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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 มี.ค. 2013
- Check out this walk around of the 820 video we listed • Walk around of the 195... . Showing how to start a John Deere 820 cylinder that has a pony starting motor. The pony motor is a V4 gasoline engine which is started first then it is engaged to the big diesel to crank it over. Cool technology back in the day. Love this tractor but it's being sold on ebay 04/01/2013. Enjoy ebay item 330900694067
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Haha that bought back memories. My brother had a bush aircraft operation in a remote village on the Yukon river in Alaska. Roads were all mud, and virtually impassable in summer. So out of the blue, he buys a John Deer 820 with a cab on it . When it showed up on the barge, the villagers were awestruck, and started calling the Big Wheel . We had a big trailer attached to it, and used it year round to haul freight for us . So we would operate it at 30 below zero in winter. We kept a blanket to cover the pony motor and use a heater to keep it warm. The pony motor also circulates its hot water through the main motor. So in cold weather, we would start the pony motor and let it run maybe 20 minutes which would warm the main engine. Then afterwards the main engine would start instantly. People that came to visit the village were always awestruck to see this giant tractor zipping around town. Also was pretty good at pulling wheelies if you popped the clutch in low gear........
Man, that's a great story !! Cool to hear all the stories on how these were used over the years. Thanks for sharing.
Not only does the pony motor share coolant with the big engine it also wraps it’s exhaust around the intake of the diesel warming that up as well so you’ve got warm air going into the diesel engine
Great vid! One thing though, if your gonna run the big engine over with the pony for a while before starting don't have the diesel throttle open or else it will wash the cylinders with fuel
Got a lot of hours in on an 820 working for a farmer while going to college in Bozeman Montana. Cool old tractors
Love the sound of the diesel engine starting and the pinging when it stops. Brings back memories of being on my uncle's farm in Iowa during the summers.
What memories! I was born in 1944 in central Saskatchewan . Wow!,,
Just want too clear a few things up. Understand you had warmed it up before hand. I,ve owned an 830 for over thirty years now and keeping it. Yes the proper way to start them is as follows. Start the pup using the choke only if needed and warm the pup up. Leave the diesel throttle off or all the way back, this keeps the fuel shutoff. After pup is warmed up pull the decompressor lever all the way back then slowly pull the clutch lever back, first half engages the pinion to the flywheel the second half is the clutch. Motor the diesel till you have oil pressure for 5 to 10 seconds more if you want. Then release the decompressor lever and advance the diesel throttle only till the stop buttom pops in and will start no problem if the engine is good. I was told years ago and still follow this rule as was mentioned in the coments when shutting the diesel down after cooling it for 5 minutes if it was working hard pull the decompressor lever to let the main coast to a stop. Otherwise the pinion is always engaging in one of two spots on the ring gear. Was also told that John Deere never shipped electric starts to Canada because our climate is too cold for the electric start, only pup starts up here from the factory direct. If in cold weather - 10 C then motor the main engine for a minute or so under full compression without fuel to warmup the combustion chamber. If you can start the pup the main will always start with some time depending on the tempature. Proper way. From a greendash 820 - 58 hp-pto to an 820 blackdash - 69 hp -pto, 830 is the same and thats why an 830 was never tested at Nebraska.
Don't start the diesel at half throttle, just off the idle stop is where it should be.
Nice tractor. I own a 720D and really like it.
A few suggestions for you.
1) the red light should go out when the pony motor builds oil pressure.
2) never crank the big motor over while the compression is released and the throttle lever is forward. Pumping fuel to the big motor with no compression floods the cylinders with diesel fuel.
3) when shutting down, after you pull the throttle back and cut the fuel to the big motor, pull the decompression lever back and let the big motor coast to a stop. This procedure isn't in any manual, but it saves flywheel splines.
Good info on the compression release at shut down. Never thought about it. If I ever buy one of these again I'll have to remember that.
snowman9980 One more that you left out: do not shut down the pony motor with the ignition switch; instead close its fuel valve to empty the carburetor and after it stops turn off its ignition switch.
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This is more complex than a Navy F-14. But actually fascinating. Thanks
Having grown up owning and operating R’s 70-730 and 80-830 series John Deere diesel tractors on a farm in upstate New York, here are the mistakes he made starting it.
Never crack the main throttle while cranking with the compression released, never push it much past idle during starting, always let the pony motor run a few minutes both before and after starting the main engine to prevent carbon buildup which will eventually lead to locking it up, and always shut the fuel off to the pony motor and let it run dry before shutting off the ignition. Same goes with all the JD gas and all fuel tractors as it helps prevent most carburetor issues.
After seeing this video I want one of these really badly. That's a real machine, everything made today is just a toy
How much was that 20 different things before you can actually drive with it?
20 different things to start up the main engine. That’s what makes it appealing.
I am indian farmer I read hindi appload to google john Deere tractor all model biography messege in hindi
kirdot2011 Yeah more like 8, but when you are up north in the cold Canadian winter, and it is -40F, you can run the pony motor as long as you like and crank the diesel engine, then you can have the coolant warmed up and have the tractor at full operation temperature without even using diesel. Just don't shut it off until you are sure you don't need it haha. Lots of these also had electric starters but the pony motors were better in cold temperatures.
Yes, when you pull the throttle back it just brings it down to an idle. When you pull out the knob and pull the throttle all the way back it shuts off the fuel supply to the big motor and after a couple revolutions of the motor is shuts off. Pretty cool tractor to operate once you've done it a couple of times. It was sold and picked up and I miss it already. Maybe another one someday in the future.
You are correct and the 820 manual confirms it, release the compression lever and let the big engine turn over a few revolutions then push the throttle forward half way. Unfortunately the pony motor needs a rebuild and is on the week side so I have to throttle up first and release the compression lever after. I have to pull the compression lever back a couple times to keep up the rpms but she eventually fires. It sold any way so the new owner will rebuild the pony. Thanks for the nice comment.
Cat used this tech from 1929 or 1930 up until the early early 1970's I have a d4 with this set up and just sold 2 d7s with the same style setup.
Are they good motors? Reliable ?
@@kristophermulhollen5600 the cat machines require someone knowledgeable on the maintenance of a pony motor. They are very finicky but typically easy to get right
great video. I have one of these as a model and I keep looking at all the levers wondering want they are for, I have to say just a little more complicated than just turning a key
Really awesome startup
The ability to spin the main engine over freely before a cold start until the oil pressure comes up is a great engineering idea. Most cold start wear can be eliminated if you spin the cold main engine over for about 30 seconds.
+scdevon that is what I have been saying and no one has been listening!. I always thought it would be beneficial to have a priming pump or some kind of way of splashing the oil around the engine before hand.
Hell you could have a primer bulb connected from the dump to the heads, squeeze it 20 times and the engine has oil dripping all down from the heads right? It could be rigged up easily. Great thinking y'all. Same with what I was thinking.
Oops, then engines would be lasting too long, so it wont be done. Lol
Another great engineering idea JD had with the pup motor system is that the exhaust from the pup motor goes through a heat exchanger in the intake manifold for the diesel, thus providing warmer air for an easier startup.
Nice tractor my uncle ownes one just like it its a 820 thats my favorite tractor to run
THANK YOU FOR THE GREAT VIDEO!!!!👍😃
I volunteer at my local Dirt oval speedway and we've got an old grader, I spend countless hours in it grading the track days before race day all because I love old machinery not to mention I'm only 20, so people just think I'm weird
Hey, Nothing weird about loving old machinery. I just hope a lot more of the younger generation catches on to how cool this old stuff is and keeps them all running for many more years to come. It's amazing how this old equipment is still running strong after all these years, some coming up on 100 yrs old. I don't think the engineers of the past expected their designs to last as long and it just shows how over engineered things were compared to what is built today. Everything now is disposable and only designed to last a couple years. Sad. Keep up the love of the old stuff and get as many of your friends involved as possible. Take care.
I am 16 and love things like this. Always been fascinated by machinery.
Cool!!!
That was simple enough, especially for a pony motor start procedure.
Iv got a 70 diesel, i have to kick the starter petal about 50 times before shit happens but its a good tractor, nice vid man!
I believe if you check the owners manual, it will say not to advance the diesel throttle from the stop position until you have motored the diesel engine a few revolutions under full compression. I don't know why JD says do it that way as oppose to the way you do it, (except that you are pumping fuel into decompressed cylinders). I've seen it done both ways by various diesel owners. Apparently it doesn't cause a lot harm to do it your way. The owners manual also says you can motor the diesel engine "indefinitely" with the engine decompressed in order to pre-warm the diesel engine in cold weather (assuming you can keep the pony running and it doesn't run out of gas). I'll bet those "electric starter guys" can't do that, not for very long anyway.
deeredad Diesel fuel will wash engine oil off the cylinders, causing parts to wear more quickly.
Never start the big engine at half throttle.
Exactly. Introduce fuel only when main engine is cranking with good oil pressure, and with full compression to avoid loading it up with raw fuel. And a half-throttle startup? Not on my tractor.
Ugh. Amazing this tractor has a head gasket left after a poor starting technique. I hope it was already warm. We had an 70d an 80, and a 730. The 730 was electric start and if below +40 it would never start. The 80 was never used in the cold. But the 70 was used year round. Proper starting involved letting the pony run more than 30 seconds. Usually 5-10 minutes. Let it warm the big motor up and preheat the intake. Always started no matter how cold and with the fuel tank being right above the motor we could run #2 in it even when it was -20. 65 years old and our 70 still runs like a champ, and the motor never touched.
Great video. I could never figure out what that little knob next to the throttle lever was for. Obviously it's for shutting the diesel down, does it act as a fuel shutoff or something?
What a processe
father restored one of these when I was growing up
One real pretty diesel engine WHAT A SOUND!! Mother had 5 brothers they were all dairy farmers 2 brothers owned and ran their own dairy upstate NY one year they had a model R ohhhhhhhhhhhh how I LOVED that beast yours here ....well THANK Y O U for sharing!
Man after watching this it's a miracle JD didn't go broke.
They actually sold quite a few of these tractors
Never shut the pony off with ignition cutoff always turn the gas off and let it burn out of the carburetor
Any 2 cyl. J. D. diesel with pony start should be started with throttle in off position or "dead rack" until oil pressure is built up. This prevents any injected fuel into cylinders. Prevents fuel washing cylinders, bad news in cold winter starts.
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Да уж. Буржуйский трактор уже в 1958 году кнопочкой заводился, а наши до последнего - веревочкой - шморгалкой :(
I think the pony motor is a lil tired
My 850 works the same, I just happened to have to intake off and turned the key backwards, and happened to also notice the smoke and panicked thinking an electrical fire was about to happen. Lol.
I own a Volvo BM 650
mine says 820 on the side but it doesnt look like this one at all
Jeez, those pony motors run the opposite philosophy of the main diesel, sounds like its revving to 5,000 rpm!
They do scream when they run.
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You said the pony motor is 4 cylinder ? Do you know the displacement ? Thanks
Not sure off hand. Maybe someone out there can reply back if they know the answer. It's a small motor so probably not much displacement. Thanks.
Ok, Thanks !
I'd let the pony motor idle for a bit before I rev it up......
Yes you are correct, warming up the pony motor is a must. I had already started this in my building and all was warmed up before I shot the video. It was not a cold start I was doing but just a video so everyone could see what was involved to start one of these tractors. As mentioned in a previous post, one thing I left out was to choke the pony motor if needed to get it going. But it was warm already and didn't need it. The choke lever pulls out right next to the tach. as seen in the video. Thanks.
1motors Hello...,thanks for your reply. ....cheers,Roger
I've always been told after the diesel is started you should shut the gas off on the pony and let it run to burn the gas out of the carburetor
That is not a good idea, as the gaskets in the carburettor will then quickly dry out, if the engine isn't run frequently.
MrAstrojensen but then again it was a pony motor on a Caterpillar bulldozer I was told that about. maybe Caterpillar and John Deere may have different set ups
Possibly, but I'd think the carburettors would work pretty much the same and should be treated pretty much the same, too. My dad has been a mechanic for 55-odd years and he's taught me a thing or two and he always strongly advices NOT to let a carburettor dry out, if it can be avoided. Many are made from aluminum castings with brass fittings and these have a tendency to corrode on the inside, if left dry. The result is often not pretty and you're left with a complete mess you need to take apart, clean, replace gaskets, clean pin valves, etc. It's a real bother.
MrAstrojensen I'm not doubting anything you say. I'm not too familiar with the set up on a John Deere but the Caterpillar pony motors have a down draft carburetor and I've been told if you don't run all the gas out of the carburetor if there's any leakage in the carburetor that gas could find it's way into the crankcase and thin out the oil then you'll have one mell of a hess
That's possible. One would have to make sure in each different case, if there is a problem with not emptying the carburettor.
No choke for the pony motor?
Hi, Yes there is a choke for the Pony Motor. You can see it in the beginning of the video next to the tach/hour meter. The diesel doesn't use a choke so that choke pull lever is for the Pony. I had started the tractor earlier in the building to bring it outside for the video, so the Pony was already warmed up and didn't need to be choked.
1motors thanks great video!
Thats a nice sounding2 stroke motor for the starter. what type of oil does it burn?
They are not 2 cycle motors.
Bruce Miller I think the pony motor is a V-4, with a two inch bore and stroke. Starting speed for the pony motor is 5,500 r/min. That's why it may sound like a two-stroke.
I heard these v4 had total loss oil consumption and used low ash oil, not sure.
The pony motor is a four stroke V-4 motor. Cool little unit but they were prone to wearing out fast because of the high RPM's they ran at. There are rebuild kits for them now, they were hard to come by years ago. This pony was in need of a rebuild as you could see by the smoke while it was running but it still ran strong and cranked over the big motor just fine. I hated to sell the tractor but needed the cash.
Bruce Miller ji
He sounds like an older, less enthusiastic T.J. Miller
Didn't one of them have a v8 pony motor? anyways awesome video!
Thanks. Not sure of any that had a V8 pony, maybe a larger tractor. The JD 80 and 820's had the V4, it's a real small motor but pretty cool. The earlier JD R had an opposing twin cylinder pony motor. The later JD 830's eventually switched to an electric starter. I personally like the pony motors, just cooler old technology stuff if you know what I mean. Thanks again.
You happen to know the hp of the pony motors? My d4-7u and d7-3t have pony motors, better than electric in my book, don't need a battery to start
Not sure of the HP of the Pony. I sent all the manuals I had with the tractor. Out of curiosity, I tried to find it on the Web but couldn't. I know the early green dash 820's main engine was about 67 HP but this one I had was the last year of the 820 and it was what they call the black dash which had about 75 HP on the main motor. These HP changes followed through to the 830's.
Hint why I asked lol, thanks for the info and your time !
Thanks. I knew these "existed" LOL, never had anything to do with 'em.
So they didn't *really* exist, but only did as a pretend thing, hence the quotation marks?
+Maxx Fordham! What the hell are you on? Did you have a concussion?
I am on _nothing_, Just Here For The TH-cam. The _real_ question, since you're too stupid to understand what I'm asking fourfortyroadrunner and _not you_ about his quotation marks around "existed," is what street drug(s) _you_ are on. Did ya take a bunch of acid or were ya just _born_ this dumb, kid?
Maxx Fordham! I didn't even notice the quotations, sorry for the hostility.
Then how come when you read my reply you didn't do your due diligence and scroll back up to _look for_ those marks in his comment, so that you could've said to yourself, "Oh! I think I get what he's asking," Just Here For The TH-cam?
I believe that’s a 830 it has a black dash
No, it is definitely an 820. The early 820s had a green dash, the last year of the 820 and it could have been the last two years the dash was black. This indicated the changes that were made increasing the horsepower by using the head that was designed for the upcoming 830 model. There may have been other upgrades but I can't remember. If anyone else wants to chime in on the 820 black dash upgrades feel free. The serial number tag was there and the numbers matched the listings in the books as an 820 black dash. Thanks for checking out the video. Just do this for fun.
Where was the April Fools' prank?
it is easier to fly an air plain
It might be "pretty damn handy," if you are interested in piloting an AIRPLANE, to first learn how to spell the thing.
it is more useful to be nice to people who don't speak English or speak it as a second language
So you are the one who STARTED making snide remarks about this video and now you want to lecture ME? Go away. Learn English.
No, fourfortyroadrunner, it's not about spelling the word or words; this is a word *usage* issue (because those words were the wrong words but spelled right).
+Maxx Fordham!
NNOOO. . .
It is not easier to fly an airplane than start a 60 year old tractor !!
This "imad omda" fella is deriding this video up-loader, the tractor, the manufacturer, and America in general, and we don't need to stand for this shit !!
This tractor prolly fed his grand-parents!
Let's have some RESPECT, and make America GREAT again !!
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