Persona and Why You're a Fool Too
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ต.ค. 2024
- man, i wish i was a persona protagonist :(
The idea for this video came to me in a thrift store, so that speaks to the enduring quality of the ideas presented here. Either way I think the concepts of development of self and free will that are reflected by a series of 20 mirrors in Persona are pretty neat. Oh and uh, the god killing, that's cool too. I like that also, yes - เกม
Literally just woke up to find that people actually wound up seeing this video so... welcome! All of your feedback has been super touching and I'm glad to see all of my hard work wound up paying off in the end. As you can all obviously tell I'm pretty new to this whole youtube thing so it's definitely still a learning process, but stick around and maybe see where we all wind up! More videos on the way, eventually....
1k subs over a month and 2 vids is amazing work, I love this one
This is a really well-made video for someone with just three subscribers. I hope this video gets spread around more.
this dude had only 3 when he made this??
@@spookey3114 yep, this comment aged BEAUTIFULLY badly
Howd someone manage to get 1k subs in 2 weeks!?🤯
This video's writing was amazing not going to lie
P3 kid: He's listening. He doesn't care.
P4 kid: He's listening. He's just deadpan.
P5 kid: He's not listening. He spaces out a lot. Lord help him if he gotta recall what happened sometime ago.
This is why they need the 20 different flashbacks for the cutscene that played 2 minutes ago in P5. Bro needs to remember the plot.
@@thunderstrand Useless?
P5 kid literally carries a whole ass cat everywhere he goes. There is no neurotypical explaination for that.
The drugs did him no favors either
@@d.chriss_You're usless to mee!_
I will say that there _are_ a few in-game reasons for the Protagonists to have the Fool Arcana outside of just meta-narritive. The Fool card, after all, isn't just for the "trickster" archetype as P5 would have you believe, but for madmen, beggars, naive individuals and travellers with nothing to their name and no connections. They're supposed to be empty and clueless and uncaring to the point they can't even lament their lack of things because they also lack the knowledge of what is missing from their life. The unseen goal of a Fool (in both Tarot and the Pesona games) seems to be to "graduate" into someone who actually connects with and understands the world around them, which happens during the course of the game.
P3's Protagonist has nothing and apparently gets passed around between his family members like a broken doll before the start of the game, but somehow he doesn't resent that and wanders around with an empty head and heart without truly caring about anything. He doesn't have any past friendships or connections that reach out to check on him, nor does he reach out in return. He doesn't even care about how weird the Dark Hour is until others start pointing it out to him. By interacting with SEES, however, he grows his Fool arcana and eventually "graduates".
FeMC is basically the same, but with a vaneer of silliness and false positivity that I think is in reference to P2's female protagonist, Maya.
P4's Protagonist is disconnected from others and gets pushed out to the countryside for convenience's sake. You can see in the intro cutscene that his city classmates complain about him leaving, but no one ever contacts him because he doesn't care to have any deep connections before Inaba. Hell, even his own parents don't contact him while there's a murder case going down in his town, and he doesn't contact them either! His connections with the Investigation Team is what allows him to grow as a Fool and "graduate" into a slightly less complex power than P3's protag.
P5's Protagonist actually does have a past hatred and rivalry with a certain character, as well as a stiff sense of justice, so yeah, he does fall more into the Trickster side of things. I think this is also why his ultimate persona is the only ultimate of the Fool arcana, whereas other Fools will change their ultimate arcana based on their experiences. He still lacks connections though and wanders naively through a strange and unfamiliar situation without much care for the consequences, however. When he "graduates" he retains all of the values that he had before, but he also denies anyone from controlling him and continues journeying as he pleases. It's pretty appropriate.
And now for some SPOILERS for P3 and Arena Ultimax:
Because people can change their arcana via character development, the Fool Arcana _can_ be obtained by others under very specific circumstances. This has happened twice, actually.
Aigis becomes a Fool after her life loses its purpose. With a whole load of nothing seemingly in her future she attempts to reduce herself back down to an emotionless tool, emptying herself of all wants and connections in order to wander through life blindly and without giving any response. This can justify why she manifests the Fool Arcana, but her prior connections and the circumstances of The Answer make her powers work unusually by borrowing directly from the compendium of another.
Elizabeth is the final Fool user (because the Jester doesn't count), having developed it after years of staring at a really big door and wondering how she could possibly fix it. She already starts out powerful, but not powerful enough to achieve what she wants. It's her sudden acknowledgement of the fact, despite being so powerful, she knows nothing and no one that allows her to change into the Fool Arcana and begin her own journey.
I know this is a huge read, but I just really wanted to dump out all my thoughts here because the Fool Arcana has a LOT of symbolism that people constantly miss. Because yeah, we are all the Fool when we play these games and we learn from our experiences with it, but one of the best parts of a game is hearing the opinions of others and learning new perspectives - which is exactly the kind of character development we're encouraged to go through in these games!
FemC reads best as a more atypical presentation of depression; the anxiety-driven constant internal urge to perform upbeat and friendly behaviour as a defensive mechanism to conceal how you're actually feeling and the need to be constantly active and engaged in something to stave off navel gazing. I think that's where the 'false' positivity is coming from on her route - I'd argue it's quite legitimate but partly stemming from denial and insecurity. She also strikes me as the type of outward-looking leader who feels the need to shoulder everybody else's burdens for them while ignoring half her own.
@@DebbieJacksonArtist Agreed! I felt that same way when I played her route. Her personality truly flips towards the end of the game, providing much more heavy and grounded responses than she does in the early game. I just didn't add as much detail to her section because she suffers depression in many the same ways as Makoto/Minato and my comment is basically already an essay. I also think her and the male protag mirroring Maya and Tatsuya is an oft overlooked meta-angle.
"Let's positive thinking!" - "Let's think positive!"
FeMC basically provides the option to say a spin on this at many opportunities. Male MC is The Fool 0, and FeMC is the Fool 22. FeMC is the character you were supposed to play after the Male route having been avaliable for a long while, so you approach it with the experience of your last journey, much like you would approach Maya's journey in Eternal Punishment after having completed Tatsuya's journey in Innocent Sin. FeMC also doesn't have a fully canon ultimate persona (her end credits show her Orpheus, not Messiah) and Maya is the only persona user to ever reject her shadow without terrible consequences because of being unable to let go of trauma, meaning her ultimate persona is technically incomplete. Both women gloss over their fears and past with an outward vaneer of positivity. There's also shared sacrifice imagery with blatantly christian visuals, but that could just be the themes of the games themselves rather than purely on the characters.
Only if TH-cam had an option to save comments. Really loved what you've said here. Thank you for putting in the effort to jot down your amazing insights for us to read.
“Like the number zero. Empty, but full of possibilities.”
Figured I'd correct an error you made at the very beginning
While p1 and p2 didn't have slinks they did assign arcana to the party members and it would influence how well a character could use certain personas
Very true.
If a character in P1 has a Good Affinity with a certain arcana then they can equip and use personas within it easily.
Having a Bad Affinity with a certain arcana, however, means you can equip the Persona and gain its weaknesses and resistances _but_ you cannot use it in battle.
And a Worst Affinity persona can't be equipped at all.
Meanwhile, in P2 things are slightly different.
A Good Affinity reduces SP costs and can allow the persona used to mutate and become stronger.
A Normal Affinity had no SP bonus and a low chance of mutation.
A Bad Affinity increases SP costs by 50% and has only a 1% chance of mutation.
And Worst Affinity personas are simply unequippable.
Great Affinity is usually saved for each character's unique Initial and Ultimate Personas, but there are exceptions.
There are also some notable personas that will always have good or bad affinity with everyone, regardless or even because of their personalities.
For example: Cerberus is Great Affinity with everyone 100% of the time because he is a Good Boy (and an old school mascot of SMT), and there is a character who specifically has a Good Affinity with Satan despite otherwise having Worst Affinity with the Judgement Arcana (I guess he's just a... _bad judge_ of character, ey?)
@@conspiracypanda1200 Reiji's affinity in p1 is so shit he gets like no personas he can actually equip until end game
I
SMELLL
UNDERATED.
you ligitimately summerized persona (In my opinion) as perfectly as possible, I am going feral over this, and sending it to all my fellas
This video sure has a well written script. Focused and has a good structure. Keeps itself concise and the humor doesn't undercut the main topic; seriously, this shit was fucking funny.
“When the series actually started to matter” is absolutely fearless way to start an essay geared towards Persona fans, instant subscribe
I am a the trickster
hell yeah you are
I am a got dam genius.
You are the Joker (2019) from the movie Joker (2019)
Now way dude, is that the real Jonkler?
Damn this was a good video. I just started P5 and was already familiar with Jungian psychology and tarot and all the other light psychological themes the game focused on and wondered if anybody else appreciated what the game was hinting at. You managed to pull it all together and communicate it very clearly while being entertaining.
When I started Persona 5 I was already familiar with Jungian psychology but not tarot card reading but i started learning about tarot cards and their meaning after playing persona 5. I appreciated the persona games more pretty ironic that Persona 3 had a summer school lecture with Mr Edogawa on tarot reading when the protagonist goes to summer school since Mitsuru signs him up there.
Persona made me get into Jungian Psychology
0:36 can we talk about that smooth transition “but burning that”. Bro COOKED
I kinda needed to hear this. You deserve more views, likes, subscribers, comments, whatever. Awesome video.
Ok, it’s growing more popular already, so I’m at least proud to say that I was one of the first.
13:57 Seeing the little "gay" after all the existential dread was the funniest thing
This video is looking cool, Joker!
Good video!
And the ending made the video so much better!
We are not just fools or tricksters.
You're seriously underrated mate. Highly insightful video while keeping a good level of humour.
This was a good video! The whole spiel of existensial questions was a bit too much imo. I was like, "How long is this guy gonna insinuate that life is futile at me ?" LOL.
Nice that I stook around longer and got to the part when the message got positive! Keep up the goodwork!
This is awesome, I always felt this way about the arcanas. I used to go on deep, drunken rants about specific arcanas and what they represent to the most minute details. Glad someone else is pointing this out too!
Your voice is so cute and soothing, very well-edited and interesting!
Good video. I hope your stuff gets promoted more by TH-cam.
Leaving a comment because I know how important they are even after long after a video’s release, speaking from experience.
This video is great, love the presentation and it really nails what I love about the Persona series. Keep being your creative self and don’t stress about living up to the expectations of all these new eyes that are on you!
I don’t like playing favorites but i gotta say this comment was especially motivating for me, so thank you :)
4:24 his wife youradice
Your transitions from topic to topic are so great. I bet this video has an insane retention with how well structured it is. wow
Ngl it would be cool if we got a persona game where the mc isnt the Fool leading to a great plot twist where the real "chosen one" awakens later to the Fool which may or may not be the mc. Something RPGs used to do back in the day here and there
Would be neat, the early persona games protagonist isn't fool like tatsuya being the sun and Naoya being the Emperor.
The fool journey is getting old ngl, Tatsuya arcana reflect his character so much both The Reversed sun tarot card and the upright.
Given what the Fool symbolizes, that's etiher the MC goes amnesiac, or he goes into a totally different context. So the second half of the game would have different characters and mechanics...
@@orlandomoreno6168 not necessarily new characters and the like but it is possible. Say if the mc starts out on the wrong side and gets the classic betrayal and reformed treatment then that would fit perfectly with a new cast of good guys. But if its a good guy mc thru and thru then it could be them opening their perspective. All it takes is a pivotal moment that changes the mc's point of view to be a better person and start down a new path. Rpgs have done it several times in the past, like og Cloud coming out of the Mako stream and accepting who he truly is could be the closest example since he grows a ton after that and becomes his full self afterwards
i keep thinking if we get a game from the point of nyarlathotep taking the philemon approach and choosing his own champions to wreak havoc on the world , and the velvet room we get is literally the one from twin peaks aka black lodge since it was the main inspiration :3
I like this take on the Persona themes. The lesson also applies to our relationship with other fictional characters and stories in general. Great job sir.
Damn you make some good shit man. Keep it up
7:04 favorite line from this video
Love how you're like: "You're a fool because you don't know enough about Jungian psychology," while actively pronouncing Jung's name incorrectly, and right before changing the pronunciation multiple times throughout the video.
I might be stupid
.
7:07 “These figures are the means by which a culture communicates the archetypes that are important to them”
You could say… they are the means by which all is revealed.
In Reloaded I would have given the possibility to choose the protagonist between Him and Her Once chosen, the other is a Sess member with new Personas and an exclusive Confidant
Es He Hanging in the path of Her, She Temperance for Him
Or 2 alternative arcana versions..
this is a genuinely incredible video, wow!
it feels like a love letter to humanity only understood by those of us who have the privilege of having played these games, and i am absolutely here for it. thank you so much for such a beautiful analysis
Personally, I don't care that life has no meaning that's why it is a treasure you are not on 1 set journey you are free In a world of chaos so why not go for it why be scared of something that has no meaning live life, well until you realize addiction is a form of it , yes live life but there are things that we simply should try our best to "a-void" because they are a void in the chaos they give you nothing yet they take away from you that's why society exsist its a set of rules that we agree that they are not good for anyone society is a foundation to avoid the void in this world yet its not perfect in itself and it will never be perfect cuz greed and[the other deadly sins here] are not just a void we go around they spread once they got someone they use him to spread it and it grows until others see it as "normal" even tho it hurts them
I am stressed rn but I know 1 thing, this year is a life decider but even if I fail I will find a way I just rather go by the system get this year done and be ready for the coming bs its ok be stressed depressed ect. Infact if you think you are happy for a long time that means something is wrong and you are forcing yourself to be happy negtive feelings while can be physical(and should be checked)its also mental your brain chose to feel these feelings because they help you live in a healthy way you shouldnt run you should confront them you can be happy but happiness is not eternal
YOU FOOL, I COUD READ THE PERSONA 4 PACKAGE, OR, MAKE OTHER PERSON READ IT FOR MY, LIKE YOU, great video btw was awesome
Pretty sure you are a fool cuz joker. That's it the joker(also found this emoji 🃏)
Already commented something but back at it again - this also reminds me of Hermann Hesses "Steppenwolf", the main character is in a dreadful existential crisis and his only way to overcome it is with humour :)
makoto is emo, kotone is an airhead, yu is a old guy in a teen's body, and ren is just a dork 😂😂😂😂
Minute in and I can tell this is gonna be a banger
Wanted to return to say you have it fucking phenomenal video
Huh, seems I'm the first person to watch this video. Neat
“Even after atlus got bored with the idea and tried desperately to distract you from it with existential and political *dread.* But *burning* that-“
Underrated joke
You know I’m something of a fool myself
This is an excellent video!
Single note, Eurydice is yor-id-i-see.
"Ever since the Persona series started to matter" lmaooo
This video is really great, I honestly hope you continue uploading more content like this, I love reflective videos, even more so if they are from Persona
Good shit can't wait to see what's next
actually great video. im suprised you dont have more subscribers
You... somehow managed to put into words everything I have ever wanted to say about the modern Persona series.
We're all dumbasses.
Literally the biggest problem I have with Persona is how they seem to simplify characters with a singular Arcana, when that's not what people are at all. Your relationships with individual people can be represented by that, but to be defined by that Arcana is a gross misrepresentation of the human experience.
I am a Wheel Of Fortune in how I want to take my life back for myself after having someone else's expectations forced upon me for so long, and yet I am also a Tower for how much I want to tear down the system that made me how I am now. Hell, to an extent I'm even an Emperor and a Justice! I am all of these things...
...and more. We are ALL more than what people see us as. We are all on our own Journey, passing through the many Arcana to attain the World. We all have different faces that we present to different people, and the essence of being human, of LIVING, is to be more.
+1 stupid person here, great video! Very well thought out vid (even if, as you say, half the shit was already written out for us to be aware of if we dug around in P4 haha)
Brother I just wanted to watch a funny little persona video now I’m imbued with existential dread
Pls keep making videos 🙏🏾🙏🏾
Got the biggest grin on my face watching this video while you rattle off on all my hyperfixations and major and how they apply to Persona. Excellent video!
I know what this guy's doing with the video and I appreciate it but at times to somebody who doesn't know what this creator is trying to say it sounds like he's just bashing on anybody who likes these games and wants to enjoy them like I said I know what he's trying to say but remember this is the internet folks
0:28 I dont really get this comment, a lot of these ideas were obviously placed intentionally by the creators. You even mention half the concepts from this video come from the game. I also dont get the one after it that implies extensential dread and political dread dont effect the formation of identity. We're these just jokes that I'm reading in to too hard?
Bro this got Daganronpian real quick lmao.
Great job! Thanks for sharing!
As much as persona can be read as im 14 and this is deep this game series shows that even if you are 14 it is kind of deep
I love TH-cam recommended. I had a conversation about this with my friends during Overwatch match the other day. How foolish.
Good Video!
This was a great video. Really funny and critical of the persona series also I appreciate you acknowledging persona 1 and 2 duology. Please I beg you make more!
I Wish I Was ONE
so in other words you're saying we're divergent
I do be spurting out my thoughts when I’m busy or doing something but I just realize how funny or stupid they sound, so yes I guess I am a fool.
And you're trying to tell me this person has less than 200 subs???????
Not everyone is a fool, it depends how open you are to change
You forgot trauma and Parenting.
PLEASE MAKE MORE VIDEOS HOLY SHIT THIS WAS SO GOOD I SUBBED
This was an amazing video I'll be back when this hits 100k views
Didn't use Persona 2's Hades, 0/10 /j
This is not the quality I was expecting, but in a good way. Damn, you need more recognition
Wow that was really good. So glad it went reccomended. Keep going you're sure gonna explode soon
SHES REAL TO ME!!!
0:37 i hate you for that joke lol
Make more vids abt persona , ik you had p4g classroom as your source but I found this interesting
Damn bro.. that was some peak
7:04 I thought you were gonna say “the means by which all is revealed” that’s it. That’s the comment
Great vid! Surprised you have so few subs and only 2 videos up!
This video was incredibly refreshing. Love everything about the lore, characters, and story in the series…just hate how the game punishes you for the choices you make, it’s like the game has to be played under a guide to receive all the content it purposely makes inconvenient
Thank god I’m not the only one that connected the dots with Carl Jungs work, like come on persona 4 was basically shoving it in your face with shadow work.
It’s been years and I haven’t seen a single video talking about this, at one point I wanted to make a video essay, explaining Carl Jung influence in the persona games, like it’s literally called persona for a reason 😂.
Like literally every time I bring this up with friends, they say it’s not that deep, and it’s just anime and look at the hot anime waifus.
The fool and the trickster are not the same archetype! Joker is definitely a trickster but P3 and P4 protags are not. The fool is the protagonist at the start of the story - and is foolish in both good and bad ways, full of mistakes but also creative vigor, unbound by conventional wisdom or social convention. The other 21 cards of the tarot tell a story of the Fool’s life as he proceeds from one stage to another. So, in a very real way, the Fool archetype is the self-insert archetype - they’re supposed to be a blank slate!
Persona games are beautiful. The video was beautiful. Please keep making videos bc you're amazing at it, and i would love to see more content for you!!!
(On a side note, the way you said baby was a little ... ❤❤)
This video goes incredibly hard. "How are you suppose to deal with anything if you can't realise how funny it is that Jesus fell asleep on the L key of the type writer of the existence?"
I have nothing to add, but ik this'll help your algorithm, so here you go :3
(also i like your voice)
This video really made me feel so much better and inspired me to keep on going, but while laughing.
I’m experiencing a lot of stress due to job instability and have been worrying for days, but this video made me remember that this world is so meaningless and that I’m just doing my best during my time on this floating rock. If I’m going to face all this crap and live anyways, I may as well joke about it.
amazing video and i love the connections between psychology and the human condition being made possible by my favorite stupid jrpg series
Bruh, this montage and narration is great! You deserve to grow!
Got the p5r final edition or whatever the last moneyed one was and my parents made me throw away the tarot cards. Since I spent the money I kinda just hid em under my bed.
0:38
"But burning that, and putting it aside." While talking about dread? I see what you did there.
SPUD'S ADVENTURE MENTIONED, ALL MY TATER FANS RISE UP, WE OUT HERE PUZZLING BOYS
6:58 I don't know why I find this single frame the funniest thing I've seen for the past few months at least
so glad i stumbled upon this. was running out of video essays to watch and this is the type of content i love to consume
bro upload a masterpiece of a video and it’s only the second on the channel 😭 give me more 🙏
damn this video was really good!
Time to go fail my philosophy midterm now!
Saw this video the same day after finishing og persona 5 and was very mind opening. Keep up the good work, can't wait to see what you make next!
A PERSONA ANALYSIS THAT IS ACTUALLY FUNNY??? LITERALLY UNWATCHABLE 😡🤬😡🤬🤬
Tanaka would be joker if he didn't awaken to a persona they both absolute trolls
i like this
Inb4 this guy gets like 100k subs
Incredibly good vid, gave me both existential dread and ungodly levels of motivation.
Keep it up
Brother never stop grinding, ur channel is fire 👌😁👏🔥🔥🔥
Oh so this is why character tropes exist.
Thanks for this video. I loved an explanation for all of this.
this needs more views