure my bees would appreciate the warmth too.
@@stansmith4054 Just remember that the freezing cold is natures insect pest control :)
400.00 for this is a little too steep for me
Check out Lorrobee they have an inexpensive and less capable version.
Second time I use the regular one I set the wax on fire. So I went to the Johnny O's
Don't burn those hives Wade :)
@@FrederickDunn that's why I quit using the stick and went to the gun cuz I sent one on fire pretty good with the gun I haven't had issue
@@FrederickDunn supposed to be in the 70s today I'm going to try to do a really good check make sure I have queens and all and see if any of them needs to be taken down to one box cuz we supposed to have some 30° weather next week
If that video doesn't prove to the doubters that OA isn't harmful to the bees I don't know what will. I wish more people understood just how deadly mites can be especially over winter waiting for spring. It makes me think a large percentage of hives that don't make it are because of mites.
I have to agree, that many colony die-offs are due to the impact that varroa and the diseases they carry have on the bees. When I observe the results after OAV treatments, I have to look back over the years and wonder why I didn't give them that boost all along. I'm late to the OA treatment game and I'll know more in spring when I see how they cope through winter with this advantage. Thank you for watching and commenting.
💛👍
You are not using the correct filter.. oxalic is not an organic vapor it is an acid. You need the purple yellow filter
Thanks Ashby, I am using, and have always used the correct filter. I invite you to learn a little more about them 3M Organic Vapor/Acid Gas Cartridge/Filter 60923, P100 Respiratory Protection. I welcome all challenges :) I believe you may have been looking at the respirator listing, not the filter listing.
People share this vlog. This mite can Destroy us. No bees no life on this planet....
FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Congratulations!!!! I wish I had a prize for you.
You have one breed of bees that have good resistance to varoa and another breed that have poor resistance to varoa. Isn't that telling you that you have poor genetics that doesn't make economic sense to not only sustain but to propagate from. There is a fair bit of research now telling us that feral bees have much better disease resistance than managed hives and it is a much cheaper way of acquiring bees. All beekeepers should keep the opening sentence in the book -Beekeeping for all by Abbe Warre in mind.
Apiculture or beekeeping is the art of managing bees with the intention of getting the maximum return from this work with the minimum of expenditure.
Hi Ben, thank you for commenting. We are continuing to monitor feral colonies of honeybees to see how they are surviving with our current pest and environmental challenges. The problem is that more than 90% of the feral colonies targeted for observation/study died out last winter. As a backyard beekeeper without commercial pressures, I am free to watch, learn, experiment and then of course, share the findings. If I were a bee-breeder, I would definitely have a different approach. For me, the "maximum return" is in knowledge, not monetary gain. Feral bees tend to swarm out often which results in breaks in varroa which is one way they are surviving. When a feral colony completely abandons a tree or other cavity, wax moths and other insect residents move in and consume the old comb - when the cavity is re-occupied by another feral colony, they seal it all up with propolis (antibacterial envelope) and then construct new comb and begin again. What seems to be continuous occupancy by feral bees often isn't "continuous". We have a lot to learn from feral bees and those studies will certainly continue. If someone is going into commercial beekeeping, the financial bottom line will certainly dictate their approach from hive construction to the genetics selected for maximum production. My viewers are largely backyard hobby beekeepers - most of the commercial keepers in my State are always treating their bees and most don't monitor for mites as that's "too time-consuming". I think the Saskatraz bees have many promising traits I will continue to see how they cope with our northern winters. Non-commercial beekeepers like myself, as with free-ranging chickens, are not guided by the financial bottom line - and will probably spend more than what may be gained financially. The rewards are a lifelong pursuit of bee knowledge.
@@FrederickDunn I think you misjudge what most beginning beekeepers are prepared to spend on equipment. Its a mistake for beginning beekeepers to think they should buy flow hives, uneeded acid treatments trying to sustain colonies that are obviously failing and bees from different climates that are not adapted to their local environment. The bottom line is that for beekeeping to be popular everyone of limited financial means has to understand that beekeeping can have a good return on investment. That's why Abbe Warre called his book Beekeeping for All.
Ben K you seem to be completely out of touch here. Mr Dunn has demonstrated a thoughtful approach to intervention when it's required. How did you determine that the Saskatraz bees are failing? 90% of the commercial bees are requiring treatment. Where are you coming from?
@@MrSydjf HI Ben, I never tell people what to buy, I share information and leave it to them. In my first FlowHive video, I close it out by sharing how inexpensive Langstroth kits are. There are many ways to keep bees on a budget.
@@masterbeekeeper30years18 You obviously live in a different paradigm. The evidence is right before your eyes. Treatment free or natural beekeeping is being practiced around the world by amateurs and professionals without thinking they have to throw money at disease problems.
This is so sad to see this. How chemicals have destroyed our health and gods creatures
Please explain how these chemicals have destroyed your health and "God's Creatures"? If your family consumes a pound of carrots, you've ingested more oxalic acid than is in an entire treatment in a beehive. Please explain your position further? If the bees decline and die from varroa infestation and the diseases they have vectored, is that your preference. My mind is open and I'm very happy to have this discussion.
Let’s use your logic then. Allow the bees to collect oxalic acid on their own and consume it. I don’t force my family to eat a pound of carrots neither should you force bees
And yes it’s much better to allow the bees to die then to meddle with their health. There’s a reason why people are sicker than ever and bees the same. Chemicals, natural un natural have destroyed the health of food, life, everything. When you become dependent on treating a symptom instead of the root cause you will never have true health. The wisdom of man is foolishness to god
@@BlessedBeJESUSCHRIST I didn't see a question in there. I'll continue doing the best I can for the bees in my care and I am certain that you'll do the same.
I know years ago when Apistan was used to kill the mites there were 2 unintended consequences. 1. The mites developed resistance to the pesticide. 2. Because the wax was reused over and over again to make foundation the wax foundation became more and contaminated eventually making the bees sick and dead. Will this not be the case with the use of OVA?
HI Bill, OAV has not shown to cause resistant bees. It's a naturally occuring acid that comes from plants and is already present in all bee comb. The levels of OA in the wax from treated and untreated hives are almost not measurable. It's a very different treatment.
Thank you Fred