Scrap The SPG - Scuba Tech Tips: S17E18
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ต.ค. 2024
- With today's sophisticated and reliable dive computers, is there a need for the SPG?
Alec suggests it maybe time to scrape the SPG except for some special uses.
Watch "Alec Peirce at the Ranch" for home and ranch ideas. / @alecpeirceattheranch
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Shearwater has never let me down.
A great product.
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I have yet to have any problem with a dive computer !
perhaps because I don't trust a battery operated toy ...
the Ole school SPG's and a dive table still rule !!!
You must be a vintage diver like me.
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I use a small SPG in addition to a wireless AI computer. Aside of a backup when I'm gearing up and turn the tank valve on I can see the tank pressure right away, as at this stage my computer is still turned off.
That's a good use for a SPG.
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Cool video. I scrapped my SPG years ago after getting my Teric + transmitter. In order to still have a "spare tire", I opted in for a mini 1" screw-on gauage that my dive buddy can look at in the unlikely unevent of a dive computer failure. Been enjoying how light I feel underwater since!
Good tip!
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Even if new generation of computers are a nice add on to diving gear, I always keep my mechanical SPG.
I totally hate relying on electronic equipment when a reliable mechanical equipment is available, the SPG is a very good example of that.
It is the same with automobiles where idiot lights and electronics have took over, I by far prefer gauges, they are a good diagnostic tool and that speak so you can take the corrective actions before being stranded in a very uncomfortable situation.
very good topic
If you like your setup, just enjoy the dive. I'm getting some divers really wound up by even suggesting no SPG. The comments are interesting and show a wide range of SPG uses. Thanks.
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IME, it's rare for a transmitter to fail during a dive, more likely to fail before hand, due to not being used for a while (flat battery, been dropped/damaged etc) So, yes, take your mech SPG off your rig, but don't throw it away, simply put it in your "save a dive" kit and take it with you. Then, when you kit up, should you find your flashy wireless pressure monitor has gone south, no worries, it's one quick spanner job to pop the old mech SPG back on, and of you go on your dive as normal!
A failure "in the water" of any pressure monitor, should NEVER become an issue if you are diving within your limits and are paying attention. What would be potentially dangerous is failing to notice your SPG/Transmitter has failed, but that's not an equipment issue, it's a "you" issue, and here, a computer, unlike a mech SPG is going to be beeping it's little head off in the event of a loss of reliable air pressure signal.....
Good points and tips for everyone, thanks.
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Boy, Alec Sir.. I was hoping this video would get me off that fence for certain 😂!! But all points well taken. Pros and cons for each side on this one… still trying to figure it out. But thanks!
Just hoping to educate and get folks making a decision on their future gas monitoring solutions.
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It tells you “ dummy your run out of air” 😂😂 I’ll never forget that phrase from your older video 🤣
So true. It's not a surprise if you check regularly.
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@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter ohh 100%
Good perspective! One point to add is that a backup SPG shouldn't be necessary from a safety perspective: in the event of a transmitter failure you have to end the dive, but you know (hopefully!) that you have enough gas to safely ascend and complete stops. I typically run one or the other, even for technical/decompression dives, with the philosophy that carrying both is just adding extra O-rings etc to possibly fail.
Thats a good point for probably most tec/deco divers. For the many recreational divers, most comments say computers have the advantage for them. Still, if you're happy with any setup, then just enjoy the dive.
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I like your no-nonsense, easy-going approach even to (for some) controversial topics :)
Thanks and every subject is controversial in scuba. Just mention spit fins vs rockets or even pick a dry snorkel over a plain tube! We love to argue.
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Mr. Alec, The spare tire analogy is great. If I was only doing shallow dives in The Bahamas with a sandy bottom at 40’, I would ditch the SPG, otherwise I’m taking my spare tire.
If that setup makes you comfortable, then just enjoy the dive. Some take my ideas as either law or anarchy!
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I love SPGs….now I have 2 that are stuck arround 70 bar… so never out of air any more!
My Suunto EON Core with transmiters on tank and stage just works perfect, for years now… Alec, you are right, scrap it - before it leaks, also!
Lots of opinions on this from keep to toss. Some folks have logical and safety reasons, others just keep it because.
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Ill never say never but im keepnig my SPG for a long time for several reasons. 1. I don't trust electronics much 2. Its attached and I can't forget it at home. I don't use a wrist computer 3. The fancier you get the $$$ adds up and I'd rather spend it on traveling to actually dive rather than have fancy equipment sitting in a closet.
Dive travel is costing more each year so stick with what works for you.
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I prefer an SPG, with a transmitter you have to worry yet about another battery for something vital as your air pressure. It is fragile and easy to lose. I am a recreational diver who likes to rely on electronics as less as possible. I use a computer but also a mechanical automatic diver's watch and even consult my decompression table. Most new divers don't even know how to use a decompression table anymore so if their computer fails they cannot dive, but I do!
Currently diving in Cuba , 3 days ago my transmitter blowed up due to internal failure. Port plug is easier to find here then a new transmitter.
So back up spg for now.
Wow not a fun dive but a memorable one.
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I am a recreational diver and exclusively have been using my AI and wrist computer. It's awesome and works flawlessly. Of course you need a back-up plan for if it breaks. I'll always be with a buddy and if any of our gear is not working well, we will abort the dive and head up for our safety stop. Pretty unlikely that both divers will both have their means of monitoring air pressure croak at the same time.
That is the typical scenario for most divers. But if you're far away on a live aboard, then you need a backup computer to keep your dive history, NDL loads etc, to keep diving.
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I'm a recreational diver and I always use an SPG, on my recent overseas trip on a liveaboard I discovered my computer and transmitter were damaged, luckily a fellow diver had a spare transmitter and I had my backup AI computer, so I'm always comfortable having my SPG in case those other devices fail and I have nothing else to use.
Thats one good reason for a backup computer or a spg.
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👍🤿😎🇵🇭! Don’t care what other divers think I still use both!
Well said.
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1- on my last 3 foreign liveaboard trips at least one of my group have encountered computer problems/failures. for that reason i use 2 computers, one on my wrist and one on my SPG console. And now tell me why would i want to combine the SPG function with the electronics of the computer?
2- mounting gauges on the SPG means that's one less item to leave inadvertently on the boat -because it's attached to my reg/tank/BC.
3 -personally, I find that analog gauges are easier to read in reduced visibility. did you ever wake up trying to make out what 88:88 means on the hotel alarm clock?
@DonWarfield it's also depends on the brand. Not to start a brand wars here, but there is one brand that rarely have issues 😅
Good points and safe diving.
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I have had issues with wireless transmitters in the past (Suunto D4i) and have been happy to have an SPG as a back up. That being said, I upgraded to a Garmin Descent Mk3i, and the transmitter seems to be much more reliable (and has a user/field replaceable battery). I am considering ditching the SPG and HP hose and just keeping them in the dive bag with me. Worst case scenario would be a single aborted dive if the transmitter fails on a dive. Can always add the SPG and HP Hose back on between dives to make sure I can keep diving that day if needed.
Good idea to keep in around. Kevin has a Garmin Mk 2i and loves it with the transmitter but also has an air integrated dive computer has his backup.
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I prefer an SPG, with a transmitter you have to worry yet about another battery for something vital as your air pressure. It is fragile and easy to lose. I am a recreational diver who likes to rely on electronics as less as possible. I use a computer but also a mechanical automatic diver's watch and even consult my decompression table. Most new divers don't even know how to use a decompression table anymore so if their computer fails they cannot dive, but I do!
I think you mean dive tables and not specifically decompression tables which is not recreational diving. Good points on the spg.
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@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter yes, I mean dive tables. Thank you
Alex, did you notice when you were explaining the faces of the console, you mixed up the SPG and depth gauge 0:59 but you did get the compass right 😉 BTW I will only use analog SPGs, none of the expensive computers and transmitters and their extra service and maintenance costs as. The KISS analog SPG works fine for me.
KISS is the best solution for most things.
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@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter Agree.
Hi Alec I heard that there were issues with damaging the early transmitters when people tried to lift the tank from the valve and transmitter? I seem to recall very short extension hoses being available to help protect them. I do still like the idea of analog gauges, of coarse I'm old fashioned. Take care Owen m
Yes, a short HP hose for the transmitter is still a good idea.
This is an issue I've seen on some boats and "valet service."
I hate people touching my expensive life support gear even if it's "to help." I usually screw my swift transmitter directly into the HP port for streamlining if it's just me and my budd(ies), and ALWAYS try to carry my own tank.
Some deckhands and porters are pretty aggressive about wanting to do it, in order to get more tips (especially in third world countries), but I've found that if you explain you'll tip them anyway, they'll back off.
If I can't carry my own, or I'm going somewhere new and I'm not sure if I can, I have it on a very short HP hose, which is small enough to carry in my save a dive if needed.
Early boat crew used the transmitter as an easy lifting handle, until they snapped off or bent and leaked. Not true much anymore today but I know Kevin used a short 6" HP extension on his transmitter. Mostly to get around his big shoulders.
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I got myself what I think is a Walter Kidd tank from 7 - 88 everything I read says these tanks are perfectly safe if properly inspected and there is no reason for an lds to turn them away. What’s your opinion on this? It’s still got a good hydro date on it, I need to get it visually inspected but I don’t want to be turned away by a less than informed dive shop.
Like it or not, good tank or not, the dive store or inspector has the final say.
He is not obligated to pass a tank if he doesn't like it.
Once he accepts it for inspection, then he has to do so & pass it or have definitive evidence to not pass it.
I personally have passed hundreds of tanks that others might not have passed.
But I am very familiar with the history of these tank (I was there!!) & with the problems associated with them.
Many newer dive stores simply refuse to service any gear, tanks or otherwise, that is older than say, 10 years.
It's partly liability, partly salesmanship (not good salesmanship!), and partly lack of knowledge/experience.
Find a more amenable, more experienced dive shop.
Alec
@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter yea, oh well the inspector was absolutely willing to and certified to properly inspect it but the store said no… good thing it’s my brother in laws tank lol he let me take it to get inspected first almost had a tank for 75$… I’ll take it back to him and he can keep it lol and thank you so much for your time! So much great information on this channel!
I have had multiple dive computers fail. I'm sticking to the SPG
Thats unusual. I only had one i think fail on a dive in all my years but maybe i'm lucky. Good assurance to have a SPG if your gear is not as reliable as you want.
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I carry an SPG in my gear bag but my one HP port is for my air-integrated computer. I've been using air-integrated computers since 1992 and for the last 20 years or so carried a backup non-air-integrated computer on my wrist or in a BC pocket. I've had 3 liveaboard trips where my air integrated computer failed in some manner but I was able to continue without having to sit out any dives because the backup computer had all my dive info and all I had to do was unscrew the air-integrated computer and screw in my SPG. If I lose my air pressure reading at depth, I'm still gonna have a pretty good idea of air remaining and can make an educated conservative decision on getting back to the surface (the benefit of experience).
Sounds like a good solution especially when on a live aboard or exotic location (ie no dive shops). I know lots of divers who do the same, backup in the dive pocket saves a lot of problems.
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I dive Sidemount almost exclusively now and each tank has a transmitter. The computer auto switches between each tank when I switch regulators. However, the computer and transmitters do not always talk with each other. I will keep my SPGs on my tanks. If the transmitters or computer goes down, I have the SPG as a back up. The dive would be done and but I will have that information. I also carry a deapth gage in my pouch as a back up. It is great to have a decompression plan on the computer but having it written on a slate or wet notes as a backup is also a wise choice incase of computer failure. The dive computer is a great and convenient tool. I will do whole dives and not look at my SPG or any other analog device but I know they are there and i am prepared to use them.
SPGs can fail too. During a dive my buddy pointed out I had bubbles coming from the neck of one SPG. As a Sidemount diver I was able to shut off the tank and return to the surface on one tank. After taking apart the SPG I discovered an o-ring had gone bad. A quick replacement and we were back in the water after our surface interval.
Thank for sharing your side mount issues and boat fixing skills.
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I use a SPG as my primary pressure gauge on twins. If i was to use Ai it would be as a backup & to monitor Tank 2 in a shutdown scenario.
And - Deco Sickness is just as risky for Recreational Divers as for Tec Divers - especially in the last 5m of ascent
Well said. I miss my old twins, they were twin 53 cu/ft but still back in the 70's, it was super cool.
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I've never had a computer or a transmitter fail on a dive, but I generally take SPGs as well because, well, why not?
Why not. Another comment said they had 3 failed computers so a SPG would be a comfort.
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I personally like my analog gauges where possible. Electronics have physical and software layers to fail and are useless when power is lost. A lot of my dives in my backyard are shallow 10 - 15 ft. a dive computer is not really needed. I need to know my air pressure more than anything else.
Analog is reliable but does not give you all the new and useful data about your dive, like ATR, air time remaining, deco warning, NDL etc. Having both would be the best solution.
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@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter oh I agree for a most dives, in my case at home I am at a depth my NDL is almost unlimited, I only need my air monitored. Save my dive computers battery for a other dives.
Took off the spg already 3 years ago. Detail….. i’m only diving for 4 years! 😉
You have many years of fun ahead, enjoy.
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I live in Mexico Baja and most of people have a backup generator since the grid not reliable and some other like me have a backup for the backup generator 😊
Double backups are good but have you tested them recently? If not tested under load you never know if it will work when needed. Hope it does.
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@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter test every month
Are there computers that can monitor more than one gas source at a time?
yes, shearwater perdix can use multiple transmitters
Shearwater, Apeks and now Ratio have this.
Garmin descent
Yes and the viewer replies have some of the dive computers with multiple gas monitoring.
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Garmin transmitter is the best. Hands down. I don’t use SPG anymore.
Kevin is a Garmin computer and transmitter user. Loves them.
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Lol I'm not going to give up my SPG... I don't trust computers after my jeep patriot has set in the yard for several months due to a computer issue and only a jeep dealership can fix it.. for a price. Lol.
I do have a couple of computers that I'm not sure they work, but I have them. My diving these days are mostly for fun, and probably in 30 feet ir less. I tried to add up my hours of under water time and after 1120 hours, I gave up. I worked with my girlfriend to get her some extra dive time and showed her some stuff the instructor did not teach and she discovered she was learning a lot of stuff that was not true.. mostly dealing with weights and how not to panic when stuff fsils.. like the BCD power inflation button sticks and the BCD slowly fills with air as she was swimming around the bottom. I was the one wearing the new BCD and when I started to rocket to the surface I dumped the air, and and played with the button a second, and simply disconnected the air line. And kept going on the dive. Then her weight belt buckle broke. So I pushed it tight a zipped tied while under the water so we could head back to the meet up spot and start working our way back to our entry point. That was her first dive out side the class room and beings I was a commercial diver her instructor let her dive with me so she could work on her techniques and figure out why she was having trouble with not being able to stay on the bottom. After I told her how to start guessing how much weight she needed and then work on fine tuning it from there. After 36 minutes she was able to go back to the pool and pass all the exercises with flying colors, and started really enjoying the dive rather then feeling like it was a chore and fighting through out the dive. It really helped me too as when I was working I was in the water so much it was like going to the gas station or supermarket. It became boring and was not exciting anymore. Even when I was in the water with alligators.. which was daily year round even in winter. When I started working with Sherri it was like someone learning stuff that I forgot I was even doing. Simple things like checking the SPG and depth, and fine tuning stuff, and snugging up the weight belt if it stretched after it got wet.. unplugging the air hose from a BCD with a self inflation problem and just going to manuel inflating it.. lol. Clearing my mask which is a king Neptune trivia mask that looks like a submersible on your face.. not those puny little skine tight things you see these days.. it takes two good breaths to clear that monster. Lol. She was jittery when she seen her first shark... it was a huge rascal as big as a city bus. Well a match box city bus. It was a three foot lemon shark that just crossed our path and I simply pointed it out and and signaled her to look around and not get fixed on that one thing. It worked. She was so excited but a little 3 footer that was not even interested in us wad not really a notable occurrence for me but Sherri bragged about it for a week. It made me feel alive inside again and now I'm finding myself digging out my old gear gear, looking it over, and reading my decompression tables, practicing my assembly and relearning things that I took for granted and just did out habit. Heck I'm even learning new things like not just holding the SPG face down as I crank the preasure on .. essence the blow out plug is pointed at your face when you point the face of the SPG face down.. lol old habits ya know. Now I got an infant grand son I plan to teach him everything I know one day. Maybe in 16 years he will be bragging about the 3 footer the same by and Sherri will be laughing about it. It's never too late to start enjoying life again. Lol
You were a Neptune owner too! I have some Neptune gear for my Sea Hunt displays at shows. Good to know you're still interested and helping the next generation get started right and safe. Thank for sharing and hope you will stick with diving to help Sherri.
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@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter thanks.
I still use an SPG, for redundancy, computers can and do fail. Guess I'm Old School!
@markdanielczyk944 computers fail, spg fail, o-rings go busted, power inflator can fail , mask strap can brake, anything can brake.
Not taking advantage of technology just because it may brake is silly.
I just had my transmitter blew up during a dive because some internal issues, so i installed a port plug and continued my diving with SPG. Meanwhile, company already mailed me a new transmitter.
@amadeuss3341 I do have a computer, still use a SPG as backup!
It's a good idea to have either a backup computer (especially on liveaboards or exotic locations), or a SPG just in case. You're lucky, read others comments on computer problems. Safe diving my friend.
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@@AlecPeirceScuba_SeaHunter Safety First!
My SPG NEVER failed, air integrated dive consoles will fail, computers with transmiters Will fail. I dont know any tech diver that doesnt have a SPG as a redundancy. Only issue with SPG is that Over time the reading Will have some % of error, can be 50 bar, as long as you know how much it is no problemo. I Will always have One , even if i have air integration.
If your happy with the setup, just enjoy the dive.
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